Poll : What Are You?

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Let’s talk about you dear readers.

What are you?

What school of empath do you believe you belong to? Standard, Super, Contagion or Codependent?

Perhaps you are unsure? Maybe you feel you are empathic but you do not quite reach the status of empath? Maybe you feel you are a normal, with a selection of low empathic and low narcissistic traits?

What Cadre of empath are you (if you are an empath)? Saviour, Doormat, Magnet, Carrier or Geyser?

Perhaps you do not know or you feel you are on the cusp of two (maybe more) of these categories. You can have elements of different schools and cadres, but usually one will prevail with regard to the school and cadre.

Finally, are you a Dirty Empath (Of the Infidelity Variety) and/or a Dirty Empath who is a Marriage or Relationship Breaker?

You may choose all that are applicable to you. Thus is you identify as a Magnet Standard Empath who is a DE (IV) and and a DE (MB) you can choose all four.

If you want to know for sure, you can of course consult with me. Also see the various articles on the blog appertaining to the schools and cadres (to save you searching Contagion has not been published yet).

As always, do expand in the comment section with your thoughts and observations.

What are you?

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332 Comments

  1. “I am Batman.”

    Or, in your nomenclature, HG, I am a Magnet Super Empath w/very strong Saviour tendencies. However, I have enough narcissistic traits to be able to haul out a “travel size” Devil’s Toolbox to right wrongs and do not suffer the delusion that a narcissist/Cluster-B, once definitively identified, can be saved or cured.

    My Supernovae are brutal and frequent, causing all but UENs to run for cover. And this was BEFORE I both found your work and received treatment from a psychologist specializing in narcissistic abuse recovery. Unfortunately, upper mids & lower uppers can’t get enough of me. This has been greatly reduced by changing the company I keep & the industry I work in and by moving from a megatropolis to the country.

    Prior to reading your books and going through therapy, I was racked with guilt over revenge campaigns I’d undertaken toward narcissists in my life, especially the many successful ones, but I’ve become a guilt-free caped crusader of sorts bent on removing fuel and shattering constructs whenever necessary.

    So far, the gods of love and justice (and a strong helping of karma) have been with me. I believe I owe my successes to a strong moral code: I NEVER lie, fabricate evidence, or break the law. Being of the Magnet cadre makes smear campaigns far less believable and my Truth that much more plausible. For this I am grateful.

    My skin is thick, my heart is bruised, but my eyes are evermore open.

    Thank you.

  2. My mother i suspect to be a lesser to middle midranger. Im certain shes pretty much unaware of what shes doing altho she has used my brother(golden child) as a flying monkey to do her dirty work and smear me and my hubby. She uses him as her eyes and ears into my dads side of the family who she could never get over not being a part of. She sulks and dishes out silent treatments. She also gives cold fury and ive seen her do this to my stepdad. Hes completely terrified of her cold fury. He came from a marriage of abuse and that in itself validates the fact my mother is a narc bc victims will quite often pick the same abuser again. They gravitate towards what they know. My stepdads mother was a matrinarc and very controlling.
    My narc im in confusion over. I really do think its a spectrum. Having a son on the autism spectrum i realise how varying a disorder can be and personality factors into this as well. There isnt a cookie cutter anything for any one narc. I think he lies somewhere between an upper midrange and lower greater. I feel he shouldnt be in midrange bc he never feels sorry for himself and actually gets upset at pity. He wont admit it openly but gets quiet and weird if you show him pity like hes angry at it. As far as his awareness and pride in his npd id say he is a greater. Hes fully aware of his manipulations. He sets out knowing how to lure and capture prey. Hes even used the word “bait” before in this context. Hes aware and uses his npd. Where i dont see greater is hes not a super high achiever but gravitates towards those that are. He would be a follower or in a group of friends of such a person. He respects and wants to be like a high achiever greater who lies, cheats and gets away with manipulating people.

  3. Oh dear. I think I must be a Standard Geyser empath. 😂😂😂😭😭😭😏
    I feel like some sort of protector empath. I leap protectively in front of the narcissist and tell the angry masses to back off. Not a saviour empath per se, as I understand all too well that there can be no change. I do see the good in them, but it’s a different form of good. Yes, I know narcissists can be a menace, but most people don’t understand what they’ve been through. I understand what they’ve been through. I was raised by MatriNarc as well. Why I didn’t freeze into a narcissist I don’t know. My little brother did. I remember being locked in a dark closet for hours on end, crying bitter angry tears and telling myself over and over, “I won’t be like her! I won’t be like her! I won’t be like her!”
    But what if the narcissist is just a younger intelligence in the universe? A young soul. Can you imagine asking an unruly toddler if they could please exhibit the wisdom and control of a 75 yr old? Then angrily telling them that life could be so much easier if they just would?!! Also, it might be harder for a younger soul to handle abuse and stress. And a younger soul might naturally be more self centric. So why then would we disparage someone for being at a different progression point? And especially one who has been affected by circumstances that were beyond their control? I know you have said HG, that you believe that narcissists are further along in human development having done away with certain hindering emotions. Either scenario is interesting to me.
    My life’s work will be to understand and help narcissists. Not change them, but assist them with their needs.

      1. I’ve been thinking long and hard about these words Sir. I take Your advise very seriously. I know if I were stood before you yammering, “but… but… but…” it would take just one glance from You to shut me up haha. But since we are here in this virtual glass castle, I wonder if I might press forward a little?
        I will be perusing my Masters degree in psychology with a focus on NPD (which needs to be renamed in my opinion, it’s not accurate and it’s insulting). Whatever I end up doing though, at least it will be with a real understanding of what’s happening with the narcissistic perspective. There will be many going into this field and there will need to be some who understand what’s really going on. Personal experience will go a long way also I feel. I will be in contact with Your kind. It’s probably going to be inevitable.
        Having said that, I do understand that I should stay out of any personal involvements with them. (Unless asked to serve a term in House Tudor of course!). But after Your advise I am thinking about abandoning the last and most dangerous portion of the “hands on” research I’ve been doing… to interact with what I believe to be a Greater Elite (who has been circling around) for the purpose of testing some theories. My original plan was just a quick reconnaissance mission, in and out in 6 months… no falling in love. Ha ha yeah, I know. My friends and sisters have deemed the plan foolish and a terrible idea. It’s so tempting though!

        1. Jules, Please stay away from him! I have been involved with two greaters, one was an elite. They are by far the most dangerous! They will take your heart and break it in a million pieces! Even with you knowing what he is and telling yourself you can handle it, you will not be able to. The pain you fill is unbearable at times. They know what you are going to say and do before you do it! If this is something you want to do, be prepared! You see they always are. Save your studies for the office. With the greater elite you won’t even be safe there! Good luck with what ever your decision might be.

      2. I agree with HG. I have had some narcissist s come through my private practice. I choose not to treat them because to them there is nothing to fix. If they really want to continue in sessions it it for show or very superficial reasons.

      3. Dear HG, I cannot help but noticing that the perpetual emotive dynamic between the narcissist and the empath is not dissimilar to the multifaceted dynamic between the Dominant and the submissive in bdsm scenarios. In bdsm, both parties seek, understand and abide by rules, which are mutually understood and, respected.

        If so, is there any possibility of a balanced and mutually satisfying relationship between the Greater narcissist and empath, provided the rules of the game are well defined and agreed upon by both parties?

          1. Thank you for your response HG.On reflection; it seems like I am dealing with a completely different “animal” to those I have encountered in the bdsm scene over the years. A person with such a void should never dominate anyone because it supersedes sadism and breaks the bdsm rules of consent and responsibility for one’s own actions…
            Separately, I have watched just about all your videos and I am still learning. It feels as if the best I can do is to stop analysing and bluntly go to a finite ‘no contact’. I don’t think I will find any answers from him and, even if some were provided, I wouldn’t trust their veracity.
            I shall just say ‘c’est la vie’ and work on myself so that next time, I choose more carefully. The man I have been seeing for the last nine months is of a lesser social status to mine and yet, I enthusiastically fallen for his games. Kudos to him, I guess… I know that I need to stay focused and logical in my analysis, swallow my slightly shattered pride and count those nine months as an experience to learn from.
            Although, I must admit, I do find the topics of such pathology fascinating to ponder. Perhaps I should focus on my own shortcomings so that this doesn’t ever happen to me again.
            Your insight has been invaluable, yet a little chilling. Thank you

    1. Jules, I see your point and I really do get it. I think there is some validity to your point, however I also think you’re wrong. I also believe HG is wrong about being more evolved. Hear me out please. The narcissist… there is good in them. They are very injured. They are like toddlers, less evolved. It is harder and requires more strength to control those dark urges. Just because you can do something doesn’t mean you should. Using restraint is hard. Putting something else’s needs above your own. Figuring out that self is less important than a cause, a belief. Knowing you have the power to harm or help and choosing to help. That is real power. You are choosing to help, I get it. We love big, but they cannot be loved out of this. It’s a fatal flaw, narcissism. They’re addicted to power. We all have this power, they choose to abuse it. I can be narcissistic and demand the world pay for my pain. It doesn’t fill the hole, it doesn’t negate the abuse. It only masks it. Pain begets pain. If you aid them, enable them, then you retard their growth. Like a drug addict, they have to hit bottom and see for themselves the only way out is to choose a different path. I know, i know the creature. I believe all people have a creature, a breaking point where pain, fear, shame, helplessness and hopelessness reside. Some people seem to have excellent control or perhaps have never been pushed to their breaking point. I have. I battle my creature every single day. The difference is I’d rather die than let it win. By protecting the narcissist, you only further their decay. I know, I sacrificed most of my life protecting narcissists. I’m a fighter. It only made them worse, more addicted, more vengeful. Instead of using me as a shield to gain strength, as I intended, they all, every single one, began to blame me for their pain, their weakness, their inability to face themselves. I am not responsible for my mother’s sexual abuse as a child, but she is mine. She happily sold me out for favoritism and acceptance. You can’t win this war. Stop fighting for them please.

      1. Hey IdaNoe! Thank you so much for your kind and insightful reply. I love how you pointed out that we all have this “power” (to abuse, to steal, to manipulate, even to murder) but some choose to abuse it and some don’t. So true! It’s about discipline. For those like you and me at least.
        I was wondering about a few points you made.. Like when you said “if you aid them, enable them you retard their growth” or “they have to hit bottom and see for themselves that the only way out is to choose a different path” or “by protecting the narcissist you only further their decay” These all sound like change is expected or possible. Or even that further decay is possible. It seems to me that if narcissism is an unchanging fatal flaw then we can’t help them to any point of understanding or change.
        I also found it very interesting when you said that whenever you tried to give some shelter and help to a N that they all just became worse (more fearsome, vengeful, etc.) I can totally see that being the case. Wouldn’t that just be because they were well fueled? So what then? (and I ask this in earnest) Are we to ostracize and “starve” all the Narcissists around us so that they become less efficient at what they do? Or could we at least provide some positive coaching (fuel) and help with their laudable endeavors, like finishing education, keeping jobs and the like?

