Exposure During Escape



Should you expose your narcissist when you have escaped? Should you expose him or her if you have been discarded? It is far more likely that you have established who it is you have been dealing with for so many tortuous months or even years, when the Formal Relationship has concluded. Whether you managed to escape, or, more often, you have been discarded, the revelation of what you have been entangled with is more likely to appear in the aftermath than opposed to during seduction or devaluation.

Armed with this new found knowledge, as the pieces of the jigsaw start to fit together, but whilst the emotion remains raw, the desire to expose us to the world at large is extremely tempting. What better way to secure revenge than letting those who fawn over us understand what we really are? You know now and in accordance with your empathic nature you feel obligated to share this truth now that you have sought the truth and found it. Now it must surely be time to announce to the world that we are a narcissist?

Once again, as described during devaluation, the timing and the school of narcissist are highly relevant to understanding what is likely to happen as a consequence of this unmasking to third parties. We address here the likely outcomes when you have escaped your narcissist.

Post Escape

The next scenario is to consider what will occur should you expose us to third parties once you have escaped our grasp.

The Lesser. 

You will have stolen a march on the Lesser Narcissist. Based on the assumption that you have effected no contact and escaped his grasp without giving him an opportunity to try to prevent your escape (see https://narcsite.com/2016/08/20/how-no-contact-feels-part-one/) then your exposure will have taken the Lesser by surprise.

His efforts will have been focused on trying to win you back through the application of an Initial Grand Hoover, but if your no contact has remained intact and this IGH has failed, the Lesser will have been forced to seek out a new primary source to replace you. His fuel levels will have dropped and he will not have the energy levels to engage in any meaningful smearing of you as he tries to seduce a replacement.

As word of the your exposure reaches him, he will be wounded by this substantial criticism. His fury will be ignited and he will want to lash out at you. Knowledge of the exposure will have amounted to you entering a sphere of influence so there is a Hoover Trigger. His reaction will be to want to effect a malign hoover against you. However, if your no contact is solid and the wounding effect of the exposure will mean that you have raised the bar high in respect of the Hoover Execution Criteria. He will not effect the hoover because the prospect of fuel is difficult, he may not be able to contact you and there is the risk of further wounding.

He will however have his fury ignited by the wounding effect of the exposure. Unable to apply this heated fury against you through a malign hoover and in desperate need of fuel, the Lesser will actually be likely to lash out at his secondary sources. This creates a further problem for him. Whilst on the one hand those secondary sources – family and friends, will react by giving him fuel – they cannot help but do so as he lashes out at them causing anger, upset and surprise – he is also reinforcing what you have exposed him for.

Accordingly, in such a scenario, you have spread word of what he is. This has got back to the narcissist and irrespective of whether people believe what you have said or not (we turn to that in a  moment) the mere fact of you committing such an act of treachery as well results in huge criticism and thus huge wounding. Unable to perform what will in effect be a Malign Follow-up Hoover against you, the Lesser will have lost control and will lash out left right and centre. People will be railed against, insulted, items smashed and so forth as the Lesser damages the facade through his own inability to control his rage.

Eventually the garnered fuel will heal the wound but after this the Lesser faces the consequences of his actions. Numerous sources will turn their back on him and he will be left to rely on a diminished range of sources. Lacking the energy to draw in many replacement secondary sources, the Lesser is forced to focus on obtaining (or embedding) the new primary source. He will however withdraw generally as he regains fuel and slowly replaces the appliances that he has lost. This may even force the Lesser to move territory and seek out a new hunting ground.

Your exposure to the third parties will meet with some success, certainly more than if it took place during devaluation. This is because you are likely to be more composed in your approach, because you escaped and you have been able to get in first with your exposure before the Lesser has been able to smear. Not everybody will accept what you tell them, but others will. You will also then see that rather than fight back by smearing you and tackling your exposure, the out of control and wounded Lesser will only behave in a manner which allows you to stand back and say

“Told you so.”

So long as you engage in this exposure in a manner whereby the wild and raging Lesser cannot exact his Malign Follow-Up Hoover against you, exposing him post escape is likely to meet with success.

