What’s It All For?
The sudden silences. The periods of no communication when before the airwaves crackled with the send and return exchange of text messages. The repeated calls throughout the day to talk of something and to talk of nothing, now gone and empty. The absence of a morning greeting. The absence of any greeting. Just absence. Cold and unremitting silences which stretch from hours, to days, to weeks. What was once there has been banished. What’s it all for? Perhaps he just wants some time alone?
The inability to ever say sorry. The frustrating failure to ever issue an apology, it is as if those words cannot be formed or do they manifest but something causes them to freeze so they never find the light of day? The denial of fault, the deflection of blame, the resolute and forthright rejection of any accountability. All you want is to hear her say it the once, to say sorry, to hear that admission and sense some humanity exists there after all. What’s it all for? Perhaps she believes that I will think less of her if she apologises to me?
The never-ending carousel of blame and accusation. The merry-go-round of that dizzying discussion which never reaches fruition. The whirling array of “I never said that”, “you do the same”, “you can’t keep accusing me” and so much more leaves you disorientated and nauseous. Just once, just one time, can’t something be resolved without this round-the-houses farce? Must it always be this way? Why is nothing ever put to bed? Why is everything buried alive? What’s it all for? Maybe he just doesn’t understand me, perhaps I need to be clearer about what I mean?
The broken engagements. The no-shows. The promises to meet and then the failure to appear leaving you upset, annoyed and miserable. He promised. He promised that this would not happen again. The frequent ringing and all you receive is the notification that the cellphone you are calling is not available right now. Where is he? Has he forgotten? He cannot have done, you spoke to him only four hours ago to remind him of the arrangements, especially after what happened last time. You miss him and you were so looking forward to spending the night together after a period of not being able to do so. Surely he should have remembered? The chasing messages “Where are you?”, “Are you near?”, “I have been waiting twenty minutes, where are you?”, “What’s happening, I am worried”. What’s it all for? Perhaps he has had to work late, or he is stuck on the subway or he has run out of charge for his ‘phone?
The repeated alterations to arrangements. The tears, the shouting, the disappointments, the rolling out of false explanations to try to ease their upset. Yes, he did say he would take you out today, he must be caught up with something else, why don’t we do something instead? How can he let the children down like this? The turning up without agreement and demanding to see the children. Forcing you into a corner in order to placate him so the children are not scared. You back off again and again. Always you making the compromises. Always you trying to explain away the increasingly unexplainable. The arguments about the arrangements, the lies about what was arranged, the confusion over details. What’s it all for? Is he going mad? Maybe you are?
The insults and slurs, the nasty words, the harsh put-downs and the savage comments. The vicious text message tirades sent at 3am, the blistering verbal attack down the telephone, the dressing-down in person just before a night out. The personal cutting remarks, the swear-words, the name-calling and the labelling. So hurtful, so demeaning, so upsetting. What’s it all for? Perhaps he just doesn’t love you anymore?
The chopping and changing. Last week’s steak had to be well done and now it has to be bloody. How were you expected to know, but you were? The eruption and the tantrum which followed demonstrated that you were the one to blame. Red is good, now it is bad. No soda with the vodka, but now he is banging doors and shouting because there is no soda. Sit there, no there, be quiet, say something, leave me alone, you never speak to me much these days, do it like that, no don’t do it like that, who taught you to do this it is brilliant, who taught you to do that you are an amateur, back and forth, push and pull, right then wrong. What’s it all for? Perhaps he just cannot remember or just wants to keep changing for the sake of it? Perhaps the pressure of work is really getting to him these days?
The argument over nothing. The argument out of nowhere. The argument when everything was going well. Why is she angry all of the time? Nothing is ever right but rather than discuss it in a civil manner and be reasonable with one another, there always has to be a fight. She could start an argument in an empty room. She seems to thrive on creating a scene. So many days, so many occasions, so many events all spoiled by the epic tantrum which she throws. What’s it all for? Perhaps she has anger management issues?
The sudden bouquet of flowers. The expensive perfume. The sudden trip away to somewhere exotic and exciting. The sensitive poem carefully written in copper plate and placed under your pillow. The sudden proclamations of love. The dizzying romance. The grand gestures. What’s it all for? He must really, really love me.
The accusations, the challenges, the pointed finger and the sneer. The demands for the truth when you are telling the truth. The inquisition and the interrogations over anything and nothing. The way you answered the phone, the way you wear your dress, the friends you said you were visiting, the time you came home. Always the questions, the allegations of lying, cheating and skullduggery. Every time this happens when you want to do something and he never seems to realise he does all of these things himself. What’s it all for? Perhaps he is just possessive because he cares so much?
The lies. The tales. The fabrications. Every day a new boast which is so outrageous that she must surely know she is telling a porky pie. The flagrant omissions of the truth. The repeated protestations that this is the truth even when you know she is lying again. The lies when the truth would serve her better. The inability to know she is lying. The fact she really does seem to believe her lies are her truth. What’s it all for? Perhaps she is just a born liar and a fantasist?
The disappearances whenever you need help. The excuses that he has something else more important when you require support. The sudden coldness when you call and explain how you have been bullied at work again. The distant look and the eye-rolling as you try to explain why you are crying. The sudden lack of availability when you need a hand. The fact you must fend for yourself even though you are too weak to stand and feel dizzy. The shirking of responsibility, the rejection of assistance and the distancing when you are injured. What’s it all for? Perhaps he just cannot stand the sight of blood or does not know what to do when somebody is ill?
The flirting, the staying out late, the drunkenness, the drugs, the gambling, the smell of perfume on his clothes, the receipts from lap-dancing bars, the hours and hours and hours spent watching porn online, the obsession with his video games, the sudden and mysterious trips away. What’s it all for? Perhaps he has an addictive personality?