        1. Hello Jules!
          I do believe narcissists change as they go through life, as we all do.  They learn, become more efficient  or deranged depending on your point of view. I think back throughout my life at how my mother’s manipulations evolved over my lifetime.  So yes they can change. As for further decay, go to a nursing home.  Somatic or cerebral,  times catches everyone.  They’re debilitated, desperate and dangerous. This is their fatal flaw nearing the bottom. Rock bottom would be completely incapacitated and unable to gather fuel. There, they have to finally face themselves and their creature. I do think, in theory, it is possible for them to change before this stage, however I completely agree with HG, they will see no point. In my opinion the only hope is that in their end times, being forced to face themselves, they can carry that knowledge to the next existence and be more accepting of themselves and their weaknesses.

          With the narcissists I was closest to, all had similar issues. No true self acceptance, paranoia, anxiety  and a huge issue with their mothers. The mother thing seems to be at the heart of narcissism, so it’s hidden, but as you know them it becomes apparent. When they were offered kindness, it was seen as weakness.  Acceptance was viewed as an open door to take. Coaching in good behavior was used to gather information on my morals and then warped and twisted as they tried to break me. Forgiveness was seen as permission to do whatever again. Give them an inch, they take a yard. So, yes, I believe they must be starved.  It’s hard to do. It requires us empaths to have excellent control of ourselves and our emotions.  Basically we are punished and unable to live free because of them. Perhaps we could ship them all to an island and let them eat each other! For me, that’s part of what I’ve gotten out of this, that we’re food. They don’t love us. They dont respect us. They never will. We are not a safe place for them. They’re running from themselves.  They want two things from us, our life force and to punish us for being an independent entity.  They don’t feel or know their own life force,  so they envy ours and try to consume it. They pretend to be strong, however they are completely dependent on us. Because they can’t generate their own fuel, they will never be independent of us, ever, because they won’t face themselves and accept their own weaknesses.  It’s like a never ending circle. And it’s a cycle we’re locked into them with. Want to hear the ultimate contradiction? I think they are the ones who need saving. And to save them, we must go completely against our empathic natures and starve them to death.

          1. Wow, thank you for his reply! So sorry I lost track of this thread. I wish we could continue this convo but it will be too long in the replies. Awesome stuff. Thanks again.

  4. I feel far less empathic after dealing with my N for years. Maybe things he said to me made me think I am far less empathic than I thought I was originally. I often had the thought that he was immature, but then I would give it to stop the hurt on me. Not to stop his “hurt”.

    Even after reading HG’s many articles, I still have no idea what cadre, if any, of empath I am.

    But I do know I am a dirty empath. I had an affair. To prove him wrong about no one else would ever want me. To rebuild some self confidence. To rub his nose in it, without saying a word.

    The problem with that was, he never noticed. Then I knew he wasn’t omniscient or omnipotent. He may be holding me prisoner, but I did so much poking of the bear, he would at least leave the house and leave me alone, for hours.

    But he repaid my treachery of refusing to believe he was my god, by depriving me of any and all of monetary value and future as he could before he died.

    But I’m still here, and happier with him gone. : )

  5. Hmm, it is really hard to figure out. I seem to mirror and match people and protect people (truth and justice). I fight back if I realize that the person is hurting me or someone else. I sometimes completely cut people out of my life without explanation if I know they will not change. There is also certain people that I would run back to, even if I knew I shouldn’t have. I notice I have to ask people quite often what to do with certain situations, like I can’t figure things out on my own.  I’m not sure co dependent or super. If you think you have insight feel free to answer. ( see I told you😂)

      1. Nice legs HG … ok so word press got me lost … you new supermaiden on Instagram is he magnet empathy and super empath ? I thought you avoided super empath ?

        1. OMJ
          HG has stated previously that his preference is Magnet Super Empath and that is what Shieldmaiden is.

          1. NA .. I guess I missed that part, I guessed what she was – I have a good instinct – I like to believe.
            More to come … looking forward to it.

  6. SMH … Sound like me … :)) HG … Is she magnet empath too ?? You said you try to avoid superempath usually, are you making an exception ?

  7. Dear MB … I am with you on how I admire and I get touched by his mastery of Words and how he makes them dance with one an other in a perfect harmony.
    By chance check if you have your Venus in Gemini… that could explain why that is an aspect very important to you ! Cheers !

  8. I realised that when thinking about the different criteria that fit or don’t fit in conjunction with this poll, that I had to fight my ego and my vanity and pride at many points. I am aware of the fact that self-concept and metaperception of oneself, combined with either pride and vanity or feelings of inadequacy or deep-seated shame about oneself, can serve as a strong filter that hampers an accurate assessment – and that may well go in both directions.

    Carrier is the cadre I associate myself with the most, even though I don’t tick all of the boxes. My assessment is based on real-life interaction, off the screen. I don’t perceive myself as overly emotional or ‘histrionic’ enough to be a Geyser, and while there may be tinges of Saviour, I don’t feel that this is the cadre I belong to. I like to help and support, but at a certain point, the feeling that the other person should be allowed to learn on their own and that I am overstepping boundaries in being the Florence Nightingale kicks in. Besides, my boundaries and need for time and space on my own don’t allow for overly exhausting myself in other people’s problems. In real life, I am perceived by others as a solid rock who remains calm in turbulent situations, who has a soothing effect on others and someone who can carry a lot. I got this feedback repeatedly, and that applies to both my workplace and how I interact with people close to me in my private life. A work-like, more problem-solution-oriented approach resonates with me. In my interaction with the Elite MR, I adopted a (seemingly) unaffected stance which seems to fit the more ‘stoic approach’ while churning on the inside as outlined in the Carrier article.

    I often get asked for help in the streets by strangers and especially children but apply this to my ‚harmless‘ appearance and that I seem to be trustworthy enough to be approached in person rather than to a magnetic aura. It is not my style to gush with praise and admiration, regardless of who I interact with. I love to compliment someone on their abilities and achievements but only when I feel it is ‘earned’ by trust and consistency of words and actions. In narcissistic interactions, this stance may make my fuel not as delicious as that of others in potency and quantity – that at least explains some nuances of the dynamic with the Elite MR I was involved with. He repeatedly told me that there was a stark contrast in how I reacted to him as opposed to other women. My attitude is a personal matter of preference and how I expect to be treated in return.

    Also, there is a dirty streak – I don’t like this label for several reasons, but that is where I belong as well. I committed infidelity in my long-term relationship.

    I am not sure whether ‚just empathic’ or empath or normal and also not quite sure about the number and strength of narcissistic traits. But far as school is concerned – if empath applies to me, then I would tend to standard with codependent traits. This assumption is based on many different factors (likelihood, ‘statistics’, altered perception of the schools when viewed through the lense of the narcissist’s needs and wants etc.).

  9. HG, could a SE use their narcissistic traits in an empathetic way? For example, the SE asserts control over someone in order to defend someone else against mistreatment. Would this be a SE narcissistic traits?

    1. They could. For example the narcissistic trait of pride might be used to ensure someone’s children are well brought up but not done in a rigid and controlling manner.
      Defending someone being mistreated is the exercise of the empathic traits of justice and compassion.

      1. Thank you HG. So because the act of asserting control is done out of compassion toward the one being mistreated and not necessarily to gain control over the one mistreating, in this instance asserting control or superiority would be a empath trait not a narcissist trait? Because of intention?

  10. HG, where is all this information about your new ipps? All these details about what your watching on TV and she’s intelligent , your name for her on here etc? Is this all on your instagram ? Or a post on here ?

      1. Im enjoying HGs instagram except that last snowy driving vid lol i get enough of that 😄 hope you and your sheildmaiden go somewhere warm brrrr

        1. Chi, I believe he commented a few weeks ago they have a trip planned for somewhere warm in February.

          1. Well HG, better later then never. I know you have your posts picked to come out ahead of time. Would you be able to tell me if the one on future fakery will be posted anytime soon? As always Thank you for your time HG. I realize I’ve been asking a lot of questions lately but my ex will be coming into the picture again in a week ( not by my choice. Work related.) I want no I need because of certain situations in my life at this time, to be armed and prepared! You and the ladies are all I have to keep my emotions at bay! Thank you again!

        2. Yes, take SM to the caribbean please! If we have to live vicariously, can’t we do so in some nice warm climate 😉

  11. I haven’t done this poll because i haven’t got a clue what i am, i do know i’m definitely not normal !!
    I would never cheat on someone or get involved with anyone that wasn’t single and definitely not a married man, apart from that i have no idea, i’m trying to work it out myself i just know i’m a complete mess ha ha, that’s trying to sort myself out.

    1. Dear dear Lisa,
      Welcome to the best education you’re ever gonna get
      First n foremost ….. YOU ARE AMAZING and VERY SPECIAL
      Never lose sight of that beautiful one
      You have been captivated by a narcissist who wanted all your
      marvlessness
      Mr Tudor are all the lovelies here will help you precious
      Hang on Lisa, it’s gonna be a bumpy ride, but in the end you’ll feel soooooo much better and the rewards are “greater” 🤣 so here begins the beginne
      Baby steps precious ……it can be confusing as there’s lots to absorb
      Hugs to my lovely and wishing you the best
      Luv Bubbles xx 😘

      Sorry for the delay Lisa….. trying to keep up

      Yoohoo ….K ….. where are you gorgeous ..and lovelies …. help is needed here …it’s urgent

      1. Dear Lisa,
        You’re most welcome precious
        Keep commenting and asking questions …. . help is on the way
        Mr Tudor is really nice now … he’s overflowing with fuel …so get in quick 🤣
        Luv Bubbles xx 😘

        1. I’m not nice. I am the same as always – polite, professional and accurate. A few more witticisms I grant you, but the normal high standard of interaction remains the same.

        2. Thanks Bubbles
          I have to say i’ve noticed no difference in HG, I didn’t even know he had a new girlfriend.
          He always just seems the same to me.

          1. Lisa
            I think empaths are projecting a bit. Maybe because we know it as the golden period and we are relating it to our own experiences. We have never witnessed him in this period or heard him speak about his IPPS using the terms as he has used to describe Shieldmaiden recently. Someone even said his girlfriend seems classy and it struck me because what do we even have to base that on? Emotion seems high, with Hope leading.

          2. She is classy. Master’s degree, holds a board level position of an international company, is trilingual, dresses elegantly, well-read. I could go on but I am not telling you everything at once.

          3. HG
            I didn’t say she wasn’t. I said we had nothing previous to base that on. It was not a criticism but an observation using logic and not emotion.

            Also, that is your assessment/perception of classy. I saw what you listed as character traits and residual benefits.

          4. I know you did not say she was not, you just stated you had not seen evidence, so I provided you with some. The Shieldmaiden exhibits considerable class in a number of ways and I mentioned some of those elements – it is evident in her manner with people, what she says and does but I do not have the time to evidence in detail, for now, accept my confirmation and as I provide more information over time you will see how this statement is supported by the facts.

