Sadistic Streak


You could be forgiven for thinking that all of our kind are sadists. From your perspective, much of our behaviour, if not all, makes no sense and therefore it could be argued that to behave in the manner that we do must mean that we are all sadists. That is an understandable proposition. After all, if one day a person is kind to you and then the next is nasty to you when you have given them no reason to behave like that, then surely such behaviour is sadistic is it not? The behaviour has no grounding in any logic, the nastiness is manifesting just for the hell of it, is it not? Are we then not deriving pleasure from your hurt and discomfort and therefore that must makes us sadists?

A true or pure sadist is one who derives pleasure from the sadistic act. This often manifests in a sexual arena in that the act of sadism is acted out in a sexual engagement or the sadist becomes sexually aroused from the sadistic act (which may not be sexual in nature). Accordingly, a sadist may derive sexual pleasure from flagellating a bound and gagged individual. Similarly, a sadist may become sexually aroused from murdering the pet kitten of someone else.

Those of you have familiarity with my works will understand that fromm the narcissistic perspective, what we do is not done solely for pleasure (indeed we do not experience pleasure or joy) but rather it is done for the purposes of gaining fuel. It is our need for fuel which is the driver behind all of our behaviours because the emotional response of another provides us with the validation that we desperately require to fill up the void which exists inside of us.

The acquisition of fuel occurs in many, many arenas. It might be gaining a smile from an appreciative stranger as get in a lift with them, from the tears of our partner who is crying after we have held them by the throat and described how much we hate them or from them ecstatic groans of our lover as we provide them with orgasmic relief. In each instance, fuel is what flows, fuel is the aim and fuel is what is required.

All of our kind receives fuel from the emotional response of others. We do not feel joy from inflicting pain on you because we do not feel joy. Your pained expression provides fuel. It could be tears, it could be a smile, it could be laughter. As long as there is an emotional response then we gain fuel.

When you are hurt from our manipulations this is a by product of our need to gain fuel. It is a collateral consequence. Our lack of empathy means that we do not care that you are hurt. However, it goes further than this. The reduced cognitive function of the Lesser (and to some degree the lower echelons of the Mid-Ranger) means that not only do they not care that you are being hurt, they do not know you are being hurt. They see an emotional reaction and that provides fuel (although of course they do not know the mechanics of that operation). They cannot recognise the pain. I appreciate this will be rather hard for some people to grasp – how can he not know I am hurt when I am telling him so and he sees my face twisted in pain and the tears spilling down my face? The fact is, those members of our brethren neither care nor know. Thus when you are manipulated it is done purely for the fuel, it is not done primarily to hurt you. This is cold comfort nevertheless as the outcome remains the same. You are hurt.

Where we have a sadistic streak (and this is more prevalent with the upper echelons of the Mid-Range and the Greater Narcissist) we know we are hurting you and we do not care. The knowledge of your hurt adds further fuel. Accordingly, your emotional response which we witness provides us with the fuel (in the same way as a Lesser or lower echelon Mid-Ranger would) but the knowledge you are being hurt and we are causing this, provides  us with extra potent fuel.

A sadist behaves in the way that he or she does purely for the sake of pleasure. We do not do it. If we have a sadistic streak then we deploy it in our machinations for two purposes:-

  1. The provision of extra-potent fuel as described above; and
  2. For the purposes of punishment and revenge.

Our aim, through this sadism, is not solely pleasure but rather the reinforcement of our superiority. Not all of our kind wish to punish, hence, they have no sadistic streak. The Mid-Ranger who has lost his primary source will feel fury for this transgression but he is far more likely to direct his energies to applying an Initial Grand Hoover to get you back and reinstate the golden period. He has no urge to punish you. Even if that IGH fails, he will then focus on recruiting a new primary source and he will leave you alone. There may be benign follow-up hoovers when he devalues the new primary source, but there is still no desire to punish you He may be looking to ‘win you back’ or just gain positive fuel. If this fails, he may not apply a malign hoover, but instead will leave you be before returning at a later juncture with another benign hoover (if conditions are right).

If you have been discarded by a Lesser but you keep trying to find out why he has discarded you, he will apply malign hoovers. This is not done as an act of revenge, but is rather done to make you stay away so he can focus on his new primary source and so you will not spoil this golden period by telling lies (the truth) about him to the new primary source. He wants you deleted and the malign hoovers are a response to your interference.

