The Three Strands of Empathy
The concept of empathy can be divided into three types. There are three identifiable strands.
First of all there is the idea of cognitive empathy whereby one can understand the point of view of another person. I am able to understand another person’s point of view but I will rarely accede to it, unless I see some ulterior gain to be obtained from expressing that I understand their point of view. Even where I explain I understand, I am still unlikely to accept it. The Lesser and the Mid-Range are unable to understand that person’s point of view because it will oppose their own, stand in the way of what they want to achieve and frustrate their aims owing to their differing perspective. They lack the cognitive function to address this. Of course, empathic individuals are experts at understanding another person’s point of view but they will go further than this. They will exhibit patience to allow that point of view to be articulated, they will ask questions to draw out this view and they will apply it to their own situation and experiences. Empathic individuals want to understand the other person’s point of view. They not only give it a platform to begin with, but they also allow it to be aired, expanded and applied. It is little wonder therefore that this cognitive empathy bleeds into the empathic traits of patience, needing to understand and needing to know the truth. Furthermore, having such cognitive empathy means that the empathic individual is far more susceptible to the word salad, circular conversations, lies and half-answers that our kind provide. The empathic individual endures these manipulations as he or she tries to wade through the quagmire in order to flex their cognitive empathy so that they understand the narcissist’s point of view. Of course, since our point of view operates from a completely distorted and different perspective, you have little hope of achieving it.
Secondly, there is also empathy concern whereby one is able to recognise the emotional state of another person, feel a need to address that emotional state and therefore exhibit the appropriate concern for the individual. In all three schools of narcissism, our capacity with regard to empathy concern is skewed. The Greater is always able to perform the recognition part of this but has never been created with the sense of needing to address it even though our increased cognitive function means we can work out, through observation and experience, what the appropriate concerned response should be. This means that we can recognise somebody is in distress, understand that they need help but feel no compulsion whatsoever to provide it. We will however, because we have two of the three parts of empathy concern, feign a concern based on our understanding, but only if we see it as serving our interests. This is why, during seduction especially or for the benefit of the façade during devaluation, we can appear that we are concerned that somebody is worried or upset. We do not feel any need to assist them, but we recognise our own need can be served by doing so.
The Lesser is able to recognise the emotional state of another person, feels no need to address it and is unable to exhibit the appropriate concern for the individual. As a consequence, even during seduction, the Lesser will present as blank-faced when dealing with certain emotional episodes and will often vacate him or herself from the situation. During devaluation, he will only see the fuel advantage from this emotional state and indeed rather than be supportive, since he feels not need to, he will just exploit it further.
The Mid-Ranger also recognises the emotional state, feels not need to address it and has a limited repertoire by way of fake concern. Thus in some instances he can pretend that he is concern and in others he has no answer and will leave the victim to their woe and distress and has enough calculation to state he has somewhere urgent he must be and thus he escapes the demand for assistance and help made by the victim.
Unsurprisingly, the empathic individual has all three elements of this particular strand of empathy intact and in intense quantities. The empathic individual is able to recognise the emotional state of another with considerable ease, even if they are trying to mask it. They absolutely feel and recognise the need to do something when they see somebody else’s emotional reaction. This compulsion is almost irresistible for the empathic individual and they are also fully-acquainted with what they should do by way of response. They will share in the joy, congratulate when someone is happy through good news, console when someone is miserable and hold them when they are heart-broken. The empathic individual is no different with our kind and see our emotional response – albeit from a limited selection – feels the need to address it and also knows how to address it. Thus when we discharge our fury, our hatred, our envy and our antipathy, the empathic individual owing to this concern empathy is always galvanised into action, will rarely shirk the challenge and addresses the issue even at considerable cost to themselves.