          5. HG
            I hadn’t wondered, but thank you for that glimpse and I look forward to things as they unfold.

            My point however really had nothing to do with SM (or you for that matter). It was about empaths being empaths and immediately responding with emotion (namely hope), because previous to your offering, there was nothing to base the fact that she was classy on (other than she must be because she is with you). That we (some) are still instictively slapping on the rose coloured glasses instead of waiting and observing.

            Even though it’s always about you, it’s not always about you.
            (Insert animated dancing raspberry here).

          6. NA, in fairness to the person(s) that made the comment of SM being classy, I believe they were discussing the few détails you could see about her in IG (nails and clothes, I believe). I think that was the base of their comments.

          7. Lou
            I understand your point. I guess it’s the interpretation of classy then (or any other description that we used but didn’t know at that time). If being dressed and wearing nail polish is classy, then I (and almost everyone else here) is classy AF. It sounded to me like they (and not only that person – that was just an example and I don’t even remember who it was and it wasn’t personal) as empaths were already projecting their thoughts. Logic says all we saw was a table for two with food and drink on it, hands, a snippet of clothing. Emotion fills in things we don’t see like class, beauty, etc. I guess I was pointing out that empaths are still quick to use emotion to romanticize things given very little detail, and that means they might still be highly susceptible in their own life.

          8. NA, I understand what you are saying! I noticed also how there may only be a picture as if taken from a travel guide, but many assume that is where they are at. If that is true then that person or persons are letting there emotions run thoughts. Not logic. Is that correct in what you are saying? I have learned my emotions still run my thoughts but if I take what I have been taught and put it to go use, I then see a whole different logical side. I still have far to go, but I believe I’ve finally had a breakthrough because HG and people like you.🦜🦜

          9. NA, I totally agree with your observations. I wouldn’t have arrived at the conclusion of her being classy by the details revealed in HG’s IG photos either (nothing against Shieldmaiden; HG, it is just that I surely do not have enough information to form an opinion of her in that respect). However, I was not sure if you had seen the photos and if you had forgotten people mentioning her clothes and nails. That is all.

      2. Dear Lisa,
        Sorry lovely…. there’s soo many newbies … I confuse easy trying to go back n forth … haha
        Still, it’s a great way to connect…. yes
        Luv Bubbles xx 😘

      3. Dear Mr Tudor,
        Did you not see my smiley face ….. I was being funny
        I did not make any derogatory remarks otherwise
        You’re being too sensitive and should control your emotional thinking
        🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
        Luv Bubbles xx 😘

      4. First of all, welcome, Lisa! Second, I didn’t see love at all in HG’s description of his lady, just a lot of residual benefits. When you’re in love, you can’t define what you like about the other person, it’s a “ne sais qoui,” not a bunch of objective assets. No offense, but she sounds perfect… for a job application. I’m very happy for you though, HG. And like all of us, remain hopeful.

        1. My response was with regard to NA wondering whether she is classy. It was not an exhaustive list of why I am in a relationship with The Shieldmaiden. As I wrote, I am not telling you everything at once. Thank you for you kind wishes nonetheless.

          1. You’re welcome. I’m glad to hear there’s more, HG. I didn’t ask much because it’s not of my business but of course, we learn from your interactions with women so…

          2. You may always ask SP. If I have time I will answer where I decide I wish to. Most of the time I will provide information where people ask or it will appear in articles in due course.

      5. Hi HG…the sheildmaiden sounds amazing! I find it surprising she would be that intelligent yet know nothing about npd? Especially being in her type of career situation. It is possible tho. I think unless it impacts you on a very personal level you dont go looking to find out. She will if she hasnt already. I do wonder if the newly discarded kim has gone researching the signs of npd as she picks up the pieces of her life as she knew it? Perhaps she was researching while in the relationship.

        1. CM, believe me I have had many intelligent partners who knew nothing about NPD and in certain instances I know they still do not. Furthermore, I have consulted with many intelligent people who had been in the dark for a long time indeed about NPD (some know about it but still struggle to deal with because of the interference of ET).

          You are correct that most people only know about it once it has had an impact on you. Much like listening to Justin Bieber.

          1. Ha ha ha! And regret it once they had the experience too, “much like listening to Justin Bieber.”

          2. “I have had many intelligent partners who knew nothing about NPD and in certain instances I know they still do not. Furthermore, I have consulted with many intelligent people who had been in the dark for a long time indeed about NPD.”

            I feel like sometimes there should be a little footnote somewhere on your landing page – or maybe just put it big, bold, black letters:

            ‘Book learnin’ and having official letters following your name will not save you from a narc.’

            Oh, and re: Bieber…sorry about that.

      6. Oh, that’s interesting SP, my fear of heights is definitely more extreme than other people’s. I’ve had people doubt me on that
        : P I’ve read some information on hypnotic suggestibility and how it may relate.
        I think my synesthesia is basic in the sense that most people have some version, I just think the sensations are more extreme, automatic and consistent than average for me. So someone telling a story about something that happened to them if they feel it themselves I get involuntary physical sensations from the story and increased flinching and touching body parts, etc…. If the person is not emotionally attached to what they are saying I tend not to. I also get that energy feeling where others in the room are having a feeling and it starts to fill my body. I think most people with empathy have that. Like I say it’s just more intense than average for me according to what I see. Your visual perceptions must be an interesting and intense way of seeing things. I think that’s fascinating. I have some bipolar tendencies and it is exaggerated with traveling east and hypomania tends to increase my sensory perceptions I notice and there is much heightened awareness toward random things, it can get chaotic. I think some of my spirituality is related to that, but I would argue that heightened sensory input could be tied to heightened perception of reality. I do sometimes notice alterations in focus and volume around certain things. My thinking about the conscious filter of information is that we self-protect by blocking out things we are perceiving automatically in an attempt to “normalize” them, but if we stop and pay more attention in real time we may filter out less- so for example a physical sensation can be dismissed as tied to an incorrect cause and downplayed, when it could be more of a synesthesia and learning to pay attention can increase awareness of our environment and influences. I especially say because I spent a lot of time ignoring cues and dismissing intuitive information. It is a challenge for me to pay attention consistently and sort.

        I think that being able to sense feelings of others with greater intensity is empathy that does actually affect day to day interactions. So when I am communicating with someone, if I physically feel their discomfort rather than just observe it, it causes minor changes in my intention and expression in that interaction. Like in HG’s article “Bitter” he is observing and absorbing her reactions. I would more likely feel them and then make conversational adjustments to the energy to smooth it or level or comfort it (within boundaries and reason). Interestingly I am starting to focus on that tendency in others as a requirement for investing time and energy into an interaction or a relationship. Some people who have others drawn to them are maybe doing that type of thing? I feel it can get hijacked.

        There are remote sensing testing activities online you can try if you are interested. I like things like that and I’ve seen some others on here recently suggest some testing things online that I want to look at, I’ve not seen before. I like that sort of thing, personality insights and whatnot.

        1. NB, I found your reply, sometimes this venue drives me crazy too. You have mirror synesthesia! I have always wanted to meet someone like you, that type of synesthesia sounds extremely intense to me. There was actually an exhibition about this in London last year, I happened to be visiting and a friend of mine suggested that we had to go, it was really interesting and it explained your type very well.

          Like you, I feel I restrain myself from listening to my sensory clues. Thinking in retrospect, I know my senses were telling me I was interacting with someone different from all the other people I’ve been with when I got entangled with the narc. I could not feel anything coming from him even when he was telling me he loved me or kissed me. But you said it very well, we try to silence our emotions because sometimes it’s simply overwhelming. I usually enjoy being with people, but there are times I feel the urge to run away, because it feels like time speeds up and I feel too much excitement around. I always attributed that to anxiety, but reading you I know it is part of this intense perception. Last week I had a new thing, I had a lightning bolt caused by touch, the tactile sensation was not as painful as the blinding shock. Until then, all of my visual experiences have been related to sound only. But I have read about some synesthetes that combine different senses, who knows. I need to investigate more about this.

      7. OH! SP, I have a few things, but-
        I got a lightning bolt by touch about two months ago. Had never happened before. “Lighting” was the label I had placed on it afterward, but so funny you say about mixing senses, because I had zero visual from it. It was only physical like a zap through my body. I haven’t been able to expand my thoughts on it. I lost the ability to focus or process anything for awhile afterward and I was convinced the other person did it on purpose (the zapping part). I try to shift my energy if I touch that person.

        1. NB, I got it while at the doctor. She accidentally pinched me and I overreacted and pushed her away screaming Nooo!! she got shocked and I had to apologize and explain to her that I just got a lightning bolt because I have synesthesia. She found it really interesting but I think she was scared to get any closer after that haha. Poor thing.

          1. Sweet P
            If you’re that touchy I feel sorry for your gynecologist. They better wear a hemet!

          2. HAHAHA!!!! You kill me, NA! It has never happened while there, NA, but seeing the recent changes I can’t promise it won’t next time.

      8. SP, thank you so much for your feedback on the mirror touch. I was thinking it must be some relationship to mirror touch, though I have responses to verbal descriptions as well, and also I don’t think the sensations are as defined and intense for me as for some people. And yours sound vivid, yeah I agree on the anxiety, that it could be something else. What I like to do is try to further open my senses and this conversation is helpful for me because expanding any mirror touch perceptions is beneficial for my work anyway, and for my personal development. I’m going to read some more about it, but I love when I find outside the box stuff to read, so I’ll have a look around. I know what you mean about the time speed up. I’ve mentioned response to sound on this blog in the past, btw, I like to use binaural beats and sound frequencies for chakra mediation and focus on physical sensations. You’ve got me thinking, it is such an interesting subject.

      9. Oh that is interesting! Thank you for explaining.
        Mine was nothing like that I don’t think, I just had a touch and the person is someone I enjoy but it was very specifically a zap through me and randomly unexpected.

    2. Welcome Lisa! You have come to the best place you could possibly be! Everyone on will help support and guide you. Take advantage of all HG has to offer! There is know one out there that can compare to him. You will hurt you will cry at times you will be angry, yes you will even laugh! You have found a place where no one judges and most have gone through what you are going through! We do understand! Stay with the blog, read all of his books, take advantage of his many forms of consults he has to offer. Remember this, there is no price to high to pay for your freedom! Welcome and I hope you find the peace you so deserve.🌷

      1. foolme1time
        Thank you
        I think my response to the poll about not knowing what type of empath I am has confused you and bubbles but thank you for your kind words.
        I have been on the blog annoying HG for quite a long time , couple of years at least and had quite a few consultations etc with HG .
        My point was that I don’t feel that I can really say what I am in terms of the Empath spectrum, I have mostly focused on understanding NPD and realising what that is and understanding how much of that i’ve been exposed to in my life and really being able to recognise it, it’s not something that I fully understood straight away. It’s probably only since clearing all the narcs out of my life that I have started to look at myself in the last 6 months and see my behaviour patterns and how I have contributed to a lot of these dynamics. Of course I can recognise things in myself in HG’s posts regarding Empaths , but I can’t totally say that i’m sure of what I am , there’s bits and pieces that fit.
        Anyway thank you for your kind words.

