What Happens When You Accuse A Lesser Narcissist?
The issue about the state of awareness of our kind is a central piece of the puzzle. Victims struggle with the proposition that someone behaves in such a way as we do yet does not see what they are doing. How can he not realise what he is doing? How can he not see that he is wrong? How can he not accept that I am right, I have the evidence in my hands? How can he not grasp that it is him and not me that is causing the problems? How can he not recognise that he is being selfish, hurtful or abusive? How can someone not know that they are behaving in this manner? I daresay you have said one or more of those questions at some point. Our awareness of what we are also dovetails with your awareness of what we are. As I have pointed out previously, next to nobody spots our kind when we first entangle with you. Even if you have been ensnared by one of our kind already, you stand a good chance of being ensnared a second time. Often the realisation as to what has happened to you may not take place for many years after the event or once the discard has taken place. You may realise that you have been entangled by a narcissist during the devaluation or more likely when we return looking to effect a post-discard/escape hoover. Almost without exception, once you have realised who you have become entangled with you have the overwhelming desire to tell us that you know what we are. It is a moment of triumph surely? You have been advised by an outside influence and/or you have read extensively and so many of our behaviours match with that of the narcissist. You have had your “aha” moment and whilst your head may still be swimming from the experience, your heart pulled all over the place and so many questions remained unanswered, you now know what we are. You have the knowledge and you are going to unmask us by telling us straight that you know and you are going to tell us direct what we are. It is time for you to strike a long overdue blow back at us. Thus, armed with this knowledge, what can you expect to happen? As you would expect, the response of the narcissist depends on which type you have become involved with. Let us begin with the Lesser Narcissist.
The Lesser does not know what he is. He acts through instinct, reaction and knee-jerk responses. If you tell a Lesser that he is a narcissist, chances are he may not even understand what you mean. If you have expressed this knowledge in a fuel free fashion, if he does not understand what one is you would most likely be met with the ignition of his fury and comments such as
“Why are using fancy words all of a sudden?”
“What are you using dictionary words for? Are you trying to make out that you are better than me?”
His inability to understand what you mean will be perceived by him as a criticism of him. He will feel wounded and thus his fury will be ignited. Lacking much in the way of control he will lash out at you as he instinctively seeks fuel for the purpose of healing his wound. He does not know that this is what is happening, nor does he understand his reaction, but this is what will happen. If you happen to have gained your awareness from a book and you use that to justify the label expect that book to be torn in half or thrown on a fire as knee-jerk response.
If the Lesser has some understanding of what a narcissist is, he will again only see it as criticism. Like many he will consider the label to only mean that he loves himself. You can expect responses such as: –
“Are you saying I love myself? Huh, guess I have to because you don’t anymore do you?”
“I love myself. You have some cheek. Have you seen the way you go on, preening yourself and swanning around?”
The Lesser will immediately deflect this perceived criticism by turning the position around and engaging in blame-shifting against you. He will seize on any evidence to hand which shows that you are the self-love and not him. If you have recently bought some new clothing, you can expect that to be brought up and you challenged for your spending habits. Said clothing is likely to be ripped or thrown away. If you have a range of potions and lotions which you use as part of your beauty regime, they will be seized on as evidence that you love yourself. They will be thrown around the room as the fury ignites, poured down the sink or smashed up.
The Lesser will not and cannot accept that he is a narcissist. He does not know what he is and therefore has no awareness. If you attempt to “educate him” by explaining the various traits and behaviours of narcissism and link it to the way he behaves, if you do this in a neutral fashion you will be heaping more criticism on him. Every point you made will be met with deflection and denial.
If you say,
“Look, I am just trying to get you to see that when you go out and disappear drinking before coming home and demanding sex, you are not showing any thought for me and ignoring my boundaries, that is the behaviour of a narcissist.”
You will be met with,
“Oh so now I am not allowed to go out drinking am I?”
“I don’t demand sex, you never give me any as it is and anyway you should, what’s got into you these days? Getting it somewhere else are we?”
“Boundaries? Narcissist? Who has been filling you head with this shit? I bet it was Lucy wasn’t it, she has never liked me.”
As the ignited fury erupts you will witness the paranoia, blame-shifting, denial, projection and deflection as the Lesser avoids discussing the issue. It does not register with him at all. No matter how obvious it may seem to you, he cannot grasp that he can be at any fault. It may be plain as day to you, the narcissistic behaviour matches exactly with what he does, but for all your explaining he will not accept it. Firstly, he will not do so because he does not know what he is, therefore he lacks the capacity to accept it. Secondly, even if he could he will not because of the defence mechanism that we have, namely that we are not accountable.
