A Dark Angel
I am regarded as a bad person. In fact, bad would be considered somewhat mild and I have been on the receiving end of epitaphs of “evil”, “satanic”, “malevolent” and “hell’s representative on earth”. None of those labels have bothered me in the slightest. Is that because they are true and I am content to acknowledge what my behaviour amounts to? Perhaps. The greater truth is that they were all delivered coated in emotion, dripping with fuel and the person hurling what they perceived as an insult at me was doing quite the contrary. They thought they were striking me down, belittling me and hurting me when they were just making me all the more powerful. But they were not to know this were they? Very, very few people actually understand why my kind behave as we do. Oh those who have the misfortune (their word) to entangle with my kind know all about our behaviours. They will sit you down and spend all day cataloguing every despicable deed, each aggressive act and all those malicious moments as if they were reading from a diary. That is how etched on people’s minds we become, how we infect their hearts and poison their souls. I know because I know what I do. I know because you show me how it affects you and you certainly do plenty of telling me (as well as anybody else who listens) because that is how embedded we become. We appear coruscating and shining and then we maim, cripple and injure. You know better than anybody else how it affects you but you rarely understand. How could you? You have no idea who you are dealing with. We do not appear with the letter N branded on our foreheads as a warning (although I suspect even if we did some people would still fall prey to us). You do not know what has wrapped its tendrils around you and you cannot be expected to know. It is not your fault although we will spend all of the devaluation and beyond telling you that it is. Those of our kind do think everything is your fault. They are programmed to think nothing else. I am worse. I know it is not your fault but the maintenance of blame is key to the upholding of control and the continuance of my dominance and therefore I will readily apply that which I know to be false in order to achieve what must be achieved. Again, you would not know this and whether you have become entangled with a Lesser, Mid-Range or Greater of our kind you become ensconced in trying to make us see, make us understand and achieve some kind of breakthrough. It is nigh on impossible. The Lesser is not programmed to accept it. You are trying to put a video cassette in a Blue-Ray player. It just will not operate. The Mid-Range must apply fault because he knows it provides him with a defence. The Greater and the Ultra of us understand what you are saying and know you are right but we will not accept it because we must remain superior.
Those you turn to for assistance do not understand either. Well-meaning family and friends struggle enormously to grasp what has happened. This is because they cannot comprehend someone can actually behave that way and it becomes easier to think you are the one with the problem, that you are over-tired, stressed (hell of course you are because we made you that way) and you are imagining things, mis-remembering and so forth. They do not want to become involved because that means trying to fathom it out and it is too hard. It also means shattering the façade we have created and it is so much easier to keep it intact and point to exhaustion/drink/drugs/hysteria and so on than grapple with understanding there is such a thing as a narcissist who love-bombs then abuses in the blink of an eye? Even those who do try to understand become jaded with the unrelenting news feed of abhorrent aberrations that you detail on a daily basis. Plus, people are ultimately too wrapped up in their own lives. Who would credit it? Selfishness from us and from them keeps you trapped.
Professionals offer some insight in varying degrees although few have actually experienced it and it is only those who have done so who can truly relate the full horror and the unrivalled brain-mashing, mindfuckery, soul-destroying rollercoaster ride of being entangled with us. Seeing is believing. The absence of truly experiencing what it means to be ensnared by us means that explanations fall victim to conjecture, theory and speculation.
This is where my good job arises. I am a bad man but I am doing a good, not a great job, by conveying to you why we do as we do, why we say as we say and allowing you to take on board this information and applying it as you see fit. This is not done as an altruistic act; such a concept is anathema to me. I have my own agenda and my own aims to achieve as a consequence of this sharing of knowledge. It also appeals to my malevolent outlook by empowering you, those who have suffered with our kind for so long, with the knowledge and tools to fight back. It entertains me to think that the provision of my information is causing consternation and mayhem amongst our kind as you, the empathic victims move on, fight back and progress. I owe my brethren no loyalty. It is one for one and damn the all. My methods are my methods are my methods. The useful consequence of my actions however is that finally you start to gain understanding. You realise what makes us tick. You finally realise that we operate to our own reality and our own logic. You realise how we see things and therefore it finally makes sense even though it does not make sense – if you see what I mean.
You grasp that it was an illusion. You understand it is lie upon lie upon lie. You realise why that was said, this was done and why it keeps on continuing. It still makes no sense to you from your perspective but then you begin to realise why to us it makes sense and that is why we do it. You understand that it is not about winning the battle but never fighting the battle to begin with because the odds are always in our favour. We make the rules, choose the rules, break the rules and remove the rules. It still takes time for it all to filter through and click into place but when it does – well, the effect is significant. The phrases you have heard so many times take on a new meaning. The actions which left you bewildered, hurt and confused now only hurt. You understand why we want you mired in emotion. It still takes you time to plough through that emotional sea but at least you now realise why you were thrown into it. Myths are dispelled, incorrect assumptions are crushed and you are given the very thing by which we operate and by which we succeed – cool, hard logic.
There is so much to convey to you. So much to detail from how we come into being, what we are trying to achieve, what we are seeking to keep at bay, why we keep doing what we do, why change doesn’t happen, why we choose you, why we never let go and so much more. All of it will be provided to you. It is brutal, it hurts and it is uncomfortable but then haven’t you had enough of the sugar-coated crap? Now it is time to swallow the harsh truth because that is what will ultimately set you free, that and your application of it to your own circumstances.
So, this is what I do. I write. I detail. I convey. I illuminate. You can keep seeing me as evil, bad and hellish. By all means, that is your choice, but I know you understand, at least most of you do, that this bad man is doing a good job. If you keep reading, keep asking and keep digesting, you will achieve your desired outcome.
All the errors, mistakes and failures you have committed and experienced can now be consigned to history as you embark on a different chapter towards your eventual freedom. No longer will you be hindered by misunderstanding, hampered by confusion and mired in the wrong answers. For too long you have been led up the garden path, taken in circles and made the wrong decisions based on erroneous understandings. That was because you didn’t have me. After all, it takes a wrong doer to show you that you are doing wrong.
218 thoughts on “A Dark Angel”
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Hi HG,
When you write:
For too long you have been led up the garden path, taken in circles and made the wrong decisions based on erroneous understandings. That was because you didn’t have me. After all, it takes a wrong doer to show you that you are doing wrong. For all the reasons which led you to write 44 books and all these illuminating articles I am thankful.
Reading some of the comments above, is there a book which describes all the circumstances by which you ended up in therapy. I listened to a few in your interviews which Christine and also in the 3 Narcissist confession books but not fully. Just wondering if that has been published and if so where?
Thanks again for all the help you have provided me and my fellow empaths. I know I would not be where I am today if not for you!
Have a great Friday-Cheers 🙂
It has not been published yet Victoria.
He who has me is in therapy also. He has the therapist totally manipulated and revels in other peoples idea of him seeking to be the best in overcoming the PTSD that he claims from the war. He really pounds it into me that he is doing so much to change. I’m still not sure if he is a narc. or merely insecure and traumatized. I asked him what he thinks he could do to grow and improve, he replied he has expanded his work. I’m baffled. I’ve read that if they are asked that question and can’t answer its a sure sign. That answer didn’t give me a sign. Either way I shouldn’t be treated in the manner and control he has casted upon me, yet I bombard him with compliments and motivation and positive energy. He craves it. He wants to be spoiled, he stated. I do what he wants. I feel guilty when I think I hurt his feelings. He makes me angry, he is full of deception and neglect and denial and he knows how to convince that what he does is right. I know more than he thinks I do now. He recently showed what abuse he is capable of to me. Just so I’m aware of it, I believe. I’m learning. I want to be sure. HG, question: Why won’t he just do the discard instead of making me plot my escape? Wouldn’t it be easier to have him discard me?
I read this and think, F you. Not you, HG, but all N’s. Do N’s go to Heaven???
No such place.
HG!
Come over to the agnostic side, my dear! (I thought you were “Christian” or a believer)…..definitely not a belieber (thank goodness!).
*evil laugh*
I believe. I don’t believe. I am whatever I need to be. I am the one to be worshipped of course.
Jesus Christ HG!
Ever So Nebulous God of Clouds and Lightning!
*BTW, that was a Justin Beiber reference, not a misspelling of believer two messages up. I have nothing against believers (since I am agnostic)…just beliebers! LOL
Great insights here. In many respects, you’re the Frank Abagnale of narc diversion. Thank you!
