The Wrong No Contact
No Contact.
This is what anybody who has been a victim of our kind must achieve. Whether that status of victim stems from being a friend to a narcissist where you are taken for granted, used when the narcissist needs a lift or someone to moan to or whether it is the beaten down and trampled Intimate Partner Primary Source who was wife, boyfriend or partner has endured and suffered extensive abuse, no contact is the antidote.
Building that robust and effective wall of no contact can be difficult. It is time consuming, requires rigour and perseverance and not only are you trying to repel the advances of the narcissist who is trying to breach your no contact regime, you also have to fight against yourself and your emotional thinking which is trying to make you breach no contact as well. Indeed, it is often your emotional thinking which proves to be the harder enemy to conquer and it is not a one-off battle. Your emotional thinking, because of who you are and the emotional infection your engagement with the narcissist has caused, means that this is an ongoing battle which requires your repeated vigilance. Through the application of understanding and building your Logic Defences, the task does become easier, but it is not one which goes away. Like any wall, it must be checked, maintained and patrolled, otherwise holes and breaches occur and the narcissist will impact on you once again.
Time and time again I see people who think they have put in place no contact and they have not. Sometimes it almost beggars belief that the victim thinks they have established no contact – it is obvious they have not. In other instances you could be forgiven (if forgiveness was something I gave) for thinking you have implemented no contact but in actual fact you have not. There are many instances where people think they have instigated no contact and all they have done is embark on The Wrong No Contact. Here are just a few of the many ways in which you might be getting no contact wrong and the risks that come with this.
- Looking At Social Media
Just because the narcissist does not explicitly know you have looked at his or her social media does not mean this is no contact. Indeed, we rely on you doing so and expect you to look at our social media, that is why in certain instances you are not blocked from looking at our Facebook account, Twitter feed, Instagram and so forth. We want you to look at it. Just because you are not interacting directly with us, just because you are not commenting and we are not replying, just because you are not adding likes – this is not no contact. If you are looking at our social media you are likely to see indirect jibes made about you, Relationship Bulletins about your replacement, reminders of the golden period and even direct attacks against you. This will result in :-
- a risk you will be upset, hurt, angry
- the maintenance of the emotional infection because you are thinking about us
- a surge of emotional thinking which may cause you to contact us to attack us for our barbed comments towards you, to seek answers when you are upset about the reminder of an anniversary or similar
- stopping you from moving forward
2. Not Blocking Our Number
You may think that it will be the first thing you will do when you commence no contact. You block our number from your telephone and mobile phone so that we cannot call or text you from the relevant number. Of course we may get around this by using a different device therefore that is why you are better served by changing your telephone numbers, but if you do not change the numbers then you ought to block the new number of ours which appears and keep doing so, like a matador dodging the on rushing bull each time to avoid harm.
Nevertheless, the number of occasions I see people who claim they are no contact but they have not blocked our number is higher than you might think. These people think that if they, as victim, do not contact us, then that is no contact. No, it is not. Of course, those people who do not block the number are giving in to their emotional thinking because they WANT the narcissist to contact them.
If you do not block our number, this is not no contact. One of the easiest hoovers for us to perform is to text you. It uses no effort, it brings with it a reduced consequence of wounding (say compared to ringing you on the telephone or seeing you in person) and allows the drawing of fuel. If you do not block our number, you are lowering the hoover bar to such a low level that hoovers are more or less inevitable.
The emotional thinking of victims tells them things such as :-
- It is over, there was a ‘final discard’ he will never contact me anyway;
- If she does text me, I won’t reply and that will wound her, so actually I am ‘winning’;
- There might be an emergency and therefore I cannot block him
Utter rubbish.
There is no such thing as a final discard. We will contact you, subject to the Hoover Trigger being activated and the Hoover Execution Criteria being met. If you do not block us, this is going to happen. You will be hoovered.
If you allow a text through, you are maintaining the emotional infection and you will suffer a surge in emotional thinking which may very well result in you responding and before you know it, you are not only providing fuel but you are being drawn back into the Formal Relationship. Months later you will ask ‘how the hell did that happen?’ Every text which arrives adds more and more to your emotional thinking until such time that you can no longer resist. Oh, I hear your protestations that you can resist but i have witnessed such resolve melt away. If you are playing Russian roulette and pull the trigger once and do not blow your brains out, you have survived. Pick the gun up again and again and again and eventually you will kill yourself. This is the similar effect of repeatedly engaging with us by allowing those texts through – you WILL succumb.
