Whore

WHORE

 

Tell me, what is it like to be such a whore? How does it feel? Are you proud of yourself? Are you pleased with what you have become? Are your parents proud of what their son or daughter has done with their life, to become this thing that prostitutes itself so regularly and with no sense of shame? If only they knew eh? If only they knew the lengths, you go to in order to get what you want. It must be a shallow existence don’t you think? Knowing that nobody truly likes you, that all of the love, affection, friendship, kindness and gratitude has to be bought and paid for. What an empty life that must be? I know you are very good at it.

I will give you that. You are a professional when it comes to performing this role. I must admit that I sometimes watch with a strange kind of, well, I suppose it is respect isn’t it? Yes, respect for the way that you work your role. You know what to say don’t you? Those words come easy to you but they should because you have used them often enough on other people. You are a serial offender if the truth be told and that is why the epitaph of whore is so fitting. You know just what to say to get what you want. You know when to say it, what to say and how to say it, just like a hooker parading her wares in a window in Amsterdam.

You have worked out your best side, your most beguiling stance and you have them come flocking, every time. I am impressed by it; I have to say. You make it seem so real. You fooled me, there was no doubt about it. You have used your experience and you are experienced, to heighten the sensation so it is better than anything else. It is probably better than the real thing. I know you are just going through the motions but I am wise to you, I would be a fool if I was not, but there are countless of them out there who will fall for it time and time again.

You won’t be going out of business, not at all. You will have a steady stream of those willing to have sugar poured in their ear, hear those honey-coated words tumble from those oh so inviting lips. And the promises, oh the promises. So difficult to resist, so inviting, so exciting. They clamour for your attention in the end. I find it odd in a way because you are selling yourself but you don’t actually have to sell yourself do you? They come to you. They flock in their droves, lured by your siren call and you always deliver. You always give them exactly what they want. You did that with me. You knew what I wanted and you provided it for me, in spades. It was sensational and you got me hooked so I didn’t want it from anyone else. That is pretty powerful.

I wish I knew how it felt though. How does it feel to live like this? How does it feel knowing that everything is a show, a performance and it isn’t real? What is it like being so shallow? Do you even care? Perhaps you don’t, after all you are getting what you want aren’t you? Well we both are actually so we should both be delighted with it, but why is it that I am not? Why is it that I feel used? I thought I was the one who was in control, I thought I was the one who was calling the shots and yet I always seem to surrender that control to you. I thought I was the one who got to play the tune and you danced to it but then it doesn’t always work that way does it? I wish I could work out why that was. You make me feel like you at times, or at least you make me feel how I imagine you feel, cheap, used, dirty, a whore.

I suppose I shouldn’t be surprised. This is all you know isn’t it? This is how you have had to adapt, how you have to ensure you survive by getting people to do what you want, to make them like you, to make them adore you and love you. I wonder how long you will carry on like this? Is this the way it is always going to be? Is this you are consigned to do for the rest of your life, seeking a way through the vagaries of your existence by always doing what the other person wants. You need to please don’t you? That’s how you survive.

You exist only through the permission and desires of the others. You may think you wield the power, you may think that pleasure, absolute please, joy, ecstasy and delight are within your gift but you are beholden to provide those things because if you do not then you are nothing. You are nothing. Nothing without me. Nothing at all. I made you who you are, you need me although you will tell me that I need you. Perhaps we need one another? I don’t like to think that is the case because I have to be the one that makes the decisions, pulls the strings and gets what I want. I dictate and you react. That’s the way it is isn’t it?

So, you carry on doing what you do best. Carry on imagining that people really do love you, that people really do like you and that they want to be with you because you are so wonderful and delightful. It is your performance that they want and you had better not forget that. You had better remember that you are beholden to their desires. You dance to the tune and he who pays the piper plays the tune. Everybody pays though don’t they?

The payment is what it is all about and you always make sure you get paid. You are never short-changed, ripped off or discounted. You won’t do anything without extracting your payment and you make sure you get full value for your endeavours don’t’ you? Nothing for free. Everybody pays. Nothing because you want to do it or feel you should. It is all about the payment. That is all you want, the payment for yourself.

Whore.

I hate you

108 thoughts on “Whore

  1. WiserNow says:

    In the news this morning, I heard that Rupert Murdoch and Jerry Hall are set to divorce. It’s not surprising – the two of them are an odd couple.

  2. Rebecca says:

    SP,

    I have a plan on play right now. How it turns out is anyone’s guess, but I’m OK. I’ve been through worse and I have a back up plan and a safe place , if I need to run to it. Xx ❤ I hear you and I’m paying attention. I’ve gotten out of a worse situation than this one before. I’m ok.