Ha ha and nobody is going to catch me either.
We too have disproportionate logic like your kind. We too have agendas but they are just very different from yours. What serves me is being able to believe that some of it was real. I have an innate ability to hang on-e even when there’s not much worth hanging onto. I need to believe in some type of humanity in everyone-even during the obvious displays of inhumanity. What keeps my empathic traitts alive-my “fuel,” is being able to find them even in the most malicious of your kind.
Brilliantly written-as usual of course. But I do get it and you have given me insight. Even as you write with honesty and regardless if it suits an agenda for you. It’s a hard pill to swallow. As you already know an empathy dissects others as well as your kind does. Unfortunately we focus on the goodness-even crumbs or morsels of so called “goodness.” It is in the same warped logic as you function-is how I function. To let go of my false beliefs are as difficult as it would be for you to change your ways. As you-it is my core-it is who I am and I how I was designed. I know the reality of the narcissist-I’ve been so entangled. The reality isn’t what I fail to see-it is the delusion that I’ve created that is so blinding.
Thank you CLS and useful observations.
Carolovesteven
That was very honest and refreshing to read. Yes, both sides can be pitbulls to fill their needs, its just easier for some to accept that theirs was done with pure intent towards love so it seems more palatable. Those people stay stuck until they realize there is a control issue on both sides.
carolovesteven….every once in awhile someone here writes a perspective that resonates and is quite profound… i ♡ this.. cool user name as well
I’ve been trying to understand why your mother initiated your treatment with the good doctors if she is a narc.
seems to me a narc parent would do everything in their power to prevent a family member from getting help, which would allow the parent to continue exerting control and keep their abusive behaviour private. HG, please shed some light on this puzzling situation.
Control. She has no intention of the therapy ever ending and thus is suits her agenda to appear to care but it is all about maintaining the facade and exerting control.There are other factors in play also.
thank you for your response, HG, but it still doesn’t clear up the inconsistencies I mentioned.
if your mother is a narc, she would have many other ways to exert control over you without risk of exposing her own wicked deeds. I can’t imagine any narc choosing therapy over more underhanded ways to achieve their nefarious goals.
as a Mid-ranger, your mother should be no match for a Greater like yourself, yet she has somehow gained the upper hand. how did that happen?
I also once accepted the Matrinarc label at face value, but as evidence to the contrary surfaced, it became increasingly clear that the label doesn’t hold up to cool, hard logic.
Wrong. She recognises her control over me is slipping, hence that is why she played the ‘get him in to therapy’ card. It was done purely to exert control over me. My entering into therapy did not expose her – I already knew.
How has she gained the upper hand? She has not at all. You are drawing conclusions without having read all the material I have produced about this. Do you know why I have entered therapy? Have you read about that? Are you aware of what I am doing by consenting to go along with it?
In addition to the material that I have written, you are unaware of the Grand Design which is evidence that I am the one with the upper hand.
MatriNarc looks to contact me regularly. I ignore many of her calls and choose to respond when it suits me.
HG, you keep your cards pretty close to your chest, so I’m not privy to the details in your Grand Design, but I’m aware of its existance. I’ve read about the circumstances that led to your therapy, but am sure there are more details scattered throughout the comments.
ignoring her calls and choosing to respond to your mother only when it suits you doesn’t sound like she has much control over you. if she wants to regain control, surely there are more effective techniques in the Devil’s Toolkit. like it or not, your mother’s behaviour just doesn’t make sense to me if she is a narc.
It will once you read more.
You recently indicated that you would divulge how a Narcissist was created. I assume a Narc parent plays a role. I’m looking forward to reading your explanation! Will that be in an upcoming post?
It will be in a book.
if I discover that your mother lacks a conscience, then I will know for sure that she is a narc. all nasty parents are not narcs, even though all narcs have a nasty side.
I’ve taken your lesson to heart about narcs using words as weapons to distort reality for their own purpose. although most of your writings ring true, I would be foolish to take erything you write at face value. the work you do here is important, and I apreciate the opportunity to learn from you through your posts and by interacting with you.
Where is the reply buttons? Okay I’m not that high, I know I’m replying but not every comment has a reply button…..has this always been the case? *laughing hysterically*
My comment ” then part of you is a good man” was in reply to “I don’t abuse children” wanted to make that crystal clear, HG
If you wish to regard it in that way Ms Brown, by all means. It is simply the case that I have no interest in children and have limited interaction with them as a whole.
So none of your IPPS, IPSS, DLS targets etc., had children? Because if any of them did, though you don’t have an interest in said children, it did put you in their proximity where you could abuse but chose not too… an abuser can have limited interaction and still abuse… you do not abuse children…
Yes some of them did. There are also children in the family. I don’t engage with children much – I don’t really understand them.
If children are in the proximity it can still be considered abuse in that they feel and witness how their Mother/Father is treated. An indirect abuse but abuse all the same. Children feel evil even if they dont see it (for those who think they “hide” it).
i agree with that point
I do too. I am sensitive when it comes to kids. They feel the abuse by proxy through they parent that is attached to the narcissist. That infection spills. My friends that did not even know my ex well, they saw me change and felt the different. I am sure a child would too.
The last ex of mine had a daughter. He didn’t physically or sexually abuse her, though he psychologically and emotionally did. His relapsed drinking bouts that she witnessed over the years before I came in the picture, the push-pulls and he taught her some of his tactics(lies, cheating on games), and triangulated her all the time. I miss her. I used to try to teach her about making decisions (she always deferred to her father’s wishes). She was a budding empath with some spark!
HG:
If having children furthered some goal – career, money, fuel – would you have them the same as you got married to further a goal?
A very good question. I would find an alternative way to achieve the goal and avoid having children (which I have done previously).
HG
Re: having children
Haha. I picture you scanning World Vision profiles to “parent”
When you were engaged both times, during that golden period with them, did either fiance think they would start a family with you at that point leading to the marriage? Or is that one area you have always been straight forward that you absolutely do not want to have children?
I’m just curious if you have used that as a manipulation dangling the potential for a future family when timing is right (future faking) then blindsighting and destroying that hope for them?
Of course they did.
That makes me very, very mad!
Clarece aka Little Super Tanker
You used an exclamation (and I suspect stamped your foot). You need to practice your fuel-free lol.
Never NA!! Lolll
I have such a surplus of fuel, I don’t mind if a little gets away for a good cause.
I’m the Little Super Tanker who could (like the Little Engine that could from the children’s book)?
I am really intrigued to know what and how you feel about children. I apologise if you have wrote in all these huge amounts of comments about your own child, or how you would feel about your own child? To read these many comments would probably confuse and bore- no disrespect!
I don’t have any children Mirelle.
Yes, but there are predators specifically seeking them out exactly for their innocence and inability to fight them off and they are stuck soaking all that evil up like a sponge. You have no interest, therefore there is an internal threshold whether subconscious or not that you don’t cross.
You wrote in one of your books that you had a vasectomy as a young adult because you knew you never wanted children, correct?
Correct.
That’s, of course, your choice. But did you tell your girlfriends prior to engagement, HG?
i DO regard it that way, HG
HG and Indy,
Firstly I really hope HG that you know I was not suggesting in any way that you abuse children.
Indy, I was going in that direction. He, in a way, is a living legacy of her bad behavior. I wanted to know if he recognized this.
He cannot continue the legacy of narcissistic abuse as he has remedied the situation. The thought/question was, isn’t he continuing her legacy in himself by replication? Does he see it stopped by cutting off the next generation and now does he wish to leave a legacy of novels and articles about weaponising empaths as a way of destroying her legacy and creating his own?
Must be the solar eclipse making my self expression cloudy. That is a medicinal herb btw. I am a cardholder. *Chews gummy bear hand off*
I know you are not suggesting that.
I recognise now that I am as I am in part owing to her.
The legacy I am creating includes, in part, the work here and more besides which will be detailed as it comes to fruition.
Thank you. I look forward to the juicy details. ♡
Wish I was a card holder 😂 In my state I have to be dying in order to get a card. Which after my comment, I wish I had the excuse of some *foot in mouth
You all lose me with this card holder stuff. As far as I know all things cannabis related are completely against the law here in KY. That’s why we just grow our own. It’s the number one cash crop in the state plus provides occupation to many state troopers (sheriffs of course just turn a blind eye).
