You Say This, I Hear That

Image result for picture of a woman speaking into a man's ear



I make repeated mention of how the key to gaining freedom is to understand. One of the central principles to understand with our kind is the fact that our perspective is very different from yours. You gauge our responses, our actions and our words through the lens of your world view. That is understandable, but it will only lead to you becoming mired in confusion, frustration and bewilderment, trapped in the quagmire of emotion which of course is where we want you to always be. We do not want you applying cool, hard logic to prise yourself free from our grip. We want you embroiled in emotion.

Of course we prefer to make it seem that you engage in double speak. Our private paranoia causes us to twist what you say in order to use it to our advantage, but then we always do this. We always seek to profit from fabricated misunderstanding and false inferences, but the reality is we do also actually hear something completely different from what you say to us because of our existence in a different reality.

Accordingly, you need to understand that we operate in a different world view to you and once you ascertain that world view, you are unlikely to like what you see there, but you will begin to make sense of what we say and do. As part of this understanding, you should appreciate that when you say certain things to us, we hear something else. Here are ten examples, to assist your comprehension of our kind.


  1. The dinner you made was lovely

The dinner you made was better than anything I have ever tasted before. Your skills in the kitchen are beyond compare. You are truly talented and gifted. I am so fortunate that someone as brilliant as you made something so tasty and delicious as that meal for someone like me. I am amazed and astounded by your talent and thank my personal god every day that you are in my life.



  1. I don’t know what I would do without you

You are my everything. My beginning and end. I am nothing without you. I would not function without your skilful operation of me. I have now submitted to your total control of me, I am in your hands, do with me what you will.


  1. I love you

I don’t just love you, I love you with everything that I have, every fibre of my being and every molecule inside me because you are so magnificent that I am compelled to provide you with this astonishing and amazing love. I cannot find the words to express the extent of my love for you but it is beyond anything I have ever experienced before because you made me feel this way.


  1. I hate you

You are powerful, masterful and the puppet master. You are so skilled that you can make me gush with emotion at the merest flick of your wrist or the raising of your eyebrow. I cannot help but feel like this because you have me so entangled in your dark and admittedly brilliant machinations. I may say I hate you but it is really a form of admiration at the magnificence by which you operate your dark arts.


  1. I don’t understand you

I am stupid and weak. If I wasn’t I would understand wouldn’t I. This is a frustrated admission on my part that I pale by comparison to you. You are a colossus, a behemoth who is far better than me and I can only look on in rapt awe as you forge your way through life. I don’t understand you but I wish I could be like you.

  1. Please stop hurting me

Your machinations are highly effective and I cannot stop spurting with fuel for you. You may as well keep going because you have me all worked out, but I still have lots and lots of delicious fuel to spill for you.


  1. No

I am trying to stand up to you but we both know that cannot happen. I am just a wretch compared to you, but I try to think otherwise, but I am doing this for you. I am saying this to invite you to exert your authority over me and to punish me for my insolence. I want you to do so because I know this is what my role is, a conduit for you to achieve what you want, so I say it so you can open the door to yes.


  1. I just want to be happy

I am a selfish person who as usual is putting my needs before yours which is completely wrong so you must correct me, teach me and make me learn my lesson in the way only you can do.


  1. I am sorry

I am utterly useless and pathetic. I ought to have known better but as usual I just decided to do what I wanted and forgot how that might impact on you. You are generous and kind and I beg your forgiveness in the knowledge that I deserve none. If you choose to make an example of me for my frequent erring and repeated apologies, then so be it. You know best.


  1. You are wrong

I want to destroy you. I am wounding you. I know how to weaken you and I have done this to bring you to your knees. Yes, I am a traitor, a treacherous betrayer of your magnanimous nature but I do not care. Does it hurt? Does it burn? Good. I want to see you weaken, shrivel and cease to exist.

