The Wrong No Contact


No Contact.

This is what anybody who has been a victim of our kind must achieve. Whether that status of victim stems from being a friend to a narcissist where you are taken for granted, used when the narcissist needs a lift or someone to moan to or whether it is the beaten down and trampled Intimate Partner Primary Source who was wife, boyfriend or partner has endured and suffered extensive abuse, no contact is the antidote.

Building that robust and effective wall of no contact can be difficult. It is time consuming, requires rigour and perseverance and not only are you trying to repel the advances of the narcissist who is trying to breach your no contact regime, you also have to fight against yourself and your emotional thinking which is trying to make you breach no contact as well. Indeed, it is often your emotional thinking which proves to be the harder enemy to conquer and it is not a one-off battle. Your emotional thinking, because of who you are and the emotional infection your engagement with the narcissist has caused, means that this is an ongoing battle which requires your repeated vigilance. Through the application of understanding and building your Logic Defences, the task does become easier, but it is not one which goes away. Like any wall, it must be checked, maintained and patrolled, otherwise holes and breaches occur and the narcissist will impact on you once again.

Time and time again I see people who think they have put in place no contact and they have not. Sometimes it almost beggars belief that the victim thinks they have established no contact – it is obvious they have not. In other instances you could be forgiven (if forgiveness was something I gave) for thinking you have implemented no contact but in actual fact you have not. There are many instances where people think they have instigated no contact and all they have done is embark on The Wrong No Contact. Here are just a few of the many ways in which you might be getting no contact wrong and the risks that come with this.

  1. Looking At Social Media

Just because the narcissist does not explicitly know you have looked at his or her social media does not mean this is no contact. Indeed, we rely on you doing so and expect you to look at our social media, that is why in certain instances you are not blocked from looking at our Facebook account, Twitter feed, Instagram and so forth. We want you to look at it. Just because you are not interacting directly with us, just because you are not commenting and we are not replying, just because you are not adding likes – this is not no contact. If you are looking at our social media you are likely to see indirect jibes made about you, Relationship Bulletins about your replacement, reminders of the golden period and even direct attacks against you. This will result in :-

  • a risk you will be upset, hurt, angry
  • the maintenance of the emotional infection because you are thinking about us
  • a surge of emotional thinking which may cause you to contact us to attack us for our barbed comments towards you, to seek answers when you are upset about the reminder of an anniversary or similar
  • stopping you from moving forward

2. Not Blocking Our Number

You may think that it will be the first thing you will do when you commence no contact. You block our number from your telephone and mobile phone so that we cannot call or text you from the relevant number. Of course we may get around this by using a different device therefore that is why you are better served by changing your telephone numbers, but if you do not change the numbers then you ought to block the new number of ours which appears and keep doing so, like a matador dodging the on rushing bull each time to avoid harm.

Nevertheless, the number of occasions I see people who claim they are no contact but they have not blocked our number is higher than you might think. These people think that if they, as victim, do not contact us, then that is no contact. No, it is not. Of course, those people who do not block the number are giving in to their emotional thinking because they WANT the narcissist to contact them.

If you do not block our number, this is not no contact. One of the easiest hoovers for us to perform is to text you. It uses no effort, it brings with it a reduced consequence of wounding (say compared to ringing you on the telephone or seeing you in person) and allows the drawing of fuel. If you do not block our number, you are lowering the hoover bar to such a low level that hoovers are more or less inevitable.

The emotional thinking of victims tells them things such as :-

  • It is over, there was a ‘final discard’ he will never contact me anyway;
  • If she does text me, I won’t reply and that will wound her, so actually I am ‘winning’;
  • There might be an emergency and therefore I cannot block him

Utter rubbish.

There is no such thing as a final discard. We will contact you, subject to the Hoover Trigger being activated and the Hoover Execution Criteria being met. If you do not block us, this is going to happen. You will be hoovered.

