You Said We Would Always Be Together
You told me that we would always be together.Do you remember that? I certainly do. We did so much together didn’t we? I would call on you or you would call on me and just the two of us would fill our days together. Nothing concerned us. We had one another. We liked the same things and the same things made us laugh. We used to laugh a lot didn’t we? Great big laughs which shook our bodies and made it hard to breathe. We would set one another off and the more you laughed the more you made me laugh and vice versa. We would collapse to the ground pointing and laughing as the tears rolled down our faces. People used to look at us and wonder what has got into those two again? We found humour in so many things and whatever one pointed out the other understood straight away. We worked together too we were a true team. Each knew what the other wanted and we never argued about it. You had your role and I had mine and together we got along just fine. I did not want anyone else apart from you. I did not need anyone other than you. Every day I would wonder what it would have in store for us as we explored and investigated the world together. There was never any disagreement about what we wanted to do. I made a suggestion and you agreed with it. You came up with an idea and I liked it.
The summer was the best time. Those long days. We would be up and away as the first rind of dawn broke on the horizon as the world was not even waking up. How we enjoyed the silence as we made our way to seek out the day’s adventure. We would explore and find something new even if we had been down that path on a previous occasion. Sometimes there would be a scrape and we would have that moment of panic, that sudden uncertainty until we helped one another and then we would halt, free of the danger and stand panting until the laughter took us.
“You should have seen your face,” you would laugh.
“You should have seen yours,” I would respond.
We would break into paroxysms of laughter once again but this time there would be nobody to hear us. Many times we would follow the old rutted and meandering path into the forest to spend time at that lake. The water cool and inviting, an ideal antidote to the heat of the day. The clearing would echo to our shouts as we embarked on some new escapade but there was only ever us there. Nobody knew about this place or if they did, they never chose to visit it. It was a secret place. It was our secret place. Although we loved it most during the summer for it offered so many possibilities for excitement, we did not abandon our haven in the other seasons. Autumn would see us attend there amidst the blustery wind and the swirling leaves to collect and forage. Winter would be a spectacular vision of sparkling whites. The lake frozen and unyielding, a beautiful yet deadly spectacle out before us. Spring brought the smell of life and rejuvenation as the pouring rain woke the forest once again. We loved it all but best of all we loved it together.
We were inseparable and even though the march of time had cast others asunder it had not even shown the first inkling of doing the same to us. We had something different, something that was forever, something real. It was something forged from such similarity that we really were two halves of the same thing. We often looked at one another stood beside that silent pool, the birds silent, too tired from the heat to fly or sing. We stared at our reflections in the tranquil water and without speaking recognised our similarities. It might not have ever come to happen. I sometimes made reference to this serendipity that we had enjoyed but you preferred not to talk about it. I did not mind. It was admittedly easier that way. Sometimes as we crouched beneath the shielding canopy of a tree as the rain lashed down around us, the drumming noise so great that it filled our ears with sound, I would ask if this would always be the way it would be. Without fail you always reassured me.
“We will always be together, I promise.”
You would tell me and I knew you meant it. I knew you stood by your promises.
I know you did not choose to break that promise. Somebody else did. They broke it and then you were gone. It was not the only thing that broke that day.
184 thoughts on “You Said We Would Always Be Together”
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This article is referring to you losing your soul. You had it in childhood. You laughed, you felt happiness. You thought it could never separate from you, but it did. It left. So heartbreaking.
What have you killed her HG?
You previously stated that you don’t hurt animals because that isn’t something that interests you or something.
I can’t remember if you said it was beneath you or not.
Delete “her” in the type as you read… I never wrote that.
I’m on Android and something is going wrong with it.
So you got promoted to “psychopath”?
He’s always been. That’s what a greater is. Narcissists and low functioning sociopaths suck to be around. Psychopaths are actually really fun friends to have if you keep enough distance between. Psychopaths are not bad unless you want an intimate relationship with them or you’re related.
In broad terms, that’s accurate.
J, I don’t really see how you can say psychopaths are not bad unless you want an intimate relationship with them or you’re related…
And I know some seem to think they are one and the same, but others say there is a distinction between the two. I was more thinking along the lines of famous psychopaths like the (very charming) Ted Bundy or Ed Gein … HG, those statues of former girl friends in that house of yours… Are those stuffed specimens?
Did you ever kill anything other than annoying mosquitos, vermin or the fish that you have caught (I remember you like to go fishing)? Do you have any (physically) sadistic tendencies?
They are not stuffed, they are statues.
I have killed many things.
I have a sadistic streak, yes.
Maybe my narc is a psychopath 🤣😂😄
HG, my question regarding “stuffed specimen” was a referral to Ed Gein, who skinned his victims. I was not meant as a critisism to you (not sure if you took it that the wrong way), but to lighten up a more difficult subject. Your answer is enlightening and sobering. Thank you for being so honest.
Not taken as a criticism, thank you.
HG,
You have statues of exes in your home??? Do your new gals know? ? Ha! That’s brilliant. Constant ever-presence.
It reminds me of a story. As a young artistic college student, I picked up a few odd jobs for fun. My favorite was modeling for an artist. His main medium: bronze sculptures.
Imagine my surprise when I saw naked ME on someone else’s coffee table! Haha – Small world!
They do not get to see that room.
Do you make those sculptures HG? I guess you do.
That is so Bluebeardian.
There is one room with female statues. Entrance strictly forbidden.
The picture of HG is on the wall of another room (by the painter Oscar Wilde 😉). Also strictly forbidden to enter.
Oh, and there’s a dungeon. A beastly creature lives there.
I believe HG lives in Hotel California.
You can find more information about those statues in one of his articles. You will learn a lot more searching for it.
The beastly creature in the dungeon not to be mistaken for me on my naughty stool. Different creature, different room (3 doors down on the left – nothing to see here).
Catwoman sitting on the naughty stool with an IPad? I say it is worth taking a look and a photo of you NA.
Lou
Very well, but please refrain from taking photos when I am licking myself.
Meow.
NA, you will never leave that naughty stool. Ha, ha.
HG
I’m confused. So about you having statues of exes? Was that a joke or you do seriously have statues of your exes? At first when I read that I wasn’t sure if you were just joking or being sarcastic or if that is true fact.
It is a fact.
HG
House of Wax…. Vincent Price.
