Not Tonight Caroline
Established readers may remember dear, sweet Caroline, an ex-girlfriend of mine who had a huge conscience and always sought to do the correct thing. She often wanted to fight back against my manipulations but could not do so because she took the view that it was wrong. Wrong because she did not believe in meeting fire with fire. Wrong because she always maintained that I needed help to overcome the issues that apparently I had. She was sweet but ever so misguided. Caroline was a particular enthusiast of horror movies. I at first found this slightly at odds with who she was although I naturally embraced her enthusiasm for them as part of my mirroring of her likes. I found that it was actually psychological thrillers and creepy horror (not out and out gore fests) which she preferred. The reason for this soon became apparent. She enjoyed being scared witless in the cinema because it made her amorous, randy, horny, call it whatever you will but it made her want to go straight to be to make love after any visit to the cinema. We would make near weekly visits to the cinema and sometimes twice in a weekend for her dose of fright and then the sex thereafter.
Once the period of devaluation began with Caroline I knew, as was often the case, that withdrawing sexual interest from her would provoke the appropriate hurt, upset and frustrated response which would provide me with the negative fuel that I craved. I also knew however that she was confiding in a handful of people outside of our relationship (note – always secure a lieutenant in the primary source’s camp) and it would not do to have my name besmirched in such a way. Firstly, I was not wanting those listeners (two of whom I had identified as potential targets) to think that I had a reduced sexual appetite when that was not the case, of course they could not be told that this apparent loss of libido arose as a consequence of a manipulation. Secondly, I did not want her to garner sympathy and support from her camp over my withdrawal of sexual attention.
Accordingly, the tactic needed to cause the withdrawal without it being directly linked to me. Naturally I identified that the attendance at the cinema to watch frightening movies was the catalyst that ignited her libido. To her, film night was sex night. Film night therefore had to be the target. I needed to maintain my appearance (at least) of being reasonable so I would be able to garner sympathy at her now failure to engage in a sexual union and also to avoid it seeming as if I was the one sabotaging film night. She had to be the one to sabotage film night and thus if we or rather she did not attend the film there would be no sex to follow. This would be her doing and I could justifiably complain that I was the one not getting any sex as a consequence of her selfishness.
Accordingly, my aims with Caroline we are as follows: –
- Cause the withdrawal of sex leaving me blameless and thus with grounds for complaint;
- Sabotage her attendance at film night without it appearing that I had done so;
- Cause her to cause the sabotage so I remained blameless.
I knew she was angling for new car and I had been engaging in future faking by suggesting that we would organise for her to get a new car. I kept putting it off and I knew that she was becoming irritated by this because she wanted a larger vehicle for the increased mileage she was doing associated with her job. On the Saturday when we were due to go to the cinema that evening, I returned to the house with a couple of brochures from a dealership.
“What have you got there?” she asked pleasantly enough.
“Oh a couple of brochures for the new Jaguar, I fancied a change.”
“What? Already?”
“What do you mean?” I asked.
“Well you’ve only had your car less than a year.”
“And?”
“Well, you don’t need a new car, I do.”
“It’s like that is it?” I asked.
“Like what?”
“I am not allowed to look.”
“You said you fancied a change.”
“I do but that isn’t the same as ‘I am getting a new car’ but oh no, you had to assume you knew what I meant, just in the same way that you always assume you know what is best for me. If I want a new car, I will get one, it is my money.”
“Yes, yes, okay, but you have been promising that we would change my car.”
“No I haven’t.”
She paused trying to keep her rising exasperation under control.
“Yes you did.”
“Are you suggesting that I have lied,” I said firmly and quietly. She halted.
“You were weren’t you, you fucking snake,” I hissed at her.
You can imagine how the rest of the conversation went. I baited and pressed until she erupted in tears of frustration. I strung the argument out until it was close to the time to depart for the cinema.
“You are in one of your moods again, I’m not going to the cinema with you since you are being so horrible,” she declared.