If you allow a text through, you are maintaining the emotional infection and you will suffer a surge in emotional thinking which may very well result in you responding and before you know it, you are not only providing fuel but you are being drawn back into the Formal Relationship. Months later you will ask ‘how the hell did that happen?’ Every text which arrives adds more and more to your emotional thinking until such time that you can no longer resist. Oh, I hear your protestations that you can resist but i have witnessed such resolve melt away. If you are playing Russian roulette and pull the trigger once and do not blow your brains out, you have survived. Pick the gun up again and again and again and eventually you will kill yourself. This is the similar effect of repeatedly engaging with us by allowing those texts through – you WILL succumb.

So what if there is an emergency? I know you are kind, decent and honest but we are no longer your concern in that respect. You need to remind yourself that you have no obligation towards us (of course our perspective will make us tell you differently) and therefore that False Suicide Power Play Hoover is not something you have to deal with. If you co-parent establish a mechanism whereby the narcissist e-mails routine communication to you. You tell the narcissist in advance that you will check the e-mails once a week at a set time  and never deviate from this. This way you cater for communication regarding the children but only expose yourself once a week to potential hoovers. When the narcissist realises this is being done, see how the hoover attempts diminish. If you need a mechanism for emergency communication, tell the narcissist to contact a third party who will then contact you. Use this gate keeper.

3. Keeping our telephone number

You may say that you will not use it and therefore think that this is no contact, but once again, this is not no contact. With our number sat in your phone, even if you have changed the description to ‘Arsehole Number One’ , ‘Shit 4 Brains’ or ‘Narcopath’ you are creating problems :-

  • You see the name and number and you are then reminding yourself of us and thus this is a form of Ever Presence ;
  • You are leaving open a gateway. There will be an occasion when your emotional thinking surges and causes you to try to contact us. If our number if there you will use it and message us or ring us. If there is no number, you cannot call us.

Do not come up with the nonsense of ‘I have memorised the number so I will remember it anyway so what difference does it make if I keep the number in my phone?’ Bollocks. Your memory is fallible and over time if you have not used our number, you will eventually forget it altogether or at least get some numbers mixed up. If it is still in your directory, you will ring it.

Delete that number. Do it and do it immediately.

4. Talking to friends and family about us

You may think that because you are not engaging with us directly then this must mean no contact is in place. It is not in place if you continue to talk about us to your friends and your family. This is causing you to engage with us, albeit indirectly. All this does is result in :-

  • You continuing to think about us with the consequential impact on your emotions;
  • The continued feeding of the emotional infection which you should be purging, not feeding ;
  • Allowing your emotional thinking to surge with the risk this may control you once again and you end up contacting us or succumbing to a direct hoover with all that follows from that

It is of course inevitable that you will discuss the situation with your family and friends especially when you do not understand what you are dealing with. However, once you realise you are dealing with a narcissist then there does not need to be any more discussion. If you are not sure whether the person is, do not discuss it with your family and friends, they invariably have no idea whether the person is or not, they have no expertise. Indeed, they may well be revelling in joining in the ‘narc hating’ sessions which are actually not helping you at all. Alternatively, they may well be sick of hearing you going on about him or her and want you to shut up, but tolerate it out of a sense of loyalty. If you are unsure, ask me and I will give it to you straight, one way or the other.

Once you know, you go.

No more debating it with your best friend. No more mulling it over with your football mates after the game in the pub. No more ‘ifs and buts’ discussions with your parents. This person is a narcissist and you are not to dedicate any time to discussing this person. If you have to discuss an arrangement concerning the narcissist because they are collecting the children from your parents, then that is allowable but keep it to that. You do not need to tell people what the narcissist did or said. All you are doing is repeating this person is a narcissist, you already know this, they already know this, so why keep going on about it?

You do it because your emotional thinking wants you to do so. It wants you poring over the latest misbehaviour because it craves the horrified gasps from your friends or looks of disapproval from your mother. You do not need these responses.

Do not talk about us. Explain to your friends you do not want the narcissist spoken about to you. If they try to do so, politely explain again that this person means nothing to you anymore and therefore there is no need to talk about them.

