Putting A Sex On You

PUTTING A SEX ON YOU

I was in session with Dr E.

“So,” I asked, “what is today’s topic for discussion?”

“Sex,” he replied.

“Do I have to talk about this with you?”

He pushed his spectacles back.

“You do not have to talk about anything, but I would hope you would discuss this with me.”

“Can’t I talk to Dr O about sex?”

“Why? Are you uncomfortable discussing sex with another man?” he asked. I could see he had his pen poised ready to make a note.

“Not at all. Sorry, doctor but there is no homophobia about me.”

“What makes you say that?”

“Well you were about to suggest that my reluctance to discuss matters of sex with you denotes a homophobic trait on my part.”

“Not at all, that would be prejudging you and an unsafe basis for analysis.”

“I don’t believe you,” I replied.

“Why would you rather discuss sex with Dr O?” he asked. He showed no sign of irritation or disappointment at my preference.

“I would be interested to learn her views about sex. She is so pristine and clinical when I see her, I want to know what goes on under the bonnet.”

“These sessions are about you not us,” said Dr E.

“Don’t worry Dr E I have no interest in whether you apply nettles to your scrotum or whatever it is you do to excite yourself.”

“Is that something you have done?” he asked.

“No but I have used them on someone else.”

“Male or female?”

“Female.”

“Why?”

“The stinging sensation across the nipples or the inner thighs of course hurts but then that gives way to a delicious flood of pleasure when combined with the application of my tongue.”

Dr E was scribbling.

“I see, so you enjoy the fact it hurts the other person and then becomes pleasurable for her?”

“No.”

“Please do expand.”

“Will I get to talk about sex with Dr O?” I asked, shifting topic.

“On some aspects of sex, yes,” replied Dr E. I smiled.

“Good. Very well since that is going to happen and I will hold you to that promise Dr E, I will expand on my point.”

“I do it because the issue of that person’s pain and then pleasure is entirely at my gift. I control it and that appeals to me considerably.”

“So control in an sexual encounter is important to you?” asked Dr E.

“Control is the sexual encounter for me. I have little interest in my own sexual gratification, yes it feels pleasant when I orgasm but ultimately I can do that myself and invariably with more intense results. I have even less interest in the sexual gratification of another person. Denying them that sexual gratification? Now that is far more enjoyable than granting them their release. Sex is all about control. I am highly skilled in between the sheets.”

“Is that your conclusion or of others?”

“Both. You see I know how people think, I know how they react and I have had many sexual encounters with many different people. There are vast numbers of different permutations when it comes to what satisfies a person and no two people are the same.  I am like a super computer. I can rattle through the various combinations until I hit the right approach which will send my bedroom companion into orbit. I am willing to apply every part of my body, every facet of my sexual knowledge in order to make that person feel utterly orgasmic. That gives me huge control over them and makes me very powerful. I know what turns them on, what makes them moan and scream and shudder in orgasmic bliss. I use this massively powerful ability of mine to bring them under my spell. Once that is done I will grant it and deny it as and when I see fit. I will purposefully do the things that does not arouse them in order to make them react. I will caress a partner in a public place and whisper in their ear that if they show any kind of reaction to what I am doing I will stop and deny them any sexual congress for an indefinite period. This gives them an earth shattering orgasm and underlines my control over them. I will interrupt a row with a girlfriend by taking her against the kitchen workbench. She soon forgets what the argument was about as I have her moaning in delight before I just walk off before she climaxes. Imagine how she follows me about the house begging for me to “finish her off”? Think of the promises she makes just to feel me inside her again? That is control. That is power. I work out a person’s sexual key code and deliver heaven. They find that addictive and want it so much. I find the power attached to this ability addictive. When you go to bed with me you are getting the best. Nobody afterwards will come close to what I give you.”

There was a long pause as Dr E jotted down my words. He looked a little flustered to me. I wished it was Dr O sat there instead.

“Do you think a sexual encounter should be about something other than control?”

I laughed at this comment,

“Heavens no, that is its only function. It is an instrument, like so many other things, to bring you under my spell, but I must admit, it is probably one of the most potent and effective instruments. Sex is actually rather boring but controlling the reaction and emotions of another person, well, now that is far more interesting.”

“Have you ever wondered what it would be like to give up that control and allow yourself to be enveloped in the ‘moment’ with the other person?” asked Dr E.

“No I cannot give up control. You see, I know there are those that engage in being tied up and punished, you know smacked with an open hand or a cane. They may get a sexual reaction from being treated like this but the real reason they do it is that they are giving up control. I had a girlfriend who was very submissive and allowed me to do…well I will let you use your imagination there doctor, but she wanted zero control. She was high up in a bank and responsible for millions of pounds and hundreds of employees and she wanted to be divested of that responsibility and give up her control if only for an hour or two. I found her explanation interesting but I could not understand it. Why give up control? Why surrender something you have worked hard to achieve? Control is the ultimate aim of taking someone to bed. I control them in that bed and the spell I put on them means that control extends far beyond the bedroom, such is its power.”

Dr E nodded and continued writing.

“What if you lost your sexual potency? What if you became impotent?” he asked.

“Why would that happen?”

“Plenty of reasons. Alcohol abuse, substance abuse, diabetes, age, anxiety. There are many reasons why this could happen.”

I shook my head.

“People like me don’t suffer that. God gave me the gift of sexual brilliance to further my purposes, He would not take it away from me.”

“But if it did happen, what would you do? How would you manage with such a loss of this marvellous instrument of control?”

“Are you taking the piss now doctor?” I snapped.

“Not at all. Just posing a relevant question aligned to your desire for control.”

“Listen doctor, don’t project your problems in that department onto me, okay?”

Dr E remained silent. I copied him an just sat in silence glaring at him. How dare he suggest I would lose my potency? What an idiot. He ought to know better than that by now. I kept staring at him waiting for his next clever remark but he just stared back. This stand-off went on for a few minutes but I knew he would look away first. I maintained my baleful gaze as the fury at his impertinence coursed through me and then he lowered his eyes to his black and red notepad and made some more notes. I had won.

“Not so cocky now are we doctor?” I muttered under my breath.

Learn more about the narcissist’s view of sex in the ground-breaking book available here

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543 Comments

  1. G’ Day STBS:)! I am born overseas but I call Australia home:) I love Mardi Gras because of the incredible spirit 🙂! I am an extrovert and I used to be a party animal 😂. And when my heart was broken last year, before I met Narc 2, a very sweet gay man wiped my tears and gave me the moral support I needed. Sexpo is trashy, I saw some photos and it was enough for me to lose any interest to visit. So you are no not alone 🙂.

    1. G’day mate (Claire)!

      I’m south to you, but out in the countryside 🤗

      Lovely to know there is another from Oz! Shame the circumstances are…well…such as they are.

      I can see that the Mardi Gras would be wonderful for an outgoing girl! Not me I’m afraid! A bookworm with tastes running to quiet views, roaring fires and as much quiet as possible.

      A tear wiped away from a gay man! What a sweet and touching experience!

      And yeah….NO WAY to Sexpo! Not in this lifetime! Haha

      Xo

        1. Absolutely! And these guys can give you a better insight and better advice. Sometimes you need just to open up without any judgement, like “ I told you so “ What the hell you were expected” , etc.

      1. I love the country people, STBS🙂! I deal with them on a daily basis due to my work. They are nice and down to earth , hardworking people.
        This blog is the best! You are going to learn a lot from the best teacher about narcissism, no one can compare to HG!

        Indeed it was a blessing to meet this gay man – the right person in the right time! God bless him!

        1. Me too Claire! Aussies are a wonderful bunch! Especially the country people! Nothing but warm welcomes and open arms to all!

          I couldn’t agree more about the blog. It’s become my happy place!
          I get excited every day to see what’s new. Always something new to learn and enjoy or bristle at!

          Haha! I had to read your last paragraph twice! I thought you meant HG! Hahaha!!

          But yes! A kind moment with a sweet stranger just lights everything up! That’s why it’s important to always be good to people so we can light them up too ❤️

          1. STBS, although our awesome HG doesn’t believe in God, he is included in my prayers. Thanks to HG my inner peace finally was restored ( I divorced a Narc and then kicked out of my life another Narc) and now I feel much stronger.
            “That’s why it’s important to always be good to people so we can light them up too ❤️“

            I couldn’t agree more with you🙂❤️!

            Xo

          2. Hi Claire,

            It’s nice that you pray for him!

            His information is extraordinary! It’s good to hear that you found peace here. ❤️

            I’m still working on peace. But I’m well on my way.

            May all sufferers eventually find their way to this place! I’ll pray for that tonight and hope that it’s heard. Xo

  2. Well, there you have it: just put “Sex” in the title and you end up with almost 500 (and counting) comments.

      1. Perverts?!!

        Sex is natural, sex is good
        Not everybody does it
        But everybody should
        -George Michael, who may have drank himself to death

        1. Sex is best when its 1 on 1
          I love that song, there was so much controversy when that song came out.
          Love that album one of my favourites George Michael RIP ! Agapie mou !

          1. True HG , we just love this topic ,especially the book Sex and the Narcissist. Now I I know what goes in that mind of yours my dear. Ummmmm interesting.

          2. At this juncture, you know about 25% of what goes on in my mind. If you have read all of my work so far.

      2. Oh, I know right?!

        I still haven’t experienced a narcissist or psychopath that could rock my sexual world lol.

        How boring lmao.

  3. HG,

    What happens to a Mid Range narc when they become impotent? What happens if a IPPS insults him about it ?

  4. Hi again Witch,

    Trust , you would accept some brief comments. This is only my view so it is subjective🙂
    “Women have more orgasms in lesbian relationships because women are more e sensual and focus more on the clit.“

    A woman cannot give me what a man can. I am attracted only to the opposite gender and I have no desire whatsoever nor any curiosity to be intimate with a woman. Some guys are very sensual as well.
    Each to their own:).

    “A lot of men think that once they ejaculate sex is finished.” This is due to their physiology and the hormones released during/after climax.

    “Women require more of a build up towards penetration because we need time for our vaginas to get moist and relax.” Agree

    “I also read a survey which reported that most of the guys who took part expressed disinterest in a woman’s pleasure if they were not in committed relationship.”
    In general, a non committed relationship is unhealthy one so no surprise from the result of that survey.
    On the other hand, if there is great chemistry even ONS could be a memorable experience, trust me 😉. Some guys are very keen to please and what 2 ladies do between the sheets is just a part of the foreplay with the guys .
    They are eager to give a lot without being asked.
    My 2 cents.

    Cheers

    1. Hi Clare,

      I was not suggesting that you need to sleep with a woman especially if it goes against your natural instincts. I’m sorry if it came across like I was trying to pressure you into something you have no interest in.
      I mentioned that women report receiving more orgasms in lesbian relationships than het relationships, only to evidence my stance that women should not fall for these pathetic excuses and continue to accept less than what they deserve.
      I find that a lot of women especially women in their 20’s express disappointment with sex or a lack of interest in sex for their own pleasure and a lot of the time it’s because they continue to come across guys who are disinterested in their pleasure.
      I’ve even had a woman tell me that she mentioned to her husband that she has never had an orgasm and he said “that’s okay I don’t mind”
      LMAO!!! WOW!
      Of course there are exceptions to the rule. But there is also a noticeable pattern.

      1. Don’t worry Witch🙂, you don’t have to apologise🙂, nor I feel any pressure from your side . You are free to except your opinion on the topic and I respect it🙂.
        I have a younger friend overseas, she is a lesbian and we were very closed, like sisters . We fully communicated, accepted and respected each other’ s sexual preferences.
        My heart sank in few occasions when her heart was broken by unscrupulous girls ( straight and bi ) as she is a fantastic person and didn’t deserve it.
        So regardless of one’s preferences in a healthy intimate relationship both individuals should cherish their partners. If one blatantly ignore ( like the lady’s husband you mentioned above) other’s needs or forcing them to experience something that they are not comfortable with ( you name it ) then it is not a healthy alliance.

        My 2 cents :)

        1. Yes I agree.
          I’m sorry to hear about your friend. I would encourage her to self reflect as to why she may be primarily attracted to emotionally unavailable people.
          If a woman told me she was straight, I may still sleep with her but I wouldn’t take it seriously, I would keep my expectations low low low.
          It’s one thing being attracted to the same sex and it is quite another to be willing to face homophobia as a consequence of having a committed gay relationship. Many bisexuals do not want to deal with the consequences of their same sex attraction. Most will end up in long term het relationships, partly because the dating pool is much larger and partly because it is socially safer to do so. I have empathy for that. But at the same time I expect people to have the decency to be honest and not to lead others on.
          Lesbian marriages have higher divorce rates than gay male marriages. I would love to find a survey for the reasons why.
          I think women can be more prone to bickering over minor things and I think generally speaking men probably have lower expectations because they are not as taken in by unrealistic fluffy BS such as “soul mates” and “meant to be.”

          1. Hi Witch,
            My friend is an empath and she was conned in the past from the girls in the same manner like some gold diggers con some men . She is very smart, has a PhD, very generous and open person. She is from a well off family and she looks as a cute boy, it so so rare to see a woman with a very short hair looking terrific and without any make up.
            No wonder she was played by some women.But no longer – she is still single but more cautious and doesn’t allow anymore to be exploited.
            In many European countries the gay marriage are still illegal.
            In Australia they become legal last year.

          2. P. S. Off topic – you and your fiancée should come to Sydney for our famous Mardi Gras. It is a marvellous spectacle- fabulous costumes, music and lighting. I love it❤️! People are very friendly, the City is transformed into a giant disco club, the vibe, the spirit 👍🏻. And the so hot gay boys – an unbiased remark from the straight girl😉.

          3. Hi Claire,

            A fellow Aussie!! 🙂

            Your Mardi Gras are indeed a spectacle!

            I was invited to Sexpo this year and I had to refuse! The overt sexuality of Sexpo and Mardi Gras intimidates the life out of me.

            I’m so private sexually, I think I’d go into cardiac arrest being at those type of events. Mind you, I’ve only ever been to a nightclub twice so that’s saying something about my lines of entertainment!

            Nice to have a neighbour here 🙂

          4. “Many bisexuals do not want to deal with the consequences of their same sex attraction.” This is true, but I think it’s mainly because most bisexuals (I prefer sexually fluid) are stigmatized both from the heterosexual community and the LGBTQ one. As for the orgasms, I think a woman should have a right to express her preferences and obtain as many orgasms as she wants (together with a room of her own). It is true in my personal experience that women are more willing to care about another woman’s pleasure. Although some of my male partners have been extraordinary good at that too, my husband for example. So we can’t generalize.

          5. Sweetest—the entire sexual identity thing is indeed wildly variable and I hate terms. I don’t identify as anything except heterosexual and absolutely prefer men. I do get sick of how uptight some (many) people are about women being together. It’s viewed as quite risqué and it irks me because it’s not nearly risqué compared to some of the crap I’ve done with men. (No chandeliers yet either..) People are dumb. If I want to sleep with a woman then so be it or a man so be it.

          6. I know this is not true for all women that identify as bisexual, but in my case, I married a man because I fell in love with him. This the prefix “bi.” Many LGBTQ people criticize this and many heterosexuals wonder how you can define yourself as bi if you are in a heterosexual relationship. The relationship looks heterosexual, but I am still not. And that is who I am, regardless of who I decided to date or marry. There are also many bisexuals that have never had the luck of dating a person of their same sex despite knowing they feel attracted to them. Life is unpredictable.

          7. Hi SP,
            Of course you are still bisexual no matter who you are with.
            There are more closeted “heterosexuals” that are actually bisexual than people care to admit.
            I remember several years ago talking to a woman on here, who was so shocked that her narc ex ended up with a man, she couldn’t get over it or let it go. I was honey he likes the D, get over it!

          8. Witch, as soon as I told my narc I’m bi, he decided to act even more bi than me, everything is a competition. He told me he had had sex with men, which I honestly don’t care about, and he even showed up wearing panties on one of our encounters, which I honestly didn’t care about either because I was focused on his abs and biceps. He liked to fantasize about wearing makeup sometimes and I am such an idiot that I thought maybe I could help him express his inner self. I didn’t know he doesn’t have an inner self. He did that because he wanted to suck all aspects of my identity, including my sexuality.

          9. @SP

            I was trying to get one of the narcs to admit he was bi lol
            He told me that one of his guy friends went down on him when they were both drunk and high, and he tried to blame it on the fact that he was intoxicated and his friend “took advantage of him.”
            He also said he asked a boy in high school to touch to him lol
            When I went into his room he has a whole book series titled “bisexuality and aids” and I said “so you have a lot of books about being bisexual” and he was dead silent, he heard what I said but didn’t respond.
            He also let me finger his batty hole.

          10. Well well well… let me tell you that the last sentence is not an evidence of anything as many heterosexual men also find pleasure in that. But yes you’re right, some people find it very difficult to admit their bisexuality. I don’t know why so many people blame it on alcohol, either, starting with Katy Perry! “I got so brave drink in hand / Lost my discretion.” Yes yes, but you liked it!

        2. Hi Claire,
          Your friend sounds fantastic. I love a hot tomboi. I hope she finds someone special.
          Thanks for the holiday suggestion.
          We are going to Morocco in May and saving up for our wedding. We want a party (I’ve never had a party) and parties are expensive, but maybe one day we will get to see Australia

          1. Wow, a trip to Morocco sounds very exiting, Witch🙂👍🏻! Yep, parties are expensive. I agree, better have a memorable party on your wedding day🙂.

  5. @not me
    The narcissist world is a very strange world indeed. But it’s important that we continue to learn about what we are dealing with so we have the right tools to protect ourselves.
    You don’t need to stop being empathetic or open minded, you just need to learn how to recognise the narcs early so you can avoid them and concentrate on the people who are worth while.

  6. FYC, “Every time you make a choice, you create a path to a belief”. This is why I value your advice so much. In order to understand, I have to be able to see a visual direction in my mind. This makes sense to me. It’s like what MB was talking about on another thread. I believe she called it thought block. I did that and still do it order to redirect my thoughts. In my mind when I would have a thought of the narcissist I would shut the door on the thought or the vision of him (it’s actually a window with shutters). It became habit and I hardly think about it now when I do it.