    1. Asp Emp says:

      Rebecca, to read that you have a back up plan and a safe place; and that you are ok – is so good 🙂 Well done 🙂 x

      1. Rebecca says:

        Thanks AspEmp 😊xx I’ll keep updating on here too. Xx Thanks for everyone’s support too. Xx

        1. Asp Emp says:

          🙂 xx

    2. WhoCares says:

      Rebecca,

      That is good news. Happy to hear you have somewhere safe to go if need be. 💓

      1. Rebecca says:

        Thanks WhoCares for your words of encouragement and support xx

    3. Sweetest Perfection says:

      I am very happy to read that, Rebecca! Sending strength your way!!!!!

      1. Rebecca says:

        Thanks SP for your words of encouragement and support. Xx

    4. Joa says:

      Rebecca, and I am also very happy!

      Human should always be ABLE to turn back.

    5. JB says:

      Rebecca,

      That’s good that you have a plan and somewhere you can go if you need to. I’m thinking of you xx

    6. WiserNow says:

      Rebecca,
      It’s good to hear you have a plan and a safe place. It’s a difficult situation when your ‘nearest and dearest’ don’t respect or care about your feelings or point of view. I’m sorry that’s happening. You have somewhere to talk about it and get your feelings out here though. Your feelings are valid and real. I hope you can stay safe and keep commenting here. You are understood 🙂

  3. NarcAngel says:

    I have also read this through the lens of a weaponized empath.

    1. A Victor says:

      Aha, great way to read it! It puts the whoredom squarely on the narcissist! Thank you!

  4. Joa says:

    I perceive this text as an internal “confession” of the narcissist. Own dialogue.

    N2 also once called himself a male whore. The same overtone of his words, although less elaborate. I understood just as well. N1 once said the same thing in a more veiled way – in times of crisis.

    Of course, at certain times they can also be interpreted as dialogues: narcissist-empath, empath-narcissist.

  5. annaamel says:

    I think you’re correct Emily. The whore here is the narcissist.

    1. Another Cat says:

      Thank you, Annaamel!
      I think you can expand on an answer better than I. I can’t say specifically how it is that a narcissist gets into projecting, but I know two things
      100 %:

      They cannot reflect on ever themself being wrong.
      Projection gives control and power.

      So that´s the black box I need. There are a couple of psychologists on youtube reflecting on what projection actually is, how it is constructed, using terms like ‘the false self attacking the real self’ and so on. “They think that they talk about you, but they actually talk about themself”

      If HG would write a book on Projection, I suppose I would be sure about the mechanism.

      It is important to understand that the narc projects also when he is bragging. Then he is actually talking about YOU.
      “I always put the needs of other people first”
      Then he is projecting towards himself. He is unknowingly actually talking about you. It is YOU who are putting other people’s needs first.

      So then it’s “They think that they talk about themself, but they actually talk about you”.

  6. Cindy says:

    These words describe a narcissist. From “no sense of shame” and “shallow existence” to “nobody truly likes you” and “serial offender,” if the words are intended to describe a woman being devalued, projection permeates the entire piece.

    “You make it seem so real,” “…probably better than the real thing,” “…everything is a show, a performance that isn’t real.”

    Perhaps, when your own world exists within certain boundaries, it’s difficult to NOT see others’ lives the same way. And it would be difficult to NOT wish you were as skilled as others at attracting attention when attention was your life breath.

    “You exist only through the permission and desires of the others.” There is no other personality that fits this description as well as a narcissist, is there? They create false personas because their only value is in being someone else that can attract others. And they refine that skill because they have to.

    “You won’t do anything without extracting your payment…” 100 percent narcissist. Favors aren’t a thing to a narcissist.

    These words describe a narcissist and the emptiness inside.

    1. Contagious says:

      Yet I worked in Las Vegas as a lawyer. There are many in the profession who don’t feel ashamed at it. They choose it. One woman was making $350,000 a year and spoke quite proudly about it on the radio there.. I don’t get sex for money personally but if someone is ok with it so what? It’s not worse then blood for oil. If it is Not forced. Of legal age. Who cares? I think women can make their own minds up. No judgement from me even if it is a business trade I couldn’t do. I hate the term whore. I know my opinion won’t be popular but these woman who chose to do what they want…they can in my opinion without derogatory thought.

  7. Sweetest Perfection says:

    “You exist only through the permission and desires of the others. You may think you wield the power, you may think that pleasure, absolute please, joy, ecstasy and delight are within your gift but you are beholden to provide those things because if you do not then you are nothing. You are nothing. Nothing without me.”
    The metaphor is particularly effective because it can be used both ways, as in other articles HG has written where the point of view shifts. It is particularly effective because most empaths, due to their ingrained sense of guilt, will immediately feel alluded to as the whore. Narcs also make you feel like you are one, when it’s them who prostitute themselves for fuel. We don’t depend on fuel for a living. They do. Fuel is their pimp.