68 thoughts on “You Say This, I Hear That

  1. Nina says:

    When you text to the N finally after you cannot take abuse and lies any longer “we are finished , you do not exist to me from nowon , nice and clear” what is he perceiving themoment i say it and soon after ? And what he undetstands after 18 months of no contact on my part?? while in this period he committed first a benign hoover and then a malign hoover by proxy also both failed ? Nina

  2. Clary says:

    Wow number ten what us his imaginations exactly what I ant except that I’m not a traitor

  3. steeviann says:

    HG! I just listened to the radio interview again. I heard more. I also passed it on to the Narc and another friend who was fascinated with what I was telling them about Narcs. I need a nap now.

    1. HG Tudor says:

      Thank you for sharing.

  4. mlaclarece says:

    I’m sure you have me pegged for No. 6.

    1. HG Tudor says:

      Why do you write that Clarece?

      1. mlaclarece says:

        Because more or less, every time JN would reappear over the last couple of years, I would basically gush what his actions do to me, which equated to stop hurting me. Plus you are aware with samples of the type of exchanges we’ve had over the last year. Two weeks ago I got a “final” email from him with an apology. This past weekend I got an email check-in from him. He must be hoping the well hasn’t run dry yet with what is apparently really “delicious” fuel as you put it.

        1. HG Tudor says:

          Oh he will be operating on the basis that there remains a reservoir of fuel to keep returning to. But you know different now.

  5. nikitalondon says:

    Wow very interesting. Would have never imagined that background

  6. 1 and 3 literally cracked me up, to know that’s what you and your kind hear when we say those words.

    I remember vividly how mine conditioned me in tk telling him he was wonderful or handsome etc and this was when I still thought he was a weirdo. He would tell me I was gorgeous, I would thank him and then he would say ‘well’ are you going to tell me I am. I would say it, but I’d feel really awkward and uncomfortable because I didn’t think he was. Later in the day he would tell me how amazing his day had been and reel off the compliments he’d essentially made me give to him ?? I used to laugh to myself at how weird this was and how could he actually believe in what I was saying to him ??

    1. Miss_stress says:

      Proof and point, Alexis… that as long as it is admiration and adulation, it doesn’t even matter to them that it is fake or insincere. I can’t abide by that, if it isn’t real then don’t say it, good or bad. Exactly, I wouldn’t tell someone they are handsome or I love them, desire them either et cetera If they are not and I do not. I would focus on other attributes. And hope they had some…if not , then I would remain quiet.
      Did he believe it or did he need to believe it….in the deluded sense?

      CN ( new handle ) used to say this, I can’t tell you I love you if I am angry at you and not feeling it, now can I? he would say don’t want me to lie to you, so, I am just doing as you ask. MY reply was, yes, that is true, thank you. Can you also Apply that thinking to other areas as well, if possible.

      1. Yes, I have never complimented someone in that way before. I realised his behaviour was odd but at the time I put this all down to his illness.

        Yes they know when to work the lie thing. The MN and I became friends over a previous person lying to me and ‘swearing on his life’ against something I knew to be fact. I told the MN how childish I thought swearing on your life was. No one has done that since childhood. But this group of people at the watering hole (Full of PDs) all do it ?? And the MN did it too, even though I had told him how childish it was.

        This place is literally like seeing three and four year olds in an adult form. With just one or two mature people. It’s quite comical at times.

        1. HG Tudor says:

          I swear on my mother’s grave it is the truth. Oh she’s not in it yet? Doesn’t matter.

          1. Oh I beleive you HG, no one would swear in their mothers life.

        2. Miss_stress says:

          CN swore on his sons life he would never lie to me….simply vile, claimed his son and I were only ones he didn’t lie to. I imagine not even him. I have nevr swore On My life or the life or death of another person, either. I do make promises though. But, I strive to always keep those.
          It sounds it, is it mostly the men or the women too? It must be like watching a play or live theater at times .make you want to keep a pacifier, sippy cup and nappy in Your purse for such occassions. Mind you I revert to childhood behaviours as well. Poor coping a nd defence mechanisms relating to emotional abandonment. Not proud to admit that, but it is true. Thankfully not publically displayed.

          1. HG Tudor says:

            Nothing is out of bounds if it serves our purposes.