    Work is good. I actually enjoy my job. The situation that we talked about before is still there but I can not change it. On a positive note my boss has set me up to take the classes I need so I feel like I was heard when I had the conversation with him. I will do what makes me happy. At least I do not feel like I’m stuck in a situation that I don’t want to be in. I do have options! How have you been?

    1. I am happy for your progress Mercy, but not surprised. In life you have options at every turn. It is freeing to rewrite your internal ‘sound track’ to one that maps to your own beliefs. All your choices in thought and action from this point forward can be conscious ones. Should you later decide to change course, that right is reserved.

      Do let me know how your classes go. I hope they grow your opportunities. I sense you have much to give and more to claim in your future and I am cheering you on.

      As for me, I have had some challenges of late with a familial N, but today I am listening to Zero Impact, and although I am only half way through, my mind is blown. Unbelievable. To say that this package is intelligent, insightful, packed with epiphanies and actionable advice would be an understatement. I highly recommend Zero Impact to any empath regardless of perceived need. So, I guess, all in all, I am feeling great today! Onward and upward. Thank you for asking.

      1. FYC, I am sorry to hear that but glad you are doing better today. I am very interested in zero impact. Maybe it’ll be a Christmas present to myself. I have heard you talk about your N family members. Do you mind if I ask how they are able to pull you in? I’ve been wanting to ask about your background but don’t want to intrude if it’s too personal.

        I will definitely let you know about the classes. I feel like it’s a win against my previous narc boss and it’s given me a new respect for my current boss that he is making it right. Thank you for the encouragement you gave me to talk to him about my concerns.

        1. Mercy, you are very kind and very welcome. You have so much to offer. Now that the N boss is out of the picture you can shine. Just remember to keep your internal stake holders aware of your ideas and progress as it relates to them. That way, next promotion that arises, you will be top of mind and recommended. As for my family, I was very low contact but an unexpected health event has changed that for a period of time.

          Zero Impact exceeded any expectations. In fact, I think HG soft sells it. Zero Impact is more necessary than he describes for all empaths, and more powerful In ways I had not anticipated. Excellent audio delivered passionately too. I highly recommend it.

          1. FYC, I am glad zero impact is working for you. I have one last hurdle to overcome. (which I will consult with HG about) and then I’m ready to purchase the package. I want out! Mind, body and soul!!

            Know that I’m thinking of you and wish you well with your struggles. You have been most kind and have helped me a great deal this last year. Talk to you soon ❤️

          2. Thank you for your kindness Mercy💞 I believe you will one day be 100% free. HG and Zero Impact will get you there. And very soon, you will never again feel any doubt about your worth. You will know you are worth everything.

  7. Since this article is sexual is nature, I do have a question you may be able to help with, please HG?

    Can anyone else please tell me if they can relate too?

    Since being sexual with my lover narc (in an affair) who I haven’t seen in 8 months…I can’t orgasm unless I think of him.

    It does not matter if I’m alone or with my partner, I just can’t, unless I’m thinking of him.

    Is this common? And does it lesson over time?

    1. It is not common, but not unheard of. It is a product of emotional thinking causing you to link the individual with the sensation of orgasm and convincing you that you cannot orgasm to anything other than thinking of him. Reducing your emotional thinking will release its grip on this aspect of your life.

      1. I do know that you are correct HG.

        Mental bonds with me are stronger than anything physical.

        However, how does one just change their thought processes? It makes me who I am, doesn’t it?

        Can an empathetic person genuinely change who they are or how they think under any circumstances?

        Can people change, genuinely? Ever?

        1. Organise a consultation and I’ll explain how. You don’t change who you are, you cannot. You change how you behave to accommodate who you are in a more constructive and effective fashion.

          1. Thanks, HG.

            I do realise that I am stuck in the netherworld of all this.

            I keep thinking that I’ve come so far that I’ll get through it without needing help and then I just keep hitting new brick walls.

            I will arrange another consultation with you when I can find the time alone. I don’t know when, but yes, I can see that I don’t seem to be making much progress on my own.

            You are up late!

          2. Well done for realising that you are stuck, it is important to be able to recognise that. Whether you arrange a consultation is of course entirely upto you, but the longer you delay, the harder it becomes.

        2. Oh. I feel for you. I really do.

          Echoing HG, its unusual. In fact I think this is the first time I’ve come across it. Not being able to orgasm with a partner is fairly common but in this instance, you’ve pinned down a reason.

          I’ve been sat here thinking about how I can help you. All I can do is to say what I feel when I’m having sex. Fact is, I dont think of anything at all. This might be why I enjoy the act so much; it’s a break from my brain.

          Women are so fabulous. It’s such a shame I’m straight. I percieve that when we are in the moment that there is nothing else. No thoughts. Emotions yes. And contagion.

          It’s clear you’re an Empath. Actually I find it very surprising you can think yourself to orgasm. Many years ago, I could do that but not now. And yes, I was with the big narc.

          It could just be as simple as the fact your body recognises that you are literally sleeping with the enemy and reacts accordingly. When we are in that moment we are very vulnerable.

          I recommend a consult to remove some of the ET. I hope you are now away fro. The narc but if you’re not, I’m not judging. I know it’s hard. I’m always here.

          1. Hi Renarde,

            I am deeply ‘in my head’ sexually.
            I am not often visually aroused. I am all audio and thoughts.

            If I hear something that I find arousing or think of anything I find arousing, then that’s my on switch.

            I can’t think my way to orgasm without touch though.

            I am well away from the narc but he did make a Hoover attempt today. I will never see him or speak to him again. That is certain to me. I don’t want to because he’s poison for me.

            I don’t want to be thinking of him at all anymore, especially sexually. When I need to achieve though, it seems to be the only thing that now works.

            Maybe I subconsciously like abuse?
            I have to wonder. And if that’s right, then I am a bit of a freak, I think.

          2. No. Your emotional thinking makes you believe that you like abuse.

            I will make is very clear what you need to do.

            You are an addict. Your ET makes you feed your addiction. You need to learn to reduce and manage your ET. That is why you need to arrange a consultation.

          3. I am addicted HG. Completely.

            Also, in awe of.

            It’s fascinating and intoxicating to me.

            Can that be altered?

          4. STBS

            Well done on resisting the Hoover! Excellent work. Be proud of yourself!

            You’re not a freak lovely. Or if you are, I am too and I dont want to be a freak.

            I find it fascinating how you view your own sexuality. Please do keep on posting if it helps you. I must admit I have now a prurient interest in your sex life!

            I must ask though, how did the Hoover get through?

          5. Hi Renarde,

            I don’t know if I resisted the Hoover well at all. It was via a mutual friend who I don’t speak with often. She called me and I had a strange sense that I shouldn’t talk to her. So I didn’t answer. She kept calling and calling, which is out of place for our friendship. I kept brushing it off and I texted her that I am very busy and would call back when I could. She ignored that and keep calling and calling. So I worried that it must be important. I answered and it was the narc show. “Oh poor such and such, he’s so depressed, he’s so lonely, he’s aged years since you left work, he’s looking terrible, he’s so miserable”, then wants to know all about my life and every little detail about my plans. It’s only odd, because we don’t have a relationship that is so close and it was all about the narc and then an information bonanza about myself. I just chatted away and didn’t think about it much, until afterwards and I realised that I had given much more information about myself than I should have and now I’m worried as I understood clearly that every word I said was going straight back to narc.

            I can’t say for certain that she was encouraged to make that call with me, but my senses are going off the charts about it. I should never have taken that call.

            I have stopped seeing her and all our mutual friends and have rejected all social plans with her and others, citing excuses about called in to work unexpectedly etc, but because she just would not stop calling, I let my worry override my common sense and I wish I could undo it.

            So then, (oh how I adore this universe!!) I woke up in the middle of the night last night from a dream about my narc, where he displays that he is a narcissist and that people all around him are telling me he is a narcissist over and over again. This is odd because I still battle with the is “he/isn’t he” rolling around in my head and this seemed like confirmation from the universe! I have asked the universe to answer that question to me a dozen times and last night it delivered! Too late?

            So, today I am considering calling this friend, admitting my affair to her and asking her to not transfer any single thing about me to the narc but I don’t know if that’s the right move. I told her I was moving house and I even told her which suburb when she asked (f*ckhead I am!!!) And I am desperately trying to think of a way to ask her not to pass that information on. Very mad at myself.

            So, I can’t be proud of myself unless I can prevent the information traveling to him. 😟

            On to glorious sex Renarde! Haha. It’s funny how we all not only love the topic of sex but love everyone else’s sex live’s too.
            HG is right! Dirty, dirty empaths, who are a bunch of deviates!

            My sex life, at present, is, for lack of a better word, eradicated.

            I’m not good at short answers…but I’ll try to summarise it..

            I am 40, and until I met narc 3 years ago, my sex life was a porno. Marathon sessions that were beyond inspirational. I have no idea how or why my sex life was so intense and how my partner (of 23 years) and I never tired of each other in the bedroom. Nothing was off limits and from weird to filthy to unimaginably filthy my sex life was just spectacular.

            I have never been able to view love and sex in the same category. Thanks to childhood narc abuse (unbeknownst at the time of course) I have never been able to feel loved. Even though I had loads to give. So I accepted sex readily as it made me feel wanted, if not loved and I was insatiable.

            Flash forward to meeting narc. An aging old man. Very gentle in every scenario and when we went to bed he was slow and tender and had a touch as light as feather. He led the sex as I wouldn’t dare not follow suit.

            Hrmmm! What’s this then….??? A first at my age! Nice sex? Sweet? An intimacy that I can’t explain! Love making!

            And for the first time in my life, when someone told me that they loved me…I believed it. I could feel a new love bursting from me and I wanted my every last day on earth to be his.

            Since him, ( last sex with him was Oct 2018) I have barely had sex.

            I don’t want nasty sex ever again and I tried leading my partner for it to be gentle sex and it just didn’t feel the same.

            My partner is beyond furious with me for my disregard for anything sexual. I am furious at myself for not being able to please him and I feel like screaming or crying everytime he starts hinting at sex or berating me for my lack of interest.

            My sex life has gone from one extreme to the other and so has my love. Or lack of either and both.

            I’m a sexless and loveless fool at the moment and try as I might, I have no interest in either.

            Having said that, if I could make love with my narc at this moment…I would not, but I’d want to. So I’m f*cked. Up down, left right, black white, no matter how I shade myself at the moment, I have no middle ground.

            I’ve hit a crossroads and I don’t think I want my life anymore in the way that it is. Nothing is satisfying to me. Absolutely nothing and I don’t know what I need or how to find what I need.

            On a brighter note, last night I tried something new in my head and I achieved a very welcome orgasm! It was absolutely unacceptable to have the thoughts that I did and it worked like a wrecking ball. So! I am going to play around with the new fantasy in my head for a few attempts and maybe it’ll be just enough to break the cycle of thinking about narc. Surely that can only be a positive thing for now!

            Now…did some fabulous person mention Tim Curry in a corset?

            Slap me silly if anyone could resist that f*cking freak in that outfit! I can’t pretend that anything about the transexual or transgender interests me in any way, shape or form…Tim Curry remains the exception! Well done Tim!

          6. STBS

            Lots to unpick here but that’s cool!

            “I can’t say for certain that she was encouraged to make that call with me, but my senses are going off the charts about it. I should never have taken that call.”

            Don’t beat yourself up lovely. I received a very strange Hoover the other day which in retrospect I shouldn’t have accepted. I did. It hurt. Spent the day in tears. However, in your case, do I sense that your contagion strand is coming online?

            Your dream and asking the Universe is also indicative that something is happening for you. That’s brilliant!

            “I have never been able to view love and sex in the same category. Thanks to childhood narc abuse (unbeknownst at the time of course) I have never been able to feel loved.”

            Snap. I could have written that.

            “My partner is beyond furious with me for my disregard for anything sexual.”

            That’s disturbing. It’s like being told to ‘calm
            down’, it never works.

            You know, I did something very similar to you. I know you haven’t done it voluntarily but I stopped all dating and sex for a good seven months. It was the very best thing I could’ve done for myself. I’m very happy to report I have been narc free (IPPS or IPSS) for over two years.

            Well done on your O btw. You see, things are changing! You are receiving messages and your drive is coming back.

            I’m recieving messaghes and not about me eityher. One was an incredibly importsant one that came via an Empath to me concerning my partners’ ex wife. On another occasion, I felt strongly compelled to message a third party and it turned out that I had supplied a very important bit of information regarding a woman who used to be in my coven and created all kinds of havoc. So that helped him.

            Oh before I close, you said you think you might confess the affair to a ‘friend’. DON’T! Never trust anyone with that kind of information. Please.

          7. Hi Renarde!

            Always lots to unpack. It’s the neverending unpacking of the stacked to the rafters.

            Yes, I’ll never know if she was encouraged to call me in the way that she did. I would never ask and she would never say, so I’m not stewing on it now. I had an instant and overwhelming sense immediately that it was the case but it’s a moot point.

            I had already previously decided to let our mutual friendships go and I broke my own decision as her phoning was just so out of character and incessant. I will just stay firm on completely removing all mutuals so I don’t feel twisted up over it again. I will never tell her.

            Yes the message I received was loud and crystal clear. I used to lucid dream an awful lot and this dream, although not lucid, was very strong and vivid.

            I read once that when the universe is trying to tell you something, that it WILL repeat itself until you listen.

            I heard it and I’m so thankful for it. He IS a narcissist and I need to stop my mind telling me that I might be wrong and just move on.

            And yes the sex thing, it’s like the more he goes on about it the more uncomfortable it makes it. Then it becomes awkward and forced.

            Why we still accept Hoover’s (if that’s what they are, absolutely probable that I’m paranoid) is beyond me. It’s as though the need to please others and not hurt them through silence is a challenge. To simply ignore old friends that I care for, is painful and makes me want to scream. I can’t stand to treat people that way. But it seems important to do what I need to do regardless.

            I guess all we can really do is learn to trust in ourselves and listen to the messages that we get given (without agenda) with thanks.

          8. STBS

            You’re not paranoid. It was a Hoover. But I can’t tell you why I know it for certain.

            Anyway, thing is, that trick can never be pulled again so hes shot his load there. Dick.

            You ok today?

          9. It is nothing to do with the universe. That is emotional thinking.

            Focus on the evidence. Apply logic. Utilise no contact. You will only be hoovered if you keep open the means by which you can be hoovered.

          10. HG

            As you know, I recieved a very tangential hoover this week. I thought it was relaying information about my children but it wasnt.

            It blind-sided me. I’m not really sure where I’m going with this but I do really despair at times.

          11. Hi Renarde.

            Do you mean that you can just ‘feel’ that it was a Hoover?

            I’m feeling a bit silly really, because I’m actually feeling a sense of comfort, that I’m not so forgettable as he has made me feel that I am. If he bothered to try to get information about me, at least he has thought of me. It hurt, badly, to think that I was no memory at all to him.

            If I’m atleast a memory, I can live with that. But to have been forgetable to him, after the times we had together, well, that really hurt just too much.

            So I’m ok today and thankyou so much for asking Renarde!!! 🤗. I have good days and bad days. But everyday, without doubt, is getting easier than it was before I understood about narcs.

            Where is your story Renarde? Can you link me to where your story started?

          12. Hey STBS

            My story is a long one. Being with the narc almost cost me my life but I’m very happy to say I got through it with I should add, lots of support from this site.

            Indeed earlier this year when I was very low indeed, there were members helping me as I attending a very distressing interview.

          13. Renarde,

            I’m sorry to hear that your road almost cost you the most precious thing of all. That’s terrible. I wish I could hug you!!!

            So thank goodness that you found this place and so much support!!! It is a blessing!

            I hope more people find their way here. I can’t imagine how many people are suffering out there right now without the answers that we’ve been so fortunate to find.

          14. Well STBS, I’m taking that virtual hug anyway!

            You know, what I’ve been through is extreme. Even by NS but conversely, once I began to see through the whole N BS then it changed.

            Not overnight. Sometimes the awareness would come in fits and starts. Often accompanied by physical symptoms. But not illness IYSWIM?

            So sometimes being down and crying (but not true depresssion). More often it was extreme, delocalised anxiety. True fear. Which led to issues with not feeling hungry. I dont think I have anorexia btw.

            I hope people come here as well. But as HG says, hope is a bitch.

            But look. You are in a precarious situation. I deliberately (and some might say foolishly) draw attention to myself. There are ways you can do it too but please be careful.

          15. Hi Renarde 🤗

            I’m glad you took my hug! It may just be virtual but it was given with heart that I would give in a real hug xo

            I understand the physical symptoms. I get them too. Not so much anymore. My insomnia won’t leave me. I can’t stand it. But I decided that if I’m going to lay in bed awake staring into the dark, then I’ll be damned if I think of mine. To hell with him! I actively acknowledge that he enters my mind and then I push him out and spend the time thinking of what matters now and all the things I want to do.

            I’m sorry to hear of the symptoms you’ve suffered. I hope you keep fighting off what has happened to you Renarde. I feel like you’re really important and that you matter more than you know.

            What is IYSWIM…?

            Some may say that hope is a bitch and maybe it is, but we just can’t ever give up on hope and positivity.

            Feeling light and bright is my everpresence and I always attract good to myself and make good all around me. I have a feeling that you have that too!

            Is my situation so precarious? I swear I WONT have my narc back. He is utterly lost and I won’t be there for him. No trick will work. My desire does not outweigh the offense I have taken at his behaviour. I am ashamed of my old friend and I hope he finds peace in his lifetime, but he can find none with me. I’m lost to him. But I still ask the universe for good things for him. Not for his good really, but for my own peace.

            The attention you draw to yourself, from my eyes, is one of a caring and lovely human being. I wish I knew you in my real life Renarde. You are special.

