Tears – Part One
Tears. One might consider them the ultimate embodiment of emotion. Tears appear when you have experienced some kind of extreme emotion. I know because I have watched on so many occasions as I have sought to understand the circumstances in which somebody cries and why it is that they do so. I understand that when tears appear, whether it is a welling-up in the eyes, the single full teardrop which slides down a cheek or the cascading waterfall which leaves the eyes red-rimmed and blurry, it is as a consequence of you experiencing emotion in a huge dosage. What I had to learn was which emotions were associated with the emission of water from the eyes. The first emotion that presented itself for my understanding as to how it caused tears was pain. I remembered as a child that my younger brother was somewhat accident prone. If there was tree branch he would fall off it, if there was a wall,he would fall off it and once he even managed to “fall” off a rug and sprain his ankle. The cuts and bruises would have him howling in pain as he lay there sobbing or limped away tears trickling down his face in search of our father. I saw how a physical injury such as a scraped leg or bruised forearm would bring forth a flood of tears. My younger brother would await the attendance of my concerned father, usually brought to the scene by my always caring sister and his tears would be wiped away with a large white handkerchief as consolation and soothing words were administered. I was not accident prone and therefore rarely susceptible to physical injury save the deliberate. I do recall once catching my hand on the edge of the grill and instantly a sore red weal appeared. I presented myself to my nearby mother as I felt the tears forming in my eyes.
“No tears HG,” she announced firmly, “tears show fears, be fearless,” she instructed me as she cast a cursory glance over my injury and directed me to the cold water tap. Tears came from physical hurt but it was not to be for me.
Around the same time I also understood that tears were generated by sadness and it was sister who exhibited this the most. I would find her in one of her many hiding places (I knew them well as I used them myself) and she would be quietly crying.I would ask her why she was crying because I wanted to know. Thinking back, I never felt anything other than curiousity when I saw her with puffy eyes and tear-stained cheeks.
“Why are you crying Rachael?” I would ask.
“Mother shouted at me because I hadn’t tidied my room, she said I was a bad and dirty girl and I don’t like her saying that to me, it upsets me.”
I would nod in understanding and walk away, leaving her alone. She was instructive in showing me that sadness caused tears. Her rabbit escaped from its hutch and went missing so she cried because she missed it. She missed a birthday party because she was ill so she cried because she was sad that she could not play with the other children. If she watched something on television she would often be in tears as she felt bad for the starving children in Africa or the victims of some earthquake. She would cry and ask my father why God did these things and he would do his best to comfort her and explain. He was always good at finding an explanation, but he was a very bright man, well-read and with a keen hunger for knowledge which he invariably retained. There was at least something that I had inherited from him then. I would watch in fascination as Rachael would cry and he would scoop her up and make gentle noises to try to soothe her. Just as he laid a gentle hand on my sobbing injured brother, I saw how this demonstration of tears, be it through physical or emotional hurt engendered sympathy and caring from him. He never rejected them, he never barked at them to deal with it or get on with it, but he would always pander to their upset until he had chased it away and made them feel better. It always got them attention from him, more than I ever did. All they had to do was cry and the sympathy would flow with the attendant attention. I learned that quickly enough.
I, by contrast,never recall feeling sad. I have tried and the good doctors have asked me about this on numerous occasions.
“How did you feel when something bad happened to you?” Dr E would ask.
“What do you mean by bad?” I often have to help him provide some context to his questions. I thought he would have learned by now.
“If you did something wrong for example.”
“I was well-behaved as I child. I did as I was told. I saw what happened if I did not.”
“I see, did your parents ever tell you off?”
“Yes.”
“How did you feel then?”
“Resentful, angry, determined,” I answered quickly.
“Sad?”
“No.”
“Upset?”
“No.”
“How about after the incident?”
I glared at Dr E as I did not like him springing that on me without adequate warning. At least he had remembered to refer to it by the label I required.I remained silent.
“Did you not feel sad after that?”
“No.”
“How did you feel?”
I paused. I did not want to revisit this but I knew he would not stop until he had extracted something from me. He would prod and probe in order to fulfil his selfish desire to know how I felt. I felt empty and I felt angry but I had realised by now that if I told him this he would only go on even longer. The truth would not serve me here. I remained still and silent.
“How did you feel?”
I noticed his tone had become gentler, more searching.
I then thought of all the injustices that I had ever suffered, the hurt that had been meted out against me, the denial of my brilliance, the shunning of my achievements, the lack of recognition when I deserved so much more. I focused on the times when I had been ignored by the foolish, the fact that I am consigned to an unending quest for fuel. I brought to the fore the hurt that I keep under control except for moments such as this and I banished the room and Dr E from my mind as I allowed the floodgates to open. The desired effect eventually came, although it took some time and I eventually felt the welling in my eyes.I blinked theatrically to ensure that Dr E noticed and finally I felt a tear, only a small one though, squeeze out and make it was beneath my eye. I brushed at my other eye, features set in melancholy and still I said nothing. Dr E remained quiet as well as I stared at the floor willing another tear to join the first and thankfully it too finally came and rolled downward, a larger one this time which landed on my left thigh. He will have seen that. I did not look at him but concentrated on the floor still, summoning up all of the hurt I could muster in the hope of maintaining this appearance.