The Mid-Ranger

What then of the Mid-Ranger? How does he respond once you have exposed him post escape? Again, this is based on you managing to escape without tipping him off as otherwise you will initially face the scenario detailed here https://narcsite.com/2016/08/22/how-no-contact-feels-part-two/

Once word reaches the Mid-Ranger of your exposure he will also be taken by surprise. Although possessing of a better cognitive function and greater control than the Lesser, the Mid-Range Narcissist will also suffer a massive wound as a combination of the twin criticisms of your escape and the exposure. His immediate reaction will be one of horror at your disloyal behaviour, amazement at how treacherous you are and disgust that you of all people could do a thing like this.

The fury of the Mid-Ranger will be ignited and he will need to seek fuel. Just like the Lesser, he will turn to wanting to contact you by way of a follow-up hoover, since your exposure step has caused you to enter his sphere of influence and a hoover is triggered. The Mid-Ranger will not proceed in a malign fashion but he will want to hoover you in a benign way and for the purposes of rolling our repeated pity plays in the expectation of causing you to give him fuel and to also end and indeed reverse the exposure.

He will want to know why you could do this to him after all the things he has done for you, how you could treat somebody who loves you so badly, how you could be so cruel, so evil and heartless when all he has ever done is love you. He will be oblivious to his devaluation of you as he is intent and focused on his own discomfort. The wound will have him restless, morbid and in victim mode. If the Mid-Ranger is able to engage with you, you can expect a lengthy monologue as he seeks to draw sympathy from you and also your confirmation that the exposure is a mistake, based on a misunderstanding and you will rectify it by telling everyone that you have made a mistake and that he is in fact a decent and reliable person.

If the Mid-Ranger is unable to contact you to make this heartfelt plea, then he is forced to seek sympathy elsewhere and he will engage his energies in locating (or embedding the new primary source) as he smears you for your hurtful treachery and also rolling out his own propaganda response to those you have exposed him too. He will want sympathy and support from his supporters, he will entreat his coterie and lieutenants to disbelieve you and to persuade others of his merits.

You may meet with some success in persuading third parties to accept the true nature of the Mid Ranger if you are able to steal a march on him through your escape. If you can get your exposure in before he can smear you then you will have some success. You will face the difficulty that the Mid-Ranger will not respond in an aggressive manner but rather deploy pity and seek sympathy all in order to have people feel sorry for him. This is an effective step by him and he will not engage in the self-defeating behaviour of the Lesser.

Your exposure combined with no contact will cause him to slink away and leave you alone. He will be forced to apply his efforts to the replacement and trying to repair his reputation with the third parties and smear you also. Whilst he has more energy than the Lesser, he may ultimately opt to maintain a low profile and rely on what remains of his loyal sources as he located and embeds the new primary source. You have raised the Hoover Execution Criteria bar and therefore the prospects of further hoovers will be limited for some time.

The Greater

Finally we turn to the Greater. What is his reaction on you escaping him and exposing him? Once again, if you have tipped him off as to your intentions, the initial response from him will be as described here.

If you do not tip off the Greater, what happens when he learns that you are exposing his behaviour and what he is to third parties.

Your escape and this attempted unmasking, amounts, as you would expect, to a criticism. It wounds the Greater but he will manage his fury and keep it under control. For now. His initial response will be two fold:-

  1. He will seek to apply a Benign Follow-Up Hoover to charm you. This will be fierce and sustained and seem like an Initial Grand Hoover, but it is not. He will be delightful, pleasant, apparently remorseful and will lay on the charm and magnetism; and
  2. He will deploy all resources in order to counter the effects of your exposure with the third parties. This will be initially by way of asserting his credentials, then undermining you and smearing you.

If the Greater is unable to contact you for the purposes of charming you, he will accelerate his efforts to secure a new primary source (even if the replacement is not 100% suitable) as the Greater will want a replacement immediately for two reasons.

  1. Naturally for fuel; and
  2. To parade to the facade’s third parties as part of the assertion of his credentials and the smearing of you.

Your escape will be portrayed as him leaving you. You will be smeared as The Crazy One and he will gain fuel from your replacement and his other sources. He is adept at doing so and consequently this will provide him with the additional energy to smear you and derail your exposure.