    1. Another Cat says:

      SP, me not finding reply buttons but yes, the trousers. My empath dad and I used to listen a lot to Never let me down again, and those very first two seconds, God Almighty intro of a song dammit.

      1. Sweetest Perfection says:

        That song is probably the best song by DM. Not my number one, but objectively the best, probably yes. I bet no one knows my favorite one! Not even HG.

        1. HG Tudor says:

          Clearly a tie between Big Muff and Boys Say Go!

          1. Sweetest Perfection says:

            Haaaaa hahaha!!!!! What’s Your Name is probably your favorite one!

        2. Another Cat says:

          SP, totally understand. Well, I wonder how you real DM fans can manage to concentrate on the content of HG’s very artistic blog. For me it was recognition of album and song titles first.

          Btw this spring I was at a little concert of Spanish classical music And It Hit Me, as an epiphany, the sound of the tuning of a guitar when coming from the speakers… aha… that’s the same as those very first 3 seconds of Personal Jesus (just before “Reach out, touch fate”). It’s simply the tuning of a guitar.

          Bet you ll keep your favourite a secret. New Life and I Feel You are spectacular in my mind.

          1. Sweetest Perfection says:

            AC, New Life is a song that sits very dear to me. I love I Feel You. And of course, I think everyone can recognize PJ instantly at the first chords, I think the whole movie theater did when they released the new documentary in 2019. I recently recovered the vinyl of Songs of Faith and Devotion. Listening to In Your Room through the professional speakers that surround my house was orgasmic (my husband plays different instruments so he has good ones). Most of my vinyls were lost or left behind when I moved to the US (except for the double live album 101, which I gave to a very good friend of mine) so now I am getting them back. 101 was my first album so I started listening to DM a little late. I remember I played it at home and my mom said it sounded like the sound of cans and chains. I fell in love immediately. That was a clue to my favorite song btw.

          2. Another Cat says:

            Sounds so cool that your husband has all that sound equipment, SP, you’re blessed.
            Oh, I don’t really know DM songs or much about albums, when people claim to be init they usually mention Ice Machine as no 1 and Run Like Hell by Pink Floyd, those two songs are far and wide connected, 😉 😉
            But 101 I will check out! I just googled and live albums are generally winners.

            Btw, now I’m reflecting on the guitar in the Studio Session version of Corrupt. Eargasm is a good word for these things yes. Cans and chains? I couldn’t figure out the song. You’re the expert here.

            /The sound lover

          3. Sweetest Perfection says:

            Yesterday was the 35th anniversary of the Pasadena concert of 101, by the way! No, I don’t keep track of these things. I have a very good friend who does, he reminded me yesterday and I thought about our thread here. 101 is a superb album, AC, considering the sound quality of live recordings at that time, and my song sounds very different (and much superior) in the live version in this album as opposed to the original one.

  8. mollyb5 says:

    HG ..Male narcs like to visit whores . They’re pissed and feel used when they have to pay. Male narcs feel entitled and want the whore to like them the best …out of all the johns …the narc wants to be the one she falls in love with.

    1. Mollyb5 says:

      Yeh , it can also be …the narc yelling at the empath . Ye the narc usually thinks the pretty empath who gets a lot of attention from other men is a whore or if she flirts or leaves the narc . He feels it’s because she just wants to fuck around . Never because he has done anything wrong or has been fucking around . Oh never .

  9. Tracy Gray says:

    Well , is’nt that the cover calling the page a book ? You’re just jealous because I’m more desirable than you !

    1. HG Tudor says:

      You mean envious.

      1. Emily says:

        Oh so this is literal. You really do despise sex workers? Do you feel envy towards them?

        1. HG Tudor says:

          No, it is not literal, Christ almighty, use your brain.

          1. Emily says:

            Narcs often use sex workers and do so to emotionally abuse them you could have easily been a customer of one.

          2. HG Tudor says:

            Indeed I could have been and yes narcissists do abuse sex workers (as do normals, not all but some).
            This is not about sex workers.

          3. Viol. says:

            Trying to teach word usage and literary personae to the hard of understanding again, HG?

          4. HG Tudor says:

            Oh that their fuckwittery would crash upon the edifice of my knowledge and thereon be consigned into oblivion.

          5. FoolMe1Time says:

            Getting your panties in a twist there HG? Hahaha xx

          6. HG Tudor says:

            As you know, I do not wear panties FM1T.

            I wear the trousers.

          7. FoolMe1Time says:

            So says you HG, I’ve only ever seen you in a tangerine bathing suit. You could possibly be wearing panties underneath and we would never know. Hahaha

          8. HG Tudor says:

            Bathing suit?