          2. Miss_stress says:

            I didn’t believe him though, I always knew when he lied. So why even use it on me, when there are so many naive ones that would trust such an admission.

            “Be bad, but at least don’t be a liar, a deceiver!” Tolstoy

          3. I’m sure you’re N did lie to your son too and swear on his life whilst telling lies. They are vile missy !

            The women as much as the men at this place.

            When I discovered what Ns and BPDs were this place gave me a very distorted view of the world. That said there are significantly more cluster B types in the world than I had imagined. But this place is over representative…..well over. I wish I could say where / what then it would make sense.

          4. HG Tudor says:

            The Emirates Stadium is a strange place, I agree.

          5. Hahha nice try HG !! But the Emirates is no match at all for this place. Not even close. Though I have been known to make an appearance there.

            I’ll see you around 😉

            I’ll be the one staring straight into your eyes 💋

          6. HG Tudor says:

            No need Alexis, I will see you before you see me.

          7. I know this to be true HG – I’m waiting for you

          8. On a separate note. Your sharing of knowledge has helped me massively over the last few weeks. And by handling an N in the correct way (engaging and disengaging at appropriate times) who was trying to turn nasty (business related) it all concluded yesterday and worked out better than I could have hoped for. Thank you 🙂 with the added bonus of knowing how wounded he would be from my win 😉

          9. HG Tudor says:

            That sounds to me like a pleasing result there Alexis. Swift half in Bar PD to celebrate?

          10. Are you buying ?

          11. HG Tudor says:

            I’m buying but you will be paying.

          12. I never feel the pressure to repay any more. I’ll accept your kind offer of a drink HG

          13. Miss_stress says:

            Women in general can be far nastier then men when it comes to competition and backstabbing. Mind you CN ‘s sweet sensitive ploy reels them in too and then the sympathy for fabricated illnesses….which he knows will ensure someone like me would stick around for post devaluation hoovers.
            Other then wound his ego which he can easily fuel to repair, I don’t know how else to deter him. I wish I could play with him like you with yours Alexis and know you have successfully avoided and Baited him. Other then his fury and rages, which I dint even know how many of those were staged for dramatic purposes to herald a silent treatment. It feels like I was part of. Scripted reality show, I wasn’t aware I was a player in. Tbh, even a lot of things he said during sex sounded scripted to me. His excuses, his apologies, his platitudes…..akin to I was the only one improvising without a script….always calling out for lines.
            My friend keeps wanting us to see Arsenal play when in UK, we have yet to. I can imagine the players in there…the ones off the field, I mean.
            Alexis is this o,ace you refer to your workplace or a social place, like a nightclub or social club? I always envision the Office, Ricky Gervais version, couldn’t stand the American version. Speaking of Ricky Gervais, outspoken, beyond funny, sarcastic, sexy, talented, creative….
            Now you mention it I will envision a row of prams parked up, with toddlers in bonnets, with bottles all vying for attention , tantruming and crying and spilling milk everywhere 😊

          14. HG Tudor says:

            Stephen Merchant is the real talent. Gervais is a one-trick pony although is laugh is very effective when combined with Karl Pilkington.

          15. Miss_stress says:

            Yes, Merchant is brilliant. Are you saying, Gervais writes none of his own work? That’s. Disappointing.

          16. HG Tudor says:

            No, Gervais evidently contributes but Merchant is the real power house of talent in the relationship. Gervais has perfected the shit-eating grin though I will give him that. Who are your favourite comedians?

          17. Miss_stress says:

            I like the older comedians….classic Peter sellers, ..Richard Pryor, Eddie Murphy, Don rickells, George carlin…I liked sarcastic and biting humour….I like Eddie Izzard, Steve Coogan, is brilliant, Peter Kay, love him..Billy Connelly .John Cleese most definately, I love Monty Pyhton and Fawlty Towers….Rowan Atkinson, especially Black Adder….and Mr bean, none of his films though. Nick frost and Simon leg, oh God yes , yes….brilliant, every film. That show, a man stroke woman…soooo funny. I use it to watch when feeling low, it is the best medicine. Same with the mighty boosh. Tears of laughter.
            Chris O dowd…I personally relate to English humour much more then North American, the same goes for music.