So what if there is an emergency? I know you are kind, decent and honest but we are no longer your concern in that respect. You need to remind yourself that you have no obligation towards us (of course our perspective will make us tell you differently) and therefore that False Suicide Power Play Hoover is not something you have to deal with. If you co-parent establish a mechanism whereby the narcissist e-mails routine communication to you. You tell the narcissist in advance that you will check the e-mails once a week at a set time and never deviate from this. This way you cater for communication regarding the children but only expose yourself once a week to potential hoovers. When the narcissist realises this is being done, see how the hoover attempts diminish. If you need a mechanism for emergency communication, tell the narcissist to contact a third party who will then contact you. Use this gate keeper.
3. Keeping our telephone number
You may say that you will not use it and therefore think that this is no contact, but once again, this is not no contact. With our number sat in your phone, even if you have changed the description to ‘Arsehole Number One’ , ‘Shit 4 Brains’ or ‘Narcopath’ you are creating problems :-
- You see the name and number and you are then reminding yourself of us and thus this is a form of Ever Presence ;
- You are leaving open a gateway. There will be an occasion when your emotional thinking surges and causes you to try to contact us. If our number if there you will use it and message us or ring us. If there is no number, you cannot call us.
Do not come up with the nonsense of ‘I have memorised the number so I will remember it anyway so what difference does it make if I keep the number in my phone?’ Bollocks. Your memory is fallible and over time if you have not used our number, you will eventually forget it altogether or at least get some numbers mixed up. If it is still in your directory, you will ring it.
Delete that number. Do it and do it immediately.
4. Talking to friends and family about us
You may think that because you are not engaging with us directly then this must mean no contact is in place. It is not in place if you continue to talk about us to your friends and your family. This is causing you to engage with us, albeit indirectly. All this does is result in :-
- You continuing to think about us with the consequential impact on your emotions;
- The continued feeding of the emotional infection which you should be purging, not feeding ;
- Allowing your emotional thinking to surge with the risk this may control you once again and you end up contacting us or succumbing to a direct hoover with all that follows from that
It is of course inevitable that you will discuss the situation with your family and friends especially when you do not understand what you are dealing with. However, once you realise you are dealing with a narcissist then there does not need to be any more discussion. If you are not sure whether the person is, do not discuss it with your family and friends, they invariably have no idea whether the person is or not, they have no expertise. Indeed, they may well be revelling in joining in the ‘narc hating’ sessions which are actually not helping you at all. Alternatively, they may well be sick of hearing you going on about him or her and want you to shut up, but tolerate it out of a sense of loyalty. If you are unsure, ask me and I will give it to you straight, one way or the other.
Once you know, you go.
No more debating it with your best friend. No more mulling it over with your football mates after the game in the pub. No more ‘ifs and buts’ discussions with your parents. This person is a narcissist and you are not to dedicate any time to discussing this person. If you have to discuss an arrangement concerning the narcissist because they are collecting the children from your parents, then that is allowable but keep it to that. You do not need to tell people what the narcissist did or said. All you are doing is repeating this person is a narcissist, you already know this, they already know this, so why keep going on about it?
You do it because your emotional thinking wants you to do so. It wants you poring over the latest misbehaviour because it craves the horrified gasps from your friends or looks of disapproval from your mother. You do not need these responses.
Do not talk about us. Explain to your friends you do not want the narcissist spoken about to you. If they try to do so, politely explain again that this person means nothing to you anymore and therefore there is no need to talk about them.
5. Watching what we are doing
You may make the intelligence agencies proud of your covert observation of us as you watch where we go, who we are with and what we are doing. You do not need to do this. Again, once you know what we are, get out and stay out. Yes, I understand it is so tempting to know what we are up to, are we seeing someone else, what does he or she look like, why are we going to these places but all you are doing is succumbing to your emotional thinking which is conning you into maintaining a link with us.
