5 Common No Contact Mistakes – No. 2


A second common mistake which occurs when somebody implements no contact is thinking that there will not be a hoover from us. As I have explained, the hoover takes place at various points in the dynamic between narcissist and victim. In this instance, it concerns the post escape or post discard hoover.

Where you have escaped us, you will almost always face the Initial Grand Hoover as we unleash a frenzied attempt to bring you back under our control. This will happen where you tip us off and also once we realise you have embarked on your escape without giving us any notice of what you are doing. (You can read more about how we react in such instances with these articles How No Contact Feels – Part One   How No Contact Feels Part – Two  How No Contact Feels – Part Three ) Should you manage to resist the Initial Grand Hoover you are usually granted a period of respite as we seek fuel from our supplementary sources (secondary and tertiary ) and look to find a different primary source.

Where you have been discarded of course there is no Initial Grand Hoover. We have a new primary source and we focus on that person, effectively deleting you from our minds. You may try to contact us, to get answers, to win us back, to try and resolve unfinished business and you are rebuffed and receive malign hoovers which cause you to back off.

Accordingly, in the case of escape you have rejected the Initial Grand Hoover and there is silence. Or, you have been discarded and your attempts to connect with us have been rejected and there is silence from us. You implement or maintain no contact going forward and the fact that you have heard nothing from us, no messages, no phone calls, nobody calling around to see you, no enquiries from our friends or family causes you to think that you have weathered the storm and that it is all over.

It is not.

I will return to this presently.

The other common mistake that people make with regard to thinking that we will not hoover is making use of the phrase ‘final discard’. I have seen this used many times and I do not know where it has originated from. It appears to be the case that people seem to think that there is some final flourish from us as we tell you that this time it is REALLY over and this time I mean it (although didn’t I say that last time?)

There is no such thing as a final discard. I have written previously that the word discard is not accurate because it really is a dis-engagement. In our minds, our relationship with you lasts until either you die or we die. It is for life because you belong to us. Yes, we will put you from our minds at certain times (when enjoying the golden period with someone else, when we place an IPSS on the shelf) but this does not mean that it is over.

Just because you have weathered the sustained effort of the Initial Grand Hoover to win you back does not mean that we have got the message and we will leave you alone. It is a temporary cessation in the hostilities. Our need for fuel will send us elsewhere as we hunt down a new primary source but we will be back. You have a period of respite by which you can build your no contact and recover but do not be drawn into thinking that this one off blitz of hoovering was the end of it. Similarly, do not think just because we have told you that we wish you would fuck off and die, or disappear off the planet that we will not come back for more. Just because you have tried to speak to us but we have rebuffed you does not mean that that is the end. Not at all.

We are contrarians, hypocrites and engage in contradictory behaviour. This is because of the narcissistic perspective that we adopt. We do what the fuel requires of us. All is as the fuel dictates it to be. If that means in January you are persona non grata, it does not mean that by May we will not declare our love for you once more. What has gone before is the past and we have no sense of shame or reluctance in coming back to you again. It does not matter that we once cast you aside because you failed us. That was then and this is now. Now somebody else has failed us, they have been painted black and this means that you are back in favour. You have recovered and we see you through the lens of being a ‘good’ person once again, someone who is going to give us what we need. It is irrelevant that you let us down  previously. What matters is that our perspective causes you to be seen as a good source of fuel and we want it.

It is understandable why you might think we might not hoover, this may be for any of the following reasons:-

  1. We were so savage in our discard of you;
  2. You exposed us to people when you escaped;
  3. Significant time has passed;
  4. You believe there was a ‘final discard’;
  5. You hear we are with somebody else;
  6. You are with someone new;
  7. You sent us packing when we tried the Initial Grand Hoover.

Whilst these may influence the likelihood of a hoover occurring they will not in themselves mean that it will not happen.

Accordingly, just because of the circumstances and the passage of time, you decide you can go back on social media, you can accept friend requests from strangers, you can go to the places you had avoided for some time, you can talk about us freely again with your friends or even our friends and so on. This is dangerous.

