Meghan Markle : A Less Than Royal Narcissist : Part 33.1 Engagement Analysis
34 thoughts on “Meghan Markle : A Less Than Royal Narcissist : Part 33.1 Engagement Analysis”
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Generally, Meghan doesn’t really have ‘introspective’ moments, unlike Harry who ponders things and looks around while answering with thoughtful or spontaneous expressions.
The vice-like grip on Harry’s hand is quite funny after a while. The ‘death grip’ as HG describes it goes on for more than 20 minutes! It makes me wonder if it caused a serious case of pins and needles for Harry.
Throughout the interview, Meghan is staring intently, either at Harry or at the interviewer. When staring at Harry, she is either holding his attention or looking directly at him while he answers a question. They have a lot of direct eye contact and they agree with each other constantly on the points they make. It’s interesting that when Harry confirms that he’s in love and says that they are passionate about tackling things together etc, Meghan turns to the interviewer and happily says things like, “that’s so nicely said, isn’t it?”.
I find it a little strange and telling when someone needs to ‘boast’ about their relationship, especially to a stranger or to the outside world in general. It makes me think that they see the relationship as an ‘achievement’ or to prove a point, or to get some kind of ‘upper-hand’ over other people. In that way, the ‘relationship’ itself is an ‘object’ too, in the way that a narc sees another person as an ‘appliance’.
Another thing that was interesting was when they were discussing the engagement ring. Harry said to Meghan, “..make sure it stays on that finger.” I find that comment quite interesting coming from Harry. Together with the comment, “the stars aligned etc”, I feel Harry was at an age or a phase of life where he was ‘ready’ or at least thinking about marriage. He had already had a few past ‘failed’ relationships, which may have caused some self-doubt in him too. Perhaps he was a prime target for someone who showed a keen interest in wanting to have a committed relationship with him. It would be difficult I imagine, for a sensitive or empathic person, to have their personal private life globally scrutinised, with every relationship being fodder for daily papers. That in itself would cause self-doubt and negativity when it came to a romantic involvement.
Unlike narcs, empaths – at least when unaware – do enjoy intimacy and ‘connection’. They do have a need to ‘attach’ and this tendency is often unconscious and sincere. So, Harry’s ‘ensnarement’ may have happened at a ‘prime’ moment in his life.
WiserNow, her vacant, vacuous stares off into the bushes, haha, are indeed unsettling. The ones where she thinks she’s coming across all introspective and thoughtful. Maybe I am getting this eye thing more than I thought…
A Victor- you know whose interviews I also found interesting, is Mary Kay Letourneau’s and Vili Fualaau’s, especially as he got older. Now that she passed away and he’s finally truly away from her, I hope he can heal. There are also some recent interviews of him on YouTube that he’s given, since she died. I always found that case particularly disturbing.
Wildviolet, wow!! I totally forgot about that one! I’m putting her on my narc bullets list! That poor man didn’t stand a chance, I hope he can heal too. Yes, most disturbing! All those lives she affected, the children both husbands, Fualaau’s parents. She was so sick.
HG – I love that you are incorporating body language analysis into your series on Harry and Meghan’s engagement interview (along with the piece on contrasting images of Meghan and Kate)! This is something I personally have been wanting to see in your work because I find myself becoming more and more attuned to the subtle tells (especially when observing Mid-ranger) of when a mid-range is attempting to stifle their irritation, and then the follow up manipulation they choose to regain control.
Totally loving this aspect of your education!!
WhoCares, I have been enjoying that aspect as well! And what is interesting is that it all makes her, and made my ex, come off as slimy, awkward, sleazy people. Sadly, Harry’s body language looks to me like a man who is confused and insecure, exactly how I felt much of my marriage. And trying to do the right thing. Poor man, he’s in a lose-lose situation.
AV, Harry would ‘win’ should he get the right support at some point in the future. Being part of the RF, he’ll be luckier than most to access the right support for him (he should in any case). Yes, he does look a ‘broken’ person and yet does not realise exactly how or why at present.
AV,
It is interesting; this is the most I’ve heard that woman talk (watching the engagement interview and Oprah interview) and I know there was a time when the grin she has plastered on her face, in the engagement interview, would have fooled me and I might have just thought, oh she is just simply so smiley and glowy from the excitement of the engagement plans…ugh. Totally different view now.