Didn’t he make waxworks of people.
I’m not saying you have a waxworks but you know What I mean.
I love the old hammer horrors.. it just reminded me of that.
Narcissism IS an art form.
Honey Bee
Narcissism is an art form. Too bad there are more Vandals that Van Goghs.
HoneyBee
Perhaps.. There are many definitions of art… The beauty of art is that it is different things to different people.
Art for me is something I would see as something to relax with. Or that evokes relaxation.
Being around a narcissist when things are good I found it to be more than relaxing.
When things are bad I find it distressing.
Precision, calculation, detail etc I would regard as art also but some narcissists are all over the place…
Still , there is art that is very random and obscure….messy and uncontrolled by it’s very nature… Like a big splodgy painting.
So perhaps narcissism is a form of art.in its own way if you think about different elements of it. …. to some and not others.
Food for thought indeed.
I think the way I have learned it is that all psychopaths are narcissists but not all narcissists are psychopaths.
Correct.
Hi HG…could you give us one or a few examples of your sadistic side? I cant imagine you sadistic. I realise theres the fear of turning people off but i cant help wondering why youd say you have a sadistic side. Do you mean you take pleasure in seeing people miserable or do you mean you enjoy seeing people etc in pain physically? Thx and no judgements here im just wondering bc its hard to envision you this way.
We don’t like to think that way, but if he calls himself a psychopath I can’t help but wonder.
It would really put me and a lot of women off, but I guess he does not talk about this sadistic streak with his new appliances. And there will be some women who would die (no pun intended) for a BDSM session. But somehow, if he has killed then I don’t think HG would respect a ‘safe word” (he would probably avoid that conversation).
I think this has more to do with being a psychopath (or sociopath) than with narcissism. I hope HG can elaborate on this.
I don’t think my N had a sadistic streak. other than an emotional one maybe. Hurt me and I will do my damndest to return the favour. I’m so not into BDSM (personal preference, no judgement), although I would prefer a man who is into BDSM to a man that is into diapers, pacifiers and playpens (that would be an absolute horror and turn off)
Hi honey bee…my narc doesnt have a sadistic side as far as physically enjoying seeing people or animals in pain but he does take pleasure in seeing peoples misfortunes. Im not sure thats sadistic tho but more from a place of envy and being miserable in some aspects of his life where npd is concerned.
I do find it shocking how serial psychopathic killers in prison develop a following of women or men that find them attractive and write letters to them hoping to develop a romantic relationship. I guess maybe they feel theyre behind bars and safe. Some even with children persue these monsters. Its mind boggling to know what these convicts have done and yet these people put themselves in harms way and their loved ones. Psychopaths have zero empathy and therefore make them very unpredictable. Serial killers with a track record are not to be lusted after and sought out.
Bdsm i think there are levels of this. You have to be with someone you know you trust and has your best interests at heart otherwise it can be masked as a form of abuse.
My dad and my brother both have sadistic sides. Its terribly upsetting thinking back on certain memories of what my dad did. Ive had to compartmentalize this to maintain him in my life. He has zero disregard for animals. It disgusts me to my core 🙁
It could be whoever you choose it to be to suit the audience hearing it. And it’s a lovely tale…who would question it?
Many of the articles/books that are in more of a personal vein regarding HG have mystery. There is another (of course I can’t recall it just now but it might be where he burns his hand and he is warned not to cry), where his Mother says something along the lines of: You dont want to end up like him do you?
Who is him?
What happened to him?
Is the him related to this article or someone/something else entirely?
Makes you want more, and of course he is the Master of the “hook”.
Yes master of the hook.. maybe it’s just made up ! Fiction, to tell / Share to a an unsuspecting new appliance.. maybe previous women have heard this tale of love and friendship..it could just be a manipulation! Is it actually true?
Flutterbymorpho
I understand your comment, but I just wanted to be clear that by “hook” I meant that the way he writes leaves you wanting for more, and of course it is also what narcissists do. I was not insinuating that it wasn’t true.
I could be mistaken with someone else’s story, but I remember something about a very gentle grandfather for sure (working on cars as a hobby or something like that) … and I seem to rembember a narcissistic grandmother.Could that be and could the grandfather be the “him” in that story?
The person in this story is probably the mythical “Amanda”. Any idea what age she was back then (meaning not in this story)?
Yes I knew you meant the wanting more by hook.. but it also made me then think about ‘hooking in’ 🙂
Well all I could think of about these lovely times you’ve written about was that it was a pet dog. I know it referenced speech but I still think of a pet, and then one day because you had such a bond and gave so much attention and had so many good times with it… someone else didn’t like that, jealous of that, and you came home one day to find them gone.. just like that. Devastating loss by another and you had no control and felt powerless… Or could have been a childhood friend that moved, so was taken away in that manner. Glad you enjoyed those times and felt the happiness, joy and connection and a shared affection.
The reason I think about death is that the story is nostalgic, but light and positive. It turns dark with: “The lake frozen and unyielding, a beautiful yet deadly spectacle out before us” and “… even though the march of time had cast others asunder it had not even shown the first inkling of doing the same to us”. Normally, as children, you are not torn apart by time (death due to advanced age). And the words “time … doing the same to us” to me indicates something that is a natural part of life (that tears people apart), like death. And “not even shown the first inkling”, so without warning or sudden.
I think HG is very intelligent and I think he picks his words very carefully. If two words have a similar but slightly different meaning he will use the one most appropriate. Those two sentences marked a dark twist to this otherwise beautiful story.
I am of course not sure if she died, but I keep seeing an older child (a girl) and a young teenager (HG). It could be someone else (a narcissist, HG’s mother perhaps) felt the need to interfere. Maybe his mother “warned” her parents. A young female child with HG roaming about in the woods and by the lake … Nothing good could come of that… So maybe there were not allowed to hang out together. But somehow I don’t think HG would have accepted such an outcome.
Or maybe … it just may be that this is a tale made up of the stories of other appliances. Somehow I don’t think so.
HG, I thought for a moment you had a twin brother who died. But that would be very surprising. And extremely sad.
A twin??!!! HG would have stolen his traits and offed him in utero.
NA, he was only an innocent psychopath then. No
I know a twin brother is far fetched, but it is the only thing I found that would explain the complicity HG describes here, the reference to the serendipity that brought them together, the reference to being two halves of the same thing, the physical similarity and specially the promise that they would always be together.