            There are many more, that is all I think of ASAP…I love humour and laughing. It is the one thing I think is essential in a man, along with music, literature, intelligence and all the emotional components that seal a healthy relationship.
            Gervais, still as the Uk office I found quite funny. He uses sarcasm well to my liking.
            How about you, who do you enjoy….HG? Probally very few on my list. My dad is older, and I watched Benny Hill as a child and tbh, I did find him funny along with all the carry on films, I wish humour was more today lie, it was then. The English without a doubt excel at humour, just look at yourself….I am always smiling and laughing at your quips.

          18. HG Tudor says:

            Eddie Izzard is both clever and entertaining. I know Steve Coogan who is very talented and is often maligned by jealous individuals. I also know Peter Kay who is supremely funny, along with his brilliant observational humour his voice makes me laugh in itself. I am not a fan of Billy Connolly, John Cleese is suffering the backwash of all the ancilliary relief that has been sought from him and thus he has somewhat diluted his stock in recent years to my mind. Rowan Atkinson is excellent as well. He was in the same restaurant as I was a number of years ago. He insisted on facing the wall in this small country house restaurant so he would not be recognised, not diva behaviour, he wanted to be able to have lunch with his mother undisturbed. Nick Frost and Simon Pegg are very good, Pegg is excellent in the Mission Impossible films as well (I am a big fan of the Cruiser). The League of Gentlemen is one of my favourite dark comedies, absolutely fantastic characters. I also enjoy Ed Reardon’s Week which is on the radio, hilarious. Yes you do seem to have English humour as a mainstay. Benny Hill – I may have to write to Yakkety Sax tonight!!

          19. Miss_stress says:

            I have an unusual sense of humour, Peter Kays car share is so funny, love it so much. English humour is intelligent and biting. North American humour is too obvious for my liking. Mind you one of my favourite films is Young Frankenstein with Gene wilder…..I laugh so much. The man who knew too little with Bill Murray, same thing, brilliant. Far too many films to mention Comedic genre.
            Sense of humour to laugh and be able to laugh at ones self is so vital.
            Thank you so much for your reply HG.

          20. Yes women can be nastier that’s for sure. And there are some really lovely people there, really lovely. This place does seem full of PDs and CDs and empaths buy the good ones are in the minority. Yes fabricated illnesses are a key trait for Ns. I think mine does have a genuine one. I beleived it the whole time he was lovebombing and devaluing me. But when is finally worked things out, what he was, it all seemed far fetched and none of it made sense or stacked up. But I’ve very recently seen something which leads me to beleive his illness is real. It made me feel so bad that id ever doubted it. But an N is an N is an N and so I guess his pity plays and lying about other things including bits of his illness jumbled it all up. And his illness is the trump card which he always plays to everyone and who can not allow him to ??

            Missy I would never recommend playing with an N, ever. They can be so dangerous and beleive me if I wasn’t completely and utterly over him I couldn’t. It was never my plan to do this and I never sought revenge at all, not ever. It just kind of happened this way and I’m having fun. But always, always I keep in the back of my mind what he is really capable of. But I’m a very strong person and bloody minded Hahha plus I can close the door on the watering hole at any time, just walk away and never have to see anyone from there ever again. For most people their N is entwined in every element of their life. So please don’t think about it.

            The most imortantant thing is for you to focus on you and your recovery.

            Plus we still don’t know how my story will end lol. I’m winning at the moment but that could change at any time. It’s just snakes and ladders.

            Many of the things they say do sound scripted, I really see that now. Even at the time some things sounded so, but I just passed them over. And sometimes even now he sounds and seems so genuine, that I have to remind myself. But it’s usually not too long before he does something to someone else to remind me anywya.

            Yes go watch an Arsenal game when you’re here next. You won’t be disappointed ……..well you might.

            The office the British version, hahaha love that . Yes I watched value 20 mins of the American version and couldn’t even recognise it.
            No this place isn’t a nightclub.
            Prams and bottles haha yes that’s exactly what it’s like – just have to give them some more milk when they start crying !