Finally there comes the idea of the emotional contagion. This is a deep-seated and one may even regard it as a spiritual element of the empathic individual. This is not just about understanding a point of view or recognising an emotional need and response, this is about feeling the emotion just as somebody else does. Thus if a friend is upset over the death of a parent, the empathic individual is contaminated by this grief and experiences the same emotions as if they were grieving themselves. This not only means that they fountain with fuel which of course our kind will exploit but that they are powered into recognising the need and doing something about even more than would be afforded by the cognitive empathy and concern empathy. The emotional contagion exists in all empathic individuals but is more intense in certain people. Indeed, its intensity may even go beyond being proximate to the person experiencing the emotion. A highly-attuned individual with the emotional contagion will watch a television programme and where the main character is frightened,they will feel that fear also. They will read a moving newspaper article about the plight of an orphan and they will feel that despair as well. It is an immensely powerful part of empathy and causes the empathic individual to have to respond to it.
We have no such emotional contagion. It is completely absent and therefore we have nothing which might cause us to feel something so we act upon it. There is nothing there. The plight of the orphan is not felt by us and we are utterly unmoved. The fear of the heroine on television is regarded with annoyance since our primary source seems more concerned about that person than us. The only time that we regard this emotional contagion as any use is when it serves our purposes when the empathic individual fountains with fuel because of it and directs their empathic traits towards us. We do not have this contagion and we do not feel anything in the way that you would do.
141 thoughts on “The Three Strands of Empathy”
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Good evening HG. I thought you did check on us to make sure we are not members of your family or acquaintances of yours. Do you check when you have a doubt?
I check all, Lou.
Happy Thanksgiving, ladies, gents, and HG. I am truly thankful that I found this blog and HG😊 and thanks to him it won’t be interrupted by a hoover. 😊 I shut that down immediately. In true narc fashion of course. I almost feel bad, because I knew it was coming the sphere of influence is grandma blocks away. Lol, he was wondering if I could sneak away. Lol, please, why should I he’s aged, lost his physique and makes me sick too the stomach. A little anger may still reside but it doesn’t consume me and for that I am thankful for all the healthy relationships I was able to resurrect and the new ones. Thank God
This season is the reason to show how grateful we are by investing in the many literatures and blogs HG have made available for us. Just in case I forgot to mention I adore you. But, I am in love with my Lord.
Thank you Entertainment.
HG, I’m sorry you chose to be a victim of circumstance, instead of fighting for your humanity. I hope you can find your way someday.
Aw Love you have quite a journey! Were you born in the Middle East? Cuz your food is amazing and you said you like to cook right…? 😉
Thank you Punisher. Yes I was born in the middle east, lived in Europe for a bit, and now in the States. I would love to cook for you though I’m in the West Coast.
Yes Love! My last boyfriend was Saudi and he made me the best dinners! I want to learn 😊 Next time I’m out that way I’ll let you know. Jaded I’ll scoop you up, you’re on the way.
Very nice. He probably made kabsa a lot? I love chicken kabsa.
I believe so, he didn’t always tell me what it was. My favorites were kebab and red rice with chicken.
That sounds yummy! My favorite is with cornish hen. The red rice is a blend of spices: saffron, chile powder, cardomom, nutmeg, cinnamon, and more.
Sorry Mr. Tudor for turning your blog into the cooking channel.
Good afternoon HG!
What is one of your favorite meals?
I love the cooking channel Love. Lol
Baked empath soul.
Sprinkled with some sugar.
And a covering of honey.
And a side of Neapolitan ice cream. I know how you like things that come in threes.😉
Very good.
That doesn’t surprise me one bit HG that you can tell where we are all from. I picture you in a dark room at your command station with the world map lit up and we are all located on it and with the press of a button you can pull up everything about us. It included what category we are in, our age, our interests and etc.
Love that was funny, maybe I should check the shroom field for Trippin Monks.
Only one is allowed at this sanctuary HG moves about freely, the gaurds at the front know who is in charge here.
HG. Can you tell that by our IPs or something else? I am in Great Lakes but split my time between two states. Can you tell when I’m in either or if I don’t tell you? I only have my mobile. Your honesty is much appreciated on this one bc N2 alluded to the fact that he could tell. I just attributed it to him driving past where I was staying.
I can tell by the language used.
…and the timestamp on posts.
East coast, lol.