The tears, the pleading, the begging, the demand for one more chance, the assurances that it will never happen again, the promises to get help, the panic in his eyes and the wailing from his mouth. The neediness, the repeated requests to make things right, the long involved explanations, the repetition of how we should be together and how good we are for one another, the promises, the future, oh the promises of what the future can hold for us both. What’s it all for? Perhaps he is broken and you should not walk away from someone in such need?
Maybe he struggles to express himself?
Maybe he just has never had anybody stand up to him?
Maybe she has problems with trusting people?
Maybe he is just disorganised?
Maybe he struggles with being a single parent?
Maybe he cannot help how he feels?
Maybe he is indecisive?
Maybe he feels unappreciated?
Maybe he really does love you?
Maybe that’s his way of loving you?
Maybe she is just different?
Maybe he doesn’t love you anymore?
Maybe he can’t help but feel jealous because he really does love you?
Maybe she tells lies to make herself feel better?
Maybe he struggles with responsibility?
Maybe she is tired?
Maybe he is lost?
Maybe she is over-worked?
Maybe he is stressed?
Maybe you don’t know what you are entangled with?
Maybe you make too many excuses for them?
What’s it all for?
Fuel.
196 thoughts on “What’s It All For?”
Vent Your Spleen! (Please see the Rules in Formal Info)
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As a true avid student, I can’t stop reading your posts/comments – having devoured 7 of your books already.
I don’t like doing things by halves. Ha.
Anyway, I just came up with an interesting analogy.
I would, in a way, compare you to a vaccine, the toxic agent that provides acquired immunity to an infection.
Of course, protection sometimes fails because the host’s immune system does not respond adequately. Or at all.
Thank you for reading.
You achieve resistance, not immunity and that is a very important concept to keep as watchword to your besieged heart.
Understood, thank you for clarifying!
HG – I know you don’t emotionally attach to anyone but do you ever truly care about anyone? For example when I think of my son I smile and feel love/ nostalgia as I think about his loud laugh, how he walks or the way he holds his fork. I also get teary eyed anytime I hear my father’s voice in home videos because he died last year in a car wreck and it feels so good to hear his voice again. Do you feel nostalgia like that? What about midrangers? lessers?
No.
HG, do you have children ? If so, how old ?
No I do not.
🙂
Jenna!!! So good to see you back❤️
Ty star. It’s good to ‘see’ u too!
I’m extremely addicted to your site HG…the long and short of it…no pun intended is that my Narc relationship was brief.. only 2 months, but after week 2, without meeting yet, he asked me to move in & marry him. That did have a chance to happen, but the golden stage sure did. We had what he called an argument and then it was silence. Then 2 months (almost to the day), he reappeared (as in just this past Wednesday). He said that our non communication was a misunderstanding, and that he was waiting for me, mean while I was waiting for him…..he never did say if we “are back on”….but I imagine he just assumed??
The non communication comment is a lie. He assumed you are back on owing to his compartmentalisation and sense of entitlement.
I thought consciousness and conscience were two different things?
Your better understanding of your self must sometimes go deeper than the behavioural level?!
*sigh*
I hope you at least feel a form of contentment for effecting change in others.
I have consciousness. I have no conscience.
I feel pride, not contentment.
HG, It appears that you know yourself very well. You are very decisive and every time I asked you a question, you didn’t hesitate with your precise answers. On the other hand, narcissists are known for not having a true identity, as they chose to bury it very deep inside, and instead create a fake identity. It’s a paradox, isn’t it? You seem to understand precisely what your fake identity is, what it wants, what your goals are, but at the same time you ignore and refuse to acknowledge your real identity. What do you think? And how do you know that your answers are real if you are thinking on behalf of somebody who doesn’t really exist?
The ‘fake identity’ as you describe it is effective and decisive. Why should it not be? That is what is necessary to exist.
Hi hg,
This is something even i do not understand. If there is no real identity, then ur opinions wud change constantly, correct?
So how is it that you state the fake identity is ‘decisive’?
Sure, the decisions are ruled by logic over emotion, which wud make them decisive, but wud they not always be changing depending on the person targetted, circumstance, fuel needs, etc? Ty.
HG, Thanks. Do you understand at all your real identity? Do you allow yourself to think about it or do you choose to ignore it all the time?
HG, What do you think about the most?
Myself.
When you don’t think about yourself (which is not easy for you, I get it), what kind of thoughts go through your head?
If a publicist was not there to cover something happening, did it really happen?
Ha-ha :). Do you think about books you read or movies/plays you see? Do you think about your childhood (on your own, not when your therapist asks about it)? Do you think about your ex’s? Narcissists constantly talk about ex’s (mine did very often), but do they actually think about them, and in what way?
Do you think about goals in life? Are any of those goals not materialistic?
I always wondered what went through my ex’s head. It was a mystery as it changed almost daily. Sometimes, even more often. My head was spinning. But now, I’m really curious. It’s fascinating to me to learn about it.
Read the books, this tells you more about what I think about.
HG, I have been reading your books. But, I still have lots of questions. The mind of a Narcissist is puzzling and hard to comprehend for somebody who is not wired that way. My ex has hurt me enormously. He said all the right things, but was beyond cruel in his actions behind my back. For many years. The pain is still inside of me. Horrible, excruciating pain of the worst kind of betrayal and back stabbing. So, forgive me for asking so many questions – I need answers the same way you need your fuel.
I have another important (for me) question: do you think/hope that you will ever meet somebody who is your true best match one day? Somebody who will be everything you wish for physically, intellectually, emotionally, etc. and will be as selfless as possible to be compatible with you. Could it ever happen? Most importantly, can it last long-term? Is it the same illusion as for an empath to finally be content with a narc as it is for a narc to finally find his best empath?
That is the expectation.
It could – would it last? Remains to be seen if there is an altered dynamic if they know what I am.