            Are you stuck in the Victorian age FM1T?

          9. FoolMe1Time says:

            Hahaha! I thought I was speaking your language HG.

          10. Sweetest Perfection says:

            Thong, probably, as the cheeky free spirit you are.

          11. HG Tudor says:

            No, flip flops are not applicable.

          12. FoolMe1Time says:

            Ok now who’s in the wrong era HG? A thong is not flip flops. Hahaha

          13. HG Tudor says:

            My solid Aussie cousins will tell you that you are wrong.

          14. FoolMe1Time says:

            I am not wrong about the thong, but neither are you HG.

          15. WiserNow says:

            Yes, in Australia, flip flops are called ‘thongs’ (plural – with an s at the end) and a thong (singular – as in underwear) is called a G-string.

            Fun facts: to find out the origin of the name ‘G-string’, I googled it. Apparently, there is no definite knowledge about why these ‘dental floss’ underpants are called ‘G-strings’. It could be because the G stands for ‘groin’. They were introduced in New York in 1939 because of the 1939 World’s Fair. At that time, NYC Mayor Fiorello La Guardia was concerned the city’s fully nude strippers would cause an international scandal. The strippers then came up with a solution and covered up their ‘bits’ with a tiny strip of cloth. Perhaps the strip of cloth was called a G-string in honor of Mayor La Guardia…

            You learn something new here every day.

            Personally, I don’t like G-strings, for men or women. They are so uncomfortable and unflattering too, in my opinion.

            A man in a G-string reminds me too much of a mankini as in Borat-style, and that is totally and objectively wrong.

            …and HG, don’t go wearing thongs under your trunks either – that’s just weird.

          16. Asp Emp says:

            Nobody else has mentioned it, as yet. So, I will. MANKINI. I suppose a thong is far better than having a mankini bringing your balls up to your midriff….

          17. WhoCares says:

            Pahaha!

          18. Asp Emp says:

            Quite. The “fashion” did not quite take off, eh? 😉

          19. WiserNow says:

            …umm… hate to burst your bubble Asp Emp, but I mentioned it more than six hours ago.
            Just so you know 🙂

          20. Asp Emp says:

            It got lost in the mail, it must be the time-zone difference 🙂

          21. Sweetest Perfection says:

            HAHAHAHA!

          22. Asp Emp says:

            Laughing….. nor are the socks, sandals and shorts 😉

          23. Sweetest Perfection says:

            You know FM1T, as long as you remember who’s wearing the trousers…

          24. HG Tudor says:

            I expected you to pick up on that. Jolly good.

          25. Sweetest Perfection says:

            Instantly! Haha

          26. Viol. says:

            Sweet-P:

            “Cheeky”?

            Oh, dear.

        2. Another Cat says:

          Emily
          This is what is so special about this blog, I remember from first glances back in 2016, and then 2018. HG writes what the narcissist thinks or says, in devaluation stage, or in golden period stage. This post is obviously about devaluation of a victim, imo. The narcissist is fiercely projecting.

          Sometimes he writes from the victim’s perspective.

          1. HG Tudor says:

            Well stated.

          2. annaamel says:

            Hi Another Cat. Your knowledge and insight are appreciated. Are you suggesting it’s the narcissist’s criticism of themselves, which they cannot or would not do (the lower ranks don’t understand it and the upper ranks cannot risk such self criticism which would jeopardise the construct) instead turned outwards and aimed at someone else? Ideally the person they are closest to as it’d be the most satisfying? So when narcissists devalue they critique at least in part based on what they see (perhaps unconsciously) in themselves?

      2. Alexissmith2016 says:

        Are you envious of Tracy then HG?

        1. HG Tudor says:

          No.

          1. Emily says:

            You appear to hate her? At least she was honest, you hire a hooker you know what you are buying?

          2. HG Tudor says:

            Nothing to do with hookers.

          3. Alexissmith2016 says:

            I know HG. Just couldn’t resist hahaha

  10. Emily says:

    Im confused are you saying narcissists are whores? Are you calling youeself a whore? Youre payment is fuel?

    1. Rebecca says:

      Emily,
      I believe the article is about empaths and how narcissists see us during the devaluing stage.

      1. Emily says:

        Oh thanks for clarification

      2. A Victor says:

        Hi Rebecca,
        If I remember right, a while back when I was questioning this article, someone said also to look at what we might gain from the relationship. That put a whole new perspective on it for me. There is definitely a symbiotic relationship going on. Thankfully we can stop in on our side and have a healthy relationship if we chose to.

        1. Another Cat says:

          Exactly A Victor

          Many men, esp empaths would Not have reached their prominent positions at work without the fulltime manager of a Manipulator wife.