I don’t know what I am. Some things I feel very deeply, but sometimes I feel like I have no empathy at all. I didn’t really care when my dad died, cared even less when my mother died, and only a little sorrow when my sister died earlier this year. My narc has commented about my lack of emotions, even told me I have no soul. But when my late husband died I thought I would die, too. I howled with grief. I still do, 12 years later, if I allow myself to go there. I met my narc husband very soon after my late husband died, while I was still intensely grieving him. Would that pain and grief have appealed to my narc, H.G.? I almost feel like I lured him in under false pretenses, poor guy probably thought I was a super empath but actually I’m pretty damn tough. My typical reaction to him when he threatens me is “Go ahead do it, I don’t give a fuck!” The poor guy wants to break me soooo bad but I am an oak. Is that why I’ve never really experienced the silent treatment or a discard in 12 years?
Your pain and grief would have stood out and attracted your narc, yes.
Have you considered what it was about your dad, mother and sister that made you not care especially much? Was it that your grief for your late husband was so great, it would have caused all else to pale into insignificance?
Do you like animals?
You appear as a super empath – tough but with fuel – but the jury remains out until further information is furnished.
OorW, I’m really glad you commented because I relate to what you’re saying a lot. I have been told I’m a cold/distant person and often have wondered if something is wrong with me. I especially relate to what you said about death. It just doesn’t upset me as if I understand it or something. It freaks me out that I don’t cry at funerals yet when my dog was going to be put down I bawled uncontrollably (a first and last for me) for like 12 hours. I almost never cry, but I definitely feel A LOT and after finding this site would assume I’m a super empath. Were you discouraged from showing negative emotion as a child? Do you let people get close to you?
Nice
A wonderland created by You HG, is it anything like alices trip?
More Alice 2.0
Lol if i was I wouldnt say Punisher ;), yet had an interesting experience once when i was younger.
East coast at the moment
Are we all from the east coast? How curious.
i can tell you that you are not all from the East Coast.
Punisher, I’m in Ohio.
You can tell where we are from, HG? Snow White I believe we live rather close to each other. The best people really are bonkers.
Yes from the way people write.
Who is not then? Where do you suppose I’m from?
I won’t speak for others as their location is a matter for them to disclose, if they wish. You are from the United States, either Michigan or Ohio.
Hi Punisher! I’m in IL about 2 hours away from Chicago.
Is that the Twilight Zone, Clarece?
Come visit and you tell me!
Oh I shall.
Oh, you Tease!
Ha ha.
Please let me know when you do so I can leave IL.
Impressive, H. I don’t doubt you knew that before my comment to SW. I don’t know where Love is from but the rest of us super sensitive girls commenting seem to live in the same vicinity and I think that’s neat.
‘Tis a veritable hunting ground.
I’m from Michigan but currently in IL and still split my time in Michigan. Hmmm.
Hi Clarece! Will you be joining us on the farm?
HG, I imagine most places are a veritable hunting ground for you.
TP you say the nicest things.
Thanks, H 😉
I’m from the East too. Except it is the furthest East of everyone else. The Middle East.
HG, you are funny. The only thing worse than a narcissist is one with no sense of humor.
Indeed NN, at least I can make you laugh as I ruin your life, so using your empathic trait of positivity you can take that as a silver lining.
***Contemplating the value of positivity***
Don’t do it for too long NN!
Please do visit Love we would have a grand time, Punisher and SW come join to. Yes I have chickens fresh eggs are delicious, lol I was taught how to prepare meals from a chef. To this day I dont know how he had the patience with me. Yet I love to cook and learn new ways to prepare food.
Awwww… Thanks for the invite DFA!
It sounds beautiful there. Are you in the States or elsewhere? I have never been mushroom hunting. I love to cook. Something else that relaxes me.
I had some interesting mushrooms once.
Lol!!! Are you going to educate me about these kind of mushrooms?
If you wish.
Good afternoon HG, I’m picturing Wonderland. Lol. Have your visited?
I created it SW.
It’s beautiful in Wonderland. Temptation is everywhere there. I have been Alice before.
Mad Hatter: “Have I gone mad?”
Alice: ” I’m afraid so. You’re entirely bonkers. But I’ll tell you a secret.
All the best people are. ”
I love the characters here.
Haha, HG! I’ve had some interesting mushrooms myself. Are you growing any crops DFA?
Thank you DFA. I love cooking too! Maybe you can turn your land into a narc-sanctuary.