Who comes.
Who leaves.
Who wants to go.
Who has to go.
Who is praised.
Who is blamed.
Who wins.
Who loses.
Who sits.
Who lies.
Who’s in.
Who’s out.
Who fits.
Who quits.
Who heals.
Who hurts.
Who reigns.
Who serves.
Who is good.
Who is well.
Who prompts.
Who repeats.
Who designs.
Who resigns.
Who excites.
Who exits.
Who soothes.
Who scolds.
Who is up.
Who is down.
Who helps.
Who betrays.
Who accepts.
Who regrets.
Who is hero.
Who is zero.
Who decides.
Who departs.
Who topples.
Who tumbles.
Who recovers.
Who is bad.
Who is there.
Who is gone.
Who is right.
Who is left.
Who benefits.
Who suffers.
Who bows.
Who bows out.
Who is hired.
Who is fired.
Who chairs.
Who presides.
Who is over.
Who is under.
Who gives in.
Who gives up.
Who is first.
Who is last.
Who is sorry.
Who is sad.
Who commands.
Who obeys.
Who is major.
Who is minor.
Who stumbles.
Who crumbles.
Who packs in.
Who packs out.
Who speaks.
Who is silent.
Who assists.
Who stands by.
Who is victor.
Who is victim.
Who pays.
Who pays back.
Who is Who.
Who says what.
Who steps back.
Who kicks back.
Who’s old.
Who’s obsolete.
Who’s number 1.
Who’s number 2.
Who is honored.
Who is humbled.
Who is host.
Who is hostile.
Who is goodman.
Who is badman.
Who steps up.
Who steps down.
Who sees green.
Who sees red.
Who is groomed.
Who is doomed.
Who does well.
Who means well.
Who goes ahead.
Who goes behind.
Who is a friend.
Who is an enemy.
Who is thrilled.
Who mourns.
Who is welcomed.
Who is ousted.
Who is refunded.
Who is replaced.
Who contributes.
Who distributes.
Who is family.
Who is familiar.
Who is in quest.
Who is at rest.
Who earns it.
Who deserves it.
Who is vested.
Who is invested.
Who leaves early.
Who leaves late.
Who is not named.
Who is shamed.
Who is missed.
Who is dismissed.
Who is confident.
Who is confidant.
Who has tailwind.
Who has headwind.
Who is selected.
Who is sorted out.
Who is successful.
Who is successor.
Who congratulates.
Who wishes luck.
Who is a leader.
Who is a follower.
Who is chief.
Who is big kahuna.
Who escapes.
Who is a scapegoat.
Who says thanks.
Who says No thanks.
Who is severe.
Who gets severance.
Who is a big wheel.
Who is a bigwig.
Who advises.
Who am I??? Which one you going to be is the question.
I will be his muse for 2018.
Who is well advised.
Who is appointed.
Who is disappointed.
Who is at C-level.
Who is at eye level.
Who will be back.
Who leaves for good.
Who fights for honor.
Who fights for money.
Who shows grace.
Who falls from grace.
Who makes a big deal.
Who makes a big fuss.
Who is a personality.
Who is a person.
Who goes through hell.
Who keeps going.
Who has a vote.
Who has a say.
Who has the last word.
Who can say it?
ref.:
https://exechange.com/academic-research
I love this Yolo
Jasmine
What did you get from that?
Narc Angel,
Oh wow.. a lot. On immediate introspection: it’s all very black & white. Similar to the narcissist way of thinking. You are good or you are bad. Two sides of the coin. Though some of the statements aren’t complete opposites, but rather variations. It covers quite a bit of human thinking, feeling behaviors. I believe in fate but I also believe we have the ability to make choices.. I just think that ultimately our choices -may- lead to our destiny. Can we choose different paths? Can the narcissist? I dunno. The only thing I do know for certain: we know very little about life. We have much to learn.
Of course the author could have meant anything. That’s the beauty of poetry.
Jasmine
Ok. Thank you for your reply.
What does this mean? Whose muse? Or Who’s muse?
The narcissist’s.
Everything belongs to him
NarcAngel,
Jasmine response to your question is correct. Sorry, you didn’t see the value in it.
I responded to the muse ? In another post.
Yolo
It was not that I didnt see value in it. I just didnt understand what you intended to convey and wanted to understand better.
Yolo
I want to be: Who is free.
If you don’t mind my asking, who is the “he” you are referring to and are you the muse?
BTW, this is fascinating. I like the way you think.
K,
I am glad you enjoy it. I want to be who is free?
I was on a site reading about various CEO’s of large corporations sudden departures. And the who is? Was listed at the bottom. Copied it and figured it was appropriate to use based on comments and posts
Ladies do you think H.G. is ” he” ? Am I his muse?
If I am speaking of H.G., no need to fret. I think everyone here have been an inspiration to him and will continue to be.
The statement was said in tongue and cheek.
I am inspired by everyone on here that bravely share stories in one way or another. Inspired to try…
Thank you, Yolo, I did enjoy it and if HG is the “He”, then I want to be Thalia, the protector of comedy and hold a mask.
Yolo,
I suppose we all could be his muse.. though naturally tempting, tis also unnerving. He IS, after all, a confessed narcissistic psychopath of the most cunning kind. Something we ALL should keep in mind when dealing with him. Especially when that empathy flows! And I know y’all know what im talking about!
BTW, thank you for sharing the poem. XO I loved it 💞
K,
Thaleia it is, flowing with joyous air. Name means “flourishing”, can we both be her. I love the thought of flourishing.
Btw, I had to google it.
Jasmine,
Thanks for your concern, by no means do I take HG or anyone else with this disorder lightly. I’ve had more than my share of narc craziness.
I’m rebuilding my life and there’s absolutely no place or space in my mind or life for narcs.