            Okay lovely lady – have a good day xx

          21. Miss_stress says:

            I won’t play with Him, Alexis, I am in no contact, all I ever did was ask him questionsd that was bad enough for him. Not antagonizing questions either…yet, he always felt I was Intent on seething him. I never was, I just legitimately sought answers.
            Alexis. Do you think MN knows you are smarter then him, not that he would admit it, but do in think he understands that he cannot dupe you? Maybe not if he still try’s……I get what you mean about watering hole….it is good you can leave and not go back if need be. Clean break, when you want it.

            Lol,on Arsenal….
            Have a super day day, Alexis

          22. Oh I’m far more qualified than the MN by a long way. He knows this But he still thinks he’s smarter than me. I don’t care though, he can think I’m as dumb as he likes. It doesn’t bother me one bit, I find it amusing plus it also helps me achieve my goal without suspicion. The dumber he thinks I am, the easier it makes it for me 😉

          23. Miss_stress says:

            Amen, Alexis. People assume nice people and kind people , are not aware or Intelligent enough to know when they are being insulted, manipulated or lied to. Underestimation of another should be a sin 😏 keep being you, Alexis.

          24. You were doing what any normal person would do missy. So forget how he tried to turn it round to being your problem. That’s all part of their plan. Xx

          25. Miss_stress says:

            Thank you Alexis, I am prone to guilt. Yes, all part of his plan….

          26. Yes I completely understand. I too used to be consumed with guilt and self deprication and always put others first.

            And that’s where we need to draw the line missy.

            Now I come first, I don’t go along to events or help someone just to pleas them.

            It’s now always, do I want to do this, does this person really need help (is their load to heavy to carry on their own and will it overburden me if I help them carry it), and finally, do they have a kind heart (I may not like someone or agree with everything they say or do, but if there is no kind heart there is no help. Well unless it is to my benefit of course). Oh and one more thing, you can lead people and show them things but ultimately you can’t do it for them, or you run yourself ragged it is up to them to take responsibility.

            Before I bore everyone’s weight and thought of others before me.

            This is not selfish, it’s real and healthy and helps develop a real self esteem. Not an inflated one or false one. But real. I had never thought it was possible. I didn’t really beleive anyone who did not have issues with self esteem. But it is possible and wonderful.

            Keep going missy !! You’re doing well xxx

          27. Miss_stress says:

            Yes, I have run my self ragged for others, this is true. Kind heart, a good barometer Alexis.
            Thank you, this is wonderful and valid advice for us all here.
            Changing our self esteem to elevate it, allows us to no longer accept that which we falsely feel worthy of and reject that which we truly do deserve to be loved and respected.

          28. You do deserve it missy – you’re number 1 !! Look after yourself xx

          29. nikitalondon says:

            Hi Alexis
            In my country a very Catholic one its very common to swear over people and even more dead people. Its proof of telling the truth and a very powerful one.,
            Has nothing to do with being inmmature..
            At least here…

          30. Hey nikita, yes I think it is likely a very different culture in your country. Here it is very different and from my own observations, I’ve not noticed people I typically would interact with since childhood and even then it was not common. It is something I’ve observed in the PDs and they almost use it so that how could you not belwice them if they’ve sworn on the life of someone close to them. To them this is complete proof. And before engaging with these types I was clueless about how convincing some liars were when it was blatant they were lying ?? And much of the time lying about something that really didn’t bloody matter hahah

            Makes the ‘shaggy’ song, ‘it wasn’t me’ all make sense now. Obviously that kind of lie would matter.

