Long Live the King


I will always come back to you. I do this because I need to know that you are still pining for me. I need to know that you have not been able to move on from the pain that I have caused you. When I have cast you asunder and I have left you in a mental torment of pain and confusion as you struggle to reconcile the early golden period with the horror that followed, I will leave you be for perhaps a couple of months and then make my reappearance. Somewhere down the line, I will disappear again. I will wait for as long as I vanished the first time so you start to think, “yes he has really gone this time” and then I will add a week and then reappear. Each time I do this I wait just a little longer than the time before so you lower your admittedly fragile defences. It is all calculated.

I do this so you are conditioned to expect me back at some point. This means that I can seek out new victims in the meanwhile safe in the knowledge that you are sat waiting for me and will provide me with a deliciously juicy source of fuel in the future. It also means that I can manage your expectations. I get away with more and you expect far less. Again, it is all designed to enable me to do what I want.

I often return expecting to carry on as if nothing has happened. I call this my grand entrance. Like a king I will sweep back into your life and you will be so relieved to see me and also blown away by the grandiose nature of my return that you will be powerless to resist my overtures. In fact, because I will open the gates to heaven for a little while, you are relieved and delighted to have me back again. You think I have changed. You think I have been away and reflected on what I have done and have returned improved, better and redeemed. Oh the look on your face when I just appear at your front door. I can see you want to shout at me. I know you want to call me all the names under the sun but you cannot. My conditioning of you is so effective you just melt into my arms.

Alternatively, I decide I will play the spinning game. I will telephone you and then hang up the moment you answer. You call me back and I do not answer. You are now wondering why have I called? What does he want? Is it more torment or is he calling to apologise and makes things right? You cannot help but over analyse this situation. That is part of your DNA and why I chose you. I keep you spinning round and round. This entertains me and also softens you up for when I do decide to make the grand entrance.

Which ever way I decide to return, return I will and I shall do so in triumph as I capture you once more.

136 thoughts on “Long Live the King

  1. WhoCares says:

    Hi Lori,

    This is quoted from your post and is what I orginally objected to:

    “I’m supposed to take advice from a woman that allowed a narc to make her homeless? Ummm no. yeah I’m pretty sure that I nor many of the women here are that stupid dependent and needy to let that happen. The narc may have harmed me emotionally, but not intellectually and I’m certainly educated and intelligent enough to not allow myself to be put on the street and can most certainly provide for myself”

    Someone recently said to me: “Attack the behaviour, not the person.”
    So I regret if the fall out of my objection makes you feel personally attacked. That isn’t what I was attempting to achieve.

    (In fact when I thought my first reply to went to the ‘spam dungeon’ I was kinda happy since it allowed me to rethink my position and compose a slightly different – and hopefully more neutral – reply. Which is the reply that follows immediately beneath your quoted comment. But then HG found the orginal post of mine – which is fine because it probably reflects my authentic feelings more accurately.)

    The commentators here pride themselves on being empathic, strong, resilient and adaptable *DESPITE* having gone through what their narcs subjected them to. And one of the challenges that brings us all here is the question of what *is* considered abusive behaviour.

    I’ve read accounts here of people engaging in activities with their narc that, while they found it exploitive, I myself might not personally identify such behaviour as abusive or offensive. Further, if my narc had ever laid a hand on me in physical violence (but he never did) I would have been out of there faster than you can spell ‘wtf.’ However, if he asked me for the proverbial shirt off of my back – I may have just given it to him…*not knowing he was a narcissist and believing we were both working towards a common goal.*

    I’m going to draw attention to my own example above because even though I wouldn’t personally tolerate being hit by my partner, I would try my best not to judge someone who finds themselves in that situation because I understand the complexity surrounding the issue (as K explain exceptionally well in one of her posts.)

    So you may have been cutting down a troll in your statement but I took offense because you yourself are here offering advice to others and I don’t think it is wise to directly or indirectly convey that ‘homelessness’ is worse than staying with your abusing narc.

    It depends on your situation.

    It doesn’t matter if you’re fleeing a fancy-assed mansion or a fucking hovel.

    Sometimes fleeing is the only option you have and is the wisest and safest option.

  2. WhoCares says:


    “And I agree with you, there are many misconceptions about abuse and the key to fighting this is education and awareness, not finger pointing.”

    I greatly appreciated reading your post. It is well put.

    I may be equally guilty of finger pointing, and may have reacted out of being triggered, but I could not let it go because I’m fairly certain that there are readers here that are even reticent to post because of the level of some of the discussions. As many posters are quite educated, articulate and strong-minded. So if they finally get the nerve to take part and then come across messages like that..well, obviously it upsets me.

    But with the issue of socio-economic brackets; I have seen both sides of the equation – so I simply could not keep my mouth shut.

    1. K says:

      Thank you, WhoCares
      I don’t think you were finger pointing at all and it is understandable that you would be upset. You are correct to state that there are readers out there that may be too reticent to post. Domestic violence affects people of all socioeconomic backgrounds and education levels and the last thing any abuse victim needs is to feel shame or embarrassment.

      You have compassion and you strive for the truth, all while fighting for the underdog. Excellent empath traits BTW.

    2. Lori says:

      This is truly fascinating to observe. A woman shows up here with obvious signs of trolling behavior used insulting belittling downright nasty words like retards and you take up for her ? No one instigated or provoked this woman, yet you act as if she was wrongfully attacked?


      Absolutely not. This woman initiated some really nasty behavior and she was appropriately called on it.