          Of course.

          She is the one who is booking meetings, pushing him, pushing away all his competition by speaking badly of them to the right people. My country’s former PM is one of these examples. A nice empathic man with a very firm decisive narcissist wife. She is older (she was married, with kids when they met) so he can’t have kids, he has in many interviews expressed very quiet mention of how much he loves her grandchildren.

          She is a boss at our national church. Always stealthily putting in a sneaky bad word about his competitors. Always firmly explains to reporters that she and he never actually did anything wrong.

          This former PM was raised in an orphanage and fosterparents. The narcissist knows how to pick vulnerable or lonely victims.

          But as you say AV, it’s symbiotic. Without her he would never have been PM of a country.

          (though there is always sacrifice, but
          prominent empathic men don’t often notice, the children get messed up, etc)

          1. A Victor says:

            Hi Another Cat, thank you for these further thoughts, ones I was unaware of, I really appreciate them!

          2. Another Cat says:

            I think, AV, that most narc women through history had to settle with lifting their husband, not pressing down his career. Instead they control led the children, triangulations and what not. After all, it’s quite a temptation for many men to have a wife taking care of everything, so he could concentrate on his career. At least it feels like it during golden periods. Comfy…

            Once I called an opera singer to book a speech for our local church. He was part of the parish, committed and everything, semifamous baritone.

            His wife answered.
            – What is this about?
            – Well we would like him to hold an evening speech.
            – No you can’t speak with him, he is not home and has many other engagements. He should not hold events now.

            I don’t know if this woman was a narc, but I can’t remember anyone speaking to me like this before or after.

          3. A Victor says:

            AC, I suspect you are correct about most female narcissists through history, it would’ve had to be so. Such an interesting thing to consider also, I had not before.

            They can be really unbelievable, haha, sadly I live with a female narcissist, I absolutely never know what I will encounter in any interaction with her, so I try to just stay away from her. The opera singer’s wife actually does sound like the one I live with! Are you not glad you knew what could be causing it? In the past, pre-narcissism knowledge, I would have been so flustered by that behavior. Not anymore!

          4. Another Cat says:

            Yes you’re right, feels good to have an idea, at least in retrospection! Sometimes the wife is not narcissist, just Polish, Russian or East Asian. They can act like this due to cultural pressure (wife equals tough manager), I have experienced. I mean the guy looks very much like Bryn Terfel, and he has a beautiful soprano empathic daughter, opera solos as well. No matter how much we want to believe that one can be famous and suceed by being kind and have a beautiful voice and work hard,

            most often it’s not so. Contacts and good social circles are needed. The right family/relatives, or a tough manager family member, often a manipulating narcissist. Getting rid of the competition is key, but the victims might not want to see that. They’re superhappy about being famous!

            Gah, I wish you wouldn’t have to share your home with a narc woman, AV, bitsy understandable if it’s your daughter, but I’m guessing not!

            “I absolutely never know what I will encounter in any interaction with her”

            Oh, the most current one is the mother of the children’s schoolfriend. I have to admit she’s quite ok and humorous, but must be hell of confusing to live with, I only meet her when delivering the kids to eachother on playdates.

            Opposes anything you say or suggest, any line, immediately.

            I have learned to deal and plan so that her empathic son can at least spend two consecutive hours with my kids without her calling that he should get home after 20 minutes of being here, the husband often running over here to quickly pick him up.

          5. A Victor says:

            Oh wow AC, you totally get it! “Opposes anything you say or suggest, any line, immediately.” That’s exactly it. So frustrating. It’s my mother. I have been practicing ANC with her for at least a year, very helpful. My son does also, she drives him crazy too. It’s nice that you can have her son over sometimes for a while, I’m sure he needs a break sometimes.

        2. Rebecca says:

          Hi AV,
          I can definitely see the symbiotic relationship at work with my husband and I. I was talking to him yesterday and I tried expressing my feelings and he either cut me off, acted mad about my feelings or he would make a joke about my feelings, dismissing them…and I kept feeling his annoyance, my feelings were annoying him, so I withdrew, stopped talking and partially shut down emotionally. I was left feeling disbelief that he just did that, and then I just felt grief and left the room. My feelings are a problem for him. I’m not allowed to be unhappy and I’m not allowed to voice my emotions. Just shut up, stop talking, stop crying and just look happy, can’t you do that? Can’t you try? Try again, better

          1. A Victor says:

            I am sorry Rebecca, I wish I could help you somehow. It is hard to be in the midst of what you are. I know that you will do whatever you need to do to make things better for yourself, and I know that can take some time. You are in a great place here and HG will help you figure things out. I can’t stress enough how valuable his insight is when we’re in the place you are at this time, dealing with a narcissist every day. Stay strong, it will work out. 💜

          2. Viol. says:

            I try so hard not to get upset
            Because I know all the trouble I’ll get
            Oh, he tells me tears are something to hide
            And something to fear-eh-eh
            And I try so hard to keep it inside
            So no one can hear

            Til Tuesday, “Voices Carry”

          3. WiserNow says:

            On the subject of hiding emotions, it’s interesting that men are generally made to feel they need to hide or repress their emotions. It’s sad to me that men feel the social pressure to do this. It’s irrational too, that if men show emotion they are considered ‘weak’ or ‘sensitive’.