I am aware of the damage they cause and the many lives lost and unable to recover due to their behavior.
My desire is to bring awareness to as many people as possible. We plant the seeds and warning signs in as many people as possible we Win they lose.
Peace and Harmony to all.
Namasté
Of course we can both be Thalia! And, I use google quite often, too. HG wrote that James Corden was an utter helmut and I had to google “helmut”.
Did it come out as helmut?! It should have read “helmet” !
Christ, I can’t spell for shit. It was helmet and I think you meant he was an utter dumbass.
Hg I don’t remember getting any silent treatments so does that mean my ex isn’t probably lesser instead of a mind ranger?
1. You may have received silent treatments but not necessarily realised they were silent treatments.
2. If silent treatments were not used this is a factor which would suggest the narcissist is not a Mid Range narcissist but is not determinative in itself as there are other factors which would support the narcissist being Mid Range besides silent treatments.
If karma is really a thing, what the heck did I do, or better yet, what did we all do to deserve the treatment we’ve received from the narcissists of the world? I used to believe in karma because it made me feel better to think that people who did hurtful things would eventually get what they deserved. But that means that I also have to believe anything bad that happens to me happens as karmic payback for something bad that I’ve done.
After all the madness I’ve gone through for the past 32 years, I wonder what I must have done to have deserved this… Nothing I’ve done in this lifetime warrants this much bad karma. What the HECK did the previous me do??!!
Indeed Snarkandgrace, people bandy the ‘karma’ will get you line and seem to miss the point that they must have done something rather terrible to be treated the way that they are now if karma exists.
I think people believe in Karma because its easier to HOPE some spiritual force will deal with people in the future for transgressions theyve committed against you now, instead of growing a pair and calling them on their shit right now in this life lol.
Correct.
To hell with karma, I was thinking more along the lines of a gun and a chain saw.
HG, I believe what goes around -comes around but I’ve got a more scientific than religious approach to that. It’s undeniable that some form of energy keeps our body working, while alive, so…we’re some kind of machines (your kind more than mine). Of course we evolved and adapted, BUT we couldn’t come from “nothing”.
A brilliant man (named Tesla) said there must be a Source. Not the one from graphic representations, God equals (for me) the huge amount of energy keeping the Universe as it is and there must be an equilibrium there. That’s why there are narcs and empaths, both good and bad here, on Earth. One can’t exist without the other. Good people also have narcissistic traits and narcissists have some good traits (if only coming from their will to succeed and leave some legacy).
That’s not saying I’m not confronting narcissists because I expect karma to make justice. That means I’m not really damaging them (aside from acid replies and/or ignoring them), because it isn’t for me to “punish” them.
Evil people have no problems in this existence-because they would only become more evil out of that, they are not able to learn goodness and understanding out of it. They only learn to hate more the healthy ones. There’s no equilibrium to achieve there.
Hi somewhere over the rainbow…i agree with much of your post about karma except i do believe in a god but that doesnt mean i dont see the science behind our world. So much is unknown. Our souls where did that come from? We cant see them but theyre there. When it comes to karma i believe a narcissists disorder in itself is a form of karma. If you asked a young child how theyd like to live happy or miserable for the rest of their life theyd choose happy. Narcs are miserable and highly codependant which is why they use and abuse. The byproduct imo is karma. When you hate it dwells within and you hate yourself. They live their karma.
It is incorrect to state we are miserable. You may regard the way we operate as miserable, but that is from your perspective. We are not miserable – those that state as such do so as part of their manipulation, those are Mid Range and engaging in their usual pity plays – they will profess misery to dupe you, but they are not miserable. Lesser and Greater are not miserable – both forge forward unhindered by the complications you bear.
I agree with you HG. When you really look at the mid-ranger they pretend to be miserable (pity play) but they are not miserable at all. It is all manipulation. You are not wired for joy and, if you are anything like me, when I am bored I simply find something else to do. One of my strongest emotions is hatred, however, I love myself and hatred is an excellent emotion to have; I find it quite useful. And none of the narcissistic children I see at school has a choice about being happy or miserable; they just look for fuel. They are victims of circumstance.
Indeed.
Hg and others,
Hello and happy new year to all. I’ve not been commenting for awhile as i’ve been too depressed to type. But i’ve been reading. Great letter clarece💗
Hg, how can u say ur not miserable when u never feel joy and get bored easily?
Just because I do not feel joy does not mean I feel miserable. I feel powerful, not miserable. Being bored easily does not equate to being miserable, it means I go and engage in something else.
Ty hg.
Hello Jenna!
I was worried about you and I am very sorry that you are depressed. You and WS2 stopped posting around the same time and I missed you both!
Just so you are aware J, WS2 has been in touch with me via e-mail and she is currently occupied with other matters for a few weeks but she is well.
Ok, good to know. Thank you HG
K
Thank you. I was wondering about our WS2.
Pleasure, Narc Angel.
Thank you for letting us know about Windstorm2. I was acutely aware she was absent after your return after the holidays. Good to know she’ll be back at some point and she’s well.
TY k.💗
I missed all of u. I am gaining some strength in my fingers to type, simply becoz i have just booked an audio consult with hg. Knowing i will talk to him soon is giving me some strength.
Hi Jenna! I was concerned with your absence recently. I guessed that either you did not hear from your Narc over the holidays or that you both had an argument and he went silent on you. He’s the one that affects you to that extreme. I’m so sorry you hit a low point. The consult with HG will be a good move for you.
Thanks for the shout out on my letter!!
Be kind to yourself!!
Aww clarece ty for the kind words.
Jenna
Hi Jenna. Glad to hear from you and that you are getting better.
Hi narc angel,
Ty super empath, that is u💗
Im saddened to hear you have been suffering Jenna.. but I am glad to see you sharing and contributing..