            If we attract bad ones, which we always will, then that’s because we are positive and they are negative and that truly says more about them than it does about us.

            Be careful in what way Renarde? In a universal way? In my real life? Or here? Or in a way I have not considered?

          16. STBS

            What a lovely post! That’s really given me such a warm feeling today.

            I percieve I’m special because not many of us are picking up the baton. There could be many reasons for this. Probably chiefly that when Empaths come here, they are looking for an immediate end to the emotional pain they are in because of a failed intimate partnership.

            Rightly, that’s in their heads. They want it in/out and move on. Without thinking about the wider picture which is what us regulars usually do.

            Where I am different is that this whole situation has gone on way to long and needs to be drastically reduced. If we could just reduce the amount of people that are being conned into functioning as the IPPS then there night be hope for humanity.

            Last night, Prince Andrew’s interviewed aired. I’m still in shock for many reasons. Its THE most obvious example of Middle narc buffoonery I’ve ever had the displeasure to watch.

            He was roasted and hung out to dry by the BBC. I shall talk more x

            Yes. Insomnia is a bitch. Do we all suffer? I’d imagine a large proportion of us do.

            As to your question. The time atm is precarious. If I understand correctly, you’re married and have had an affair? I do not judge you but you have made yourself vulnerable. Chances are, hes of in a low hanging fruit quarry and you’ll be left alone. I do hope so.

            I really like your last sentence. I cannot answer that you have missed a way but the fact you are even considering it shows you acknowledge there is a blind spot there. Thats very very good.

            IYKWIM is If You Know What I Mean.

            I bought the print Mail on Sunday today. I never do that. Its remarkable.

          17. Hi Renarde.

            You are special as not many people will ever pick up that baton. I’m certainly incapable of it at the moment, as I’m sure so many are.

            Yes they come for instant pain relief as the pain inflicted was devastating. I hate to remember that state and whoever comes along, is no doubt in a similar stage.

            Some are lifer’s. Some are grab and go, some are nomads and some may have other motives altogether.

            I think it’s human nature to find the reason, the logic and then the relief before moving on to the next chapter.

            Hope for humanity! Oh! How I love the very thought of it!

            The Royals, I have never watched anything to do with them or even read about them to be honest. There is something about the blantant collection and showboating of everything while others go without, that just ruffles my feathers.

            But if you have opinions on said roasting, then that will be enjoyable!

            Insomnia, that darned curse! Having said that Renarde, I’ve noticed that the last few nights, it has ended up providing some very vivid dreams when I finally do manage to sleep. This is a very good thing as if I can record my dreams then I can restart the process of lucid dreaming again and that was something that I very much enjoyed! Another positive arriving from a negative! I love the way the universe works (sorry HG) and some loves can just never be abandoned!

            Precarious, yes, I see what you mean now. I’m not married but have been with my partner for 20 odd years. It was indeed an affair that led me here. What a gargantuan f*ck up! But nothing ventured, nothing gained and I have learned about my past from the treatment received by him. Which really, is a good thing. I had closed the chapter of my childhood with no answers at all and thanks to the affair I could revisit, with correct answers to it all and then reseal it forever. No more pain at all. Done and dusted. Another positive derived from a negative!

            Yes, he was probably a low hanging fruit collector. But that’s really ok now. I’m not in any physical pain anymore. That part is behind me. He’s just a memory that distorts my sexual pleasure and soon that will be behind me too! I’m working on that final hurdle with gusto now. 🥴

            He is becoming irrelevant and if his timing does not rapidly hit me directly, (which he can’t know and frankly, I’ve lost the ‘he is all knowing’ (a God) feeling) then his return is pointless. I like that I’m almost there! If he stays absent for just a few more weeks I’m home free Renarde!!

            With me there may always a blind spot! But from being here, I can flick a light switch onto the unseen.It’s visible now, IYKWIM. ☺️

            What is print mail? A newspaper? That is remarkable for you because….?

          18. STBS

            I’m really admiring your ho getting attitude. I know you’ll be ok. Hang on in there lovely!

            Matters of the heart are always difficult. If MY taking your path you’ve helped to heal your childhood; well I commend that attitude. I really do. I certainly do not Judge.

            I’ve never cheated but I’ve been a DLS. Twice. I am ashamed of that. One had a child, a teenager. What I did was wrong but at one point, I was also that teenager.

            Yup, bought a newspaper. Fascinating! Andy is ripped apart by two exceptional writers, both female. I was going to do the same bit theres no point. One shows clearly how often Andy blatantly contradicts himself.

            In reading those articles I was given a nod to go and watch The Crown. Specifically season 3 with Olivia Coleman and the episode ‘Aberfan’.

            I think you are US but in the UK, Aberfan was a very very big deal. A huge coal spoil heap collapsed after heavy rain in Wales. It utterly engulfed a primary school and over a hundred children died. Now, some parts of Wales utterly despise the English. When Charlie boy was invested as Prince if Wales at Carnavon in the 70s, there were serious security issues that the nationalistic Welsh would attempt to assassinate the Queen.

            In the Crown drama, the Queen is talking. She was DRAGGED to visit the town and at one point, she pretends to cry after visiting the survivours.

            Pretends to cry. What. A. Cunt. How very narcasssitic of her. Those poor children and their families.

            I love Olivia Coleman. So naturally empathic. Her performance when she as Queen knows what she needs to do. Her duty. But cannot bring herself to do it. Put on the performance, she says. You can see how frightened she is of getting it it wrong. An Empath wouldn’t necessarily worry about that because that energy, of compassion, flows through us. An Empath would probably worry about something unexpected happening.

            I dint think I’ve ever seen such a masterful display of acting. I hope she gets the BAFTA for that.

            Anyway, my point is that I was made to re evaluate my own perceptions of the Queen and to a certain extent the PM, Harold Wilson.

            What has happened with Andy is utterly unacceptable. He is on the Sovteugn Grant. We pay him to consort with child abusers and sex traffickers.

            That whole ‘sweating’ issue is a fucking disgrace. Vets, geuine vets, will be going berserk at how this entities,stuck up, very stupid narc has used the excuse of combat vet to explain his behaviour.

            In the paper there is a gorgeous picture of Andy at that time. Clearly of his nuts on Charlie and probably MDMA sweating like a stuck pig as he exits a nightclub.

            This is in the same week that an Apprentice ‘guru’ says that nurses should take a second job to avoid using food banks. Nurses! (NS I trolled him expertly over this and his pretentious use of being a visiting professor of the business school named after him. I gently corrected him. Said, btw love when you ien the university, you dont need to settle for professor. You can be Chancellor, if you like. Professor hah! If he had ever attended a lecture I’ll eat my top hat).

            Hope this hasn’t been too much of a ramble!

            Keep Buggering On as Churchill would say.

          19. Renarde: The part I found interesting in that episode of “The Crown” was the Queen’s resulting recognition and admission that she is deficit of something (emotional empathy). Accurate. HG has stated she is not a narcissist, so I would guess that puts her at a narcissistic normal.

          20. Do keep in mind also that “The Crown” is written to entertain, it is not wholly representative of the queen and her behaviour etc.

          21. FYC

            I just dont know. Her narc traits where well known. Think Charles and Gourdonstone. My own Med History tutor reminded me of that.

            Her handling of Aberfan and of course the aftermath of Diana’s death do leave her precariously exposed.

            Indeed, allowing airmiles into buck house shows a tacit approval for his behaviour.

            From Randy’s POV, he has done nothing wrong. That’s standard. But the Queen? She needs to give her head a fucking wobble.

            Philip was well known as a philanderer. His tangential involvement in Profumo still hasnt really come out. But it will after his death. Its disgusting.

            I will watch more episodes of The Crown. Its fascinating

          22. Hi Renarde,

            Sorry for the late reply. Very busy few days.

            Thankyou! I’m hanging in there!
            You hang in there too and we’ll be good as new in no time. 🤗

            It’s ok to make mistakes. We can beat ourselves up, but it won’t turn back time or change our situations. Forgiveness of others and self is the only way forward.

            A newspaper!!! They still exist? 😉

            Thankyou for the rundown on what’s going on in the U.K

          23. Hi Renarde!

            Sorry for the delay in reply.

            Try not to feel shame anymore over past choices. We can’t change the past. All we can do is forgive ourselves and try to make better choices in the future and be more mindful of our actions.

            We are smart lasses and we can do better the next time we find ourselves in a moral dilemma.

            If no-one can get hurt, then I’m just about game for anything and everything, but I don’t want to cause anyone else to suffer again because of me.

            The newspaper! It still exists? 😉

            I’m a big sook Renarde, I can’t read current affairs, it hurts me over and over as I flip through the pages loaded with hate and scare mongering and cruelty and a few celebrities thrown into the mix for entertainment and distraction. The less I know about the world we live in, the less ashamed I am to be human. It’s sad to say that I want to reinstate my rose tinted glasses to deal with the world.

            I appreciate the rundown of what’s happening in the U.K, thankyou! I’m in Australia 🦘

            Our politicians are a disgrace in my eyes. I have no faith in our system and all I can see is the rich lining their pockets at the poor’s expense and openly mocking the country with their blatant disregard of common sense and lack of honest behaviour. I have zero hope in our system here and I think that it’s too late for the people to do anything about it. I think evil will always prevail because they are always willing to do wrong for greed. I’m not shocked anymore when I hear of corruption. What would shock me is to hear of honesty and real change for the better.

            We can live in hope!

            Nurses in Australia are still on a very good wicket as long as you don’t take staffing ratios into account. It’s not so bad here. For now.

            Our issues are primarily our housing bubble and our utterly corrupt banking sector (shock! Haha). To say nothing of our cowardly sell-out government who leave us without the bright future of the great Australian dream.

            F*ck the ones who pull the strings and the entitled bastards who do their dirty work at our expense.

            But on a bright note, thank goodness for Joaquin Phoenix for rocking my world and making me forget every little thing that gets my hackles up!

            We’ll “keep buggering on” as we were taught to be cautious, my Lord”.

            Xo

          24. STBS

            Didnt know you were in Oz. And yes, I agree. Politics has always been corrupt. PN had a saying; the Government always gets in. It does make one wonder why we even bother with the mandate.

            I remember the day very well when I realised we were fucked. I wasnt in work. I was caring for my baby daughter. I’d watched an excellent film about Nick Leeson and how hed brought down Barings Bank. Then in the next day or so, our economy tanked. It underwent a correlation fion, I believe it’s called. Summer 2007. The austerity drive came online and the UK has been largely fucked ever since.

            It was an excuse to beat public sector workers on the head. When I watched that film, I was about to put my own home on the market. Thankfully it sold on the first day. But my ex and I bought at the height of the market which had been hyper inflated for years. When we moved and austerity really kicked in, despite that I (not him!) Had wisely put down way more than we needed to in equity. (Btw the bank were willing to stump up 5 times his earnings.). Despite that, our loan to value ratio did not hit 85% and therefore we could not borrow on the equity in the house. Eventually I was forced back into work by sure need. That took me away from my 18 month old boy. I would had preferred it if he was at least 3. But needs must.

            How the public sector in the UK has been treated is shocking. God only knows what will happen on the 12th. I suspect that BOJO will win. I dont see any semi credible alternative.

            Corbyn has been YET AGAIN mired in anti-semitism. The guys a tool. Liberals are also mired but this time in a sexism scandal. Torys are loathed but hes promising to deliver.

            The concept of whether we are in or out is equally fraught both ways. It’s the devil and the deep blue sea. Neither option is a winner.

            Anyway. Who knows?

          25. I like your views and comments Renarde. I find them helpful. 🤗

            I take something from every article and every comment from everyone and I piece it all together into a collage of what feels right for me. It all helps and I’m so grateful for all of it.

            I feel like HG must get exasperated at our viewpoint sometimes and must roll his eyes, yet he’s always here for everyone and giving us endless time and advice.
            A teddy-bear in disguise? There’s hope for you yet 😜

          26. STBS

            I’m really glad you find my comments helpful. I also find yours and others views brilliant! I’m grateful too.

            One of my fave HG IGs is the ‘HG, is this a Hoo…’ Slap. Genious.

            Im sure he gets very exasperated!

          27. Now I understand why my husband always wants to sit in the driver’s seat. Wont let me drive. Control,control,control.

          28. Lol, I do put make up on when drives and then try and kiss him with my lip gloss . He hates that, he doesn’t like kissing .He ignores me and starts texting when driving and when I tell him its dangerous he doesnt care .Grrrrrr!

          29. “Vroom Vroom, can I drive?

            No. I always have control of appliances”.

            Now that was a funny exchange! Of course the answer was no!

            Haha!

          30. Hi Renarde,

            Your comments and everyone’s comments are always helpful.

            Everyday I get something from everyone here. It’s really such a comfort and it does feel better sometimes, to get some of it out.

            ….”HG, is this a Hoo…” haha Renarde, patience seems to be a virtue reserved for narcs! I sure as hell have NONE!

          31. STBS

            Patience is a virtue for some narcs.

            I hold no patience with them either. Sometimes I have to fight semi-hard battles with the Middles.

            Always semi-hard. Much like their roll on roll off motion.

          32. Soon to be: I suggested Tim. I’m glad if it’s had a positive effect. I know RHPS is a parody of sci-fi and horror movies, but I’ve always thought Curry was seriously smokin’ hot as Frank N. Furter. I just wish I could have seen Anthony Stewart Head (Giles from Buffy) play the role; he did the show on stage in the UK.

          33. Oh Violetta!

            If possible, I would hug you!

            I got such a giggle from that! It brought me back to teen years when I thought I was odd for finding him erotic and then reconfirming just now, that I’m still odd, because “oh yeah! I’d still go there!”.

            Haha!

          34. @STBS

            Put that associate in her place and tell her to mind her damn business and to concentrate on her own struggle and be done with it!

          35. @STBS

            Ignore my previous comment, I thought your friend knew about the affair and was just being a frienemy trying to pass on information about you to the narc deliberately.

            Definitely consult with HG!

            I’m just wondering, did you fall out of love with your current partner before meeting the narc which led to the affair?

          36. Hi witch,

            All good. I don’t know why I dont receive alerts when someone messages me 🙄

            My friend doesn’t know. I never told her.

            He gave her a gift to give to me which was engraved with something which alluded to the fact that we were lovers but she was too polite to ask me about it. I never told her anything and I doubt he would either. He protects his reputation. But I don’t know?

            I still loved my partner when I met my narc. I ignored the narcs advances for a long time. And then I fell in love with him. I don’t think I’m in love with either anymore. Just a sense of longing that I can’t replace or fill.

          37. STBS
            Is it possible that you loved and miss who you were when you were with the narc? You realized a part of yourself that you hadn’t experienced before so never knew you wanted or lacked (for example the tenderness). Perhaps you were not in love with either your partner or the narc but sex was substituting for a longing you were not aware of? Maybe way off but something to consider internally.

          38. Hi NarcAngel,

            You know, that’s actually very possible.

            Maybe I just loved how happy I was and gave him all the accolades for it.

            To consider that when we are at our happiest point in life that it must be due to someone else, other than our own self.

            It is something to consider!

          39. Hello Sparkling, I am short on time today so I cannot quite do this justice, but I wanted to let you know that genuine happiness comes from within, not without. The feeling you are describing masks what you have not yet created within yourself, and therefore seek in another. Your comments sound similar to something my CoD sister would say and she has had a rollercoaster of relationships with narcissists. No one can fill you. The desire to find this feeling from another will lead you to another narcissist. Healthy relationships are those where two people who have their own internal strength, direction and happiness, share these with each other. I’ll comment more later if you like. My hope is that you keep reading here and do some internal work on getting to know you through your own eyes and not another and certainly not a narcissist’s. Your happiest feeling is yet to be.

          40. Hi FYC,

            Thankyou for your message.

            I do agree that true happiness can only come from within. I love that actually. I see most things as inner, not upwards or outside of.

            I am co-dependant, since I first read about it, I knew it was me and then I had the consult which confirmed it. So yes, that’s spot on.

            I’ll get there. I feel pretty confident that I’ll find my way. I’m learning that I am actually a pretty tough nut to crack. 😉

            I will definitely keep reading here, I do every single day and I always see something new or interesting.

            I agree that the best happiness is yet to come! And I am excited about whatever is next! ❤️

          41. Hi Sparkling, I’m sorry I was hurried in that message. In re-reading it, it came across pretty short and that was not my intent. I do not judge you. I want you to have a happy life and I want you to be able to find that wellspring of happiness in yourself and know it will always be with you and is never dependent on another. You deserve to have a solid sense of self; to know who you are and that regardless of any other person, you are unique and valuable and wonderful as is. You are definitely in the right place. Have you read HG’s book “Chained”? You may find it of interest.

          42. Weird for thinking Tim Curry was hawt? You had and have a LOT of company.

            If you need cheering up, go to a midnight showing. It may be the first one you’ve done in years, but recovering your sense of fun is an important part of recovery. I was in the throes of Inflammation of the Wanna-Be Playuh Narc, and watching an Austin Powers movie with a friend helped relieve the symptoms.

          43. STBS:
            “I hope more people find their way here. I can’t imagine how many people are suffering out there right now without the answers that we’ve been so fortunate to find.”

            I’ve not only been telling all my friends about Narcsite, I’ve been posting on all my news sites. If it’s an article about someone whom HG has specifically discussed, I direct them to “A Very Royal Narcissist” or “A Very POTUS Narcissist.”

            There is more than one person in my life who got played by these people. My vocal coach got jerked around both emotionally and financially by one, and when I first met her, I sensed something that I didn’t have a name for then. Just that she was using him, but without knowing how to recognize specific signs. Don’t know if he’ll make his way here; he’s pretty stubborn, stubborn enough to argue if he does show up, but I know he’s still hurting.

            I’m also going to put in a request for our local library to start stocking HG’s books. If I can get just ONE on the shelves, cardholders will start requesting others, and it will snowball. They have plenty of books on sociopaths and narcissists (I oughta know!), but none that helped me to break the spell the way Narcsite has.