“I can see it is troubling you, perhaps we should move on. We can revisit this at a later time,” he said softly.
I nodded.
Those early observations of how the crying game worked had paid off once again.
116 thoughts on “Tears – Part One”
Vent Your Spleen! (Please see the Rules in Formal Info)
This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. Learn how your comment data is processed.
Greetings, HG!
I hope you’re having a lovely day with tons of delicious fuel 🙂
This post made me curious about your sister. You may have answered questions regarding your sister previously (my apologies if so), but I haven’t located where in your blog where it is at. Anyhoo, my question is, what effect did the emotional & verbal abuse from your mother have on your sister? Did she become co-dependent? Empathic? Did she end up marrying someone that invalidated and abused her? Judging from your posts, it doesn’t sound like she become a narcissist..?
I’m just curious because (long story short), I grew up with a raging alcoholic, sociopathic, narcissistic father, and a co-dependent, pain pill addict mother. 2 of my brothers became malignant narcissist’s/alcoholics, with one being a full on sociopath. My third brother turned out decent. He doesn’t drink, he stays physically healthy, maintains stability, but he shuts everyone out. He moved away years ago, and we barely see him once a year. I don’t blame him for keeping his distance, to be honest. My older sister is diagnosed with BPD and depression. I too am diagnosed with depression and generalized anxiety. I’m also very co-dependent, highly sensitive, and empathetic. My point in explaining all this to you is, I’ve always wondered why I turned out different from the rest of my siblings, even though we endured the same shitty childhood and abuse. Is it because I didn’t inherit the NPD gene?
Not to brag on myself, but I am nothing like my family. I don’t like taking advantage of people. I’m compassionate, I’m kind, I’m giving, I’m a good listener, I always put others’ needs before my own, I make it a point to consider other’s feelings and put myself in their shoes. However, I have very low self-esteem and I’m also very drawn to very toxic people. I guess they remind me of my father and siblings? I let those kinds of people hurt me and invalidate me and it seems like I always come back for more. Such a difficult cycle to break.
Thank you, Mr. Tudor
Kind regards,
Tracey
Welcome Tracey, she became a co-dependent and you can read about this in the book “Chained” in terms of what she became, why she did, who she married and more besides.
Tears for Fears – Shout started playing in my mind when I read that quote of your parent.
If I was your therapist, I’d ask you to write a letter to her. Making it longer than one page, of course, she dislikes waffle. And using the most colourful/offensive/hurtful language, list all her failings and tell her the no holds barred version of how you feel about her. I wouldn’t want to read it mind, burn it yourself.
With luck, you’d be at fever pitch fury by this point. I’d escort you to a soundproof room. Inside a cricket bat, punch bags, things to smash/kick/destroy and stamp on.
‘the incident’ in big letters and maybe some snaps of mother, and some darts.
Id ask you to do as much damage in 5mins as possible.
Maybe some cool down ‘whale humping’ muzak.
If only my therapy sessions were like that… ‘your mother’ *smashes joint up* ‘same time next week?’ 🙂
Incidentally, MDMA assisted psychotherapy works well. An article popped up in Guardian today ‘My therapist gave me a pill’: can MDMA help cure trauma?
I can personally recommend.
Completely different experience than when I took it in clubs.
Just say no kids.
Interesting SJ, thank you.
🙂 Intruiging. And do they realize that you are the best therapist for us, ironically?
Dear HG,
I believe if you showed **our** comments to Dr. E you could make him cry.
😉
I have a feeling that Dr. E already does cry.
But I meant in a good way. Our comments about helping us. Does he know about your books, etc., HG, or does he think that you are keeping a diary?
Yes they know about my books.
I get attached to people very easily, and if I had a best friend or patient such as Mister Tudor, I would go home and cry in regard to my not being able to “shake” them into knowing how true love feels. I would try and try in every way possible to make him understand.
I understand that feeling WP, because I have that rescuer in me. I feel free of this now, less codependent now….I couldn’t do my job if I had this with my clients. It would wreck me. I have had to learn how to compartmentize my emotions and creAte boundaries in me, emotional ones so i do not get lost in others pain and in their journey.
Indy, I am learning, but when I see others hurting or in a bad place, it makes me die inside… I have a hard time coping with seen others in a situation that would seem so horrendous to me. I want to be stronger like you are.
