Poll : What Has Narcissism Cost You?

POLL - hg


Everything has a price and narcissism is no different. What has narcissism cost you? Did you find yourself paying for anything or even defrauded as the savings accounts were emptied and you found loans in your name that you did not even take out? Perhaps it has cost you friendships as you fell out with those around you or you had to cut off an innocent parent when going no contact with a narcissistic parent? Maybe you were left suffering from anxiety and hyper vigilant, your sense of security snatched away and you no longer felt safe? Did you lose your home? Has it cost you a relationship with a child? Perhaps you feel it has taken your sense of who you are?

Whether this cost appears permanent or it was a temporary state of affairs and you have brought about recovery or restitution, do share your thoughts. Choose as many of the options as are applicable before casting your vote and as ever, please do expand on your situation in the comments.

Thank you for participating.

What has narcissism cost you?

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  1. What has Narcissism cost me personally? I’ve lost my life and gained my soul.

    Recursion. An extremely powerful mathematical concept. It’s when boundary conditions fold back in on themselves. A good example of an infinite recursion is when you place two mirrors on opposite walls. Or when a camera films a camera filming a camera etc… We all know it. But do we really see how important it is?

    Recursion is everywhere. I believe that recursion is in itself a central tenant to how society functions. It’s how abusers get away with it time and time again. If you look at society itself, it’s staggering. I see recursion all the time. The way I have had to fight again and again and again. Against multiple agencies, multiple times. Files go missing, fields in databases go blank. My name being missed off key distribution lists with critical and I mean CRITICAL agencies involved with child-welfare. Society looks as a whole but it doesn’t see and few are inquisitive enough to really question. Why should they? It would break apart their own realities.

    I’ve been speaking to someone today and whist he utterly got how important it was, the fact that he had his boundary condition, are the children about to be seriously harmed and therefore could he help? Yeah, I get that? But it is NOT the Courts role to determine that. It’s the Police.

    Children are being abused over and over again. The reason pretty much ALL of the abusers die without ever being brought to justice is the parable of the ‘Thee Wise Monkeys’. See no evil, speak no evil, see no evil. It’s very easy to say that those people are cowards. Oh no they are not. They just sense it. It’s going to far. Cannot look at it. If I close my eyes, it’s not there. Because at that moment it’s just seen as well, not that bad really? Not as bad as this…

    Bad is Victoria Climbie or Baby Peter. These two poor children are endlessly held up to Safeguarding Professionals as to attest the fact that there are, (coughs) multiple failings in the system. Lessons have been learned, we’ll move forward. NEXT!!!

    All SP’s are then meant to sit through this outrageous bundle of utter shite but Heh! It’s OK, cos, we now all of that checkbox ticked, don’t we?

    Recursion. We as a whole never ever really turn over the stone and see the truth. Billions of children have been failed by this lack of awareness in human nature. Billions.

    It doesn’t matter that I have been assaulted and very seriously so. Or others have. It’s fucking bullshit. In the case of Victoria Climbie and Baby Peter, they were abused by their primary caregivers and then failed by probably dozens and dozens of people around them. Clustering. Statistics. Those examples are terrible. Awful. But I hear countless times about the ones that slip through the net and are never heard. Usually from women. Countless voices screaming out into the void.

    Then the system folds back in on itself. Of course you get usual pressures of work. Human mistakes/frailties. Then you get the Ns who deliberately tamper with the system because at that point in time; it gives them fuel to do so. Magnify that on a global scale and essentially; we are all fucked.

    There are too many of them. Far far too many. Usually hiding under the cloak of middle class respectability. You only need to take one look at Baby P’s mum and her utter look of fucking gormlessness to know this lesser wretch had not a fucking clue about cognition. She was unusual in that respect and very possibly why she might have been held up for example in the first place.

    It’s no good crying and hand ringing after the fact. So, so many do. Guess it absolves their conscience?

    The reason Baby P strikes so hard to me is that when my eldest was still a baby, the scandal broke The fact that one parent could do that or even allow that to happen to another is beyond hell. I held my baby close and swore to protect her. She is crying out now and I cannot help. Is she in immediate risk of harm, they ask, all concerned like? That is just a mere question of degrees. Define ‘harm’?

    Take a look at rape. One of the most serious crimes on the statue. Yet, can we convict? Can we fucking bollocks.Oh balance of probabilities [insert your own platitude] etcs. You get that fucking ARSEWIPE Greer saying, ‘Well ya, ya know, there is rape and there is RAPE-RAPE!!’ I read about three pages of ‘The Female Eunuch’ before I vommed a little bit.

    Rape is control, power over another. Bit a bit of slap and tickle goes wrong; all good! Hi jinks gone silly! No harm done! You’ll get over it! What that very silly, and dubious ‘Cerebral’, spectacularly fails to miss is the methodology that builds into the act in the very first place, Or maybe she hasn’t missed it and is being deliberately provocative?

    When marital/partner sex goes wrong and someone calls it – it’s never about sex; it is about the degree of control one person has over another. Ohh, that’s ringing a bell!..And that dynamic WILL have been in place for months if not years. Usually because of the nature of typical MR abuse it will have been subtle and easily slides under the carpet of just well; it’s shades of grey. It isn’t? To suggest it is so, is probably one of the worst abuses perpetrated against my own sex by my own sex. Far, far worse than any male could ever do with his cock.