Lol sorry, I didn’t phrase that correctly. I just had a visual of narcs wearing monk robes and roaming about while tripping on shrooms.
I’m in! Hope you live somewhere warm 😊
Only in the summer. Lol.. I’m on the east coast Punisher
Hello Punisher,
I also do yoga and it does help with the calming. Brings me peace and I do like to walk. Thanks for the app recommendation. I will try it.
Love and Punisher I moved to the country due to the sensitivity. Malls heck no I dont go to them. I do most of my shopping on the Internet lol. My job I have to spend a couple of hours in my back yard to recharge as to I have to deal with people constantly and being touched is off limits. At that point I get overwelmed by whoever it is emotions and lose control. If they are sad I will start to cry, angry all hell breaks out, happy is the only one I dont mind.
I have only met one other as sensitive as I.
I have had some very embarrassing moments due to this. Other then that I am very calm and quite and very much in control.
I have never tried Yoga, I have heard its very relaxing.
I have taken an interests in learning how to shoot a bow. Or mushroom hunting. I love exploring the woods alone.
Living in the country sounds heavenly. I imagine having a garden. A few chicken and maybe even sheep, and a dog to herd them. It would be so nice to have fresh eggs and cook from the garden. Ooh, and make jam and bake pies from scratch.
Ah, I want to come live with you DFA 😉
DFA or sounds like you have found some good technique as well. Hiking definitely makes me feel better. I’m definitely not as sensitive as you and the others who answered my question. Thank you all for sharing. I only know one other person who is like me so it’s been helpful to hear your stories. 💖
SW and DFA do you find it hard to be in large crowds of people?
I avoid large crowds. An indoor mall is hell for me. I prefer more intimate settings.
DFA, I avoid certain places too. I’m plessed now that I live alone. There is so much peace. For a long time, I used to not go to a part of town that my psychopath had lived in, even though he had already moved out of the city. That area still had negative energy. There is no way I will go near my last narc’s neighborhood either.
Thank goodness my city is spread out and there are many suburbs.
* blessed
Damn Love, you are crazy sensitive! Crowds have more of an after effect on me, like I just need to release anything that may have attached itself to me. What kind of methods do you use to handle other people’s energy?
Punisher, I handle other people’s energy by running away lol. I have to have alone time to restore. I guess that’s why I was fine with my ex narc’s monthly ‘business’ trips. It gave me a chance to refuel.
Hi Love,
I am enjoying the peace also. I am very content to spend my days indoors and by myself. It is such a contrast from the two and a half years with my ex.
Hi Snow. Alone time is so healing. I’m glad you’re in a good place now. I can tell you are a very loving and sensitive soul. ❤
Awwww Love! Thank you.
I love your spirit and humor.
❤️🍎❤️
Thank you Snow! I’m glad you noticed I’m almost always light hearted and having fun. I worry people on this site take everything I say too serious.
Hi Punisher,
Hope you are doing well!!!!
Before my narc experience I never had a problem being in large crowds. But now it’s extremely difficult. I am highly sensitive to everyones moods. When cashiers or shoppers are rude, making comments under their breath, or insensitive I get frustrated and I can’t handle it. I am always the one to say “excuse me” or thank you” and I am now aware of how people really behave. I just passed it off before.
I also described it to my therapist as sensory overload to my central nervous system. The hustle and bustle of people, the music, noises from loudspeakers and any little thing that could possible startle me affect me.
Then there’s the anxiety of running into someone who is associated with my ex or even herself. That’s huge for me. I am always on guard looking around. Even when I’m driving I’m looking for her car and license plate and her wife’s too. Two weeks ago I did run into someone and it left me shaken and crying. I felt that anxiety for days afterwards.
I shop every Black Friday and this one is going to be a challenge.
I am well SW, thank you 😊 I hope you are well also. I can’t imagine being that sensitive, it must be really intense. Have you tried any visualization techniques to protect yourself? Have you, Love?
No I haven’t tried any visualization techniques. I dance, do yoga, and swim. They help balance me. I’ve recently come to the realization that there are a lot of people with cluster B personality disorder around me. Family and long time friends. I cannot cut everyone out of my life because I still love them. I am now learning how to limit my time with them. That way, I can enjoy them and still maintain my sanity.