NarcAngel
Ha ha ha…that is what sharks do in utero.
Lou
Your suggestion has as much relevance as any other scenario presented. I was only making light of a narcissist sharing (specifically a uterus).
Hi NA,
Yes, I got what your point was and found it funny. I just wanted to explain why the idea of a twin brother came to my mind. But I consider it now as too far fetched.
Lou
I think it was a playmate. This article evokes profound sadness and loss.
K
I think it was a playmate, too
Hi K,
You are probably right.
It could also be his half brother and Matrinarc separated them.
We’ll see.
Lou and WS
It could be his half brother and we shall see. This article was heartbreaking like Angel of My Creation.
This is beautiful and heartbreaking and gives me the sensation of an unquenchable thirst… of
wanting to know you better.
HG
what you have written is painfully beautiful.
Thank you for the privilege of seeing your world through your eyes.
You are welcome.
There’s so much innocence in this piece. So beautiful.
Hi HG, I am new to your blog and as many do find your writing fascinating, so much so that, i read this post before bed and a lot of comments but not all. I Just woke up suddenly thinking….
HG, Is this your imaginary friend?
I am slightly worried that your posts have got into my head a lot like an ex-boyfriend i had from years ago. At the time i had no idea what he was, but i only wish i knew then what i know now, maybe i would not have spent years trying to get over the devastation! Unfortunately, i don’t think he has been the only one in my life, with a sister being one i am sure, finally made me look at narcissists, but hopefully I’ve have seen the last one..no disrespect :-/ Thank you for sharing.
I will ask it a different way HG Was this your imaginary friend?
No.
Donna I had the same thought at first but I couldn’t come up with how the promise would have been broken.
No.
💔😪
When I read this I see innocence which makes me think very young. The amount of time that was spent together makes me think this could possibly be a close family member like a cousin. Cousins are usually a child’s first best friend. If it was a close childhood companion and somebody else broke the promise then I would think a parent was the “someone else”. Possibly matranarc disgarding one of her brothers or sisters that is the parent of the cousin/best friend.
Maybe a half brother? Torn apart by divorce?
Hmm good thought MB!
No its not.
NA, What am I missing. I don’t know HGs background as well as you all. I figured with MBs obsession…I mean crush, she knows his family history.
Theres a brother from another mother but he’s alive and they’re not close as I recall.
Ok back to the drawing board. I’m still thinking it is someone that had close family ties like a relative with kids has age or a friend of momma’s with kids. For some reason the “someone else” seems like it’s his mother to me.
I don’t get the feeling that the companion in the article died. I think the separation was something else. Something out of the control of a child.
Me neither MB. The reason whyI thought the companion may have died is because it was the only reason I found that could have caused the loss of a twin brother.
Mercy, you were right the first time. I’m obsessed! Since day 1 girl.
The half brother/step brother thing came to me because HG does have an older brother not by both of his same parents. I’m so bad at remembering details. K is the genius at that! But HG has explained that he is the eldest in one family and the youngest or middle in another? That’s all that was.
MB at least you have good taste! Do you ever feel rude talking about him knowing he’s in the room? That’s why I call him The Man. Thinking he won’t notice if I don’t say the name that starts with a H and ends with a G.
Mercy, no, I don’t feel rude at all talking about his brilliance. I’ve never been rude intentionally. (There was this one time I called him a “pretty boy” that got kinda ugly.) I thought it was a compliment which it obviously was not. I quite enjoy providing droplets of fuel or at the very least having an outlet for my naughtiness. Don’t worry. He doesn’t know I’m alive. The story of my life. Admiring Narcs from a distance. 😂
It is an incorrect thought I’m sure.
Just want to add that in my relationship with narc, I said we would always be together in one way or another – that I would always have a place in my heart for him no matter what happened because he rescued me from Lesser and was my port in the storm for awhile. It turns out that I lied but this is why I thought maybe you yourself, HG, were the ‘someone else’ who caused the other person to break their promises – because that is what MRN did to me.
This is wonderful, HG. Like many of your writings, it can be read in a number of ways from different perspectives. This is one thing that makes them so brilliant. It is also why sometimes I am not sure with whom I am meant to identify.
I first read it as somewhat sinister, assuming a romantic betrayal – in which case you could be the ‘someone else’ who broke the promise and caused the other person to disappear. But I then read it as a poignant account of a childhood friend who was under the control of their family (happened to me – I was suddenly whisked away against my will). It must have been devastating for your friend too.
It could be both romantic and platonic. All relationships are mixtures of different genres. Doesn’t everyone always insist they want their lover to also be their best friend and soulmate?
Thank you.
I’ve been thinking about this story today HG. I don’t think it is, but I wonder if you would tell me; is this the same girl that wanted to hold your hand in the shed during hide and seek? (I get the feeling this is a boy, but I wanted to ask anyway.)
Interesting, MB. I assumed the other person was a girl, maybe because I first read it as an adult romantic tale. Now I think you are correct – it is a male friend from HG’s youth. The other boy is uncomfortable with the ‘serendipity’ perhaps because closeness to HG suggests weakness? Society does not allow men and boys to be close to each other because dependency calls their masculinity into question. Boys/men have it much harder that way than girls/women do, though ‘millennials’ seem to be pushing back.
HG, have you ever thought that you were gay and punish especially women because you blame your mother for not providing a safe environment?
No.
OK
SMH, it felt similar to how my sisters and I would play in the woods and at the creek when we were young. Inseparable from morning til evening. Lots of adventures in all seasons of the year. We were in the country and didn’t have friends. We were each others’ built in friends.
I wonder if the children of today will remember with nostalgia about the friends they played with on XBox Live. And that epic summer when they beat the Red Dead Redemption game?
MB, It is important to get them outside to ‘do nothing’! I can remember from my own childhood spending hours creating scenarios and stories using only flowers from the back garden – especially snap dragons :).
I am glad my kid was just a bit too old for smartphones and the like – he was never into video games either and his dad is very outdoorsy – massively long walks, bike rides etc.
I remember something about someone telling HG he was strong and he could fend for himself (I remember reading this because that is what I was told too). He had to detach from his emotions in order to survive.