Windstorm and ABB,
😂😂😂 Yeah, they are cracking down on The stuff in GA. Oddly though they just passed a law this year in GA allowing those with cancer(end stage), glaucoma, seizures, autism and end stage MS. I suppose I can’t say I’m related to someone with autism, bummer. Foot and mouth disease, 😂 Oh yes, come visit !! We will be smelling purty 😉
Roasting Smores over the flames 🔥
Im liking the EAZE out of Silicon Valley…. brilliant…. its going to be bigger than Amazon… INVEST NOW
Hi Ms. Brown C*,
I am so confused LOL…is “ease” another code like 420?
Or is this a computer software thingy(Silicone valley reference)??
I am old…LOL
Laughing at work, Indy
Haha. Snoop dogs Uber. Hes investing in Canada. Wondervif he’ll add that.
NarcAngel,
For real?
Indy
Its a weed delivery service is what i meant by his Uber lol. He was up here for real and reported to be looking to invest in some weed growing facilities he toured.
It is EAZE, a start up company out of Silicon Valley… you can google it for more info… my kid lives there and is on the up & up with all the new technology and start up companies, before most ppl know about it…. it will be nation wide, in time, and deal with all pharmaceuticals… that is the goal. Right now it’s weed products & you can get an Rx with virtual consult for $29, never leave your home & products are delivered to you! The way of the future, for pharmaceutical “Amazon” type platform… ps they r hiring drivers right now in that area too, lol
Sigh….California dreaming while living in a closed minded conservative state.
ALL dogs go to heaven!!!!
Including Snoop Dogg! 😉
lol… I have a picture of Snoop (Diggity) my Son and I together at Lollapalooza, 2003… he is like 7 ft tall, really laid back and down to earth. his whole family was there with him… please don’t ask “how” & “why”…. but its the truth
Whoa, that’s cool 😎 haha… I won’t ask but we sound similar!!! 😉
oops… first time I met him was 1997… I am really giving away my age here!
Girl! I’m in my late forties, it’s the new 30s I say!!
I’ve got it, you have hand, foot, mouth disease. That’s enough for a card right there in Michigan. Ima have to come visit u Indy. I’ll bring essential oil for your brownie mix as I light fires on HG’S blog.
or get Bitcoins and travel to Silk Road 😉
The Silk Road? I am getting educated here. Wow.
I just smoke occasionally (1-2 times a month), when in bad physical pain from fibromyalgia and autoimmune stuff. I saw what pain medicine did to an ex (he died from addiction) and ibuprofen and Tylenol are horrible on the stomach and liver. The dairy/gluten free diet is helping some. I cannot believe it got this bad this year after going through a narc relationship. Still healing my body, though my mind is doing a lot better. (No more anxiety or need for meds for it. No more foggy brain. I do have a startle response but I had that before this experience. I just need this pain to decrease. Trauma to the mind really does effect the body. I am still angry about this, as I used to be so much more active and an avid hiker etc. I guess I am healing if I am getting pissed instead of anxious and depressed LOL
Indy, I have a lot of autoimmune problems too and had debilitating pain. Mine are psoriatic and more joint related. Cutting out nightshades was transformational for me. Almost no pain anymore. Tomatoes, potatoes, peppers and eggplant. Damn hard to do, they’re in so many foods. I had to give up gluten-free because potato flour is so often used in gluten-free foods, but that hasn’t bothered me any. Just a thought…
Oh my, I have psoriasis too! I had to go on biologics and now my skin is nice and clear but my joints! ugh! I love potatoes and nightshades. Sigh….I should try that next.
Indy, one week cold turkey. If it’s going to help, you’ll feel a difference in a week. But you have to cut them all out. Especially after you’ve been on it awhile. Just a little tomato or pepper in something and I’ll have pain again for 1-2 days.
I don’t take any meds for mine. Pomegranate seed oil as a topical gets rid of/keeps away my skin probs. Need to apply it daily wherever you have issues.
It is really obnoxious to stick to, but the difference in pain and mobility is just too awesome! Even for someone with no will power like me!!
Good luck!
Indy….wow do i “get” that! I suffer with chronic pain since prob 10 years old and a rheumatologist put a “name” and diagnosis to it when i was 35… FMS, just like you. I suffer from chronic pain until the last 6 months and went into what i call, self imposed isolation…. only a few ppl get in. Thank god/dess for the Inet as it is my 24/7 lifeline and this blog my reason to get up sometimes, lol. Physical pain level decreased significantly but the rest still hurts…
I offer you the suggestions above as an alternative to get WHATEVER your heart desires. Silk Road is sic! (in a good way) otherwise I would up and move to Colorado or Cali! I love where my Son lives in Cali, but he also lives in Stuttgart also! I know you have mentioned you live in GA… I have passed through and spent time there twice per year for past 12 years… I particularly love to stay in Senoia at the Veranda with Rick and Lori! Beautiful southern charm at its best!
Hi Ms Brown C *, Thank you 🙂 Wow, you had this since a youngster! I developed symptoms of all of it in my 30’s and would go through cycles. This year was the worst. I spend so much damn time in Epsom salt/lavender baths, massages, and shopping for foods that will not make it worse. I isolated more in the past year as well. I have a good friend that pushes me out though…a good thing!
It is comforting knowing that others are going through this too. Sharing ways to get through it as well as just not being alone in it helps so much 🙂 I will check it out what you recommended. My sis lives in Cali and I see her once a year. She got a card so easily. I wish! I am not a stoner, just someone wanting to stop pain. If I get the giggles in the process, so be it (LOL).
Where do you reside (state wise?) Yeah, I have FM, CFS, and psoriasis that I think has converted to arthritis type. I am hoping all the diet changes and occasional anti-inflammatory “herbs” help. I had to put one of my jobs on hold due to the pain and fatigue. I hate it that it came to that. I love being busy.
Where are you from?
Best,
Indy
👍👍👍
HG,
To secure your legacy is a statement that you have used in the past. Isn’t it really Matrinarc’s legacy if you continue to act like she did? Not trying to start the fire here, just wondered if you have a response to that.
No because my legacy is entirely different.
How so? I understand the no from a writing/entrepreneur standpoint, unless she’s a writer/entrepreneur, but from keeping the narcissistic traits in place by using them in an abusive manner towards others, is that not keeping her inheritance alive or maintaining her legacy of sorts? *playing with matches*?
It is my legacy I am referring to, not hers.
I know that. Aren’t you also carrying her legacy as well for the reasons I stated? Or do you not want to think of yourself as being like her?
*puts kindling, wood, gasoline in pile, holds breath*
I am not like her. I am superior to her. My legacy is not about the behaviours.
What is it about then? Along these lines, I have a question I have wanted to ask…. clearly you are well off financially and don’t need the money/ proceeds you acquire from personal consults and the sales of your books, etc. Is the money generated from this going to a project or foundation you have in mind? One can’t help but wonder…. I understand and respect if you choose not to reply to this…
You will see.
Then part of you IS a good man
Hi,
I think I understand where ABB is going with this, if I may. I thing she is talking of the “passing on” of narcissism to others (generation to generation) by continuing to use what your mother had taught you as a child(abuse tactics). (I know you are more than your mother as you also have your own tactics too, HG, though just acknowledging the tendency of NPD to be passed down via abuse plus genetics). Am I in the correct direction, ABB?
Now, that could potentially occur if HG was doing this to susceptible children. Adults would not become narcissists, but victims. Which, could also be looked at as multigenerational effects. HG, (if it is ok for me to ask) do you engage in your abuses with any children, such as those in your family, that would cause harm, to your knowledge? (if you do not wish to disclose, I understand).
I don’t abuse children.
Hi HG,
I thought not, though I had to ask (I apologize if that question was insulting to you, I didn’t mean to insult you). I appreciate your response. So, then, the NPD would not be passed on as adults that receive your abuse would not become narcissists as it is created in childhood. I think that is what ABB was getting at. I could totally be wrong here, though.
Now, the use of the abuse will be remembered and associated with you by your IPPSs and perhaps some secondary as well while those of us (myself included) that have benefited from your wisdom will remember you for helping us more than anyone else. How does that dichotomy feel? Is it better because of the contrast? A man of great malice and insight that saved others? (Not meant in a judgment filled way, as it sounds. Not at all. Meant for real. We are all complex, with both “bads” and “goods” within. Yours are quite dramatic, I think. Thus, I am curious.
I wasn’t insulted. Yes, your third sentence is correct.