Those are all awesome, Love! Yoga is my absolute favorite way to stay balanced. I find meditation to be very helpful as well. The app Headspace helped me immensely. When I’m out I like to visualize protective light around me and everyone else’s energy just like disintegrates when it touches me. Might help when you’re in public.. It’s hard at first but gets easy over time.
Thank you Punisher! I just downloaded the app and will give it a go. Appreciate you telling me about it.
I do understand Love, one reason why I live so far from my family, do places effect you to?
The closer I am to someone the farther the distance I can sense them. This is a double edge sword thou.
I do feel what others feel whether it be in person, through the phone, or what one is experiencing in a movie or tv show. I can feel their grief, heartache, anger, anxiety, and fear just like they are.
I am also affected by other peoples’ moods more than normal people. I noticed my therapist making notes about this in our session today.
SW this is what makes you a prime target for Narcs.
AH OH
I’m seeing a lot of reasons that I am. This blog has opened my doe eyes. Lol…. I have learned a lot about myself here.
I’m glad you have memories to cherish everyday.
I do not feel much of someone elses pain. I do feel the inconvenience of seeing a fender bender as I drive by. I do feel very sad when I see a dead animal or even a felled tree. People, ah, not so much. I do say sorry to them but never feel it.
I am selfish. I hate drama.
I have in the past felt very deeply about some things. It seems to have evolved. I think about the call of my father’s death, how it felt. Waking up and dressing to go to the nursing home, where I was that morning, talking to him. Looking at his body. Leaving the room so they could take him away. He was my favorite person in the world. No one ever loved me as much as he did. That was in 2007.
Ah Oh, wow, you got me in tears. 2005 for me and no one could ever love me like him either.
Yes, I think of him every day.
No more tears Love.
Nothing like the Father/Daughter relationship.
Ah Oh, are you an empath?
Yes, I have empathy. I understand the feelings, but most of the time I do not let them affect me. If it does have an effect on me, it is very short lived. When I turn my back from the person, I make a face and think how little I do feel about their situation.
Having been involved with someone with this disorder, although brief, has led me on a journey to who I am.
I do not wake up to plot to destroy someone who has not been forthright with me as I feel it just happens. They will bring it on themselves. I could tell of many times that I have seen it happen. Some call it Karma Theory. I call it “you fucked with the wrong energy this time” Do you understand?
I cry, I hurt, it is mostly for myself or my animals. My children and close family. If one is not in my contact or active in my life, then the feelings are less.
I compartmentalize. It is a skill that I have learned over the years, and I am perfecting it. Sometimes I let out an emotion, such as jealousy, but do I feel it or just pretend. Or do I feel it for a moment and then put it away again. I do believe it is a bit of both. I can say if I do feel this, it is because I am not getting the attention, not that I am jealous of the person. I do think I am the shizzle my nizzle.
Do I feel love? I look at this word as being very diverse on so many levels and a word that is overused. I love my car. I love these shoes. I love my child. Same word but so different in meaning and context.
What is love to you?
Would I help someone if they fell? Yes. Do I help someone who needs to pull their carry on out of the bin? ( These examples come to mind because I was in this situation.) Yes, I do. Does this mean I am empathic? I think I do it for the appreciation the person will show me. This is a fact.
Am I known for being nice? Yes and No.
I can go on and on. But I will stop now as I have to get ready for my piano lesson and I have NOT practiced. UGH!
Any more questions? I will tell you all about me. I am forthright and an open book. Do you know why? Because I am, no more, no less.
Thank you for sharing yourself with us, Ah Oh. I’m sure I will take you up on your offer in the future.
Hi AH OH, I felt your loss in that post. I am sorry that you lost someone that close to you. No one can prepare you for the feelings that come with a death of a parent that loved you like yours did. I am sure you have many fond memories of the two of you.
Thank you Snow White. My parents separated when I was a baby so I do not recall my father living with us. All the great things he did with me and my sister. Macy’s Parade and the room was along the route so it was like we could reach out and touch the floats. But of course we never could.