      Failure to stick up for oneself when abusive or inappropriate behavior is directed at you is what keeps one in

      There is no excuse for behavior like that I don’t care what had happened you no one has the right to get away with that BS. Excusing it is enabling it

      1. K says:

        you really have missed the point. Neither WhoCares nor I are talking about, or defending, The Troll. We are talking about how the reader may perceive comments that display a lack of empathy and understanding in regards to why some people are forced to become homeless or choose to stay in abusive relationships.

      2. Lori says:

        Holy cow! She’s a troll! and it turns into some debate about empathy and homelessness? There is no other point

        I mean everything doesn’t have some deeper connotation and something that needs to be analyzed to death.

        She’s a troll that’s all it was about and all it will ever be about.

        It’s was inappropriate behavior period.

        Do you folks not get that she smashed through some boundaries? You don’t show up somewhere calling people retards and fucking idiots that’s criossing boundaries and healthy people recognize that. You do mot except that kind of behavior or explain it away with some sort of life experience that others may not understand. I don’t give a shit what her experience has been. It’s not excuse to overstep boundaries

        But in reality we are all here because there was a lack of boundaries. That’s just a fact

        1. SuperXena says:


          “But in reality we are all here because there was a lack of boundaries. That’s just a fact”

          Yes, it is important to define and settle boundaries but the main difference is how and why you are doing it.
          You are doing exactly the same as the original commentator. That is not a definition of boundaries. That is a personal attack that ipso facto loses its force. You are losing focus here.

        2. K says:

          No, you have got it all wrong. When you are done deflecting, projecting and being defensive, google: insight and cognitive empathy. Read about those until you have a good sense of what they mean.

          No one cares about The Troll*, except you, based on your rant. You are being too sensitive and you are looking at it the wrong way.

          * most likely a ULN IMO

      3. NarcAngel says:

        I could be wrong, but I think it was not about you adressing the troll, but rather the collateral damage in that there are others reading who may have been in the circumstance of being homeless arising from their entanglement and feel that you may have been lumping them in with the troll. I understand it was just your anger and outrage at the troll and I dont think you were thinking past addressing her, but the concern was that some may be reluctant to relate their circumstances if similar or if they thought they would be mocked or ridiculed and that is not what I believe you intended.

        1. K says:

          You are correct.

          1. NarcAngel says:

            Of course I am-I was just delivering it empathically lol. I am of course no stranger to controvery myself as you know, and though I understand the concerns of both sides very clearly, I appreciate her voicing her opinion honestly and owning it. Both sides have been allowed, as is the much appreciated protocol here in exposing us to different views and allowing us to decide for ourselves. Thank you HG. Now if you’ll excuse me, some bitch is banging on my cardboard door and she looks pissed………

          2. K says:

            Thank God you held on to your empathy because I felt mine slipping away, like dust in the wind. Good luck with the bitch at the door BTW.

      4. Lori says:

        You bet it’s personal and appropriately so. Your job is not to reprimand me. No one has been assigned that role

        Now if you would like to carry on with this we can certainly do that otherwise I’ll consider it a dead issue.

        1. HG Tudor says:

          I am drawing a line under this now. People have made their points and anything further is repetition.

    3. Bibi says:

      It appears I missed something. There was a troll?

      1. K says:

        It is all cupcakes and rainbows now, Bibi. I suspect The Troll is a ULN based on the comments and the threat “to turn HG’s world upside down.”

        1. HG Tudor says:

          I wouldn’t flatter with the Upper.

          1. K says:

            Ha ha ha…good to know because I wasn’t sure. The hostility, the threat and the posturing were excellent signs. And the opening statement was classic lesser language and the reason why I laughed. That’s what I grew up with.

      2. Bibi says:

        Given the title to this article, I think it’s appropriate to tell HG that a king doesn’t swat at flies.

  3. Lori says:

    I got ZERO Empathy for that loser that starts off her experience with calling people’s retards, idiots, morons etc…. that’s is not helpful to anyone and it’s being an asshole we’ll because she’s an asshole. It’s not acceptable behavior and I will call it out every single time. Just because you have had some “bad experience” it’s not an excuse for piss poor behavior. I’m sorry it’s not. She’s not someone wounded animal. She’s a troll

    As for what anyone thinks of me ? Who cares I know I don’t

  4. WhoCares says:

    You’re absolutely right Lori.

    I did need to hear myself say it. (But I’ll bet there are others that can identify with my post.)

    It is difficult for me to stand up for myself – but I can do it for others. So by doing so I put myself out on a limb and got *exactly* what I expected in response.

    You miss the point.

    It is not about the trolls. It is about the fact that you make valuable contributions here (as I’m sure others would attest to) but by belittling (inadvertently) the experience of others who are reading along (NOT the troll) when it is already an uphill battle to free yourself from an entanglement…well, it is hardly empowering.

    1. Lori says:

      I call things how I see them. Facts are facts it’s not personal. She is a troll

      Showing up call people retarded pathetic idiots is trolling behavior.

      I’m belittling a troll and it’s appropriate.

  5. WhoCares says:

    Call anyone whatever name you want.
    My statement still needs saying.

    1. Lori says:

      According to whom? Who told you it needed to be said? I think what you meant is you wanted to say it

  6. WhoCares says:


  7. WhoCares says:

    HG – I just sent a comment (somewhat longwinded) to Lori but it appears to be ‘lost’ …I don’t want to re-type it if its in moderation, but feel it is important for other readers and will retype if necessary.


    1. HG Tudor says:

      Spam dungeon ate it.

      1. Lori says:

        That is funny 🙂

      2. MB says:

        Thank God you’re drawing a line HG! Next time trolls come to the blog, I would prefer that HG handle them (correct them) without releasing his comments. People that come here only to cause trouble and have nothing constructive to add, shouldn’t be allowed to post publicly. HG knows what they are doing as soon as their first post comes through.