The contrast you identify is naturally all par the course with regard to how I operate. Of course, should part of my legacy come to fulfilment with regard to the extensive dissemination and application of my work then that will appeal to me considerably. As I detail more in my writing you will see how these contrasts flow through everything that I do and I know when many people read about what I do it will create a conflict of feeling I should imagine and something of a moral maze too.
It makes sense, HG.
The black/white thinking, the splitting of good/bad, the contrast in fuel, the stark contrasts in your personality. All compartmentized neatly. This is part of NPD and other types of PD and trauma survival. So, you do not have to think of the contradictions, because it isn’t to you. It is how you survived your life, to cut off those unacceptable events….then you put more things in there too…such as pieces of you. but in even smaller separate boxes, where the boy is.
I wonder, do you not “get” children because your boy is locked up. I had to unlock my girl to do my work with kids. Now, I will never go back. It is freeing (to me). I get paid to use play-dough, bubbles, dolls and blocks…to roll on the floor and get spit on…to play monsters. It is serious business! My grandson reminds me every time I see him, play is WORK! (He also has those eyes I bet you had as a kid, the fire eyes when angry).
The coexistence of black/white, good/bad, maliciousness/savior-esque in ONE man. It is one step away from….yep, I am gonna say it! The DIALECTIC! It would require lifting those compartment walls in you and let them bleed into one another…I wonder what that would be like? Have you wondered?
HG
I know what you mean as children and I thank you for that, but because I am incorrigible and always have to poke the bear I will point out the following……………
We, as well as your victims are all someones children..
*Goes quietly to sit next to ABBs assemblage of arson accoutrements*
Honorable goals, even if they put in such harsh manner. But what about you? Who and what could help YOU to find YOUR freedom? Not perfect “fuel”, but perfect freedom. What do you think?
I already am free, I do what I want. Yes I know I need fuel but it does not restrain me.
Um…with all due respect…
(bull poopy)
You are chained to fuel. Free as an addict.
But, hey, look who else is free like you….yep! Just your ever loving, optimistic, do-gooder, empaths and co-dependents!
*oblivious singing*
*hearts and flowers and marsh-mellows*
*skips away with her basket of stale fuel*
Indeed I am chained to fuel but it comes so easy it is not a burden.
Says the 30 something who throws caution to the wind. What about the 70 year old HG down the road?
I watched someone with addiction in their 40s and seemingly cheat death multiple times. He died in his 50s when death had his number. I kept telling him, stop. I kept saying that he had so much to give, why do it? I kept saying the body will not keep up and the mind will fade with all that self abuse. He would go fuzzy, then come back better than ever. He believed he was invincible. My son nick-named him the terminator. I even believed somewhere inside. He kept going and going. Until he didn’t. This addiction clouded his cold hard logic. And those of us that loved him as well…
it was his choice.
As it is yours.
No, you are not an opioid addict like my ex was, but you can still die from this. You never know when you cross that one person that is more dangerous than you (from viruses to craziness). And, will you be able to get that fuel when you are 60? or 70? I would hate to think you would fade. Use YOUR cold hard logic!
Make that fuel yourself!
Just two cents from someone that lost someone they loved.
when it comes to romantic entanglements, I believe you consistently expose the painful truth behind a narc’s facade. bravo, HG, for being brutally honest! the game changer for me was fully understanding a narc’s two states — they either control you or spend the rest of their life trying to control you.
as long as your aims are secret, how do I know that I’m not unwittingly helping you harm another innocent soul? will your growing success as a narc guru give you the means to take revenge on those who have done nothing more than stand their ground? I certainly hope not, but in the face of an insatiable appetite for the dark arts, hope is entirely futile. nonetheless, your work is highly appreciated.
Thank you CLJ.
true.
I cannot condone your behavior of attempting to shred the soul of those who fall for your games in real life/offline. You hurt/wound every single one. Your kind does. Yet you, the elite narc, do so knowingly and willingly… That to me is terrible/unacceptable, twisted, corrupt and warped.
I cannot deny that your blog has done countless good in giving closure, understanding and healing [via eye-opening knowledge] to those that fell prey to your kind (possibly even yourself).
I cannot tell if you are simply attempting to get revenge on Matrinarc for what she has done to you or if you would have turned out this way regardless… both by hurting these women that fall prey to you and by this blog that gives you thought fuel on how you annoy and starve your own kind by “weaponizing the empath” or if you somehow seek to find an adversary you deem worthy of yourself in some long drawn game… possibly all of the aboves…
I cannot qualify you as “evil” because you do good, yet it’s very clear you are not “good” since that is a choice with intent behind it and the feelings to match, in my opinion anyway.
Ah, but is it a choice to entangle then elicit fuel? Certainly not for the Lesser or Mid-range Narcissist, according to my understanding. Does awareness imply choice for the upper Narcissists? HG can probably answer that!
I don’t think my Narc was aware of why he does what he does do to reap fuel. I think he only examines what works and does not work in order to attain his fuel, much like a lion or shark hunting their next meal. And lions have been documented having killed and eaten their own…
The choice is that of the Greater, yes. Lesser and Mid-Range operate through necessity and their own perspective. In their world view, what they do is correct and the only way thy see it.
i agree in so far as, it IS about intent… all thoughts/actions are
LOVE this paragraph!!! : So, this is what I do. I write. I detail. I convey. I illuminate. You can keep seeing me as evil, bad and hellish——-You are the bad man doing a Great job.!!
<3
Indeed. I didn’t know that. The good angel of death,
” … carrying the souls of all the deceased to heaven.”
And, interestingly, he has the same role as Maat, even though in Egypt, he would have been the one writing down the result of the weighing of the soul (he is the God Thoth).
“In his third role, he weighs souls in his perfectly balanced scales. For this reason, Michael is often depicted holding scales.”
But here, he is holding a sword, therefore:
“He is viewed as the angelic model for the virtues of the spiritual warrior, with the conflict against evil at times viewed as the battle within.”
Saint Michael Archangel,
defend us in battle,
be our protection against the malice and snares of the devil.
🙂
I only knew that he was the protector, fighting for us, and that he stands for “balance”. So, I’ve learned something new. 🙂
This is a hotbed of learning Ava101
You inspire me, master teacher. 🙂
I think I have told you just a few times how grateful I am for your blog 😀But just in case…. thank you HG!!!!!
You are welcome Star.
Uhm … which angel is this on the picture by the way? Is this Michael?
He is the Christian Angel of Death so I believe so, yes.
The logic here is outstanding and has saved me, and many others, from emotional devastation. I found clarity and answers in the darkness and I see exactly what you mean. It does take time to learn, but simply put: we win the fight by not fighting. You are the darkness and we are the light; you bring us the answers that set us free, like no others before you. You are the Bearer of Light.
Thank you K.
Agonizingly beautiful.. thanks HG, you’re giving us the “closure” we could have never got by any other means..
You are welcome.
Thank you HG, I thoroughly enjoyed this piece. Extremely well written and engaging.
Thank you Lisa.
Hello HG. How much truth does it take before one “gets it”? The market you have tapped into is an ever producing sap tree. Fitting Yes?
The key to understanding that you have provided, in spades, is to continually take in knowledge. It becomes useless however, if you do not apply it. To succeed as an empath you must destroy every iota of hope that a narcissistic relationship will change. There is nothing that you can do. No angles, no communication techniques, no self improvement which will cause the narcissist to change. It is embedded in them to think and act as they do. Only the narcissist can choose to dial back his tendencies. Nothing external to him can make him choose to change. Which is so difficult to understand as we empathic individuals want to believe so badly, that another human being could not possibly walk around feeling ambivalent and/or nothing in regards to certain emotions, primarily love. It is the brutal truth. This topic has so many facets. So much to say, so much to convey from your mind. I wonder if we will be able to contain it? It is so much to take in that newcomers must be fed intravenously. Then move to baby food. Then solid food. It’s nice to watch the transformation of others as they seize the power. I bet it’s very gratifying. Please continue with your writing as I am wanting more meat and potatoes….I want dessert too, but that’s another matter altogether.
It is all about winning the battle between cool logic and emotional thinking. Some people take longer than others to cross the emotional sea.
and you are the very best at being bad!
You’re not doing this for us, helping us is just a by-product. Nevertheless, I think you’re doing a great job educating people. Thank you, HG.
It makes me very, very angry that a narcissist, of all people, needs to come along to teach us. Where have the mental health professionals been all this time, to PROTECT the vulnerable, to SPEAK UP, to EDUCATE?!!!