    All my life I have had it said to me, well yes, all rape is control but until I really understood HG’s writings I finally got the essential, why.

    Not all Ns rape but ALL rape is about control. You can’t control that vicious tongued bitch when she’s conscious? Wait until she is an ‘automaton’. Do it then when she is asleep/drugged/whatever. Oh yeah? Makes you feel like a proper God then doesn’t it? The fact that you have had to go to THAT length to exert it, speaks volumes heh? Yet so-called ‘sleep rape’ is considered one of the ‘least of all rapes’.

    HG asserts that the three aims are fuel, facade, benefits. I agree but from a empathic perspective there only ever is one; control. All of the rest are irrelevant to me because the outcome is the same. That some males need to control me. If they cannot control me; they attempt to wound me. If they cannot wound me, they smear me.And then they forget I can write. One cannot continue to divide zero by zero, you know?

    This has been a breathtaking rant and for those that have got to the bottom of it, thank you.

  2. I have to post this – I cannot not help but do it. It’s so fucking hilarious!

    A lot of you know my background and have given me utterly invaluable support and very kind thoughts indeed over these last week or so. I need to share this because it is so very funny and I think you’ll appreciate it. And hopefully contribute too!

    As you know, don;t have much money hence the need for the ‘pencil’ interview’ the other day. So today, I tried AGAIN to access either free or low cost legal advice. Right. I called the number to speak to the lawyer.

    I think we got a live one here! It took maybe a dozen words before I realised I had a member of the genus narcus narus on the other end. The reason why I know are two fold.

    1 – My girlie bits tingled
    2 – He was waaay to insightful for his own good and in such a short space of time.

    A brief 5 minute chat ensues where I outline the situation.

    I’m about to go into court, he says.

    When shall I call?


    I call at 2. He doesn’t answer. I call again ten minutes later. He doesn’t pick up. Now this is already strange. He’s a pro so he really should have been there unless in extremis. I’m a potential client after all. Already ‘ting’ unprofessional.

    Then imagine my surprise when I get this text, ‘Can’t talk, busy’. Whoahhh there stallion!!!

    The very first question I would have said is ‘Do you understand NPD behaviour and it’s effects on the survivours and how the court system is used to further abuse?’. No 1 Q in my book. As Our Dark Father outlines. At length.

    OK let’s rock! He’s looking for response time. I’m feeling particularly benevolent so I give him what he’s looking for. Reassurance. Plus; he’s intrigued me. So for about 5 or so minutes the texts go back and forth. Just to reiterate, I do not know this guy from Adam. Never interacted before today.

    He ends by saying, ‘OK, send me an email outlining your situation. You’ll need a two hour consultation.’ Hmmmmm!!! Time for the curve-ball!. I give him an unempathic response;

    ‘I shall martial my thoughts. Thank you.’

    I’m ringing at 5.

    Believe me, last few days have again been horrific but manageable (I’m OK! I really am). I then paused and reflected. If I want to go into court with either him or armed with information from him, the I would far rather it be a N than one of my kind and a male one at that.

    I shall keep you abreast of developments. This could be interesting!

  3. Hey folks. Just in stupid pencil interview waiting room. Got into lift before. Someone asked me if I’m an actress. Weird.

    1. Hey, Renarde… I saw below about your assessment but inquired here hoping you’d see this post. So what’s the latest… still in limbo waiting for the next phase?

      How are you feeling tonight, which is pretty late for you right now so I’m hoping you are occupied, but I just wanted to see how your spirits are as of now?

      1. Spirits go up and down. The tenuous communication I had even last week has now stopped. I’m not being told of anything, informed of anything. I don’t know what to do and I don;t know where to turn.

        Actually, there really now is only one way left and I’m going to take it. Abuse thrives in the dark. All those old family secrets coming out. It’s baffling isn’t it to an Empath to realise that so many people have such dark secrets. Emps don’t live that way. Living in accordance with your own moral compass naturally means you have absolutely zero indiscretions that you don;t want others to know about. How hard they try to hide them.

        Thank you for thinking about me BKK. x

      2. There is something to be said about shining light on such disturbing matters. It’s amazing how it loses its power once out in the open. While I’m not certain of the secrets you are referring to, I wish you the best as you reveal & heal.

        Remember Renarde, you are not alone. So please keep your narcsite family abreast as you make those moves to rectify this… while staying true to your empathic convictions, of course. 😊

        And you know what we say here in the US… about that squeaky wheel? Frequent calls and messages might prompt them to respond and expedite your matters. But I don’t know if it will work so easily in the UK, so I don’t want to give advice that might cause them to put your file on the bottom. Whoever said patience is a virtue wasn’t dealing with our modern day government!
        Best Wishes and Hang Tough …

    2. Renarde
      I don’t know if you’ll see this and I’m sorry for such a late reply. I hope you’re feeling much, much better now ❤️ I apologize if you’ve posted an update, it’s just very hard to organize the chronology of the comments (or lack thereof 😒). Sending a big hug anyway 🤗

  4. Anyway so, everyone has been really kind this last few days. I thought I’d give you an update. When I was feeling suicidal he other day I was on my way to the ‘can I pick up a pencil’ assessment for fitness’s to work.

    If I didn’t have so much on my plate I would be incandescent with anger at what I’m about to do. I have my Dr, many years in GP, qualified, etcs who repeatedly pronounces me not fit for work. I have the damn cert.