          44. A good way to get them into libraries is to buy hard copies and donate them. Include them also when donating items to women’s shelters. They have time to read while there and are already removed from the abuser.

          45. Violetta

            Your suggestion via donating new and in print books to libraries is brilliant! I’m ashamed I didnt think if this one myself.

            Ive thought on this. In the UK, I dont know if libraries accept donations. I’m now checking with someone in the system. The last thing I would wish for is a kind person to buy HGs books only for them to be relegated to sitting under someone’s desk.

            I believe it was NA who said ‘and also Womens Aid’. They have time on their hands.

            I’m happy to buy five paperbacks and donate them to either libraries and/or WA groups.

            HG

            What are your top five?

          46. I assume you mean which are the most popular? No Contact, Exorcism, Fuel, Sitting Target and Escape.

          47. I never wrote a review of that one for fear my husband would see it, but it deserves to be among the top three. I’m on a mission.

          48. Pati, 2 books you should buy and read over and over and over are Escape and Getting out. Forget the Sex book.

          49. HI kim,
            Yes those books should be next .My ET takes over all the time . My situation is very rough . Thank you so much
            Hugs xoxo

          50. Kim e, I’m sorry to disagree. SAN helped me decide to escape and also understand why, even while being a hyper sexual somatic in appearance, my narc had a lot of reservations with intimacy which I believed Pati was recently complaining about too with regards to her narc.

          51. SP. those books I suggested and SN are all good books. Just trying to get Pati to decide something…..anything.

          52. Oh, of course! I was just saying SAN is excellent too but all of them are. I have them all! I have what I call Tudor’s dungeon in my Kindle!

          53. Kim you are a total sweetheart ❤ and you care so much. Love you for it !
            I have read Fuel,sex,50 things Not to do with the Narcissist and Manipulated.
            I am trying to understand what I am dealing with . I need answers . I will buy those books you suggested next. Thank you !

          54. Km, I need some advice and I dont know who to turn to other than this blog.
            I took my dog out for a walk this morning
            I bumped into one of my neighbors. She told me she saw my husband with so so getting into his car and driving off A while ago she told.me she didnt see any hanky panky. Lol
            I know this girl she was my brother in laws girlfriend at the time and mine . She wanted advice about her relationship and my husband was there for her . She broke up with my brother in law and my husband smeared her and he doesnt llke her . She also moved out of the area.
            Does this sound fishy to you?
            I just needed someone to talk to.

            Thank you!

          55. “And my husband was right there for her.” FISHY. Sorry but if he’s a narc, that sounds very very very fishy.

          56. SP, I dont have proof that he was cheating the proof is in HG’s work and the fact that he is a Narc . Its my ET again .

          57. If he’s a narc… but I’m happy you’re gonna consult soon. It will certainly help you.

          58. Pati, I suffer seeing you going through the shock, the discovery that everything is a lie, the devaluation, the confirmation he’s not what he pretended to be, the lies… I went through that minimally, being his secondary source only. I can’t imagine if my husband turned out to be a narc after so many years. I am confident HG will help you but I feel your pain and shock, I’m very sorry. 😘

          59. SP, you dont know how much your words mean to me . I am so upset . I am sitting by my computer doing some work and he is in the bedroom watching TV ignoring me . I am in pain but I will get through this . It’s the emotional abuse. He has never ever hit me or my kids . Everyone loves him. I know what he is now and my life is a mess . HG will be my saviour . You are an awesome person even though I have never met you . Thank you to everyone on this blog who have given me advice . 😘

          60. Emotional abuse is real, Pati, and it can be devastating too. You got this, we are here for you whenever you need to talk. Just know you are strong enough and you will get there. ♥️

          61. Being on this blog have saved me many more ways than you can imagine .I want to thank you again and for caring about my situation. One day I will be Narc Free thanks to you and this blog.😘

          62. Pati,
            Your husband is a narc. He has been having “friends” your entire marriage. Does not matter who this friend is. Could be the ministers wife, the coffee girl in the office. He calls them all freinds and alot….maybe not all ….but a lot of them he is sleeping with. He has no boundries. You are his SUV, she is his dishwasher, she is his toaster. We all are in the same boat…we mean nothing to them except what they can get out of us. (This applies to your children also) And as HG says if you ask him about her, he will say “she is just a friend”. No. She. Is. Not. Just. A. Friend.
            And you are stupid and do not understand him. You dont give him sex and you are cruel to the children. Yes…this is what he will tell his “friends”.
            Please consult with HG. I understand that this is all new to you and you are trying to get your brain to comprehend it all but your ET is so high nothing can get in.
            Please apply for angel assistance.
            Reading or listening is great but believe me there is nothing like HG talking to you. You might have to talk to him numerous times but for your sake and the sake of your children, you have to start taking bigger baby steps.
            Please keep asking questions but you need to get a foundtion going. You do not need any questions to talk to HG. Believe me, he has plenty to say. Just get comfy, get some coffee and a box of kleenex. Once he starts talking, when the questions come to you, ask them then.
            I did not mean to make this harsh….just realistic.
            Hugs…………..

          63. Thank you Kim (sniff sniff) I just needed someone to talk to and get it out. HG is the man and I will consult with him soon and ask all the questions. I appreciate you listening so.very much.
            Hugs xoxo

          64. Pati, I know it is a very hard pill to swallow. I was not ever the IPPS and yet I have been unable to get out for any length of time until jus this past September. Over 2 years of this ET crap. So I understand that it will be very hard as you have built a life with him.
            Talk any time you like. that is what we are all here for. As I had said here once before, we have all been there in varying degrees…..we get it.

          65. Kim, again I thank you . I have built my life on lie. This is very difficult for me .I will get through it I know I will.

          66. Kim e is right, Pati. However, when I was being love bombed the sex was not good either. The sexting was, but the actual moments of intimacy were lame. I think mine preferred having sex with himself than being with another person, it is very well explained in the book.

          67. Same here SP. He was alright but nothing to die for. I find his sex very robotic. Wham bam thank you mam. Just really strange .

          68. Kim thank you , I have been devalued for so many years without noticing . How could have I been so stupid . I feel like I live with a roommate from college ,than a husband .
            Hugs for your advice xoxo

          69. HG

            Ahh you got me. Quite rightly. I actually didnt mean most popular I did mean which ones you would recommend as your solid 5 go-to books.

            I’m extremely surprised SATN isnt there. But the five which are really selling, well I can understand why.

            Is Fuel only at #3? I’d have placed that at #1.

          70. You’re welcome, HG. Proud to be a Tudorista.

            Btw, was Evita one? She definitely is in the show, charisma with nothing behind it, but was the historical Eva Peron a narc?

          71. Violetta

            [Coughs meaningfully]

            I decided now that the time is right to unleash my inner librettist.

            I give you……

            Ode to a Lesser

            Don’t cry for me my Ford Cortina!
            The truth is, he never left me!
            He rotted quietly
            On my driveway
            I gave him some resistance
            He didnt keep his distance…

            Ren

          72. Renarde:
            That was NarcAngel who recommended donating books. I haven’t managed to buy for myself yet, though I intend to give myself a Christmas present, regardless what happens with my job-from-Purgatory.

            As for the library, I have started with a request for Sex and the Narcissist. I believe that Fuel is the basis for everything else, but I figure Sex will fly out of checkout, people will recommend it to others, they’ll start looking at HG’s other titles, and eventually they’ll work their way to Fuel, No Contact, Escape, and the others.

            As HG is well aware, Sex sells.

          73. Violetta

            I agree with you. Sex sells. Surprising therefore it’s not on his best seller list.

          74. Dear HG

            Well. All I know is from my modest book sales is that people really like grot. I have a title that I edited tgats really very filthy indeed.

            In other news, I’m checking out reviews for Puzza Express in Woking. I hear it’s quite the spot to dine out in.

            Oh ok. Where is SATN in your Top of the Pops?

          75. Renarde:
            So many narcs in that show. Eva just happens to be better at it.

            Magaldi (speaking for all narcs who overestimate their worth):
            If this were Buenos Aires
            I’d have that town at my feet
            I never ever meet members of the public
            They tear me apart

            CHÉ
            I understand their feelings

          76. Violetta

            Dear old Che. He was a rum un. Never quite figured him out!

            Anyway, I’m now obsessed with Randy Andy. Still in shock. I just cant believe he is THAT stupid.

          77. Kim e:

            I was going to START with SatN. I’ve been No Contact for years, but I want to make sure I don’t fall for a routine like that again. I also want to learn how to appreciate guys who aren’t so superficially charming. I’ll never get to know a Darcy if I keep gravitating to the Wickhams.

          78. Violetta

            I’m finding you a treasure at the moment if information I dont know.

            Whats a Wickham?

        3. Hi STBS,
          You should receive a notification now.
          Once you resolve the narc issue with HG, I hope that gives you more clarity about your current relationship as well.
          You mentioned that your partner is with you all the time, how does that make you feel?
          I saw a lecture from a relationship therapist who explained that when couples become too close they can lose desire for one another because then they become like family and most people do not want to have sex with family. She said that in order to maintain desire in a long term relationship there needs to be distance, not too much distance but enough distance to maintain some mystery and she argues that mystery creates desire.
          Let me know what you think.

          1. The relationship therapist is incorrect with that statement. They really do come out with a lot of rubbish.

          2. Thats why I dont go to one. I am very sorry and apologize for my phrase but they are full of shit.

          3. @hg

            How so?
            I think it does offer some insight into why sexual desire can deplet over time in long term relationships. The initial passion people have at the beginning may fade because the relationship has become too familiar, predictable and routine.
            She said when she has asked her clients when they are most drawn to their partners, the answers where when they witnessed their partners concentrating on their own projects or hobbies. They were most drawn to their partners when their partners asserted themselves as individuals and separate from them in some way. The distance and separateness created desire.

            Having the same routine, the same friends, the same everything, never going anywhere as individuals, doing everything together. It does sound dull.

          4. A lot of what she says I find relatable and makes sense to me but I’d love to know your thoughts HG. I’m sure you’ll have something interesting to say

          5. Hi Witch,

            Yes I got that notification 🙂.

            Thankyou. Current relationship is tricky! It’s frustrating at times. I absolutely crave solitude.

            When I do get precious moments for myself, I feel utterly free.

            I agree actually that without mystery, desire can lesson and that once you bond as family instead of lovers that subconsciously no, of course we don’t want sexual pleasure with family (EEK!!).

            That’s actually a very interesting way of thinking!

            In my situation, i’ve always need to be led. I follow happily and don’t have a care in the world. I tend to put everything, all faith into my partner to always know what’s best. He likes it that way and I suppose since I was raised by a narc, that that situation was perfectly comfortable for me, as I had no trust in my own instincts or in myself.

            I think over the years, he lost my trust due to repeated cheating and taking advantage that he could do anything to me forever and somewhere along the line I gave up all faith in him and pulled back.

            I still loved him, still do, but lost the “in love” feelings. When that happened, I lost the sexual desire for him and felt like a bit of a lost puppy. So then a narc comes along and I more than want to follow, I jump in, head first and I have a leader again and there’s my heaven. Someone to adore who always knows what’s right for me. So when he started to devalue me, I was more than a lost puppy, I felt abandoned and truly lost.

            I’d thrown away all faith in my partner and shifted all my trust elsewhere. And then there was nowhere to put my trust, except into myself and therein lies my weak spot.

            I suppose that says more about my deficiencies than anything else.

            I need to follow myself. Trust my own decisions without relying on another person.

            It also seems i put a lot of pressure onto any partner that is mine as I can’t and won’t lead and that is a lot of responsibility to put onto a partner. Lucky for me that my partner is at his happiest when he is the undisputed boss of the universe.

          6. Dear Mr. HG Tudor,

            Why do you say that the statement written by Witch made by the relationship therapist is incorrect? It seems like it could be true.

            Speaking only for myself, I like to keep a little distance. It keeps the formality and the respect, as well as the desire, fresh.

        4. Hi STBS,
          You may have mentioned this already, but have you thought about whether or not your current partner is a narc?
          There are some red flags there, the cheating, the need to be in control, the possessiveness. I’m not surprised that you feel free when you’re on your own.

          When I was with my first narcissistic partner, about 8 years in, I started an emotional affair online with a much older man who I would never meet. When I fantasised about having the sexual affair, I enjoyed fantasying about almost getting caught. Why? The rebellion aroused my desire, the emotional affair was my protest against the tyranny and Within fantasy I was asserting my self and reconnecting with my individuality. I don’t think I would have even been attracted to this older man in person… I realised it wasn’t really about him. It was about me. I was reconnecting to a lost self through him.

          It’s possible that the reason you are finding it difficult to let go sexually of narc number two, is because he is symbolic of your protest against narc number one?

          I know you said that you are most comfortable with being led but maybe you are being directed out of your comfort zone because you are yearning for change?

          Please correct me if I’m wrong, these are just my thoughts as an outsider.

          1. Hi Witch,

            Yes I have considered that my current partner is a narc. I’m quite certain, but years ago something snapped in him and I saw a bizarre change. What went down for him was massive and every single area of his life went down in one hit. It was a frightening time and something shifted in him. The dynamics between us changed and I started to get ‘some’ say in my life. Everything changed but was still the same and it would take me hours to sit down and explain it all correctly.

            I WANT to be in love with him again. I keep hoping that I’ll feel that way again. I think essentially that he lost control of me through his own doing and in turn, I then lost all respect for him. I don’t know if that’s right, but I feel often that it may be the case.

            I’m just a bit of a f*ck up at the moment which is the exact opposite of what I’ve always been. There’s something missing in me now and I am darned if I know what to do about it.

            In a perfect world, I could just skip along merrily behind my partner again. But it’s just not there. I look at him and I try to will it to all come back. He needs me. But, I’m empty. Functioning almost perfectly again, for all intents and purposes ( 😉 Thank you HG, the correction was not missed but I did appreciate how gently the correction was delivered (how tragically embarrassing, by the way!)).

            I don’t know. I’m just doing the best I can to keep my family as happy as possible and myself, as much as I can.

            F*CK it! I should just jump into bed with a glass of wine and my copy of Fifty Shades 😉

          2. Also Witch,

            My narc was MUCH older than me. Disgracefully so. Frankly, I should be ashamed of myself. But he was smart. And that to me is utterly irresistible, it’s my weak spot. I NEED to be in awe. I don’t know why and I can admit that I’m weird like that.

            Maybe it is good that your emotional affair stayed online because once inspired, age had nothing to do with it. It was invisible to me. He could have been impotent and that would have been irrelevant to me too. I was utterly captivated and would have followed him into lava.

            Maybe online emotional affairs are actually a safe option?

            Was it enjoyable Witch? Did it cause you any pain or just joy?

          3. Witch. But the situation has to be triaged for what truth is most important. One person has a cut finger. Another person has an odd ache in the shoulder. Another person has the symptoms of a heart attack. All true. But the person with the heart attack is the truth that should be dealt with first, of course, because that situation is most pressing and dangerous. Likewise, if a person`s Emotional Thinking is the lead train, and the runaway train, that truth needs to be dealt with first, then making sure that this person, later, is able to retrieve their luggage from the train, contact concerned relatives, has a way to go home, etc. are secondary truths to be dealt with next. The list of truths are never ending. Some are more important than others at any given time, as you know. Emotional Thinking is often the runaway train. And the most dangerous truth.

          4. Hi PSE
            I don’t disagree with you, I just like to explore and share ideas.
            We have layers to our motivations.
            I have already said more than once that STBS should consult with HG and she should as soon as possible. That is the only way to stop going around in circles. I hope I did make that clear as I wouldn’t want to put someone off from a consultation.
            HG is the only one here that can really help with a narc problem.
            I’m just having a conversation

          5. Witch
            That’s how I look at it – we converse, probe, and suggest amongst each other, but we recognize and defer to HG for most the impactful advice on matters involving his kind.

        5. Hi STBS

          I think it would be a good idea to also consult with HG about your current partner, because there appears to be several red flags there.
          Narcissists are not horrible all the time there are periods when they appear to be kind and accommodating but it never lasts! Genuine kindness is consistent, it doesn’t waver that easily.

          You don’t have anything to be ashamed of. He was older, so what? That’s not the problem, the problem is the narcissism.

          There was pain involved with the emotional affair, because I genuinely believed I was in love with him and so I felt hurt that we couldn’t be together. How can you really be in love with someone over the internet? I was in love with a fantasy.
          I will always be grateful for the fact that the experience made me face my denial and dishonesty and it helped to free me from my awful relationship.

          What makes you want to be in love with your partner again?

          Over time I realised I never really loved my narcissistic partner, I felt like I SHOULD love him out of guilt, but I never loved him for him and he never loved me for me. You can’t really love narcissism which is all a narcissist is and a narcissist can not love anyone due to their need for constant control and narcissistic supply

          1. I have consulted with HG over the phone and also twice via email and received replies via recordings.
            It was helpful. Immensely so.

            If my partner is or isn’t is something I don’t know if I’m ready for. There’s been so much and it’s quite overwhelming. Narcissist or sociopath? He’s one or the other. I honestly lean towards sociopath these days as the more I read, the more I learn.

            The emotional affair hurt even without meeting? Yes, I can see that anything deeply emotional does lead to love. Well, I sure can’t try that to fill the void that way then.

            I suppose I fell in love with a fantasy too. It’s a shame that fantasy feels more alive than reality. I wonder why that is?

            I want to be in love with my partner again because at the end of the day, he is always there. He says he is still completely in love with me and I feel disgusted in myself that I can’t return it in that way anymore. Or, maybe I need to be in love so badly that since he is here I wish I could feel it with him rather than not feel it again at all. I don’t know.

        6. Hi STBS,

          It is very painful facing up to the fact that someone whom you have shared so much with, is a narcissist so I appreciate the motivations for not wanting to know.
          However, this is not to your best interest. Knowledge is power, it is empowering and freeing to know the truth.
          Only because your partner says he is in love with you, doesn’t mean that he is. It is part of the manipulation in order to gain control over you and to stop you from leaving. I’m sure a narcissist can tell when your behaviour has change towards them and so they will try to cover their own arse. But it’s not out of care for you. They are securing their supply.