Your emotional thinking will tell you that it is permissible to engage in this behaviour because you are not contacting us directly, you are merely observing. These are examples of your emotional thinking conning you into thinking this stalking and observation is a good idea
- You are gathering evidence to tell other people what we are doing to confirm what you have told them previously (you do not need to – you know what we are, that is all you need, you do not have to persuade other people)
- You are gathering evidence for a court case (you do not have to do it – hire somebody to do this or if you cannot afford to do that, have a friend or family member do it – also question whether you really need to this evidence)
- You want to know who the narcissist is seeing so you can warn this person about us (part of your decent nature but unnecessary – you owe the new person no such obligation to warn then and in any event it is unlikely you will be believed because of the smearing we will have done against you)
- You just need to know for your own piece of mind (utter nonsense, you do not need to know at all)
Recognise these sleights of mind by your emotional thinking and act on them.
If you keep watching us, all you are doing is
- Creating harmful emotions that impact on you
- Keeping the emotional infection alive and growing
- Causing your emotional thinking to surge so you contact us directly
- Being spotted by us and suffering a hoover (benign or malign)
- Being spotted by us and being on the end of a restraining order or similar for harassment etc
These are just five examples of The Wrong No Contact. There are many more. Be alert for them, recognise them and understand why you are not implementing no contact. Stop letting your emotional thinking con you.
Once you know, you go.
Get out, stay out.
47 thoughts on “The Wrong No Contact”
Vent Your Spleen! (Please see the Rules in Formal Info)
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After I broke NC it feels like I gave him all my powers and the upper hand in the situation (again!) I am sure he thinks he «has me» and that is what it feels like, too.
I would like to take my powers back, but I find myself in the middle of an absent scilent treatment/ maybe disengagement from his part. How do I proceed?
Will NC at some point wound him, or will he just laugh it off now. Can you Please elaborate on how no contact is regained after a horrible breach, and how it effects the narc, when it is restored again, after it has been breached? Does the effect get reduced, then?
Will (repeated) breaches of NC lower the effect of a new implemented NC?
(Sorry for all the Qs… my head is spinning from ET these days)
You implement no contact straight away. You need not be concerned about its impact on the narcissist, your focus should be implementation and maintenance.
Ok, I will. Thank you!
Narcs are still people! If you don’t get too close and you know what they are and what to expect, you can have somewhat of a “relationship ” with them. Being forewarned is key! Thanks H.G.
I’m not judging, Marina. But when you do that, you are helping the Narc’s facade, and fueling them to abuse other people. Just because the Narc never hurt you, doesn’t mean they are not abusive.
Anm, so true. That is what I have been cutting off friendships with narcs. Even to the one who has been really nice to me so far.
Mommypino,
But if they are narcs, are they ever actually really nice to anyone? When I was first with my daughter’s father, I was on cloud 9. He had humor and charisma like many have never seen. He had this ability to walk into a restaurant or bar, and by the time he left, everyone knew who he was-liked him-and couldn’t wait to run into him again. He was all over the town we lived in. I would also have to yell at him while we were at dinner, because his phone was constantly ringing with his friends calling about the latest gossip or just trying to get some of his time. As time went on, his true colors started to show.
HE HATED EVERYONE!!!!!
After he would get off the phone with his adoring fans, he would make a vulgar comment about them immediately. Even after we would spend the weekend with his close friends or family, he would focus on their flaws and wish them the worst.
The worst was how he spoke about ex girlfriends, or even just women “friends”, it was with such disdain, I was also surprised when these women were around, even when they found out he was a narcissist/had anger problems.
They are all shit talkers and hateful, even the covert ones/mid rangers.
Anm, you brought up such a great point! That is actually one of the ‘red flags’ that I noticed to be consistently present with narcissists in my life—shit talking. They have contempt for everyone! My mom, a Lower Lesser constantly talked shit and made up shit about other people privately to me or even smearing them even just after visiting with those people like my favorite aunt and being treated so warmly and like a VIP by my aunt and sharing jokes with each other. My matrinarc would always notice something bad or read something bad about everything. My Mid-Range sister was the same. It always surprised me that after having dinner at her codependent bestfriend’s house where he just made an amazing steak dinner for us, she would make fun of him in the car to me and tell me gossips about him and his past relationships. My stepdaughters always talked shit about her friends to me and her dad even though they did everything together and acted like they were all that together. She judged them about their looks, behaviors, education and income level. That is why I know for sure that my dad was not a narc and my husband is not a narc even though both (was/is) highly confident and possess very dominant and strong personality because both of them would never spend any time charming someone that they despise (except to be civil if the situation didn’t give them a choice to avoid the person). And both of them were nice about the person in private to me as well as being nice to them while interacting with them. It was such a relief for me when I lived with my dad that he was so easy to read that if he acted like he liked someone, he really did even after that person is not around anymore. And if he was badmouthing someone to me in private and we see that person in public, my dad would try to hide and avoid that person but of that person sees us my dad would be polite and say hi and be in a hurry to leave. Thanks for pointing that out Anm.