        1. Lisa, I’m in the same position you are. Just not sure what I am! I think HG is coming up with away we can find out through a consult with him! If that’s true HG?! I’m in! Good to talk to you Lisa! 🤪

        2. Oh Lisa you don’t annoy HG! He loves being ask questions! That is what he is here for! Now me on the other! I can really get under his skin at times! 😝

          1. I do! I am the annoying one. I am not normally so annoying – I just like a good philosophical argument, even if it is a circular one with a narc (see what I did there?)

          2. Thank you again for being so generous with your time in all ways – glad I can offer something enjoyable. For me intellectual highs give drug induced ones a run for their money.

      2. Dear foolme1time,
        Yes, he is getting his knickers in a bit of a twist
        I feel Mr Tudor has been a ….”tad”…”more responsive” in answering comments in this, his “golden period”
        Thats my version of him being ” nice ” …..otherwise same same 🤣
        Luv Bubbles xx 😘

  12. Hi HG,

    I grew up with a narcissistic father. I am often saving others and because I’m honed at working out what others want or need from growing up walking on eggshells I like to wear high heels lol 👠 and tended to be a saviour/codependent type for too long.

    It didn’t bring me happiness and I was very self unaware — a people pleaser of the highest kind.

    I’ve been working hard on this for some years and have learnt to feel self love and self worth. This really was forged in steel when I became involved with a narc ( not the same as my father, différent calibre) and I feel it was a lesson meet Ming him so I could heal unresolved issues with my father (I walked out of his life aged 18 and never saw him again). He died 10 years later.

    My parents were divorced so I still had my mother. He had remarried ( to a woman he was having an affair with while married to my mother).

    I’m intuitive, pick up on others energy and what they want like a dog can sniff out food.

    I dont ever talk about my father to people. If they ask I just say he died. People leave it then. But he was cruel, heartless and incredibly grand in his views of himself. Loved to put me down and play mind games. I was never good enough. He was far superior to everyone.

    My mother did tell me once as a boy, my father was going home after school and sucking milk out of a bsby bottle. Given to him by his mother. He was plenty indulged. Odd upbringing.

    I wanted to be loved and so I think I kept my faith in finding it when I could escape the house of horrors with him. I went to live with him during my last years of high school. He put me through a private school.

    Things seemed amazing at first but a few short months later living there began to change. I didn’t notice at first but when I realised I was living in a dysfunctional home I was careful not to inform my mother because I was scared of my father and getting punished for it. And if I’m honestI wanted to protect my mother.

    That’s my story.

      1. Hello NarcAngel,

        Thank you 🙂 I love it here because you can share things that you can’t with most people. It’s the best thing ever, me finding this place. Just writing things down sometimes, makes you feel better and it’s healing. Happiness to you xx

  13. I was surprised at reading “Super Empath” and “The Empathic Super Nova”, because it was a SPOT ON description of what I thought was a fairly rare personality to suffer from). Now I see 20% claim to be Super Empaths, which makes me even more average.
    What up HG? Do we really top the charts for Empathic types?

      1. I read that couple of years ago. I’m sure you can google it. The issue is that codependency doesn’t harm others to the extent the others do and it is mostly seen as behavior pattern and not a disorder I think to myself what’s the difference ? lol behavior pattern or disorder its all dysfunctional

      1. Hi Lori
        You mention somewhere on here that codependents might be added to Cluster B ? Where did you see that information please ?

      2. I think it was first considered in the 80s from what I read there had been controversy sorrounding as many see it as a behavioral dynamic and not a mental disorder

  14. I was a highly malfunctioning Codependent at the extreme end of a personality disorder that can relate to some elements within each cadre but not much within geyser. In many ways the personality disorder trumped the codependency as solitude was chosen over relationships that made me feel bad while I tried to protect the little bit of me that still existed.

    Much has changed 2 years 4 months post UGN disengagement/no contact. Much continues to change…

    1. Narcissists as a whole would not engage in this way, so perhaps you mean, what do I get out of it yes?

  15. I do find it interesting that those of us who are empaths are very happy to be empaths full of emotion and those of us who are narcissists are happy (well not happy, pleased?) to be narcissists and void of most emotions and see them as a hindrance.

    1. I am pleased the word ‘like’ appeared there, we had enough trouble with the last ‘hole’ miscommunication, recently.

      1. 😘 (wanna talk about it?)

        Will I be seeing you tonight or did the plane move on from Schiphol?
        Tell me how you fly from Norway over Iceland to Amsterdam? Did you get hold of some weird discount ticket? Or did you need to drop a body first? (like they used to during the Argentinian military dictatorship)

        1. I agree SP. We have a lot of fun here at times. I wouldn’t stay if it was super serious ALL the time. Its almost like a really weird extended family. Plus it is a well established fact that if MB isn’t having fun she’ll pack up and move to another sandbox!

          Ps. I’m glad you’re part of the fam!

          1. I would move to another sandbox with you! Thanks, MB, I’m happy to having met a lot of cool people here and talk on a daily basis. HG has done a wonderful work establishing a healthy tone and interaction, and allowing humor in.

          2. SP, I agree re HG doing a fabulous job. He’s one of my favorite people on the planet.

            IMO, without humor, life wouldn’t be worth living. I like you SP. I’m glad to have you as my friend in the sandbox. Now, be sure your hair is dry before you head out to JFK so you don’t catch cold!

          3. I like you too, MB. And yes, better dry off my hair, it’s cold in NYC! Ha ha.

  16. I am not 100% sure but I believe I am a contagion geyser. I don’t think I own enough confidence to be a Super but I also don’t like the title of ‘Super’ so I am going to rebel against it. I cry a lot though so I know geyser suits me.

    I have a problem with absorbing others’ crap and so I need to withdraw as result. I am self-absorbed but I feel others’ pain and much of that is to my detriment. I don’t like it.

    I also notice that few chose contagion as their type. That is interesting and I wonder why that is.

    I also attract narcs. It doesn’t matter if romantic or professional–they seek me out, and I get devalued even in the workplace! This has happened many times!

    I can be so bitchy though. The real answer is I don’t know. I’m not so perfect and nice all the time. So why the bleep do they come to me?

    So annoying!

    1. Bibi:

      I can relate to much of what you have written, mainly the comments below:

      “I have a problem with absorbing others’ crap and so I need to withdraw as result. I am self-absorbed but I feel others’ pain and much of that is to my detriment.”

      THIS! I don’t know if I’m absorbing other’s crap or just moody myself. I feel like moods change a lot, especially based on what’s going on around me. Is that a “normal” thing or a contagion trait? I have the geyser aspect in that I was still crying last night when I got to the vet’s office about hub lashing out at me before I left. When my hub has rage episodes, I want to scream and be violent. I never would, but I feel panicky and angry. I try to sooth him so that *I* feel better. What is that? I’m definitely self-absorbed and don’t like that. Can an empath be self absorbed?

      “I also attract narcs. It doesn’t matter if romantic or professional–they seek me out, and I get devalued even in the workplace!” THIS ALSO.

      “I can be so bitchy though. The real answer is I don’t know. I’m not so perfect and nice all the time.” THIS TOO. Had to comment because so much of what you wrote sounds like how I feel.

      Mary

      1. Bibi,

        Thank you for sharing the link for 4 on the Enneagram. Holy cow! This definitely sounds like me. How did you find this? Did you take a multiple choice test to find which number it assigned you? Or did you arrive at #4 by selecting the qualities that fit you?

      2. Bibi,

        Hi again. Just as an update, I found a free quiz online and did test high on 4, but tested even higher on 6! There are elements of both that are very strong. With regard to 4, the need for “alone time” is strong, the desire to be authentic and emotionally honest with and about myself, as well as wanting to feel special which I think makes me more vulnerable to narcs and their flattery. With regard to 6, I definitely struggle to make any decisions because of fear of making the wrong one and sacrificing what feels secure and safe, and I’m always thinking of what can go wrong and trying to mitigate risks by having an alternate plan. (When choosing seats for a flight, I’m like “in case someone else is sick, which seat would limit my exposure?”) This drives my hub insane. He is the complete opposite and thinks it’s ridiculous to always think that way. For me, it makes more sense to try to minimize what could go wrong in advance, to at least exercise control over the variables that I can. That reduces stress over the long run because at least THAT detail is taken care of. This is a total #6 thing. Both of them fit very well.

        Did you feel like there was another number that fit you almost as well as 4? It’s amazing how many combinations there are. This is fascinating. Thank you again for the link!

        Mary

  17. I still to this day have no idea what kind of empath I am as I’m not even sure I am one , I recognize too many bad qualities in myself that make me question wether I’m even an empath but at the end of the day it doesn’t matter to me I’m just happy to be out of the relationship with the narc whom I’m not even sure to this day was really a narcissist , just know it was a very unhealthy relationship and happy to be the longest I’ve ever been away almost 8 months

    1. Me too, Ugotit. 8 months! Almost 9, actually. Last year this time he was trying to entice me back into the relationship. In fact, we were probably lying on the very sofa that I am on now. Might even be the same day. Maybe that is why I thought about him a lot today.

      I know he was a narc. I also don’t really care what sort of empath I am. But since I’m here, it might be worth finding out so I don’t attract the wrong type again.

  18. I’m not exactly sure, I seem to be a mixture. People gravitate to me, even when I dim my light. It’s like I can’t seem to hide my light and they still find me and tell me their innermost problems. I can peer into someone’s eyes and feel and see where their thoughts are originating from but I prefer to listen to the person and form my view of them that way. I have to be careful that I don’t absorb others feelings, I can feel others emotions radiating in the room. I experienced abuse when I was growing up and it sharpened my accuracy for identifying manipulative individuals, in particular those afflicted with personality disorders.

    I no longer choose to help those that do not want to change-that is sometime’s the hardest to resist. I really do want to help and heal others and seek justice for those that are hurt but I know better than to drain myself dry in that way. I am aware that I have had super nova moments and am weary of my temper since I can pierce someone’s soul with my words, I save this only for when I know the person is abusive; even then I will typically regret my behavior so grey rock is used in lieu of a super nova event if I can help it. Maybe I’m a magnet empath and just have traits of some of the others.

    I’ll be looking forward to your explanation of the contagion empath.

  19. I am most definitely a magnet super empath. I knew I was a super empath but I realize my magnetism after your last post on the subject, Mr. Tudor. It was a coincidence that you posted that article the same day the man that was sitting beside me on the train told me his whole life and actually cried because of the horrible day he had at work before giving me his number. I was so scared because of the narcisistic signals I was detecting. I rushed to search in this site if you had written something that could guide me, and luckily you had! I also understood why people always tell me about their problems, even in early stages of the relationship or when I do not know them at all. Thanks for sharing the knowledge, Mr. Tudor!