Hi WP and PTSD,
It takes time and practice to become less and less co-dependent. Practice…I have to practice this skill. Listen, I am in my forties and it took a lot of practice and Im still practicing. Being trained in DBT by some very skilled supervisors who help me accountable for my own seeking approval and being self strong, going through a lot of pain and seeing the patterns with addicts, along with 12-step CODA groups and literature. You have to be vigilant to look for your signs of it, not beat yourself up for relapses, and keep moving forward. It is actually a relief…a lighter feeling. It hurts to say “no”, over and over…it hurts to draw boundaries, AND we have to. Over and over. In the long run, sooooo worth it. You get your inner power back. Their emotions no longer flood into you when you practice this. They will seep in, sure. And you will always be empathic, you will not loose this. That is a good thing. Just watch out and do not confuse empathy with codependence. Or Sympathy with empathy….VERY different experiences. HG uses the word “empath” here, though be mindful that empathy and sympathy and codependence are all very very different.
A note for all with rescuing urges….Rescuing others is not kind, it is not. It prevents them from healing. Giving them a sip of “wine” to keep them “alive”, is not kind. If your replace NPD with alcoholism…you can see more clearly. You would not sneak a beer to an alcoholic to prevent shakes, would you? No. Same with fuel, people. You would bring them to rehab (or if they threaten suicide, you call 911) and leave them to the experts.
You put your own oxygen mask on first when the plane is going down, then your child’s mask. Because, otherwise, you pass out and neither of you have masks.
Thank you, Indy. I like your example of the child and airplane masks! I am learning to be less Codependent. But, still have intense BPD feelings. But, I also cannot handle someone fawning someone with glib-like displays of wordy affections…especially when I say something and they try to “up” it by saying something better and it comes out with the fragrance of being waaaaay to perfumey in a ……never mind. I will try to ignore PTSD’s sticky comments from now on concerning Monsieur Sociopath. After all, it is not my business.
I understand and I see your point. Yes, I have to be careful, too as I know I am pushing.
I too have to realize that different folks had different healing pace than I.
I feel that you are doing fine in your guidance, Indy, and I am obliged. But, this other individual is ….like a “saint” or something… I mean, everything said is LOVE, LOVE, LOVE, LOVE, LOVE, LOVE, LOVE…Love is wonderful as we can all attest to, but has she anything else to add besides her LOVE, LOVE, LOVE, for Mister Tudor, and how little we all else are for not knowing of such “grand love” as hers….(cough)? It’s like…over the top? Are drugs involved? Or, is she simply better than everybody else in the entire existence and she never even needs to use the facilities because there is nothing inside of her very body that needs to be eliminated? I mean…get real already…
WP, i do not drink, take drugs, never have, never will. I have never even tasted alcohol. So you are wrong in that regard. Again, i apologize if i have offended you. I was not trying to ‘up’ you. Regardless, i will be more mindful next time. Thank you.
Reposted:
WP, many of us here flatter, glorify, and flirt with HG all the time. It is just for fun, and is a stress reliever too.
If you read some of the older articles, you may be shocked by others’ comments, referring to their panties, body parts, outright sexual references, etc. I have expressed my dislike for such comments in a public forum. Thank you.
Reposted:
WP, i am not trying to ‘up’ your comment. I’m sorry if it appeared that way. I do feel great admiration towards HG for helping us, and a slight attachment too. However, it was a joke that i dream about him, and HG is witty enough to know that. I’ve never actually dreamt about him.
HG said he doesn’t acquire much fuel here since we are remote strangers. So i try to give him more fuel by admiration, appreciation, grand gestures of praise and love etc. He does so much for us. He answers all questions here free of charge, spends a large amount of time and energy towards us, and i assume he doesn’t gain much monetarily either (his books are quite inexpensive). The least i can do is try to increase the fuel level since much of his time is spent here. I apologize if i have upset you.
You need not apologise PANA.
Thank you HG
Never mind, M. Tudor. I’m not even gonna say what I was gonna say to you.
Hi WP and PANA,
I am not taking sides, just some observations and thoughts. It is actually a very teachable moment for all of us.
Please see, when anyone gets jealous of anyone here(and it has happened many times, we have all seen it), it is really hurting our own emotional energy (except for HG, of course, LOL, it is like a fuel slush puppy for him). I know that it is easy to make bonds, to care-take, to be territorial, and not wish to loose something (i.e. HG’s favor and attention). What it really is, though, instead of a real attachment, it is fear of abandonment rearing its head. Just like when it is hard to be completely alone and outside of a relationship. It is understandable (based on past experiences of abandonment) AND we have to ask ourselves….is it a valid experience in this place? The answer is simple. No. HG, the lovely author he is and an exceptional ally in this battle with NPD and ourselves, he is not anyone’s to be had here. Playing is meant to be fun, but taking it more than that can really set one back.
Now, outside of this blog, we also have to be fearless in our search of our own codependent characteristics. Can we be alone and be ok? This is my question for all of us. This is why I am taking my time before jumping into the dating world, honestly. I need to be OK being alone.
Just thoughts and observations, as we all have lessons on here that we are learning. No need for fights.
Peace to you all and hang in there! I had to take a deep breath while watching this go down, as I could feel the hurt on both sides.
Indy very insightful words. You are an amazing person.