          So no, you don’t owe him your love in exchange for his empty words.

          You can find love again after narcissistic abuse. I did and I’m not the only one. However that is not the most important thing. The abuse from a narcissist will have a detrimental effect on your psyche, so most importantly you need to escape. That’s the only way you will be able to start healing.

          1. We are on this blog for a reason Witch ,and everyone here is so helpful . I dont know what I would do if I couldnt talk about it . It is also great to hear other peoples situations and helps me know I am not alone. So thank you again .

          2. Yes Pati, the worse thing is speaking to people who (for no fault of their own) do not know what your partner really is, because the suggestions they give are terrible.
            If you suspect that your partner is a narcissist, it is highly likely that they are.
            Narc surviour Tina Turner already told us “what’s love got to do with it?” But we didn’t want to listen and so we find ourselves here.

    2. Oh STBS, that sounds like a dreadful block to getting free. Do you have to think of him at a particular time, place or doing something specific? Do you think about him a lot at other times?

      1. Notme, it’s certainly very frustrating.

        No, I don’t have to picture anything specific. I can think of any scenario at all and achieve it, so long as he is in my thoughts. If I don’t picture him, then I feel no sexual desire whatsoever and there’s no finale.

        It strikes me as a bit odd because while yes, I still think of him often, i don’t hold the same deep feelings for him that I used to. I can’t even cry over him anymore. I’ve gotten to a much better place and I would not be with him again under any circumstances. Quite the opposite infact as I now consider myself very lucky that I didn’t end up with him.

        The fact that the same problem still applies during sex is not a welcome side effect at all. As such, I’ve started avoiding sex as I feel just too guilty.

        What I should note is that, in relation to this issue, when I was engaging in sex with this narc, I couldn’t orgasm unless I thought of my partner, so this is where the whole thing gets unusual. I was still love with my partner when I was sleeping with the narc. I fell in love with the narc after the sexual encounters.

        I think I can only achieve orgasm, if I’m thinking of the one I love, which paints a very messy picture indeed, at the moment.

        I can still g-spot orgasm no matter what I think of or who I think of as there is no stopping those orgasms once they get set off. But clitoral? Forget it!

        I am at the point of thinking that hypnotherapy may be a viable option. Not really sure what to do, to be honest.

        I can clearly say that this issue has always been present with me. If I love someone then I must think of them to achieve.

        I just didn’t realise that I still held such strong feelings for the narc, as I’ve been happier and happier everyday without him and I want nothing to do with him.

        Maybe I should try watching porn (really not my thing) to force my sexual thoughts to visuals for a while instead of mental?

          1. Hello HG.

            Yes. I know they are excuses.

            My partner works from home though. He is with me at all times. Wherever I am. He is. Wherever I go, he comes.

            Or, I am at work.

            I wait for opportunities, such as his planning a guys night out so I can have time alone, but those instances are very rare indeed.

            I don’t mean to make excuses and I realise that I do. What can I do?

            I know I need some extra help and moreover, I want your help, very much.

            I know you’re the best as you’ve already dragged me back from the original state I was in and speaking personally with you, was of immense value to me. Believe it or not, I’ve come a very long way since I first found this place and it’s been a genuine life saver for me. I know with certainty, that there is much more peace to be found here and I’m lucky to have stumbled across the site.

            When I can, I assure you that I will engage your services again. Even when I’m ‘forum quiet’ I’m still here everyday and reading your articles, so I can remember to stay away from my narc.

            I do need you HG and you know that I know it. It’s just a matter of never being alone.

          2. Use your lunch break at work or set off for work an hour early or return an hour late and call from your car (or somewhere quiet at work) and you can explain to your partner you have to go in early or stay late.
            Or arrange to see a friend, but instead use that time to call me or use the time to call me and see a friend.
            Explain you are going to the mall and use part of that time to call me.

            There are many ways to organise one hour to yourself to consult.

          3. Yes you would be but unfortunately unavailable. You’ll have to settle with a consult STBS

          4. Do you have related articles or books that would also address the ET? I have never had an addiction but I feel like my husband is my addiction. There are many times that it literally makes me sick to my stomach and I just want to break free of him forever and make it impossible to come into contact with him as well as completely block him out of my head and heart and to make the heartache just go away! This is my first time with a Narc and I am 38 years old. I no longer believe in love and trust absolutely nobody. I am always wandering when someone is nice.. why are they being nice and what angle are they coming at me for and with. I just want to erase everything of the last 7 1/2 years and re-wire my brain and heart.

            If there is anything that would be beneficial to help me that you wouldn’t mind recommending then I would greatly appreciate it!

          5. I’m treating myself to at least one HG Amazon paperback for Christmas, and fuck privacy. Too many people have written me off as another flaky actress, despite knowing perfectly well some of the things I achieved outside theatre, for me to have two fucks left to give.

        1. Hey STBS
          Certainly sounds like emotional thinking relating to Narc, they are insidious, and maybe even relating to partner (guilt?) when you were with Narc. How to get these individuals out of our heads? – not got there yet either. Porn might work, or maybe Pinot Grigio?

          1. Hi NotMe!

            Oh haha! Moscato for me 😉. Though as my bottle is now empty (however did that happen??) on to the whiskey, goes I! However, now that my curiosity is piqued, into the shopping basket goes Pinot Grigio, tomorrow! I’ll let you know how we find each other!

            I only thought of porn as a last resort, as it will be hard to indulge in my own thoughts if I engage in audio/visual stimulation of that nature. As I said, porn is not my switch, but, surely it is healthier than thoughts of a heartless bastard? Maybe it can take my attention for long enough to break the pattern of thinking of him.

            Worth a try.

          1. Hi Violetta,

            I had to google who he is, haha. My TV tastes run to much darker places than Poldark 😉

            You’ll generally find me hanging out wherever there is a more twisted tale!

            Ive tried thinking of anyone that I find attractive and it’s pointless.

            It just won’t go!!

            The stupid “button” is broken 🙄

    3. Soon to be sparkling,
      I actually had the opposite problem. Narc would pop in my head during the act and throw me off so I couldn’t orgasm. It did happen less and less frequently and eventually go away. I hope the same happens for you. 💗

      1. Hi BL,

        How interesting to have the exact problem in reverse! It’s amazing to me how we all differ to such degrees.

        I have to say that I wish that was my case.

        I am missing intimacy but the guilty feelings that I’m getting over this issue are preventing me from having any desire to make love.

        I’m glad it eventually left you and I am really hoping that I get to that point too!! ❤️ Thank you!

        Surely it will resolve, as I no longer hold this narc in high regard.

        1. STBS,
          I think I created a vicious cycle for myself – I would try to put narc out of my head, but I would worry so much about thinking of him during the act that of course it happened. Every. Single. Time. And because my brain had already decided that once I thought of him I was not going to orgasm, I stopped trying the second he took up residence in my head. I just had to stop worrying about it happening. The fear of it made it a certainty. Once I stopped getting frustrated and decided to let it run its course, things got better.
          I think you need to stop fighting yourself because you’ve convinced yourself that thinking of him is the only way you’ll orgasm, the way I convinced myself that I couldn’t if I thought of him. I personally believe it’s guilt for having been with the narc, and our mind’s way of punishing us – subconsciously, we are punishing ourselves for straying. My advice is to not beat yourself up if it happens… just roll with it and know it won’t last forever. 💗

    4. Soon to be sparkling, this was a problem for me. HG is right about reducing the emotional thinking. For many years he was my only sex partner but it was never boring. Every encounter was good, like really good. Fun, exciting, flattering and most times just straight up naughty. For a very long time I couldn’t even think about sex because it would trigger thoughts of him and that would trigger my emotional thinking. Even now I’d rather go without rather than risk a positive emotional thought about the ex N.

      1. Hi Mercy,

        You too????!!!!! I’m sorry to you as I know how tough it is, but I feel guilty to say, that I’m grateful that there is someone who can understand this.

        That’s where I’m at and I’m very lost about just what to do about it. I need to shake up my sexual interest to knock him from the rungs, but I don’t want to cheat on my partner again.

        Ive learned that some people are just not emotionally touch enough for affairs (namely…..myself 🙄) but I need him to cease to exist sexually, in my mind.

        I can’t ‘achieve’ by thinking of my partner (because I’ve became an actual a*sehole of a human being), but I need to reboot my sexual thoughts.

        How? I sure don’t know! I need a new thought train to consume me a bit or just enough to break my cycle from always returning to him.

        So Mercy, when you say you experienced this for many years…just how many years are you talking….?

        And do you still feel connected to the narc?

        1. STBS, how long has it been since you were with him? Have you tried to do something new with your current partner? Porn isn’t the answer, your mind will just insert the narc when you come to the finish line. Seeking a new partner would be a disaster. Think about it, having an affair to get over an affair. That will just create new problems.

          He was my partner for 8 years. You’d think after 8 years the sex would become boring but it wasn’t. I did things that were beyond my moral boundaries for him but that’s what made it exciting. His positive reaction to the things I would do for him is what hooked me. I just really loved to please him. You ask if I’m still connected. Yes, but the connection isn’t positive. It has taken a darker turn. Now when he is in my sexual thoughts, I think of him knowing I’m with another man or him knowing he doesn’t own what he once claimed. The thoughts are not positive but they are still of him. He’s always there to tip me over the edge. Lately it is getting better because the person he is disgust me. The fantasies do not come as easily anymore.

          1. Hi Mercy,

            I understand where you’re coming from. No moral boundaries and the delight of pleasing them is heady indeed. Almost as if their sexual pleasure becomes our sexual pleasure. If he’s happy, we’re in heaven.

            I agree about the porn. I don’t care much for it. Whatever floats ones boat, but it’s not my switch. I considered it was worth a try. But I don’t like it enough to even load it up.

            Trying something new…there really isn’t anything new we could try that we haven’t already. It’s more on the emotional level that something is wrong. If I’m not feeling love then I can’t make love (or have disgraceful hot sex). If I feel nothing, then I feel nothing. I can’t fake anything. My body language, my face, my responses, I can’t hide. I am as readable as a book and I’d rather reject him and have his resentment and disappointment than lie or be fake to him.

            It’s a problem. I wonder if I should just go off into the world with a whole new mindset (now that I know that monsters are indeed real) and maybe just try a whole new beginning. I’m caught between it’s never too late to live and what if I can’t manage alone in a world that really does frighten the hell out of me. I am just a bit lost at the moment and the guilt of seeing my partner everyday and not wanting him is a horrible feeling. It’s a blantant wrong and I’m hyper aware that I’m not a good girl for letting something that’s loveless continue due to my own insecurities of facing a new life. Also I do have a concern that once I sort out my own head, there may be something to save here. It doesn’t feel like there’s anything left, but believe me when I say that I’m wrong all the time. So I have no idea what’s right at the moment.

            I understand when you say that that the sex never became boring as I had that too. It amazes me as I hear all of my girlfriends saying sex is boring after a year or so….? Huh? This made no sense to me? 2 decades I had of sex that was never once boring!?

            I last time I had actual sex with narc was last October. The last time we spoke to each other was in April.

            It’s madness that he’s still present in my head. The “in love” feelings are gone. The crying is gone. The paralysis is gone. The longing remains. The insomnia remains. (Only 2 more nights of sleeping tablets left again).

            I don’t want a new lover as I’m confused about what I even want sexually and for the most part, I’m not feeling sexual at all now.

            I’m stuck in a catastrophic thought mill of knowing that the narc is gone and not feeling love for anyone at all now.

            I’m essentially destroying my relationship as I’m still in it, but it feels all wrong now and I am harbouring guilt that I’m stealing time from my partner when I’m not feeling love for him.

            I’m staying incase my head straightens out as I don’t want to be too rash or hasty about letting 23 years go. But at the same time I feel empty.

            I love to love and I’m bursting with it and have nowhere to direct it. It feels morally wrong to give it to my partner when I’m not feeling it for him. It would be fake and I can’t do that to him.

            It’s like being an explosive little cannan ball with no direction to fire away.

          2. STBS, Thank you for sharing your your story. It sounds like you’re at a crossroads and in order to be happy you’re going to have to choose a path. Before I found narcsite I use to think I was the queen of impossible relationships. My first 2 relationships were loveless but I stayed because of duty, responsibility, guilt and fear of the unknown. My relationship with the x N was a guilty pleasure but still an impossible relationships. Ironically, the narc relationship is what drove me here and ultimately change my life.

            It’s normal to feel guilt when it comes to your husband but don’t forget that he is a grown man and he is responsible for his own happiness. If he is not happy in his marriage then he has his own decisions to make. You cannot force yourself to feel what you don’t. I use to think that I had to give my love to someone too, but I’ve learned that sometimes that love becomes an obligation. You say you stay in case your head straightens out but how many more years of doing the same thing with no results will you stay? Will you find yourself not letting 25 years go or 30 years go? We don’t get these years back! You are not stealing time from your partner, that is on him. You are stealing time from yourself.

            Your sparkle does not come from your partner or from the narc you were with, it comes from you. The best thing I did for myself was not having a man in my life at all. It’s given me a chance to give my love to myself and I’m happier because of it. My head was so out of wack from the narcissist relationship and releasing myself of all other burdens forced me to take a look at myself. Narcsite was my starting point and it gave me the strength and desire to find my own happiness. I do want a happy, healthy loving relationship but I don’t feel empty without it. I still have that wild rebellious side that caused me to indulge with the narcissist but I’ve learned to indulge in other places. We don’t lose anything when we don’t have a partner in our life. It’s an opportunity to gain and grow from the things we’ve learned and ultimately it gives us more love to give.

            Only you know what’s right for you and your current relationship but try to unload the burden and the guilt. Let your partner take half that load. Let him make his own decisions about his happiness while you take care of you!

          3. I really hate it when I am editing and I hit send accidentally. Very frustrating!

          4. Mercy,

            Those were some very wise words to STBS…

            These words especially resonated with me:

            “The best thing I did for myself was not having a man in my life at all. It’s given me a chance to give my love to myself and I’m happier because of it. My head was so out of wack from the narcissist relationship and releasing myself of all other burdens forced me to take a look at myself. Narcsite was my starting point and it gave me the strength and desire to find my own happiness. I do want a happy, healthy loving relationship but I don’t feel empty without it.”

            Glad to see you back and commenting.

          5. Thank you WhoCares, it is good to hear from you too. I’m still a work in progress but I have had moments in my recovery that might help others.

    5. Soon To Be Sparkling,
      Yes, if I get into a relationship with a Narcissist, I will only think about that person, and continue to do so for a long time afterwards. I know I am addicted to Narcissist.

      1. If you are no longer in the relationship with Narcissist good for you. Please dont get into another one you have been through enough .
        Its hard to know but HG is here for us.

        1. Hi Pati,

          I won’t get mixed up with another one and I won’t let him come back.

          I do believe my partner is one, but I can’t ever leave my family now, so that just has to stay as pretty much irrelevant.

          I don’t know what the future holds, but I can’t really see myself ever leaving my family.

          And yes, it it nice to have a place to come to and that HG helps us when we can. It’s like a home away from home. Which sounds weird but this place has given me a lot of comfort. Especially when I can’t sleep, I just read and try to really make myself understand it all.

          I do appreciate all of you! Xo

      2. Hi ANM,

        You and me both.

        Their bastardization of love certainly leaves it’s calling card, long after they’ve gone.

  8. I believe that Dr E was missing the main point – that being an Ultra HG has a lot of tools to assert control and the sex is only one of them.
    His questions about HG’s future loss of potency were out of touch.
    Being a Dr ( although he might not be necessary a MD) he should know better that sex is not only the penetrative one.
    I have heard that some women prefer oral or even digital ( fingering, not the cyber one) sex.
    So let have a look at this scenario: A Greater Narc ( not HG) , middle aged, a silver fox with still good body, a stellar career with all perks ( money, properties, a beast or 2 in the garage ) and razor sharp mind . He has lost the morning wood, he might have some form of ED . But his fingers and his tongue are still magical.
    Obviously such a Narc won’t suffer any shortage of intimate partners, especially those ones that do not value that much the classic act of copulation but prefer alternative forms or have low libido.

    1. Correct.

      1. Sex is just one method of exerting control. Yes, it is a major one (see the book Sex for why) and is the most effective (see the book Sex for why) but it is not the only one available. There are many other methods available, both benign and malign, by which we can exert control.
      2. Sex, as you identify, is not just about penetration with the penis. There are many other implements that can be utilised, chief amongst which is the mind. This is used very effectively by Cerebrals and Elites.

      The loss of sexual potency will be more of an issue to Lesser Narcissists (LL and ML) , because their “skill set” is limited as is their access to resources. The UL has a limited skill set, but usually has greater resources and therefore if sex fails as a method of manipulation, there are other resources that he or she can turn to. The Greater Narcissist is not only more likely to be have looked after himself to ensure sexual potency and performance, he has a much wider skill set available to him and is able to draw upon substantial resources.

      Of course all of these questions on this particular topic just demonstrates what a group of perverted degenerates are out there!

          1. Am very much liking your concept of the head fuck.

            It’s all about the mind.

            You clearly delineate the difference between the somatics, the cerebrals and the elites. Victim’s can go fuck themselves.

            Sex begins in the mind and ends in the body. ONLY the Elites can straddle both arenas.

            Fascinating.

      1. I really love this book HG and I am eternally grateful that you wrote it! When I read it for the first time I was shocked because for me, personally sex ( the consensual one) is always equal to pleasure and I never ever used sex to control anybody or to extract monetary or non monetary benefits , like career advancement or promotion.
        The book was an eye opener and gave me the answers that I was desperately looking for during my marriage and why the other Narc , the younger one was so keen to pursue me.