It is very hard to expose a Greater because he has charmed so many people that they will just find it very hard to believe what you are saying to them. Not only that, the Greater will be fighting back by reassuring these people there is nothing to worry about whilst pointing to your drink problem, your habitual lying, your possessive jealousy and so forth. This combination of reassurance, charm and smearing means you are unlikely to have much effect on the thoughts and opinions of the third parties, other than them to hold you in contempt.

The new replacement will be paraded in order to try to draw fuel from you, there will be frequent Relationship Bulletins and you may have escaped but your exposure will actually feel like you are under siege again because of the effects of the Greater’s sustained and co-ordinated response.

Even high calibre evidence of what the Greater is may well founder in the light of his charm and concentrated abilities and ultimately you run the risk of either being seduced again through his charm or if you can maintain no contact, you will find your exposure has not dented his standing but has had an adverse effect on your from the sustained smearing you will suffer. Even if your exposure ‘gets in’ first, the Greater can  mobilise his propaganda machine quickly with the consequent problems this will cause for you.

You may wish to consider carefully whether there is anything to be gained from exposing the Greater and instead focus on the gains you have made from escaping.

Next consideration will be given to the scenario of exposure following discard.

26 thoughts on “Exposure During Escape

  1. Violetta says:

    Thank you all for your helpful feedback.

    Melmel, do whatever you have to do to remind yourself that you aren’t the worthless person your narcs would convince you that you are. I have visited dog parks, chatted with folks who go to the soup kitchen in my neighborhood so at least they’re recognized as human beings, even if I can’t help them financially; when I still had the job, I brought the soup kitchen unused snack bags that all those carb-o-phobes left in our staff lounges plus two creaky but operational bottle-warmers GrinchLady was ready to toss and the trash when new ones arrived (I wish I had been able to save the books she tossed before my shift started). I couldn’t fund any assistance, but I could bring them things no one else was using with minimal effort and feel that at least, someone was benefiting.

    God bless my friends, because I told them the whole story at one gathering. One couple who’ve known me for years (I’ve held all their three kids when they were babies) not only allowed me to hold, feed, and try to burp the latest (the last turned out to be unnecessary: he has a self-burping mechanism), but they even allowed me to nibble on his chubby little face. (I never practice cannibalism without consent of parent or guardian.)

    Be around people who will counteract the false picture of yourself your work narcs are trying to impose on you.

    I reviewed the Work Narc package after I lost my job, and was struck by one thing HG said in the last segment. Sometimes, you just can’t stay there. There are some situations so toxic that no technique can keep them manageable. I don’t know if your situation fits that category, but don’t beat yourself over the head if you can’t fix it. I was working with infants, so keeping an unemotional exterior in front of GrinchLady would have been not only impossible but inappropriate. Responding enthusiastically when a kid stands up without holding on to anything or being sympathetic (“Oh, did you fall down and go BOOM?”) is part of the job. I have no doubt my professional future wasn’t enhanced by the look on my face when GrinchLady occasionally bounced plastic balls near babies, even younger ones on mats, as a joke. Sometimes the ball would hit the baby. If the baby cried, she’d say, “You’re lucky I wasn’t throwing that full force. I did sports in high school!”

  2. Violetta says:

    So in terms of work narcs….would like feedback from all Tudoristas who care to comment, as well as HG (who did confirm that the lead teacher was indeed a narc, with many lesser qualities and barely enough facade to make it into lower-mid-range).

    I got a notice that my unemployment was denied for monetary reasons, i.e., insufficient weeks or pay per week. I sat down with a calendar and wrote the following appeal:

    1. MONETARY: I started paid training at Miss Minchin’s Select Seminary for Young Yuppies online Wed, 10/7/20. This would put my employment through March at 23 weeks. Full-time onsite work began 10/19/20. This would put my employment through March at 21 weeks.  I took voluntary exclusions when I had possible Covid symptoms with negative results being sent to my employer: Nov, 24, 2020, Dec. 18, 2020, Jan 20-22, 2021. Voluntary exclusions until my Covid tests returned should not reduce my weeks working, as I was working with children and it would have been irresponsible to risk passing them any possible virus. During Unpaid leaves beginning 11/3/20 & 3/18/20, I was still employed until the week beginning 3/22/20.