Those you help have a wonderful person to talk with.
Now back to my craziness I must deal with tonight. This blog is the only place i can come and life doesnt seem so intense.
Thank you, Indy. You are correct. I do not know why I get territorial. I already have my own boyfriend, Frazier!
Hi WP,
It’s cool. It happens to the best of us. I think there are many learning opportunities for all of us here. I have so many lessons I am learning, too! We are all human!
I am in China, right now, visiting my Polish relatives. My sleep patterns are all messed up from jet-lag. I feel very unsettled, and everything is everywhere. Still, it’s a beautiful place.
How bizarre, I am in Poland visiting my Chinese relatives.
Oh yes, my Polish relatives have Chinese relatives whom we visit during the ending of the holiday seasons.
I got a fortune in my fortune cookie, the last night that said: STAY AWAY FROM DARK ALLEYWAYS & SOCIOPATHS
Isn’t that odd because I got a fortune cookie last night which said
Stay away from dark alleyways as there are no victims there
ha ha ha
I value your observations indy.
As I value your shared experiences and desire to grow as well! We learn from each other here 😊
No, PTSD…you are not at fault. I am at fault for reacting in an over-sensitive manner. You did not upset me. Hugs PTSD <3 <3 <3
Hugs back to you WP 💗
‘…less co-dependent…’, excellent indy!! I hope to make it there one day!
So…when i talk he’s thinking about something tragically from his past, movie, etc. I am happy I ever fell for it, I would just look at him. Like what are you crying for? So when that did not work he would get very upset. My mother-in-law, would say i have no emotional feelings. 😄😄😄😄😄. Yeah planning escape😬😀.
WP.. I WAS codependent. Not anymore. I admit I had NO idea all of it was fake.. and yes, it WAS easy for him.. I was gullible..
Yes, I made it easy for the Narcs, too, AH…I did not know what a Codependent even was. I felt responsible for everything and everyone. I still deeply care for others, but I don’t kill myself trying to make them better…because I cannot do so anymore. It almost killed me.
I know the feeling, WP.. I feel it’s ok to be an empath… But we are learning not to be someone’s doormat. All the best to you in your journey, my friend 🙂
I wish you the same, AH, my friend 🙂
My narc told me he cried when one of his family members found out about his casual sexual liasons. I think he was being genuine. Perhaps he cried out of shame. He regrets his affairs and has stopped.
Oh, he is a Narc who feels Regret? He actually has stopped his affairs? Perhaps he is not really a Narc, or maybe he is doing his Narc job very well on you.
Ah, you are a Codependent. He need not do his ‘Narc Job’ on you too well for you to believe. Easy Peasy for him.
WP, other posters have asked me this as well. He is not malign, not physically abusive, introverted, and quiet (except in devaluation he raised his voice at me a few times). His devil’s toolkit (as HG terms it) consists mostly of silent treatments, future faking, deflection, changing the topic, and blame shifting, in a very passive manner. He has said the following over the past 3 yrs that undoubtedly categorizes him as a narc:
1) i have no emotions
2) i never feel happiness
3) i am nothing but i can be anything (referring to the different masks he displays)
4) i have no identity
5) you will only see your reflection
As you can see, he is indeed a narc.
He has stopped his sexual liasons. I signed up with a false ID and false pic on one online dating site and one casual sex site on which he’s registered. He doesn’t know that i know about these two sites. I messaged him there. He didn’t reply and it shows no current activity. Out of shame for being exposed to his family member, i think he stopped.
I think he regrets his actions only because they were discovered. But i don’t think he feels any remorse. In other words, if he had not been discovered, he would probably have continued the sexual liaisons.
Hi PTSD,
Actually, he could also have BPD. It’s hard to tell in this setting of course, all guesses. But those with BPD, as I think you know, can look different in men. Suicidal, extreme moodiness, pity plays, black white thinking, loss of identity are all part f BPD too. If he truly feels guilt and regret, and that is hard to tell with a true narcicist as they can mimick this well, ur if he feels guilt then I wager he is a mix of traits, like BPD with traits of narcissism. The big thing that differentiates borderline personality disorder and narcissism is the ability to empathize and to feel guilt and shame for ones behavior. It’s rare for a real narcicist to kill them self,( though I never say never…because some have severe mood disorders and drug issues too, which can lead to death). I hope this helps. I’m not diagnosing, just based on what I’ve seen and learned. There are always a rare outlier.
Good for you leaving him. It’s had to cut off someone you care about and lust after too. I know, most of us here know that battle. Now, he needs professional help if he isn’t getting it. If he threatens suicide, call 911. I had to do this. With two exes. You should not be responsible for his care as it can make you experience intense symptoms too. Make sure you take care of you too. That is most important. Glad you are getting support here though I have to say I have both a personal therapist and psychiatrist and working on my codependency. It’s gone down a lot, but it rears its ugly head, it’s how I am…..I have to keep my need to overcare for others and caretaking in check and having a therapist helps a lot.