          31. nikitalondon says:

            Okay I see how it was for you. So The Ns here have an advantage due to the value swearing over somebody has here. Its also so culturally different how they take the lies of the people in Europe rather than here. For me its amazing to see both sides.
            Have a nice day

          32. We all revert to childhood behaviours sometimes missy. But most of us know how and when to control them. But yes abandonment at a young age has a massive affect on us xx

    2. Miss_stress says:

      # 5 made me laugh..stupid and weak. His last fury frenzied tirade that he closed on, involved calling me a stupid fucking woman, oh and an fucking idiot too. On repeat, I might add. I worried he developed another disorder, such as Tourette’s, the way he spouted off at me. He must do it to make himself feel better, it has no effect on me. Other then I used to pacify his anger to calm him down.
      HG! Another question for you 😊
      He always told me how. Intelligent I am, so, does he really think I am stupid or was it just his fury reaction? He has no impulse control at such times. As in …Say what immediately comes to mind and Blast me with it full force.

      1. HG Tudor says:

        He told you that you were intelligent to seduce you, he told you that you were stupid to hurt you. I would not look to him to validate what you are as it will only be lies.

        1. Miss_stress says:

          Excellent points and advice, I know what I am. His validation was important at the time, when I thought he loved me and meant what he said. Thank you HG.

          1. HG Tudor says:

            You are welcome Miss S.

  7. But of course that’s what you hear, it’s just common sense really.

  8. Miss_stress says:

    He/ she said …..she/ he said….all forms of communication between two people are open to interpretation. One cannot assume that the other interprets what is being said as what the person saying it means to say.
    This surmounts to Barriers and breakdowns in communication. Leading to arguments, anger, hurt feelings, jealousies, retreating and silences to avoid communication.

    What it is important to understand when we say something, is that the other party understands what we mean and vice versa. When one party, especially in the case of a narcissist, interprets Meaning In completely different manner. The onus is on them, not the listener to convey what they actually mean or if feeling criticised to express that they feel criticised and why. If communication is stalled or halted in any manner then chaos ensues, which is beneficial to the narcisisist in terms of fuel, but deterimental to them in terms of wounding.

    So, HG, a posting such as this is very valid and vital. It conveys the differences in meaning from what one party says to another and the way it is interpreted.

    Again, I reiterate regarding #9, saying sorry is not pathetic. Knowing when One is in the wrong is a sign of strength, admittance of such is as well. Even saying sorry. To ensure the other party feelings are not hurt is thoughtful, which is not weak either. To remove ones pride for the sake of another, is a character strength, not a flaw. Only those who are unable to do so because of inability to relinquish ego control, deem it pathetic.
    So, would you rather, NO one ever apologize to you for being wrong. Doesn’t such an apology laud your power and show you to be superior and right. Does it not flood fuel to you by its mere utterance.? What you deem pathetic is also advantageous to you. For someone saying they are sorry or wrong, Is also in your interpretation, saying YOU are right.

    1. HG Tudor says:

      If one is never wrong how can one ever know that one is wrong?

      1. Miss_stress says:

        Indeed. I would tell you. If you like 😏 with appropriate penance following.

        1. HG Tudor says:

          That sounds like a collision course to me. We are on to the Qs anyway.

          1. Miss_stress says:

            Quibble, then 😏

          2. HG Tudor says:

            Very good. Is that your middle name?

          3. Miss_stress says:

            It is Anne….ha ha. I don’t relent easily. Once I receive my answers I am all good again though, calm and serene. You do make me smile HG…I set myself up….I am a quibbler, indeed. I choose appropriately.

          4. HG Tudor says:

            Sometimes it is better that you do not know.

          5. Miss_stress says:

            I disagree, it is always better to know. Do impart.

          6. HG Tudor says:


      2. Clary says:

        HAHAHAAAAAA is not that you’re never wrong is the admittance because you know you’re wrong is just easier to blame the other self I say self because you mirror yourself in others

  9. 2mpathetic says:

    HG what’s your take on string theory? I expect a snarky comment there….do you think in an alternate reality you are the most loving super empath? I’d be a MN. Role reversal is fun. I’m on top this time. Rodeo!!

    1. HG Tudor says:

      I am only interested in their application to black holes, as you might expect.

      1. 2mpathetic says:

        What about white, yellow, brown and red holes? U r interested in those too, N’est-ce pas?

  10. Cara says:

    And this is why talking to my mother is infuriating. She hears what she wants to hear, not what I actually say.

    1. HG Tudor says:

      Pardon Cara?

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