    2. WORK BULLYING: In addition, there was an incident where a cabinet door that the lead teacher had attempted to repair fell on my head, requiring a visit to the hospital where it was glued shut.  I mentioned during a meeting that the maintenance union would deny all liability for this incident, since they weren’t the ones to attempt to fix it. The management’s response was to ignore numerous violations of policy by the lead teacher and focus on every technical flaw they could find with my work performance, which of course was deteriorating due to constant harassment by the lead teacher.


    I worried that the 2nd paragraph was too whiny, but since I couldn’t change documents after submitting, I wanted to get the union violation out there. I tried to call to consult, but no one was picking up yet.

    Within a few days, I got a notice that I should log into the state agency that regulates certain day cares (not all) because I have new messages. I’m pretty sure the messages are that I’ve been banned from registered day cares and booted from the agency rolls after being reported by Miss Minchin’s Select Seminary. Not sure if this was when things would be processed anyhow (got the boot in Mid-March), or the director (almost certainly a Mid-ranger) gave a push to the state agency after seeing my appeal. (I don’t know for a fact if she would see it, but there was a notice that copies would be sent to various parties.)

    Do I:

    1. Save myself the stress and ignore it, deleting it without reading from an Archive I have devoted to all Minchin’s Maenads communications and concentrate on getting a nice office job where they don’t care if a few Dunning-Kruger exemplars think I’m not good at wiping baby butts;
    2. Don’t read if it will raise my ET, but save in case I need some sort of documentation;
    3. Read and reply with a list of every violation GrinchLady and her enablers committed or permitted? (I’d have to look up my log-in, which I haven’t thought of in over 2 months.) Would this be violating NC and get my angry ET elevated for no good reason? Should I put it all behind me, count the job a useful expedient during lockdown when jobs were few, and now seek a higher class of work narc than is to be found in baby-butt-wiping? Do I owe the hapless kids a crusade to clean up that gentrified Dotheboys Hall? Would it be a crusade, or just revenge?

    I may also be eligible for extended benefits, but I’ll have to consult a human at the agency to find out.

    1. Violetta says:

      Technically, this would be exposure after discard, not escape. The possibility that they are monkeying with my benefits could indicate malign Hoovers. They don’t want me back, but they do miss torturing me.

    2. Melmel says:

      Dear Violetta,

      If you read my post to AV below you will see that I am not the best person to give advice on work narcs.
      However, I do have quite a lot of experience and a little knowledge of Labour law at least in Canada (so it might be quite different where you are).

      I think that you need to read the message so that you know what it contains, especially if there may be some restrictions (or maybe the message is something else entirely) that could affect the type of job you are able to get in the future. No point in applying for a job that you can’t get because of whatever smearing has occurred. That will also cause your ET to flare if you do this and learn through a third party what the email contains.

      Having said that, reading the email will definitely trigger you and cause your ET to be very high. I am lucky because when I receive these emails I am alone in the comfort of my home, and I have learned some coping techniques to work through all my narcissistic traits (and yes, I have them all) while there is no one else around to suffer. DO NOT REPLY TO THE EMAIL. Read it, close it, and go do something else. I typically like to listen to HG (helps me think with Logic and soothes me with his voice, and usually gets me thinking about different aspects of my life and how I have been and am affected by different narcissists) and garden. Or go for a walk with headphones in. If I could still stay on rollerblades to save my life I would do that to angry music. If I am so upset I can’t leave the house (even going into the yard is scary sometimes because I have scary Narc neighbours that are home all day too), I get down on the floor and breathe and/or stretch. Sometimes I listen to worship music and sing and/or dance. I have a very hot shower. I go cry in my bed.

      That’s just me, but do whatever works for you.

      There are three steps for me to working through the heightened ET:
      1. Stop thinking about the problem/conflict/narcissist and focus into yourself.
      2. Identify and allow yourself to feel and express whatever emotion comes up to the surface.
      3. Soothe yourself in whatever way works for you – imagine that you are a child with those strong emotions – how would you hold space for and comfort that child?

      If when the ET and the strong emotions subside you feel like you can think clearly and/or you get a Logic Download during the process, then at that point I would write down your thoughts so that if a need arises in the future for you to defend yourself officially the Logic is clear in your mind. Also write down the emotional process that you went through because if there ever was a claim or case made against the actions of the agency or the facility it will be important to have documented evidence of how it made you feel in the moment. DO NOT SEND THIS AS AN EMAIL REPLY. Print it and file it so you have a hard copy and can use it if you need it later.