I have been in contact, in fact today is his birthday and we’ve had some amusing little texts exchange. I was never in love with him and we only had a fling for a few weeks so I’m not emotionally invested. We were casual friends before the fling, and although I found him obnoxious, I still kind of get a kick out of him. He made me laugh today with a witty text, and I am not angry with him nor am I pining for him. I simply wish him well.
Guilty occifer!
I haven’t blocked his number, because, well, in all honesty, my thinking was this…
If I blocked him and then we had a referendum, resulting in us NOT leaving the EU afterall – he’ll want to text to brag about ‘being on the right voting side all along’. And quite frankly, I need that in my life.
Meanwhile…
Chewy is conquering all the Empaths and saving all their delicious fuel for himself. And while the rest of the narcs are being made redundant in the shadows due to the corruption of mass destruction on a world wide scale – he knows that the disturbing revelations of his inside knowledge have almost destroyed the Empath’s already fading Hearts.
Will Chewy defeat the Emotional Empire? Will the Empath’s internal monologues convince them to future fake themselves? Will Narc Angel’s lips get too puffy from sucking too much Elite ass?
POW! SHAZZAZ! KERPLUNK! SCRABBLE :/
To be continued…
Haha, you’re cute. I can see by your pic that you’re just upset that some Lesser’s ass left you hanging. Say hi to Aunt Clara for me.
Ooh, resulting to bullying on the physical appearance of someone. Tsk.
Sorry, I have no idea what you mean by aunt Clara.
Sarah Jane
There’s no bullying about appearance. It’s just that you accused me of kissing ass but you’re the one puckered up in your pic.
Yes there was. You suggested, because of the way I look that I could only ‘bag’ a Lesser. Presumably because (to you) I look like a thick air-head whose opinion is invalid.
I made that particular pose to take the piss out of the popular ‘duck face’ selfies that are going around – but then you know nothing about me.
If you can’t handle a bit of light-hearted banter, I’ll leave it at that.
Teehee!
Sarah Jane (aka Aunt Claira),
Bullying on physical appearance vs bullying to cause a reaction. Not all empaths think it’s wrong to fight fire with fire.
Your projection reminded me of a narcissist I once knew
I’m not here so other supposed empaths can ‘guess’ what I am. Granted, you may have more knowledge than I do about the topics brought up on this site, but as I’ll say, again, I was just pointing out that everyone’s opinion should be valid here – whatever they’re going through. And to have several members jump on me for that is just weird.
I will help you.
If you express an opinion which other people do not agree with, guess what, they will express their opinion about your opinion. As you point out, they should all be valid should they not as opinions.
It occasionally happens that someone believes that they should be allowed to write what they want but nobody is allowed to disagree with them.
Further, the manner of your opinion invariably has a direct consequence on the manner of the opinion that is expressed about your opinion.
Thank you. Understood.
Maybe I get that ‘arsehole’ approach from my dad’s side, as that’s how he treated me. I hate attention being on me as a whole, so I’ll just fuck off back to in my corner and think about what I’ve done.
You are welcome. It is to your credit that you take on board the dynamic. Everybody is welcome here and I very rarely delete comments, I let most through and as long as people know this is an emotive topic, that strong opinions are shared (and expect to have them articulated about your own opinion) and that you can be forceful but do so in a constructive and considered manner, then all is good. Oh and that I am the boss.
Yes, I realise this.
You are the boss, Mr Tudor.
That just sent a shiver down my spine.