“Suits me. I will go on my own.”
I saw her mouth drop open. She expected me to talk her around into going. She probably also expected me to arrange a new car for her in order to persuade her to come to the cinema. That was how manipulative this woman could be and I was not falling for it. Apologies, that was how I later described the conversation when recounting the poor treatment, I had been subjected to. I knew she expected me to sweet talk her into accompanying me to the cinema, but I was not doing so. I had to turn my head so she did not see my smile of satisfaction. I was fuelled from her upset and frustration. I also knew that she would be cursing the fact she was not going to the cinema and would in turn rue the loss of the catalyst for her sexual engagement that she otherwise wholly enjoyed. I made for the door as she made a noise of protest and headed to the car.
I adopted a blackened look on my face, appearing as if it was I who had been wronged by her refusal to accompany me to the cinema but the reality was I was delighted. I had drawn fuel, asserted my control, reinforced my superiority and I could watch the film without someone grabbing my arm every five minutes in terror. I could also complain about her behaviour to anybody I chose to tell and knew her options for complaint had been severely limited because she chose not to come to the cinema which in turn stymied her expected later pleasure.
This is how a greater narcissist thinks. Planning ahead in order to secure the fuel, the control and the winning outcome.
82 thoughts on “Not Tonight Caroline”
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Would a ‘somatic narcissist’ withhold sex? My ex narcissist was VERY sexual all the time. I only saw him a few times a month so I’m guessing that’s why he never wanted to NOT have sex. Sexual seduction I would say was his main m.o. in life. He’s married now and I’m wondering if he withholds sex from the wife as control/fuel. Would his need to devalue for fuel override his desire for sex? I’m very curious.
Please see Sex and the Narcissist, Amy.
My exnarc right before NC began denying me sex. Why? He would deny, I would accept the denial, he would do some laundry, then an hour later start touching me when I was trying to sleep. Then get mad that I got mad that he was touching me, then provoke, then later when we began full on arguing about it say I was trying to force him into having sex (???!!!!!!).
Fuel of course.
So tragic, particularly for the children. Yeah, I recall Peaches dying as well, though didn’t know the whole story.
HG, I researched that bridge just now. I wanted to see any it looked like. It looks an incredibly Romantic pedestrian Bridge. I can envision crossing it hand in hand through the mists of fog and the shimmering city lights to reach the other side. Clasping hands tightly while walking close beside him, stopping to whisper In his ear, kiss and be kissed by him along the way. I clearly see the seduction aspect of such a location. As I, imagine most devotees would.
HG would you target the girl standing to the side contemplating the beauty surrounding her, or the one lost in the memory of a past love, or the one sitting solitarily writing In her journal, lost in concentration of her words, or the one taking photographs, offering to take one of her with the bridge in background, the one walking her dog, whose leash has momentarily escaped her hand and you happen to reach hold of and return to her….or simply the one walking beside you with love In her eyes.
Steeviann, enjoy wherever you may travel On your holiday and be happy.
Depends whether I am seducing, devaluing or hovering the primary source.
It is a very romantic bridge. It has served me well.
Late on the discussion, not meaning to interrupt….it brought back memories of that bridge in the INXS video from the late 80s early 90s, “Near Tear Us Apart”. I think it is the same bridge. Sigh, Michael Hutchens….loved that band and what a hotty.
A great band. Hutchence was led astray by Paula Yates.
Didn’t know that. Just looked it up. I didn’t know of her, ugh. I always heard he died of suffocation that was part of a sexual act/masturbation thing and it was accidental. I just read it was considered a suicide. He had such a lovely voice…
We had a morning show in the UK called the Big Breakfast. Yates who was married at the time to Bob “Live Aid” Geldof used to interview celebrities on a bed. She interviewed Hutchence. There was clearly electricity between the two. She later revealed that within two hours of the interview they were in a hotel room in London shagging and where they stayed all day and carried out at least five illegal acts. Yates of course was a drug addict. Hutchence died either through suicide or autoerotic-asphyxiation having gone wrong. Yates later died of an overdose. The cuckolded Geldof brought up his and Yates’ children (one of whom who would later die as an adult through a drug overdoes – Peaches I think it was) and he also took in Hutchence and Yates’ orphan. When Yates died I think two of her young children were still in the house which was littered with drugs and their dead mother.