    I now need to go back to this building to presumably walk in a straight line and pick up a pencil. How fucking demeaning?

    I am going to drive then take the train, walk then get to the 7th floor. If I can do that I can fucking pick up a pencil. Whats the betting there’s some low grade MR with a fucking clipboard there today? Because I am really and I mean really looking forward to how they asses my mental capacity. How can someone who hasnt had that degree of training make a clinical judgement?

    Whoever devised this system (yeah, I think we know who) needs to be taken outside and fucking shot IMHO. When I was working (years as a teacher then a scientist/engineer) I was happy that there was a benefits system in place. It was there to help the less fortunate and I was happy my taxes were going that way. Made no difference to me. Actually, I don’t want to be this way but equally, I cannot be around Ns who have power over me ever again. maybe I will tell them that.

    If I have to come back again without being seen I swear to God I’m going to the papers.

    1. You go in there, Renarde, and you pick up that pencil like a warrior! 💪
      If a haughty low-grade MR is standing there with his assessment clipboard, well… you know where to return his pencil. ✏💩

      Best wishes to you on this journey, Renarde. We will all be cheering for you. 💓

      1. I’ve just replied to NA but yes indeedy! I did get a narc! A MR – quelle suprise! Who’d have thought it, a MRer in a low level government post!

    2. Renarde
      This all sounds so bizarre. Is there some kind of trick to this assessment? Like what do you pick the pencil up WITH. In that case they’d get a show and I’d be fucked.


      1. Ha ha! Its The Department of Work and Pensions – their fitness to work assesment. I didn’t have to pick up a pencil because it was clear to the MRN – oh yes! Got one there! That if I could drive, I could pick up a pencil.

        No, I had to go through the mental health stuff. I was prepared for this. What I was NOT prepared for was turning up to my appointment and being made to wait for an hour despite the fact I was on my own in the waiting room for most of that time. I almost left.

        They kept saying soon, soon. It really is utter bollocks, very demeaning, time wasting and I’m guessing that I will be pronounced fit for work despite the fact the last time I went I was feeling suicidal and they know that.

        At one point I did precisely what I shouldn’t have done and had a ER in front of the narc. So yeah, he got well fueled. Wonder if he’ll be nice to his partner tonight or not? You know, he grabbed my file then kept me waiting another 15 minutes.

        1. I was thinking tonight -by the time you all finish “You” I will be watching the second season, and there’s nothing good on Netflix- that thing Renarde said once about empaths having big eyes, and narcs reading just through us. I happen to have big, deep eyes, so I just imagined for a moment if that is true for all of us and we ever met in person. It would look like an anime convention. That made me giggle. Love you all, good night! 😘

          1. I loved TKM, HG. So I shall take your advice on Elementary. You have good taste. As do I apparently.

  5. Serious thought experiment. HG asks, what has the Ns cost us?

    Now lets us Emps have a thought experiment of our own. Suppose if the Gods gave us the power to destroy NPD. Once and for always. What if? Suppose, just suppose all we had to to do was put two wires together? Wipe them out. Forever. All those people that died or who were maimed. All the innocent people who had suffered. Would we do it? Could we do it? Why would we do it?

    I know what I would do but what do you know? Would we kill them off or let them live? I would really like to see/read peoples’ reactions.

    What would WE do?

    1. Ooooh I love this Renarde!
      However, it requires some thought and consideration, especially under the influence of certain mind relaxing sunbstances.

      I’ll get back to you shortly xo

    2. We’re all gonna die anyway Renarde and it’s not as if anyone ever asked to be put into this world.
      Malignant narcs have suffered in childhood.
      Should we kill their parents? Or are they victims as well?
      There is no such thing as righteousness on this planet.
      It’s like they say: First you are born, then you go: WTF??? Then you die.

      1. Urm bit confused? It’s a thought experiment. What if you could? How would the world change? For the better, the worse or no different?

    3. Well, Renarde, with the mood I’m in this morning…
      I’d black widow ’em.
      Yep. I think Id go for the ole have a good time, then take him out. No – I have long been worried that I’m turning into a narcissist myself, so while that sounds appealing, I’d just put my two wires together to eliminate the disorder – the NPD.

      I actually think many of them would be pretty fantastic without the disorder. Besides, they say black widows don’t ALWAYS eat the male. So if they can stop themselves, I can too. ☺

      But Renarde, your point is really more on how staggering their abuse is. I would love nothing more than to eliminate that horror from this world we share. ❤🌎 I hate that I can’t accomplish that feat, but I can at least change me. The healing from these fuckers truly start with that. Actually, we are the only place it starts. Once the anger lifts, I promise it gets better.

      But I understand how you meant that question, in theory. And I understand the fury narcissists spark. “Hell hath no fury…. ” So True!
      I had some pretty dark thoughts about what I’d like to do to my narcissist. I won’t mention them here in case he comes up missing or something. Although I’m certain I’m not the only one he’s scorned. (Still, no need for me to give the detectives an open invitation to knock on my door.) However, I do find it to be a comforting fantasy at times….

      1. I get you on the dark thoughts lovely, I have them to. I have a friend who desrbies to me what his narc ex does and frankly, I don;t know how he stands it. He doesn’t help himself and I’ve told him that. I’ve explained over and over again about ER’s and fuel. He’s gone NC now. About time, I’d say. But he does tell me how he feels.