HG, i know you do not know Joy.. but I wonder if you can be suffering without being aware..?
To be filled w hate seems incongruous w ever being satisfied w life…
But then again.. if you do not know what you are missing..ignorance is bliss?
I maintain my sincere wish that your heart will one day know Joy and Love.. that there exists a sufficient motivation to break your addiction..
You accomplish such incredible things w so much if your energy being dedicated to fuel, I can only deduce your magnificence would be exponential in other circumstances..
Being filled with hatred does not make me feel miserable. I know what suffering is – I have seen it many, many times and I am not suffering without being aware.
Having your heart broken is absolute misery; hatred isn’t misery; it is powerful, motivating and impels you do things, good or bad.
K
I agree with you that hate can be motivating and fosters action (good or bad as you pointed out). Far worse maladies are cowardice or the lifelessness of apathy.
I concur Narc Angel. My memory is fickle but I believe you commented once: Hate before apathy. And I understood that very well. I have hatred and it serves a purpose but it doesn’t make me miserable or full of hate. It is neutral until I need it.
Found it!
POLL – WHAT WOULD YOU WISH FOR UPON THE NARCISSIST?
NarcAngel
AUGUST 4, 2017 AT 19:38
Hate over apathy any day.
Excellent quote!
K
Haha. Leave it to you to track it down. I stand by it.
Narc Angel
When I read your comment, I thought: Now this is a person who understands that hate has a motivational aspect and it can be used for good (or bad). You have the ability to see, very clearly, that hate has potential/usefulness. And that is sublime.
How can you feel hatred without feeling love? Boredom without joy? Can one truly exist without the other? We have darkness and light. Hot and cold. Day, night, young, old.. I’m not convinced it’s possible to have only one-sided emotions. Perhaps your love has been “switched off” as a self defense mechanism?
Easily. One does not need to love in order to hate.
Jasmine
I think you are correct. NPD abuse removed the positive ones from the narcissist so s(he) could survive and they seem fine with it. It is a self-defense mechanism.
Nuit etoilee,
Merci beaucoup.💕
J’espere que tout va bien.
Hi Jenna,
Happy New Year! Great to see you are back. 🙂 I am sorry to hear you were too depressed to write. I hope you are feeling better now.
Ha ha ha…you are a riot E.B.! Thank you for the laugh. That was excellent.
HG I had to google conkers. It is a superb reason for living in the UK.
I am pleased you agree.
Hi EB,
Ty kindly. 💗
Still feeling very low, but taking benzos and looking fwd to my consult with hg.
Jenna,
You have been missed! You are not alone, we are here for you.
I am sure the consult will help you deal with those people and things that drain your energy.
-Hugs-
Hi Jenna,
Be careful with the benzos. I know they can be a necessary evil, (I have some in my own med cabinet) but they are highly addictive.
~No judgement here. My son is an addict ☹ Benzos are his thing.
Hi jasmine,
Ty for ur concern but don’t worry, i am under the care of a psych regarding the meds.
I am sorry ur son is addicted to benzos. The best way is to taper off gradually. I hope he can do that if he needs to. My prescribed dose is higher than what i actually take, due to my fear of it becoming habit forming, like u said.
Ty Jenna. He has been to rehab 3 times. Each time I pray for a miracle. All I can do is hope. ❤
Jasmine,
I hope the best for him. Try to stay strong.
Hi EB,
Ty. I missed all of u as well
when i was not posting. The consult was a life saver! Hugs back to u💗
Hi narc affair,
I also believe in God, but I believe God is only ONE for all of us (as religions), no matter how we name Him. God is energy, that’s why (in my opinion, I underline this) we can feel His presence, but we can’t see him, because the material dimension we live in has its “physical” limits. If I say I felt an usual presence at least two times in my life, HG will believe I’m crazy. I’m a rational woman myself, that’s why I search for scientific explanations rather than only religious ones for what happened to me! And I’ve got my answers, but I’m convinced this isn’t the place to talk about that…
P.S.: I imagine HG’s mind at work reading these lines: “a lunatic”! LOL
K,
I picture you chasing your ex down the street with a running chain saw 🙂
Hi Hg…it is my perspective and i cant speak for anyone but from what ive learned about narcissism i cant see a narcissist being truely happy. When a narc operates from a position of control, insecurity, jealousy, envy, loss of self, codependant on others to exist how can that not feel miserable!? I know from my codependancy its hell and i hate it. I want to rely on me to feel good and not have to need others to help me feel ok in life.
For a narc maybe their idea of happy is different but i truely believe you reap what you sow and if you are treating people badly and have a poisonous heart then you yourself are toxic and that cant feel good. Again its my perspective but if im right id say thats karma.
I have always maintained and explained that we do not feel happiness. However just because one does not feel happy it does not follow that one feels miserable.
The Lesser cruises along oblivious doing as he or she pleased, feeling powerful as he is fuelled, his perspective of the world such that he is unaware of so much that it does not bring him to a place of misery.
The Mid Range will feign misery in order to manipulate. He or she feels powerful through their perception of being a good person, a caring person, a pillar of the community, the presence of the facade. He may be irritated and frustrated when people do not do as he demands or expects and then use a Pity Play as a means of overcome that resistance and thus removing the irritation and frustration. The Greater achieves and conquers, creates success and drives forward – that does not invite misery.
I agree there is jealousy, there is envy, there is hatred etc but that does not equate to feeling miserable.
When I first came here I was broken hearted and miserable, now I am happy. I have bucket loads of hate, rage, aggression, hostility, and contempt, however I am NOT miserable and, to be fair, I do have love. Great explanation regarding the mid-ranger and irritation, that is what I witnessed with my MMRN and his mother and I confused it with misery.
((((Jenna)))) …youve been on my mind. How come youve been depressed? Only if you want to share. Hope you feel happier soon💓
Hi narc affair,
Ty for thinking abt me🌸
I’ll spare everyone the details.