It’s very interesting when you say during the morning show interview, it was clearly visible Yates and MH had a lot of chemistry. It goes to the laws of attraction, that like will attract like. Both of their inner pain that drove them to their vices respectively must have been flowing full throttle as that electricity you spoke of.
Narcs and Empaths really do have to deal with a magnetic, gravitational pull with each other.
There is force in your observation Clarece. You can come out of the naughty corner now!
My pleasure! Thank you for releasing me Master!
Hi Indy
Excellent recall on that Bridge from. Video, wonderful song too. MH! Didn’t do anything for me, his bassist did though..Garry Beers.
Reblogged this on fletchenkitty and commented:
Wow.
Thank you.
The art of manipulation crystal clear. I don’t know how they do to twist and turn everything to their side and at the end the other person is so confused that it all turns out on the favor of the manipulator.
I wonder if they are just unable to sit down and have a normal conversation on why its not convenient at the moment to get a new car, because they are unsure if they will win or not, or its just an instinctual reaction to plan and manipulate or they are very aware and do it on purpose like that for the fuel. Two birds with one shot. Fuel and getting their way.
What can I say about the story……. Good narrative as always.
Never underestimate the role that lieutenants play! Other websites refer to them as flying monkeys. I’m just now seeing how deep the lieutenants go. Scary yet impressive. I’m realizing for my own safety and sanity that I need to change cities.
The narcissist’s obsession is terrifying. She lets me go and then when I start to heal she tries to suck me back in. She knows I know what she is. And while she tarnishes my reputation to all and claims I’m the scary obsessive one, she tries with all her might to ensure that I still have to see her and deal with her. I’m tired. I just want it to be over.
Yes. Caroline and I have great taste in movies but that’s where any similarity ends. Watching horror movies doesn’t make me horny. I hate material gifts and it drove n2 nuts when I told him no thanks to a gift. Price vs cost. I’d never accept something like a car…or expect one..and I’d rip my tongue out with pliers if I thought it would ask for a car…which it WOULDN’T. I’ll buy my own car or whatever I want at the time if I can afford it, thank you very much.
Ann, I so agree. I really feel for those bound to a narcicist or sociopath due to children. And the children…sigh….the cycle continues…so sad. I was engaged, ready to buy a house, etc, and I endd it in time. Phew.
This article made me laugh! What a gong show! Hahahaaaa!!! The withdrawl of sex would have had me thinking “this guy must be half a fag or something.” Not saying you are but it is in the top 10 signs of a gay husband. (In my case anyway) Thanks for the laugh H G. Your articles have become a favorite pass time for me and I have been sharing them with my straight wives online support group. They seem to like them.
It was the withdrawal of sex on this particular occasion Mary in order to have the maximum effect. Thank you for sharing the articles, I appreciate. What is the Straight Wives Support Group, can you expand on this for me?
I missed this response of yours HG, it is a totally private online support group, the members are mostly from Canada, Uk and the US. No one can access it unless screened and then invited in by the creator of the group. The women in the group have all discovered their partners are gay in some way or another. Most of these secret gay men are also narcissists and the abuse is from mild to severe in these women. I post your articles on there. Some of them now follow you. This is a club I never would have imagined I would become a part of. These women are the only ones who can truly understand what I went through. Bad enough he was a total narc but repressed gay to top it off.