When pupils are hanging themselves having been bullied for years by junior narcs… when desperate wives and husbands are seeking help in marriage counselling with their demonic partners in tow, only to be victimised *all over again*… when battered wives are too scared to get a restraining order… WHERE THE FUCK ARE THEY WHEN PEOPLE NEED HELP MOST URGENTLY?!!!
I despise them for having known all along yet having done nothing to raise awareness.
Fair points Matilda and thank you.
Right on, Matilda! I read many, many useless “getting over a breakup” books and blogs, but didn’t really get the recovery process started until I found this site and started to understand the real cause of my pain.
Exactly! In fact in my Amazon review for HG’s book “Exorcism”, I said something to the affect that this book has parts relevant to anyone going through an especially long, hard break-up whether or not it is with a narcissist on beginning the steps to move on. I can’t even click on links to articles about relationships or dating because so much of the “advice” would actually enable the narcissistic dynamic even more.
On a side note, HG, I hope one day you become a good man doing a great job!!
Thank you Clarece.
RecoveringNarcoholic,
“I read many, many useless “getting over a breakup” books and blogs, but didn’t really get the recovery process started until I found this site and started to understand the real cause of my pain.”
That’s how it unfolded for me, too! I was quite well informed by the time I stumbled upon HG’s work. I had many pieces of the narc puzzle, but also a lot of conflicting information from mainstream media, and was trying to see the bigger picture. I found the answers here. The peace of mind is priceless! 🙂
Matilda. I read your comment and understand where you are coming from. However…my thought on this is this…’where are those people that should have been there to protect and educate?’ My answer is, I believe they had no idea (true idea) about narcissism. Its only in recent times that the knowledge has become available. Its only in recent times that the word is truly spreading. Those so called professionals were probably (and most likely) not taught themselves on NPD like they may be now days. After all, who were they going to study to get their information? Certainly not many narcissists. They dont go for help, or if they do, it would only be part truths on what/who they really are. Whatever the educators of this world were taught in the past, I dare say it would have been from limited sources, old text books and very little hands on experience. Therefore, they can only know what they know. Can only teach what they know. Can only protect in a very limited way. I, like you and everyone here, certainly wish our past victims had a better understanding that could have come from someone, anyone. But in saying that, at least now we have HG and those that truly do know about this subject, to teach us, our educators and the victims. New and old. May all our futures be better for it.
I agree Lisa. I don’t believe the information on Narcissists has been readily available for Health Care Professionals or the public, until recently. I took at least one psychology course in Nursing school (long ago) and never encountered info on Narcissism. I divorced my abusive ex 15 years ago and the term “Narcissist ” did come up in my research, without a lot of relevant information. I’m just grateful the information is now available, that HG is sharing his insights for whatever reasons and that we’re able to have this discussion!
I agred Kim, most definately. If education is not there, then it simply is not there. Surely now, our future generations will have much better access to this problem should they need it. Thanks for your response Kim.
Does anyone else wonder why this is? I mean after all narcissists have been around since the beginning of time. Why is it seemingly a new problem?
I think narcissism was a necessary survival trait when times were more brutal. Still in my culture so many of the traits of narcissists are tied up in “being a real man.” Also the rights and equality of women is unfortunately still fairly new in our cultures.
I think it is that society is changing and what was once desirable is now considered a problem. Societal change is slow and that’s why information on narcissism is still difficult to find. In my culture many people still see no problem with narcissism. They see it as strength. Elite narcissists are looked up to and highly respected. There’s still a lot of the old “might makes right” thinking.
That’s why HG is so ahead of the curve in his posts educating people about narcissism. My opinion.
WS2…I can remember asking my mother why my father was abrasive, arrogant, abusive and aloof while groung up. Why all she cared about were appearances, polished floor boards, home made clothes and her tiny waist. Why there was no nuturing but plenty of rescuing (of other kids), and why we were only to be seen and not heard. And to add to that, her constant criticism of me.
Her response, “well it was just a sign of those times. It was just how it was back then”.
Hmm. Now, as for narcissism by todays standards, I put awareness down to the internet and word of mouth. It is clearly a sign of OUR times. Has anyone noticed the use of the words ’empathy’ and ‘narcissistic’ all over the TV by any chance? I certainly do. It seems suddenly theyre being used more and more, as if to draw our attention to it. Its only a matter of time before it will all be made aware, to those that are still asleep. Those that havent, as yet, had the luxury of HG for example. We are living in a break through moment. Thank god!! (so to speak 😉 )
windstorm2…i wonder about this too and i think its a couple reasons. First i think theres an overabundance of narcissists where years ago it wasnt as pronounced. I think this is largely due to the fact of lifestyle changes and the family dynamic disintegrating. Theres more divorces now then there was years ago. Thats not to say people who stayed in marriages that were toxic shouldve and this could cause damage to children in itself. Nowadays people really struggle to get by and are more stressed than they ever were and this rubs off on parenting and not being as present for their children. In turn i think its lead to narcissism being on the rise in children. It starts from the roots which are children! Lifestyle also in the media and internet has formed more of a narcissistic view. Children are like sponges and soak up what they see and learn as being whats popular and accepted.
On the flipside i think narcissism is on the forefront and making front page like codependancy was years ago bc were more aware of this problem in our society. I deem it a problem bc true narcissism is invasive and damaging. Narc traits are healthy if balanced but true narcissism is lack of empathy and destruction. Despite many successful narcissists it still does not make it healthy or right.
Narc Affair
I understand your viewpoint, but think we probably are from very different backgrounds. Both my parents grew up in homes with no electricity or running water. Their parents worked from sunup till sundown at hard physical work and had little time for the children. People in my area have it way easy compared to past generations. I’ve heard so many stories from my father about horrible abuse and sadistic treatment he witnessed of many women and children who had no way to leave, no abuse shelters, no government or law enforcement to aid them.
At least here in KY, I know without doubt that life keeps getting easier – not harder. Even just in my lifetime. And I haven’t even touched on the availability of information- tv, the internet, things like this blog. Even when I was young if you lived in a remote area you were cut off from all communication and sources of outside knowledge (think of what that was like for narc victims – and there were tons of them!) Many people grew up and never even saw a bookstore. I could go on, but I’m just upsetting myself….
Windstorm
Im glad things are better now but it kinda made me sad at the thought of all those banjos silenced.
What do you mean silenced? Now people have more time to play and upload to YouTube.
Windstorm,
your comment is very interesting, I was reflecting on this while cooking dinner. 😉 Good questions.
Why has never ever anyone told us?? I assume other narcissistic psychopaths were and are busy scheming and putting on a facade. HG would be too busy, too, if he didn’t have plans of his own … just a wild guess. 😉
I do feel lucky to have received all the information I got.
I think there have been many descriptions of narcissist and psychopathic behaviour over time. We also have a fairy tell here about it, it called “the cold heart”. Also, the story of narcissus must have come from somewhere … They are all over literature.
But no detailed descriptions, or explanations (still don’t have any), or how to cope with it. Maybe people thoughts it would be enough to give moral guidelines.
It’s also true what you say: it wasn’t regarded such a problem in the past, like in ancient rome or during the inquisition … in Rome a woman was the possession of a man anyways, and he could do whatever!! he wanted with her. But they knew how to punish narcissists – punishment by erasing their memory. As if they had never existed.
There also might have been tribes, clans, over history, where an abusive husband would have ended up in the swamp, tied to a stone … because people would have lived closely together in family units and would have noticed such behaviour, and especially when it was posing a danger. Because it would have, too.
But you’re right, that kind of behavior wouldn’t have been unusual since the dawn of patriarchy, it is described in the old testament, and everywhere. Maybe … it wouldn’t have made a difference anyways, one or two centuries in the past, if we had known more.
But you are actually saying something very good here: We do notice now, and someone behaving like Nero does get noticed. And there is more information now in general and HG’s information in particular, so we can learn to identify the next narc crossing our path.
So … here is part of the Law of Maat, Goddess of Truth, Justice, and Balance, from before partriarchic times, who weighed the soul of people. Sounds like she knew what she was talking about. If I remember correctly, her 42 laws had to be recited every night.
I have not told lies.
I have not closed my ears to truth.
I have not committed adultery.
I have not made anyone cry.
I have not assaulted anyone.
I am not deceitful.
I have not stolen anyone’s land.