I think this story is about a childhood friend (a girl). She penetrated his developing armour. I think he never expected to find someone like her and (eventually) he fell in love. I think he felt like it was meant to be (serendipity). She was younger and not yet of an age where she would be romantically interested in boys.
Then things when wrong and he lost her. I think she died.
Loving someone means losing them, so he detached from feelings of love altogether.
That’s what I think. But I could be sooo wrong…
Was she the love of your life?
Do you ever think about what your life would have been like if another choice had been made?
“Loving someone is losing them”
You expressed this beautifully, Honey Bee, about a painful learning experience many of us make – in variations.
I don’t quite know how to interpret the piece itself because there are so many fleeting associations and thoughts I cannot quite get a grip on.
I just wondered – is ‘the other’ in HG’s narrative really penetrating his developing armour? Was there a developing armour at all that time? Is ‘the other’ an actual person or can it be interpreted in a twofold way – the other as a person and, in a metaphorical way, as a part of something that was once whole, complete? I associate penetration with a form aggression, the attempt to find a crack to hook into and ‘break’ something, even if that happens with the aim to achieve something good and noble. The piece speaks of so much tranquility, silence (as opposed to the surrounding noises that do not disturb the serenity of the scene), peace, similarity, two halves of the same thing (“forged”) – a safe haven, a shelter, a paradise (lost). Both do not need to voice their similarities, there is a mutual, silent recognition – the passage where they recognise each other’s similarities in their reflections on the still water stands out to me, partly because it reminds me of the pool scene in the myth of Narcissus and Echo where Narcissus falls in love with his reflection on the water without realising that it is himself he is entranced by. In the piece, the reflections on the water are recognized by both as distinct from another, two entities but similar, thus belonging together? Whatever ‘the other’ is, I feel that ‘it’ could have been the very armour against a hostile environment, a much needed shelter and place of safety.
Those are fleeting, unorganised thoughts – I might be wrong with those interpretations as well.
Saskia, I love your thoughts on this and the way you broke it down. Your interpretation of the reflection is interesting.
Saskia, I also thought there may be a reference to Narcissus in the part where both are looking at their reflection in the water.
I don’t think she noticed his armour or was actively or agressively trying to penetrate it. I think his developing armour (the later construct) was passively being permeated just by her being. And he didn’t mind. I think he felt safe and secure in her presence. And maybe he still dared to hope and long for love?
I like the challenge of solving a mystery, but the empath in me does not like this puzzle. And something dawns on me. The story reminds me an awful lot of getting close to a narcissist. False promises that were made and broken, and trust is broken.
HG, what will be the title of the forthcoming book in which this story is detailed?
Little Boy Lost – The Creation of a Narcissistic Psychopath
He sure did!
Hi all and HG.. been staking this site some..when I need it so I don’t fail.
It took four years but now I don’t care much. He Hoover’s and even if I don’t recommend my way of doing this (listen to HG) but I had to ride out the storm.
He did it all!!! The Hoover’s, the shelfing, triangulation, the lies .. you name it and he did it.
I cried, almost killed my self and cried some more. Went to therapy, talked with HG, let him back in (oh after we lived together and I took care of his kids and payed for it all I was the mistress) ..
I did it all .. all the terrible things.
I was the stalker, the crazy maker and the crazy ex.
I still did not let go… I did my intelligence, and found out all the lies even before he knew it himself. I have it to him in a folder,
all of my findings … it finally killed him.
Result of my revenge .. he lost his business and soon homeless and loosing his kids..( trust me they are far better off).
I did it all… it took a huge toll on my sanity and life but today .. I don’t care. He keeps calling and I don’t care …
I’m only writing this to all of you struggling … one day you will be like me .. you don’t care because he is nothing. I’m back .. finally and better than ever.
I’ve been single all this time. I’ve been dating a bit but to be honest I don’t recommend it.
Be happy alone and one day we might meet a nice man again.
Lots of love
C
Thank you for outlining your experience with us. It sounds like it’s been a lonely struggle ——- we can all relate to that. Feel free to share more of your insights. We very much benefit from the collective wisdom of other courageous empaths who’ve walked the difficult road too.
Hi!
Thank you. Yes it was terrible lonely way to finally get out. I don’t recommend it however my gut feeling told me I needed to go the terrible road with this one. I tried NC and for me it worked the longest for 9 mo. I needed answers.. neeed more validation that he is an N. Stupid perhaps and it did hurt more. But ticking of every single box made it worth it. Also I was close enough to see how karma took him while I recovered, became stronger and my life back on track. Today I have almost everything back that he took from me… not possessions but that don’t matter. I have a better paying job, promotions, a house that he would die for, my sanity and health back… and money to travel again. So he can keep the last objects he stole because he can never get my new life nor happiness. The sad part is that I did find out more than I asked for and therapy was the only option.
This process changed me. I’m a better friend, mother and nicer to my self.
He has not changed, thinking his old live bombing and truck would work. He is now older .. lots older and as I stated in poor health and his life is crumbling. He even cried over the phone and admitted his loss and stupid behavior (oh well to get sympathy).
I feel sorry for him but I’m not helping out with money or going back.
This is karma for me. I’m back and he is slowly fading…. all the bad things in his life is all his own fault.. with a little help from me .. revenge is best served almost cold 😉
So again I do no recommend this way but it was the only way for me… I wanted to reach the point that I don’t care. If I’d have done NC I would not have been finished ..:
But not I am.
Lonely yes … but oh so strong.
Listen to HG and do what is best for you.
Hugs
C. I’m kind of jealous that you got revenge. I wish I could have, but I was too respectful of his privacy at the time (usually I’m not, but he scared me into it). I missed finding EVERYTHING on his computer by being a good girl. UGH.
This was a real tear jerker.
Hmm. Fourth reading, maybe it’s big brother and little brother. On the same wavelength, sharing the same sense of humour, cracking each other up so easily, partners in crime, so to speak.
It’s bittersweet, and there’s an innocence about it.
This is one of my new favourites.
Reading this post my mind goes to children or very young teenagers, oblivious to their own mortality), HG’s best friend and confidant (his first love that never came to be, or a male friend), an accident (maybe something to do with the beautiful, but deadly frozen lake), coma, withdrawal of life support (someone else’s decision, like his/her parents). Sometimes reality is worse than what the mind comes up with.
If it was a girl I don’t feel like there was a romance (yet). It sounds too innocent (no raging hormones).