If you find yourself in a situation where you know that your particular narcissist has a new primary source, you are doing nothing to enter the spheres of influence but your narcissist will not leave you alone and is applying malign hoovers against you, this is evidence of the sadistic streak. It manifests as a malicious obsession which causes you to enter the sixth sphere of influence (see the relevant section in What is Making Him Come Back? ) and then the Hoover Execution Criteria are met.

The relevant narcissist may not actually receive any Proximate Fuel from you as you are treated to these malign hoovers because he cannot see your reactions, so you may wonder, why would he do this? The reasons are as follows:-

  1. The sadistic streak means that he is willing to sacrifice the fuel he is gaining from the new primary source to carry out this sadistic, malign campaign against you. Usually, the narcissist will want to gorge on this positive fuel from the new primary source and keep his attention on this person, but where there is a sadistic streak, he is willing to use some of this fuel to power the malicious campaign against you as the discarded or escaped former primary source.
  2. The sadistic behaviour allows for the provision of Thought Fuel as the sadistic narcissist contemplates your terrified reactions and it is his perception of how you feel (even though he cannot see it and thus it is not Proximate Fuel) . Ordinarily, a non-sadistic narcissist would not bother to apply the energy to gain this weaker Thought Fuel but a sadistic narcissist will do so.
  3. Our superiority is maintained by doling out punishment and revenge. A non-sadistic narcissist would seek that reinforcement with a new primary source (because it is easier to gain that positive fuel from them and to focus on them solely). The demands of the sadistic narcissist are such that he requires this ratification and validation from both current primary source (positive fuel) and discarded former primary source (negative Thought Fuel and the power felt from the application of revenge).

Accordingly, when you are entangled with a narcissist, so that the Formal relationship is continuing and you are being devalued, and he exhibits sadistic behaviours towards you, this is for the purposes of gaining extra potent fuel. If the sadism occurs post escape or discard, this is done to punish you. If Proximate Fuel arises, so much the better but if it does not, this is not a massive concern to the sadistic narcissist because we are willing to sacrifice the fuel gained from another source in order to power our desire to achieve revenge over you.

Since you look at matters from your perspective and not ours, you may find it difficult to truly distinguish when sadistic behaviour is being used against you during the Formal Relationship. It is, however, at its most recognisable when you have escaped us or have been discarded. If you know we have a new primary source but there is a campaign of hurtful behaviour being used against you – slashing the tyres on your car, putting bricks through your windows, posting unsavoury comments about you online, handing outflyers accusing you of child abuse and such like – this is the sadism being manifested. This is not a smear because the smearing happens prior to your discard (so we have got in first) or if you have escaped, the smear will happen before we get another primary source. The key determining factor in knowing that you are facing a sadistic narcissist is that we have a new primary source and instead of relishing solely in the golden period with them, we are lashing out at you again and again.

67 thoughts on “Sadistic Streak

  1. mollyb5 says:

    My narc has become sadistic to me .

  2. Sillyolperson says:

    Dear Mr Tudor,
    I was hoping with your knowledge, I could seek confirmation of what category my ” killer kitten” step dad was!
    Thanking you

    1. HG Tudor says:

      You can through consultation.

  3. Sillyolperson says:

    Dear narc affair,
    Thankyou for your kind thoughts. I have a very loving, caring family, even though I was never shown it from mine. I’ve bottled this up all my life and am now releasing and reassessing it. My health depends on it. Coming across Mr Tudor, he has helped me to understand what I was dealing with. I always thought it was me who was to blame and my fault, but now I understand, it wasnt me, it was them. The massive collision in my life, brought all this to a head.
    When I recap, it’s slmost surreal, I can’t believe it actually happened, but it did. At 7 years of age, I was lured away by the bogeyman, I managed to escape and he was caught and arrested.
    But, after all that, I believe myself to be a a kind, caring and loving person. I wouldn’t want it any other way.
    I understand your pain narc affair! I sincerely hope you are in a better place and moving forward as I am.
    Heartfelt wishes

  4. MyTrueSelf says:

    He watched porn, was very open about it. He asked me repeatedly for affirmation that his manhood was big/ hard enough.