5. Watching what we are doing

You may make the intelligence agencies proud of your covert observation of us as you watch where we go, who we are with and what we are doing. You do not need to do this. Again, once you know what we are, get out and stay out. Yes, I understand it is so tempting to know what we are up to, are we seeing someone else, what does he or she look like, why are we going to these places but all you are doing is succumbing to your emotional thinking which is conning you into maintaining a link with us.

Your emotional thinking will tell you that it is permissible to engage in this behaviour because you are not contacting us directly, you are merely observing. These are examples of your emotional thinking conning you into thinking this stalking and observation is a good idea

  • You are gathering evidence to tell other people what we are doing to confirm what you have told them previously (you do not need to – you know what we are, that is all you need, you do not have to persuade other people)
  • You are gathering evidence for a court case (you do not have to do it – hire somebody to do this or if you cannot afford to do that, have a friend or family member do it – also question whether you really need to this evidence)
  • You want to know who the narcissist is seeing so you can warn this person about us (part of your decent nature but unnecessary – you owe the new person no such obligation to warn then and in any event it is unlikely you will be believed because of the smearing we will have done against you)
  • You just need to know for your own piece of mind (utter nonsense, you do not need to know at all)

Recognise these sleights of mind by your emotional thinking and act on them.

If you keep watching us, all you are doing is

  • Creating harmful emotions that impact on you
  • Keeping the emotional infection alive and growing
  • Causing your emotional thinking to surge so you contact us directly
  • Being spotted by us and suffering a hoover (benign or malign)
  • Being spotted by us and being on the end of a restraining order or similar for harassment etc

These are just five examples of The Wrong No Contact. There are many more. Be alert for them, recognise them and understand why you are not implementing no contact. Stop letting your emotional thinking con you.

Once you know, you go.

Get out, stay out.

59 thoughts on “The Wrong No Contact

  1. Morning sun says:

    I broke NC yesteday. I asked a mutual acquaintance whether he knew anything about how the narc ex was presenting our break-up in the BDSM community. I’m 100% certain that this acquaintance is not a lieutenant – in fact, the ex hated him with a passion because I used to spend a lot of time with him on a project and we had a blast.
    (BTW, when he told me how hurt he was that I had excluded him from ths project, h also told me that I’ve changed as a result of spending time with the friend andin a bad way, that he was bad for me etc. I was stupid enough to buy into it, but then he was smart enough to know exactly what to say. Anyway.)

    The friend told me that he doesn’t know anythin but that if I really want to know, he can ask around. I declined and said I was just curious, feeling like a complete fool. I’ll blame the full moon and the equinox, The fact is, though, that my life has been moving forward in many respects and that it feels odd not to share it with him. I’ve shared with him every minor thing for the past 5 years.

    It seems that with relaxing my tight control over myself and my emotions, certain repressed thoughts and feelings started to suface. Maybe the adrenaline has worn off now and I’m finally feeling safe to actually feel my emotions instead of clamping down on them with logic. Time to write to my therapist and practice some mindfulness.

    BTW, if anyone ever starts off the relationsihp by warning you that you may hear some nasty things about them, but that they’re not true and that people are just jealous/stupid, walk away. Nobody normal ever has to do that. Nobody.

    1. Morning sun says:

      And I meant Beltane, not equinox! Gah.

  2. GR says:

    This post was too real for my liking, (baby steps) but you are 100% right. We make excuses for ourselves and for them.We cant win with these people. The only way to keep them away is 100% no contact. Seeing his social media will send us into a dark place. I had to take my self “out” cause he would never do it.

    if no kids are involved, change your number, erase all social media, delete old email addresses and get a new one. Because like HD said blocking them serves no purpose. Blocking them only makes them crafty, in how to find you. BS aside, we want them to contact us and if the do “go out of their way” to contact us from another phone will only give us a false sense of hope. Such as “he went out of his way to find me. He does love me, he wouldn’t do it if he didnt love me” Lies we tell ourselves.