Whatever happened, it seems like a golden period came to a ruthless and heartbreaking end.
HG
This is so perfect, and so bittersweet.
The pace, the unfolding narrative, and the description and intensity of that perfect young love…the boy meets girl and the excitement of that (apparently) deep connection…
The “you are the person of my dreams”, and only having eyes for each other….the pure, intoxicating pleasure of love without previous baggage…
That first experience, and heart and mind forever transformed….
There is a perceptible undercurrent that remains unclear. You tease your readers by alluding to it at the end.
Will there be a follow up story? A part two to bring us some closure, please?
(I’ve read this piece three times today.
Thank you).
There is not a part two but more detail about this particular article in a forthcoming book.
HG
Yummy!
More of your work!
I’ll patiently wait for you.
I know you are super busy.
I sent you an email BTW, one more for your overloaded inbox.
Caroline
Interesting that you got a boy and a girl.
NarcAngel
I think it’s because it reminds me of my first adult romances at University, the euphoria and connection in a man’s arms that I hadn’t experienced up to that point. The ‘special places’ and so much laughter were the other things that resonated with me.
It’s brilliantly written.
What was your initial impression?
I see myself in him.
I see myself in her.
I see myself in them.
Your father?
Kevin Spacey: “Let me be Frank”
Although this short video of just 3: 06s makes reference to his scandal. Taken out of context, his words might sound like the thought of a narcissist.
https://youtu.be/L3M_9EzryhQ
We laughed a lot together. And enjoyed places and activities as you describe above.
HG, I noticed many of your posts are reposted months or even years later. I don’t know (and I would like to know) if this is because there are a lot of readers that come and go or because you yourself are looking for something (you gain from our reactions, not being fuel)?
I don’t know if this is your story and your truth (about how you experienced things that happened in your life). But like everyone else reading this I too cannot prevent certain scenarios coming to mind. But when you speak in riddles to empaths the story will take on many shapes and forms. We cannot guess what happened in your life. We were not there. And we were not the ones who controlled the turns of events back then, and it seems neither were you. You probably felt powerless and I guess it wasn’t the first time you felt that way.
I do know when people speak in riddles they often want others to understand and/or support, but find it difficult to open up (for various reasons).
So, HG … Are you hoping someone will guess right? I don’t think that will happen. If there is something you seek to gain, you would be wise to tell us what it is you want from us, or give us more information. You could start with your age at the time… But if you don’t want to elaborate any further, that is your right.
It is done because
1. New readers arrive all the time;
2. Existing readers may not delve into the archives; and
3. Existing readers may have seen the article before but as they move forward they find new things in a re-reading.
There’s also plenty of valuable comments in the earlier articles. It’s always worth checking them out.
Valid point.
HG, is this one of the three events that you feel shaped your narcissism?
Yes.
Then I’ve got all three! ❤️
I very much doubt you have.
This is the one I was missing. I had the other two.
You will be mistaken then.
You’ve stated previously that you’ve written about all three. Are they not all three contained within your work?
Not all of the work has been published yet.
You confuse me, Sir. That’s good.
Well it is quite simple – I have written about all three but that does not mean you have yet seen all three in explicit detail in a manner which will cause you to understand.
Ok. I know of the three events, I don’t know the explicit details, however.
I think you mean you know there are three events, but you do not know what those events are.
Ok.
I thought I did. I must be mistaken. I stand corrected.
Quite alright, I would not want you to labour under any misunderstanding, MB.
Thank you HG
HG, I would have also thought I knew what those three events were but did not have all the details about them.
I thought those events were the abuse you suffered, losing the person you write about in this post and losing Amanda. Is that correct?
True, we still don’t have enough information about them to know exactly what happened but the three events are there, aren’t they?
No. Not yet.
MB
I am curious, I believe I have two.
What are your three?
HG said I was incorrect, Twilight. So mysterious.
MB
I saw. I thought I missed something, I have been staying away more often as of late. I have over 2000 emails I still have to go through. I am grateful and appreciative to HG for the work he does here every time I see those numbers (my emails) keeps things in perspective to what I deal with and what he deals with daily or when he leaves for a few days, I imagine his numbers can become higher quickly in a matter of days.
HG has a way of triggering emotions…….this article brought a flood of memories for me from my childhood. The line became blurred for a moment discerning my emotions from others from what is. I have moments when things absolutely suck.
Number 3 is true for me. Something that I have read months or even a year ago takes on a new meaning today because of my current understanding. I think it also effects some in different ways depending on what stage they are in their healing
Mercy
Very true. I think very differently about some articles now than I did previously.
NA and Windstorm, another thought I had is that HGs work is often multi layered. I may not have understood the true meaning of an article the first time I read it but there was something there that I identified with which kept me interested and coming back for more.
Mercy
The one true constant in the universe is that everything is always changing. That includes us as well. We are none of us the same person we were a year ago. As we learn and as our situations change, we change also. Our outlooks and opinions subtly shift. It is no wonder we react and feel differently when we reread something from the past.
Can readers who know more about the circumstances that shaped HG’s narcissism tell the rest of us more about it as well as what this story means?
HG
was this a pivotal time of awareness for you?
Was it a time of personal growth, maturity, increasing inner recognition, and of becoming yourself, having left the parental home and the assigned roles inherent within that?
Were you an undergrad student at University at the time of this romance?
No.
No.
No.
Caroline
I read it as a child, friendship, and not necessarily two boys. Do you think this could be a good example of projection of the empath at work here?
Thank you, HG, this consideration is very much appreciated. Especially your understanding of #3.
HG
Ha ha!
Thank you for replying, but I’m none the wiser.
Are you going to keep us in a romantic cliffhanger?
NarcAngel
WordPress is playing games with comment placement today…
Your response is so interesting, and yes there’s sure to be some empath projection.
Are we not masters at seeing only what we want to see?
The lens of hope: it’s like beer goggles for empaths!
Ha ha!
Thank God for that and our selective memories , or many of us wouldn’t have survived to adulthood.
Damnit HG, you’ve made me cry.
That’s all it was between him and I
A beautiful lie.
Beautiful HG! I haven’t seen that entry before. Thank you for reposting it. I like the stories of simpler times. You have experienced joy and you decribe it well.
Beautiful HG.
In Scotland the language you have used here reminds me of childhood. When you call on a friend – it’s asking them to come out and play.