I have not been an eavesdropper.
I have not falsely accused anyone.
I have not been angry without reason.
I have not terrorized anyone.
I have not been exclusively angry.
I have not behaved with violence.
I have not caused disruption of peace.
I have not acted hastily or without thought.
I have not overstepped my boundaries of concern.
I have not exaggerated my words when speaking.
I have not worked evil.
I have not used evil thoughts, words or deeds.
I have not spoken angrily or arrogantly.
I have not placed myself on a pedestal.
I have not acted with insolence.
Maat is a killjoy, Ava101.
Ava101
Now THAT sounds like a fairytale lol.
Ava101
You make interesting points as well. I agree that society has tried to curb abuse through moralistic teachings. But while some abusers were dealt with by society, I believe most escaped all punishment because isolation and poor communication kept their worst abuses hidden.
I found it interesting that when you thought of harsh times in the past when narcissism was valued, you thought of Ancient Greece and Rome. I was thinking of 50-100 years ago!
See? She knows.
And it might come as a surprise to you, but there are people who find it a joy to live in peace. 🙂
I was just thinking … maybe a lot of ancient religious or spiritual practices were _also_ designed for your kind.
However: Maat is not a killjoy when you know where she leads you after you have passed the test. And I think you are improving your chances through this blog. ;P
Thank you Ava101
🙂
Lisa,
Those are very good points, especially the limited availability of narcs as objects of study, and up-to-date information on the subject.
Perhaps they did not know any better… hmm, food for thought! 🙂
Kim,
“I don’t believe the information on Narcissists has been readily available for Health Care Professionals or the public, until recently”
I cannot speak for health care professionals. They might have access to information via their institutions/employers.
From my experience, state-of-the-art information in the form of research papers, published in prestigious, peer-reviewed journals, are not publicly available. You can only access them through affiliation with a university (as I do). Abstracts are free to read, but entire articles cost up to 30 Pounds each. Not a viable option for most of us. A sad state of affairs.
I’m also grateful that alternative ways of educating yourself are now available 😀
Windstorm2 and Narc affair,
“Why is it seemingly a new problem?”
I think it has to do with the shift from physical violence to psychological violence. In former, you could spot narcs, and avoid or deal with them. These days, torture is of the insidious, silent, invisible, relentless kind.
Depression, burnout, psychosomatic illnesses etc. are on the rise, people are less productive which jeopardises economies. Perhaps that was when the elites started to pay attention, and the issue became more widely known.
Windstorm:
No need to go back in time at all – narcissistic, psychopathic types are the ones wanted on top of large corporations and countries today. Or so it seems.
I thought of 50 and 100 years ago, too, but then went back in time. 😉 Because I was thinking about ‘when narcissism became normal’. You said yourself “from the beginning of time”. 😉
But it’s true that the victim was completely isolated and without information 50 or 100 years ago, too, and there are many many stories told about women telling other people and finding noone to understand them, or to understand what was going on. And no information either, and if they did know what they were dealing with, there weren’t many options to apply this knowledge. Lots of things, and lots of ways to deal with the situation, were hidden. It’s an interesting question: what personality types were in control 100 or 50 years ago (and today) – and could also suppress empowering information.
Even if someone had had written down this kind of information back then, in words that everybody could understand – who would have published it?! And no narcissist would have at his own expense without personal gain.
Even if there had been such a book around 100 years ago – my grandmother wouldn’t have had access to it, nor the time or money.
Movies like “gaslighting” and lots of books tell me that people knew about such personalities. But there wasn’t much they could do. The lady who told her side of the story of “deep throat” (the movie) – she was sent back against her will to her beyond abusive husband by her parents. Police didn’t do anything. They all seemed to think that she belonged to her husband and that it was okay that he beat and raped her. Never mind the severe emotional abuse, that was not even an issue. That was only 45 years ago.
But you’re right, when my mother married my father (1965), his narcissistic personality must have been regarded as “leadership abilities” and things like that on the outside. My mother was isolated, they moved away from her family, all she had was their christian facade (my father was a baptist pastor back then). (But she is a narcissist herself).
She also had no access to information. I guess people to go to would have been … well, the pastor …and maybe her doctor.
But you certainly can forget about books from the 60ies on relationships or psychology.
Noone ever questioned the role of my father OR my mother. My own sister told me later that it was okay that her husband beat her (she also told me that I should have been beaten more often with a belt, when I was a child)(Yes, she was being serious). That was around the year 2000.
I had one teacher speaking up, but she was “smeared” by my mother.
My grandmother was even beaten at school. That was over 100 years ago.
So yes, parts of abusive behaviour, at least by men, must have seem “normal” and acceptable or even desirable. 🙁 And to be non-emotional, decisive, ruthless, etc., anyways.
Same goes for abusive behaviour by parents. My parents even had books on child care, those books obviously failed to teach them about emotional availability and respecting the needs of children.
In the 70ies, my father was a pedagogue, he worked with young men from disrupted homes and who had difficulties. His narcissistic character traits obviously weren’t a hindrance.
One of those young men slept with my eldest sister when she was 13. That also wasn’t noted in the 70ies.
Ava101
Very rarely do I read a long post where I agree with every single thing said, but I do with yours. I have seen examples of everything you described. You could have been talking about where I grew up and people I know. And while the subject of narc abuse is a sad one, it’s always so refreshing and affirming to see that, despite often obvious cultural differences, we are really all so much alike. We are way more alike than we are different. We are not alone and there are others who do understand.
Great comment Ava101. Thanks.
Thank you, Windstorm.
Where are you from, if you don’t mind saying here?
Ava 101
The state of Kentucky in the US. Never lived in a city or even a small town. Although I lived most of my life on small farms close to a town. Even when I went to university I commuted back and forth each day. I’m not much on following other people’s rules and love the freedom in rural areas – and also the wildness and beauty!
Where are you from?
Windstorm:
I’m from Germany. I went to school in the US for a school year (Massachusetts), but I haven’t been to Kentucky. I imagine that it must be beautiful and what you describe sounds wonderful!
I live near a big city, but also right next to the woods, which I love. Will go collect some midsummer herbs tomorrow.
Ava101
I have a narc friend from Aachen but he lives in Munich now. And my exhusband and one of my daughters in law were born in Augsburg. Their fathers were stationed there in the army.
Long long ago I went to summer school at the University of Valencia in Spain. When I had travel time I went up to see Augsburg and got attacked by a hotel guard dog and got to see the inside of a German hospital! It was very interesting.
I thought Germany was much more like the US than France or Spain. I actually felt at home there. Probably because so many Americans have German ancestry. My fathers family was from Bavaria by way of England. He had a lot of family come straight here from Germany.
Oh, yes, Windstorm, we are very Americanized, and are about to loose our culture and national identity anyways. People sometimes ask me which country I’m from and assume that everyone here is English speaking. The French fight a lot more for their nation. And the British are wise.
You have a narc friend in Munich … oh, my. Yes, Augsburg is kind of pretty. I worked there when I met my narc. …
Hi Matilda,
You anger is completely justified! I, too, feel that anger and some sadness too. It took me over a year to find a therapist that knew something. I wish this was taught in grad school to all mental health professionals as a requirement. It wasn’t when I was in school. I had to go through it personally, then learn from my clinical supervisor. She sent me to HG!! Actually, it needs to be taught to all kids…to be honest…in high school. And how to keep one’s boundaries and build self esteem in elementary school. It is really ironic that the person that helped us the most is the Ultra Narc Extraordinaire. And, I am so glad HG has taken this mission on. Regardless of his intent.
It is slowly getting out there, and it is so slow. On a positive note, just the other day I found a small group of therapists that are getting certified in Narcissist Abuse and found a colleague of mine, I was so happy to see it! I do not know if it is as useful as HGs knowledge, but it does use a trauma informed approach for healing, which is awesome. They also support the use of no contact too. I need to learn more about the program. I am not sure if HG is OK with me sharing the website, so I will hold off on that. It is a database of therapists that are trained in Narcissistic abuse. Many are in Cali. (Let me know, HG, if you are OK with it, I do not wish to disrespect your site).
Even with these new developments, HG really lays it out and it is hard to find anything else like this out there.
I was looking for my sister, who is ensnared now. I referred her to HG for consult too. It is really sad and a disservice that more are not trained, so many people are going through this. It is a huge hole in the field that is not being filled yet….and there are those of us getting the word out. I refer friends of mine here too, to learn.