I am not suggesting that you must spend the rest of your life always looking over your shoulder. That is unsustainable but you ought not to think that there will never be a hoover because if you do this you will instinctively lower your guard and in so doing you will cause two things

  1. You are far more likely to activate a Hoover Trigger by entering the spheres of influence; and
  2. You will lower the bar on the Hoover Execution Criteria and thus increase the chances of a hoover happening.

Of course you may well be in a better place and thus far more able to repel the hoover when it happens but there remains a risk, because of your inherent susceptibility to our kind, that as I explained in Part One of this series, you will allow exposure to us cause your emotional thinking to rise and over take your logical thinking which means you are risking being dumped into the emotional sea once again.

If you think a hoover will never happen you will become complacent and you will then start to do the very things which will result in a hoover being MORE likely to happen. Thus, by always reminding yourself that there is a risk (even if it is very small) of a hoover taking place you will continue to maintain a degree of vigilance which ensures this risks stays small and you do not begin to engage in behaviours which encourage us.

I see repeatedly people state that they know their narcissist will not hoover again. They write that it will not happen and they are safe. The only way you are safe from a hoover is if we have died.

I have hoovered somebody after a 12 year hiatus. I would do it after a longer period of time if there was a Hoover Trigger and the criteria are met. There is fuel available and we will take it and assert our superiority and control over you. Remember, we made an investment in you, all that time ago and we will want to keep drawing on it. The fact you have not heard from us for a long time is because our attention was elsewhere and your no contact is proving effective so even if there is  Hoover Trigger, the criteria are not met and therefore no hoover follows.

If you start thinking we will never hoover you, you will become complacent and that is when you run a greater risk of a hoover actually taking place.



  1. Dearest WhoCares,
    Thank you my sweet 😊
    I’ll bring the cake n 🍾🍾🍾 🥂🥂🥂
    and we can all be weirdos together … haha
    Luv Bubbles xx 😘

  2. Dear Getting There,
    Thank you precious one
    I truly appreciate your concern n support
    Religious n political conversations, I believe, always end up in chaos
    Everyone comes here for a reason, I feel NarcAngel summed it up most admirably
    Luv Bubbles xx 😘

  3. Dear FYC,
    Thank you my lovely, you are too kind
    I really appreciate your support in this situation
    Luv Bubbles xx 😘

    1. Dear Bubbles, you are most welcome.😘 That baseless attack was merely a projection of PDs inner world, it had nothing to do with you. NA called this one perfectly.

  4. Is it wrong that I was actually flattered that he attempted to hoover me?

    I didn’t think I was important enough in his matrix and he probably wouldn’t even notice I had jumped off the shelf. Apparently I was worth more than I knew and that pleased me. #myfuelbringsalltheboystotheyard

    1. Flattered, Really? The last time I was hoovered by my lesser narcissist, I was nearly killed last year. He stalked, stole, destroyed my cell phone, punched me repeatedly in the face, strangled me until blood came from my eye, and pulled a gun on me and pressed it into my skin until it bled and left the imprint.

      1. Darling1, I’m so sorry that happened to you. God, that is horrible! I hope he is in prison where he belongs. Please accept my apology for triggering that. My narc situation was nothing like that. Apples and oranges different. From another planet different.

        1. Its fine, I’m glad to hear your narcissist is not violent. Yes he’s heading to prison in July and on tether now until final sentencing. I have remained no contact since the incident last year. Wasn’t hard at all; I had no interest speaking to someone who nearly killed me or being hoovered.

          1. Darling1, thank God he is being put away! I’m glad you’re here to tell the tale and support others in life threatening situations. May you be blessed.

            Mine was a middle midrange that was 1000 miles away and I was just a shelf IPSS. Night and day from your situation. House Kitten vs. Wild and dangerous Lion!

      2. Wow I’m so so very sorry to read this. I can’t imagine what that felt like to go through Darling1. Glad you’re still with us. <3

        1. Thank You Survivor X for your well wishes. It hasn’t been easy, but this site, has given me some insight. I feel better every day.

          1. Darling1

            Welcome. Glad to know you are out and have found your way here.