    28 days i believed i had “no contact”
    6 days REAL CONTACT

    Wish me luck

    1. NarcAngel says:

      You are thinking logically so luck is not part of the equation. I wish you continued success instead.

      1. GR says:

        Thank you.

  3. /iroll says:

    *go see him (typo)

  4. /iroll says:

    Well, he said that i should make all the effort to see go him, because only then shall i truly appreciate him “like i am supposed to” and suffer a miserable life in return for a moment of bliss, with him. I quote. As if.

  5. Caroline says:

    Could you elaborate some more on not talking about the narc with family/friends? My ex-narc was emotionally (a given, I suppose), physically, and sexually abusive. Due to this and some already underlying C-PTSD, I’m currently in counseling to work through the abuse. Am I misreading, or does talking about him/the abuse in therapy do me more harm than good?

    1. Morning sun says:

      I actually told my therapist, after giving her the gist of that relationship, that I don’t want to talk about him anymore because he’s taken up too much of my headspace already and I choose to focus on me instead. It was something that was right for me. We agreed that we’d reopen the topic of me in intimate relationships once I met someone new… which might be soon, as I have. He’s definitely not a narc though and I’m being realistic this time around. I’m doing things differently this time, taking it slow, getting to know him as a person before I engage emotionally. He could be a good match, from what my friend who introduced him told me, time will tell.
      This time I’m not looking for the ‘whole package’, but rather a friend and partner.

      1. Caroline says:

        Morning Sun,

        I thought you were responding to me, until I realized it wasn’t me that wrote the original comment…I didn’t realize/remember there was another Caroline floating around until recently, lol…

        Anyway, since I *thought* you were talking to me (I’m the Caroline who’s always in the rather drab, pale-green “dress”), I applaud your reply comment.

        You sound very grounded and realistic about your direction. And I’ve personally never been to therapy, but a friend of mine has (for an abusive relationship) and she got to a point where moving on from talking endlessly about that person was more healthy and has moved her along even more.

        Best to your continued healing + progress.:-)

  6. /iroll says:

    Yes, valentines and birthday hoovers. He told me to travel to see him, i teased him, because of course i’m not just going to go, and now i have a silent treatment. It fascinates me to see how he’ll deal (or not) with the dynamic and also to witness my own (trauma) issues re-surfacing, when i’m not outwardly reacting to them. The teasing was an act of defiance, but i kept it light. I feel drawn to the uncanny valley, but not the darkness at the end of the tunnel. Although, perhaps if it bit me then i’d wake up for good.

    1. H. says:

      The darkness has a very strong pull. As my friend said, surround yourself around the white light.

  7. sarabella says:

    Whenever I bother to look, all I feel is a huge, heavy weight in my chest. I don’t think anything he could do, any fake Golden Period, could ever remove that weight where he is concerned so it really doesn’t matter if I block him or not as a step to keep him from me. I remember the exact opposite feeling in my chest when I went to see him. When I contrast then to now, I know and he knows that he could never, ever pull the same empty seduction he did before. And without that, he has nothing to bring to the table for any kind of hoover even if he wanted to try. He has no tools at his disposal. Nothing he could say, none of his fake loving lyrics as he called them, could ever lure me into engaging with him again. And without those, he had nothing anyway, no honesty, no grounded sense of being, no consistent character for me to engage with. Whatever emotions I feel, they are not love for him anymore. Just the deep long hurt for what he did. But not love. He managed to kill that all.

    1. H. says:

      Exactly….they dig a hole in your heart and brain….and things just rot. The old feelings don’t have a space to exist any longer.