I think that is why everyone here voiced concern. For your safety. Just worded differently. we all can get passionate about our views, because it is at times a miracle we survived.
I still am still a prisoner in my own head of all the horrid memories. It is nothing I want anyone else to have to go thru. Perhaps I am being my Codependent self by trying to heal PTSD!! There you go! Sigh..
WP,
Keep healing and moving forward sweety. We are all here primarily because we need to learn, grow, and heal. Part of that is supporting one another! I don’t think you are being codependent by trying to heal yourself. If our offer heLthy support to others, that is not codependent either. It is only when we try to rescue someone else at our own expense…..that is codependent.
Thank you, Indy <3 <3 <3 Everyday is a struggle, it seems…
Thank you, PTSD. I am not a professional, but he does not sound like a Narcissist, except for a few choice sentences he spoke. I could name several other things he sounds like, but not being a professional, I won’t do this. But, he sounds nothing like a Narc from the above description. Just my thoughts!
Indy and WP, thank you for your comments. I always appreciate well thought out, well explained comments.
However, i strongly believe he’s a narc. Perhaps a narc with borderline traits (slightly different from what indy suggested).
His hoovering behavior was my first clue to his narcissism – 50 phone calls and hundreds of texts in a 3 day period. Many of his phone calls were just seconds apart. I ignored all of them. His hoovering actually surprised me because he would not contact me for days after sexual intimacy, so i thought he was losing interest in me.
He absolutely has no empathy, and has told me that. He even laughed at me once when i said the emotional pain of missing him is so unbearable that my chest hurts (he apologized later). He said he cannot feel love, and that hugs, physical closeness, and the thought of marriage gives him anxiety.
He said he has never felt happiness, and asked me what happiness feels like (after his mask was stripped). He feels shame, but HG stated that narcs do feel shame. He feels a constant underlying hate for this world and everyone in it. He lies often, but actually believes the lies.
He used to triangulate repeatedly, but finally stopped after i told him it hurts me. He is highly somatic, taking hundreds of shirtless selfies and showing them off. He told me he reflects everyone, and that he’s always ‘faking it.’ He usually has a cold, blank, empty stare.
I do have a psychiatrist and a therapist. I switched providers twice though, because they were not helping me heal. I only started healing after finding HG. However, the therapy is still in place. I appreciate your concern very much. Thank you.
Hi PTSD,
Yeah, like I said, it was a guess. It’s hard to tell online. I’m glad you are seeing a therapist too. He needs his own therapist and psychiatrist. He might be using your sympathy for him as fuel, exp if a narcissist, and drain you dry. Take care of you.
Indy, thank you. I greatly value your comments. With your background in psychology and your career as a therapist, it is undoubtedly advantageous to have your contributions on this blog.
My narc refuses therapy because he doesn’t consider himself ‘crazy,’ as he labels it. As you stated, i do believe he is using my sympathy for fuel. But i will be guarded. Thank you again.
WP: the memories – you can work with a) NLP fast phobia cure (works also with PTSD), you find it via Google, b) EMDR, c) meditation. You need to reprogram yourself, reconnect the neurological pathways. In general: make the memories small, grey&white, turn the sound off or play circus music, etc. Replace this by beautiful, big happy pictures. Search for ‘swish’ in NLP. Look into books by Richard Bandler. You can handle all memories this way, also the could ones which make you think of or miss your ex-narc.
Those are excellent recommendations Izzy!
Izzy, thank you <3 I copied your message so that I might do these things you suggested. I am grateful for your advice as a way to relieve this torment <3
Had the Narcs I was with showed such tenderness, I would still be loving them, too <3 But, even the "non-malignant" Narcs were treacherous, devious, liars, gaslighters, triangulators, mentally abusive, word-salads, blame shifters, etc, etc… Yours sounds like an angel narc <3 <3 No wonder you will love him forever. I would, too! Perhaps he is a new breed of Narc? The Narcs I have been with don't choose to do what they do; they do it because it is who they are; it is in their blood. They do not simply lie; they are The Lie.
AH I’m with you. I believe the tears are just a way to get attention. My ex narc would cry the big tears when he would get caught doing something. It was a diversion so I didn’t know the whole truth. Bait and switch.
Was your narc an excellent actor?
With alllll due respect… Your mother referred to you as “HG” ??? – PA HA HA HA 😂😂😂😂😂😂 – Cause eighteen yr olds get burnt cooking sometimes too.
No she referred to me by my first name but I’m not going to reveal it in one of my works, hence HG is substituted.
Oh my goodness! Can’t wait to read all your books!!!
Then you were lucky, my patrinarc numbered us.
How many were you Ava? Hopefully your name is not 101!
*lol* love, just 3 and a half sibling whom he called by name, if at all.
I had a childhood friend named Seven. I think she was the 7th child.
No that was Steven but the t went missing.
Have you seen the Netflix series, Stranger Things? Eleven is my spirit child !!! I love Eleven!!!