In general I have always watched body language but since learning about narcissists, I really scrutinize it in depth.
“Sadly, Harry’s body language looks to me like a man who is confused and insecure”
He is definitely playing second fiddle to Meghan’s narcissism.
WhoCares, you are correct, having this knowledge has begun to change how I watch and listen to everything nowadays.
WhoCares, I was thinking of Harry in the more recent interview with Oprah, I haven’t seen the engagement one and he probably wasn’t at that stage at that point.
WhoCares,
I agree that the body language analysis is very interesting. The very subtle changes in facial expressions are so subtle sometimes that they’re almost undetectable.
To me, Meghan’s demeanour overall throughout the interview feels like she is “selling”. She is in ‘sales-pitch’ mode. Harry makes a couple of slightly sarcastic remarks towards the interviewer’s questions, however, Meghan is being friendly and familiar with the interviewer. I think at this stage, Meghan was very much into ‘making a good impression’.
There’s nothing wrong with trying to make a good impression, however, it shouldn’t come at the expense of the truth. A narc doesn’t care about the truth though and generally, they forget what they’ve said five minutes after they’ve said it.
Looking back at the engagement interview, it makes it so clear that a ‘whirlwind’ romance can go terribly wrong.
WiserNow, I’m just thinking how body language experts can be so wrong. There was this body language expert who even did a Ted talk who said when Harry and Meghan just got engaged that their body language shows so much love and one of the signs is that they mirror each other. She said that it is a really good sign when lovers mirror each other’s body language because it means they are in sync with each other. How misleading is that?
Hey MP,
Couples who are in a normal relationship with no narc involved will mirror each other. I think it’s normal to pick up certain mannerisms or catch phrases from each other. I’ve even got ready to go out before now, come downstairs in jeans and a shirt and my partner has been waiting in jeans and the same colour shirt with the similar colour boots! Mirroring is normal to a degree. That’s the problem with the narcissist. They do what we do, it’s just their motivations for the doing that are different. Makes the individual behaviour in isolation inconclusive.
I lived in the US for several years. I didn’t pick up the accent. I did pick up a number of phrases though. I haven’t lost those. I still go to get gas for example, I still buy candy not sweets! If I was a narcissist this would be character trait acquisition. It might even be triangulation with a country to appear more interesting! I’m not a narcissist but I still do narcy things at times and, I do them repetitively. Even worse!
There are so many things we have to look at to establish whether an individual might be a narcissist. Even knowing what we know I think it’s difficult. I think my approach now is to trust my instincts more. I’m pre disposed to like someone not dislike them. So if I dislike someone upon first meet, then that’s good enough for me. I will not search out the exact reason for the dislike. I rule out quite readily anyway. Now I’m more inclined to rule out than previously, I just won’t feel any guilt for doing so!
Hello TS,
You’re absolutely correct. Mirroring is normal to a degree. I catch myself mirroring too. But not to the degree that MM had when the body language expert was pointing out in their video that Meghan and Harry were leaning on the same side of their bodies or starting to walk with the same side of leg or crossing their arms at the same time etc. The handyman that tried to seduce me mirrored my movements. Even my manner of walking and when we talked he used the same facial expression I had after I used it. I didn’t think that he was mirroring me at that time. I was so puzzled that I found someone so similar to me except that he’s pure white and he’s much much much more taller than me. I never believed in soul mates because I have always been a Christian but I started to wonder if maybe soul mates are somehow real and I just found mine. My husband however doesn’t mirror. I wonder if it’s because he’s a normal. When my husband and I move together I don’t feel like I’m in harmony with him which I felt when I was interacting with the narc handyman. That even added to me wondering if I married the wrong person at that time. It wasn’t just the mirroring though, there was the “stare” and hot and cold as well in that short span of time which makes me think he’s a Lower MR. My husband only coordinates with what I am wearing when we go somewhere where our pictures might be taken. And he doesn’t want to match our clothes really closely too. He just pulls out a couple or so of clothes and asks me which one would go with what I’m going to wear. He also thinks that I am more aware of fashion than he is.