  6. HG, thank you for all that you do… for your invaluable service.
    May life continue to bless you.

  7. Money, friends ,jobs ,I could go on every time I get engaged with a narcissist the just about bleed me dry it’s almost cost me my life but I have always found my self again I am very wary now the biggest thing is I have lost my trust in people it takes a lot to break down my barriers

  8. OK. So, yeah narcissism has cost me a lot. Some of the states I’ve experienced will be temperament, others temporary. It’s time for the bigger picture.

    All of this, the blog, the books, is about weaponisation. But there are scales to the ultimate goal. I hasten to add that I’m not there yet. But I’m close.

    Around about November something happened. I’m still not quite sure what it was, why the change happened when it did. All I know is that something shifted. I began to journal, really write. It’s about what I’m going through but it’s also a time capsule, a message from me now to the children, for them to read in the future. I live in quite a strange area and it’s probably in response to that and having a lot of time on my hands that has really made me think. You see, I think that the ability for a empath to be weaponised at all is awesome. Some of us, maybe all, or maybe just a few will finally walk the through the bubble, the facade of society and actually move with the Greaters themselves.

    This is an extraordinarily painful thing to do. There are some things that are seen that can never been unseen. The knowledge of what society is; it’s a shocker. Your thinking changes too. In ways that you cannot even begin to fathom. It’s like something get’s ripped out of your mind… the fog maybe, it goes.

    Someone asked me if I had spoken to HG. Yes, I have. About the kids and weaponisation. It didn’t take long during the consultation for me to understand the truth; there is nothing about the situation with the kids that he can tell me that I don’t already know. That I hadn’t thought of dozens of times before. What he did in effect was gently tell me; you’re running your engines on full speed. Where is it going? He didn’t say that directly, but that was the gist of it.

    I thought of something another friend said; there is a third way. There is always a third way. I’ve never really held much value in myself therefore it is always a shock when people get overexcited by me. My biggest value to the ex is fuel. He’s desperately trying to control the narrative by engineering a situation where the kids can only speak to me via his mobile phone. Trouble is, he rarely picks up when I call. This is similar to the Google Calendar stunt he tried to pull. I can read it but I cannot edit it. Therefore I’m forced to go cap in hand to him to ask for time with my children.

    I am fully entitled to have a relationship with my kids that does not involve him. For that to happen, total independence, other things need to be in place. Another thing that HG reminded me of is when two Ns collide. Each will attempt to control the other. Eventually, it will become an exercise in futility and they will part. I need to keep that in mind.

    So, I’m going to put those measures in place and then, OMG, the NC is going to be fucking awesome!

    As to the future. Consequences of weaponisation has put me in a position that we all can recognise and access but actually remains really rare in society as a whole. I come across this all the time when I deal with agencies. So what can I do? I can write, I can educate, I can help others in similar situations.

    I’m going to set up a charity – Survivors Of Narcissistic Abuse. SONA. If anyone would like to help in any way, I would be eternally grateful.

    Thank you all, once again. xxx

    1. Renarde, ❤
      You ARE a survivor. You’ll make an excellent chairwoman of SONA. I’ll help in any way I can.
      Many blessings to you.

    2. Renarde, listen, there is no man on this earth who could dim your light!! Hold on to that.

      Children are clever, they know more than they let on. Trust me, my boys are 23 and 18 and could always sense things were off. I’m sure, in time, your children will want both sides no matter what your ex tells them. Your children – if anything like you – will be strong and intelligent – and of course truth seeking too.

      I am so sorry you felt suicidal, in 2014 I attempted it, my children were so angry with me. I promised them I would never hurt them like that again. My boys were heartbroken and it crushed me to hurt them in this way. Your children, will always be your children regardless of where they live and will one day want the truth. They will always love you.

      I’m glad you got the straight talking from HG, that support is priceless.
      The third way sounds interesting and a goal for you to aim for whilst you recover and plan your next steps, gather your strength and then justice will be yours in abundance!

      With regards to your charity SONA, great idea. If I can help in anyway – my work experience may be helpful for you. But as contact is purely blog based – I’m not sure how help can be achieved?

      Hold on to that inner bad ass, she will get you through all of this, you’ll be stronger, wiser and fulfilled in helping others with your first hand experience. Chin up pretty lady xxx

      1. PV – I am so sorry you ecxpereinced that but hey? We’re still here!

        If you can help then I’d love that. Not sure yet how to facilitate contact re:SONA. I came up with it a while ago but like everything else, it had to take a back seat.

        I wouldn’t mind considering the importance of what I was doing with my kids but sadly, despite everything, I made little to no import on getting custody back. I could not make headway for the life of me. I tried so hard. Fuck it.

        Thank you very much for your support x

      2. Nice to see you feeling better Renarde :)

        Trust me, you have not lost them. Children are so clever, in the meantime be the best version of you and work your third way plan. Go get those targets!

        Think about this as well…. the more he smears you, the more questions your children will have. You are writing a journal – a blog – document the lot in that so one day you can ask your children to read the other side.

        Words are powerful.

        Keep being you x

  9. Just a very quick message to say – I’m staggered. I’m in tears. You are all so very kind.

    I’m OK, I’m safe and and relatively intact. I’m going to respond to every person directly.