  5. HG I understand my ex narc is still more than likely within the loved up phase with his new IPPS however I am still maintaining a strict NC regime and have done since Jan. I have had no hoover attempt yet despite being in the same social sphere most weekends. However where as normally he will skulk off when he sees me, this weekend it was different. He came and sat about 6 ft away from me and my friends like he was ‘king of the world’ where as his new squeeze remained a fair distance from him all night. In fact although they enter together they are never within talking distance ever…Would this new move to sit within my space be classed as a failed hoover attempt on his part? I didn’t acknowledge his presence or react in any way but I’m curious whether this was an attempt to push my boundaries and whether he is testing the waters for a hoover? Like I say my NC regime is solid however he does live within walking distance so I’m wondering if I need to be extra vigilant in that regard. Many thanks.

    1. Your NC regime is not that strict if you are monitoring and/or giving thought to where he is at with the new IPPS.
      I answered the point about where he sat in a different comment, FF5.

      1. I am only checking with you for my own safety no other reason . I explained the incident to give you the relevant info. I am not monitoring him or acknowledging him in any way. I haven’t seen the other comment I don’t think. sorry

  6. Im married 25 years to narc.i need out pls.cant deal.im financially dependent on him .3kidz elders 24 youngest 14. One grandchild.help how do i escape .by reading ur emails and books is a great help.but i need out pls pls im drowning

    1. Sorayah, you have shown tremendous strength by reaching out. Take the next step and consult HG. He will give you tons of information and action steps to free you. His book ‘Escape’ is a must read for you if you haven’t already done so. My thoughts are with you. You can do this.

  7. I ignore my narcissist and I am not interested in any kind of hoovering I cannot look at him the same way I used to things are good the way they are now he.is way to toxic I won’t be letting him back in especially now because I have got you to help me keep my thoughts in perspective knowing what he is is a blessing it makes it easier to keep an emotional distance from him you really have changed my life HG

  8. Pretty much my never had to Hoover me. He did though, but I hovered him too. Now I have initiated the wrong no contact, but I am strong. Still, I dream about him every night, not good dreams, and I feel him thinking about me. My emotional thinking tries to trick me into contacting him all the time and gets mad when I don’t. It’s like there is some Separate me living inside me that has all of these thoughts and dreams, but I am finally running the show again.

  9. Wow. Do you think a low grade will hoover that’s being sent to prison for 5+ years? Wouldn’t that make them not want to Hoover the person who put them there?

  10. You are doing yourself a disservice talking about yourself as an animal like hunter – cause you are talking like you are hunting humans. Humans are intelligent beings. They can learn a predator’s behavior and if that predator follows a rather predictable pattern and is continuing to “hunt”, that predator can be “trapped”.

    Just food for thought. Not all people are toneless and unable of managing a sick person.

    1. You evade the predator, you never try to trap the predator. That is emotional thinking. You cannot Control something which is designed to reject control.

      1. I beg to differ. By the way, i keep getting notices and email for every single comment. How do I turn this off? I don’t want anything sent to me from this site.

        REAL WORLD – let me be quite honest with you, if you acted this way down south or some other places in the world, you’d get shot. So think about that. Hard to control people when you’re dead. This is why we have laws on behavior.

        1. I have been to far more dangerous places that you. I am still here. Think about that.

          Down south? Do you mean Slough, I know it is a concrete hell hole but it’s not that bad really, after all it is near Windsor.

          1. Seagull in the tower!!!!!!!

            Umbrellas up everyone! The screeching and squawking while flying about slamming into walls and shitting on everything is tiring but as we know – can do no real damage. Poor things are of such limited intelligence that they can’t reason that if the territory they’re in is not comfortable for them that they have the rest of the sky. They mistake themselves for peacocks and are to be pitied.

    1. No.

      1. Nearly all people do not know they are ensnared by a narcissist the first time around.
      2. Once knowledge is acquired, very few would try to trap the narcissist.
      3. Any that try will fail because they are being led by emotional thinking. Any actions designed to try and trap a narcissist are doomed to failure owing to the lack of ability to trap (empaths are not very good at manipulating and if you think you are good at manipulating you are again being led by emotional thinking), the fact that the ET obscures logic (logic dictates GOSO) and furthermore you are trying to control something which is specifically designed, created and operates to always assert control and reject any attempt to control it.