        I personally found some of the questions not quite appropriate. Yes , everybody on this blog can express their opinion but asking a stranger about the number of their sexual encounters or their sexual performance doesn’t show respect, self respect and a class. I partially blame the mass media about – open any women or men magazine and you will see at least one article “ How to make her O” “ How to make her scream”. It is kinda of blame shifting that he, the poop dude is solemnly responsible for her climax .
        It is not . If a woman doesn’t bother to learn a basic anatomy and her own body, her own erogenous zones, her very own private parts, then she cannot blame their partner for her lack of satisfaction. If she fakes it – the relationship won’t last long for many reasons.

        Thank you very much for the detailed reply and further explanations on this topic, greatly appreciated .

        1. You are welcome.

          The boundary violations you refer to in your second paragraph are borne out of narcissists controlling the narrative which then impacts upon non-narcissists as they are conned into believing that this narrative is “how it is”.

          1. I would think that most of the messages conveyed in mass media are “narcissists controlling the narrative” – hence, why the non-narcissists feel as those they never measure up.

          2. Dearest HG: On your already long list, I wish you would consider putting the famous feminist Gloria Steinem under the Tudor-scope, in the fullness of time. I remember that at one point late in her life, she married and many of her regular and supportive and professional and rabid etc, followers felt betrayed and directed the blue touch paper towards her because she married. But, as I think about this now, she may have married to have her personal Primary Aims met, if she actually were a Narcissist, or maybe she rejected her theory that women need not attach? There was such a tumult over her marrying, that I never had the energy nor concept knowledge, (I know about feminism, but I never studied it formally nor informally) to fight through all the resulting madness and mayhem in Feminist Theory that she caused. And, I had only heard of her famous name before, but I did not know what her tenets were, but I do know that some women actually and shockingly said that they wanted to kill themselves when she married, and that she ruined their lives, and that she betrayed them. Many other women said that because she was rich (I guess they knew her income?) and famous, that of course she could find a desirable mate at her late age, but many said they wasted their lives by listening to her, and were too old to redo their misfortune of listening to her tenets, on their economic and social level. And hearing about all that did interest me. Anyway, because, after being on your blog, I realize that sex does attach women. Look at what you are dealing with on here, first hand. I am one of the few that attached without being intimate with the person, that I have read about on here, written by those readers that do post. And I know that I should be thankful that I did not ever become physically intimate with the Narcissist that I became enamored with, However, largely because his 4 jealous Lieutenants, became an immediate roadblock. But because others interfered, the entire scenario feels so surreal and incomplete to me, because I will never really know, but I do understand a lot of what would have probably happened by listening to other readers and by reading your work. But I think that a lot of this feminist thinking running around out here is jamming a lot of females up, and causing us to too easily become involved with wrong men after wrong men. Like, we have been set up to fail, as quiet as it is kept. And Gloria Steinem et al, is a big name regarding how modern females have been groomed to behave and to carry themselves, in modern times, especially in Western Culture and including all women that follow western culture as a role model. She and her people controlled and set up a lot of the narrative and behavioral expansion for modern women. Is Gloria Steinem a Narcississt.

          3. PSE: You’re not alone. I didn’t do mine either, which I rather regret, now that I see experiencing his dubious skills might have broken his hold on me sooner.

          4. Violetta: After reading HG Tudor`s work, and after reading and still reading the experiences of so many of his readers, we are better off that we did not become intimate with `our` respective Narcissists, in the end. There is also a mystery in sex, and some volatility, although these 2 factors are seldom discussed, and I would say it is our emotional thinking that is quite dissatisfied that we were not intimate with these 2 respective guys, but we are better off, and it our emotional thinking that would love to suggest reasons why we should have pushed the issue, etc., of intimacy, for either good or bad reasons, or whatever reason our emotional thinking can think of that could possible work to get us to reflect upon or to actually try to be intimate with the Narcissists: All HG Tudor wisdom. However, we shall let our Logic win this round, yes? And not fantasize intimately about these 2 guys, neither in a good way nor a bad way: You say, Violetta, that the entanglement may have ended for you sooner with sex, but you do not know that. It may have been drawn out for you longer, as well, but of course emotionally thinking does not like to voice that scenario and that possibility, right? Emotional thinking is so deceptive and cunning. But, we cannot know what would have happened, because of the inherent mystery and volatility involved that we can not predict. So, it is good that we are out of it. And, our reckless emotional thinking will just have to begrudgingly accept that it will not be satisfied in our respective cases. And get over it. And logic, that champion of ours, that is so often disrespected, shall have, once again, another un-praised victory, on our behalf.

          5. Dearest HG: I just took a peak for the first time ever into Gloria Steinem, even though I knew of her, as a cultural phenomenon. But, I am feeling brave today. HG, she had actually denounced marriage and then she married quite late, I see, at 66 years old, and on top of that, guess whom she married??? WOW! The father of one of my most favorite actors in one of my most favorite movies, Christian Bale, of the movie, American Psycho, his father, of all people. So funny. hahaha! I found this article right away just now on my first pass on google, however, HG, I have noticed that Google is rewriting history, by pushing its new type of search engines, at an amazing pace. NONE of the hysteria and tumult and outrage that happened, in the Feminist community, when she married, is mentioned in this article, but I do not have to google ad nauseam to uncover this fact, nor to even know this fact, to google it in the first place, BECAUSE, I have first-hand living memory. She created a crisis. Her books were burned and everything. Also, some women in Feminist Theory classes in college/university, etc, were extremely upset and confused. Some even changed their majors. I do not care in the least what google says. I remember! It was a big scandal in the Feminist movement. HG: Here is a softly-couched article that came up on my first past when I typed in her name on Google: [~~~~~~~~~~~~Marriage at 66 for radical feminist Gloria Steinem
            By Philip Delves Broughton in New York12:00AM BST 07 Sep 2000
            GLORIA STEINEM, the feminist who once said marriage turned women into half-people, has wed for the first time aged 66.
            But as if to prove that age has not blunted her radical edge, she chose to be married at the home of a fearsome Cherokee Indian chief named Wilma Mankiller. Ms Steinem married in Oklahoma at the weekend according to Cherokee custom, in which the word “partners” was used instead of “husband and wife”.
            Her husband, David Bale, 61, is the father of the English actor Christian Bale, who starred most recently in the film American Psycho. A South African-born businessman who lived most of his life in England before moving to America 10 years ago, Mr Bale made his fortune importing skateboards to America. This is his third marriage.
            Ms Steinem seemed as surprised as anyone by her role as wife. She said: “Though I’ve worked many years to make marriage more equal, I never expected to take advantage of it myself. I’m happy, surprised and one day will write about it, but for now I hope this proves what feminists have always said, that feminism is about the ability to choose what’s right at each time of our lives.”
            Ms Steinem rose to prominence in the Sixties as a journalist in New York. Her report on life as a Playboy Bunny was an instant hit, and over time her writing became more political. In 1971 she joined forces with another radical feminist, Betty Friedan, to launch a magazine for women called Ms. The debut issue contained a full-page petition for the legalisation and regulation of abortion.
            Her numerous affairs with men ranging from black athletes to Jewish billionaires earned her a risqué reputation to go with her intellectual one. For years she denigrated marriage and said the chances of her marrying were extremely small.
            In 1987 she said: “I don’t think marriage has a good name. Legally speaking, it was designed for a person and a half. You become a semi non-person when you get married.” She has known her husband for 10 months. They met at a benefit for her political group, Voters for Choice, of which Mr Bale is a supporter.~~~~~~~~]

        2. Claire,

          “If a woman doesn’t bother to learn a basic anatomy and her own body, her own erogenous zones, her very own private parts, then she cannot blame their partner for her lack of satisfaction.”

          Good point.

        3. @clare
          What about when a woman does know what she wants and her partner is still not attentive?
          I’ve slept with women and of course women talk about sex, so I know for sure that when women express disappointment a lot of time it’s because their partner is not attentive and sensitive to their needs.
          The women who are most disappointed are usually being disappointed by a narcissistic partner. I can guarantee most lessers and Mid-Range men are wack at sex and will blameshift their lack of skills on their partners supposed “close mindedness” when really they are just not listening.
          This isn’t the 1950’s most women masturbate and have sex toys.

          1. It doesn’t have to be a lack of skills though. N-ex was proficient and paid close attention. But for an empath (even a dirty, dirty one) a hand full of orgasms and a polished performance doesn’t make up for a lack of intimacy and connection at a differnt level that is truly shattering.

          2. Hi Notme
            I don’t disagree.. I just don’t think it’s “blameshifting” to hold men to higher standards when it comes to sex.
            I would not be able to live with myself if I didn’t leave a woman satisfied. Why do women report receiving more orgasms from a lesbian relationship than a het relationship?
            Speaking from experience it’s not that hard to find your way around a vagina.. even if your penis ain’t doing it, there are other ways.
            At the end of the day if a man is content to just ejaculate inside of you and expect you to be satisfied with that, you don’t need to explore yourself more… you need a new man and some new dick! Facts!

          3. Hi Witch, agreed, communication and mutual satisfaction is key. I’m laughing at myself currently for being so interested in this topic. Clearly sex is like air, no big deal until you’re not getting any. Have you had experience with female Narcs? I’m freshly escaped from Narcville and eschewing all men atm, narcs or otherwise. Apart from HG of course, I used to listen to audio books in bed, now I go to bed with HG and Knowing The Narcissist.

          4. Hi Witch,
            If a woman knows what she wants but her partner is still not attentive , there are 2 possible cases:
            1) A very unexpected partner who doesn’t deny her satisfaction deliberately. It doesn’t mean he is a narcissist.
            A woman could help him during the act using verbal ( not barking commands thou🙂) and non verbal communication (changing positions, putting gently his hands, mouth on her body on the places she wants them to be).
            If she prefers a slower thrusting or a deeper penetration this could be easily achieve contracting the muscles surrounding her pelvis / vagina and/ or changing the position.
            A genuine person will respond positively to the above.

            2) He is a Narc and using the sex to control,
            Hence , the blame shifting from the Lessers and MidRangers.
            HG had explained in details in his marvellous book “Sex and the narcissist” .

            Another case could be a woman being a narcissist herself and no matter how hard her partner tries to satisfy her, she blames him/her for her lack of enjoyment and/or orgasm.

            You have mentioned in another comment if yours that many women achieve more orgasms in a lesbian relationship. It could be a case of subconscious thinking that ejaculation is a dirty thing, that male body parts are disgusting, etc . This subconscious thoughts are usually due to a traumatic sexual experience ( rape, molesting) or sexual preferences to the same sex or woman being raised by very dogmatic, religious parents and so on.

            I have never felt aroused by another woman although I have been pursued; groped without my concern , approached by ladies so my comments on this topic are based on the intimate relationship between 2 people from the opposite sex.
            Off topic – an ejaculation itself is a trigger for the final O for some😉.

          5. @not me
            I believe I did come across a female narcissist for a very short while. She was pushy into getting me into bed (of course! standard narc move.)
            She seemed to believe she was the “man” in her relationships including in the bedroom… however it didn’t happen that way. I ended up giving more than I received.
            She enjoyed herself.
            A few days later she tries to suggest that it can’t happen that way again and (to cut a long story short) she wanted me to assume the role of a “pillow princess” (cringe lesbian politics I’m sorry!) I lost my shit, objected and decided to end the affair; which led to her trying to threaten me. She also made statuses about me on Facebook using social stigma against bisexuals as leverage. I didn’t care until she identified me with a video (non-intimate, don’t worry.) That was humiliating because she had a lot of lesbians on her facebook from my area, some of which I have seen at events and everyone knows everyone else in this community.
            I snitched to the police and they must have warned her cause the posts were removed.
            And that was that.

            Another woman I dated for about 5 weeks – she was narcissistic. During lunch out, she warned me not to get fat. I ended it and that was that.

            Now, I’m engaged to a wonderful empathetic woman. I’m very lucky to have her.

          6. Hey Witch, sounds like same meat, different gravy with female Narcs, thanks for sharing.
            I feel a bit like I’ve fallen into some alternative reality with this stuff. I want my head and my life back! I think openess and kindness are the most important things in the world and I feel that’s served me well up until this chapter of my life. I’m railing agsinst giving it up or changing because of this prick. I hate that my open mindedness about sex has contributed to this shit too. I think as well as fuel from my all too evident emotions, the residual benefits I provided were a big draw gor him, not sex, as I understand that that was about control but the fact that people always come to talk to me and he fucking loved it, more fuel. Argggggghhhhh!

          7. @Not me… Not even sure what to say. This post from HG has gotten crazy response. I’ve been in here for quite some time and so I’m bowing out and letting you all figure it out. 💕

          8. @clare
            I agree that shame, guilt, and trauma can impact on how quickly it would take a woman to relax and be able orgasm.
            However in my opinion I think you give men too much credit.
            Women have more orgasms in lesbian relationships because women are more sensual and focus more on the clit.
            A lot of men think that once they ejaculate sex is finished.
            Men watch porn and see a woman getting daggered with a penis and they think that’s all there is to it.
            Women require more of a build up towards penetration because we need time for our vaginas to get moist and relax.
            I also read a survey which reported that most of the guys who took part expressed disinterest in a woman’s pleasure if they were not in committed relationship.
            I know women talk about their sexual partners so that could never be me, because I couldn’t live with that kind of reputation and I don’t understand men who can.
            So I’m all for men’s magazines providing some much needed education.

          9. Witch—the obvious answer is to not limit to a man or a woman. Just sleep with a couple and get all in one. It’s like a two for one sale. Easy fix to who does what better.

          10. @lorelei

            I like how you think…
            I hope the guy can handle being outshined by me though 😆

          11. HAhaha Lorelei – a couple! Liking your style there! Another plus to that would be at least you have someone’s to talk to afterwards.

  9. HG

    I need to know so something very important.

    A couple of years ago a very interesting manuscript landed in my lap. It’s a bizarre piece of work.

    But what I need to know is, is Oscar Wilde one of yours or one of mine?

    Please and thank you x

          1. HG

            I should explain.

            In 2017 a orphaned manuscript almost literally fell into my lap. I requested permission from the Bodeleian to publish and they granted it.

            It was dictated to a third party by a man who was running around the edges of Wildes circle. Hes right there at the trial. Indeed, I strongly suspect he was briefing the newspapers. You see, Bosies brother, Viscount Drumlanrig had an affair with the Prime Minister, Rosbury. During the trial, the PM was very Ill. No fucking wonder. He was terrified of being exposed. My man had also being doing the deed with Rosbury. And Bosie. It’s all terribly incestuous.

            Then there is the mystery of the missing emeralds. In todays money, two million pounds worth of jewels went missing. Hed obtained them on credit from a Oxford jeweller. Almost sunk them. No one knows what happened to them.

            I spoke to the jeweller. Alas they dont have their own original purchase ledgers but by gum, they were still very cross indeed.

            Ostensibly, the jewels were given to the actress, Elen Terry. I’ve also spoken to her Trust and they confirmed that there was nothing like that in her possession on her death. However, she was known to hold auctions in her life. I had been promised a copy of the catalogue of one of them but then, well, YOU happened HG and I had to leave the whole matter for now.

            It’s not just Wilde, its Verlaine, Beardsley, even the Dowager Empress of China (I’ve got some lovely sexy times info on her). Plus many others.

            Its largely been dismissed and not of merit by a certain Trevor-Roper, he of the Hitler Diaries fame. T-R is a tit. How DO these people get chairs at Oxford? Cos its certainly not how intelligent they are.

            Might be about time I dusted it off.

            Cheers HG.

        1. The first round of Quantitative Easing or an ocean liner are not narcissists and therefore cannot be Greaters, AS2016.

          1. So annoying. Was just trying to save my fingers you know.

            Instead I had the inadvertent affect of making you use yours more. I’m learning…

            Queen Elizabeth I

          2. Dearest HG: hahaha. Regarding QE1: Rarely does anyone `pull a fast one` on our Alexissmith2016. I can now say, I was there when it happened. Bravo! Sorry Alexis . I am afraid that HG won this round. lol.

          3. Thanks PSE – not quite! HG hasn’t posted my response to his where I won hands down.

            But just to be on the safe side I’m going to go and hide somewhere very far away indeed.

        2. Alexis: Was QE1 a greater HG? HG Tudor: The first round of Quantitative Easing or an ocean liner are not narcissists and therefore cannot be Greaters, AS2016. PSE: Hahahaha. I am sorry Alexis: Your sincere question contrasted with HG`s polymathic wit, brought tears of laugher to my eyes. Huzzah! And Laughter is good medicine. Plus, I am laughing with you and not at you, Alexis, of course, because you ARE a champion in your own right, usually, thus the Question and Answer is resultantly so funny to me. That is the breakdown on why there are tears in my eyes over this. :)

          1. PSE I completely understand you’re laughing with me and not at me. HG does have impeccable wit it’s true.

            Awww and thanks for saying I’m a champ – you’ve made my day!

            You’re a total champ too PSE xx

          1. Violetta: I live in NYC, a big financial town, and I have an interest in finance, especially the shady side and all of the shenanigans going on, like QE1 and 2, etc. Plus, I live a few blocks from the pier on the Hudson river where the QE docks when she comes to NYC. So what HG said was so funny personally to me, because of all that, plus Alexis is so smart, and I like her, but even so, I felt a touch of friendly shadenfreude, because people feel things like that at times for no discernible reason, and she is so strong and witty usually, and all that made me laugh as well, because of myself really, and because we all know that she was asking about Queen Elizabeth I. HG pulled a fast one. And I found it particularly hilarious. HG has pulled a few fast ones on me. So, I enjoyed seeing him pull one on Alexis, for a change. Hahaha

        1. Liza: `Ours`: not in a possessive sense, but like a named mutual member of a particular group, sometimes in an exaggerated instance. So in this case, a mutual member of Narcsite. So, for example, I would say that our Liza is not practicing to be a slave to her emotional thinking, versus another person named Liza that is a member of a different website, that binge watched only romantic love stories day in and day out, until all of her computer access had to be hidden from her. That is not our Liza, that is here with us here on Narcsite. That is another or a different Liza.