    Thankyou so very much xxx

    1. Take your time, Renarde. No rush to worry about us. We are all just comforted in knowing you’re well. ❤

  10. I responded to this poll a few days ago but did not comment. I couldn’t. I was feeling suicidal and very ironically in the waiting room of a government department that was going to asses my capability to work.

    I took the train. I kept on looking at the rails. Wondering if part of me was going to force the other part to throw myself on them. I got to the interview only to find there was a 2 hour wait with no guarantee of being seen.I left. I couldn’t cope with it.

    I never want to go through that again. I thought I was over the worst but no. My ex-H, a MRN, broke me. He has poisoned my children’s’ minds’ against me. Now I am in the utterly insidious position of shielding my own abuser from my children.

    My ex husband raped me. He threatened to rape me. He throttled me against a wall and punched me in the face. That’s the least of it. I would happily be raped millions of times if it were not for the psychological abuse.That he loved me, he cared for me. That he wanted what was best for me.That he loved our children. All lies.

    How on earth can one parent break it to their children about abuses on this scale? The news will devastate them.No question. So I am shielding my abuser. I have been for years. His abuses were a very large contributing factor in my suicide attempt last year.

    I lost my children. I agreed to temporary custody. Since then it has essentially been death by a thousand cuts. He’s used the situation against me. I worked so fucking hard to get that custody back. All the agencies, every single fucking day I tried. Every day. Ringing and ringing, documenting, logging, over and over and over again. The sheer level of incompetency I’ve seen. Letters that haven’t been sent, police lying to my face, addresses being changed, people in positions of power who don’t also flag safeguarding concerns. But it’s over. Last night it’s over. I’ve lost their minds.

    No human should ever, EVER be placed in the position of protecting their abuser. That’s what I’ve done, to prevent further harm. Last night, I really really wanted to kill myself. I didn’t for one reason and one reason only. If I were to do that on the back of seeing them they would never ever be able to live with it. Last night was the first night in many years where I was absolutely 100% sure that I would survive.

    When HG talks about the battle post discard there is also another battle. When the N poisons the minds of others; the smear. Both of my children can’t take it anymore. My ex offers stability, the lure of a new home, a bigger home, a fresh start. More money. Fun things to do. What can I offer apart from love?

    I had so little, last year, with them. So little. I tried. Oh my God I tried. Even that little was eventually taken away from us. On utterly spurious grounds. Being with me causes them stress and anxiety. So what do I do? I dont want my children to suffer and if them being with me creates anxiety then removing it is the right thing to do? Surely? But then what happens? I then have no influence plus they are now living with their abuser.

    I lived this life, I know how it will go with every fibre of my being. It’s already begun.

    Now it’s over. They want to spend time with me but my days of being of influence are over. My heart is utterly broken.

    I had a emergency Drs appointment today. I cancelled it What’s the point. There is no drug he can prescribe that can stop the pain. This is terminal.

    The only thing on HG’s poll list that I haven’t lost to NPD abuse is my mind. Bizarrely, that’s the one thing I have prayed would be taken.

    1. Renarde
      I don’t know what to say. What you have written has flooded me with many questions about your situation (because of the instant and driving need to provide a solution)- none of which really matter right now. What matters is only how you feel and how will you move forward. You are very raw and it was brave of you to share. I will only say that I am deeply upset for you and your situation. How can I help?

      1. Bless you. I really mean that.

        The sad fact is, no-one can help. I’ve pretty much at the end of what I can do. I need to find a new way. The third way.

        Thankyou for being here and witnessing my pain x

    2. Renarde, I read what you are going through. I hear you and you are very brave to reach out. I hope you will keep pushing to be seen by a mental health professional. Please don’t give your abuser the ultimate control over you by ending your own life. Have you reached out to HG? I don’t know how the health system is there, but you may be able to get an appointment with him before you can the doctor. He can help you with your emotional thinking which is causing this horrendous pain. You don’t really want to die. You just want the pain to stop. Hang in there, girl. Please don’t give up!

      1. Reaching out to HG is an excellent suggestion MB. I hope if that’s what Renarde wants, a consult isn’t cost prohibitive. Not that you’re consults are overpriced HG, just that we don’t all have lots of disposable income.

      2. That’s it. I want the pain to stop. I’m going to stop the pain and I think I know how. It’s the third way. OMG it’s scary though but also very exciting.

        I will see the Dr and yes I have contacted HG and he was a big help.

        Thank you x

        1. Renarde, I’m glad to see you are in a better place. It’s wonderful that HG was available to help. His calm and logical demeanor feel like shelter from the storm. Do see the doctor and get on something to help you over the hump. I hope your third way involves low contact. Stay strong! I’m pulling for you. Be the star in your own life. You’ve got this girl!

          1. Hey MB.

            I’m going to ring up and see a Dr.

            HG was a great help because he gave me the ‘hard stop’. That was really important for me to hear it. He did it in a way that was extraordinarily thoughtful too. I always appreciate straight talking and I heard it. Our discussion on weaponisation was equally fascinating.

            Thank you again x

          2. Renarde, Wouldn’t HG make the best big brother ever?!?

            Seriously though HG. I’m not sure how it came about for you to help Renarde. I have questions around it, but will just be content and grateful that it happened and the outcome was positive. God Bless you, Sir.