      1. On the contrary. He showed all the red flags. I can’t assure the man was a narcissist but I’m still recovering from the narc in my life and I felt scared by the idea of being such a magnet for these kind of people. In 15 minutes he told me how horrible his day had been, about his insensitive ex wife and cried. He also said he hadn’t cry in 10 years. The whole story made me nervous and even thought I wasn’t impolite, I became very suspicious.

  20. Lori I always love your answers. I see myself a lot through them and younwrite your thoughts very concisely.
    I agree with you and I have been on that very painful path to think that if I can control him than I can control me – and do everything to have so what I want.
    I wrote it many times here , after acknowledging that you are with a Narc, if you don’t Goso , you will not win.
    A narc always win the war, although he can concede a few battles – unless you decide not to fight and leave.
    I have spent endless night decorticating his mind –
    Planning my next move- using flying monkeys and lieutenants etc
    I only aged through it and lost many many battles that have left me depleted and angry – especially that he made me believe I would win the battles but overturned strategy last minute and échec et mat.
    Thank you was a good reminder of my progress to read you.

    1. Oh thank you. I appreciate that! I realize that a lot of the things I say may be quite unpopular especially with those new to this. I also realize that my comment are through a codependent filter and perspective which doesn’t apply to everyone. I would say though if you have those feelings of wanting to manipulate to control him or get him to behave you may have some codependent issues.

      This whole Super Empath thing to me is comical. For me, I can exhibit element of all these schools and cadres but my primary mo is Codependent but as I have always said it is completely dependent on the situation whether it be a professional, familial or romantic relationship the dynamic can look different with me. I could look like a Doormat in one situation or a Magnet Super Empath in another. It really depends on the level of control I feel in the dynamic. The one thing that however doesng waiver or change is the Magnet piece

      Having been thru this a couple times and having been in therapy where I received my diagnosis and reading here, I feel I have grown quite a bit. Am I cured or healed ? No, I am not, but what I am is aware and awareness is key. Im glad that someone appreciates my comments as I do realize that sometimes they come across as harsh. I would like to say that I don’t mean for them to come across that way but if I’m honest sometimes I do.

      Also if I’m honest, some of the crap I read on here from alleged empaths toward HG from some moral high ground drives me nuts lol

      1. Lori,

        “I do realize that sometimes they come across as harsh. I would like to say that I don’t mean for them to come across that way but if I’m honest sometimes I do.”

        Yes we got that.

        “Also if I’m honest, some of the crap I read on here from alleged empaths toward HG from some moral high ground drives”

        I don’t know how many times I’ve read you saying “the crap I read here”

        Speaking of “from some moral high groumd”..

        You continuously accuse commenters in general of such behaviour, leaving people wondering who you it is you are accusing. Show some guts the next time and mention someones name first, so we know who your accusations are adressed to.

      2. Lori, I think if you look at it from the prospective that this is HGs way of teaching us the different ways that a narcissist looks at an empath. This is his site and he has created these 4 schools of empaths. These are not clinical terms. In fact I don’t think most psychiatrist even recognize empaths as a thing. 

        Alot of us agree that a person that keeps going back to an abusive relationship has co dependant traits but thats not what this poll is about. It’s about what we have learned from what HG has taught us. If you look at it this way maybe you will be able to relate to other readers comments especially those in the SE category which seems to be the category that offends you. 

        1. My lexicon has been devised to avoid esoteric scientific terms and clumsy terminology. I am a hugely effective communicator and whilst I have no formal psychological qualifications I know myself, my kind and your kind inside out and therefore I bring this expertise to the fore but do so in a way which people can relate to and understand. Thus the schools are part of that process. We provide labels and definitions for clarity and understanding but do remember we are relating this to humans and human behaviour which is vastly complex so sometimes it won’t fit neatly in a particular ‘box’ but that is not something one should get perturbed about and hung up on, but instead focussing on the closest approximation but moreover what does that MEAN and use that to help yourselves.

          1. No, just recognise you are not alone in that regard and it is a fact. Then proceed accordingly.

          2. It is a fact that you are brilliant or that I am envious? It’s not normal for me to feel envious of what others have that I don’t. I think I’m suffering from a feeling of inferiority that I am putting upon myself.

          3. Both. However your view of yourself is your issue MB and you have many endearing qualities, cultivate a little Inner Narc and Go Proud!

          4. MB, I feel differently. I am tenacious – not brilliant – but to me brilliance (and the right sort of humour) are the pot of gold at rainbow’s end. My goal in life is to not be bored and it makes me ecstatic to find intelligence and humour in the same person. Unfortunately, it got me attached to MRN (sapiosexual that I am) but that won’t stop me from continuing to look for it. I do not know HG yet here I am, in great part because of the brilliance and wit that he chooses to share with us for whatever reason. I feel very lucky.

          5. SMH, The other day when I posted this, I was struggling to appreciate myself. I was astounded by the way HG “got” me and addressed what I was feeling. He has a gift and it is beautiful that he uses it for good here.

            My goal in life is to not be bored too! Life needs to be fun as much as possible. Intelligence and humor IS difficult to find! They can have one or the other, but most of the time it’s NEITHER! I feel very fortunate as well to have found HG and his work. I find narcsite quite rewarding.

          6. Mercy, you and HG should indulge in some super attractive, steamy leg love…you both are Supers in my opinion (sorry to objectify your bodies!).

          7. Ahh, the torture!
            Could you not have left that one in the vault where it belongs??

          8. HG
            Re: Shelves being full.
            Ah. Well everyone should carry insurance shouldn’t they? I was concerned that you had succumbed to that which you refer to as the traitorous bitch Hope.

          9. HG
            I was teasing about hope as I know that to be the case, but it raised a serious question:

            If you do not refer to this new relationship in the sense of ‘hoping’ it works out, what term would you use? Confidence? Expectation? Belief? Just curious the terminology you would apply.

          10. NA, he is always faithful during the Golden Period. Pay attention in the back! The shelves are to capacity. The minions are currently at The Home Depot buying supplies to build more. HG, hopefully you instructed them to buy some extra special materials for the construction of the display table for Kim’s statue!

          11. MB
            Yes, I know thats usually the case but wondered if this new dynamic had spurred such optimism that the shelf situation may have been altered in some way. We are after all not privy to what alterations to his behaviours have been discussed with the good doctors or adopted by HG to effect success this time.

          12. He’s used “spoken for” and “taken” within a week. I think he might have caught a fever in that cold temperature.

          13. Thank you HG! Total misconception that drives me crazy. No offense SP. I can’t tell you how many times I’ve heard my MIL say, “You’ll catch your death of pneumonia if you go out with wet hair!” I think this one might be worse than “hot water heater”!

          14. Agh! I know… although cold weather itself is not a catalyst for catching a fever, (the wet hair argument with my mom still continues nowadays) it is true that the flu virus peaks in the winter and the cold rather than in other seasons, and therefore, the misconception. I was using that common misperception for a little joke on HG becoming delirious, but being too scientific ruins the fun 🤓 You guys remind me of Sheldon Cooper.

          15. You are correct the flu virus peaks in Winter. That is because people tend to stay indoors more and therefore it increases the opportunity for transmission of the virus. Further, people’s immune systems are less effective during winter. Thus, cold weather does not cause a fever but the cold weather has an indirect impact on the greater incidence of flu and the attendant fever. There we are. Next patient, ah Mr Carruthers, now, how’s that rash….

          16. HG, is there any topic that you cannot have an intelligent conversation about? Please tell me there is!

          17. I was gonna let it go, but since you are so arrogant I have to tell you: “That interview has been cherrypicked along with interviews from other people involved in the ‘world of narcissism and the broadcast ‘I Feel You – Narcs and Narcissism’ is the result.” It’s “I Feel for You-Narcs and Narcissism.” Depeche Mode slip of the tongue.

          18. Not arrogant, I am what I do. Thanks for pointing that out, I have corrected it (I have been listening to the mighty DM today so I have clearly been manipulated into the error – never my fault you see.)

          19. SP, “you guys remind me of Sheldon Cooper”. I shall consider that a compliment! Thank you for that. I needed it after my meltdown yesterday regarding my inferior intelligence! (Oh, and also for including me in a group with HG. Re “you guys”)

          20. NA, it is unfortunately on the ‘oll: What are you?’ thread and it was from last evening and early this morning. (Our time) HG was very supportive and objective. He realized that although I am normally witty and humorous, I was serious about this. He totally “got” it. You will see, I plan to reply to him, but I want to give it my undivided attention and unfortunately my job is getting in the way today.

          21. E&L, I cut sex off with my narc months before I stopped talking to him and I haven’t considered another partner since. I can’t even play with my toys for fear he will creep into my thoughts. Please, objectify away. I need some action!

          22. HG, I couldn’t agree more. You have the gift of communication and if it wasn’t for that gift many of us would be lost in scientific terms. Your lables and terms give us an avenue to organize our thoughts and apply what is relevant to our individual situation. I respect your gift and knowledge of your kind and mine. You have given me freedom not only in the relationship with the narcissist but in many aspect of my life. Thank you.

          23. HG one last thing, if they put you up against a psychologist on this subject my money would be on you every time. It takes one (an ultra) to know one.

          24. I agree. Interestingly, the interview I did for BBC Radio 4 has ( as I anticipated) been cherry picked and used in a programme with contributions from others who work in the field with regard to narcissism (psychologists, doctors etc) so you get viewpoints from six of us. Several readers have listened to it and pointed out that I am the only one who actually fully and directly answers the questions. Somewhat ironic don’t you think? Cue Alannis and her misunderstanding of irony!

          25. It’s like 10,000 spoons and all you need is a knife.

            Your no nonsense teachings and direct answers are part of your success. I’ve started using direct answers (mirroring you). It’s very effective and people tend to listen. Too much fluff and they get distracted.

          26. Where can we find the interview HG?

            Thanks for making me think of a black fly in my Chardonnay too btw! Now that’s stuck in my brain. Like there wasn’t enough going on in there already tonight with my whole jealously meltdown. I thought it might help to try and think of things that I am better at than the object of my envy since your advice was to “proceed accordingly”. I came up with zip so I’m guessing that’s not how I should have proceeded.

            I’m over it for now thank goodness. I looked inward to see where that feeling was coming from and then just laughed at myself and let it go. (It will be back though. That’s what I found out when I looked.)

          27. HG
            I appreciate your schools, cadres, and terminology. It helped me in the beginning to break down the avalanche of information for both narcissists and empaths into manageable bites in a way that no other source allowed me to make sense of previously. It helps me still in being able to loosely identify where someone might be on the spectrum and allows for better planning in how to deal with them, and I believe, better communication (why different groups may react so differently to a certain article/discussion for instance). I have never thought of people in boxes because of it. Intelligence allows for it to be used as a guide and recognize it as such, and not an attempt to hard label.