Hello Mary,thank you for the explanation and thank you also for posting the articles in this group, I appreciate that. Naturally there is nothing wrong with being homosexual and I am sure you agree, it is the fact that you feel that you have been deceived into believing that your partner was heterosexual and it is the deceit which causes the hurt, alongwith the abuse. As I have written in Sex and the Narcissist, the issue of sex and sexual orientation is invariably just a weapon to achieving our aims. Sexual orientation in our kind is something that is often seen as fluid, purely in order to draw fuel and maintain control. To put it bluntly, a hole is a hole because it belongs to an appliance not because of the person it relates to. I know of one of our kind who stated as follows, “I am not gay per se but you know, whatever it takes to keep the party going.” It is a device like everything about us.
What if she tried to leave and get in the car with you? Or what if she drove her own car to the cinema and sat down beside you as film was starting? What if she watched a thriller film at home while you were gone and her libido was in full force upon your return? Would you simply turn her away at each turn and rebuke her citing her selfish behaviour as a turn off and your lack of sexual desire?
In the same vein as this article. I find arguments/ Impassioned debate with partner, depending on Partner that is, a sexual turn on. D did too, so if he didn’t retreat due to feeling wounded, then all was grand following. He knew this and never deterred it. I suppose more fuel for him. Interestingly, MN would not engage sexually following an arguement at all. Especially one he lost. I felt it was more about control to him, he choose the negative fuel, whereas CN preferred to reap the positive fuel.
She would know better than to try to do that.
She would know better that to try to that as well.
She needed to watch it with me.
She would have known better? Meaning she was conditioned not to do such? What would have occurred if she didn’t know better? The fury?
Correct regarding conditioning.
Yes the fury because her disobedience would amount to a criticism of me, the fury would have been ignited. She would have been ejected from the car and ejected from the cinema.
Who’s the snake here? Between this story and the “I hate you” messages to Jane, you are really exposing how treacherous and harmful you are willing to go. To go to those lengths, the fuel that washes over you must be better than the most animalistic, primal sex ever, because otherwise who would choose that?
Just my opinion, but if you’re not up to the usual movie date night, one would probably say, “hey, I’m not up for it. I’ll make it up to you. Go out with one of your friends.” What’s wrong with that scenario? You’ll garner all that adoring fuel upon her return.
Curious, on your list of the different types of personalities you cater your hoovers to, I’d imagine Caroline falls under “the well-wisher”?
I had another comment about you lashing out with the insulting “snake” name-calling, but decided it best to pull back. I wouldn’t view a reaction as wrong as she did though.
The negative outweighs the positive Clarece during the devaluation, hence there was no suggestion of saying go out with your friends.
Ugh, there is a saying down South. You’re just being “mean and ugly” here.
HG, have you ever bought one of your primaries a car? Or let her borrow yours? I remember reading somewhere (earlier post or maybe one of your books) that your car was sacred to you, so I can only imagine you loaning it to someone if you had an ulterior motive that would provide fuel (such as finding a “scratch” or nick or something that was probably there before she took the car but of course you would blame her for it and make her feel completely irresponsible and never let her borrow it again!)
I have bought cars for a number of primaries. You are absolutely right Cody concerning use of my car. I wouldn’t allow a scratch or nick to remain on the car but I would complain about the seat being adjusted, the rear view mirror being changed, the CD I was listening to (pre ipod days) being removed and such like. I used to throw a couple of sweet wrappers into the foot well in order to have something to complain about.
Whose name is on the title? Do you make them give it back to you after discard – which I realize is not really a permanent discard? Or is it a perfect “leash” to keep them beholden to you even when you’ve moved onto other primaries?
My name is. I haven’t taken any back. They are useful reminders and one can always suggest to the authorities that my car has been stolen….
A car is just a car ……….. why make so much fuss about a car….
A machine used for transportation thats it.
Just adjust the mirrors again, and the seat and thats it. Takes 30 seconds.
I have never understood why make such a fuss about a car…
I do wash mine and keep it clean but thats it.