        1. HG Tudor says:

          I allow ‘trolls’ to make a comment because it is part of the dynamic here. In a wider sense, those who arrive here and attack me (and readers) are either

          1. A very raw and hurt victim who has let their emotions (understandably) get the better of them. They may read more and alter their view, they may fail to do so and retreat;
          2. A troublemaker who is just looking to get a reaction. They are just providing a dollop of fuel and they will not get a lashing from me;
          3. A well-intentioned individual but one who has jumped to conclusions because they make inaccurate statements whereby if they had actually bothered to read the material and seen the interactions on the blog they would realise their statements are inaccurate. Chief offenders are “You only does this for fuel” or “All the people here are idiots for believing what he tells you, he is a narc” Those individuals may spend some time reading and alter their view or are too opinionated and cannot deal with the fact they have made a schoolboy error and therefore lash out further or just disappear.
          4. My agent trying to wind me up.

          In all but number 4, these individuals demonstrate part of the narcissistic dynamic form one side or the other and therefore an initial exchange is permitted. I then halt them where it is either ad hominem, out and out nonsense or repetitive.

          1. Twilight says:


            You have an agent that comes here to wind you up, or try to?

          2. HG Tudor says:

            No, it was a joke Twilight.

          3. Twilight says:

            And here I was thinking maybe I could apply for a new career 😉

          4. HG Tudor says:

            Ha ha.

          5. Twilight says:

            Now is that your evil laugh or your charming laugh…..doesn’t matter I would like both

      3. MB says:

        You’re very patient HG. Much more grown up than I am. Thank you for being the voice of reason…in every way.

        1. HG Tudor says:

          I can be in certain instances, this place is one.

    2. Lori says:

      I saw it. You may cater to the troll if you like. I don’t have to

  8. WhoCares says:

    I’m so sorry Lori – but I have to step in here and respond to something that you said. I feel the place where your response comes from and agree with some of it but there’s something you should keep in mind and that there are women (and men) reading here that are not from the same socio-economic bracket as you (although I don’t know your situation of course so even that is an assumption). There are those who struggle with leaving their narcissist but for fear of being homeless they do not. And then there are those who make the choice to be, effectively, be homeless rather than go back to their narcissist. It is not always so easy a decision and there are many cultural stigmatizations that play into the decision.
    Sometimes it would it be far wiser to choose homelessness (hopefully temporary) than re-entanglement with a Narc. And I would hope that a woman’s decision to do so – with or without children – in order to achieve protection would not be regarded as stupid because it is beliefs like that can feed into someone staying with a narc well beyond the time that they should.

    1. Lori says:

      Then perhaps that person should be calling others idiots who wouldn’t be in that situation

    2. Lori says:

      Sorry but asshole knows no socio economic status. Asshole is just asshole. It comes in all shapes sizes colors and socio economic statuses

  9. /iroll says:

    “It also means that I can manage your expectations.”

    Well i’m glad this came up because it fits my Infant King narc, perfectly. He even loves to use the phrase “managing your expectations”!

    While my defences are admittedly fragile-emotional, i’m also observing and gathering info. about his vulnerabilities – (it’s why we obsess about the abuser, because we’re looking for bluebeard’s skeleton key) – which may have zilch to do with his feelings for me, but are definately indicators of how he feels about himself.

    For instance, when he came to my place and saw signs of another partner, despite us not being in a committed relationship – he got so territorially jealous that he barely ate the whole time. That’s a sign of stress hormones working with elevated Testosterone. Ofc he sulked, alienated and triangulated because wanted me to feel rejected, but nothing can break through his fear of being rejected all the time, and i did that to him once, setting the eternal cycle in motion (plus his incapacity to bond). That’s WHY we must become eternally pining damsels, as fuel to repair their worst fears.

    Maybe this is a special role? I’d like to see the post-relationship fuel roles broken down.

    It’s crazy-making, but a normal person doesn’t keep coming back to their ex, and there’s no trauma bond that would make us desire it. It’s a strange situation and i’m facing it ‘atm’.

  10. Angela Diaz says:

    Are you all fucking retards???? I hope none of you pay into this idiot. Every person is a narcisist and a victim. All of your pity stories to this ridiculous idiot are not even correct. I feel you type to hear yourself talk. I dated my guy for 2 years and we fought on and off. It took me to realize that I played a victim as much as he controlled. MAYBE LOOK AT YOUR OWN SELF INNER WORTH AND WHAT YOU HAVE ACCOMPLISHED ON YOUR OWN!. I only type this to help those of you that suffer from a complextion that has exhibited control by this freak. My friend Samantha told me about this site and I find it amazing how many retarded self worthless women there are on here. I spent time in a homeless shelter, lived on the streets because my ex kicked me out. Not once do I blame him anymore since I found strength in the fact that we just were not meant to be. ALL I CAN HOPE IS ALL OF YOU seriously chin up and do the right thing. Move on women. It is us that are in control when it comes down to it. THANK YOU SAMANTHA FOR TELLING ME ABOUT THIS SITE!!! How pathetic and I bet none of these women lived like I did.

    1. HG Tudor says:

      There is little point highlighting the repeated inaccuracies and worthless ad hominem insults in your comment. Its totality speaks volumes about what you are.

      1. K says:

        Ditto what you wrote, HG. This sentence alone is very telling:
        How pathetic and I bet none of these women lived like I did.

        Although, I did get a little chuckle out of the opening statement.