I’m starting to feel slightly better since yesterday, due to booking my consult and being back on the blog. Thx again.
Ty for your explaination HG but i get confused bc in a lot of your writing it seems to say otherwise. When you talk of your mother, the creature, when fuel runs low, fury ignited, the fear of failure, constantly plotting, never trusting and having to stay number one. What emotions do those trigger? It sounds like a miserable existance but my logic and perspective are different.
I do appreciate your perspective. I have to keep reminding myself narcs think very differently.
You view it as miserable but it is not. My mother invites hatred, annoyance, revulsion. Fuel running low creates a sense of impending doom, restlessness, increased emptiness. Not trusting anybody creates vigilance. Ignited fury is precisely that, fury.
Hi somewhere over the rainbow…your posts have really resonated with me.
I know what you mean about feeling gods presence ive too felt that. You cant see him but thats where faith is important.
Prayer has given me strength dealing with what ive been thru but i know its up to me to take the steps to move forward.
You didn’t necessarily. I can’t answer that, but I don’t think you should punish yourself, or think that it’s your fault. If that was the case.. I’ve done something horrible in my past life! Better to forgive yourself. Learn from it instead.
(I just like to dot all my i’s and cross all my t’s)
HG, What fascinates you the most? (Other than yourself).
How James Corden has made such a little go such a long way.
:). So, what do you feel towards James Corden? Envy? Desire to learn from him?
Contempt.
Thanks, HG. Do you have any people in your life that you admire or consider an authority, even temporarily? Do you ever ask for others’ advise? Have you ever had a bond (or felt that you did) with another human being (could have been temporarily, like when you were making love to a new target during idealization stage)?
My guess is it’s a “no” to all of the above.
There will be temporary moments of admiration where it suits my purposes.
I will obtain advice in relevant situations (usually professional) and consider whether it is worth applying.
There is no such bond, no.
Have you ever taken any advice from the doctors on dealing with MatriNarc (if they’ve given you any)?
No. I know how to deal with her.
If it makes you feel any better, I had to Google that name. I am not much into pop culture.
That pleases me.
James Corden — who?! I also had to search the name on Google and he is not someone I would watch. He is nobody to feel contempt for.
Oh he is. Utter helmet.
So I guess that means we won’t be seeing you on carpool karaoke…
Only to garrotte him.
Lolll SW, too funny! Imagine if that was the way we all got our big reveal of HG one day. Carpool Karaoke to DM, “Enjoy the Silence”.
Never going to happen.
Rotund, Late Nite talk show hosts are a penny a dozen. You are a rare breed. I could say more but I don’t want to waste my brain cells thinking about him. Who?
I love James Corden. He makes me laugh. I love to watch Bruno Mars and James in the car and I’ll sing (shout) along.
Of course, I don’t know these men personally, they might be complete assholes, but I can’t make psycho analysis of every actor/ character I see on a screen, before I watch them.
Why do you feel contempt HG?
Because he kisses men?
No because he has no talent, he thinks he is brilliant and he is immensely irritating. I would readily stamp on his trachea until it bubbled.
HG
And some say you have no feelings.…
Okay… Now I am fascinated by you knowing a trachea bubbles after enough stomping….
I’ve missed participating here…
The only time I have ever done karaoke was when I lived in Aruba. I used to go to an after hours karaoke club owned by Asians. When you have heard Chinese men with a tin ear sing “My Way” it can make you feel like an undiscovered operatic phenom…. As usual I lied to myself but it felt great not caring.
Thanks as always for the honesty and humor… I DO LOVE to laugh.
Blank, the Bruno Mars video was my first. I love it. Of course being a Bruno Mars fan doesn’t hurt 😉
It ought to.
Ha ha!
Love? No. Love isn’t supposed to hurt x
I have to look up James Corden…
My experience suggests the universe is indifferent. I too see no evidence of karma. I do, however, wonder about where the body’s energy goes after death. Energy never dies it simply goes somewhere else…
Into the maggots.
Ha ha ha, thanks for the laugh, HG.
Pleasure.
James cordon is the carpool karaoke guy? Lol. I LOVE that bit! Xo
I must admit I have no clue who this James Corden is. I googled him and I still have no clue;)
Lol now i have to look up james corden 😂 surely he cant be that awful now?
If I were to list all the current untalented celebs, I’d have to jump off a bridge in the name of blowjobs because that’s the only way they could have gotten where they are.
This is why I avoid pop culture like rape.
HG, Do you feel grateful during idealization stage to the person you are idealizing? Do you ever feel grateful?
No, only entitled.
The discussion of karma and funerals above demonstrates one of my favorite things about Ns (and likely why they so appeal to me.) Their uncompromising ability to cut through to the unemotional reality of a matter. It is so contrary, isn’t it, that people with so little ability to view themselves accurately have, IMHO, The Best ability to see right through without letting ANY emotion cloud their thinking.
So true, J! That is why they are so pragmatic and great problem solvers. At least the ones I know. They also make great leaders and business people.
J and Nina
Yes. A necessary evil so to speak.
Nail on the head, J. I am emotional but also capable of compartmentalizing those emotions. Admittedly, HG’s logic appeals to me because a voice of reason often calms me when I am feeling those emotions.
This is one of the reasons I connect with the narcissists to begin with! Because the empaths are always getting butthurt over something. (One of the reasons I trouble with that term.)
I am reticent to expose my emotions publicly the way empaths can. I can discuss them now with logic, but in midst of the hurt, I was too busy crying to be able to offer any insight.
Believe me, I was very hazy a few years ago and would talk in circles vis-a-vis the narcissist.