I have a colleague that could speak hours about his car.. and does not allow his wife to drive it neither.
A car is a just a car?! Nikita, how could you? It is an extension of my magnificence. Of course I could adjust the seats etc but why pass up the opportunity to extract some fuel?
hahaha yes I believe the people who adore cars consider it their extension, which takes them up high. And sometimes the ” m. organ” extension like Kat had said. hahaha. But we know its not your case because you have a min.
Me I just need a strong car that it takes me up the snowed alps during winter. And for fuel, thats what I thought. Complaining for a mirror or a dust on the seat or the moved seat or whatever detail is just pure collection of fuel. Better go to the gas station , the real one. 🙂
It’s called picking a fight to get your way, HG. You do it, my mother does it, I do it.
why she couldn’t simply please herself in the bedroom if You have withdraw yourself from the xxx life? why would she be so aggressive about the car (even if You have promised her one) . she supposed to patiently wait …even if she would never get a car from you!
I hadn’t totally withdrawn from our sex life but rather I wanted to demonstrate to her that I was the one in control and by denying her the usual pleasure she received from sex (with the heightened experience drawn from watching a horror movie) I exerted that control. She acted as she did about the car because typically she was greedy and ungrateful. This is what I have to deal with you see.
Crystal clear as always .
Thank you.
Greedy .. 😖😖😖 greedy people 😖😖😖
Magda, my exact thoughts… My exNarc would play the game but I have always been a game changer. He once made me throw out all of my toys as he claimed only he could be the one to please me… Why when I know myself so well.
AND I agree with the rest of the ladies here, I may not be financially well off but I have never had an issue with getting what I need on my own… need a little extra? Better hustle baby! 😛
And this is precisely the reason why I insist(ed) on having my own money and never took anything from my ex-narc or my father. Because whether justified or not, I always thought that anything they gave came with a price and will be held against me sooner or later.
Correct.
Hi Ann, Yes, me too. Money has always been something I made sure I had and earned for myself. I aid my bills, my way, everything. I am very thankful for that when it comes to my ex-N. I did not wish to be owned, ever. Plus, I am a proud woman that likes that fact about myself.
Right on, Indiglowsky! Good for you! It certainly makes it easier to escape them; and if you’re fortunate enough not to have kids or purchased a home with them, therefore nothing to further bind you to them, it makes it easier to execute no contact. I understand that not everyone has this option and to them, they have my heartfelt sympathies! 🙁
I have never been beholden to a man for any reason, financial or otherwise. MN tried to destroy me in all ways, he never succeeded.
I tend to be less of a judgmental type and when I am more in “emotion mind” I watch my words…but, judgment alert: This is sick and now I really see, indeed, you are sociopathic and not just narcissistic. Ooooo, this pissed me off to read it(yeah, yeah, little fuel). ….and this is the game that my ex did, this is exactly what he did. It is so hard to explain these things to others. I doubted he had lieutenants though. You are ahead of the game there. Sick, just plain sick and mean.
The Lesser does the same stuff except I dont think they plan in advance.
It’s not sick. its different. different terms and conditions. different rules. different person. why everyone else deserves acceptance but not HG? he helps people here by spending so much time writing all of that (yes for his audience and admiration he loves and deserves)… calling someone sick when they are not is very u professional.
Agree 😡😡
Hi Magda and nikitalondon, I’m assuming this response was to my post. Just saw it today and it appears my comment offended you both and that was not my intent at all. My post was not in a professional context but in this blog. I am here bc I am a recent survivor of a long term relationship with a narcicist that engaged in this type of manipulation and abuse, it hit an emotional nerve, as it would anyone and a voiced it here in honesty and voiced my anger. Just to clarify, abuse is sick behavior, I was not referencing HG personally as being “sick”…and HG indeed is doing a good thing by revealing his ways to the world for multiple purposes that he has stated. This good deed of his is enormous and I have gratitude to him for it. Bought several books. You may not have seen any of my other posts, but I do feel gratitude. Withthatsaid, we cannot say that relationship is just “different” and has different terms. That erases the intent of this blog and his on going therapy. If it’s different and not disordered then why is he doing this? Sincerely, I hope you understand my point here and it wasn’t meant to raise ire.