I can totally relate to picking up phrases or expressions. English is my second language so I have a huge tendency to do that. It’s not to acquire traits but more to increase my vocabulary. There were times that I confide to a friend and she would say something really witty and I ask her if I could use that expression with someone else, mostly the person that I confided to her about. Sometimes I come up with my own too and sometimes they’re good and sometimes they’re a flop.
I think that it’s great that you don’t feel guilty for not liking someone or for rejecting them. My husband is the same way and he told me nothing has to be wrong about the person. The person can be a wonderful person and he or she is still not his cup of tea and it’s totally ok. Nobody has to be on trial and nothing has to be justified in his mind. It’s just that life is short and we only have so much time and he would rather spend that time with people that he has many things in common with and especially his family. I have been adapting the same thinking. I will not interact unless I feel respected in the least or I am getting something of value with the interaction. It doesn’t mean that the person is a narcissist. Just like I know that there are so many people that I really like/d that happen to be narcissists, I know that just because I don’t jibe with a person doesn’t mean they are narcissists. And like my husband’s thought process, I don’t need to put them in trial or justify anything. I just don’t jibe with the person, that’s all.
MP,
Your comment made me smile. Thank you for thinking about it. Your husband sounds lovely, considerate of you. It’s the small things that are often the most revealing. Holding up clothes and asking what would go best with what you have decided to wear. Considerate. Happy to tie in with you. Let’s face it, women often are the show stealers when we go out. A confident man is content to compliment and let that be the case.
I like the way your husband sums up his position on ‘ruling out’ too. It’s healthy. Empaths tend to overthink. I see my ruling out as both fault ( too quick to assess) but strength ( my instincts are usually right). The point is that I evaluate my behaviour. Your husband simply accepts his. I like that, I can see it as healthy behaviour in someone else but when I do it I am more self critical. I still do it ha ha, I just question if that makes me a nice person. Suffice to say, your comment and your husbands view helps so thank you for that!
It’s interesting, your thought process at the time the handyman was seducing. ET raised, leading you to question if your husband was really your soul mate. It’s a great example of what ET does. It colours everything, in quite subtle ways. Just enough to doubt what you know and see the narc as more desirable.
Thank you for your comment, you made me think. Having the perspective of ‘a normal’ is helpful. We are all congregated at one end of the spectrum. It’s nice to get some balance. Xx
Thank you TS, I haven’t thought of it that way. You’re right, it is being considerate of him. That realization made me happy. Thank you for that. 💕
MP,
Good, I’m glad it made you smile.
Xx
MP,
It is *very* misleading. It’s actually bang-on completely wrong when considering that a narcissist uses mirroring extensively when love-bombing.
Having said that though, before I knew about narcissism, I would have believed a body language ‘expert’ saying that. I would have thought, “how romantic, they look so happy in each other’s company.” I would have seen the eye contact, hand-holding and mirroring as two people ‘in love’. Even though I might have thought it was over the top, I would have looked at them with my own empathic worldview and I wouldn’t have suspected that anything was wrong.
Thinking back, I would have probably thought that being interviewed in front of cameras with the whole world about to see them talking about their new romance would make anyone nervous and prone to behave in ways that wouldn’t necessarily represent their true everyday characters, etc. I would have given them the benefit of the doubt and tried to see the positive side of things. I am *such* a tragic empath, it’s not even funny 🙄
I think it just goes to show that one aspect or one situation or seeing an isolated behaviour or example of body language etc is not enough to make a judgement. Body language is one example of how narcissism can only be identified over a period of time with evidence of a pattern of behaviours.
It’s important to be aware of red flags, listen carefully to your intuition, ask yourself things like, “would I do that?” and, “how do I truly feel about him/her saying or doing that?” (and then take your own feelings and values seriously), and to take your time in getting to know someone.
Hello WN,
I totally agree. It is very important to use many factors in relation to each other in identifying if someone might be a narcissist and not base that conclusion in isolated red flags. For example, alcoholism is a red flag for narcissism but Robin Williams struggled with alcoholism. Alcoholism can be one of the tools an empathic victim use to numb their misery and empaths have addictive tendencies as well. The mirroring that the body language expert pointed out regarding MM was not just from their first interview but also video from other events they attended. The body language expert actually felt that MM was very confident and Harry was very protective of her.