The reason I have this emotional ‘fence’ in place is because I am very emotional and hurt easily, (sometimes it does come out in real life when I don’t want it to) but when it comes to ideas and debating, I divorce myself from it. I always admired the way narcissists/socios could as well.
HG is correct that there has been no evidence of life after death and is claim is perfectly valid and reasonable. I consider myself agnostic. Open to possibility and not willing to shut that door completely because I think doing so would be a disservice to my creativity.
Bibi, I used to be very pragmatic. But after years of horrible rollocoaster I have experienced with my ex pshycopath I became a lot more emotional. It feels like my ex caused me to feel my own emotions on a much deeper level. I wish I could be more pragmatic now like I used to. But I am a different person on every level after what I have been through.
Mila,
I understand completely. My ex purposely drug out my love emotions. I had them packed neatly away, he enticed them out then stomped all over them. It may be emotional but that doesn’t mean we can’t pack them away again.. if we want.
Bibi,
I used to feel uncertain about death too.. it was my biggest fear.. and then I was dying..and I wasnt expected to live. It changed my perception. Just because you haven’t experienced something, doesn’t mean it doesn’t exist.
Kind of like how the narcissist feels about love. He’s never felt it, therefore it doesn’t exist in his world. We all have our own truths based on our experiences. It doesn’t make one truth any more real than the other.
Just my 2c.
What an interesting discussion about being emotional. I am too of course. I grew up very sensitive and was always told by my mother (the narcissist in my family) that I was way too sensitive for my own good. But I like to think that as a grown up I’ve come to terms with this; being able to separate feelings from my intellect when needed and I too am very reticent about displaying feelings publicly; needing my walls around me as protection against people getting too close; and Ive always been in great need of lots of privacy and alone time. Then my ex came along and brought it all out in me again; and worse; the anxiety, the anguish, the overanalysing everything, the gushing of emotions all over the place; and sometimes I didn’t recognise myself at all when with him. But in a way those were fabricated feelings. My hysterical behaviour was a reaction to his provocations and his abuse; it wasn’t the person I’ve grown up to be. That’s what finally led me recently to start letting go of him in my mind. I don’t ever want to be that woman again.
“a sober realization. ”
I thought it was love
and so I allowed myself
to be deceived
by all the things
you helped me feel
-r.h. Sin
HG, Do you (by you, I mean not just you, but narcissists in general) worry about getting old? Do you worry about more difficulties of getting fuel and other resources you need as you age, as your health and looks and energy deteriorate, as competition for valuable fuel gets harder – do you worry about it; do you think about it at all; do you brush it off for later times; what goes through your mind as you age?
It varies dependent on school and cadre. Please see Time and the Narcissist – Parts One and Two for further insight.
HG, I just discovered your website and started reading your books. Thank you so much for your insight! Your perspective is very valuable … I am finally starting to understand what is was all about …
I have always wondered if narcissists/sociopaths believe in karma and worry that one day they will get punishment for what they have done to the former victims/survivors. I would appreciate if you can share your perspective.
Thanks!
You are welcome.
There is no such thing as karma.
Budha will have to do a lot of meditation tonight, not to get angry with you.
Ha ha Buddha is welcome to get angry with me, it is fuel.
🙂 Not the answer I have expected, but it makes sense from your perspective – karma relates to spiritual concepts which you can’t relate to you as you consider yourself “soulless”. Does it mean that narcissists can’t genuily believe in God/Laws of Attraction/Higher Universe, etc?
Once I asked my ex (you would define him as the Greater Elite Narcissist – highly successful, handsome, manipulative pshycopath) about his future funeral – he was divorced three times, had an adult child with whom he had no relationship his entire life, his parents were dead, no sibligs, no true friends: “Are you worried that not one person will say anything good about you? That nobody will plan your funeral? That you would be forgotten as you hurt every single person who cared about you?” He answered: “I don’t care. I will be dead at the time, so it wouldn’t matter to me”.
When you are dead, that is it. That is why legacy is paramount.
Legacy – of course, my ex used to talk about legacy a lot. He writes novels (hoping that would be his legacy) – but that’s not how he makes money as he is not known or successful author. He has a real job. In the meantime, he is overpromoting himself on every single social media outlet as a successful author. He would spend hours promoting himself instead of writing his novels. He has a few published. The very first thing I did after he discarded me was throwing all of his books into the garbage. I was not doing well at the time (to say the least), but this made me smile.
He wrote his own wikipidia page. He constantly updates it. But, I doubt, anybody looks at it. He is not important – only in his own mind.
If you don’t believe in karma.. why target those that do? I imagine empaths tend to believe in the cosmic
I don’t target people because they believe in karma. I will however use that misguided belief to my advantage though.
Argh. I can’t become a zombie just to hide myself. This is frustrating.
Hg : “When you are dead, that is it.”
NOT TRUE.
Well the dead people I’ve encountered said or did nothing to demonstrate to the contrary.
Do you always believe only the things you see?
I find it infinitely more reliable yes.
I have seen no evidence of an after life or karma etc. I have seen plenty of evidence that shows that when you die, you die.
You evidently have a differing view – you are entitled to have your own view – but understand you are not going to persuade me to adopt a different view and this is not the place for such a debate.
Hg, understood. I am not trying to change your views. I know that is futile. I am trying to understand the way your mind thinks. My apologies..I am emotional.. a beloved pet passed away, one strongly tied to my life experiences.
You are welcome to understand how my mind works and you should give yourself credit for recognising that it is futile to try to change my views. Being able to recognise that is a sign of progress. You have no need to apologise, I am not offended by your comments.
Thank you. Alas, no progress YET. I learned that gem dealing with my mother. But I am a curious cat, and I will figure it out. 🐱
Hi jasmine…i agree death isnt the end. Its very close minded to think it is. Theres so much we dont know in this world. Theres been so many cases of near death experiences and people seeing the other side. Proof that cant be denied. My grandmother being one that experienced this. Narcissists will never believe in a life after death or karma bc they dont want to face how they lived and treated people in this lifetime. It scares them. What if they had to answer for all their actions? Denials much easier.