    HG I can identify with what you describe as more than a ‘sadist streak’.
    For him it was an ingrained characteristic of his being.

    There had been numerous instances of abusive behaviour and I moved out of our European city apartment . This particular city had major housing shortages, I didn’t speak the language so over the next few months I lived anywhere that would take me at short notice- first with my boss and his family, then a place two hours outside the city commuting 4 hours a day, then in a rental with a guy who routinely had prostitutes over.
    The ex charmed me and I moved back in.
    I felt exhausted, drained from having the foundations of my life shaken.
    I sat on our living floor and tears streamed and I felt as if I was breaking down. The ex sat at the end of the sofa and watched. Not moving he reminded me that he had had it MUCH worse when he first moved to the city. Then he leaned forward and said, “do you know what I really want to talk about now? Nazi torture. They had a reason for it and I’m interested in it. What do you think? Hey?”
    I knew at that moment there was something so very deeply wrong in him.
    He drew power from watching me in my suffering.
    It brings tears to my eyes even now.
    I did not understand evil in the world, but I do now I’ve been on the receiving end of it.
    I know ‘psychopath’.

    1. Sillyolperson says:

      So so sad and just awful to read this. I hope you are out of this persons life and are now healing!

    2. No More says:

      Doubt you will see this but this is very similar to my experience and so sorry ….i know the suffering well. Mine kept reading Auschwitz, hidden from me. I grew up in Holland and my grandparents helped to protect and hide the Jews. I have so many stories about all of that. If he was so fascinated, why didn’t he ever ask me about it? Never did but reading those books? He too was obsessed with the torture part. Ugh.

      1. K says:

        No More
        He didn’t ask you about it because of his sense of superiority and omniscience and, besides, he sees you as one of the “little people”. What do you know? (nothing) You’re just an appliance. Now be compliant, shut up and let me do the talking (that is how he thinks).

  5. narc affair says:

    My dad has a sadistic side to him and my brothers inherited it 🙁 a lot of what he did when i was younger ive tried to block out of my mind bc its too upsetting. He was very mean to our dogs. I now see it as a sadistic streak. He once neutered our dog with his friends. I really hate him for this. I try not to think of the memories or id never talk to him again. I dont understand where this stems from but i find it disgusting! Sadism is evilness at its core.

    1. Sillyolperson says:

      Dear narc affair,
      So sad to read this, that is so disturbing! Like my stepdad killing my kitten. Sick and twisted! That’s why they inflict pain on the defenceless! Seems to be a male thing!

      1. narc affair says:

        Hi silly….so sorry you went thru all that 🙁 i dont understand how people can be so evil and mean. I hope youre healing and can fade the abuse. You can never undo whats been done but possibly replace with better people who love you and treat you well. I know there are parts of my childhood i deliberately dont think about bc they are deeply upsetting.

  6. Sillyolperson says:

    Dear Mr Tudor,
    My stepfather suggested to my mother to move house without telling me, they thought they’d do it for a laugh! They even bragged to people about it! I sent letters and cards (after researching the address, they had a silent phone number) for 21 years …. nothing, zilcho, zero!
    Is that not sadistic ?
    Kind thanks

    1. HG Tudor says:

      It is. One of my friends at university would call his parents and repeatedly there was no answer. I told him they had moved house and not told him. He got rather upset thinking it was true. They had actually gone on holiday. He was rather gullible. He would wear camouflage pants and every time I would say “Chris, where are your legs?” and every time he would look down and then become irritated he had fallen for it again.

      1. Sillyolperson says:

        You are very naughty Mr Tudor …. I’m like your friend Chris… gullible!

      2. Sniglet says:

        Ha ha ha ha!

      3. Yolo says:

        Silly old person. H.G. how cruel but entertaining.