Haha I think it’s wonderful that you are an empath through and through. I am at the point of accepting who I am. I have been nervous about my son being so empathic but I have been reading articles on raising an empathic child and working on not worrying and instead working to make sure that he grows to be resilient. I just got the Big Life Journal because I remember how much journaling has helped me so much and I have actually accomplished more in my life when I was journaling so I think it will be helpful to him someday if he learns the habit of journaling.
Thank you for your comment MP ☺️
To be honest, I really don’t know how wonderful it is to be a ‘diehard’ empath haha 🤣 Sometimes, it would be nice to be able to just walk away from situations unshaken and unstirred like a narc does.
I think it’s fantastic that your son is empathic. After listening to HG’s videos about famous empaths, the empathic men he describes sound lovely – very sincere and caring men – and that is beautiful. After listening to HG describe famous empaths, it made me feel more positive about having the same traits. I think empathic traits have been described in a negative way too often, eg. weak, gullible, naive, and as sins etc. It’s good to hear the altruistic, socially responsible, honest and honourable traits of empaths being given respectful praise.
I think all children benefit from genuine self-worth. There are two things actually – self-worth and self-efficacy. These two inner feelings about the ‘self’ help to make children resilient and more able to deal with life’s experiences in future (both good and bad) with authentic confidence and self-worth.
I also find that writing about my thoughts helps a lot to understand things in a cognitive way rather than in a more ambiguous ’emotional’ way. It helps, I think, especially when it comes to these issues of psychology or emotions that are difficult to unravel and make sense of. That’s why it helps to have this forum to discuss things with others who understand and can relate ☺️😘
I agree about the benefits of writing down thoughts and that is why I believe the habit of journaling will help empathic kids. I think self expression is so important and when you write your thoughts you are able to articulate your emotions and even the situations you are in that seem very complicated. When it is articulated in the journal and you are able to read it, it is easier to look at it in a logical way and see where your emotional thinking is thick. I remember when I was journaling I even wrote the advantages and disadvantages of choosing a certain action towards a problem. It has saved me so much during my life with my N mom and it has helped me develop an inner self strong enough to not need a narcissist in my life. For the most part writing my thoughts in a journal feels safe as no one gets to read it and judge me. Nobody has to put up reading my grammar errors and long winded way of putti my thoughts down either. Although I stopped doing it when my N mom confronted me about what I wrote there and admitted that she had been reading it and I even found out from my cousin that my mom proudly read some of the things I wrote there to show how mature I already was at that age. It kind of destroyed my fondness of having a journal. But I wouldn’t read my kids’ journals so they would really benefit a lot from it. It is extremely helpful to be in a forum and exchange thoughts and ideas with people you have had the same experiences with which you will never get in a journal. Each outlet has its own advantages and disadvantages and I think both helps.
Narcs get shaken up a lot too. If my N mom had the ability to walk away from stuff my life would have been easier but she didn’t. I understand she was a Lesser but I have seen things affect my MR sister too and she wasted a lot of her life ruminating and complaining about how everyone failed her. I am very sensitive but I’m glad I have the ability to direct my attention to some other productive things like planting bulbs or doing some crafts like scrapbooks. I think narcs only have the ability to walk away from situations unshaken or unstirred when they know they are walking away after they have asserted superiority and control over the people involved in that situation. The empath being abused in that situation will of course be shaken and stirred and be left dealing with those emotions that are actually normal. The trick is leaving the situation before that happens and that is when boundaries can help us a lot. And also understanding that they are just narcissists and we shouldn’t take their assertion of superiority and control seriously. 🤷♀️
MP,
You have made many very sensible points in your comment, and I agree. It makes me think how ’emotional thinking’ – on the part of both empaths and narcs – can lead to situations that aren’t healthy or productive.
Your points about a narc getting shaken up as well are very helpful. It makes their behaviour easier to understand. It also makes it easier not to feel so threatened by them. Yes, they do get shaken up and that is why they need the control so much and feel so criticised or attacked when they don’t have it.
Ah, yes, the life-lessons of having an N mom… The learning throughout life is so very important. The down-side is that having an N mom makes life much more difficult than it should be. However, the up-side is that *eventually* it can teach you so much about life, other people and yourself. You just have to be willing and open to learn and to change. And also, to have healthy boundaries.