I also lived with him for a year in Germany. I was a manipulating little girl. I caused a few fights between my father and his GF. If I felt slighted in the least I would pout and say she hurt my feelings. She was very good to me too. Dressed me up like a little German doll. I have many pictures.
Fun times. My life was never the same when I returned home to my mother. For the rest of my life I was told my father ruined me and made me a selfish little girl. (I could do no wrong in his eyes)
Death, none of us will escape it. He is with me everyday in my heart and my memories.
AH OH..my dad also died in 2007. He was my favorite person as well. I never got to say goodbye. Sucks.
Yes in proximity, yet I have found I can still sense them a distance to.
Is it only in proximity for you Love?
Hi DFA. Sometimes I can get a sense while on the phone, but the physical sensations are not as intense. For example, last night I went to dinner with a histrionic (or maybe LU somatic) girlfriend of mine. Her emotions are a roller coaster. I feel ‘jittery’ one moment as she’s ranting on about her admirers. Then I feel angry and boxed-in the next moment when she’s on a tirade about the injustices of the world. It is not her words that affect me because I tune her out. I could be deaf, yet her energy would take me through a turbulent ride. I was drained by the end of the night.
I understand Love. I have a friend I can’t be in the car with for a long trip or I feel like I’m going to explode. She is not being unpleasant in any way she just has this rage when she drives lol.
Does anyone here physically feel what other people are feeling?
The Punisher what do you mean by physical? I can relate emotionally as I went through depression and anxiety after the lesser however, I have an existing disorder prior to the narc so it only exaggerated my illness mentally. They can and does affect your physical ability such as lack of energy, loss of appetite, lethargic, and body aches. Based on my experience.
Hey ent, I mean physically as if it were your own emotion. For example, yesterday someone was telling me about how their wife died and while I understood how he felt I also felt his pain as if I had lost someone myself. I feel it when people call or text me too, especially if it’s negative. As long as it’s not directed at me it just passes through me for a couple seconds and goes away though.
The punisher I think that feeling is empathy, the ability to relate to the another persons pain because we are emotional creatures. Well most of us, during the special time of month my emotions are extremely sensitive. I can watch Titanic and cry like it’s my first time seeing it😊 Also, I cry when I watch those animal donation commercials.
Does the essence of my being offend you, HG? I don’t have to contribute if you don’t like what I have to say.
No it does not.
Ok.
Hi entertainment and thank you for sharing. It’s not just empathy, it’s more than that. I had to learn what feelings were mine and what belonged to others. I don’t really know how to explain better, sry!
No problem punisher. That’s interesting, I thought you meant like you could like feel their pain. 🤔
Yes, when in proximity.
Hello, The Punisher. I do feel what others feel and I tend to stay away from people. I don’t so much through movies because they aren’t real and I can detach.
Sometimes it is retroactive. Yesterday, I was interacting with someone who lost a limb. The fact that he lost the limb entered my mind for a second but then my mind started wandering and wondering about the circumstances around how he lost it. Was it congenital…an accident…war? Then it went to his state as it was happening and after…and how he must have felt. Then I had to forcibly detach myself.
Interesting jaded, did you actually feel pain in your arm as well? I don’t feel physical trauma like that but my brother can if he thinks about it too much.
Not necessarily in the limb. The cortisol exacerbates inflammation…costochondritis, so it is right in the middle of the chest. I have to detach. I am happy for the scientific explanation.
I do feel the emotional pain of others and take it. J doesn’t. No it isn’t DID.
I’m new to your blog and very interested in learning not only about the narcissists in my life, but also expanding on my knowledge of my empathetic tendencies. I have gotten to where I very seldom leave my house because of the energy that swarms me on the outside. Sights, sounds, smells…..and people. It’s as if I’m a magnet to it all…..and I am quite lame at shielding myself from it……I am extremely selective about what I read or watch, for obvious reasons.
I am the child/scapegoat of a narcissist mother, divorced from a Greater…..and currently married to a covert-Mid Range…..I’ve only just now, since finding your blog, had the ability to differentiate between the types, thanks solely to your insight and willingness to share.