          3. I know HG. That’s why I didn’t ask. Plus it’s none of my business. God bless you for all that you do!

          4. Oh really simple MB, standard consult. That’s all. Well I say standard because it wasn’t. It cannot be when you are discussing really big ideas and concepts. Not just personal circumstances.

            As to whether HG would make a really good big brother? Yes he would. My own brother is younger than I am. I have no elder siblings. I don’t actually perceive him as Big Bro though. He is my father. In point of fact, he’s all our fathers.

            HG told me what I needed to hear rather than what I wanted to hear. That’s incredibly important because how I can I make decisions based on half-truths? Unlike my own biological father, he did it in a way which was authentic, calm and reassuring. PN would NOT have done this. He would have twisted the narrative for his own little fuel grabbing agenda.

            That doesn’t mean to say that PN is incapable of giving good advice. He just does it on his own terms and if that means hurting me, he will do it. In spades.

            Yes, I do think we all need to thank HG. For his words and this blog. We’re all little monsters together. Or is it The New Prometheans? Ether way; I’m not a ‘Tudorette’ guys. :-) But you lot crack me up so bad :-) x

          5. Renarde, I didn’t mean for you to tell me about it. I wasn’t trying to be nosy! I just thought it was nice of him to get you in so quickly is all. HG is a good egg.

          6. MB, I’m always happy for HG to have immediate access to all areas. It’s those legs x (But not the weird hand)

          7. Harsh! Lol. I thought the hand was lovely and well manicured. I would welcome that caress over being snagged by a raggy nail on the paw of a less fastidious fucker.

        2. Hi Renarde. I am catching up with the comments here and just read yours. I am glad to learn you are safe and feeling better. Keep writing and venting here.

    3. Renarde
      sending you love from my heart to yours.
      I wish I could help you, really i do. Wish I had something useful to say. That’s got me in tears reading your story.. I’m so sorry you are going through this. The pain is unbearable. I feel for you. Keep going lovely one don’t give in, you never know what is around the corner. I’m hoping for a good outcome for you. Xxx

          1. No criniging necessary! It’s just that I’ve been around for a few years now.

    4. Renarde, The system is so fucked. I am glad you pulled yourself back from the edge. Is there an organization that you can contact? Perhaps Women’s Aid or Refuge? Samaritans? I am sure there are people who can support you both in your personal struggles and in your struggles with institutions. They all have 24 hr hotlines. Please call.

      1. The fucked system: you are so very right. It’s a relief to say that I have contacted the Samaritans this year, many times. I spoke to them last week in fact. She was a great comfort. We talked about NPD (obviously they are all trained in how to spot them) and she put the ACTUAL figure that contacted their helpline as 80%. 80% of callers have NPD. Fuckers are never going to actually do the deed so all of that is wasted time and money.

        Thank you x

        1. Hi Renarde, I’ve been slammed with work the past few days and unable to return to the blog but I am catching up and yours is the first story I looked for. I am glad you are feeling so much better and that the Samaritans know what you are dealing with. That is weird to me that 80% of callers have NPD. Are they just screwing around with the volunteers’ time or are they really suicidal? You don’t have to answer as I see you have many people to respond to here. I am just curious is all. The main thing is that you are getting help.

          1. It’s very kind of you SMH to respond. I’ve had a weird few days. Things are coming to light about just how dark my ex-s family were. Dots have been joined and today has not been great.

            It’s clear to me that, like HG, my own exs childhood was horrific. HG talks, rightly so, from his perspective as a male. How he has in the past deployed manips and power plays. This is good as it’s valuable for us.

            However, a lot of people also have to deal with the female Ns. Today, it’s how fucking cunning, sly and manipulative female Ns and especially the middles are.

            The sex manipulation for example. I’m pretty out there, sex wise but I have a very clear line on my boundaries. I have never, ever in my life felt compelled to delibately seduce a man just so he can do my bidding. Both my exs mother and of course my own mother did this.

            Exs mum – targetted married men (blackmail-able). When she was done with them, I perceive she ‘allowed’ herself to be caught in the act. I knew about the first occasion when she was ‘caught’ with a neighbour by her own 13 year old daughter. What I did not know is that she was also caught with another married man at their mutual place of work. of course we all know why this should be.

            I know how dark and devious male Ns minds can be. Actually; that’s relatively straightforward. When the burden of child-rearing and childcare still largely rests with women, it becomes a stunningly different matter.

            That woman, allowing herself to be observed by her own daughter is utterly unforgivable. The fact that daughter carried that secret for decades is also – just beyond words.

            Turn to dear old MN. Yes, she really liked to do perhaps the oldest trick in the book; open the door to a male that you want to seduce and deliberately wear the skimpiest item of clothing available. Even I, as sex and kink positive as I am, would never do this in a million years. It’s so fucking dangerous.

            But yet both of these women were doing it.
            Of course my own mother did it whilst I was in the house as a baby and toddler. What have I seen that I don’t remember?
            It’s only fairly recently that I’ve understood how quickly and easily my own mother lies. When you put them under even the slightest modicum of pressure, they react in tears and withdraw in a AST to prevent further interrogation.

            I know my own value. Thanks to HG. My own internal value I mean. It’s frightening. The very people we look to for care and nature are actively undermining us, for years, for decades.
            Oh the fake tears, the ‘woe is me’? What about the lies you have both spun to keep your very silly and let’s face it, feeble fuel matrix intact.