Sarah Jane
You do not have to retreat into a corner. Why this ‘poor me’ attitude? Own your part in the uproar you caused and then continue to share if you feel like it or if you need help and support in whatever you are currently going through. In between your insulting and, quite frankly, bewildering comments there are other posts of yours that are interesting, intelligently written and might open up for interesting exchanges. If you hate attention being on you, then don’t choose to post remarks that are disrespectful and insulting towards other readers without any cause or reason. It is extremely contradictory to provoke the very thing one claims to hate so much. It speaks for you that you are tolerant of readers’ forceful counterstrikes in response to your comments – but that still doesn’t explain or excuse your ‘out of the blue’ ‘arsehole’ behaviour against other readers, such as the comment against NA.
Hello Saskia,
Thank you for taking the time to air your thoughts. I had no right to spurt out insulting comments towards the people who have been here a long time and are obviously valuable contributors to this amazing site of answers and debate.
The corner thing was just in jest. I do the self-pity thing alone, in my own world. It’s the after-affects of anxiety and depression.
Other than my mother and siblings, I’ve never known any other empaths in my life is all – so I welcome your warmth.
Hello Sarah Jane,
Thank you for your reply and you are welcome. To be honest, I don’t care about whether someone is a longstanding reader or ‘valuable contributor’ or not in that regard. That being said, I noticed you standing up for another contributor and agree with another reader’s comment – I understood the essence of what you were saying and what you were stating had value, it was the insults that accompanied that remark that triggered some vulnerabilities.
Have a nice weekend.
Have a nice weekend too, Saskia.
“Further, the manner of your opinion invariably has a direct consequence on the manner of the opinion that is expressed about your opinion.”
I agree with this…
SJ, I am usually pretty careful how I speak mostly because I’m sensitive to response styles and I know there is direct correlation often. I think people detect sensitivity from how I am talking and when they disagree with me they are usually respectful and I do care very much to hear what they are saying, so it works. I’m still waiting for someone to post “Go to hell, Nunya Biz, stupid narc”, but it hasn’t happened since people can probably tell I’ll cry about it : P
I have my opinions though and like to say them and I can get more forward in my moods as well (which I usually regret). AS it happens your posting style has made me nervous about getting called out as you did Narc Angel.
I personally can’t tell if you are an empath or not, but I suspect you are. Despite what all I said above, my supernova mode looks probably worse than most of what you’ve said once someone has gone into noman’s land with me. I’m not all pussycat for sure but I try to keep that part at bay. I hope you are finding a way to feeling well. I mean that sincerely. I’m working there myself.
Nunya Biz, your opinions have always been stated in a respectful way. I’d be stunned if someone told you to go to hell!
Hi Nunya Biz,
Only just spotted this as it says it was a reply for Mercy and it didn’t show up in my WordPress.
Your comments are right – my responses were out of order and I’ve apologised for them.
Sometimes I do wonder myself, because I have some narcissistic traits. My dad is a narc but my mom is very self-less and loving towards me, my brother and my sister. I admit I’ve been fucked up by my MMR and I’m bitter but slowly coming to terms with the fact not everyone is genuinely nice underneath.
Love your comment, Saskia.
Ha, I know mercy! And the commenters are classy and thoughtful with a fun dash of raunch and morbid, which is all great influence for me. But heh, I get moody in multiple directions. Plus I have a strong tendency to flip things around in my head, but I mostly enjoy it and I’m learning things : )
Venting my spleen!
Yeah, SJ, I could sense that as a possible explanation and like saskia I’ve seen you express empathy as well. It’s hard to miss.
I have felt that hatred in ways that people might be surprised. Especially in coming to terms with what you say. We can feel outnumbered, so fuck it, I’ll go down with blood in my mouth, lol. I still try to fight in my own way, but HG helps with a little peace that I can’t have when I descend so hard, and being passionate I can go down far. I had almost ended up in the hospital trying to face some of it. That’s how I came here. The best thing here for me is the organization that makes sense for me of why some things I’m told are wrong by others don’t make sense. That I can be narcissistic and empathic. The empathy can’t be removed, no matter what you do.
It makes the painful things difficult, but at least we can get a little control with confirmation and validation. I’ve been with several narcs, 2 narc parents, a violent (and dumb) lesser who had my dad’s blessing, boring mmr, and platonic things since high school on.
Thank you for your thoughts, I hope you keep posting.
Oh and I’m so glad your mom is nice : )
NarcAngel, haha I’m so glad you are you.
Sarah Jane, You may be dealing with some serious issues and taking them out on others, but keep your ridiculous comments to yourself. A lot of people here are actually suffering from real abuse and do not need more hostility from you.