The denial and deflection will continue until you show signs of exasperation, upset or anger. When this fuel appears, this will assist the Lesser in healing the wounds he has and therefore he will, instinctively, be looking to push you to providing him with fuel through his responses. If your questioning persists and is done in a neutral manner, he will be forced to lash out (of course you will be blamed for his) which will result in verbal violence, destruction of property and physical violence as well. The Lesser’s paranoia will convince him that you are trying to catch him out in a way which he does not understand (nor can he) and all he knows is that he feels a sense of considerable discomfort. He does not know that this is caused by the failure to provide fuel and the wounding caused by your repeated criticisms. He will instinctively need to protect himself and this means getting fuel. He needs to head off your “oh so clever” comments – hence the denial and deflection, but he cannot control the ignited fury which ignites in order to seek the necessary fuel.
If you persist with pointing out what he is and there is no fuel provision he will evade you as he goes in search of fuel from someone else and in order to get away from the source of his annoyance.
A Lesser is unlikely to accuse you of being a narcissist because he has no real understanding of what you are referring to. What he will do however is throw back at you the constituent parts which you identify as narcissistic behaviours, at you. This is to defend himself from the criticism attached with this. This is to defend himself because he cannot be accountable for any kind of failure or weakness. This is done as a reaction to try and cause you to react to these allegations so you give fuel. You end up justifying that you are not the narcissist, thus he is (through instinct rather than calculated design) able to halt the wounding attack from you and gain fuel into the bargain as you protect about how you do not love yourself, that you care about him and other people, that you recognise boundaries and so forth.
You will never ever convince a Lesser Narcissist that he is one. He just cannot comprehend it. That is why although his behaviours match those of our kind, he cannot see it. He no insight whatsoever. All you will do is cause him to defend himself, have his fury ignited and ultimately cause him to lash out at you. Do not waste your time trying to convince him. You will not. If you want to wound him, tell him, but then withdraw otherwise you will find yourself on the receiving end of some savage ignited fury.
29 thoughts on “What Happens When You Accuse A Lesser Narcissist?”
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I just noticed online …. dumb lesser narcs are really the worst … *ugh*!
Who is comment to ava?
Huhm? I meant, I met someone online, to chat, and he displayed lots of narc traits, and then started typical narc behaviour towards me, but paired with such stupid behaviour and stupid remarks, that I couldn’t stand it. ;D
But I agree with you, it’s also a very bad thing when the quality of sex changes all the time. 🙁
Oh, I think I got it : P
Had gotten confused somehow with another comment of yours, sorry. Ha, thanks for response. Agreed.
I think I am dealing with a lesser currently. He’s a younger man who is frustrating because he’ll go back and forth between being attentive and inattentive like some ADHD thing and the quality of sex alters all over the place as a result. I consider him to be absolutely brainless and when he’s being selfish and disregarding, I think completely by accident due to being fully unconscious, I get so frustrated I would say that to him directly (“you are completely brainless” and similar). He seems unable to understand views that are not his own. The only reason I ever entertain continuing is because I’m very aware of sex chemistry and as far as the pheromone, looks, sex style stuff, etc… it is complimentary and I don’t take that for granted- simultaneous orgasms, etc…. Everybody’s different and I feel like if I could get him to alter his perspective just a bit he’d be less frustrating. Maybe it seems pointless I’d bother, but I have a dumb tendency to think that I can manage things with people if I detach somewhat and stay objective, which is probably a problem in itself because narcissists see my patience as something other than patience and have no appreciation for it at all- but he blindsides me with ridiculous rude comments or actions that I don’t think he’s put any thought or malice into. I react to that with heavy criticism to the point it seems to upset him and he has no idea why I’m upset. Then weeks later he will apologize profusely. This time he says he needs to be more generous with me and he appreciates me and would do anything to reconcile things. I don’t put a lot of stock in it and I’m not looking for any great relationship with the guy, which I have also said to him. He’s meant to be fun and friendly and that’s it. I don’t feel special love or admiration that I have had with some men who try to share perspectives with me. I’ve tried to ascertain if he has any violent tendencies, especially because I have a hot temper when blatantly insulted, but haven’t seen any, it makes me nervous though and if I see him I think I have to approach things differently.
Nope. That guy’s a sociopath, fuck that.
In the latest episode of Fuck My Life…
I’ve had a couple of lessers. My very first lover and an ex who became my fiance. They are almost indescribably difficult to deal with.
The ex-fiance. Visiting him in the states. In Barnes and Noble, he spies this book on Sociopaths – the sociopath next door I think it was. He’s slavering over it. We agree not to buy it and just download on kindle, which I do. I even give the bastard my second kindle.