I’m a survivor…one month no contact! Thank you HG, ShAhida Arabi, and oh yeah, my brass ovaries that gave me the strength to leave. I hope all hears your message here, HG.
Seems like a lot of wasted energy to get the fuel that you could get from a pleasant interaction.
I find it interesting that you feel you are in control when you actually can’t control your demons. But again, this is the wired brain you have.
So you love chaos. Your rage that is just under your skin feeds on this?
Do you think that my Narc raged around his house after having to be so pleasant to me on the phone to love bomb me? I can just see him doing so. Talking to himself, swearing, banging things. I realized he used me to rage before dates. Only a few times this happened but I caught on quick. Rage with me so he could be calm with his new one. Like a horror movie.
Odd to want to have sex after a slasher flick. I personally do not like movies like this. Disturbing.
DAY FIVE!!! I am catching a flight to Stockholm this afternoon. I am going to get lost in the crowd, silently.
Indeed Steeviann and I understand why you would think that, but it is not to me. The pleasant interaction would not give me the fuel that I wanted. The negative fuel arising from the emotional reaction as a consequence of my manipulation would give me far more fuel.
I can control my demon. I have him locked away.
The chaos creates fuel. The raging your narcissist engaged in will have been to draw fuel from you.
Fear causes arousal. That is why people enjoy make-up sex so much.
No you do not have him locked away. If you did the rage would not happen. Rage is the demon. But I guess to a N, it must be your little pet that you keep on a chain.
Oh what your brain must be like when it is sparking. Who gets your rage these days?
Wow I totally see my ex husband doing this! I’m glad I acted as if I didn’t care. Almost never created arguments. It’s not my thing.
A wonderful and enjoyable holiday Steeviann, calm and relaxing and N free.
Not quite N free.
I am not including you HG. If she engages in blog activity whilst away.
Writing in the third person Miss S? Interesting.
The have, was missing from my reply ..did the typo throw you off HG. I see it might have. I wasn’t referring to my holiday, I was wishing Steeviann having a nice holiday.
Yes that is what threw me, thanks for clarifying, I though you were referring to your break but you meant Steeviann’s. Makes sense.
Yes, I had to relook its at myself, to see if did that. Then I saw typo, cursed reader and my fingers. No in my break I ensured I made time for you HG and blog. Just one of many wretched typos.
Don’t worry about the typos, modern affliction. The message is what matters most.
Thank you, I appreciate that, as the typos do bother me as they reflect perhaps my inability to spell, which is far from the truth. Plus they often detract from the message, in my mind.
Wot do yu meen? My Inglish is reet gud and propa eazee too reed.
Permission to do me in if it ever gets that bad, now don’t be changing it to do so, either…naughty. As an aside, I can read through all typos and upside down and backwards writing. How my strange brain works.
Most people can.
Then why complain so much, if they can?
Why would I complain when people can read forwards, backwards and with letters missing? I don’t follow your point.
Not you, others…..they complain about my Jspeak.
Enjoy Stockholm. My favorite city together with Barcelona. Do make a boat trip to the small islands. its amazing the sunset from there in summer.
I am going to Gotland for a few days. Medieval Festival. Right up my alley. Maybe I will find a badass Viking.
I was thinking of adding Prague onto my holiday, was actually invited by the guy I sat next to on the plane over. I guess I am charming. I must have picked up a few tips from my Narc. 😉
Enjoy your vacations. Prague is still on my list I have not done this one. Heard its very beautiful. Last time got until Dresden.
Prague is a beautiful place. The Charles Bridge is excellent for seduction.
sounds good <3 <3
I will take a boat out this Friday.