      2. Dragonfly says:


      3. angela diaz says:

        yep. pretty pathetic group that exasperates the will of the oh so called weak. HG—you are a want to be musician at heart I feel. I love your reality in the world, but it isn’t that. I have a son fighting in war’s, which I am so proud of because we don’t need the shit going on today. I have a husband today that is retired from the marines. As he tell’s me when he read’s this shit about you and all the fake want to be bullshitters—-wake the fuck up, do something to make yourself better, do something for you country. HG. quite honestly I would never want to even talk to you, but I will say if you ever fuck up my friend Samantha’s world again your world will get turned upside down. Very quickly!!! Hint Hint

        1. HG Tudor says:

          As ever you make the mistake of assumption about both me and the readers here who are largely an intelligent and articulate group. You have no idea what I do professionally but understand this, people sleep well at night because of what I do. Furthermore, you are unwise to threaten me because (a) I do not know who Samantha is, You state “fuck up her world again” I haven’t done it once, so you must be referring it to having been fucked up by someone else before hand and also I have no reason to do so she is not an issue to me (of course if you read my work, you would understand that was the case, but don’t let the information get in the way of your posturing) (b) feel free to ask my readers how much they have benefitted from my work and consultations, or shall I send you the hundreds of e-mails confirming that? (c) you would be disincentivized before you did anything.

        2. K says:

          angela diaz
          No, you are wrong and your opinion doesn’t matter.

      4. ava101 says:

        Uhm … I daresay that HG does a lot!! here, and helps combatting the darkness (at least in this role of his … private life is a different matter I suppose) – in contrast to people who believe in police states and military violence, which is all about ressources, money, power – of psychopaths! Wasting a life for that kind of illusion?! As a slave to a state power which forces you by the use of violence to act according to its wishes and give it your money, no matter where you are (in American case, you sound American), or otherwise revoking your freedom to travel! Never having asked you. And you judge about someone writing about what goes in the minds of those who abuse other people this way?! But talking about self esteem, living free life according to own decisions, judging about independent thinking and acting of readers. Funny.

        1. HG Tudor says:

          Valid points Ava101

      5. MB says:

        This person does not deserve your precious attention HG. Save it for the loyal.

        1. HG Tudor says:

          Good point.

      6. Lori says:

        Oh look littke sweet Angela thinks she’s special with her veterans lol. I’ll one up ya Angie my whole family has served

        Just when you thought you were special

        1. Twilight says:


          Why are you given her the attention she desires?

          She is what she is….blind.

      7. Lori says:


        I love a troll. I thoroughly enjoy chewing them up and spitting them out.

        No I’m not Narc.

        1. Twilight says:


          There is a way to tear them up with out using so much emotion.

          I do not like it when they appear here and decide to have a go at HG and his work, that in its self is enough for me to pick my blades up so to say, add attacking others here I am ready for a fight then.

          Use logic, not emotion you will win every time.

          You have lost focus and using emotion, your losing.

    2. SuperXena says:

      Angela Diaz,

      Your comment made me think of the following proverb. Not being English my first language , I provide it to you in four different versions. I hope you get the message of what this means:

      “The pot calling the kettle black ”

      “Man ska inte kasta sten i glashus”

      “Vemos la paja en el ojo ajeno, y no vemos la viga en el nuestro”

      ” Celui qui voit la paille dans l’oeil de l’autre mais qui ne voit pas la poutre dans le sien”/ ” La poêle qui se moque du chaudron”

      1. Twilight says:

        Well said Superxena

        1. SuperXena says:

          Thank you Twilight.

      2. ava101 says:

        I want a German version, SuperXena!

        1. SuperXena says:

          Ha,ha ava101….Touché!

          I am sorry to disappoint you ….but German is not one of my languages…Perhaps you can help me with that one??

      3. Lou says:

        Den Splitter im fremden Auge, aber nicht den Balken im eigenen Auge sehen.
        Ein Esel schimpft den anderen Langohr

      4. Lou says:

        Kehre zuerst vor deiner eigenen Haustür

        1. HG Tudor says:

          Why, has the postman finally arrived?!

      5. ava101 says:

        Same as your second version:
        Du sitzt im Glashaus und wirfst mit Steinen. 🙂

        1. SuperXena says:

          Thank you ava 101! Very similar to the second version, yes.
          Germanic languages after all. Interesting to see that both make reference to a ” glasshouse”. Just as a curious fact that I googled: glasshouse in British English means “prison” as well in “military slang”)

      6. Lou says:


        1. SuperXena says:

          ?? Lou : Vad är lustigt?

      7. Lou says:

        Hi SuperXena. I was referring to HG’s answer about the postman finally arriving. Found it funny.
        Sorry for the confusion.

        1. SuperXena says:

          Hello Lou,
          I had not read the whole thread but now that I have I understand what you were referring to. What is funny is that you wrote in German and we have the same word in Swedish meaning exactly the same…Germanic languages after all.
          What I find even more “lustig” is the whole thread originated by the original “lustig” comment.
          Thank you for clarifying Lou!

      8. Loustig says:

        You are welcome, SuperXena.

    3. Twilight says:

      Angela Diaz

      The blind can not see what the mirror shows

      1. Kellie Mccoey says:

        Sounds like Angela is a narcissist and her friend Samantha woke up in part to Mr Tudor’s insight. That would explain the distain towards him. Just a thought.

      2. NarcAngel says:

        “The blind can not see what the mirror shows”

        That is so true. Whoever is dressing Stevie Wonder should be fired.

    4. Twilight says:

      Angela Diaz

      Just so I am clear in what I said

      You can not see that which the mirror shows

    5. Lori says:

      Can you say PROJECTION ?

      Holy shit lady you seriously need a shrink and quick. Oh there’s an idiot here alright and it’s you.