Thank you for your comment MP 😘
Thank you WN,
I just saw my last comment is full of grammatical errors hehe. My emotion spiked a little bit when I was writing that.
Personally I am just not comfortable with the thought process of narcissists of being better or superior and I feel that to say that any of their inherent traits that I do not have is more desirable than my traits rubs me the wrong way. I just enjoy being able to live with a mindset where I don’t compare whether I’m better or inferior than anyone and just want to be myself. My normal husband doesn’t even give any flicker of thought whether someone is better or if he is better than anyone. Our usual conversations are about what we want to do in our yard, plans for the weekend, activities for the kids, how to lose pandemic weight gain, finances, and sometimes what is going on with the people we care about. So different from my conversations from the narcissists in my life. When I have conversations with narcissists I always feel a some kind of push to self deprecate to flatter or appease them and the thought of that now gives me disgust. I prefer to think that we are all unique and amazing in our own ways. Whatever traits we have makes us all unique and the thought process narcissists have that they are stronger or better is often times not supported by the facts of their own lives. Just my thoughts. Thank you for patiently reading. 💕
Hi MP,
I understand what you mean about not comparing yourself to anyone else and being happy with your own self and what you enjoy doing. I feel the same way. At times when I do admire or notice something about someone, it’s more or less just an observation or passing thought. Even at times when I might be envious or critical of something, it’s not a feeling that consumes me or makes me dwell on the matter. I don’t harbour animosity towards that person or feel the need to copy them or anything like that. It’s an observation or an everyday comparison. We are all different and we all have our ‘good’ and ‘bad’ points.
Recently, I have been thinking about the kind of natural thoughts and motivations I used to have before I knew about narcissism and the need to be on constant watch for red flags. In some ways, I miss those days. I miss the innocence and spontaneity of my thoughts and emotions back then. I’m sure I had the same energy ‘push’ and pull that you mention without being aware of why, so in that way, I’m glad I’m aware now. However, the constant awareness now, and being ‘on guard’ whenever I’m with people – in case they are narcissists – is tiresome and detracts from the enjoyment of social interactions.
Like you say, I also feel the energetic push and pull when I’m around people. I notice it more now. I notice the effects of things like silent treatments, ignoring, small ‘tells’ or tests, and how these things affect my mood. Knowing about these effects is both helpful and also off-putting, as you describe. It’s irritating because I don’t want to be someone’s emotional dumping ground, so in that way, it does feel unwanted and I feel tension and irritation and also sadness. It’s helpful too at times, because I can feel what someone’s emotional needs are.
The whole aspect of narcissists thinking they are superior or better is an interesting human behaviour. That is what ‘narcissistic’ traits are all about I think. A way to compare ourselves to others and then rank each other according to what is better and what is worse. When you think about it, there’s a lot of judging and prejudice that goes on by humans in a social sense. The thoughts about what is ‘stronger’ or ‘better’ are subjective judgements based on personal convictions or social beliefs. These judgements are subjective rather than logical, so yes, they aren’t supported by facts.
You’re welcome MP, I’m happy to read your comments, and thank you for your patience too 🙂
Hello WiserNow,
I actually acquired that kind of thinking from my N mom. Then through my relationship with my husband he noticed that habit from me and he often told me that he doesn’t understand why there has to be someone better. I worked on removing that from myself. My husband is very competitive though and he told me that the way he motivated himself when he was in school was to pick someone he thinks is excellent and he works hard to be better than that person. But now as a professional he doesn’t do that anymore. He just cares that his patients are helped. He almost has zero narcissism in terms of being compared to other doctors. And I think that’s why it doesn’t bother him when some doctors act superior than him or if someone went to his rival. He is just confident and satisfied with what he has achieved and he loves when he knows he has really helped his patients and doesn’t seem to care if his rivals do great or not. I think there is a healthy level of competitiveness and then too much of that can be toxic. My husband said in school the only way he could sustain his interest in working hard was to have a goal to beat someone else who was really good. With my son I noticed that he learns so much faster when we play games and he tries to beat me. But I remember the way my N mom used to talk was like losing or winning defines me as a person and that over reaching I think makes the narcissistic way of competitiveness toxic.