      1. Dear Mr Tudor,
        Powerful comment …. wow !
        You put common sense into a whole new category above
        Thank you
        Luv Bubbles xx 😘

          1. Dear Mr Tudor,
            Just for clarification and interpretation purposes, my comments addressed to YOU pertained to having a “new” category of common sense placed “ABOVE” the already existing “standard” common sense and was not directed to any one individual or in way personal ….it was purely in relation to your point 3 paragraph

            I sincerely and most humbly thank you for your clarity, clear logic responses and your support back up (which, unknowingly and surprisingly, involved me)
            Luv Bubbles xx 😘

        1. It’s not a powerful comment. He’s saying cause he’s a narcissist, he feels like he’s above the law to stalk a person. Common sense dictates not doing things or acting a certain way to be arrested for something illegal.

          You are a pathetic weirdo who needs online emotional validation from a sick person who’s tricked you into worshipping him – making him feel better about actively doing sick things. He has no intention of changing, he’s just drawing a pool of subjects to abuse if he ever needs one.

          1. You are entitled to your opinion, but it is ill-founded and you failed to produce evidence in support of it :-

            1. Bubbles is entitled to express her opinion about the comment. Doing so does not make her a pathetic weirdo. Are you to be labelled the same because you expressed your opinion?
            2. You dismissed her opinion because her comment approved of my response to you. You did not like my response to you because I both disagreed with you and did so in a logical fashion. You failed to address my points and instead attacked Bubbles.
            3. Bubbles is not a pathetic weirdo. She is a long-standing and constructive contributor in this place. You have arrived recently (your recent comments supporting the conclusion of a recent arrival and the content of those comments also supporting that conclusion) and therefore have reached a premature and erroneous conclusion about Bubbles based on one comment of hers (your conclusion ignoring the copious evidence here and instead being driven by the fact she agreed with my comment which disagreed with you).
            4. Where is there evidence of me tricking Bubbles into worshipping me? Where is the evidence of worship? Where is the evidence of trickery? There is none.
            5. Where is the evidence that I am drawing a pool of subjects to abuse if I ever need one? There is none.

            You are welcome to express your views but do understand that when you advance ill-founded ones, you will be corrected. Should you be moved to respond, do so with evidence.

          2. PD, Sounds like jealousy, bullying, pathetic insults and a lot of projection to me. We see you for what you are.

            Bubbles is one of the kindest and most gracious souls here. You could learn much from her. Sadly, it appears you have already entirely missed the wisdom HG imparts.

          3. Pamela Dianne,
            My comments to Mr Tudor, were “my own” thoughts and I acknowledged how “powerful” his message was ….. for me !!
            Emotional thinking is a very personal process and varies with each individual
            I am very well aware Mr Tudor is a narcissist, however I personally cannot comment on how he feels as I do not know how he feels or whether in fact he stalks people

            Common sense is basically sound practical judgemment “derived from experience”, not necessarily a necessity to stop one for being arrested or for something illegal
            Hmmm … pathetic you say …… sad, weak, helpless n pitiful
            Hmmm …weirdo you say …. behaviour is odd, eccentric or extraordinarily strange (I didn’t realise my simple comment could be interpreted that way)

            I do not need “online emotional validation” … I’m here for advice educational learning and contributing to the sharing of advice, experiences and stories

            I do not believe Mr Tudor is “sick” as you put it … if that’s the case we are all a bit sick in our own “pathetic weirdo ” way

            He has not “tricked” me into worshipping him at all …. I give credit where credit is due
            I respect him for what he doing …. helping and educationing others
            Mr Tudor is an extremely articulate, highly educated and highly
            successful man in numerous facets of his life
            He is an author, a master of the English word and has expert knowledge of the law, a world traveller, a marksman and has a masterful knowledge of human behaviour …. just to name a few
            Mr Tudor has mentioned many many times, he receives a low dose of fuel from his blog
            I cannot comment on him changing but I do know he is not an abuser on his own blog and is highly respectful and extremely considerate to everyone
            I have yet to see his “pool of subjects” drawing …. I believe he is an excellent artist

          4. Pamela, you are correct that a narcissist does believe to be above the law. I’m not sure if that was the message of the moment, but it is one that is made clear in what HG writes as well as experiences provided by readers (examples of a narcissist saying or doing something to illustrate that thought).