This sounds like a first friendship that was dear and memorable, special and full of innocence. This was your best friend?
Did they move away? As a child you have no choice in the matter.
This piece honestly reminds me of ‘Stand by me’.
Beautiful piece, and what struck me was you have felt normal and at peace at one time in your life without the need for fuel. This would indicate Sociopathy rather the Pyschopathy?
I’m stupid.. Wuthering Heights.
This is beautiful HG – I do not know how you can write about such things and not feel the same emotions it triggers for us…also, reading this is the most emotional I’ve got over your blog in a while…this one took me back to parts of my entanglement I didn’t want to go; it is actually much more painful to remember the good stuff…
This is my favorite song because its lyrics are very positive.
DRAMAS AND COMEDIES
Fangoria
I don’t want any more dramas in my life,
just entertaining comedies.
So don’t give me stories of jealousy, crying and tragedy, no.
And call me for the usual,
don’t bother,
I’m not interested anymore.
I repeat it in case you don’t understand,
I get tired of being sad
and it doesn’t make up for it anymore.
I have decided to bury pain and grief,
I’m gonna forget about the problems.
I don’t want any more dramas in my life,
just entertaining comedies.
So don’t give me stories of jealousy, crying and tragedy, no.
What difference does it make
if it’s all a lie?
What difference does it make
Let me laugh?
What difference does it make
if at the end of the day…?
Who cares?
It’s going to end the same way.
Stop complaining without rest,
is boring and what good is it?
He thinks the future is still blank,
that nothing is written,
that anything is possible.
I have managed to erase all the jewels and hobbies with the stroke of a pen,
has been easy is nonsense.
I don’t want any more dramas in my life,
just entertaining comedies.
So don’t give me stories of jealousy, crying and tragedy, no.
What difference does it make
if it’s all a lie?
What difference does it make
Let me laugh?
What difference does it make
if at the end of the day…?
Who cares?
It’s going to end the same way.
I don’t want any more dramas in my life,
just entertaining comedies.
So don’t give me stories of jealousy, crying and tragedy, no.
What difference does it make
if it’s all a lie?
What difference does it make
Let me laugh?
What difference does it make
if at the end of the day…?
Who cares?
It’s going to end the same way.
I don’t want any more dramas in my life.
source: musica.com
https://youtu.be/2mVZvFZSCy4
Today I’m doing this with my favorite singer and I’d like to share
Cheating
Fangoria
You tried to deceive me. What a mistake.
Tired of listening to you I lose my attention
Tell me, don’t shut up, confess it
Like pieces that don’t fit resonate your words
You’ll say you lost me, there was confusion.
And there’s only one culprit in this situation
You can see how long it took me to understand
That entanglement and trickery are the mark of the house
You see, how brazenly
You dare to come back
Pretending you’re crawling and I know
That in this impersonal farce
You renounce your will
What a horror!
How brazen!
You created a mirage, just an illusion
Cured of delirium you are unforgiven
Sit down, and if you dare, defend yourself.
I’ll tell you before you start.
Don’t make it clear that it darkens
You see, how brazenly
You dare to come back
Pretending you’re crawling and I know
That in this impersonal farce
You renounce your will
What a horror!
How brazen!
Look at me, I’m all I want to be
And you can’t dispose of me like you did yesterday.
Look at you, you’re starting to faint.
Nothing can stop so much brazenness anymore.
No, because of so much stupidity.
I went crazy.
Pretending I was trying to understand
What doesn’t make sense
What I mustn’t justify
The grudge for your brazenness
You see, how brazenly
You dare to come back
Pretending you’re crawling and I know
That in this impersonal farce
You renounce your will
What a horror!
How brazen!
https://youtu.be/0weNnRrUiFQ
Was that strawberry ice cream reflecting back at us on the water? 🍓🍨
HG
This is so satisfying to read.
You’ve written it beautifully.
You’ve captured the perfect bubble of happiness that we loved so much.
I was taken back to my N female friendships. You’ve captured the emotional intensity perfectly.
The laughing until we had tears. We did a lot of laughing. We were always together, went everywhere together, talked about everything, and were fully immersed in each other’s lives. We shared everything until —
I started to disagree with one of them. There was no room for disagreement.
I started to feel smothered by another, and tried to assert some boundaries. There was no room for my boundaries.
I started to feel drained by the endless life-dramas of another, and her evening phone calls that took up all my time and emotional energy. I tried to assert some boundaries. There was no room for my boundaries.
We had promised to be together forever,
I was bridesmaid to two of the women, auntie to their children, we were kindred spirits, soul mates, and talked about growing old together, about what things we’d do, and how great we’d look as glamorous older women at the gym.
Then there was a series of heated arguments, silent treatments, and me apologising to break the silence.
Finally I couldn’t stay where I wasn’t listened to and respected.
I couldn’t stay where I didn’t have equal rights.
I closed down and left.
It was extremely painful, but I stood firm. This was followed by a barrage of hoovers, cards, notes and presents left on my doorstep. There was stalking, and I even had to call the police as one tried to break into my house, insisting that I see her and speak to her.
In promising love and friendship forever, I never thought it would end like this. I never imagined that I would be the one to leave.
Wow, Caroline. I never ever considered that I had N female friendships in the past. But your depiction of them makes me realize that I did. They’re the reason I only have friends now, rather than “best” friends.
Thank you for writing that.
Lisk
Thanks for sharing your thoughts with me. It’s refreshing to be able to share these things with other women who understand.
I’ve been processing so many things since washing up on the shores of Tudor Island after my shipwreck.
I realised that I have been subconsciously working through issues about my N-Mum in all of my friendships. I became aware a few years ago that my relationship with my toxic N-sister had badly impacted my female friendships too.
Very badly.
Mostly I noticed that all of my N-friends had the same outgoing controlling, highly productive personality that my Mum had. I’m introverted, and they were all extroverts. All my ex-Ns were the same extroverted ‘Director’ personality types.
It took time to see the patterns.
What were your experiences with N-friends?
Omg, lisk, I have had an aversion to “best” friends for aaaages. Freaks me out. Ptsd I s’pose seriously I attract narcs like mad, they home in on me (and clearly I often respond, even if reluctantly). I have a female that came in recently and said best friends and I got really nervous, she has a few narc traits but I’ve been feeling her out for empathy and I think she’s good. She knows she is CoD that’s how I met her and I’ve got my side ok, plus she’s on top of it with treatment and doesn’t ignore my signals.