      No one would have to be a narc to dump you. As angry and miserable as you come across I think most woukf dump you. Get some help Miss Angela

      That poor guy…

      1. Lori says:

        Oh geez I still can’t stop laughing at Angela’s little rant. I’m supposed to take advice from a woman that allowed a narc to make her homeless? Ummm no. yeah I’m pretty sure that I nor many of the women here are that stupid dependent and needy to let that happen. The narc may have harmed me emotionally, but not intellectually and I’m certainly educated and intelligent enough to not allow myself to be put on the street and can most certainly provide for myself

        So uh hey Angela who is the real idiot here ? The Evidence would suggest it’s you. 🙂

      2. WhoCares says:

        I just wanted point out – in the interest of fighting misunderstanding and misconceptions – that narcissistic abuse crosses socio-economic borders.
        And, personally, I had to fight against the disbelief that I had been abused because I didn’t believe (in my own opinion) that I was from the right demographic to be abused. This *kept* me staying in the situation of abuse because I fed into this stigma.

        On other hand; since the entanglement I have had to spend time in a women’s shelter and I must point out that making the suggestion – to anyone – that it is ‘stupid’ to let a narc cause you to become homeless is as equally misconceived as saying (in some situations) that it is smarter to stay with your abusing narcissist than it is to actively choose homelessness.

        1. K says:

          There are so many reasons why people stay in abusive relationships: fear, conditioning, love/hope, shame, cultural/religious reasons, isolation, language barriers/immigration status, lack of money, support or resources or a disability.

          It is a very complex issue and victim blaming is dangerous because it deflects from the real issue: why, as a society, do we ignore, condone, tolerate and gloss over abuse.

          Strong, intelligent and mentally healthy individuals often become prey to disordered personalities. I have read accounts of architects, lawyers, therapists (LCSW, Psy.D, MFCC) and doctors being ensnared and abused for years. And I agree with you, there are many misconceptions about abuse and the key to fighting this is education and awareness, not finger pointing.

      3. Lori says:

        It is stupid to let a narc allow you to become homeless. I mean damn at some point you have to say enough is enough.

        I’m sorry I call crap what it is. If you allow someone to make you homeless you have mental health issues. If you allowed abuse to that point you have serious issues and any therapist would tell you that.

        Normal healthy people don’t allow that to happen and I would say probably even say most codependents wouldnt allow that to happen. Only someone with some deep seated emotional problems would allow that. Cause trust fhat sisng just happen out of the blue one day

    6. BurntKrispyKeen says:

      I am sorry that you had to endure the pain of a difficult relationship. One of your implications is correct… all relationships have their ups and downs, and it certainly takes two to travel a journey that lasted for two years.

      You seemed to have had a particularly difficult struggle which has given you obvious strength through rising above your living conditions. Therefore, you are now speaking from a place of having conquered your battle… not from within the midst of it.

      Looking back always gives us the best view.

      But even then, it’s not always easy to see…

      Not everyone is at the place where you are now.

      Everyone here is not “blaming” their narcissist in the way you implied. Personally, I have felt like a “victim” because I was greatly deceived, lied to and cheated on multiple times after being led to believe that he’d never treat me in any way close to harmful. It broke my heart. But nowhere have I ever stated that I have had it worse than others…. just as many others have had it worse than you.

      But it’s subjective… our pain. One thing it’s not… is a competition.

      Like many here, I see MY role in my relationship with a narcissist and I take responsibility. Yes… as you implied, the term gets overused. Some will label a “decent fellow” who simply wants out of the relationship as a narcissist just because he doesnt want to stay and work it out. But that is NOT what I see happening here. And if you took the time to get to really know the details of some of these stories, you’d see the patterns of narcissism. And you would also see the sincerity and pain in the men and women who have struggled to understand narcissism as a personality disorder. Because all humans share traits of narcissism. Obviously.

      And while I applaud you for having worked through your situation, I’m still working to try to understand what was lacking within myself to make me want to stay/go back to someone who disrespected me.

      I see most of the posts here to be from kind, intelligent people. And HG… his sharing of what goes on inside his head… divulging the ways he’s interacted within in personal life… his advice for how to manage an individual with his personality traits… HIS insight is what has helped me. And I’ve tried elsewhere, trust me.

      So I’m not here because I’m under HG’s spell… I’m here because he has been able to SPELL OUT narcissism in a way that I can relate and utilize.

      So if thinking women like me are pathetic, then I’m the one who feels the pity.

      Opening our hearts to others who have experienced a rough go of it allows our minds to follow… to hopefully start to see that we all have more similarities than differences. So give yourself another pat on the back for taking responsibility, for rising above a terrible time in your life. But perhaps you will consider taking all of that energy and helping another who might not have been blessed with your fortitude?

      And may your heart then be blessed as well.

      (And if that doesn’t sound like a good option, the next time you and Samantha get bored, I will be happy to offer a few suggestions of entertainment that will surely be more fun than picking on folks who are trying to heal from relationships with people who treated them in a manner that was, at the least, plain mean.)

      1. BurntKrispyKeen says:

        I’m starting to see that meanness is a real disorder too.

      2. WhoCares says:

        I came back to re-read your lengthy – but highly valuable – post and I’m so glad I did.

        Even though you address Angela Diaz, and so your efforts there might fall on deaf ears there, the message conveyed to other readers speaks volumes.

        That is one other thing that keeps me coming back to HG’s blog; the fact that it has something to offer no matter what level of understanding you’re at. And even when you’ve come to terms with your own personal narcissist(s), Narcissism itself is such a fascinating topic on a objective level and an opportunity for some real learning (subjectively.)