      1. sarabella says:

        I think that is where Narcs so mistake the fuel they get for anything genuine. All that energy, they think means something but they have no idea of the great disconneciton they have created between that fuel energy and the original feelings. Since they aren’t capable of those feelings, they easily mistake fuel (positive or negative) as representing the original love someone had for them. For example, I had deep warm feelings of joy, care and love for the narc but by the time he was done with his mind games, he has all my attention, but he was clueless to how much he destroyed of what was there. He actually once thought I was ‘fighting’ for him. What a joke. So an ego to think I was actually fighting for him. The only thing I fought for was to take back the things (non-material) which he stole for me. I wasn’t fighting for him any longer out of love. He ruined that. But all he could see was the fight, the energy and was so clueless to how he had rotted out everything else. And because they cannot feel those other things, they have no idea really what they ruined and destroyed. They don’t realize those other positive feelings are in fact something that can last for a long time before staleness, boredom and the games set in. They don’t realize that a golden period doesn’t have to be a short event but can in fact be something that can last a lifetime. Real love, friendship, human care and well being can exist for a long time with someone.

    2. Laurie says:

      Exactly Sarabella! All those good feelings in the beginnings get dismembered from the narcs obnoxious and abusive ways, to nothingness. It created PTSD in me without doubt. Once u discover the ” nothingness ” behind the fascade, it’s so disorienting, and later created anger in me, I had been so deceived. Top that off with him calling me a ” deceitful woman” for pointing out his flaws.

  8. Insatiable Learner says:

    Thanks so much, HG! Really appreciate your invaluable insight, as always! wish I could do something in return for you. I mean you answer many questions on here, write very enlightening content. I feel like I owe you. I mean I bought several of your books and had a consult with you, but somehow I feel like I am receiving more than I am giving if that makes any sense. I am just not used to that. I am used to the other way around. Anyway, a huge thank you for all you do on here!

    1. Bea says:

      That’s because he opened an account for us in the Narc Bank. 😛
      We will never be able to repay.

  9. Morning sun says:

    The narcissist I was involved with is still contacting me now and again. I don’t initiate contact since I couldn’t care less and there’s absolutely no need for me to, but I also don’t feel the need to ignore him or fear his trying to initiate contact. He has no power over me and there is nothing to be afraid of.

    I have even kept some of his gifts and the ‘ever presence’ doesn’t bother me because there is no emotion tied in with the things anymore.
    I know that we were in a relationship, but I don’t feel it; the awareness is there but the emotion is just gone, disappeared into thin air, same as with any other ex. I’ve even unwittingly referred to him by the name of another ex several times when talking with friends… so funny.

    Sure, I’ll remain vigilant, after all I’ve attracted one narcissist, who’s to say that I won’t attract another. But the one from my past is inconsequential to the point where any kind of no-contact policy would be just silly. He doesn’t even register as a person to me.

    The point being: no contact is certainly one way of dealing with a narcissist, and it’s absolutely crucial at the beginning, but getting to the bottom of why you’re attracted to them in the first place and working on that is better. The narcissist can force you to break the no contact – they cannot influence your state of mind once you make it impervious for them.

  10. W says:

    I’m wondering what good of an empath I am since I easily I went GOSO, went total no contact , and don’t even miss them.
    It’s like once I grasped their worldview, I lost interest . As a partner anyways. My interest in the subject of narcissism spiked however,
    ….after almost a month of studying your works every night, I can spot em really fast. Like, within a couple minutes fast. It’s creepy. I can also generally grasp which school. It’s freaky — they’re everywhere,
    I’ve even asked myself…am I over zealously labelling? But no. Plenty of non narcs , not every ex is a narc. They just are way more rampant than I could have guessed,
    It really does explain the state of the world.

    1. Morning sun says:

      W, I think it’s very easy to spot narcissistic traits once you know what to look for, but it’s unlikely that everybody we flag for a narcisist actually is a full-blown one (well, unless you’re moving in a high-powered top-level corporate or similar environment, in which case you’re probably correct).

      HG, a question: if you absolutely have to interact with a narcissist at work, for example, how do you get the most out of it and how do you minimise potential damage that the narcissist could bring about?

      1. HG Tudor says:

        Those are expansive questions and they are best addressed through a bespoke situation in consultation, MS.

      2. Morning sun says:

        Thank you HG, I will book a consultation if and as needed.