            I am ashamed to be female today. I really am.

            Thank you SMH for thinking about me x

          2. Renarde, it’s terrible not to protect your children whether you are male or female. I was just reading today an account of domestic abuse against a male. The female seemed like a narc – isolating him, emotionally abusing him and then physically abusing him. She was just given a jail sentence. They have young children too. Imagine what those children saw.

          3. I read that too. It’s indescribable what that poor man went through. Thank God he was found in time. You would never guess to look her , would you? As HG says, abusers really are ‘the people in the street.’ I think in the case you are referring to, the kids were very young indeed. Still – they should never have been placed in that position.

            I’ve been writing a lot today and especially about how deadly the females can be. How they are very cunning, sly and devious. Far more so than males. A narc mother is truly one of the worst burdens any child can face.

      2. Wow, Renarde… staggering statistics on the NPD related calls received by the Samaritans. I don’t know what to say other than this “epidemic” of wounded souls breaks my heart.

    5. Renarde, I just read your post. Please, let us know what we can do from here. If we were allowed to get in touch outside the blog I would meet with you and at least try to keep you company, I feel so sorry you are suffering so much, I am glad though you had the strength to write here instead of making an irreparable decision. Use us to vent and mitigate your pain, please. ❤️

      1. I would very much like to meet. In fact, I think if we can in the UK, we should. I’m happy to organise and facilitate something in the UK. Maybe HG can create a post where we can all discuss this?

        1. Not going to happen, it is against the rules and for very good reasons. Certain individuals I know have made contact with one another outside of this place (having ‘met’ through this place) and I warned against doing so. Needless to say, it did not go well – as I warned. Indeed, one individual has had three ‘difficult’ outcomes through going against this very sensible practice. I am not suggesting that you and SP are problematic but the rule is in place for very solid reasons and its efficacy has been borne out repeatedly.

          1. OK I understand. Thank you for outlining this rule and yeah, I can see the dangers. I think there is a great need for our own kind to meet each other but we must always be cautious.

          2. Indeed. I see more than you invariably do because of my objectivity, expertise and also I have the advantage of often seeing behaviours exhibited in emails to me which you readers do not. It is for your protection.

          3. Of course. I remember you saying how many messages you receive each day. A staggering amount.

            Thank you for protecting us.

          4. HG
            Despite most people’s very good intentions, I understand why that rule of not contacting each other is in place here. I would not want to be responsible for any bad experience to anyone resulting from my blog if I were you either. I find it most sensible and thank you for it.

        2. Renarde, I don’t live in the UK but travel there often, and the idea of the organization is EXCELLENT. In fact, I think we should all create the organization and have an annual meeting in a different place each year. That way we could all meet, travel, have fun, and all for a good cause. And I am saying this in all seriousness, it’s totalky feasible. Renarde, you sound much better today and that makes me happy for you, please don’t lose hope.

          1. Ahh SP. I think we could do this but HG has already highlighted today why we shouldn’t do this. I don’t perceive he said what he said to keep me personally from harm. Far from it. He’s done it to ensure that the ones who are really vulnerable don’t get hurt. I get that.

            There are a lot and I mean a lot of vulnerable people out there. I am not one of them and have not been for some time. I need to remember that.

            Yes today I am in a much happier place because, well, I just know. It’s a very privileged position to be in. and one that I feel truly grateful for.

            Thank you SP. I have been given hope and I will take it. I have to. You are very kind. x

      2. HG, I am sorry I said that, I didn’t see your later comments. I definitely didn’t meet anyone here or talked to anyone at a personal level outside the blog. I thought Renarde’s idea of raising an organization to help victims is a very good one though, but it would be hard to organize anything without contacting each other personally. But I will never mention that again, so my apologies. Damn I was already planning my outfit for the Bourbon trip…

        1. You have no need to apologise SP, you have not done anything wrong. It was a founding principle of this place that allowing contact between people would be strictly prohibited because :-

          1. This is a constructive environment and must remain that way;
          2. There cannot be any available mechanism from this blog where if there is a disagreement here that someone can look to ‘attack’ another person elsewhere;
          3. Narcissists do occasionally appear here. They would follow-up their machinations away from the blog having ‘seduced’ here if they were able to;
          4. I do not want the distraction of potential lawsuits against me if someone were to suffer some form of misfortune from a predator (either one in their personal life who has tracked them down here or a new one who has hunted here and sought that person out in ‘real life’ ) and then look to make me liable for having insufficient safeguards in place;
          5. There are certain people here (albeit few in number) who operate a façade on the blog and behave differently elsewhere. This is where certain individuals have found out to their cost/discomfort where they have foolishly sought to extend what they thought was a friendship here ‘off blog’ and found out that there was an altogether different type of behaviour away from my watch and moderation;
          6. It is extremely rare for a narcissist in someone’s personal life turn up here (it has only happened once) however preventing contact detail exchange is part of tackling that risk also;
          7. It would be easy enough for a predator to observe the interaction between two genuine individuals here, let us say A and B. The predator then locates A on another social media platform and the predator pretends to be B (adopting their user name from here, avatar picture and information gleaned) . B approaches A on the other platform, A thinks this is B from the blog and engages and provides more personal information and well, you can see where that could go. That predator could be an existing one who is after A from a previous engagement or it could be an entirely new predator.