I agree with what you said. I experienced something regarding about boundaries recently. My N sister’s former best friend saw me in line at the post office and I enthusiastically said hi back at her when she recognized me like I tend to always do with most people. I asked her how she is and she said that she is doing terrible. She said that she is in a really bad situation. I sympathetically told her that I’m sorry and looked at my kids to look away from her. I purposely watched my kids instead of looking at her to prevent her from opening up to me. The last look I saw on her face looked like she wanted to tell me what’s going on with her and I didn’t want her to. I just felt that we have separate lives and even though I know her she was never my friend so I didn’t need to be there for her. Then I said good bye to her before I left and she looked like she was upset at me. I wasn’t sure if I was rude so I told my husband what happened and he said he doesn’t blame me because she’s an idiot. I asked him why he said that and he said because he knows her and because she was my sister’s friend and my sister’s friends are all idiots. I guess that means I didn’t do anything wrong. 🤷♀️ But he does have a point about her being an idiot in general terms of who she is but she hasn’t done anything bad to me to make me that judgmental to her. My husband being a normal just seems to see people for what they are regardless of people being nice or not nice to him. I tend to only be very judgmental after someone has really pissed me off which means it’s already too late.
I want to add that the spike of emotions for me was not because of anything that you wrote. I just want to clarify that just in case it might appear that way. It’s from my personal issue and trigger. I enjoy reading your thoughts and I’m thankful for our conversation. Have a wonderful week. 💕🦋🌼
Thank you MP. I hope you have a wonderful week too 🙂
WN,
I want to add that I think it is always wonderful to have empathy. I would rather be a diehard empath anytime than be an unempathic narcissist who destroys someone and walks away unstirred because in their mind they care out as the victor and the strong one. I personally am so amazed at how much my little kids already have a strong sense of self and genuine confidence which I didn’t see in my N mom and N sister. Last Easter my kids were helping their special needs half brother and I told my husband how nice it is to see pure kindness without expecting any recognition. The kids were handing out eggs to their big brother because they just simply want him to not be left out and to have more eggs during the hunt. Maybe they saw that he was having a harder time finding eggs. They were just doing it quietly and it is a very simple and quiet act of kindness. So different from when my stepdaughters would act like his defender to nitpick on my behavior around me even if I didn’t do anything wrong but they never spend time with him or do anything to help him. But they act as their big heroes and defenders in a very loud manner that demands attention to them whereas the little kids were not even looking if anyone was watching them be kind to him. With all of my experiences with narcissists it’s just really hard for me to see their behaviors as better than non narcissists. I am just an eternal fan of empathy.
I totally agree MP. The more I learn about this subject, the more I appreciate empathic traits. I think empathy in children is the cutest thing and it’s lovely to see. It’s totally innocent and spontaneous and it’s very sweet and heartfelt. I’m a fan of empathy too. Real empathy isn’t loud or attention-seeking.
WiserNow, your last paragraph is so true.
Thank you A Victor. These videos where HG analyses the engagement interview show very clearly that Meghan was on a mission to meet Harry and have a relationship with him. It is so obvious in hindsight.
Hi WiserNow!
“Looking back at the engagement interview, it makes it so clear that a ‘whirlwind’ romance can go terribly wrong.”
Definitely.
It will be interesting if Harry has some realization – or gets out, in the future – and he takes a look back at all these interviews, etc. “documenting” her behaviour and things she has said. She will deny things that were lies, but it will be right there for Harry to see for himself.
That’s one future disadvantage of a narcississt putting themselves constantly in front of the camera but having no sense of accountability for the future.
WhoCares and WiserNow, it was that “whirlwind” paragraph I meant in my above comment but it went to an odd place. I once knew a couple married over 20 years after a 2 week courtship and Vegas wedding. At first I thought “Aw, how sweet” but as time went on it became more apparent there were problems. I thought it was interesting because it appeared the wife was the cause of the issues. I didn’t know anything about narcissism at that time, now I would love to run into them again and view it through that lens.
WhoCares,
Yes, having the actual ‘evidence’ straight from the narcissist’s mouth on YouTube and elsewhere for all to see is very helpful. A narcissist can deflect and deny all they like, but the truth is right there in their own words.