  11. Insatiable Learner says:

    HG, is it possible that if a narc does not hoover, he is not in fact a narc or he has changed? According to you, I was/am a shelf DLS. I always provided abundant positive fuel, did not challenge him, complied, etc. He is a middle mid ranger. Many months of silence from him. Electronic means of communication are open by the way.

    1. HG Tudor says:

      No. It means no Hoover Triggers and/or there have been but the criteria have not been met. What immediately springs to mind is new IPPS.

      1. Insatiable Learner says:

        Thanks so much for your quick response, HG! Well, he has been with this IPPS for almost 2 years now. However, he still painted her white last time we spoke. I know they have recently had a baby he has always wanted but thought he would never be able to have. Can this have some bearing?

        1. HG Tudor says:

          It is the golden period which is the relevant factor.

      2. Insatiable Learner says:

        Thank you, HG! Can the golden period last that long?

        1. HG Tudor says:

          It might. Alternatively, the present situation you have experienced may coincide with a Respite Period for the IPPS.

      3. Kimi says:


        Is the period after a successful Hoover for a former IPPS a true Golden Period, a Respite Period or merely being painted White again? Is this period typically shorter than the initial Golden Period? Thank you for your consideration!

        1. HG Tudor says:

          It depends if the Formal Relationship has been resurrected or whether it was just to gain fuel.

      4. Kimi says:


        The formal relationship has been resurrected, back to IPPS.

  12. SweetestTaboo says:

    Oh my lord . I’m on no contact suicide with this one ! I keep thinking maybe its me just seeing narcissist in everything because he never did hit me or scream at me we were just together for 1 month after being long distant friends for years. But did lie alot ! .Not sure if he was lying (IPPS) or (IPSS) when he told me we will stay together forever old and grey and tried to impregnate me . And If he did leave me because of my treacherous ways when the “ex” called and texted me. He didn’t vanish completly and I kept trying to contact him . He ignored me 3 weeks absent silent was the longest , we never got back together and they keep telling me what he’s doing on social media I don’t check deleted all my accounts . But unblocked his number again . He is so kind to me lately even apologized . When will I learn 😩SMH . He never seemed to care .


  13. CC says:

    I don’t think blocking their number is enough. They will use other numbers to call in. Changing your number works as long as you know who not to give it to. Don’t give it to anyone that you have in common. And you really don’t know who they have convinced to be sympathetic to them. They have a tenacity that will rival any commitment you think you might have.

  14. Agnes says:

    This is all true, but from my experience, it is rare to block a narcissist a day after the escape/discard because we are not psychologists so: 1. we are very careful in labelling an ex a disordered person 2. we believe/hope it’s a normal person, so after getting closure there is no need to do the blocking because we think our ex will respect the boundaries like every normal human being.

    It takes time to understand that THIS EX is not normal and doesn’t act like our previous exes. But we have to see the signs of him/her having a NPD. It’s madness to think that every ex who got angry, broke up suddenly, was unpleasant during the break up is a narcissist. If I blocked every ex without a reason I would act like someone with mental problems or my exes would whink I am childish and trying to provoke a reaction. So I can tell you from my experience that only one ex out of 5 was a narcissist and this is my last ex, because despite he broke up with me he still after 6 months acts controlling, trying to contact me, once being kind, once being malign and so on. And he is the only ex I had to block.

  15. Mona says:

    HG, you still follow your family rules. Did they work for you?

    1. HG Tudor says:

      Which rules are you referring to Mona?

      1. Mona says:

        HG, I am sorry, that I did not answer earlier. I meant: “Do not talk about it .”

        All abusive families have this rule: “Do not talk about (your) problems,( which concern the family ).”

        The reason behind this rule is easy. “Never find out, that something is very wrong here.”

        I know that you have had the wrong people around you and no one to go to. And I know that you have tried to break that rule in former times. And it did not work in past.

        Real friends and good family members will listen a long time, because they appreciate you and your feelings. If it is too much they will tell you and ask you for a break. So did my best friend. It was honest and I could accept that. She never said: “Forget the past” or something else like that. She only asked for a break.