            I agree that Solomon was a wise man; I would conclude Jesus was a bit more wise but I understand not all believe in Him. Historical examples of wise men does not preclude wisdom amongst people nowadays. I am not saying that HG is equal to Jesus; but I would say that he has been given a gift of observing what he has seen or done and sharing his observations in a way that hits home and helps others. Is he wrong in what he is saying? If so, please share how. There are things HG has said that have not matched my experiences. I understand people are different, experiences are different; this site helps me learn the basics to hopefully apply in situations with another narcissist. Of the comments I have read of yours, though, it appears to me that you are not seeing that he is wrong. Is that the case?
            As for your comment regarding Bubbles, why? What was your purpose in attacking her? Why did it impact you so much that she appreciated an answer HG gave to a question you asked?

            I like to believe I think and act logically at all times. I am starting to realize that when asked why I do what I do, if my answer is that I don’t have one or is connected to emotions, then I recognize it is emotional thinking.

          5. Pamela Dianne,

            I know I’ve missed a lot on the blog lately – but… I’ll be the first to say that if Bubbles is a “weirdo”, well, she’s my kind of weirdo!
            In fact, she can be an honorary member; I think Windstorm and I both said, in the past, that we’re “weirdos”…how many members do we need to start an official club anyway!?

            PD: you’re amusing.

          6. I’ve only noticed your name while catching up on here tonight. You are a bitch, you have a personality disorder, and your diction sucks for a PhD candidate/student.

        2. Dearest Bubbles,
          You are not a pathetic weirdo! You are kind, funny, gentle, brave and intelligent!

          Luv K xoxo

          1. Dearest K,
            Thank you precious K for your kind endearing words
            I’m at a loss as to why this situation has even occurred
            I really do appreciate your support
            Luv Bubbles xx 😘

          2. Dearest Bubbles,
            My pleasure! It may just be a tiny disturbance in the force. We will just have to wait and see. No worries! Keep calm and keep reading.
            Luv K xoxo

      2. Are you sure it’s emotional thinking? Sounds like you are guessing to me. Do you think I am emotional talking to you right now? Do you need to feel like you engage my emotions and soul every single time we converse, cause that’s not the case and many people think online interactions are just like real life interactions. It’s not.

        Everyone makes mistakes, even geniuses. Even Solomon in Proverbs that pride goes before destruction and a haughty spirit before a fall. He was the only wealthiest, most intelligent, brilliant, genius man ever to have lived too. If he made mistakes, darling, then you will too.

        1. 1. No, I am not sure. I am certain. I am certain because I recognise emotional thinking in individuals because I witness it on a daily basis and from my objective, dispassionate position I am able to see it very readily.
          2. Explain why I am guessing.
          3. You have misunderstood what emotional thinking is. It is not about engaging ’emotions and soul’ but it is allowing emotions to guide thinking (that results in poor decisions) rather than using logic to arrive at a decision.
          4. Your response also demonstrates emotional thinking. Rather than review the logic of what I have written, you are stung because I have disagreed with you and pointed out that your approach is not a good one. Your response is based on feeling stung and ignores the logic of what I have written.

          1. PD. If you have come to this sight, I can only assume it is because you have been ensnared by a narcissist at some point in your life in some capacity. That is probably one of the most hurtful things anyone can go through in terms of mental health, and how it can affect it, and I am sorry you went through that experience.

            Anger is a normal part of the healing process. It can be extremely triggering to read HGs works at times because it can (or at least does for me) bring up a lot of past regressions. I clearly do not know you at all, but your anger sounds like it wants to gain some of the control back you feel you lost with the narcissist. So there is some name calling and some hope that people will do one over as it were on the narcissit.

            I agree that narcs are not above the law.
            If you are here to read, its OK if you don’t agree with every word HG says. You don’t have too.

            You will in time, work through that anger. I wish you all the best on your healing journey.

          1. Haha—while cleaning my garage yesterday my house helper and I were throwing chemicals away from a shelf. Antifreeze right there.. We both had the same thought at the same time. What a waste.. If only he could’ve lapped it up like an animal.

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