Guess what happens next? When I stand up to him (I am now in full devaluation), he accuses me, a SE of being an N. Bless him. Maybe he perceived the supernova as being an N? Who knows?
It’s too tricksy for these knuckledraggers. The scary thing is, as HG says, these bastards believe that they are Es. It truly beggars belief. It really does. If you could see this man’s social media ‘output’ about spirituality and above all, rape, you would think he was the Dalai Lama. Or Jesus. And people fall for this crap. All.The.Time.
He was an extremly angry man. Used the word ‘bitch’ many times. He also used the ‘n’ word. I would get very cross at him using either words but he couldn’t stop it. A classic user and abuser (he stole a couple of thousand pounds from me). When we ended my children begged me never to take him back. I never did. I truly hope this one rots in his own private hell.
Can’t type for laughing Renarde
Good for you, Regarde.
Children are the best antidote to a narcissist’s insane games…I know, firsthand.
Never think a narcissist will be rational. Never think they will play fair… they won’t, even on this very site.
iroll, I understand every word you said.
I underestimated my ex-N and my own vulnerability, and was blindsided by him raping me. It makes me now err on the side of caution, especially when he can physically overpower me. Women are murdered in such circumstances, and you are too precious.
It can’t hurt to save evidence and chat to police for advice.
Caroline, It’s good to be cautious, men can be really dangerous. I didn’t know if this was just his usual provocations or if he’s channeling some murder-rage into it—it’s been going on and getting worse for a year. Narcy was a coercive rapist. My dad used to channel his sexual frustrations into violence. The ‘silent treatments’ are a kind of murder anyway, but one where we can live again afterwards.
That’s a good point about ST iroll. Just hope it doesn’t escalate for you.
Hi /iroll,
My narc has ‘stalked’ me (at least once that I know of) since I escaped him. It is unverified but, apparently, he sat in an unknown vehicle for 5 consecutive days in the neighborhood where I’m currently residing. I didn’t even know – that means I would have walked right by him every day TWICE but I never noticed – that’s how oblivious I was to thinking about him at the time.
I found out about this after the fact through a casual neighborly exchange. A neighbour was so concerned that finally he approached the vehicle and asked the occupant what he was doing on the street. He said that he was a ‘private investigator’…he had camera equipment in the vehicle as well. The neighbour, when asked, described my narc’s physical description almost exactly and confirmed that it was the same individual when shown an photo.
Initially, I didn’t want to involve police because I think that since I was ignoring him in every other possible way he was likely just doing this to cause me to *have* to think about him (it doesn’t make sense in any other way because his behaviour is already under scrutiny) and all the neighborhood would think about him as a result, as well. (One good thing is that this is a small community and now that the neighbours are extra vigilant – plus word gets around – he likely won’t do it again…or if he does it will be reported to the police immediately.)
Now he has created a sense of wariness (everpresence) and perhaps he did it only to intimidate and draw attention to himself (seems illogical in his situation but you know: toxic logic)…I thought “better safe than sorry” when involving the police.
I generally do not want to give in to the intimidation factor but the reality is I don’t fully know his current state of mind, so even though the license plate and incident was reported to the police, after the fact, and there is no ‘proof’ (the police, due to privacy, can’t reveal who owned the car) that it was him – at least it is on record if his behaviour happens to escalate.
Sorry for that long account but I’ve never been fully able to access how alarmed I should be about my narc’s behaviour and I agree with others here who say they feel alarmed for you.
Only you know his history of behaviour – and while you seem knowledgeable and capable – please be safe. Also, it sounds as if you have some legitimately threatening texts that you could report.
HG , Would a midrange be able to read up on what he is and become worse / different ? Is it the brain or actually his comprehension level ?
No.
As a Greater, what characteristics have you borrowed from the Lesser? Seems my Greater borrowed lots just prior to my escape.
Borrow from the Lesser? How dare you! Burn the heretic!
Laughing, HG, your comment really made me laugh…..
*lol*
Comment on other post above:
I think, lessers are good to play with, but too boring.
But sure, dangerous on the physical level, so better stay away.
Consult with HG please!
Narcy sent me another malign-hoover the other day. He does stalk, but mostly in silence and I get very sporadic direct contact from him.
The msg was titled: “Witch burning” —and went like this (creepy sexual details left out, but I can add them):
“You are unworthy in every respect, there is nothing about you – that is any good, I can think of….You are nothing. Absolutely worthless.”
I have told him what I think his issues are and I have rejected his requests to meet, (his invites were like, “get your useless whore mouth over here” and he sent a train ticket). We have not seen each other for a year.