        Look at your followers. It helps them a lot to talk about it. Again and again. Sometimes things must be repeated over and over again, until people start to understand and then to feel it.

        And look at yourself. How often do you repeat and explain the same things? With a huge patience!!!! If you really think that it does not help, why do you do it then?

        Of course – talking is a great risk- because you find out who is your real friend and who is not. I had to send some people into desert. They disappointed me a lot, which I did not expect.

        Others surprised me in a positive way. They encouraged me and supported me. And therefore I am thankful.

        The “Not talk about it” rule creates damaged souls. This is my opinion.

  16. Mona says:

    I really understand your advice and value it. And I agree to most of them.
    I do not agree to one point: Not talking about your kind! If people do not talk about their experience, they forget it on the surface. Not talking about it does not mean, that the wounds will heal. The wounds will eat deeper and deeper into the soul. You, HG, got that advice in your childhood and you followed it. We all see the result. This advice is colored by your own experience.
    If people would not need conversation about their experience with narcs, your blog would not have so many followers, who “scream” to be heard somewhere.
    Of course it is difficult to find the right people to talk about it. If you have only one bad feeling in your gut talking about your narc, tell these people
    that you do not want to talk about it again with them. If there is a “discussion” about your narc, that means that people do not agree with you about him and that is dangerous. Then there is only little support and understanding.
    If people ask you all the time and again and again about your narc, it means that they are only curious and it does not mean that they care for you.
    If there is a discussion, whether your narc did this or that, avoid these people.These people do not appreciate you. And they do not know you. Why should they doubt your experience, when they know your good character? There is something wrong. Weak people, narcissistic people, insecure people, curious people, selfish people? I do not know.

    If you have the luck, that you have friends and family members who believe you, it is a great relief . You can trust your own feelings, you have people around you, who build up your self-worth again and who are there for you. They show you respect, understanding and value you. And they wait until you want to talk about him!
    These people are very rare.

    And if you had been surrounded by these kind of people all your life, the risk to be ensnared by a narc would have been very low or it would have been a very short encounter.

    And then – some day – the need to talk about it – stops. It is not important anymore.

    And for me personally it was very important not to block him until he tried to hoover me. I wanted to see that. Then I blocked him. I never deleted his messages. They can do a good job for me – some day.

    Nothing will be forgotten.

  17. Patricia J says:

    It has been 9 months NC with my GN. I had to laugh at HG’s remarks relating to being better at surveilence than Jodie Foster in the Silence of the Lambs. I quess that had been me. I cannot believe just how Good I was at at.

    Tonight I am missing him. I am temped to do it again. Instead I am here.

    1. MH says:

      Patricia J, just think about how much he hurt you, and that feeling “blah” is typical and preferable to all the excitement/drama/craziness, whatever you want to call it. The tipping point for me was when I realized he orchestrated situations in order to hurt me. Everyone can be tactless, selfish, awkward at times, but malice, be it due to NPD, alcoholism, or just being a straight-up jerk should neither be tolerated nor excused- When You Know You Go, Get Out, Stay Out!

    2. Caroline says:


      Love yourself MORE than how much he wants to use you.

      You are bright. You are sweet. You are caring. You are beautiful. You are strong. You are wonderful!

      TRUTH: the narcissist would rob you of your soul if he could.

      At times, I have had to look at a picture of myself as a little girl… and then, yes, it will be done. I WILL protect her.

      So will you.

    3. Linda Smith says:

      Stay here with us. Logic overrides emotion. I learned ‘chair therapy’ from a recovering sociopath who now practices grief therapy. Imagine the narc in a chair. Get a bat and a pillow to protect damage to the chair. Beat the crap out of him. Tell him off. Until he surrenders and says he’s sorry . . . like that would ever happen, right?

  18. Jojosmiles says:


    Are you still reading?
    I have just read your comments from November 2017 and can empathise with your situation. I too felt that I could put up with everything because I love mine so much.
    Please share what has happened since


  19. Bibi says:


    HG, you crack me up. I remember listening to the audio of this while working out and I burst out laughing when you said that. Thankfully I was alone.