I have just started watching this Indy, so no spoilers.
I’m addicted to it! I promise, no spoilers! I actually worked in that building highlighted in the movie briefly, that building is an old mental institution. A group of us psychologists and therapists snuck in during filming, they left the doors wide open with crew inside, crazy, to tour the underground tunnels, spooky stuff.
Lol you’re right Mr. Tudor, Steven with a silent T. I forgot you were there too 😉
Glad you’re not mad at me after scolding me lol 😁 You know I have no allegiance to yours.
Apparently I’m getting something different from others who are reading what you wrote. Seems to me you learned that by crying you could get what you needed when you need it. And that’s the only reason you cry. This was my ex narc. He cried like I’ve never seen ANYONE cry before. BIG, CROCODILE tears.. complete with slobber and snot. Sometimes, it didn’t fit the scene.. but no matter to him.. He cried anyway. It was amazing. Very theatrical. He didn’t mean any of it. I know this now. He used those tears to get what he needed. Attention. My forgiveness. My supply. This sickens me.
😂 LMAO ‘with slobber and snot’! He must have failed the cry class in narc school.
My narcs and even the psycho cried very pretty.
Just a glistening of the eyes, and one lone tear drop.
Quite dramatic without the mess.
HAHA. I would have to agree! It wasn’t pretty. But that was what made it so convincing! I never knew.. He was THAT good. Sometimes it seemed weird.. Because it was a bit over the top. I questioned it at the time, but I never suspected it was narcissism. My exNarc would fall to the floor in such dramatic fashion if I pushed him off of me (he used to corner me and hold my hands while he was crying, and when I’d had enough, i would throw up my hands to push him off of me).. almost like I had punched him or threw him down.. I remember always stoppping and asking WTF are you doing??!! I chalked it up to him being somewhat of a whimp and just being overly dramatic.. again.. not once thinking it was narcissism.. Histrionic maybe??
The Histrionic I was with was incredibly theatrical!
Yes he sounds more histrionic. I only know female ones but the theatrics are spectacular.
HG I am sorry that she was insensitive. Sounds familiar to me as I do recall that N’s brother sat down with me and explained something to me. He said, Our mother was not like you, our mother was insensitive (he stated that word with an angry and changed expression to the other words). He explained how he was very intuitive and his mother would shun his expressions of sensitivity. The N originally told me tales such as: If I had been adopted into a home that allowed my feelings when I was young, I may have been like such and such a man, I may have been different but there was no place in our home for emotions. We were told by our mother, to stop the carry on (which he recites word for word at me). We were told by our mother to get on with it (which he recites over and over to me).( If we were showing emotion our mother told us, you have got to much of what the cat licks its @ss with). If I got muddy at football, I was told to wash myself under the freezing cold tap water outside the house in winter and many more tales. Tales that now he fully denies he said in the first place. Seems like he has fully regressed and has swapped me with his mother, it is bizarre and now I am the bad guy and she was the most wonderful mother and everyone loved her, not like you, he yells.
He has very stern sayings, sayings where his face contorts or changes and mimics who I believe is his mother. His posture changes as he takes over in the kitchen and the way he stirs the sugar into his tea and funny things that I notice that seem like another person in his place. Once and only once it was frightening and he had been acting very odd after arriving in his homeland. His usual rage, was replaced with a voice I did not recognise and he hunched over his shoulders, looked cumbersome and she was was a large woman but far to aged to have adopted the children, in his opinion. He came at me with this pointed finger, a new voice and was waving that pointed finger at me and characterised a complete other being. usually he would just fly off the handle and let loose but it was controlled somehow and a complete stark contrast to his usual.
The endorphines that come from tears are good. There have been cases of animals crying, I have the videos of animals demonstrating emotion, one of a rescued cow that just escaped slaughter and she cried. I cried and drowned myself in tears for her relief. I do the same when I see the seal mum cry for her demise. I take long breaks now from animal activism and investigative work because it is very emotionally challenging and I cry with joy, I cry with sorrow, I cry for others, a tear formed when I read what your mother said! That is not fear, that is the outpouring of the essence of us.
A wise friend once told me that in order to feel anger one feels hurt first. Maybe your hurt doesn’t show up like everyone else’s. Maybe not everyone is wired to cry when recalling a painful past. It doesn’t mean you weren’t hurt every bit as much as someone that cries their eyes out. Your mother should have comforted you. I assume that she wasn’t comforted herself as a child. When you asked your sister why she was crying it wasn’t abnormal to feel curiousity. You were a child. That was your way of being empathetic, to understand because you cared.
Tears, in my family, was an open invitation for ridicule. It made no difference if they stemmed from physical pain or emotional pain – one dare not show them, ever! Once you shut them off, they are particularly difficult to turn back on. I believe this to be a useful skill now, the non-shedding of tears. It can really freak people out if that is the intent.