👍👍👍
Clarece
Is that allowed? What will the big purple hand say to your subterfuge?
I’m feeling adventurous. We shall see. Lol
Hi Indy,
I agree. It should be taught to all students in the mental health field, regardless of their future career paths.
I believe things happen for a reason… perhaps you needed to experience the pain to be the healer you are now 🙂
Yes, it should be part of the curriculum in High School, preferably discussed in sex ed class which all students need to attend. A more holistic approach is needed, more about keeping your heart safe, not just your body.
I am delighted that there is a course dealing with narcissistic abuse, that’s fantastic!! 😀
Yes, HG really is the best source of information out there, I am glad that I found his works, so glad. My mind was spinning endlessly trying to make sense of it all, but no more! 🙂
One reason why awareness of narcissism is rising *so slowly* is that access to scientific research on the subject is not readily available to members of the public (as detailed in the comment to Kim above). That’s a pity!
All I can do is to educate those I hold dear… they shall be safe from hurt and harm 🙂
Hi Matilda,
I too believe this to be the case. All things do happen for a reason! I like to think that we are like Kintsukuroi pottery. We are more beautiful because we were broken at one time…and repaired in gold.
🙂
Indy
I’ll settle for new glaze
Narcangle,
Or new pot…lol
Indy,
“We are more beautiful because we were broken at one time…and repaired in gold.”
I agree wholeheartedly! 🙂
Indy and Matilda
I have contacted my local high school and they have agreed to add NPD to the curriculum and I wrote a local newspaper (Love Letters advice) about it. The first response was pithy and she ignored my second e-mail. But I am persistent. I am working on plans to contact another local paper. The fight is on ladies!
Wow!!! K!!!!
That is amazing, I cannot wait to hear about what they include in the curriculum! I’m inspired. Proud of you! Indeed, the fight is on!
HG, have you thought about writing for teens?
I haven’t but I can see the clear need for it to be done.
It would need to be taught in a way that is sensitive to the fact that some children/teens have parents, boyfriends/girlfriends, coaches, teachers with signs of it, they themselves may be developing it….hmmm…gotta think about this. I know teaching boundaries and signs of all types of abuse is a good start. But, how much more and what manner is most effective? HG for Teens 😊
HG, if you had a high school class on such, how would have you reacted and would it have helped? At what age do you think was your turning point and what age would have perhaps changed your course toward narcissism? Do you know this?
I doubt acquiring such knowledge would have prevented me from becoming what I am. I think the provision of such information to those at high school, for teens would be to enable those people who are not of my kind to know what to look for and to defend themselves. If you tried to introduce the topic prior to the teens, it would not work, the children just would not understand. It needs to be put in the context of when romantic relationships are about to happen. Admittedly, some children start at a young age with this (I did) and therefore not all will be ‘caught; before they may have exposure to a narcissist in a romantic sense. What is evident is that material ought to be put in place at an early juncture.
K
Good work. If the school has accepted, it must have been accepted for the entire school board in your region then? It would have to be here as schools do not allow individual curriculum. If thats the case its an even bigger deal.
Indy
I am working on it and will keep you updated. Next, I will be looking into domestic violence laws in my state; there is a State Representative that I am acquainted with and I will contact him in the near future regarding NPD and DV. The thought of children, and adults, suffering is impelling me to channel my anger into action. The game is afoot!
You rock!!!
NarcAngel and Indy
Thank you! I am on a mission. Narc Angel, I wish it was the entire region! The Director of Phys/Ed. Health has agreed to add it to the existing curriculum for the town that I live in. Then I will try to find out how to get other schools to do the same in other districts. I am trying to impress upon him that students in the school system (past and present) have been affected by NPD. Keep your fingers crossed!
Fingers crossed and smiling!
K!!!!!!!
That’s fantastic news, I am so thrilled for you!!!!!! How inspiring!!!!!! Made my day!!!!!! 😀 😀 😀
Matilda
Hear hear! Where the fuck are they?! All the suffering out there that should/could have been prevented. Useless professionals. Useless college degrees. Tits on a bull! My heart breaks for the children that are victims of these psychos. I am gonna make it my personal mission to educate and protect as many people and targets as I can. I told my ex I would see him in Hell and I will take down as many psychos, along the way, as I can. Might as well put my empath rage to good use.
K,
“I am gonna make it my personal mission to educate and protect as many people and targets as I can…. Might as well put my empath rage to good use.”
Exactly, sister in arms!! 😀 😀
Matilda, Indy & NarcAngel (Sisters in Arms)
It is time to bust out a can of whoopass on some ne’er-do-well Narcs!
I got your 6, ladies!
Over, Echo-Mike-Papa-Alpha-Tango-Hotel Kilo
LOVE!!!
Sisters in Arms!!!
Absolutely, K!!! Their reign needs to end…
Well, after my last relationship, I have very often felt like a bad person myself. I mean, how do you call someone who finds relief at night by thinking of ways of killing another person? I do not feel guilty about those thoughts, not at all. Feeling bad was an unexpected, hedonistic pleasure for me- it is indeed powerful. Anyway, I haven’ t killed anyone yet, and I believe I won’t in the near future- too much trouble :). I do not know how I feel about you, HG. For a long time I did not feel anything, but deep and pure interest in your thoughts. I surely do not hate you, I do not get angry with you (since you haven’t hurt me personally), I do not adore you either (because you wouldn’t be able to adore me) , but I do admire you. I admire your cleverness and your great use of language, and I admire your courage to make yourself clearly visible-although cleverly remaining completely invisible. You are the one who actually gives Narcissists an identity, that is what I believe. I love that unique “Narc Honesty” and it is enough for me ( I will never ask you about your age, promise). Needless to say you have helped me a lot. I think I have mentioned that I had a good psychologist who lead me to understand I was dealing with a narcissist (in my country everybody thinks that a narc is just someone who looks himself in a mirror), but it was you who showed me all the hidden details and the ways to deal with it. And, I am not sure I have mentioned this, two months ago you also made me cry, for the first time after more than a year of reading you. It was not an article, It was one of your comments. I read it and suddenly tears started going down. I still do not know why, but it was then that I admitted that you are a part of my life.
We are all telling the truth here, at least what we consider the truth.
If we want to be fully honest we must rely of the source of The Truth to understand if what we are thinking/saying is, in fact, the truth.
You talk about a ” bad man doing a good job”. Is this the truth?
“Matthew 7: 16-18
16By their fruit you will recognize them. Do people pick grapes from thornbushes, or figs from thistles? 17Likewise, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. 18A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot bear good fruit.”
Apperently a good man can’t do bad things and a bad man can’t do good things. This leaves the question to you, what are you HG? a good tree or a bad tree? You decide, this is your call and nobody else’s
Wow. That was a lot of fruit salad.
lmfaoooo
That was the Bible, NA.
But no problem, I am used to the laughing and joking (dumb I must say) each time the talking touches the Bible, or Christ, or Faith. It’s unbelievable how people have all sorts of weird and personal fantasies about Jesus, religion, Christianity.
They make the assumption that since God can’t be seen than He could be just about anything and they go wild with imagining things mixed with poore knowledge of history, the scriptures, personal fears, traumas and punk views of life.
Guilia
Since you brought it up:
Thats the problem with the bible. Its open to whatever interpretation you like and I wasnt sure what all that talk of fruit had to do with anything (nor do I want to know your interpretation). I interpret it to be a fantasy and a religious ruse to keep people in check and keep from living their lives as they would like in hopes of some mythical garden party later. The biggest future fake ever (again my interpretation). You interpret it to be real and put much faith in it just as you did the Narc in your life to be the Prince Charming that you wished for. Howd that work out ? Dumb to make jokes? Its just other peoples nice way of saying keep that shit to yourself cause I didnt ask for it. But your perfectly welcome to keep believing.
Oooh NarcAngel!! Them’s fightin’ words down here!! If you said that here you’d be attacked by women like a pack of pit bulls! Despite all your spunk, I fear they’d pull you down by shear weight of numbers! Just to hint that scripture is open to interpretation is heresy here.
You reminded me of the fate of my favorite priest many years ago. He was giving his homily on the story of Adam and Eve and he said, “Of course this story is really more of a parable. It was never meant to be taken literally.”
You could feel the temperature in the church drop 10 degrees instantly and most of the faces were stone hard. Within a month he’d been reassigned to a tiny parrish in Central America.