    7. Yolo says:

      We can’t change our past experiences. I know what it’s like to feel angry at people who appear weak and victims. I later found out that those very things I hate were the things I hated about myself and didn’t know it.

      Samantha, referred you to this site for 1 or 2 reasons. I am not rushing to judge because i too was angry, hurt, and confused when I first came here.

      I don’t know if you will return to see this message. I hope you dont ever have to go through being homeless again.

    8. Kellie Mccoey says:

      Dear Angela seem like you have been through quite alot. You have made it to the other side unscathed and not bitter at all. Good for you sister! Your right to say I’ve never been homeless. As retarded as I may be according to you I’ve somehow managed to never be homeless.

    9. Persephone In Sunlight says:

      Angela Diaz,

      Really, do you talk to your friend Samantha like this? You call her a retard? Pathetic and worthless?
      Not very supportive, I would say.

      I would hazard a guess that you denigrate her every time she doesn’t follow your advice to the letter.

      With friends like you cutting into her self confidence, who needs enemies?

      And if you dated a guy for 2 years that you didn’t get along with, why did you then cohabitate with him? That right there makes your judgement suspect. It’s ridiculous to think that moving in with a person you don’t get along with would make anything about the relationship better.
      Or do you wish to clarify any of your statements, that you might make them comprehensible?

      Sounds like you are projecting your anger about something else here. I can’t understand some of what you say at all, and your cruelty to your friend, the blog host, and others who have been harmed by NPD here is mind boggling.

      Although I don’t really expect you to reply in any even mannered, well thought out response.
      I bet you are here because you think this would be an easy place to abuse people.
      (sigh) You can go back under your bridge, now..

    10. Lori says:

      I’m sorry but I’m lmao at a homeless woman calling everyone idiots and pathetic, yet continues to comment

    11. Lori says:

      Wow Angela has really come up in the world. She’s got her a real live husband and a smart phone. Look out world we have a real up and comer here!

      From homeless to to husband and smartphone. What a journey


    12. Bibi says:

      Oh, so here is the troll.

  11. Maddie says:

    Once You’ve left me You wouldn’t want to come back…I wouldn’t be anywhere…

  12. Jessica says:

    I remember this game…. I call it the merry go round from hell. Never moving forward wasting my precious time. Wish I knew about this last year but today I am more educated. Will be leaving soon.

  13. icecube says:

    It can make you a little paranoid. You find yourself not sure what is pure coincidence and what is real. Yes I will ride it out. Nothing lasts for ever after all. So refreshing to talk to you. I can’t bear all the other sites with the “victim” or “survivor” mentality. I don’t see myself as either. Thank you

  14. icecube says:

    What is the likely outcome when you NC for 8 months and then deliberately accepted the Hoover the intention being to deliberately cause narcissistic rage, which you had great success with. You are then discarded which you actually laugh at but send a final text letting them know that you know what they are and will shout it out if they don’t leave you alone. It has got to the point that if I now got a Hoover I would feel very insulted as it would imply to me that I still come across as weak enough to accept it.

    1. malignnarc says:

      Just to clarify icecube do you mean that you allow yourself to be hovered and then you do something to ignite the N’s fury on purpose? This results in you then being discarded and you send a shot across the N’s bows concerning exposure. If so and a further hoover occurred this is likely to be of malign nature to punish you, dependent on the type of N you are dealing with. If a lesser or mid-range it is likely that they will focus on someone else for fuel. A greater N would look to dole out malign hoovers to provoke reactions from you. A malign hoover is not designed to suck you back in to the “usual” relationship but instead is aimed at maintaining of relationship/connection whereby you are provoked to provide negative fuel.

      1. icecube says:

        Thanks for your response.
        Yes after seeing what he was 9 months ago (took me over 3 years !) I decided that was it. He had gone into another silent treatment and I had enjoyed it. I became me again. He then called and was angry that I was happy so I decided not to acknowledge him again ignoring all messages and calls. Then as I felt strong and felt like having a bit of fun and had also put on a bit of weight (doing battle with him was great for weight loss) I decided to accept a message so I could idealise/devalue him, critisise him and “pay back” a bit knowing it would end again and I would not care.
        I’ve since bought your books. My problem now is that I cannot work out which type he is. He seems to be a combination of all but cerebral. I know he is now “smearing” me as I have heard things back that only he knew.
        I read your book about getting revenge and it is very tempting but I’d like to feel if I just ride it out and ignore everything he might just move on completely. I’d like to know that he would be gone from any interest in my life for good and not even have to think about what he’d do. But I don’t know how to tell what will happen and I want to know.

        1. malignnarc says:

          Thanks for the additional information and for reading the books. Our kind can have traits from different cadres of narcissist but they will lean towards one type more than another, with traits from perhaps two cadres. How do you intend to deal with the smearing? Will you ride that out too? Is it having any impact on you?

  15. C’mon…the call and hang up then don’t answer routine actually works on them?! It’s so elementary, I’m surprised they’re actually falling for it. Silly rabbits…tricks are for kids. I guess if you’re not dazzling them with brilliance, you’re baffling them with bullshit…. cheers!

  16. Alice says:

    And what if, for the first time ever, I see right through you. I know exactly what you are and I never want to see you again. You’ve spent 6 months trying to Hoover me back in. But I haven’t let you. I don’t love you anymore. I don’t want you anymore. And I know you’re just trying to gain me back as supply.

    And then some day you realise this. And I’ve stopped texting you. I’ve stopped replying to your texts. And I don’t react to your profile pictures on social media. The ones you put there specificly for me. Though you would deny that.
    You know I can see them though, because “No contact” isn’t an option when there are children involved.