NarcAngel certainly does not need me to come to her defense as she is one of the strongest women here. But, she is here to help others and shows appreciation. You could learn much from her.
Thank you, Enough BS.
I am, yes. And I apologise for my behaviour.
Noted and appreciated as is your honesty about your father.
Hi HG,
Loved this!! And it made me feel proud as I when I implemented no contact I changed my email and phone number. Deleted the social media account I used and I’m not using that platform under a different name either.
I was in no contact for a year prior. I deleted his number and removed anything in my life that was a reminder of him. I was certain he’d never contact me (I can hear you chuckling at this).
I remember thinking one day, I should have blocked him. But as I’d deleted his number (and I even bought a new phone as part of the no contact so it was never on my new device – a symbol of a’fresh beginning’) I left myself open to a Hoover.
He messaged one night , almost a day to the exact year I shut him off.
What ensued next was the worst triangulation imaginable- mind games galore and a silent treatment after a barrage of hurtful comments. I was crushed. I felt I’d never recover this time. Then I got angry – and I knew I needed a clean slate. I cancelled my email – even choosing a new provider. New phone number was next.
I am 9 months into this peaceful freedom. If he chooses to contact me in the future he will get an undeliverable message from the email, and at best – a ‘check your digits – wrong number’ as a text, from whoever has my previous phone number. (Apparently your old number is reassigned after 6-12 months). I was told that when I changed it.
Either way, I won’t know, and I’m grateful. It’s easy when you know you haven’t left yourself open. Although I will never forget – as you always remind us – There’s no final discard. But I’m laying ver low and made it exceptionally difficult to be found. We live with a huge distance between us which helps too. There’s no third parties I need to be wary of. I got out. I’m staying out.
Thanks HG. Love to all the other ‘Tudes who come here too. Power in numbers. Power in sharing. We are strong. We are educated. X
Well done and you are welcome.
#1 Yes, I have been guilty of the Wrong No Contact, especially #1 and #5. He’s not on social media but his (or one of his) IPSSs (or is she an IPSS now?) is on social media, and sometimes I look to see if she’s posted anything so I can tell the status of their relationship (I know the Initial Golden Period is over for a fact).
#5 We still have some alimony-like financial ties, so I can tell what he’s doing that way. I try not to look, but once in a while I peek.
As for #2 and #3, I MUST have his phone number on my phone; otherwise I cannot block him. However, I have blocked him for sure, and it’s wonderful. When I get a call or a text, my heart does not drop, because I am 100% sure it is NOT him. We*have* had to correspond via email (alimony-like reasons) and I can tell that he tried to text me the answer instead (a habit of his) and was frustrated that I wasn’t replying via text. In other words, he could tell that I blocked him and he was not happy.
#4 I’ve been pretty much not talking about him anymore. Sometimes I say, “Oh, yes, Narc did that, too,” to a friend who might be having some romantic trouble. But I don’t reach out to anyone to cry on shoulders or to complain.
I am alone right now. I am accepting it. Hell, I am appreciating it!
HG you are absolutely right but you already know that! I’ve gone completely NC as far as social media and I changed my phone number. Today my hurt has transformed into anger and that’s not good either! I guess it will just take time because there are 3 of them which was a span of 23 years not at once. They each did me dirty with no regard to my feelings and that pisses me off!!!
I love this, and GOSO and also the four Golden Rules of Freedom. They are so helpful and very much The best antidote for emotional thinking. Please, do make more, HG!
Hi HG,
Is the narc surprised that you’ve finally implemented no contact. I was discarded a bunch of times. After the last time I found your site and implemented a strict no contact policy by blocking on everything. I did this because mainly of your site and the advice given plus I also noticed after about 4 months I was unblock on social media so I immediately Blocked back. It’s been around 2 years. I also stop hanging out in the places I used to mainly because the last time I was discarded she new everything I was doing. I guess my question is do they realise what has happened and does it surprise them that the victim actually escaped. How do they feel about it?
Thank you
Hello Gareth, please see the articles How No Contact Feels – Parts One to Three
Again, knowledge is power
Sir, can you initiate a poll of how many times victims broke their no contact before finally being completely done and out (inasmuch as such is possible)? Thank you.
The problem with this is that people think they are maintaining no contact when they are not, so it will mean different things to different people.