      3. I find myself in agreement with 2SF on this one. Go me.

        But I also find, I must exposit.

        HG brought and continues to bring clarity to a very confused area; the empathic arena. When I see fellow empaths getting confused about where they fall, I dont automatically assume that the system HG has clearly deliniated is flawed.

        Nor do I assume I am flawed. I assume there is something I havnt yet understood. Just that. Fact is and if what im thinking is true, true empaths are rare. So whilst its likely we have been exposed to a few, we just dont have that breadth of knowledge and experience.

      4. Wtf? Did I accuse of YOU anything ? If you feel “accused” then perhaps I’ve struck a nerve;)

        Believe me, I’m not lacking in guts. If youd like me to analyze you send a check or paypal perhaps maybe I’ll do it one time free of charge. How’s that for some compassion? Dang I’m nice

        You’re welcome

      5. Guts? Lol. No I have been accused of having balls of steel on certain ocassions: In fact it just happened recently. As I said in previous post that I’m not sure I hit send on, Would you like me to diagnose you? Heck I’ll even do it for free lol

        Funny stuff

      6. That’s s wasn’t addressed to you Nun ya biz

        Smh – snippy ? Nah not atl all I do not hide that I can be a bitch that’s why I have said repeatedly the codependent doesn’t always present as the doormat

      7. MB: I recognize HG’s brilliance but I feel no envy with regards to that fact because I can hold my own.

        Do I have as many readers/admirers as HG? No, and perhaps that is where some envy could stem but what HG does and what I do are in no way in competition with one another, so I am fully thankful for his mind.

        I admit to being an envious person but I am not in this case because I recognize that his brilliance is 1) fully deserved and worthy of recognition and 2) takes nothing away from me. In fact it is an asset, as I have learned so much from HG.

        1. Bibi, the envy day was bad! Since day one, I have admired HGs vocabulary and command of the English language and told him so many times. I love his brain. The comment that struck me that day was so well articulated with every word in the correct place and succinctly communicated. That is like a breathtaking work of art to me. It hit me in the gut that I don’t have nor will I ever have the ability to do such. I belittled myself and my shame was activated and I saw only stupidity. It had nothing to do with HG at all. When I was younger, I thought I could do anything, learn anything, be anything. I am at a point in my life now where I am realizing that I am what I am. I need to make peace with that and be thankful for all that I HAVE achieved which is considerable. I admire HGs brilliance, and of course it takes nothing away from me. That is silly thinking back on it. He knew what it was that day and I will forever be in awe of the way he responded. He was kind and understanding. After all, he knows a thing or two about envy. His cognitive empathy was displayed that day in living color and in that particular case was exactly what I needed and was better than real empathy.

  21. @ Joanne mine too was informal – we were having a session and I asked him out of curiosity how he saw me of course this was to flatter my ego thinking that he had been analyzing me … 🙂 and later on went reading on it – got some empathy fuel from reading all the qualities of an empathy and my ego was happy! 😜

    1. Omj
      Yes, I totally get that 😉 I would enjoy being the one who is analyzed versus myself always being the analyser… 🙂

  22. DEMB of standard empath variety , mostly Magnet but some carrier & saviour traits. Not sure about Contagion, I can feel other people’s moods and only recently did I realize it wasn’t MY mood changing but THEIR mood. Sometimes when the energy changes in a room to negative it almost knocks the wind out of me – being in a crowded place like Walmart is almost unbearable- lol (but us island folk are like that- we are used to acres of nature between properties )-but even when I lived in the big city I’d get panic attacks in the bank lineup and never knew why LOL
    – is that contagion or pretty standard empath stuff?
    Also cheated on my LMR somatic on my way out of the last go-round (cheated w my MMR elite DEMB DLS situation lol)
    That was the first time in my life I’ve cheated outright. Didn’t feel the least bit bad bc I saw it as a preemptive strike (as I knew he’d fuck me over sooner or later -but then I just ditched b4 he could)
    So I guess I have the DE infidelity streak also. Most disturbing was not feeling guilty. Very new to me.

    I’m still in my DEMB DLS gig going w my MMR Elite – 5 years now. I love it for what it’s good for . Plus, I now recognize when he’s lying , when he has another sidechick on the line, and I understand narc speak – so thanks HG for that – it really cleared my head & made life so much simpler. Kinda took some of the fun out of it but meh.
    So I obv have strong narc traits too.

    I’d love more info on Contagion , HG
    I can’t find it anymore on YouTube, can you link me up?

      1. This is of interest to me. One of the key elements of Codependency is being overly focusexon the needs of others. I am unbelievably adept at anticipating people’s feelings, needs, moods etc. I wouldn’t say I feel their feelings all the time sometimes I do but what I would say is I am aware of what their feelings and moods are and adjust my behavior accordingly. I am able to do this with surprisingky little information sometimes all that is needed is body language, a facial expression or a single comment. I have instinctively done this as long as I can remember. Does that make me contagion? The reason I ask this is because I identify most with Magnet and every Narc I’ve known has commented on my ability to draw people to me and the word most used to describe me “ bubbly “

        1. Lori

          No it doesn’t make you a Contagion. I feel people long before I come into contact with them, the visual and audio cues I get only renforces what I already know and feel.

      2. Contagion

        Thanks for the information. While I can say I have experienced that a few times. I wouldn’t say I experience it regularly. I have to be able to see or hear the person.

      3. True contagion requires NO cues. It can be aptly demonstrated by using blindfolds or closing ones eyes.

        In fact, I’d recommend that all empaths who posses contagion test it this way.

        Protip: have sex in the dark. Ns will hate that of course for reasons so try it with one that knows you…

        1. Renarde

          Well I’m no Contagion, just curious – what is it the possible Contagion is looking for/testing with the blindfold on? N’s do predominantly like the lights on I’ve found, and it makes sense because all that visual fuel would go to waste.

          1. And we need to see where the exit is to make a swift getaway afterwards once fuelled.

          2. I think you will find you are chained to the bed, NA along with the dogs – enjoy the teeth brushing!

          3. Well they better have some bloody energy if we’re together in the dark and one of us has a blind fold on!

      4. I don’t know Renarde, but I can say for 100% certain I experience some physical synesthesias. It happens all the time and it is completely unanticipated by me.
        Interestingly it happened to me today. It is why I put contagion as a possibility, amongst other reasons.
        Additionally I have remotely sensed things. No doubt to me, it is fact.
        I just don’t have any idea how much this affects other people or how often as a basis for comparison. I also have seen others on here describe other synesthesias that I do not experience.

        And it absolutely fascinates me because I know this is happening and now I understand why N’s don’t see or feel it.

      5. @nunya biz Hope you get to see this.

        I don’t know Renarde, but I can say for 100% certain I experience some physical synesthesias. It happens all the time and it is completely unanticipated by me.

        Ahh right! You are the poster who has synesthesia? Fascinating! And you link with contagion itself? Equally fascinating notion.

        Additionally I have remotely sensed things. No doubt to me, it is fact.

        Yes, I can do this too but it is very rare for me.

        And it absolutely fascinates me because I know this is happening and now I understand why N’s don’t see or feel it.

        I’m not sure I follow on this. I personally think some Ns can indeed sense contagion. I think it exists in all of us, sometimes presenting more strongly than others. However, having thought about this for a few days now, I personally think that whilst it is lumped under the ’empathy umbrella’, I’m not sure if it is empathy at all.

        @HG

        I know a few times you have written about the Empath schools ‘presenting’ as different colours and shades of fire. Can you also sense contagion?

        1. I have never met one in my private life, so I do not know. I would recognise the empath, as for the contagion element, I suspect not.

          1. Yes you would HG, be able to notice a Contagion. I believe this due to your increased awareness. As for the rest of your breathers I could stand right in front of them and they would never see me for what I actually am unless I exposed myself. They would know I was an Empath because just as the other schools I still have similar behaviors and that is what would be picked up on.

      6. Renarde, not me this is my first mention, though I’ve alluded to contagion and spiritual overwhelm, etc…
        I know I have some synesthesias but I remember sweetest perfection I think talking about colors, etc… which sounds very cool.
        I consider it contagion related based on some commentors insights and hg’s description. I appreciate his feedback about recognizing, I was curious.

        I have said and I think windstorm also I can’t watch anything outside of light comedy and action type stuff on tv (or play many games) because the sensations are too much. I am sarcastic and dirty minded etc (like many on here) so it’s not prudishness at all, it just feels too much. I started a couple of the popular shows and couldn’t handle mostly, so I just stick with romcom, parody, etc… but I also have an intense fear of heights so sometimes I think some of it is related to perception style and suggestibility, but I’d consider it all related anyway. If I can feel from another person’s inside something strong I will cry. As an example, my husband is the opposite end of the spectrum and feels very little. I have built some protection around my life that can be inhibiting and HG’s stuff helps me navigate and fine tune better.

        I have had moments of spiritual access that are factual and undeniable to me but I believe in sharing rather than negating experiences because stagnating trumping growth is what I consider the price of narcissism (stone versus water).The devalue of “the other” prevents building. It is all an interesting paradox. I like what you say because I agree that everyone has access, imo it is often a matter of sorting and contemplating one’s own perceptions and weighting validity against conscious filters….
        and I would include narcissists,
        but…

        my view is that HG’s opinion that narcissists cannot change is functionally correct and therefore very valuable. However if there is a higher plane (I think so) then my conclusion would include spiritual caveats for being enlightened, struck by god, altered by a life altering, ego demolishing event, awakening internal ernergies, or however one perceives infinite possibility. That is a giant leap past what can be accomplished in prosocial behaviour adaptations. I think transitions can be painful.
        But when I consider for myself contagion as a category I don’t see it as rigid, more just considering HGs descriptors and looking at “fit”, self exploration, understanding and how he would see a person, so I really was wondering his perception of that.
        I am interested in your considering if it is empathy, I wondered the same. My opinion is that it is pure empathy but I would easily consider another view.

        1. Nunya biz, yes I have chromatic synesthesia. I have read your self-description and felt totally identified with all of those features, very interesting! I’d like to know what kind of synesthesias you experience, if you don’t mind sharing. I’m totally jet lagged, my synesthesia also gets stronger under unusual conditions so I can expect to see all kinds of sounds tonight.

      7. I’m disappointed, I have posted my reply to this to the wrong place on the page, I won’t copy it, it’s annoyingly long, apologies.

  23. I think I am a pretty standard empath, leaning towards the savior variety. Also in the co-dependent bucket I think. I would like to think I am a super empath but in reading about that they seem slightly rare.
    S

  24. Right molyb? My narc chased the shit out of me knowing full well I’m married. Then when he had me in his grasp he was like” you can’t be my ipps, your a cheater”!!!!!!

  25. I am not sure what kind of Empath I am. Nor do I think I want to know. It would be too upsetting because I do not want to be that person anymore.
    I have never been much into forgiveness yet I have been intensely abused by Narcissists.
    From now on I am going to be utterly ruthless with them.
    I will show them no mercy, compassion or pity.