My opinion is that religion is like most things – it’s what you make of it. I think the Buddha summed it up best in his last teaching. Religion is like a finger pointing to the moon. Don’t get caught up examining and arguing over what the finger looks like. Just use it to find the moon.
Windstorm
Bring it lol. Attacked? Surely thats not God endorsed. Or perhaps it is-just like the punishment meted out to your Priest for suggesting people use religion as a guide to find their own way. He must be a punitive God. As a child I did beg and cry out to him. I called on God and then I was told I had to say “in the name of your son Jesus Christ our Lord” (so very particular) so I tried that. I tried all kinds of his other aliases too. Then I asked if he would not help me because I was a very bad girl, if he (or they) could just help my mom see, or my brothers and sister be safe instead, or to just make the man who was hurting us stop. Nothing. Silence. Every time. Well……that is unless of course he answered with more pain and suffering because that is what happened. Ask they say. He answers they say. He forsakes no one they say. I was an innocent child asking for God. Either he doesnt exist or hes a sadistic voyeur is what I got out of that. If he exists and hears others and they want to believe thats fine-but dont darken my doorstep with him now.
I meant your townfolk with their religious pitchforks lol, and not you Windstorm. Im cool with you and the moon thing.
I am forever grateful for your work HG. It seriously changed my relationship dynamics and people skills. Thank you from the bottom of my heart.
Thank you Amynm101010
Are we seriously so dumb a civilisation that you’re the first ever to write this in detail? Of all the literature and published observations of all time, where is there detail of how a deliberately abusive mind works? How come nobody had the tiniest curiosity to delve into it?
I recall so many time watching the narcs dying to confess and I simply told myself they were infantile, mischievous and confused. But all of them know.
They’d rather hide behind characters in books and movies in an attempt to normalise evil as part of human nature. It most certainly is not.
I agree, it is not. Research is being done. For the reason why our civilization is dumb about the subject is because most people are satisfied with the answer to it: evil. Which is not the answer.
A bad man doing a good job eh? Must say this is a fine attempt to search the truth inside yourself nonetheless still an attempt.
Besides, that is not the point because the point is not you but US.
I appreciate your work hugely HG.
It has given me freedom, a complete sense of self, confidence and happiness in a way I had never even dreamed was possible for anyone in this life let alone me.
And of course, I can’t help myself by causing a little bit of chaos and upset to the Ns who cross my path. They don’t know what’s hit them, now they’re the ones left confused and bewildered. Not for long I appreciate that as they quickly seek out fuel to repair and heal any NI I have caused them. But yes, you can take al the credit fort actions.
Thank you Alexis.
Honorable goals, even if they are put in such harsh manner. But what about you? Who and what could help YOU to find YOUR freedom? Not perfect “fuel”, but perfect freedom. What do you think?
I am free already, I do as I please. Yes, I know I am shackled to fuel, but that does not cause me a problem.
By far. The best article I’ve read yet. Every time I read ur articles I understand more and more. It’s like every time I have a question, ur there with an article that has the answer. It’s the honesty that I appreciate most. The irony in it is almost nauseating. I really need to thank you. My narc made me feel soul raped. Your brutal honesty is soul healing.
Thank you Melanie, indeed it is brutal honesty.
An absolutely fantastic, thought provoking read. People who have never encountered this type of abuse just can not comprehend. I don’t blame them, as it is very complex but there will be no being led up the garden path for SVR anymore. I believe the bad man is doing a good job. I know that I was sorting my life out myself and may I say I was doing a great job as it’s a slow process. I never knew what was really going on in my past but I always knew something was amiss.
I believe this man is doing a good job (thought I would credit you twice HG, but only this once, understood?).
Thank you SVR.
HG, you are doing a good job! A great job! I have searched far and wide, yet find myself returning time and again to your books, your videos and your FB posts. You have become the primary source of information for me on Narcissists and relationships with Narcissists. The clarity you provide has given me the understanding I sought, the freedom to let go and the wisdom to rebuke a possible relationship with another Narcissist. My understanding and perception have changed and consequently, so has my life! I am and always will be grateful for the gifts you have given me and others like me!
A bad man doing good things? We all have a place in the universe & lessons to be learned and shared. I still believe we are all connected by love, even the Narcissist who needs and seeks our love. And the Narcissist especially, needs our understanding and love… from afar!😉
Thank you Kim.
😙
Thank you so very much, but I don’t think of you as a bad man, really. I don’t even think of the two exes and the various men since the exes as bad men. The latest greater is the one I would say is a bad man because his secret behavior is such a contrast to the image he portrays. I hate saying so, but I don’t forgive him yet.
I just do not know what to say to this piece. Perplexed, The last sentence of this piece says it all.
Wow HG !!!!
Hi HG, I am grateful for what you do. Your reasons for doing it are not a concern of mine. You have helped me make sense of my past relationships, especially the one with my father growing up. I knew that I always ended up with emotionally unavailable men but didn’t understand the extent of it or how all the behaviors that I saw were not partly made up in my head! The frustration of trying to explain to someone what was happening just to see a blank look on their face and what amounted to a pat on the head and told it would all be ok. It wasn’t ok and I knew that, I just didn’t understand it! I consider myself to be an intelligent woman and I needed to understand! Wtf? I will figure it out, I will learn, I will fix it! Lol. Whatever your reasons, this is not about you at this point. I want to learn. Please keep writing and I will keep reading! Thank you. The validation alone is everything to me
Thank you ABL, I shall certainly keep writing.
” A good job” won’t do for me, HG. You seriously have and are doing way bigger than I can express or find words big enough out of my league to tell you how my life is changing for the better, because of your writings. I understand that agenda world you mention, I got it from the beginning reading you. I don’t want to sound weird or mushy but I am proud of you.
I know you are a bad man, I live with one and he is pure evil, but I don’t feel any fear of him until he reminds me of his connections with his bad family. That’s when I feel a danger of something weird. Not violence just weird. Scary. I guess I get scared like battle of soilders against only me. Or maybe it is the real evil and void nothing inside of him he is showing me. This feeling only started less than two years ago when I was told what he is, and when I told him what I know he is, he looked at me and agreed. I don’t mention it anymore since I started reading this blog. Thank you.
Thank you Geminimom.
If it weren’t for you, I would have gone back when he returned exactly a year to the day. I only stumbled upon your writings a few days before his return (Hoover) so I still needed to learn a lot but it was enough to question. I didn’t go back but still walked away (9 months later) with some more scars. It’s finally time for a consult. I need some help with getting my life back. Thank you.
You are welcome Nomore.
I thank you for doing a good job! Most of us appreciate what you do here, in helping us to understand and gain freedom
Thank you Ms Brown.
ummmm, you took my starr?
My xnarc was 1 out of 5 sibblings. They all grew up in the same environment but he seems to b the only one that became the narcisstic sciopath????? Don’t understand how it didn’t affect his sibblings too??
HG, here is some fuel for you….. your articles get more and more well, having trouble finding the right word, but I guess disgusting and just plain sad. A waste of time because the tone isn’t the same. Why the shift in delivery of the information? At first I read them and it seemed informative. Now it just seems creepy and mentally ill. The empath that I am just feels sorry for you. What a miserable way to live.
Kristen
Are you sure the tone and delivery you sense is not a growing recognition on your part? That youre reading it differently because the truth of what has occurred,and your part in it, stings a little more as it starts sinking in? If youve been in a relationship with a narc youre used to lies and sugar coating so it might seem harsh to you, but the truth almost always is. If you are ready to heal you will want it head on-not a light and fluffy version that allows you to make excuses for either side and for it to continue, or to avoid any responsibility in it.
Being taken stings-no question. Getting mad at the truth seems pointless but its still better than doing nothing at all.
This is actually an older article of his, Kristen. Did you happen to see “Angels With Dirty Faces”, and “Evasion Tactics” new this month? Both completely on point!!!!
I have learned much listening to u. I actually dropped the bomb on my now xnarc. I have been no contact for a little over 2 years. When he punched me n broke my nose, I called the cops, filed restraining order until the duration of divorce papers I filed. As far as the hoover, I doubt highly he would ever try it becuz I’m not exactly the kind of empath he first thought I was. He said that no one ever did what I did to him n I replied, n no one ever physically abused me like u did……guess we’re even up now. Dont get me wrong, I have suffered much grief in finding out the true, phoney person he is but have healed due to reading n learning over 2 years ago who he is.