    2. Sillyolperson says:

      Also, my first stepfather, I believe a “narcissistic psychopath” from my research (have you written about them, or could you )? He charmed everyone, (he married my mum for the status of being a “family man”) but behind closed doors, he hit my mother and belted us kids with his strap, til blue and raw! He tried to gas us kids and killed our kitten. He opened my mums letters and destroyed her personal items. He was gay and a female impersonator as well ! How would you describe him Mr Tudor?
      With abaited interest….. Thankyou

      1. Sillyolperson says:

        The irony of it all …. my real dad who deserted me, tried to kidnap me as a kid, I was the one who had to organise his burial, the psycho narc ended up in mental institution I believe and my last step dad, I had to organise his funeral and now I’m caring for my matrinarc !
        What a twisted bloody tangled web! Everyone came running back to Miss fix-it, bloody goody two shoes, frickin Mary Poppins!
        No wonder I’m stuffed up mess !

      2. Sillyolperson says:

        Dear Mr Tudor,
        If you could be so kind. Do you have any thoughts on this?
        Thanking you

        1. HG Tudor says:

          On what SOP?

    3. narc affair says:

      Silly…thats so awful! Unbelievable!

      1. Sillyolperson says:

        Dear narc affair,
        The one or two I told snippets to, didn’t believe me, I think they thought I was making it up! I could never tell psychologists, I never trusted them. I’ve come here to the right place with Mr Tudor, he’s the only one who knows these people’s minds and has helped me to understand. I could write a book… psychological thriller perhaps .. haha
        Thank you for commenting

  7. Mona says:

    Kimmi, there are some others too. You do not have to look so far in the past. Look at Idi Amin. Only one example : he killed one of his wives, let her tear into pieces, then asked some doctors to rearrange that body. They had to sew all the pieces together and then !!!! he showed this kadaver to his own children, who had cried and wanted to see their mother. They saw her.

    You do not have to go so far in the past. These kind of monsters are still around us.

    1. HG Tudor says:

      Not done that one Mona.
      I don’t have any children to show them to.

      1. Lou says:

        😳 You do scare me sometimes Mr Tudor. I think we often forget you are a sociopath.

        1. HG Tudor says:

          Understandable, but you ought not forget what I am. It will help you ultimately.

      2. Lou says:

        I agree. I have a lot of respect for what you are doing through your blog, but you are right to say I must never forget who you are. The image of one of you memes comes to mind (the little girl caressing the huge bear)

  8. kimmichaud1 says:

    Even more so than marquis da sade excuse my horrific spelling

  9. kimmichaud1 says:

    Greatest sadist ever vlad the impaler

    1. narc affair says:

      Kimmi…i was going to bring up vlad as well yesterday!! Yes he was the worst sadist ever!! I cant imagine living back in those days very frightening!

      1. narc affair says:

        Prince charles is related to vlad btw

      2. kimmichaud1 says:

        I would love to live in those days I’m obsessed with all things vampire the medieval Era and most of all eastern Europe I plan to visit his castle someday

      3. narc affair says:

        Hi kimmi…i also love history(medieval in particular) and would love to visit whats known as vlads castle. Its beautiful and perched on a mountain. I had watched a documentary where theyd said vlad hadnt lived in that particular castle much in romania. At the time the village was so terrified of him. He placed a golden goblet(as a test of his power) in the middle of the town square and no one dared to touch it. One story was he was eating dinner amongst the impaled bodies and his closest allie exclaimed it stank and if they could eat somewhere else. He had his nose cut off and impaled him as he continued eating with his friend impaled next to him. He was pure evil heartless and sick.
        Prince charles i never cared for. Hes super eccentric and idk i just never found him personable.

    2. kimmichaud1 says:

      Narc affair when I was in junior high school prince Charles visited my city in Massachusetts to tour our former mill city he spoke in a courtyard don’t remember what the heck he talked about but he was clearly wearing red Rouge on his cheeks and red lipstick creepy as f**k he is one ugly looking man but his sons are both very handsome got their looks from mom lol but yeah I think he’s a narcissist

  10. narc affair says:

    Ive seen sadistic tendencies in my narc when id be upset over something and he took pleasure in that. Its considered negative fuel but i still think theres an element of sadistic behaviour there.
    Same thing when hed laugh over someones struggle.
    As far as sadistic physically i dont think he is.
    One of our neighbors girls i seen early on had a sadistic streak when she was cutting ladybugs 🙁 i still get very upset thinking about this bc it is not normal behaviour. I told her to leave and said it was very mean to do that to animals. I see as a teen she has subtle sadistic tendencies but ive not witnessed it in regards to animals. Moreso just lacking the empathetic component and enjoying if someones struggling. I dont know if its genetic or from upbringing. Her and her sister were foster kids for a few yrs in their early childhood. Her sister on the otherhand is the meekest empathetic person

  11. KMR says:

    Current situation…3 year sadistic streak going on, and he recently got married.