I’m curious…….do you think that narcissists were born empaths, yet due to their childhood trauma, they were forced to develop the defensed mechanism of zero feelings, in order to cope to their often tragic surroundings. I’m assuming that as a baby or young child who does not feel safe, have his/her emotional needs met, lack of proper attachment…….is that actually what makes a narcissist?
My apologies if this is repetitive……I’ve just recently found your blog and I’m spending a great deal of time absorbing, literally, all you’ve divulged.
I have actually been reading about narcissists for a few years, yet, discovering your fb page and blog have allowed me to see it from an entirely different perspective. Would you be so kind as to recommend which of your books I should read first?
Thanks for your time.
Hello IDGAF, I do think we are on the same spectrum. I find it interesting when people talk about being an empath in what I would call a Pure Empath (i.e. someone who feels connected to the world and feels all of the energy etc – I know that is putting it simply) and when people do, it does cause me to consider the link between your side and mine. You see, you essentially ‘feel’ the environment around you, it flows about you,around you and over you. I have to control the environment around me, I have to impose myself on to it and I feel everything is connected to me but I control it, not the other way around.
As to whether I was born one of your kind and then changed, I can certainly see the logic in that. Perhaps one is born an empath and as a consequence of environmental factors if one responds by taking you head down my path, if you respond by excessive giving you become co-dependent and if you do neither, you end up a standard empath.
I am pleased you are finding what I write of interest. In terms of recommendations to read I would suggest you commence with Fuel, Fury, Ask and Ask2. Good to have you on board.
I see a link as well.
Thank you for enlightening us. I’ve spent my entire life in the sphere of one narcissist or another, and I still can’t wrap my head around the fact that you/they live without any true feelings of empathy. I’ve been the object of the narcissist as well as an observer watching from a distance as the n manipulates others. Surely the n must feel something even if those feelings are ignored in pursuit of their goal? Perhaps a twinge of regret? A tiny lump in the throat? If not, then what is it that stops you from going too far?
Great point! What stops them from going too far? They go as far as they can without voluntarily lining themselves up for imprisonment and possible seclusion. Narcissists cannot bear isolation. They cannot contemplate the isolation they so adore placing their primaries in nor the dehumanisation that comes from it. Sure they adore the fuel that comes from withdrawing and withholding quite content to lock themselves away in a room where they delightfully amuse themselves with their toys, however they have people at their disposal via their toys or in the home.
Take away their toys, their access to the outside world, bar and lock them into their withholding cell with nothing but total reliance on the crumbs they so deliciously dealt to others and watch them feel!
The fuel that comes from having power over another in this way is potent’ because it is an area they are so very weak in and receive their fuel, getting off on another self induced infliction perpetuated externally on their victims.
They delight in being cruel, sadistic yet can take themselves completely out of the picture and enter a bdsm mutual affair with someone more than obliging and yet, are even more disturbed for targeting good hearted people that have no interest in this area.
The old story of the narcissist, give them what they want and they don’t want it they are like witches with a cauldron continuing to stir the pot (the world is their pot) to being about attention onto themselves for some pervasive wound where oh dear me, oh my they were uncomfortable at some point in life with what others deal with and work through the best they can without intentionally inflicting harm on others or at least making a conscious effort to minimise the fallout to others.
They are needy, children that were deeply affected by not having a need met, needs met or not met to their satisfaction. Notice how they are very lavish when it comes to themselves. They are the children that felt resentment because a siblings drink poured by a parent was not exactly equal or more than that sibling. They were the children that was given the drink of less volume repetitively through another child (parent who never grew up).
They are the child who was taught to grab the best food first at a child’s birthday party, the child that never got invited again. They are the child that did not take well to mother knows best. They are the child where mother could not care less. They are products and projections, there is no one there, they are their disease and that is to put others at dis-ease because they were placed at dis-ease in their primary years.
They have no concrete operational thought- they are the child that could not and still cannot grasp that two glasses that hold the same volume of lemonade have the same equal amount but the shorter larger circumference of that glass in contrast to the taller, thin glass has more when it contains the same amount. Bigger means more’ to them. More, means better, less means NOT GOOD ENOUGH. More means TOO MUCH! You are not good enough, your work is not good enough, would you be good enough to get me a glass of water. Stop arguing the point, you are TOO MUCH. You overindulge TOO MUCH. Who do you think you are, you don’t do ENOUGH.