    1. u let them win if you stop being you.
      Learn to detect them and run. But give others your positive energy. the world needs you <3

  26. Ahah !!! HG you know my English sounds funny .
    I meant when I spend too much time with my Narc I adopt superempath behaviours on supernova mode- very temporarily- although I am not a superempath.

    Because when I spend too much time with my Greater Elite my narcissistic side comes out – which is more of the cadre of the super empaths than the magnet empaths.

    Hope this one makes more sense 🙂

    1. There is nothing wrong with your English.

      That behaviour accords more with The Cliff and you will relate to that when that article is published.

  27. Hmm….difficult. I’ve no idea if I am right.
    I put Super/Contagion and Savior., so three.
    But I’d be willing to bet I’d classify as Dirty, so likely that one also. Because if I have what I deem as a good reason I will do so, BUT I really don’t prefer it and don’t have a good reason. I did cheat once, so I’m guessing that counts. But also I have zero interest in married men who would cheat. I can’t say I’m a saint about it though, just so happens I don’t gravitate to the person generally, mostly because their interest is nothing to do with mine. And if I’ve really met a woman I can’t do that either.

    Super cuz I can get very hard-line in some ways and I definitely intentionally scare off men when I think they are being selfish/manipulative, etc…And I can be aware of what I am doing. Contagion because of the balance thing, the negativity in the world, the need to remove it from my life. Also some massive spiritual overwhelms that have permeated my entire being with things I can only describe as visions. That is only sporadic and I have no control over it. Hell, maybe it’s just I’m nuts, but whatever. Savior because I have a strong belief in improving things for everyone and I will also actively try to balance energy in groups to advance best interest. I am good at it and I don’t need recognition although sometime appreciation and encouragement re-energizes me so I appreciate it very greatly. Blatant disregard pisses me off and I forgive lying in self-defense, fear or privacy, but when it’s done to manipulate more actively I get upset. Like taking a lie and then building upon it into a story that serves another purpose.

    I decided, well, I have some magnet qualities, but my impression is that a magnet would draw people in a more public way and be more comfortable with continuous attention. I definitely attract people to talk to me, sit near me, etc… I am no public speaker. I prefer to write as communication, for me it is far superior to even just talking, but I really enjoy in person empathic conversation with someone I resonate with so much. I am more comfortable in intimate settings in small groups or one on one and crowds, large groups in short bursts. I love to get to know people personally.
    I definitely have many CoD and Carrier qualities, but not solid enough for me to identify myself as strictly.
    Interesting, I identified a friend as a Carrier CoD I think.

  28. Dear Mr Tudor,
    I’m definitely a magnet – people gravitate to me, however I can relate to various snippets in a few of your other categories
    I am told I have this aura about me and my eyes seem to captivate, apparently
    I always thought it was just my bubbliness

    Your poll of defining and categorising oneself is very thought provoking and essential
    Good one Mr Tudor
    Luv Bubbles xx 😘

      1. Dear DoForLuv,
        Sorry sweet cheeks …. was your comment intended for me
        I would not intentionally ignore comments
        Luv Bubbles xx 😘

  29. Highest percentage Supwr Empath SURPRISE!!! Um not.

    So we are supposed to believe a bunch of Super Empaths converged on a Narcisstic abuse page ? lol um yeah no.

    This will be unpopular with many of you, but many of you are just in complete denial. You are not being honest with yourselves about who you really are but your convincing yourselves that you are who you want to be which is going to do nothing for but likely get you entangled again.

    There are probably some of you that are but my guess is large portion of you are not. You are likely selecting certain events that might fit this scenario and not looking at yourself in the broader sense.

    I’m sue I’ll get crap for this m, but I bet I’m right. There is tons of material out there written by professionals about the dance between the Narcissist and the Codependent not the Narcissist and the Super Empath.

    1. I disagree. I think it does make sense that a ton of super empaths would revolve around this site because it is more analytical and educational than other places and provides deeper knowledge. The super empath is smart. A super empath takes on also some narc traits to attack the narc. I think to do that you do need to read and educate yourself.

      I have not seen the definition of the “super empath” in any other site so it is missing from the literature and hence why you don’t read about it.

      Why is it so hard to believe that smart people are here. probably mny others just don’t search online. It does requiere some intelligence to find relevant material. I am blown away always by how little the general populations knows about narcs.

      Yes. I think I am smart and awesome. So, what?

      1. Makes sense to me, AS. This is the smartest and most awesome site (because HG created it) so of course it is going to attract that smartest and most awesome people, who are SEs. I think co-dependents want to drag the rest of us down!

      2. Still new around here but I would have to agree that there is a major difference among the attitude and contributions of the commenters on this blog vs the other online forums I’ve been a part of. “Wallowing holes” as HG has called them. I’ve read stories of women (and men) circling around, repeating patterns, refusing to educate themselves on WHAT they’re experiencing, etc. The comments I read on here feel like they’re written by strong, intelligent people who have a firm grasp on their situations and/or making positive strides toward escape/healing/dealing.

        At the risk of offending anyone, there is a certain level of depth/sophistication to HGs writing that is going to appeal to a more intellectual reader. I’ve referred many people to this site and some came back having said it was not for them.

        If this poll were to be conducted on some other online forums — then yes, I would be surprised to see a large number of Super Empath votes. But here, I am not.

        1. Thank you Joanne. Never apologise for depth, sophistication or intelligence. This place conveys the material in a variety of ways. I recognise some people struggle because of what I am and unfortunately do not persevere but those who do, break through their innate distaste for what I am and focus on the whole point of this place – it is the single best and most effective place to learn, to understand and to have a voice.

          1. Agree wholeheartedly. Thank you HG, for your work which led me to dry land, and for providing this space that helps keep me there 🤗

      3. what? See this is what I’m talking about right here. Who said all these other schools aren’t smart ? And yes that is what your comment suggest. And and confident strong personality doesn’t always translate to intelligence.

        Being a Super Empath doesn’t necessarily mean anyone is smart anymore than any other school. To suggest that in my opinion is preposterous

        Sorry from a statistical perspective highly unlikely. You are certainly entitled to your opinion and If it gives you comfort go for it but logically and statistically speaking it unlikely.

        I’m well educated though you would never know by my text.lol I have a strong personality and in certain aspects of my life extremely confident I’m Codependent diagnosed by both a psychiatrist and therapist that specialize in personality disorders

        1. “From a statistical perspective highly unlikely”

          I’m glad you brought that up in the course of this specific discussion, Lori.

      4. You don’t read about the Super Empath because the mental health community does not use the terms nor is it a diagnosis. The only one really recognized by them is Codependency which continues to inch closer to be included in the DSM with the other cluster B s it hasn’t been included because it doesn’t harm others nearly to the extent that the others do.

        There are many decent places and forums however they don’t have the Narcs perspective. They have the victims perspective and it’s entirely different as is a mental health professional’s is. With that said, it doesn’t mean they are wrong, they aren’t but they see it from more of a clinical perspective. HG s work is from a more practical perspective and gives you more into on how this dynamic plays out in everyday life

      5. I totally agree. I was very much able to wound my Narc almost at will. I wasn’t sure how or why I was able to until I listened to the audio on Empath Supernovas. Then as I educated myself more on the subject of Narcissism I found I was able to do it deliberately. Whilst I know that the chance of being hoovered is always there, I think I did enough damage this time to keep myself on the black list for s long while
        Of all the sources I’ve accessed in my research on the subject, HG’s work has been, by far, the most detailed, informative and the easiest to understand, despite the pieces that fill me with guy wrenching fear! !

      6. Joanne

        I joined a couple of ‘wallowing holes’ months ago to see what went on & I couldn’t agree more in the refusal of some to get educated & help themselves. The same stuff repeatedly rehashed. I did help one lady get the whole emotional/logical thinking & that was rewarding. (With links to HG’s articles on it) I know people are at different growth rates & I’m not condemning that, but so many seem to be ‘fueling’ from the reactions to their repeated ‘poor me’ scenarios.
        I would also post links to HG’s articles & they were repeatedly removed. Frequently his name gets through & you just hope the ones that really want the education catch it & follow it up.

        HG, sorry if this has been asked before but when we choose on the poll, can you see who chose what?

        1. Absolutely RH and those who are wallowing may well be Mid Range Narcissists (not always but they are there) and those who remove the links often do so because they are envious of my work and are likely to be narcissists, other people recommend my work wholeheatedly, some do so with a caveat of warning which I understand why they do that. Thank you for promoting my work.

          No you cannot link your vote to a name in the polls, I and everybody else only sees the numbers per category, it is anonymous.

      7. HG

        I will always give credit to your work. I am aware I have a couple of significantly differing beliefs to you but that does not take away from the role you have played in getting me to where I am. (& the assistance you give others) For that, as stated previously, I will always be grateful.

        I saw in one of your posts a little while ago you are headed for the heat in March. If it happens to be Northern Queensland, watch out for the irukandji. They are in plague proportions this year… 😉

        1. You are welcome and it is that constructive and sensible approach you adopt to my work which I aim to cultivate here. You do not have to like me, but you will learn from me.

          Thanks for the warning!

      8. These “wallowing forums” are a mixed bag. While they can be quite comforting, they can keep you stuck. At some point, you have start examining yourself. What you can do to help yourself. Looking to understand what has happened to you is fine, but looking for information on how to manipulate the narc so you can stay isn’t and I would say the vast majority that land on these pages are looking for just that including myself .

        You can tell when people are turning the corner because they ask less questions about what the narc might or might not do and start focusing about what they themselves are going to do or just discuss Narcissism in general more. With all that said, those forums can be very comforting and helpful or they can be cesspools of people unwilling to help themselves or other Narcs.

      9. Oh my gosh HG this woman just has you smitten. I mean you can see in your comments that you are just giddy!

        I hope this works out for you, truly. I find you quite likeable which also brings me to the Empath = good Narc = bad dynamic that I often see here. I do not have that view. I find Narcs serve many purposes in our society and are often engaging and entertaining. They just can’t handle any emotional closeness and intimacy. As long as you aren’t in a close relationship with them, I find that they serve many purposes in our society.

        HG, this has also brought me to something else I have observed since being here and that’s that the Empath engages in a significant amount of black and white thinking as in Empath=Good Narc=Bad which simply isn’t true. Would you agree with that ?

        1. Thank you for your kind wishes.

          I do not agree with the comment with regard to black and white thinking. Empathic people have object constancy so they will say “He (the narc) can be really hurtful when he ignores me, but when he is being nice, he is the most wonderful man I have met.’ They look at all behaviours and evaluate them. Others also recognise that my kind do achieve great things because of our traits. There are some who do make the basic distinction you refer to Lori and that tends to be those who are still very raw and thus their ET is high.

      10. Ok I see that clears up what I’m seeing then. Now that I think about it, I do see that mostly from people who are still pretty raw.