      Then, minute by minute and day by day, work the email (and associated ET) out of your mind. When you find yourself thinking about it, choose to think about something else.

      You do not owe it to the Little Darlings to expose the school’s abuse. That is the Little Darlings’ parents’ jobs. You need to take care of yourself, and trying to expose them before you have fully escaped and are still experiencing high ET (as a result of the email) will cause you to choose a course of action that will cause more harm than good to all the innocents involved, including you! Remember the Narcs are better than you at playing the manipulation game. They will outmaneuver you at every turn until your ET is lowered enough for you to respond with Logic instead.

      Easy for me to say. Not so easy to do (the Addiction…)
      Good luck sister!

      1. Violetta says:


        Thank you for your detailed and thoughtful reply. Funny, I listen to HG when I want to calm down too! Sometimes it’s something not directly relevant, like the Royal Narcissist series, just to reassure me that this is a thing, and not just me being the weird one again. When my ET was skyrocketing, I listened to the NDC HG had done on the lead teacher, to remind myself that this is not just my personal opinion, even though no one at the center seemed to question her actions.

        A new wrinkle. The child care registry did have a neutral-toned post that my employment ended in March, but the recent notices weren’t punitive at all: they said I was eligible for two.quarters of “hero pay” for working during lockdown. I have submitted payment instructions with routing number, etc. Probably won’t be worth beans, but I’m not turning anything down.

        I’m much less inclined to rat out school mismanagement now. Sad that I’m less fired-up about Saving the Children than getting revenge.

        OTOH, I did start out writing a list of incidents and how they affected my work. I found several instances I deliberately undercut GrinchLady, and took active Narcissistic joy in recognizing I had done so. Some examples:

        When Bronwyn was new, GL told her mother over the phone, “Don’t worry, as long as she’s in my class, I’ll make sure she’s okay.” After she got off the phone, I said, “I thought Carla was her primary carer.” GrinchLady said, “Well, she is, I just…” Trailed off. Some days later, she said to Bronwyn, “Your mom says you can walk, you’re just lazy.” I was the one who held first both of Bronwyn’s hands while walking to the diaper area or the meal area, so she would gain confidence, then one hand, since I could see her balance was just fine. In a few weeks, she was running everywhere.

        GrinchLady used to shovel Jamie’s cereal in until he spit up. She said he didn’t have to finish it, his mother just wanted him to get used to the taste. He usually finished most or all of it with me, and his mother must have thought it was because the 1st time I fed him, I had mistakenly used water instead of milk to mix it, so she stopped sending milk. Actually, he finished it with me because I gave him half a baby-spoonful of cereal and let him make faces for a while, only giving him the next after he had swallowed most of it, chatting with him the whole time about how he was still getting his bottle afterwards as usual.

        Molly was afraid of the psychedelic water tiles, behaving as if she might fall in them. GrinchLady screamed at her, “I ain’t going to let you spoil this for everybody else!” Mocked Molly when she would forget about them for a while, then notice them: “You been playing near them all day, and now you’re scared!” I put Molly on one side of the glass window in the sleep area gate, then showed her how we couldn’t touch when we high-fived. I knocked my fingers on the water tiles to show her that it was solid like the glass: you could see through it, but you couldn’t touch what was on the other side, using simple words to explain why. The next time she high-fived one of the admins through the window wall opening to the hallway, she pointed to a water tile, seeing the connection. Weeks later, when Molly and others were climbing on the furniture, GrinchLady first yelled, “Git down!” as usual, then put a water tile on the table. Molly ignored it and climbed back up, and GrinchLady’s face fell when she saw she couldn’t intimidate her that way anymore.

        I’m relatively sure I’m not full narc, but when the Worm Turns, I have to admit it’s kinda fun.

        1. Truthseeker6157 says:

          Hey Violetta,

          I’m UK based as you know, so I can’t help with the legal entitlement side. if it’s work related / career related I would read the email. I imagine that this nursery has little or no legal expertise unless it’s a nationwide chain. What they threaten and what they can legally do are likely two very different things. Similarly with withholding any pay entitlement. Narcs might make threatening noises but really, as we know, in the vast majority of cases there is no substance behind it.