            Sensitivity has a bad – very bad – ‘reputation’, for want of a better word. It’s not ‘weakness’ for a start and there is not just one kind of ‘sensitivity’.

            For example, closed-mindedness and stubbornness are a form of ‘sensitivity’ that is rigid and unmovable in my opinion.

            An unwillingness to accept that someone else’s emotions are valid and real to them is another form of ‘sensitivity’ that is egocentric and biased. It is actually defined in language and word usage as ‘callousness’, however, to the person clinging on to their personal convictions, it is also a fear or inability to open their worldview to other possibilities.

            One of the characteristics of a Highly Sensitive Person (HSP) is that they are open-minded and able to see a number of different angles and perspectives of a situation. That is a particular ‘sensitivity’ that is actually not that ‘personally’ sensitive in a social situation. It is open and willing to understand others rather than being closed and insular and ‘sensitive’ to the threat of other opinions.

            Regarding men and emotions, it reminds me of a song at this year’s Eurovision Song Contest. (Yes, I enjoy watching Eurovision. So what? Don’t judge me.)

            Switzerland’s entry in the contest was a song called ‘Boys Do Cry’ by Marius Bear. The song was okay, nothing to write home about though. The interesting thing was that in the voting, the song received 78 points from the judging jury which was relatively respectable considering the overall table of points from the jury. However, the song received a big fat zero votes from the public viewing audience. Not one single, solitary point from people watching the contest.

            I found that quite curious. It wasn’t a garishly bad song. It was reasonably good and Marius had a good voice and delivery. I think there is a very, very long way to go before general public attitudes change about men actually having emotions. It seems to be very clear that men are supposed to be robots who do not cry and are not allowed to cry.

          4. Sweetest Perfection says:

            Eurovision is so full of politics, not surprisingly Ukraine won this year. I however ABSOLUTELY ADORED last year’s winners, Italian band Måneskin with their song Ziti e Buoni which I truly liked. It was thanks to the festival that I found out about them. “I’m begging, begging youuuuu!!!!” And Damiano David’s cross dressing drives me crazy.

          5. WiserNow says:

            Eurovision is great. The political element is always there. It was even worse years ago in the 80s and 90s. Back then, you could bet your house on the top points from some countries going to their political allies. For instance, if Lithuania gave Latvia 12 points, you could rest assured that Latvia was going to return the favour.

            I’m glad that Ukraine won this year though – it gave me a warm, fuzzy feeling that people watching voted with their compassion and gave Ukraine the win. It wasn’t such a bad song either, so good for them.

            The irreverence and exuberance of Eurovision are the good things about it. It’s so over the top but in a creative and fun way. It never goes too far so that it strays too much out of ‘family-style’ viewing. You can safely sit back and watch it with grandma, mum, dad and the kids all in the room.

            I like Maneskin too, and their win in 2021 was well-deserved I thought. They came across like an ‘authentic’ rock band and their song was clever and memorable. Most of the other acts generally come across like novelty acts trying too hard to be noticed among a group of other novelty acts.

            I’m glad Australia is in the contest too even though it’s nowhere near Europe. It’s popular here. I think that’s because it’s so entertaining and Aussies like irreverent entertainment that’s good for a laugh. Also, there are many Europeans in Australia too. I think the second largest city after Athens with regard to the number of people with Greek heritage is Melbourne in Australia haha.

          6. Sweetest Perfection says:

            Dearest Rebecca,
            I have seen this same interaction between my parents. Leave. My dad has become an expressionless robot that acts like my mom is not even present. Leave. He seems to care about her health when she doesn’t eat enough. I think he just worries he will run out of fuel if she dies. Leave. My father doesn’t talk to my mom at all when they are alone which is most of the year except when I or my sister are visiting. Leave. My mom cannot complain, express sadness, or happiness, and obtain any reaction from him because he is a shell of a human form. Leave. Leave. Leave. Leave. My mom lived at a time when she didn’t have any legal support or financial support to separate from my father. You are young, you have your whole life ahead of you. LEAVE!!!! ❤️

          7. WhoCares says:

            Sweetest Perfection,

            Your comment brought tears to my eyes.