Measurements and reduction. They are the children who went missing a long time ago! Dark shadows of a child they once knew and replaced for various reasons that they KNOW. Where is that vulnerable child? Discarded.
Contradictions and conflicts, confusions and collusions- the narcissist.
AAAHHAAA! The fear of isolation. I get it, purpleribbon. Thanks
Resulting in the total loss of fuel.
You were not born this way, HG. Empathy was lost along your way. The question I sometimes ponder is: can it be regained? I have some hope for you as you are one of the few who is aware of his condition.
It’s in our nature to wish for change, but why if it works for them. I too wish they could somehow have a soul to feel compassion and love for others. It’s not who they are, they are who they are. I often wondered if the matrinarc or whomever caused the damage would or could apologize and show an ounce of remorse would/could that changed them. No longer do I wonder, when someone shows are tell to you who they are believe them. Our problem as empathy we are always trying to fix things, people, and situations it’s in our nature. Once, we realize that it’s not ours to fix and move on and spend that energy on fixing ourselves only then we can reflect change in those seeking to change.
True, we want to fix people. And if we are not careful, this will be our downfall! The irony, to me at least, is that it does NOT work for them. It feels as if you are listening to an addict telling you his life is perfect. You KNOW it’s not, you know he is in denial.
Our minds are inquisitive. We want to get to the root of the matter in order to fix things. Once we know what we are dealing with, we are not blinded anymore by their words. Instead, we care enough and take the time to examine the situation. We see the restlessness in their eyes when supply runs low, their trembling hands. They will insist that all is well, but we know they are lying to themselves. Because it takes courage and strength to face your demons, and they know deep down that they are not ready for that. Some never will be.
You cannot fight their battles. Change cannot be enforced. That was a tough lesson to learn. I have slammed my head against the proverbial wall enough for two lives, it has never made any difference. Change must come from within.
Matilda, So very true as with any addiction or mental illness there’s going to be suffering (withdrawals, side effects from medications) and a host of other problems that accompany the disorder. We have to reconcile with self that we are powerless as it applies to this disease if we have to interact with them manage our own expectations. Example, if a person with dementia were to become irrational we would ignore them. We use our instincts and common sense to avoid danger however, when ensnared by npd we seem to lose those traits. More need to be done to inform the world of these types. I am sure most of us is here because when we try to tell friends and family they think we are overreacting. I really appreciate what HG is doing and have no concern why he’s doing it.
HG the more I reflect on your works, my understanding of the world I grew up in and those I love so deeply, at an extreme distance, 2800 mile distance.
I am beginning to fully understand why some chose the same path as you, knowlingly and unknowingly.
Thank you and always grateful you are here.
Is it true, then, that empathy and compassion can never be learned?
Indeed they are, they are learned from those that teach. Some of us have a teacher of a different ilk.
Hah! You answered exactly as my suspected Narcissist might! What I should have asked is if there is any way a grown up, supposedly adult narcissist can learn empathy and compassion??
Hello Lymarie, that truly remains to be seen, but my view currently is that it cannot be done.
It can be retought though I believe…
HG, through the doctors, you have said you experienced dissociation around 9-10 yrs old. Prior to that, could you have had the capacity to learn empathy?
What about the person you said you did feel a strong connection with growing up before they were taken away (was that your grandmother? I’m not sure). Do you have any memories with that person where it felt different than that wave of power? Maybe trust and happiness?
Yes there was somebody else but it is not something I am prepared to discuss at present. There remains a fog. It was not my grandmother, Clarece.
I understand.
Very true! Yet I cant imagine life different, even thou at times I so desperately wanted to feel nothing.
HG What about when you’re holding a newborn baby from a relative closely related to you. Are you able to feel at least a spark of compassion and love? Do you feel protective of the baby?
I still believe that deep within you there is a loving heart … just waiting for you to discover and welcome it.
Hello Hope,
No. All I feel is the opportunity to use this instrument to my advantage and how this child will be my mirror of my brilliance.
What brilliance???
My brilliance of course Dana, the brilliance that a narcissist believes he has and has constructed to show the world.