        2. Liza: Yes, Liza. Ir is okay for you to say that you love me. You can say it, because you are Our Liza. Any other Liza would have to be heavily vetted before she could say she loves me, and she would even have to explain to me why she loves me in great and convincing detail, first.

          1. i’m such a lucky person, i even get to go without having to explaiin, if i wasn’t me, i will be jealous of me.

          2. Liza: Hahaha. I have the fortune to be acquainted with Luck, in my life, as well, and understand, at times, some of the envy directed towards me, and I forgive.. lol

    1. Renarde
      I am sorry the reality of Oscar Wilde makes you sad but come on. Have you seen his eyes? And the Picture of Dorian Gray is such a case study! A good one, though…I love that novel.

      1. Desiree

        Ok ok. I get it. Dear Dorian was a cunt. Picture in the attic, the beast which must be caged.

        I had hoped otherwise.

        It’s that he took on The British Establishment. Which makes me very happy indeed.

        But he lost. Poor guy.

      2. He certainly has no compassion for actors. He is hell to memorize. You don’t have any cue lines, except for the occasional plot exposition. It’s mostly, “insert epigram here.”

  10. Dear HG 💙 will a Cerebral Narcissist touch a lot?
    At a quiz night there’s a guy who’s doing a PhD in microbiology. He’s not smart like you HG. He is not at all.
    Anyway, he’s definitely a narcissist and very obnoxious, and needs attention from constantly ranting and telling jokes to the group.
    I did an experiment when I first met him and I complimented another guy at the table. The narcissist protested and claimed he did the same as that guy.
    This narcissist asked me on a date and he touched me a lot, even on the leg. So maybe he’s Elite not Cerebral. He also exercises a lot (running).
    He looks like Norman Fucking Roswell (Lana Del Rey) but with a bigger head and more condensed face and he’s 6 foot 4 or something, with glasses.

    1. Somebody who touches you a lot on a date is not recognising a boundary. This does not mean from this act alone that the person is a narcissist. It is however a red flag.
      Would a Cerebral Narcissist touch a lot – no.

      1. Thank you HG 💙 I didn’t go on a date with him. At the quiznight he touched me and asked me on a date. So that’s even worse for boundaries. He is definitely a narcissist, he shows it nonstop.

        Oh he must be Elite then. I thought he was the first Cerebral I’d met.

        1. Whitney. Dang, girl! Where are you meeting all these guys! I need to hang out with you. Hahaha!

          1. Hahahaha PSE that would be fun 😁 I know so many narcissists and weird people. We could analyse everyone based on HG’s work. It unfolds before my eyes.
            I was literally blind all my life! I had no self-awareness. I’m fascinated that I’m a magnet for narcissists and psychopaths.

          2. PSE, the UMR Somatic was in Fury and stormed out of the sport we play last night, because I signed something for my business “behind his back”. I did it 3 months ago and he already “forgave” me for it. He just shows up at my shop all the time and I’m sick of being around him cos he’s so angry and has a flurry of complaints. He has a job interview today and he says if he gets it he’s gonna put $1000 a week into my business 😂 it’s not his business is he literally insane?!!!!
            I never want to see him again. I want to be in peace.

        2. Whitney. This guy is already acting as if he is attached to your business. He thinks about your business. He works out how much of his budget that he could place into your business. He wants long term involvement with your business on a timed frequency of a once a week money injection into your business. And, he frequents your place of business. Depending upon how important your business is to you, you may have a problem. Unless you can just sell him your business and leave town, and start another business. And if you ever take money from him for your business, and he can document that you took his money, he will have leverage against your business, with or without a business contract with you. By legal and common law. Both in and out of court. Your word against his. Be careful. You have to handle this very smartly, Whitney.

          1. Thank you for listening to me PSE. I like talking to you.

            I won’t take money from him. I was just wondering if this man is suffering from Magical Thinking-
            Magical Thinking wasn’t apparent yet when HG did the Narc Detector earlier this year.

            HG said this Somatic is either MMR or UMR so I’m saying UMR (makes me feel better about myself).

            Yes he thinks about my business constantly. But he has no stake in my business.

            He helps lay flooring and practical things. He almost single handedly moved all the stock to my new location 😆

            He gets fuel by shaking customers’ hands and introducing himself, introducing himself to neighboring business owners, by taking pictures at customers’ houses and telling them he’s a photographer, by dealing with other businesses agressively and thinking he’s in charge of my business, and by bossing me around

            I asked how I could repay him for helping and he said “You can never repay me. You’ll always be in debt.” My friend said that sounded scary.

            I can’t sleep at night because I’m confused by everything.

  11. Sex for control only and no interest in the way it emotionally or physically feels?

    It’s a very foreign concept to try to understand.

    So then, if a woman offers to do something for the narcs pleasure only, does that then mean that the narc is more interested in the fact that he has made a woman want to soley please him, than the sexual pleasure he will receive from his own orgasm?

    Does that mean also then, that a narc could exist without any sexual encounters at all with his partner? That it’s relevance is; sexually 0% and the control is 100%?

    Would that be accurate HG? Or, is there some give in the percentages?

    1. Sex is a weapon of mass seduction. It is about control and fuel. Yes, if feels pleasurable because we have nerve endings like you do, but the role of sex goes beyond pleasure for us, it is about control and fuel as explained in the book Sex.

      1. Thank you for your response.

        Yes, I’ve read the book. It was an excellent read.

        However, from your articles and also from the book, I read the narcs interest in sex as purely fuel based..?

        I refer to Chapter 3 “What are we thinking during sex?”.

        I noted a lack of sexual sensation in lieu of fuel. My error.

        I then wondered if the feeling of sex is the same for your kind as it would be for a normal man in that respect.

        You’ve answered yes. Which I appreciate knowing as I had considered that my narc may not of even enjoyed the sex act at all with me, if the purpose was for control and not pleasure.

        Thank you HG!

      2. Dearest HG: I agree with you completely that Sex is a weapon of mass seduction. And mens` ability to obtain sex so easily came about when the Big Bad Wolf sect of Feminism (Feminists: including all the largely hidden male Feminists, that go largely undiscussed, because these men wisely hide behind the women, and these same men energetically put into place many of the tenets of Feminist theory, while many women are pushed to the forefront as the mouthpieces of Feminism) have made many women easy sources of fuel, and have made multitudes of women various forms of Little Miss Riding Hoods to go largely unprotected through the dark forest of modern life. This sect of Feminists, both male and female Feminists, have created quite a societal disaster by grooming modern women to think that sex is not that big a deal. So, many of us learn the hard way, that it is that big a deal. In so many ways. Over and Over. While still saying, many of us women, regarding sex,` it ain`t much,` as we have been groomed to say, and despite the copious amount of evidence that says otherwise. Including murder over sexual incidents. However, all those Feminists experts, including the hidden males, could not be wrong, could they be, many will ask? Yes. They were and are still wrong. And many of us see and live the errors of their teachings, every day, and their errors are multiplying in society like a runaway train. And regarding the statement that many of us say regarding sex, I agree with what the late singer/artist Prince says about sex, at a higher level : ~ Without Love, It Ain`t Much ~

        1. When he said, “Come in!”
          With that sickening grin
          How could I know what was in store?
          Once his teeth were bared
          Though, I really got scared
          Well, excited and scared

          – Little Red Riding Hood, “Into the Woods”

          1. Violetta: I am very pro male and I admire the male gender as a whole, tremendously. And, I am thankful that they are part of the creation. Nevertheless, many men were going way too far, and taking too much advantage of many women, and deceiving women just too much, and pushing a double standard too far, to the point that many men were just brutish and criminal and abusive and unethical just way too much against many women, and something had to be done. And, so some aspects of the Feminist movement, (which is also comprised of hidden powerful males in the background and rarely emphasized) was very good. And I approve. But, some parts have been bad, as well. And some parts have gone way too far against men, as well, and are going to bring about a male backlash that has already started with the Red Pill and MGTOW guys, etc. that are vocal, but a lot of guys that are not vocal (and so not usually discussed), are part of the same backlash growing against some of the bad side of Feminism, as well. And many women are going to pay, this time around. Extremes in movements cause a lot of problems for everyone.

        2. @PSE
          I think it depends on what people mean when they suggest that sex is not a big deal.
          Are they referring to subjective values?
          Are they referring to attachment?
          Biology?
          Risk?

          -Sex is certainly a big deal for most women biologically due to the risk of pregnancy and greater risk of obtaining an STD from sleeping with men
          -Sex also releases “bonding hormones.” So sex can feel like “a big deal” physiologically and psychology (if you believe love and sex are inseparable, which may be a deeply ingrained belief that is hard to shake off.)
          -Sex can also make you more vulnerable to predators/narcissists.
          (The more people you let into your intimate space the more chances you have of coming across a psychopath and the more vulnerable you will be in that context.)
          -Women are also at greater disadvantage orgasmically when sleeping with strange men (generally speaking.)

          However, in my opinion I would agree that sex is not a big deal in the context of subjectively judging someone’s value based on how much or how little experience they have had.

          I’ve been able to sleep with some people without the expectation of commitment and without associating it with being “in love.” In that respect it wasn’t a “big deal” to me. Was I completely without feeling. No. Of course I cared. I just didn’t need them to wife me in order to be comfortable with having sex or to avoid feeling “used.”

          1. Witch: Well, don`t ask me about what is meant by grooming modern women to say that sex is no big deal. And what does this all mean? This is a question for MRS. Gloria Steinem: Only Gloria Steinem knows for sure, but she has been very busy with her handsome and rich and socially impressive husband (I took a peek today at him on google images during the time of her earth shattering marriage), and she is going here and there and she is out and about with him and with his son, the renown talented actor now her stepson, Christian Bale of American Psycho film fame, in tow, as well. lol And she `did good marrying a guy like that at here age, when he easily could have gone younger and he was at that age where men with wherewithal predominately go much, much, much younger,` and no wonder women feminist that followed her wanted to kill themselves when she married and then married that guy in particular. EXCEPT, she told the world that she was against marriage. And became famous on top of that. And most women were right, I see, after looking at his photo and his social standing and his bank account, that as a then 66 year old female, most of her followers that were then her age and even younger, could not and will not land a man like that when they are not rich and famous females like that raging anti-marriage platform feminist, Gloria Steinem was, when she turned a shocking about face before the world, and did go on and attach and marry at 66 years old, after telling other women to not do so. Hahahaha. And, he is younger than she is, if I read correctly. lol. Then, after the marriage, while her adherents burned her books, changed their majors in college/university away from women`s studies, contemplated suicide, and yelled that she ruined the best years of their lives to get a desirable man, because they believed her, and they cursed her out, while screeching in agony and dismay, and denounced her in many ways, and this all happened from Top Feminists to the young women proteges: The then newly minted MRS. Steinem tried to change the narrative about attachment and marriage, to her followers and adherents of her famous Feminist anti-marriage etc., platform. But, she would be shouted down and finally she shut up for a while. And NOTHING I am saying is from Google or any search on the internet. I REMEMBER when this happened. I only googled to see whom she married and what was her age when she did marry. But, her adherents were not buying her betrayal, at that time– her ambush against her own stance. They felt blindsided. But who knows? Time has past and all that is just some dust under the carpet now, right? As history is being rewritten about her and revisionism is hiding the embarrassment and scandal to Feminism regarding the unexpected marriage of the Great Gloria Steinem. Witch, Do As I SAY AND NOT AS I DO, Mrs. Gloria Steinem, should be able to answer all such questions for you about modern sexual practices and attachment and marriage theory, with whatever are the tenants of whatever is her new narrative, that will work, whatsoever. I forgot about her, until yesterday. And many modern women could call her, `Mother.` And, of course, `Betrayer.` And, I think she is a Narcissist.

          2. @PSE

            The blatant hypocrisy is very suggestive of narcissism.
            I have my own experiences with feminists groups. I would never be part of any “group” again. Like with anything ideological the narcissists take over and make it into a cult.
            There are some very wacky ideas that have developed in feminist circles. Namely “political lesbianism” which seemed to have inspired Gloria Steinem. The idea that women should suppress their desires for men and try to “become” lesbians. The amount of self-flagellation I’ve witnessed… no thanks!
            I’m all for people exploring their sexuality and I’m all for women realising their same sex attraction (however late in life) but I don’t believe in making people pretend to be something they are not.

          3. FemiFascists are just the other side of the coin. In the ’50s, they’d criticize other women for being insufficiently feminine. Now, it’s insufficiently feminist.

            But they’re still criticizing. That hasn’t changed.

  12. Women -remember when you thought a man who was more interested in your orgasm than his was the holy grail? Because I met N -ex when I was a sweet, young, clueless thing, his focus on me was very exciting. Having grown up prior to his 25 year hoover, it seemed that he had not done so. I was persuaded to go to a dungeon, was strapped down and spanked by a woman. It quite enjoyed it, did he just get to feel in control from that, as it was his idea?

      1. Hi Violetta, not one to be proud of! He had sent messages maybe yearly at other times during the 25 years. Sadly for me, on the last occasion, I replied. Doh!!!! I knew nothing of Narcs back then

        1. We are here to learn. I think the most helpful thing I’ve learned is the man I thought I loved didn’t exist. I had the clues–the way he’d change his opinions of movies and music, depending what the people around him said–but I didn’t know how to interpret them.
          As Gertrude Stein said, “There is no there there.”

  13. N-ex seemed to enjoy talking about sex more than having sex. Pushing boundaries mostly and being more and more outrageous, if he shocked me, he’d say ‘you have no idea how depraved I can be’ (grandiosity?) it was all about control for him and had to be a floor show. A bit boring really. Sometimes, all you want is a frantic @#$% but no, we had to lie top to tail, fiddling and talking for bloody hours, I think it avoided intimacy and was more like ‘playing’ than making love.
    HG I read the article fuel, fight or flight and remembered a lecturer talking about instinctive behaviours and the 4 F’s – fright, fight, flight and sex.

  14. At least this explains Wanna-Be Playuh Narc.

    He’d flirt endlessly when we worked together, he would accidentally brush up against me, even if it meant taking a roundabout route from his desk to a supply cabinet, sorta like going from Dover to Calais by way of Argentina, later I got weird hang-up calls, the timing of which changed if he happened to be visiting from his new job in a different time zone, but he never “did” me.

    Was he not attracted? Then why flirt with me at all? Why respond with efforts to get my attention, at times when I backed off supposing he didn’t want to be bothered by an unrequited crush?

    There were times I even thought he might be satisfying himself after or during those stupid hang-up calls, but I couldn’t imagine why anyone would do that if he could get actual sex. Weren’t pervs like that rejects who couldn’t get anybody?

    A mutual friend and former co-worker once said, “I know girls who’ve done WBPN. He’s not all that.”

    So if he had more power by making me think I was missing out than by letting me find out that he, indeed, “wasn’t all that,” he’d choose the power rather than the fair practice of lying between maids’ legs.

    What kind of man would do that?

    Well, now I know.

    1. NotMe!

      I’m sorry you went through this.

      You snagged a Cerebral. Go you lovely!

      Cerebrals are the utter aresewank of the Narc cadres. Think: they walk the walk but cannot talk the talk.

      Its reasonably rare to meet these fuckers. Bet you met him online. I wasted 9 months of my life on one. They have to talk. It’s all they have in their arsenal. But by the Goddess do they love to talk.

      They usually have average dicks and can come on a dime. Poor dears.

      1. Hey Renarde, he was/is a somatic apparently but obviously with a cerebral side as far as sex was concerned. We met in person initially 25 years ago but you are right, re-connected electronically a couple of years ago. And yes, I agree, a waste of life!

          1. Renarde
            I think I’ve had lucky escape, I think I am better off without him, I think he is a fuckwit. But…I’m still thinking about him and still feel the addiction that was instilled and although cognitively, I understand it wasn’t real, I miss him and feel ashamed that even though I know and I went, I haven’t let go. Yet

  15. I know you preferred Dr. O you would get her hot and bothered . I said this before perhaps having sex on her desk. I am sure she dreams of it and this topic would be perfect . Lol

      1. I am going to have to this topic is very interesting. I need to know what goes on this mind of yours when you are actually in bed with a women. .

        1. Pati.
          You stated….”I need to know what goes on this mind of yours when you are actually in bed with a women.”

          You need to get away from him so that you dont have to wonder what is going on in the mind of the person you are in bed with. Please you know he wants to be there it is not just for FUEL!!!!!

        2. Pati, you have this much interest and haven’t read Sex?!? You need to order it pronto girlfriend! You will find much insight into your own relationship as well.

          1. Pati
            Glad you’re reading Sex. The answers to your questions are in there. When you’re finished reading it the first time, start at the beginning and read it immediately again. You will find all the stuff you missed the first time when your mind was racing and you kept repeating “holy shit”.

  16. HG as a man gets older he sometimes may not be able to perform. How would that make you feel? Dr. E did have a point there.

      1. That good to hear . However they is medication. My dad is 81 and still performs my mom is 15 years younger with meds of course lol

          1. Agreed to much info. But what I was trying to say that men do take Cialis and Viagra to perform . There is nothing wrong with that .Even young men do. Life can get stressful sometimes and there is nothing wrong for asking for help.

  17. What happens If you couldn’t give a women an orgasm and you tired really hard and she couldnt. How would that make you feel?

          1. I think it’s irrelevant because HG doesnt have an issue therefore its irrelevant to him at the moment

          2. Wow! Someone’s eaten there Wheaties this morning. Calm down HG, we wouldn’t want you to blow a gasket! Haha

          3. That’s interesting because that is what this whole thread has been about, hasn’t it? You being able to blow?!

          4. One thing I have to say about you HG is that you have a very good attitude on life and you are not negative. Good for you .

          5. I believe it I just read Sex and The Narcissist and the room is still spinning from the experience.

          6. I think someone needs to go outside and roll around in the snow for a little while! 🙃

          7. FM1T

            He wont change. HG has no need to.

            So he wont.

            This is a glimpse into the mind of the Greater. Take it and learn.