Hi Out if Ashes,
Yes, tears were not allowed in my home either, it was more of an unspoken rule. Anger expression got us in trouble, tears were not comforted. Invalidation of your emotions early can make us loose connection with these emotions and then we internalize this invalidation into inner dialog “tears are weak”, “anger is bad”…so we no longer recognize these emotions when our guts tell us we are feeling something. I had to relearn expressing anger, in a healthy manner, nor bottled up. I still hide my tears but I’m working on how I do not invalidate them. It’s a long path to get reconnected to our emotions.
Hi Indy,
I am sorry to hear you had a similar experience. Anger was “rewarded” with corporal punishment in our home and my parents instigated it intentionally so they could then use it against us. I developed what I like to call the “force field” in which nothing said or done really penetrated me in the moment it occurred and thus they lost this power over me. I did not forget these experiences however and the correct emotions would eventually catch up, just needed to find a safe space to allow them. The “force field” has been another good tool in adulthood as I have had to navigate a lot of hard situations that would render most adults an emotional wreck, completely ineffective in rational thought or action. But they do eventually catch up and I do allow them to. These days, I have little contact with people who require use of the “force field” and I do feel correct emotions at the time of impact but still have a choice as to their expression.
Keep healing, Indy!
But, is this true, or just more words to manipulate our feelings?
I thought so.
I wonder how your tears taste Mr. Tudor.
Probably a bit wet, and a bit salty.
You never know W. You never know.
Maybe rather metallic
You wrote of narcissistic injustices and etc, but eventually you end the nonsense talk with stating a fact: “the fact that I am consigned to an unending quest for fuel.” This is your ending statement of your hurt and I find this to be quite telling of your capability of tears in that moment. Here is your tell: “I brought to the fore the hurt that I keep under control except for moments such as this.” Whether it was a “desired effect” or not you let yourself feel the hurt. The hurt of what? What summational fact did you state about your hurt? “the fact that I am consigned to an unending quest for fuel.” Yet, you pretend it was some kind of act, a preformance for the doctor. Why do you think you lie to yourself? Don’t answer this question to me here, it’s not for me, answer the question to yourself.
I am so sorry HG, reading feeling the emptiness, anger, rejection. Going to your mother and her telling you no tears, it shows fear. You didnt deserve this, your feelings not being validate.
You understand theses emotions, why do you believe you cant feel them? The wall surrounding them is very thick and now in a place you choose to not remember, and understandably so.
I dont feel anger towards your mother yet I do feel very sick, knowing. Knowing she knew yet did nothing. Did nothing just to avoid responsibility. Image to up hold. To ignore means it never happened and if it never happened then all is merry.
Sounds like you have perfected that one HG!
How do you behave though when fuel supplies are low? I understand from your writing that you would seek other sources or return to old ones.
But when it does run really low how does it feel and how do you behave?
I had a recent interaction with the MN. I know he has a lot on his plate but he seemed odd. He wanted the interaction but the whole thing seemed robotic. In a way I can’t explain. It’s not like how you’ve previously described when there is a vacancy before the storm. Although he was quite vacant it didn’t seem to be in that manner at all. I didnt get negative vibe from him. He was almost dysphoric and dejected but genuinely so. I’ve never seen him like that?
So I’m interested if you’ve ever felt like that HG?
Hi Alexis, I have mentioned previously that when fuel runs low there is an unsettled feeling, an anxiety and a restlessness. There is a sense of detachment from everything because the fuel lines have broken. The emptiness and hollowness becomes far more apparent.This increases and then it is a sensation akin to feeling like one is turning in on one’s self, the walls of the world appear to come folding inwards, the clarity of thought begins to cloud and the voice of The Creature becomes louder, bolder and more scolding. In such instances it is necessary to draw fuel from anywhere, absolutely anywhere and necessity overrides considerations such as the façade. I have written in greater detail about the few occasions when this has happened in The Creature.
My narc is going through this right now – low fuel levels. He said it feels like an ’emptiness of mind’, is experiencing forgetfulness, some memory loss, and depression. His mask is stripped and his once sky high self esteem has plummeted. He says this world is not for him and he doesn’t want to live. It makes me very sad.
How did the bunny escape, HG?
*suspecting look*
Well, I never cried in front of my family because as the youngest, I had plenty opportunity to watch what happened when my narcissistic father made my sisters cry and how they were ignored and/or put down for that afterwards. They vanished to their rooms and nobody cared.
I cried when I was alone, at night, without knowing the reason.
I saw my co-narc-dependent mother cry exactly once in my life and had no idea how to react, as I had never learnt how to deal with emotions … But: so some types of narcissists can cry …?
Did you use illness for getting attention? My sister always did that.
My mother said some time this year that I couldn’t be ill as I didn’t complain …
Interesting account of your therapist. 🙂
Hello Ava101, the rabbit must have tired of its captivity and made a bid for freedom and a desire to explore the wider world. Besides, those catches are not very strong.