  12. Just Me says:

    HG, thank you for the reply. I have great respect for your opinion. I will assume he had supply on the side to satisfy those needs… I was too good of an appliance to risk losing.

  13. Mona says:

    Maybe ,HG, you are not able to feel joy. My special narc felt joy, when he hurt me intentionally. I saw the pure joy in his face. There was no fury, it was a strange combination of cold hate and pure joy. His eyes were shining brightly, when he saw I felt pain and he was able to see and recognise that it was pain. He told me so. And that was the truth. He could hide his manipulations and lies for a long time, but he was not able to hide joy. He showed real joy in the Golden period, through devaluation and after discard. He learnt it by his parents, that hurting people is joy. He did it even in the Golden period against me,which I could not realise at that time.

    He is a pure emotional sadist. It is no streak it is his nature. He loves it more than anything else. Astonishingly he does not like sexual sadism in the sense of sexual violence at all. This is a great taboo for him.

  14. Diva says:

    “If we have a sadistic streak then we deploy it in our machinations for two purposes:-

    For the purposes of punishment and revenge.”

    Hey K …..I have a feeling if I meet a true sadist I am going to be in big trouble, probably on a daily basis. Never mind I have a high pain threshold…….that’s what Father Ted said anyhow!!!!…….Diva (definitely joking!!!!)

  15. Salome says:

    Dear HG
    Does Sadistic Empath existe?

    1. HG Tudor says:

      Only in the context of adopting that mantle for the purposes of role-playing.

      1. Salome says:

        What do you mean exactly “role playing”?

        1. HG Tudor says:

          A professional dominatrix for example.

      2. NarcAngel says:

        Sadistic Empath here reporting for duty.

      3. Dr. Harleen Quinzel PsyD. says:

        Narc Angel,

        I can relate 😜

  16. HKGirl says:

    My stbx-H always claimed he never said or did anything to hurt me. (But insisted anything I did or said that hurt him was intentional)

    As you stated, HG, even when I would specifically tell him what hurt or triggered me, he’d continue to do it, usually blaming my behavior for why he did – or his “right” to something. “It’s my right to sleep in a room where someone isn’t pissed off at me.”

    What always confused me about this was the lengths he would go to to appease and comfort his daughter. It was as if he had empathy for her and couldn’t abide the thought of her being upset with him. After his wife committed suicide, he very much made an emotional wife of her. At first she embraced our relationship but as his triangulation got worse, she grew to resent me and after she turned 18, told him that if we got married, she would move out, and told him to choose me or her. We got married, she moved out, and he spent the next year of our life – until I left, blaming & punishing me and doing everything he could to get her back home.

    She is now back home and our divorce is almost final but he keeps insisting on ridiculous changes to the property settlement (the latest he wants it noted that the car that’s titled to both of us and was awarded to me belonged to his late wife). Again, this is just to hurt me as he hated his late wife, treated her like dirt, had a 15 month affair that contributed to her suicide.

    Saturday was my 48th birthday. A box arrived from him. I expected it to be some of my belongings that he forgot to bring when we exchanged property last month.

    It was two of his tshirts, worn and unlaundered.

    The birthday card read “I know a lot has transpired between us & I am sorry for my role in that.” “When I was out there, you told me you knew I loved you & I felt good” “You are a good person & deserve to be happy.” “The sentiment on this card is sincere.” “It’s not a Barbie cake but I hope something you wanted.” “Love, Scott”

    Gosh, HG, have I been wrong about him? Is he not really a Narcissist? That sounds… so Loving!

    Oh, I should mention that the latest changes came via email earlier this evening with a note telling me how rude I am for not acknowledging or “obviously” appreciating his gift.

    Maybe, he’s just batshit crazy!


  17. Susan Kay says:

    The term “Fuel” isn’t adequate. It is not a violent, visceral or insidious. It does not evoke the terror and disgust, that jolt, that is required to give clarity.