  18. I can relate to the girlfriend that wanted to be controlled sexually for a few hours in order to escape the responsibilities she has in real life. No, being tied up or punished does not appeal to me but relinquishing control and being dominated for a short time is very freeing. I don’t see it as you do though. Someone who is use to being in control has to make the decision to give it up. If I give permission to be dominated sexually I have controlled the situation. Or at least I have made my own decision. In my opinion, being submissive in order to receive the pleasure that I want is its own form of control. 

    1. My favorite topics of discussion; sex and dominance hierarchies. I agree with your comment but I do like bondage and punishment.

      Personally, I’m glad Mr. HG Tudor would never give up control and be submissive. I don’t like weak men. Unless of course, he just wont admit to it.

      1. Njfilly, “I don’t like weak men”. The thought of a man that can show his weaknesses yet still have confidence is very sexy to me. It’s all about balance I think.

        1. Dear Mercy,

          I agree that it is all about balance. I believe the opposite, however. Many men lack confidence. They live within their weaknesses and don’t exhibit their strengths. To me, it is strength that is sexy. Strength among men, people in general, is lacking.

          This is why I think Mr. HG Tudor is magnificent. He is very strong. He has an iron will. Of course, if he felt remorse and empathy and still had his strength of will, it would be an even greater strength.

          1. Njfilly, maybe you are right or maybe we are looking in the wrong places. I think I’m at a place that I can spot the difference between a narcissist and a confident man. Finding the confidence to know I’m worthy of the later is were I am. At least we agree the HG is magnificent although submitting to a greater like him is a frightening thought.

          2. Dear Mercy,

            I’m glad you can spot the differences you noted. I’m glad you have confidence and you are definitely worthy.

            Mr. HG Tudor is a dangerous man. Dangerous men are valuable and necessary. It is a frightening thought, but very appealing. Life would be boring without danger.

          3. Njfilly,
            I have been thinking about what you wrote about weak men, would it not take a strong man to give up control and become submissive? One of the things a narcissist does not have is true confidence. He seeks and mirrors that from us. So my question would be, is he strong because he is dominate, or is he actually weak because he is afraid to give up that dominance? ( I’m not talking about you HG. )

          4. I had to put that in Mercy. I didn’t want to end up in the dungeon once again. I could tell that’s where I could end up if this conversation continues! Even if the disclaimer wasn’t true. 😉🙃

          5. Dear FoolMe1Time:

            Interesting question. It actually has many layers to it so there is not just one answer. Firstly, submissiveness is not always a weakness. and often is a choice. When you say “…is he strong because he is dominant….” is the he you are referencing a narcissist? I can’t answer with regard to narcissists as I just learned about them and that puts a new spin on the dominant/submissive dynamic. Also with regard to narcissists if there were more fuel to be gained by being submissive would he be submissive? What is most important; the need for control or the need for fuel? I don’t know the answer to that.

            “Would it not take a strong man to give up control and become submissive?” I think the answer to this depends on the circumstances. Strong men must ‘submit’ every day; submit to a higher authority, or a better idea, etc. In those scenarios, yes it is a strength that they can submit. If you’re talking sexual, in my opinion, no. No truly dominant man would ever become submissive sexually and it’s not a weakness it is his strength to be dominant and he could not be anything other than what he actually is-which is dominant. I don’t believe it is a weakness for a truly dominant man to be unable to give up his dominance sexually. He simply can’t. The same way you can’t make a truly submissive person be dominant. (in life or sexually). They just don’t have it in them. Although in that scenario it is a weakness for a submissive not to be able to be dominant. Also, he is not strong because he is dominant but rather he is dominant because he is strong. This is a very complex topic.

            There are different reasons that a man might want to be submissive to a woman sexually. Those reasons differ not only among the men but they also differ between the ‘vanilla’ community and the BDSM community. My answers here are only my opinion, but they are based on experience I have in this area, the reading I do on this subject (and I do a lot because I find it so fascinating) and also from what I learned through discussions on BDSM blogs. I have profiles on the dating sites and I start discussions with the men who respond to my profiles. (they are looking for sex but instead we talk! ha ha) One profile I seek a dominant man; the other I seek a submissive man. It’s very interesting. I also have a dating profile on a regular dating site.

          6. Thank you for giving me your perspective on this matter njfilly. I don’t think there is a right or wrong answer to the question that I asked you, I believe everyone will look at this differently simply because no two people are alike in there thoughts and needs. Take care njfilly. 🙃

          7. FM1T: I agree there are many perspectives on this issue. Thank you for sharing your thoughts.

          8. Njfilly,
            “ What is more important; the need for control or the need for fuel? “ we have been taught it is always about the fuel, but in saying that I believe being in control gives them that fuel.
            I was just waking up when I read your reply this morning and I missed that question. 🥰

          9. FM1T: So a narcissist would give up control to gain fuel, rather than loosing fuel by staying in control? Interesting. Thank you for your response.

          10. Njfilly,
            Control is fuel for a narcissist Nj. Someone like HG would not give up anything.

          11. Mercy, Please know this: you are very worthy. Take it to heart. Not being “enough” is the biggest lie. It is more about does this guy appreciate all you have to offer?

          12. Hi Mercy, Not sure my first reply went through, but if it did, this bears repeating.

            You are very worthy. You are more than enough. Take this to heart. It’s more about can this guy appreciate all you have to offer?

          13. FYC, thank you so much. Seeing your name in my notifications made me smile. I know I am worthy, I know we all are. Putting action to those words is where I struggle. Every day is a step forward and the reminders here are priceless. ❤️

          14. Fair enough, sweet Mercy. Once you acquire new knowledge, how do you purge a false belief? For example if I were anorexic, I would intellectually understand I am not fat but I would *feel* fat and find fault and continue to avoid food even though such actions would hurt me. Now consider worth. If I have not claimed my intrinsic worth and adopted it as my genuine belief, I would simply intellectually believe everyone is worthy and therefore I much be as well, but I would still *feel* unworthy. See how that works? So how does one abolish the false belief? It is by choice. Every single choice. Every time you make a choice, you create a path to a belief. Your internal dialog either reinforces or rejects your choices based on past choices. So if your internal voice says, “You are not worthy of X,” talk back to that voice and reject it. Instead, choose your worth. Recognize in yourself what we all see in you and claim it for yourself. Do it today. You deserve that. You are worthy.😘

            On a different note, how is work going? I hope far better.

          15. FYC, I responded to your comment but I believe it ended in the wrong place at the bottom of the comments.

          16. Be careful kissing too much HG ass. (No disrespect HG😘) This platform is about learning about how narcissistic abuse has affected you so you can learn and move forward. If you are looking for validation that is a clear sign you need to read up more.

          17. Dear Tammy:

            I am not kissing Mr. HG Tudor’s ass. I am merely expressing my opinion, and when I disagree, I state that as well.

            I am aware what this platform is about. I have learned and moved forward prior to arriving here. I stay because I enjoy his writing so much.

            I am not looking for validation from anybody on this blog or in real life. I only state my opinions regardless of whether people agree or disagree. I’m not sure what makes you think I am seeking validation, but yes, I will continue to read.

            Thank you for your concern for me.

        2. What the ever loving hell have I just read?

          None of you have any CLUE what it’s like attempting to submit to a Greater.

          You lot need to give your heads a wobble. You have no idea what it’s like in reality.

          You can never win. You can never get what you want. Ever. It will always be denied. What is true of those disgusting Middles is eleventy billion times true of Greaters.

          Never put your head willingly in the noose.

          1. Renarde, I don’t know of that was directed towards me but since I got the notification I’ll reply. If you look at my comment you’ll see that I said submitting to a greater is a frightening thought. A mid and a lesser I can recognize and stay clear of. A greater would have the ability to fool me and I know I would be helpless in a situation like that. Please read all of the comments before you generalize and direct your anger elsewhere

          2. Mercy

            Tammy has it bang on in her response to you.

            I apologise if my words have distressed you. I will echo others in that you ARE worthy. For future reference though my lovely, if I am addressing you personally, I will do so as I am now. Please chill. No offence meant, ok?

            I dont know your personal background Mercy but it strikes me that the concept of submission is ine that intrigues you. Now how far you have gone down that route, well again I dont know.

            What I can tell you is that in my time i have been in the utterly unfortunate position of being a geuine sub to all three schools.

            Actually, that’s a lie. I never really managed it properly with the Greaters. Actually that is a lie, I’ve never really properly submitted to any man.

            Of course, as submissive we can also run the ‘sub lite’ program.

            I do like very much FM1T but her words are also wrong. I am technically a sub but I’ve also been a Dom. Now THAT was empowering.

            True female Dom’s are incredibly rare. Most femdoms are in it for money. Findoms. They utilise their own middle narc qualities to rinse men. Standard.

            You do get geuine male subs but they are very rare. What you usually get are narcs who think they can control the Dom. Ha! That’s never going to happen.

            I interviewed male after male. I could tell they were having one off the wrist whilst on the phone to me. Monumentally disrespectful in my book.

            Once I understood that Fetlife (and I was well known on there. Too well known for my own good) was a very dangerous place to find Doms, I used it as a place to hone my writing skills. I used to hit K&P regularly.

            I stopped writing on there when John Baku introduced an algorithm which meant that users could search for pictures that had certain words in the tag. It was BDSM porn for free.

            Funnily enough, I had a huge issue with that. I stopped putting out writing for free and focussed on my own blog.

            Mercy, if you are on fet and using it to get a Dom then I urge you to stop. The D/s dynamic is just another form of the N-E bond. And one that is decidedly deadly. I am observing a dynamic right now that has all the hallmarks of death written all over it.

            I did read your comment regarding Greaters. Be very glad that one hasn’t come knocking at your door.

            All my advice is honestly meant. Again, apologies if my frank words have upset you.

          3. Renarde, I know that you address me specifically in your comment but once again I ask, is this directed towards me? And again I’ll say please read my comments before educating me on YOUR sexual preferences. BSD is not my thing.

          4. Mercy

            I have just told you, explicitly that when I refer to a person, I tag them.

            Cool if BDSM is not your thing.

            Chill. I’m not biting.

          5. Renarde, I’m not biting either dear. It’s taco Tuesday here. Nothing gets me down on Tuesdays

          6. My comment was actually directed to njfilly not Mercy. I think sometimes the replies can be difficult to tell who is being addressed. I actually replied to njfilly but not sure it actually showed up that way.

        3. FoolMe1Time
          giving up control is an admitance of fatigue and unability to keep it together in the long run, the execive need for control is an admitance of fear, none of these are stong, they are both damaged, they just cope in different ways.

      2. @njfilly
        I disagree that it’s weakness for a man to be submissive sexually.
        I’m taken but hypothetically I would not be opposed to a man who can receive (if you know what I mean.)
        On a different but related note, narc men do submit sexually. Midrangers can. I’m sure narcissists are also curious people and can derive fuel by what you’re willing to do for them between the sheets.

        1. Witch:

          There are probably many reasons for a man to be submissive. I am currently reading those reasons from the men themselves.

          I understand that my own opinions are probably formed by the anger, resentment and hatred that sometimes drives me.

          If a man can be submissive, he is not the man for me.

          Your last paragraph was interesting and I agree.

      3. njfilly

        Male subs aren’t necessarily weak men. Society has conditioned us to think that way.

        A lot of pro active male subs are actually victim narcs.

        1. Renarde:

          I agree you could be correct that they may not necessarily be weak men. I’m still exploring the reasons why a man would want to be submissive, and I assume there will be many varied reasons. I have this hatred toward weak men and I’m always willing to express it.

          I don’t think society has conditioned me personally to think that way. I believe my opinions come from my own anger and resentment. I think society is trying to condition us to believe men should be weak and that strong masculine men are toxic and I don’t agree with that.

          I think your last sentence is very funny. Of course they are victims.

    2. Mercy

      I’m a sex positive BDSM educator.

      If that gets you off, all good. Nothing wrong with a bit of slap and tickle. But Power Exchange is a different. It’s a version of the N-E bond but using the sex manipulation.

      Be careful.

      1. I was a slave to a Greater for over 6 years. What Renarde says is true – it is extremely dangerous and I wasn’t aware of that until I was in too deep. The brain washing was his art form and I asked for it as a rite of passage. Submission to that degree encompasses every aspect of life – finances, sex, career… he controlled it all. When I wasn’t following his direction closely enough I was chastised and made to feel like a failure. But the relevance to this article is that it all started with sex. The sex was good because of the adrenaline high that went with it. I am finally No Contact but it took a long time to get there and to ‘detox’. Although my losses are very similar to any Empath here, the danger was in how deep I went and, only by a miracle, that I got out. As an empath I naturally trusted everyone but was immersed in a virtual Narc hunting ground… my prize? I was caught by a Greater.

        1. olderandwisernow

          Wow. That’s shocking. That shows the tremendous strength of your character in getting out. Six years is a long time. Well done.

          You are completely correct, places like Fet are huge narc hunting grounds. Female subs/slaves largely have not one clue what they are getting themselves into until it’s too late.

          I do get really quite angry that in a society which already has massive issues with female sexuality, that when women choose to explore that side; they are abused more often than not.

          1. The bdsm lifestyle is professed to be one of deep trust and communication. That is the only way power exchange can be successful. As an empath, trust comes more naturally and so power exchange seemed ideal. I didn’t know that there are people so adept at lying. My logic kicked in within the first few years to see the lying but it took another few years to believe what I was seeing. HG is right in that the only way to battle against a narc is to turn off the emotional thinking and become entirely logical. I had to stop making excuses for his behavior.

            The Greater married this year to a naive woman who bought the dreams he sold. I fear for her and hope that she is strong enough to acknowledge what she got herself into.

            I commend you, Renarde, for speaking out and hopefully saving heartache for female subs/slaves in the lifestyle. I have seen many over the years start out with enthusiasm and then hear their disillusion until they finally disappear.

          2. O&WN

            The bdsm lifestyle is professed to be one of deep trust and communication.

            Yup. One of the biggest lies ever perpetrated on our kind; the submissive Empath. Ostensibly it’s the truth. We should be open and honest with our partners but do we really know our partner?

            Sadly, many women do not. They haven’t a frickin” scooby. Not until it’s far too late. I’m glad you got out. Every abused survivour is potentially one more voice against the horde.

            ET vs ER is an interesting one. Only the other day I asked HG if ET can be removed. No, it cannot entirely, he said. To paraphrase. We will always be enslaved to ET because it’s hardwired into us.

            I have largely freed myself of the ER burden through many, many hours of thinking and writing. ET though is another matter.

            Thank you for your kind words on helping subs and slaves. I hope I am, I just put it out there. Power Exchange is a very dangerous thing indeed. Youi’d be better off sitting in a box in the middle of a busy road (one of my relatives actually did that).

            I feel for you on the G aspect with the woman. If ‘the other’ got a handle, I mean truly, on how this stuff works then they would know that we, the enlightened, Are seriously not out to get them. Triangulation between us, the woman and them is so rife, so expected, that one cannot seem to get the voice heard over the signal to noise ratio.

            One day, they will wake up though. it’s in the nature of matters. And I guess we will be here to help them.

            If he is a Greater then it might take years. She will feel herself gradually being diminished. That’s the closest adjective I can get to how it felt for me, I was a trim UK 8/10 when I met him. At my largest I was 22/24. I have no problems with food. I do not overeat. Right now, I have the very opposite problem, I’ve almost completely lost my appetite. I lost the weight and have been a steady 12 for 5 years.

            The G was my first Dom. I loved him very much but he was a lazy fucker. And certainly not fit to control me. Ha! No one does!

            I threw everything back in his face and said a very clear, NO. I then went about my business. But I still loved him. Thankfully, that love has ended. Poor dear. And poor her. Nice lass. Bit dappy at times but you know, the youth of today et al.

            Again thank you. I never expect anything from people but when people do say well done then it gives me more energy.

  19. “Sex is actually rather boring”

    HG, I have never thus far insulted you by daring to pity you, but at this point, I must.

    Boring?!!

    This is the one time when the love to which you are usually relieved to be immune would make all the difference. My first makeout session was with a guy in Jr. High I seriously thought I loved. By that time, I, like you, had learned I could do that myself and invariably with more intense results, and this particular encounter did not involve “finishing off” for either.

    And it was better than going through the entire Kama Sutra with someone I didn’t care about.

    1. in this particular point, i agree with narcissists, the first time i understood how intimate relashionships work i found verry ugly and disgusting and couldn’t believe that people do it willingly, with time it evolved in “it’s an adult thing i will see into it later” but i didn’t realise that i was already an adulte and now i’m more like ” is it really necessary?”.
      i was really in love with that person i hade the beating heart and all the cliché things but i never felt like touching him and whenever he tries to touche me i panic. i mean i recongnise that a hug or a kiss is a display of affection and i’m happy to be granted this previleage, but the physical sensation itself, i find it desagreable, and i hate the atmosphere it’s reates.

    2. HG—they are asking you basically if someone doesn’t respond how they “should” in your mind during an intimate encounter would they be painted black. (This is disgusting me because I view you like a gay friend almost)
      Before I vomit please answer these ladies. If she doesn’t have an orgasm are you wounded, ticked off or what?

      1. If somebody does not respond in any encounter as they should do so, it will invariably be Challenge Fuel.

        1. Yes Foolme—like the time a girl told me my brother was a good kisser. I turned pale. It’s the same feeling pretty much.

          1. I can’t wait to see your reply about the comment HG wrote a few minutes ago, if you feel that way about a kiss. I do believe he has something for you to examine?! Lol.
            Little does he know in the field we are in after awhile they all look pretty much the same.

          2. Yes I did. I mentioned a book to Lorelei, you completely missed it.

            What is wrong with YOU this morning?

          3. I nearly pursued a juris doctorate a few years ago to get out of this—interested in contracts and the like. No dirty parts. Is it too late?

          4. Lorelei you were right, I’ve entered a shark fest!! And I do believe I’m the chum?! Help!!!

          5. Foolme—I can’t do it forever! I need a change. It’s become boring and my mind requires something to feast on.

          6. I would be an incredible party or wedding planner. I really should have done the stepford wife thing.