            I agree with you.

            I am glad I left when I did.
            But I wish I had had this knowledge when I was younger.

            Rebecca – you cannot get back lost time.

          8. A Victor says:

            This is very true WhoCares, we cannot get our time back and it is in limited supply from the beginning. Excellent point.

          9. A Victor says:

            Wow, SP, this is an amazing comment! Thank you for making it. As I read it I thought of my own parents and how my dad was worn down by my mom, the difference being both of them are/were narcs. But he became sick and died ahead of her and I think due very much to the stress of dealing with her for 60 years even as he was a narc. I think his sense of control was so overwhelmed that he couldn’t maintain. Anyway, all that to say that what you write here is so valid, the health effects, the lack of concern about them except as they will affect the prime aims, all so true. There is no good that will come from spending an extra minute in the life of a narc. That is that. Thank you!

          10. Sweetest Perfection says:

            Thank you AC. I was pretty immersed into it as I am just visiting and my parents are a live demonstration of what to avoid marrying into… my mom I suspect is codependent so it’s been years and years of hearing her say she hates my dad, but if you say something she immediately defends him and charges against you. There’s no point now, they’re both old and like I told them today, you chose to live with each other so now you suck it up. Both of you. It still hurts to see my dad’s lack of response to anybody, especially my mom. He also treated the waiter awfully today and I had to apologize for him because I was mortified. Maybe one of those tarantulas Bubbles talks about would make him jump, but I even doubt that. It would be worth the try hahaha.

          11. Leigh says:

            Powerful and poetic! You really have a way words.

          12. Sweetest Perfection says:

            Thank you! I’ll let Robert Smith know! Haha

          13. Sweetest Perfection says:

            Oh I noticed it’s not for the lyrics! Haha Leigh I read your comment in disarray, I thought you were praising the song. WordPress is messing my notifications.

          14. Viol. says:

            WiserNow:

            I’ve got a chip on my shoulder that’s bigger that my feet
            I can’t talk to people that I meet
            If I could see you now
            I’d try to make you sad somehow
            But I can’t, so I’ll cry instead
            Don’t wanna cry when there’s people there
            I get shy when they start to stare
            I’m gonna hide myself away
            But I’ll come back again someday
            And when I do you’d better hide all the girls
            I’m gonna break their hearts all round the world
            Yes, I’m gonna break them in two
            And show you what your lovin’ man can do
            Until then I’ll cry instead

            – Beatles

          15. Sweetest Perfection says:

            I would say I’m sorry
            If I thought that it would change your mind
            But I know that this time
            I have said too much
            Been too unkind
            I tried to laugh about it
            Cover it all up with lies
            I tried to laugh about it
            Hiding the tears in my eyes
            ‘Cause boys don’t cry
            Boys don’t cry
            I would break down at your feet
            And beg forgiveness, plead with you
            But I know that it’s too late
            And now there’s nothing I can do
            So I try to laugh about it
            Cover it all up with lies
            I try to laugh about it
            Hiding the tears in my eyes
            ‘Cause boys don’t cry
            Boys don’t cry
            I would tell you that I loved you
            If I thought that you would stay
            But I know that it’s no use
            And you’ve already gone away
            Misjudged your limits
            Pushed you too far
            Took you for granted
            Thought that you needed me more, more, more
            Now I would do most anything
            To get you back by my side
            But I just keep on laughing
            Hiding the tears in my eyes
            ‘Cause boys don’t cry
            Boys don’t cry

            The Cure, “Boys Don’t Cry.”

          16. WiserNow says:

            SP,

            Another interesting song about boys not showing emotion.

            “Boys don’t cry
            I would tell you that I loved you
            If I thought that you would stay
            But I know that it’s no use
            And you’ve already gone away”

            How much of this is projection, how much is presumptive, how much is just confusing self-deception, and how much is ego-protection?

            “I would tell you that I loved you if I thought that you would stay”. So, does he really love her? Or has he already decided it’s not worth saying the empty words because she won’t stay anyway? How does he know it’s no use? Or does he actually prefer that she doesn’t stay? Is he the one who has actually gone away? Or does he actually know that she is uninterested? Does he really care, but isn’t willing to risk a blow to his ego, because “boys don’t cry”?

            Have they both already tried to recapture their previous ‘love’ and the relationship just fell flat on its face again?

            So many unanswered questions. My brain hurts.

          17. WiserNow says:

            Viol.

            Interesting song. According to Wikipedia, both John Lennon and Paul McCartney said it was entirely written by Lennon even though it’s credited to both of them.