Is this attempt at ‘dry’ intellect, or concealed cold rage, or provocation—a lesser narc?
I thought he might me a somatic mid-lesser. Silent treatments, compartmentalisation and sadism seems to be his jam. Sex addiction and getting by on his looks/physicality but lacking in professional social networking skills.
Also, if I am dealing with the psychopathic variant, is my life in danger, is he repressing a murder instinct? The messages get more dark and disturbing.
Open floor question.
iroll, I feel quite uneasy about your situation, having read your post here. I’ve deliberated about whether to say something to you, but this uneasiness won’t leave me so here I am.
I couldn’t bear to be spoken to in such an offensive manner as he has to you.
His respect for you is zero, and statistically, domestic violence (which this is) only escalates if unchecked. Only you know what he’s said, & the extent of it, and over what time period.
I feel scared of him & I’ve only read this little bit.
I strongly encourage you to discuss it with police, and get their advice, or have them request he desist.
I think your risk of harm is quite high.
Yes, I thought it was ridiculous before, he has also said he’s “only joking” and I lack a sense of humour.
But the now *total lack of respect* seems manifactured to justify —not just devaluation and disengagement (he actually says I rejected him, in reality my escape was based on self-preservation), but continued hostile stalking—what this blog calls ‘malign hoovering’, from the perspective of narcs—and verbal abuse can be a precursor to physical abuse.
He manages to give the appearence of being in total control with his silences and his attacks, total disrespect comes from a need for total control too, but that’s an illusion I bought too easily when I was vulnerable. He never hit me when I was with him, but I now see he could have pent-up rage waiting to explode. Or maybe, as HG says, he needs to create fear and I can just ignore it. Maybe he needs me to volunteer as a victim before he acts and all I have to do is not make myself accessible in any way.
I know he’s very motivated by envy.
That’s certainly the main reason I didn’t go and see him after he moved away, I wouldn’t have felt safe. I have been ignoring it recently, before that, I was still too attached and I confess, I was sexually teasing him. I did that because he didn’t give me closure for what was—a lot of emotional intensity. But spam mails still get sent to my spambox and I check them when they appear to see if things are escalating or going away. I have erased most of them or my spambox erases them, but now I think I should keep them as evidence, even though they are triggering. For now I hope that it will just go away.
He’s extremely immature. When he did have sexual power over me, and to be honest, he still does (though it’s diminishing a lot), it was hard to separate my feelings and motivations from his. Even though I rationally knew he’s a disturbed person. I was very sad at first, there was nothing to create stable boundaries around, so I developed a traumatic attachment. He’s very good at hiding his vulnerability and creating ‘psychic invisibility’ and magicial-invinciblity.
I have a couple of friends I can share it with, but many girlfriends “don’t get” why I’d be involved with such a character in the first place and aren’t interested in it. Which sucks, I get their disgust, but it’s also a lack of respectability to be involved with something like this.
Traumatic attachment feels like love, or infatuation, but underneath that, I think that victims really feel fear-based hatred for their abusers. Everyone has contagion when their boundaries have been eroded. Abuse is painful, rejecting an abuser is painful, the aftermath requires some kind of change in the self, which is also painful.
Emotional learning isn’t always insync with rational learning.
Yes. I would definitely discuss this with police too, iroll. In my experience the only forces that have impact on these behaviours of lessers are police and judicial authorities.
Take care.
/iroll
Is this the same guy that said your legs looked “breakable”?
NarcAngel, no —that was another (diagnosed) ASD-NPD, a handsome Polish guy who I got rid of after a week of him flirting with and stalking me. He was too disturbed, but I was curious about the disorder and processing my ex.
The guy who writes me these mails was fixated on calling me a ‘birthchamber’.
Reason for being with him—I suppose I didn’t take it seriously all the time, barks rather than bites, and have issues with men from CSA.
It’s difficult to say without more information on the N involved.
But as Caroline says; that message makes me uneasy too. OK, you say lacking in social skills? That surely has to put him in the lesser category? if he is good looking then maybe a LSN?
it’s also a really unsubtle message? For example, the GEN I am dealing with ‘hinted’ that there might be ‘dark forces’ after me. [Yeah OK darling. Only you and about eleventy billion others]
IF he is a lesser then there are the obvious dangers as HG as outlined previously if you are both in sphere 1. Ride the storm. he will give up. The lessers have the staying power of a gnat. Knuckle draggers.
Is your NC in full place? How are you receiving these messages in the first place?
Oh boy yep I had a classic lesser and I never heard the word “accuse” so many times in my life. He constantly accused me of accusing him lol. Wtf?