There have been so many cases of people thinking they see ‘the other side’. I have see no evidence that supports there being an after life and plenty of evidence which demonstrates there is no after life. You are of course entitled to your own view but do understand that
1. You are not going to change my view so do not bother trying ; and
2. This is not a place for any such debate, thus we shall just have to have differing views.
I do not believe in life after death or karma because I have no evidence to support their existence. They are devices designed to give hope and purpose to people who are otherwise bereft of them, to provide comfort following the loss of a loved one (‘he is in a better place etc etc’). It is nothing to do with not wanting to face how we have lived because we do not have to face how we have lived, therefore there is no concern in that regard.
narc affair,
I did too.
@Narcaffair–Some Ns definitely DO believe in life (and consequences) after death. In fact, I think one of my Ns would likely be a murderer but for his fear of God’s wrath and/or Hell.
Hi HG…i definitely wont try to change your views bc im a firm believer in traveling our own life journey and i respect that you and others have a right to your beliefs.
My belief isnt in the afterlife bc i want to hope for that but its centered around proof ive seen but again thats my belief.
As far as karma i actually dont wish it. Thats not in my nature. I dont wish to get even with or see my so called enemies judged in the afterlife bc many suffered themselves here on earth. I cant say for certain karma exists but i wont say it doesnt.
HG, do you think that anything has changed inside of you since you have begun to write about yourselves? Any change at all? In outlook, in how you sense your inner self, identity, etc.?
Anything that has improved in your life (aside from becoming even more effective, more weaponized and having gathered more tertiary sources)?
Because the real meaning of karma would imply that you would for this work of love.
I understand more about myself. I have applied more patience in certain situations. I have learned more about those on the other side of the fence.
Woe to the empaths that come into your sights! It sounds as if you have weaponized yourself as well
‘Twas ever thus.
Can you expand on a scenario where you showed more patience in a situation and were you pleasantly surprised with the outcome, hence why you continue to try to be more patient?
It can be a situation with any kind of source, co-worker, girlfriend, your siblings, etc. I’m curious as to what old HG would have done vs new, patient, HG does now.
So there is a tiny change in consciousness?
🙂
Either way, you effect change in others for the better, helping people to evolve, to get their light, life, etc. back. This should come back to you – in your own perception, and also in form of real goodwill/affection/etc. towards you.
No, I have no conscience. I have learned – in the same way as I learn through cognitive empathy the appropriate societal responses – to exhibit a degree of patience in certain instances, not all.
Mila, if it makes you feel any better, the fact that your ex spends so much of his time promoting himself rather than sharpening his craft indicates he likely not a very good novelist and hence there will be no legacy.
I have known many like what you describe. It is quite common.
Yes, thank you Bibi. I know that he can never succeed because his intentions are wrong. He is a talented writer, but he writes for wrong reasons: to be famous, to be recognized, to promote himself, not because he is passionate about it. In the long run it never works. True passion and hard work outweigh any talents.
He told me that he posts pictures of himself everywhere (he is handsome) because women would more likely to buy his books due to his looks. And he truly believes this nonsense.
Hi jasmine…i just wanted to say im sorry to hear about your pet. I hope time heals your loss 💓
Thank you narc affair ❤
HG Love it so far. I also bought a couple books and am reading Evil now.
Most of the relationships I am reading about are long term….like marriages. Mine was for 4 months……but the pain is still immense.
Do all the situations you refer to as far as the discard, hoovering, etc still apply? Does the duration of the relationship matter?
Thank you
There are many similarities in the way we operate but there are also important differences and many commentators fail to appreciate the different factors which apply to different dynamics. To understand the relevant matters to your own situation, a consultation is the most appropriate method of proceeding.
THIS IS the only perfect description I have ever read or found of the 12 years of life in a dream/nightmare with my Demon. FOR he is what you did not say along with just as much as you have. You know exactly why his name to me is Demon.
I will not thank you for the truth, I will say to you ,in this moment to me you are Nobel and you have set me free.
To take from a demon one such as I is fuel to kill for
You are unique
True.
To think that a narc would believe in karma is oxymoronic. If you beleive that what goes around comes around you must have a sense of concern. From a narcs perspective they are right everyone is wrong. My opinion is lesser and mid rangers might believe in karma however it doesn’t apply to them. A greater may feel that no bad will come to them because of the amount of good they’ve done or will do to compensate. If we sow evil, then evil will return. If we sow good then good will return. I can not recall any biblical reference that say we will pay equally for all of our wrongs or rights. It is by faith that we are saved.
So many whys and what ifs over the last 12yrs of my life….thanks for the knowledge so i can put all these questions to bed
Nicely summed up.
Healing can only begin when there is less time wasted on why they do whatever they do and more time spent on why do I accept this behaviour.
Tbh I am tired of reading about the all knowing NPD’s felonious behavior and insipid ways.
Tell us what you would do if someone pulled the stuff on you that compromised your safety and the intrusion on your personal space and electronic devices.
Then tell us how you would do that without the cash to pay someone.
Thankso HG
They would be disincentivized.
Ah yes, Narc loves a good maybe! Hey HG, any advice on how to break the maybe cycle among fuel sources that know he’s an N, but STILL insist on ascribing innocent motives to his actions?
This one really got to me.
HG I love this. So well written, so brutally on point. No room for any emotionally thinking or excuses if one allows themselves the truth of these words to sink in. This is what it is in a relationship with a narcissist. No sugar coating, no what ifs , no deep dark mysteries. Thank you so much for the knowledge you so openly share.
You are welcome.
Beautifully put. One can’t even try to idealize the situation.