    1. HG Tudor says:

      Fuel is entirely accurate.

      1. Yolo says:

        Fuel is control….the need to feel in control, control others, control thoughts, control emotions, control the pain, control the beasts, its all about control.

        We are taught not to lose control, not to fear, not to cry, and to be strong.

        In DBT we just completed emotion regulations. We were provided a list with 175 things to think of when negative emotions appear. I don’t fully agree with some of the methods they suggest that we use. I’ve learned the hard way bandages don”t work long term.

        I cry, I identify, I pray…I trust by allowing others to see who I really am inside and what I usually hide is my way of showing trust and I accept that they will see my feelings as they really are. I am the captain of my soul.

        “Out of the night that covers me, 
        Black as the Pit from pole to pole, 
        I thank whatever gods may be 
        For my unconquerable soul. 

        In the fell clutch of circumstance 
        I have not winced nor cried aloud. 
        Under the bludgeonings of chance 
        My head is bloody, but unbowed. 

        Beyond this place of wrath and tears 
        Looms but the Horror of the shade, 
        And yet the menace of the years 
        Finds, and shall find, me unafraid. 

        It matters not how strait the gate, 
        How charged with punishments the scroll. 
        I am the master of my fate: 
        I am the captain of my soul.”

        by William Ernest Henley

  18. Ioana says:

    Wondering if a narcissist gets fuel from his primary source who is crying over her dead husband or dead son …?

    1. HG Tudor says:

      No, in fact that would ignite his fury.

  19. Twilight says:

    Do you have this streak?

    1. HG Tudor says:

      It is wider than a streak.

      1. Twilight says:

        The term I own it came to mind……

        Thank you HG

        1. HG Tudor says:

          You are welcome Twilight.

      2. Tappan Zee says:

        It is wider than a streak.

        ^I can’t handle the truth.

    2. kimmichaud1 says:

      Does u r wider than a streak include sexaul sadism I’m assuming not if you don’t experience pleasure then u can’t get pleasure from sadistic sex but then again maybe u get fuel from it what say you?

      1. HG Tudor says:

        Explained as per the article.

      2. Twilight says:


        This is my opinion only

        I believe the pleasure comes from knowing they are the root cause of the pain be it sexual or not. A narcissist with this streak not only gets fuel from this emotion but it is super charged because they know that you know it is caused by them.

        My ex had a sadist streak….

  20. Just Me says:

    HG, do you believe extended viewing of violent porn can lead to a sadistic streak or the opposite… a sadist seeks our violent porn?

    1. HG Tudor says:

      Seeks it out. I believe there is currency in excessive porn viewing that will cause an individual to ‘up’ the stakes in terms of the type of porn that person watches because what they began watching becomes vanilla and does not ‘do it’ for them. However, those individuals would remain in a passive state, merely watching it. The sadists seek out this type of porn and also would engage sexually in a similar manner.

      1. ANM says:

        I dated a Narcissist like that. He sought out violent porn. When i first met him, it was kind of cute. He was older, wealthy, had a 50 shades of Grey thing going on. You are right, he kept upping the stakes, the porn got more violent, he was taking “business trips” to vegas. Then, with a flip of a switch, all that was “shameful” and disgusting and he wanted to be vanilla again. This cycle continued and continued

      2. Tappan Zee says:

        HG— Ted Bundy (not saying he is credible but on the other hand why not) said violent porn made him the way he was. That is my gross over simplified broad brush sweep of what he actually said. But most of his interview the night before death indicated he was exposed to hard core porn (pre internet) and of course it begs the question of pre disposition vs suggestion. Do you think it could tip the scale or is the brain already tilted that way. Or both?

        1. HG Tudor says:

          I should imagine it depends on when he was exposed to it. One cannot discount that an experience in adulthood will have a considerable impact but an adult does have more robustness and fortitude than a child experiencing the same experience.

  21. Survivor says:

    From what you wrote, I’d have to say that the ex N/S and his sidekick are both sadists. Your blog is very insightful and as much as I pity you all, I still wish you didn’t exist. You’re destroying everyone and everything.

    1. HG Tudor says:

      I don’t want your pity. I am pleased you find my blog insightful.

  22. kimmichaud1 says:

    I think mine had somewhat of a sadistic streak I think

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