        Now to change the subject for a moment. If this relationship works out, do you plan to tell her about all of this ? Or have you even thought that far ahead? Do you ever see a time in the future when you might consider revealing your identity and lastly, do you feel you would be where you are now without therapy ?

        I have to say it does bring a smile to my face to see Mr. Narcissist so smitten! Fun to observe light and not darkness in a Narc

          1. “I have my plan. Stick around and watch it unfold.”
            HG, is this a battle you feel has already been won before it is fought or is this even considered a “battle” from your perspective?

          2. Your plan. The one we are to be watching unfold with The Shieldmaiden. Do you consider it a battle to be fought and won?

      11. Ok But I sure hope it’s a good one because I’m trying to think of a plan in which you could reveal who you are and it wouldn’t effect the relationship, but I can’t see one but I’m gonna trust that as smart as you are there is one that I don’t see yet. I hope you consult with the good doctors on this.

        It would be nice to know what you look like out of curiosity. Lol

      12. HG

        I referenced the irakundji as they seem familiar…
        The are an interesting & deadly creature while appearing innocuous. They are very hard to spot in the water as they are difficult to see. They hunt their unsuspecting prey & on finding a victim, they then fire stingers into them releasing venom without actually having to attach to them with their tentacles. The venom causes horrible pain, physiological side affects & the psychological phenomena of a seeming impending doom. Occasionally they have been fatal.

        Some people swim in the waters where they live, ignorant of their existence & come away unscathed. Others ignore the warnings & swim there anyway & frequently suffer the consequences. Others wear stinger suits to minimise the risk as they do not wish to miss out on the enjoyment of the ocean. Others avoid the water completely in a decision to avoid the risk.

          1. HG, there’s another topic! Now you can have intelligent conversations about the irakundji. You’ll be talking all about them at dinner.

      13. From HG

        Absolutely RH and those who are wallowing may well be Mid Range Narcissists (not always but they are there) and those who remove the links often do so because they are envious of my work and are likely to be narcissists

        That is intresting re: Middles.

        And as you know, I’ve had my suspicions for a long time about a certain group on a certain social media platform. HG is actually banned from this group but yet members quite happily post his articles.

        The wallowing, yeah, I was in a group a few years ago on FB which people would leave. Very calmly saying that now they needed to move on. As did I. But what happened? I really wasn’t any closer to understanding why it was happening. Then I went on to discover why but only after tangling with a few more.

    2. Miss Lori I think we are the highest percentage simply because we are the easiest to spot for the narcissist. Therefore we are caught in higher numbers.

    3. so of course it is going to attract that smartest and most awesome people, who are SEs. I think co-dependents want to drag the rest of us down

      SMH. I quite agree. The Swines! I cover their silly arses all the time.

      They should STOP watching Watership Down immediately. The Cadburys Caramel never helps and the less said about the Prosecco the better.

  30. Also I view myself as a Super Empath. Definitely a Magnet up to this point in my life as I have just escaped my 3rd Narcissist (the worst by far). But until stumbling upon your works , I had no idea that there was a such thing as a Narcissist . I can also relate to the Gyeser Cadre.
    I am currently working on myself doing what is necessary to de magnitize myself as I don’t think I’d survive another entanglement

  31. Your writings are both informative and empowering. Thank you.
    However I do wish to ask you something that I’d rather not do here but in a private medium .I don’t want a consultation, I’m just very curious about something. Would you agree to such an exchange? If so how might I reach you privately?

    1. You may ask by email but if it is long or requires a detailed response on my part I will direct you to the consultations – that is what they are there for.

      1. HG, I’m curious if you have a favorite type of consult. Co-parenting, Court preparation, ACON, Narc Detector, ET management, etc.

        1. I find rewards in

          1. The analysis of challenging scenarios which cover all manner of different matters;
          2. The sudden enlightenment achieved by the client;
          3. The gratitude given by the client.

          1. Aww! You said rewards and not fuel! Think we’re getting to him girls!! 🤪

          2. You are excellent at analysis and very intuitive at reading between the lines for what is there but not said. I have been impressed every consultation. Expectations exceeded, Sir.

          3. “2. The sudden enlightenment achieved by the client…”

            Sooo, you like it when we ‘get it’ and we like ‘getting it’…

            Match made in heaven.

  32. I have no idea what cadre I am – I put Magnet but then reading about Magnets again I do not think that is me. I am also not a Geyser or a Savior. Maybe I am a Carrier. Maybe I am a Super Empath because I did have a huge Super Nova explosion and I do have strong narc traits. I DO know now that I am a Dirty Empath Marriage Breaker!! And I am PROUD of it – kidding – really I couldn’t care less either way about narc’s personal entanglements other than how they affect me. I wouldn’t do it again (I didn’t plan to do it in the first place) but only because it puts me in a box and I don’t want to be in a box. Does that make me a narc? There was no option to choose narc!!

          1. It’s my mantra, MB. No one puts baby in a corner! It was an epic struggle to disentangle myself from MRN because it was the tightest, darkest corner I have ever been in, but I finally did it.

    1. Look closer. You are predominantly one of them. I gurantee it.

      Just because you have a Super Nova would not necessarily classify you as SE. I have had several in fact I just had a big one not with the narc I discuss here but another one. I mean a big one which ended up in me completely leaving the dynamic as in a light switch just flipped off and said I’m done. No discussion nothing. Complete element of surprise

      I’m still Codependent

      1. That is not necessarily a Supernova – I will be shedding more light on this distinction in the article, The Cliff.

      2. I think I’d need a consultation to figure out what I am but I will wait for The Cliff and see if that helps.

      3. All I can say is the look on this Narcs face. The fury all of it priceless but when I was done. I was going to ask you about what label this behavior would fall under? I don’t do that sort of thing often but I have done it before and each time the Narc was furious

        I cut them off out of the blue or what they thought was out of the blue and never returned

      4. HG

        I am also curious about something else. Do you find the mental health field incorrect about Narcissism? The reason I ask is I see people on here rejecting the mental healthy community’s take on this in favor of yours

        To me, I find both correct. They are merely just different perspectives. I also see that while you have a great deal of knowledge about how this plays out in day to day life and relationships, you are under the care of professionals and have mentioned that together with your awareness and some skills and or benefits you’ve gotten in therapy that you may now be capable of a new dynamic so that would suggest to me that the “Good Doctors” are quite good. Am I incorrect ? And If so expand on why I’m incorrect ?

        Thank you

        1. They are different perspectives yes, but the ‘professional’ field does not know it to the extent it should. in fairness, the field of psychology is so massive, NPD, serious as it is, is just part of a very wide field so professionals are not going to know about it to the degree they should and even those who focus on it do not know as much as they ought to. They do of course bring something to the party, that cannot be denied, not as much as me though, after all I am the party.

      5. HG

        I am curious to this new article of the Cliff, the more I think of things I don’t think I would classified what happens with me as a supernova. Now I can bring one of your kind to their knees in ways they never expect, I have been pushed past this point of what I understand a supernova is and this was the end result. In the moment it is a fight to the death (figuratively speaking) the strongest survives. In that moment I watched him die. Within nature only the strongest survives.

  33. I try not to speculate…I’ll wait until I can afford a consult. Same goes for the most prominent narcissists in my life- both past and present.

    I know I’m an empath and I know the narcissists in my life. I will seek HGs counsel on the finer distinctions and thus relevant schools and cadres

    1. Tappi,

      “I try not to speculate…I’ll wait until I can afford a consult. Same goes for the most prominent narcissists in my life- both past and present.”

      Same here. Although, I have consulted on my two most prominent narcissists. Because I needed that certainty to go no contact, etc.

      I have speculated about myself and I definitely do not fit neatly into one category. All I know for certain is that I’m a new ‘me’. I’m no longer the person I was during entanglement. I’m not even close to the person I was pre-entanglement.

      I enjoy the puzzle of figuring out who the new me is. That place of tension between who I was and who I am now – or who I am becoming – is not such a horrible place to be.

      1. Hi whocares
        Hope you can accept my apologies for the slow reply. Resumed work this week (summer break in Aus) and usually, I’m too busy to visit here during the first half of the week.

        You’re onto something there regarding your own evolving self perception. I personally think that’s one of lifes major missions…. to know thyself. As we (humans) are such changeable creatures, it’s a never ending pursuit!

        1. Hello Tappi,

          Don’t feel you need to apologize – especially about delayed responses. Sometimes I am super slow at getting back to people – mostly because I’m weighing and considering their words. I’m pretty sure I still owe a couple of replies…

          Thank-you – yes I’ve always been big on self-evaluation and the importance of ‘knowing thyself’. I think this mostly why my entanglement was such a gut punch – because I thought I knew myself – and because it has certainly brought some elucidations to light. I have always felt the importance of doing self work and understanding others – I have received so much clarity being here on the blog and the resulting discussion.

          And yes, we are such changeable creatures, and it is a never ending pursuit (at least to some) – and hopefully we can survive the setbacks and take away something useful from them.

          Enjoy the rest of your week, Tappi!

  34. Very interesting poll. After giving it some thought and thinking about the elements described by HG, I think I’m a super empath and can relate to a mix of the saviour, carrier and geyser cadres.

    I chose super empath because the way HG describes this school seems to fit. I don’t judge any of the schools as being better or worse than any other and I can see how the label “super” implies there’s something good or better about this school, however, putting aside the label, the aspects of the school seem to fit.

    I have both empathic and narcissistic traits and, depending on the situation, either of them can come to the fore. When HG describes the super empath as follows: “They hold their ability to empathise, to heal, to fix and impart goodness as a great gift and one which ought not to be abused.”, I relate to this. In addition to empathy, I think there’s an element of pride in this description, and pride is a narcissistic trait.

    Also, the description of the super empath as being able to endure the narc’s manipulations and devaluations for a long time before they dim their empathic traits and fight back with a supernova type of event also resonates strongly. The way HG describes the super empath’s narcissistic traits taking over when they’ve reached a point of “enough is enough” makes me think there are elements of both pride and anger in this description, and I can relate to that.

    I think I have elements of the saviour’s need to “fix” or “save” and I actually believe (emotional thinking!) that my efforts will succeed. If I foresee a problem or difficulty, I feel a need to “save” the situation by doing what I think will help or prevent the problem.

    I think growing up with a victim narc mother shaped me into a carrier. I tend to be a people-pleaser and to avoid conflict or keep the peace. I don’t think I’m co-dependent or a doormat because I feel resentment building if my carrier tendencies are taken advantage of or abused.

    The geyser cadre also seems to fit because I believe in love, despite all the logical thinking HG keeps throwing at us. I still believe in love and hope. I realise this is idealistic, but it’s also a way to overcome the past. Although I realise ‘love’ won’t “save the day”, I think it can “pave the way” (ha ha!) in order to improve tensions, difficulties or hardships that people experience. Also, I enjoy having emotions. While logical thinking is very helpful, too much of it is personally and spiritually unsatisfying.

    This is a great poll HG. Thank you for asking and thanks to other commenters for sharing.

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