          The advantage you all have is that you have the best of the best operating this place and its success and safety for you all reflects on me, thus it is a fundamental aspect of the operation of this place that the rule against external contact is preserved here and I emphasise that really should not seek someone out regardless of this blog (as some people have done) as the risk involved is not worth taking. You can maintain an excellent friendship here, that is why I allow some off topic banter between people (so long as it is not too much about cooking!) so you can indulge that element of your interactions.

          1. Thank you for putting all the terrible case scenarios on the table, HG. I don’t want anyone to think I’m a gullible idiot full of “Kumbaya” plans to get together in happiness and harmony, my desires to meet are moved partly by curiosity, desire for social interaction, and a need to try yo help if one of us is feeling defeated. Sometimes it’s frustrating because I travel a lot and on occasions, when someone says anything about their town/surroundings, I have to bite my tongue and not scream: we could have a drink in 20! I don’t know how you can keep anonymity so well, HG. Thank you for keeping the balance of logic among so much emotion here.

      3. My apologies, too, HG.
        Like Sweetest Perfection, you know that my intentions were also pure. (Well, I hope you know? You do know – you have those special little instincts. 😊)

        (So thank you, HG, for recognizing that most of us here wouldn’t hurt a flea.) But we do understand the potential for a select few to abuse through this medium. It would be a perfect place to do so.

        Dammit – I was really looking forward to seeing what SP was gonna wear.
        I’m still holding out on hope that you’re gonna have that Narcsite Reunion, HG.
        (Maybe in 10 … 20 years? 😩)

        1. BKK, you would have loved my outfit. In real life, I’m a top model. Ahhh, the joys of anonymity are manifold…

          1. SweetP
            I’m a model too. Of sorts……ok, I’m always the “before” in the make-over.

          2. NA, the before is better in many cases: before too much Botox; before plucking your eyebrows; before meeting a narc… I consider you my top (role) model!

      4. And I must add… I might not always like your rules, but Big Daddy, I do like your style.

        (Thanks for looking out for us, HG, no matter the intentions behind it.)

        But (s-o-m-e-d-a-y) do you think we could arrange a group get-together, in secret, for those who are willing to sign a waiver… and if you come along too, we could eventually take that Kentucky Bourbon Trail trip?

      5. HG,

        I’m curious, forgive me if its too private. Do you have a plan in place in case something tragic happens to you? A plan so that your legacy here is carried on?

        1. Mercy
          I offered early on in my participation here on the blog that if he became unable to physically continue on for some reason, that he might need someone to affix a pencil to his forehead (fivehead according to him) to allow him to continue bonking away on his keyboard. He was having no part of that then either lol. If I recall correctly, I was called a cheeky rascal.

      6. You have my curiosity stirred Sweetest Perfection. And whether you are teasing or serious about your top modeling position, I have no doubt that you are lovely 💖… AND have good taste in fashion. ☺

        I’m just an old woman, or at least well on my way. But after seeing some of of the snippets of HG’s followers, there is no doubt that there are many attractive empaths here… lovely in many ways. (I still can’t get Kel’s hand off my mind!)

        What I’m trying to get at is… HG, I realize that as the general of this army-of-one, you set your own rules. But I got the impression once that The Good Doctors asked you to consider some concerns before you set out to provide this service. Soooo, is part of the rules also to protect you (your progress) in regards to us? I mean… I can only imagine that for a narcissist with this many empaths at his fingertips, there would be a certain level of temptation.

        I see you as always professional with an ability to still have a little fun with your followers. [Your balance there works well for me personally, as IRL, I have to provide my services to clients who work in a varying degrees of positions. Without a mix of professionalism and relatability, I wouldn’t be able to connect with both the CFO and the janitor… at least not in the ways that I need be successful within my job.]

        I can imagine that The Good Doctors had concern that this dynamic might be a concern. You obviously, practice great self-control, but were the doctors worried that this interaction would be like a methhead head trying to work in a crack house? (Please know that I mean no disrespect in my poor analogy. I am struggling with how to ask my question?)

    6. Renarde, I think every single savior empath that read your post just stood up and said “show me where this mother fucker is!”. I’m ready to go to battle for you. I will not say that I understand your pain. I cannot imagine what you are going through right now. All I can say is that I want to help. I don’t know about your situation but I know about kids. A big house, things that can be bought doesn’t replace your love. Anxiety doesn’t hold a candle to abuse. Never underestimate the very powerful emotion of a mother’s love. When you say that you shield them from abuse I assume you mean that you don’t tell them of your abuse. I don’t see this as shielding them, I see it as having trust in your children to see their father for who he is. To make their own decision without your influence. Children are smarter than we give them credit for. They see what we try to hide from them. As a mother you are conflicted. Wanting to protect them when your choices are so limited. It’s just another thread of guilt that we add to our noose. Our children need us to remove those burdens of guilt. They need you to say “yep our situation sucks bad but we’re going to get through this together”. They are stronger than you know Renarde. They will grow up and say “mom I knew”. Never give up on them, never give up on yourself. Come here when you need to be reminded of how valuable you are. We haven’t had alot of conversation with each other but I’ll talk to you until you tell me to shut up. There are so many of us here that can remind you of your worth when your ET has made you forget.

      Think about what NA said. How will you move forward? That’s what is important right now.

      If that doesn’t work I’m sure we can pull a special operations team together to take this guy out!!