    Now you’re with new supply. She’s oblivious. She loves you. She would do anything and you’re her king and you know it.
    Will you still come back for me?

    I hope you won’t. Don’t ever come back.

  17. I’ve had a fake fb profiles for four years now. We were only together for a year and a half! On the last fake name I made the mistake of showing my face in my profile photo. He made a fake profile and posted negative reviews to trash my current boyfriend’s (a WONDERFUL man) sister’s business in response. HG, will he never stop? Do I have to “hide” forever?

    The backstory is that I finally went NC after he had to move out of state for a new job. He wanted me to follow him and tried all the tricks, made promises etc etc. I now live in a different COUNTRY and he still tries to poke at me. After the breakup I got enough information about him that I could symbolically knock him out and I’m not above blackmailing him into silence but I’d rather just continue to not engage.

    HG thank you so much for bearing your soul (yes, I do believe you have one) and helping so many many people heal. You’ve turned a hugely challenging negative into such an amazing positive and we are very grateful for that. I sincerely hope that you find true self worth and peace. You’re getting help and lots of people are rooting for you. Just because doctors etc don’t know of a “cure” (or whatever) does not mean that there isn’t one.

    My fellow combat veterans, please do not lose hope! Yes, it has taken years, but my ptsd is a LOT better and three months after The Bad One moved away I met someone amazing who had impacted my life in so many positive ways! It can and will happen for you! You are all amazing and you WILL recover! <3

    1. malignnarc says:

      Hello Elaine, he will never stop so long as he has an opportunity to gain fuel. You inadvertently gave him that opportunity by using your face in the profile pic. We are cruising along, seeking new victims, tormenting old ones and if you keep off our radar you will be left alone. The moment you do something and sometimes it is only slight, which gives us an in, we will come for you in order to gain fuel. It is akin to Lord of the Rings. If the one ring is not worn, the Nazgul don’t know where the ringbearer is but as soon as it is worn it sends out a signal that has them homing in on the ringbearer. It is similar for us. Yes, even though you are in a different country the advantage/disadvantage of technology soon eats away the miles. Thank you for your kind words, they are appreciated.

  18. Suzanne says:

    I’m taking my ex to court. It’s a horrible game of I charge you/ you charge me. She was very very shocked I finally stood up for myself. But in the mean time she is doing everything to try and destroy me. It’s hard.

    1. malignnarc says:

      Always the case. Court proceedings are a stage to our kind with fuel to obtain, people to manipulate and vendettas to wage.

    2. Dumb Fuck says:

      you are all a bunch of “victims” . I know my ex was a mentally unstable person. She was messy, she smelled, yet she cried because of her “current” yet separated husband managed to get rid of all her money. She was worthless—worked at places like Home Depot, other meaningless jobs. It is not a narcisist who causes the issues. It is the so called “victim card” people want to play. My ex lived with me and we really didn’t date after having sex like maybe 4 times. I never considered a relationship and was so happy I could move away from her. I always felt I had to just keep her so she could survive. The greatest day’s of my life was when she finally moved out. We still hung out, but it was horrible. We slept together, but I wanted nothing to do with her. She had horrible smells, was horrible in bed, stomped around like a 3rd grader, complained about fibromylgia if I spelt that correctly. I am just saying, stay away from the (women) or (men) that play the guiilt card. I wish I could cause her damage like she caused me, but it has been a long time and I am not going to go there. We both were bad for each other, but I just say now, being single, I am mutch happier and never ever would date a troll like her again. Keep your head up and stop playing a victim. She played it really well with my friends and myself.

      1. NarcAngel says:

        Dumb Fuck (excellent name btw)

        Well what a saint you are! What with putting up with her mess, horrible smells, lack pf bedroom skills, her meaningless jobs, and all the while keeping her so she could just survive. Sounds like you’re the victim.

        Here’s your card………

      2. WiserNow says:

        Dumb Fuck,
        Go and troll elsewhere.
        The End.

      3. Yolo says:

        H.G. why would you let this through? Hummm…walk down memory lane to??

        1. HG Tudor says:

          For reasons of demonstration.

      4. K says:

        Dumb Fuck
        If say so but you have got it all wrong.

  19. T says:

    No way, Jose! It won’t work this time, HG! 😉

  20. Observant says:

    HG, is there a thread started for the Devil’s Toolkit? I have thoughts on it as I’m reading, but they are off-topic when posted in daily blogs.

    1. malignnarc says:

      Yes Observant there is, it goes by the same title as the book and is about 4 months old.

  21. Observant says:

    The spin which got under my skin was through FB Messenger: when the N is active (chatting with someone else) and I start typing, then suddenly N’s status is inactive. There is nothing to be said in that situation without sounding like a stalker. (steam slowly rolls out of ears as ego deflates little by little)

    1. malignnarc says:

      And don’t we just know that. I used my Blackberry Messenger to that effect.It would tell the sender that I had read the message and that I was typing a response but I would just leave it there so they were always waiting whilst I went off and did something else. It was great for getting pent-up messages sent to me.

      1. bethany7337 says:

        So glad to have this confession so I never again get my panties in a wad over the little “typing a response bubbles” that I experienced a multitude of times. Just like calling me and hanging up …and then saying it was a butt dial. Lol.

      2. observant says:

        If I wasn’t NC, HG, I would use that. Gleefully.

  22. Rose says:

    I was leaving…..i got hoovered in. One more sex session….how bad can it be? Texting next morning….theres not enough food in the house, i want you gone. You stole food and didnt replace it. Your a thief. Get out. Lame shit but i allowed the hoover to prove to myself he is indeed a N. He locked me out. I broke a window. He called cops hoping id get arrested. No. I live here idiot….today is hell. Hes on eggshells wondering what I will do next. I feel powerful….got him scared. Freedom soon…..💔

    1. T says:


      He doesn’t deserve you!
      Don’t downgrade yourself to “booty call”……he just kicked you in the teeth in the end….