I did not use illness in order to gain attention. I am blessed with an excellent constitution and those childhood illnesses one suffers as a consequence of a developing immune system had to be endured with perfunctory administration of medicine and medical appointments. MatriNarc never dealt with any of that apparently she could not stand to be around sickness. At first I thought it was purely because she did not want to become ill herself but I realised over time that she just did not want to have to deal with the responsibility.
Hello HG, oh, I understand. One of my bunny rabbits kept escaping no matter where I put it. I felt soooo so sorry for it, because I knew it couldn’t survive on its own in the wild. 🙁
–> That was one of the first things that struck me about my ex-narc: his complete lack of compassion for animals. He said he enjoyed videos were snakes ate bunnies (or bunnies chasing snakes up trees). I think he tried twice to look on them through my eyes, but said really horrible things then.
Your MatriNarc sounds sooo familiar to me. I see, no fuel to gather there. And no compassionate behavior to learn. *sigh*
Did you write anywhere about the differences between you and your siblings? How come some children become narcs themselves and others don’t? How come your sister didn’t learn not to cry? And who suffered more? Do you believe I might have been “lucky” (or maybe not) because of my two elder sisters acting as a “shield” for me?
Hello Ava, my sister is mentioned in Chained (book) but there is more about my siblings in MatriNarc and Little Boy Lost. Yes, it may well have been the case that you have been shielded.
Now you’ve made me cry @my sisters shielded me … but it’s true, I felt the difference after they had moved out and I was left as the sole target.
Thank you. Will read those books. You’re a good mirror for me.
You are welcome Ava101. I am always happy to mirror.
What happens if a Empath mirrors back to you, you?
See 5 narcissistic myths
I believe I have missed something, yet I shall look for it later unless you have a link you can give me.
Found it, thank you HG.
Pleasure
HG as we come to the end of this year, I would like to say
Thank you, thank you for all you do, the time and effort it takes to keep this blog running smoothly, FB, Twitter, and YouTube.
I can’t imagine how you do this and keep your private life running.
I do feel what you went through and it causes tears and pain for a man I have never met. I am sorry for this, but if you hadn’t become as proficient at what you do so many would be stumbling and frantically searching for answers no where to be found.
Your vast knowledge and experience shows in your writings, from creation to the why’s.
Hope your celebration tonight is amazing!
Thank you DFA, I appreciate your kind words about my work here and your sentiments about me in general. I wish you continued enlightenment as we move into a New Year.
Can’t find MatriNarc book or article (only a very short one without mention of your siblings), nor Little Boy …. ?
MatriNarc and Little Boy Lost are works in progress Ava, there will be announcements once they are completed.
DFA: what exactly do you mean?
Mirroring what’s behing the mask? Sounds like an attempt in destruction – but how?
Behaving in the same ways? I don’t think I could ever outshine a master manipulator with cold strategizing skills. Nonetheless: I wrote my ex-narc that if he ever dared to try to contact me again that I will mirror back his every single move. Has worked so far (along with all the nice things HG taught us to say).
Or do you believe that a narc would change then? Seems to me that HG’s self-reflection skills are excellent already.
Ava you cant out manipulate a master unless you can cross the line. Empaths cant or I should say dont,
Yet depending on what end of the spectrum of Empath you are determines many things.
Ava
HG is unique, self reflection vs awareness and being top in a field. HG knows what he is doing, calling him a master is putting it mildly. No other could bring this topic out into light like he has done.
When I asked about the mirroring it was in reference to something I want to discuss and knew if I missed any information HG would point in the right direction
As far as a narcissit changing, yes I do believe it can happen. Will it? Highly unlikely
Hello HG, oh, that’s why. Hurry up! Can’t wait to read “MatriNarc”!
This one almost made me tear up as I was reading how your mother coldly directed you to a water tap while offering no comfort. 🙁 I once burst out crying in front of my narc while we were having sex. Was overwhelmed by my emotions and love for him I guess. What do you think he must have thought about me? Did I make him feel uncomfortable? Did he think I was weak or too emotional? Any insight would be appreciated! Thank you, HG!
Hello IL, he would have enjoyed the fuel. If this happened during seduction he may have considered (and actually have done so) comforting you or asking what was the matter. If during devaluation he would have regarded you as pathetic and despised you.
Haha, I once broke into tears after sex with my ex-narc because it was so bad that I intuitively knew that our relationship had no chance. 😉 The only time I enjoyed it and was allowed on top, he laughed the whole time …
His reactions to my tears then were comparatively nice, he just said he didn’t know what to do or say.
Later he used my tears to put me further down, of course, it was great fun for him (yes, fuel of course). Also other displays of my hurt, like scratching my own skin open (only time in my life I did that, I’m not in the habit of hurting myself). He then said that it looked a little ineffective for killing myself that way and found that very funny, too.
Insatiable, even i cry during intimate moments with my narc. It is because i am overwhelmed with feelings of love. It is not a loud cry though 😂
It is quiet, with eyes flooded in tears, and tears rolling down my cheeks, while we look into each other’s eyes, hold each other etc.