Nunya Biz, so true about best friends. I experienced that title being used for triangulation. I don’t need to be anyone’s best friend. I just want good friends.
MP, I guess when you say that I think there must be some triangulation embedded in the concept and I have experienced that as well. My aversion to it is that it has always felt possessive. Even when someone said it to me recently it felt possessive. I don’t know why it should bother me when I’m fine with the term and concept of “wife” or any other relationship. I certainly don’t mind “friend” though.
But it bothered me even when I saw my kids’ friends’ parents nearly shopping for who was going to be the “best friend” for their child when school started. While my kids do have people around them who behave in this capacity I haven’t heard them use or embrace the term and I haven’t encouraged it. I know a couple of parents who encouraged half heart lockets or matching jewelry type stuff. I feel like it’s setting up for problems.
I’ve always wondered if I feel overly tense about the concept.
Nunya Biz
What really worries me is all the parents that encourage their 5-6 year olds to get a boyfriend or girlfriend and actually take them on “dates” and talk about who their young child is “going out with.”
Windstorm
Dates at 5and 6. Thats beyond stupid. I don’t even like the term playdate.
Yikes! My daughter got asked on one date in fifth and I was worried I made the parents feel bad. I was very adamant they do not pick her up, but fine she could meet him there (at a dance). Seems like a nice kid though.
NunyaBiz, I have five girlfriends from when I worked at the bank before I got married and one of them is a narc I think. She calls all of is her bestfriends and at first I had a hard time reciprocating her with that tern because I don’t really feel the connection plus she has thrown me under the bus a few times when we were working together. But then now I’m left out because the other girls are her beatfriends. I’m the lowest person in our group’s totem pole but I just feel thankful that I have them to have night outs with 6 times a year to celebrate our birthdays. My husband doesn’t drink alcohol so it’s nice that I can have wine or cocktails with these ladies a few times a year. In all reality my husband is my only bestfriend and we don’t even get along all the time and we’re not perfectly compatible. But there is a solid connection with him. He doesn’t have any friends at all, I am his only friend so I’m automatically his bestfriend. I’m still bestfriends with my bestfriends from high school but I only see them when I visit the Philippines which is every three years or so.
You’re right about it being possessive. Like you got branded like a cow as someone’s bestfriend. It also feels like you have some sort of responsibility to that person. I’m the same, I don’t mind being branded as a wife by my husband since he is also totally mine. But being branded as someone’s bestfriend when I don’t even live with them and may not even do that much with them because I’m too busy with my family feels forced.
I think it’s stupid when parents decide for their kids who’s going to be their bestfriend. It’s micromanaging and over-parenting. It is narcissistic. Just goes to show how narcissistic our society is really becoming. I am involved with playdates because my kids don’t have neighbors to play with. The leader of our playgroup is so narcissistic, it’s ridiculous what we do for the playdates, the standards that she sets. She like me though because I’m pretty artistic. As long as it’s helping my kids get socialized I’m willing to be her minion. I’ll let her have residual benefits from me through my craftiness but not fuel.
I know it’s a term that people use to describe people that they have known forever or to whom they have shared their deepest secrets, experience etc, but as pointed out in some examples here, there are also those who use it to categorize, rate, and exclude others, so we should not feel bound to honor or reciprocate it or their rating system (whether it involves us or other people) It’s about them and not us. I have had people call me their best friend (I think just because I listen to them) but I consider them just acquaintances. I think it’s healthier to teach kids that we can value many people and different things about each, and may turn to one more than others, but that they do not need to rate. To say simply that they have good friends seems more fitting and inclusive.
Ok I’m not posting anymore comments until WordPress stops being an asshole. I write out the comment but when I hit post it does nothing so I don’t know if it’s gone off.
Wordpress is not my best friend today.
I had a glitch. Apologies if my post is duplicate (or triplicate since logically (eye roll) if it doesn’t work the first time you should just swear loudly and keep hitting the post button).
I have a very hard time having female friendships. Even without them being narcissist, they can be so nasty. There are so few genuine women whom I have actually been able to connect with on a friendship level. There are a few….but for the most part I just don’t trust them. There seems to be so much rivalry with women and deception. I know the same can be true of men but for some reason men are no where near as scary as women to me. That being said I do feel there are a lot of very caring and wonderful women out there. I have just not met a lot of them. I do feel it could have something to do with my own previous relationships with the women in my family. Mother…grandmother…! My daughter however is the greatest thing to ever have come into my life. I love her with all of heart and would do anything do anything for her. She is one of the sweetest people I know. She is wonderful and I’m so great full to have had and have a relationship with her and the experience of her in my life. She is still young just coming of age. Anyways aside from her no other females in my family are close to me. My half brothers wife doesn’t like me and as a result me and my half brother have no relationship. I actually have very little to NO relationship with anyone in my family. Just my kids and that’s it. We are super close me and my kids…honestly if it were not for the birth of my children…I don’t think I would have really ever experienced the meaning of true love. I didn’t know what real love was until they came into this world. Sorry to carry on so long…kinda got lost lol…ok women scare me bottom line. I don’t have a lot of them as friends and I know that is sad.
Yes, Caroline, I think the female-female relationships aren’t discussed as much, but I have had several. They effected my energy for long time periods.
Hi lovely nunya biz,
Thanks for your thoughts. I’m going to be thinking about it more this week.
Did you find you were working through issues with your N-Mum in your female N-friendships?
Caroline
I messed up in my previous reply to you. My fingers were working faster than my brain and I meant to write:
Children, friendship, and
Not necessarily BOY and GIRL but perhaps two boys.
Sorry for the confusion.