            “If I could see you now
            I’d try to make you sad somehow
            But I can’t, so I’ll cry instead”

            These words sound straightforward enough at face value. However, if a person cannot be made to feel sad, no matter what is done or what happens to “make them sad somehow”, then the only things the other person can do is:
            1. ‘cry instead’; or
            2. distance themselves to avoid feeling painful or unwanted emotions; or
            3. leave.

            If the option to leave isn’t there or isn’t taken, the other two options are to ‘cry instead’ or become distant and unemotional.

            If the context is a mother and baby where the mother cannot be made to feel sad or doesn’t have emotional empathy, the baby can’t leave. Instead, the baby becomes anxious (cries instead) or the baby becomes avoidant (becomes distant and unemotional).

            If you think more deeply about these lyrics, the meaning behind the words can be considered in various ways.

            Initially, I thought it was interesting that if the speaker can’t cry himself, he is going to make as many other people cry instead. That is projection.

            Also, there’s an irony there, because while a narcissist can’t cry outwardly and can’t feel or express emotion, he or she nevertheless spends their life feeling like a victim in some way, or entitled to victimise others.

            Very interesting song Viol. – it’s deceptive in it’s simplicity. Thank you for commenting about it.

          18. WiserNow says:

            …and by the way, I do know the difference between its and it’s … ugh! so annoying when you can’t edit comments after sending them.

      3. Alexissmith2016 says:

        I think In SatN book HG says women are see as a Madonna or a good whore of bad whore. Good whore just means we’re doing what the N wants, bad whore we’re not doing what the N wants and. Madonna as sexless.

        Im a bad whore and proud!

        1. Rebecca says:

          Alexis Smith,
          With me, I get along with most people, narc or not and the only time I have issues is when they’re nasty to me and that goes for narc and not narc. It’s simple, don’t be nasty and I won’t be nasty.

          1. alexissmith2016 says:

            I agree Rebecca, I did go through a bit of a spell early on when I needed revenge. But it was only in defence or opportunistic, and even then I still injected humour into it – but enjoyed my small wins. I still would if the opportunity arises, but largely I just let them get on with their shit.

        2. Ruth Cain says:

          Slut solidarity! I am very proud to have been called a whore/slut/hoe/’putana di merda’ by a variety of narcissists. Give ’em no shame and if they are low to mid range, watch their brain gears grinding to find a more effective insult.

          1. Contagious says:

            Eleanor Roosevelt said” no one can make you feel inferior without your consent.” You nailed it.

        3. Another Cat says:

          Yes, well as narc guys put it:

          A whore is someone who’s been with everyone.
          A Filthy Whore is someone who’s been with everyone but not with me …

          1. Another Cat says:

            Jealousy is their middle name.

      4. Patricia N says:

        I agree, Rebecca. I read the article as being an example of what the narcissist (or at least some of them) might say to their empath during devaluation.

        1. Rebecca says:

          Viol,

          I’m familiar with that song,remember it from childhood. My husband says to me, I don’t bother telling you what to do, you do it your own way, I’ve never seen anyone so stubborn. I can’t even get you to drop it, you keep on until you’re finished. Yup, I have my own voice and I will speak, when I want to. I get advice from friends, who tell me, try not to provoke him, I know how you can get when you get mad. Yeah, I talk back and I got a mouth on me, trust me. I have a mouth and I speak, when I want to. I know how to keep from getting hit and I know where to go, if I do.

          1. Leigh says:

            Rebecca, please use me as a precautionary tale. I’ve been ensnared for 37 years. If I had known what I know now, I would have ran away as fast as I could. Now, my whole entire life is entwined with a narcissist. I know I have to escape and that is the plan but it would have been much easier 25 years ago.

            May I also make a suggestion about provoking him. I too have a mouth on me. I often don’t know how to shut it. Until I read a comment that, Mr. Tudor made. To paraphrase Mr. Tudor, every time you react to the narcissist, whether its negative or positive, you validate their existence. When I read that comment, I realized I would no longer participate in validating their existence.

            I hope you’ll be ok.

        2. Rebecca says:

          Patricia,
          The narc I knew from last year was LMRSomatic and when he was devaluing me he made comments about my age, which he was older than me and I’m not old….and my body, ok, so I’m small, big deal, so what…he was being a jerk…and he definitely didn’t have grounds to call me whore….he was a coworker…and I can honestly say, I don’t know how I would react if he had called me that…not a good reaction, I know that much….yeah, it’s best not to say…I’m just glad things didn’t go that way…Midrangers are passive aggressive cowards anyway….he probably whined, to whomever would listen, about how mean my words back to him were….HG, says it best….how does it go? ….yellowbellied…something about little balls….whinning crybabies…. 😆🤣 Funny af!

Vent Your Spleen! (Please see the Rules in Formal Info)

This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. Learn how your comment data is processed.