    Everything is spot on. We make so many excuses. Even my dumbass 1st bf I mentioned–you know, the one who kept me waiting outside and never showed up? I still kept him on FB ‘just in case he ever needed something or ever wanted to talk’ and yet our relationship was several decades removed. He never did shit for me. Nothing.

    I am so much colder now. Unfortunately, I have to be.

    ‘Adios, dipshit!’

    (Not to you, HG.) 😛

  20. Tracy says:

    Totally amazing touches in so many areas, we separated 8 months ago and I know down deep I’m not in love with him anymore however it still breaks my heart to think he is already in love are whatever with this new female…. I have never spoken to her but of course I’ve seen 1 picture of them together and he’s using her for something idk8 what are why but I will always love him but will live alone and love him from a safe distance

    1. K says:

      I am so sorry, Tracy. The heart is fragile and when it breaks the pain is unbearable.

      He is not “in love” with her; he is “in love” with her fuel. She is an appliance and matters not, except for her fuel, traits and residual benefits. Knowing this doesn’t make the hurt disappear, it just gives you perspective. Focus on yourself and no contact and eventually you will feel better, however, it takes a while.

  21. Gabrielle says:

    I know I am not out of the woods yet. I have blocked my ex everywhere I can. Eventually I will most likely have to see him. It is a small town and if it is not an accidental run in somewhere he will most likely find a way to show up at my house or somewhere I am. Everything I’m reading says that every reaction I give will somehow give him the attention he needs. What is the proper reaction? If he shows up my house I will simply tell him to leave but if it’s in public I don’t want to make a scene especially if he has his child with him. What is my best option to get away from him without feeding him?

    1. HG Tudor says:

      Walk away.
      Do not answer the door – do not tell him to leave, ignore him.

      1. Somewhere over the rainbow says:

        A narc wrote from a number I didn’t know. My only reaction was to also block that number. HG Tudor, was that considered fuel or ignore? I didn’t want to read messages from that person; I had (have) the habit to constantly remember the way someone treated me and I usually won’t take a revenge (wasting time and energy) but I won’t engage again, not even from a distance. He changed numbers as often as changing IPPS (my guess).

        I could use a software erasing my number from his phone and my “fuel” (I only considered it “being well behaved” until getting to know who I was dealing with) from his brain…

        1. HG Tudor says:

          Blocking is ignoring which would wound.

      2. W says:

        What if they yell through the window with the kids home,or smash something?
        When my narc used his hidden gps tracker in his separated (!) wife’s car to find her with another man…he drove”by accident” into the guys car on his way out.
        If mine shows up (and he will, eventually,) and I ignore him he might drive into my bumper and take off.

        1. HG Tudor says:

          Close the window and draw the blinds/curtains.
          If they smash something call the police.
          If he drives into your car, call the police.

      3. Somewhere over the rainbow says:

        Thank you!

  22. Lisa says:

    Can you elaborate on no contact and hovering with regard to ipss? Does the same hoover dynamic apply. If they shelf you but spoke every once in awhile and you finally tell them you want nothing to do with theme do they still hoover ipss?

    1. HG Tudor says:

      The incidence of hoovering is governed as ever by the Hoover Trigger and the Hoover Execution Criteria.

  23. Wounded says:

    I deleted the number but did not block because at the time I didn’t know. My old social media account and messenger are deactivated. I did the “one more time” not once, but twice realized I was being ridiculous and stopped getting on altogether. I did another consult in regards to my concerns and backed away from two friendships. However I am still having odd things taking place that are putting my emotional thinking at risk.

    1. SpiritualDiva says:

      Thank you HG. For your consult today. Grateful for your wisdom and your writing, in arming this empath. (I think I figured out the name change. LOL.)
      This post is one I have to read often.. Constant reminders to not succumb to the emotional infection EVER again.

      Must constantly be vigilante, checked maintained, patrolled … No more breaches!

      1. HG Tudor says:

        You are most welcome, it was good to speak with you also.

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