Caroline, I am still trying to identify some issues. One thing I have noticed is that I see a pattern where I am very very resistant to certain female N’s, like immediately oil and water. When I get that feeling I have literally walked around in long circles to avoid interaction. I suspect it is most frequently somatics, but is always regarding a more obvious tendency toward attempting dominance. Others they start wiggling in a certain way and I start to slowly allow it as dominance is more subtle. Most recently I had a relationship breakdown that went similar to my relationship with my mom in many ways, multiple manipulations to keep me guilted into the relationship when they realized they weren’t in control of it, so basically attempting to keep me attached while I would also be unhappy. In other words wrapping a cord around my neck any way possible while not having to worry at all about what feelings I was having in that position. That is exactly what my mom would do. I was to be the dutiful daughter and my feelings about the matter were irrelevant and her obligation to do anything was almost none. I became so drained over time that I eventually just had to cut contact because any logic I employed to address my feelings was repeatedly rejected and I didn’t know what else to do, it was either
1. stay and feel like I was being stepped on and don’t complain at all
or
2. leave
Choosing number 2 was one of the hardest things I’ve ever done because I could only point to being mentally objectified as a problem for the most part. I still struggle with it. The recent N female issue was easier of course, but still difficult because of my self-questioning tendencies, but overall I can be a very confident person. I did consult with HG on that, btw.
So yes, working through self-questioning and why I keep having the issue. Every single time I would turn around a new person would pop up in a similar way. I seem to handle men entirely differently. One of my reasons for identifying with the “super” category in some ways is because I have a strong tendency to scare L and MR men into not speaking to me fairly early, regardless of whether we were intimate. I can sense that there is some empathy piece missing or a facade and I would start fires sometimes that are only based around that issue. I would make a situation where if enough empathy is present there wouldn’t be a problem, otherwise there would. I knew there was a pattern, but couldn’t identify it exactly. Now I’m finding it pretty easy to realize I just need to start disengaging earlier in the interaction and I understand why.
Very powerful words, HG. Everything you write touches my heart. Some pieces more than others. This was one of them.
Thank you for helping me.
You are welcome.
Wow.
Always and Never…
This is too beautiful to have HG in it, not doing something sinister. Is this a brain teaser like it turns out they’re two squirrels? Beautiful picture- was it the ice that broke? Did HG make the ice break? Two things broke, ideally someone’s heart was one of them. HG is the one who broke the promise and then her heart was broken!
Kel
Might HG have been the victim here?
I wondered about that too actually! But if she wasn’t responsible for breaking the promise, then did she die and it broke his heart?
NA, From your comment above, if they were childhood friends, maybe her family moved away.
Kel
I guess we’ll have to wait and see.
Review HG comments from his 2016 posts.
Painful
NarcAngel,
I was wondering honestly….how is it that you know so much about HG? It’s an honest question. Not trying to be rude or anything but I’ve been reading his blog for awhile now and you are always a constant on there. You are always commenting to others sometimes seemingly even for HG as if you know him better than anyone. I know HG has mentioned that he does not know any commenters on his blog in his personal everyday life….but it seems like you could be a family member or a super close friend. I’ve also noticed you have never changed the picture on your profile. I don’t know I guess I have always wondered these things I am mentioning and am just only now getting around to asking. I’ve just always wondered. I don’t mean to come off as rude maybe you are just his number one fan. I hope I don’t anger you HG or you Narc Angel….I just honestly always have wondered this. Sorry if this is too bold. I can be very observant and the urge is there and I just have to ask. Sometimes I feel you Narc Angel with some of your comments or responses to comments seem to come off as superior in some way. Maybe I am badly miss reading you and way off the mark. I do apologize for my frank inquiries. Maybe they will be taken in stride….maybe I will be kicked of this blog. I do know you go all the way back to the very beginning of his blog…if nothing else maybe it’s a compliment to HG to have such a devoted blogger.
NA does not know me, has never met me and knows information about me from
1. Having been on the blog for sometime she has read and remembered detail; and
2. As a keen student of my work, she applies what she has learned to deduce other matters.
There are other readers who operate in a similar fashion.
Thank you for your reply. She does seem a keen student for sure. I’m sure you are grateful to have her assistance.
Sighofrelief
I am not offended by your questions. I do not know HG in any capacity other than from his books and this blog In addition to the response that HG has provided and that I agree with, I will also add:
The subject is of great interest to me as I have been embroiled with narcissists from a very young age. I had a Lesser stepfather from age 5. Finding HG’s work has answered my questions and given me some peace. Yes, I am grateful for that, but more than that, I want it for others. I do dedicate time to the blog for those reasons and others I have previously written about as well. Some examples:
Intelligent conversation.
Friendships formed with commenters.
The very best information available on the subject of narcissism.
The opportunity and satisfaction of watching as others obtain the information they need to see clearly and to break free from their entanglements.
I do try to assist in my own way as do many others. The blog started in 2015 and I found it in 2016. There are others who have been here longer than myself and are quite involved as well. Clarece for instance found the blog on day one and knows much more about HG than I do, K arrived after me but assists with finding articles /comments quickly for people, etc. There are many that provide support. I will try to answer or direct people when I can because I know HG only has so many hours in a day and cannot provide a comprehensive answer to everyone. I have read many comments this morning for example and this is the only one so far that I have addressed. Speaking for myself, I do this because the success of the blog means having the blog available to victims of narcissism and is important to me, just as there are support systems available for other types of abuses and that have volunteers. I am here to support (in my way) everyone, not only as devotion to HG, as it appears some people incorrectly believe. I consider myself a student and fellow victim as opposed to merely a “fan”.
You are not the first to mention that you read me as coming off superior. I honestly feel that has more to do with how people receive and process information, and where they are in their journey. I do have higher narcissistic traits and have a tendency to be blunt. Some like it straight up and appreciate that, and others take offence. I cannot (nor do I wish to) please everyone. I try to be conscious of my comments but I do not want to become someone other than I am to participate either. I feel that if I say something that resonates great, if not, people are free to address them or skip right on past when they see my avatar. I’m not sure why my having the same avatar is of note so can’t help you there. I hope this answered some of your questions and that it doesn’t come off as too superior (I also have a sense of humor not everyone appreciates) and look forward to your future participation in the blog.
NA
PS The length of this comment and the time required to moderate it is also an example of why I am sometimes blunt.
Thank you for your reply. In that case it is good that there are people like you. People who were once victims that can devote themselves in a helpful way. I can see how putting one’s self in such a position could be rewarding and therapeutic to your own healing. I myself can be blunt at times and show a few narcissist traits….never on purpose of course. I suppose being raised by narcissists as I was myself can be somewhat of a contributor to those traits. We are only human after all. So thank you for all you do.
Hun, HG already has a #1 fan on here. Of course she’s a pretty young thing😉
Oh that’s nice…Hun. 😉