  23. nikitalondon says:

    A true but very exhausting situation. Once a decisiom is taken to start a new life there should be no looking back. To focus on a new life, new experiences, feelings and livings is a promising focus for the future.

    Thanks HG for the posting. As always great! Comgratulations for having reached more than half a million hits!!!!
    YOU ARE THE BEST !!! 😘😘😘❤️💓

    1. malignnarc says:

      Thank you Nikita.

  24. Cara says:

    The spinning game. Another version of this is where my mother is “done” talking to me & just when I think I get to enjoy blessed silence, she launches into a three hour harangue about I don’t even know what (because after 38 years of this shit, I’ve stopped listening)

  25. Robyn says:

    Thank you for reminding me this will happen. It is only been slightly over a year since we have split for God but of course he still comes into my life periodically this time I will react differently and I thank you very much for the forewarning

    1. malignnarc says:

      Hello Robyn, you are welcome.

  26. Sidney says:

    A Breakthrough….
    I have been with My N four years. (One year married, tho we have never lived under same roof). The latest MIA had lasted 3 weeks. Against everyone’s advice, I agreed to meet him for dinner. For the first time EVER, after all the push away’s and pull me back, after so many times I “melted into his arms, just at the sight of him,” I honestly felt nothing. NOTHING. He wasn’t good looking or unattractive. He wasn’t charming or boring. He wasn’t muscular or scrawny. He wasn’t intelligent or a buffoon. He was nothing to me. Even when he tried to hold my hand, touch and kiss me, it was like a familiar family friend that you are polite to, but feel nothing for. Plain. Tepid. Nothing. This feeling of nothing is the most powerful I have felt in four years. It is amazing and revealing and healing. Now to make him think the divorce is HIS idea….

    1. T says:

      Good for you, Sidney!!!!

      It sounds like you’ve had enough!

      Stay strong!

      1. Sidney says:

        Thank you T…. Each day is still a battle of sorts because as HG has said previously, he will not divorce me. Not sure how to proceed from here to achieve that end, but reading and learning has helped me get this far. The ability to predict his next move- from social media BS to slandering me- has allowed me to not react. Which btw is driving him crazy. That gives me a sense of satisfaction I must admit. From what I read here… His evil ugly worst is yet to come.

  27. Rachel says:

    Yes!!! This is so true!
    I have been no contact ! I lived this tug and pull life for a year! He was love bomb king for first 3 months! Then boom! He decides he’s not happy… Wants a reaction! I was in shock! I beefed and pleaded to make it better! Wth was I thinking! I was the perfect partner… Wanted love and respect… Did everything ! Cried, shattered all my boundaries ! I then would wait for an ounce of emotion from him. He acted like I was a bother to him… To even touch. He looked me in the eye as I was crying… And said… I have no desire to to touch you… The only reason I do is for you. I was in denial … That wanting to be wanted and loved and needed were wrong. I was becoming him!
    As I would wait for him to wake up I would cry and ask myself .. What am I doing? He had moved me away from all my friends and family 7 hours away… No money and no way out. I was so afraid to go to the store that he would be cheating or texting past loves… I was always checking his phone. He was making me crazy! He made me feel ugly and depression sat in. I wanted to scream! The night I finally stepped up and told him somthing has to change or I was leaving…( took all the guts I had) and was standing there shaking… Scared and crying…
    He comes back at me with eyes of a demon… So put frothing at the corners or his mouth… In a rage like I had never seen before… Good! Pack your shit! The only reason you are still here is because I feel sorry for you ! And. I’ve been trying to figure out how to get you out for the past month. I left that day. Broken. In a fog. My heart torn out. I came back three days later .. Packed up all my things and left… The whole time he was watching sports and getting drunk.
    I have went no contact. He continues to text. I do not open them. He text my mother when I don’t reply. She has blocked him. I have unfriended him on social media. Now his mother is sending Happy Mother’s Day text .. His friends that were my friends .. Only by knowing him… I have also unfriended on social media… Are sending me messages. In all this ” flying monkies” I have yet to crack. I have moved on in my recovery. I will never, not once look back, because I can still feel the hot breath of this demon on my shoulders every step I take forward. Be strong!

    1. T says:


      Good for you! Don’t EVER look back, friend!!

      1. Rachel says:

        Thank you! I have had no desire to answer his text… I own a property with him or I would block him for good. He has stopped texting for a week… So let’s see what’s next… I have moved on with my happiness.❤️

        1. T says:

          You GO, Rachel! I’m proud of you!👏🏽

  28. angeandkyla says:

    What happens if I left you first??

    1. malignnarc says:

      Then you will witness a sustained attempt to hoover you. If that does not work,expect further intermittent attempts either good or bad, influenced by the type of N you were involved with and the extent to which you enter his sphere of influence again.

      1. angeandkyla says:

        You were right, HG 🙂 Of course. He is being very, very covert as he has been warned by church to not contact or approach me. Why do you lot appear just as things settle??

        1. malignnarc says:

          So your guard will be down.

    2. Connie Anderson Smolak says:

      Word for word of what was written “long Live The King” Gives me chills of fear! Last time he came back! I kept a journal of the calls and the stalking and got a protection order. This is all going on while he is 6 months into his new victim! Freak! I never once called him nor contacted him but he would stalk me and wouldnt let me go. I became agrophbic, depressed, and fell apart. Doctor says “A Melt Down” The protection order is for 2 years! It hopefully will keep him away!

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