          Do you have any friends or friends of friends in the legal field? A response on letterhead paper from a law firm would likely be enough to put the fear of God into them.

          As far as the nursery and care of the children in their charge. If your belief is that children are being mistreated, then this is one thing, you have to prove this though. If it is more a case of the nursery being ‘poorly run’ then I would likely not enter into battle directly. There are ways and means to communicate poor performance anonymously. For example, greatschools.com or something similar. These sites are anonymous and allow space for star ratings and comments. You could be ‘disappointed mom’ and leave feedback. ‘Unfriendly head teacher’, ‘My child was not happy here.’ Etc. I used similar sites when looking for day care in the US. Many people relocating have to.

          General upshot, if going for revenge, do it from a distance.

          1. Violetta says:

            They are a very large chain, usually attached to corporate on-site care. They can probably afford better lawyers than I can. I got the impression that quality varies wildly not only from one center to the next, but from one classroom to the next. Some of my coworkers were excellent.

            I’ve appealed the unemployment thing and we’ll see what happens.

          2. Truthseeker6157 says:


            That’s a pain. The nurseries I looked at in KY were all little independents or a chain of two or three locally. Great with the kids, back office was disorganised to say the least. Imagined it more like that.

      2. Leigh says:

        Melmel, for someone who is ensnared, you really seem to have a handle on it. I know you were responding to Vi, but your response has helped me too.

        I hope you find a way to escape your workplace narc with very minimal smearing or damage.

    3. lisk says:

      I agree with Melmel that you should read the messages.

      Before you do open them, have a plan to not respond at all to the messages UNLESS they involve a reasonable resolution.

      Before you open them, think of all the possible unreasonable things they could write, get angry about them now, and laugh at them if/as you find them in the messages. (Predictable idiocy should always be laughed off.)

      Before you read the messages, think of all the people who CAN serve as references and think about how you can connect or reconnect with them so they are at hand when you apply for other jobs. (This should help you feel more in charge of your future as you read the potentially stupid and controlling messages.)

      Before you read the messages, look at Indeed. Tons of higher ed listings are there as schools are revving back up for Fall 2021. (You’ll feel like you have more options before opening stupid messages.)

      Also remember that there’s always temp work that can help you get back in the door.

      That place and those people sound below you. Disentangle ASAP!

      1. Violetta says:


        I did open them, and I may be eligible for “hero pay,” so I applied.

        Personally, I think it required more heroism to deal with GrinchLady every day than work during a pandemic, but their not offering a bonus for that.

        I have been applying for both academic and editorial jobs. Have worked temp many times before, especially in NY, so signing with an agency will be my next step. Can tideme over while I look for full-time, or as you note, give me a foot in the door.

    4. A Victor says:


      HG recently said, somewhere, that we need to get to the logic, to do so we need to go to the evidence. Maybe what’s in there isn’t as bad as you think. Maybe it’s worse. But, either way, not knowing isn’t helping you. If you have something there that is less than expected, it will be a relief. If it’s worse, you will know to begin looking for ways to respond that will be effective, possibly even legal recourse if needed, and also whether or not to pursue a job in a different line of work. I don’t know where you are, laws are likely different in each country represented here. But wherever you are, you could begin looking at ways to legally protect yourself in case it is needed. But not knowing what you’re dealing with, in that email, is not helping get to the logic, which is not helping your ET. I’m pretty new, take it or leave it. Please don’t be upset by what I’ve written, that was not my intent at all, only to offer what I have heard. I hope things improve for you.

    5. Leigh says:

      Vi, do you work in the US? You should have gotten paid for that time off due to COVID. Its part of the CARES act. if you had symptoms you would have to quarantine until you got back a negative result and they were required to pay you. Its called emergency sick leave. See the link below


      I think you should log on to the state agency that monitors day cares. I bet they want more info about that daycare. I think you’re response to unemployment raised some red flags about them. I don’t think you’re in trouble at all. That lose cabinet falling on your head should have been reported to workers comp. You have a claim there too. You really could stick it to them. I think you should. Not to mention that cabinet isn’t safe for the kids either.

      If you work in NY, Cuomo is all for the employee. You have a bunch of things in your favor here.

      1. Violetta says:


        I’m in the Midwest. Workers Comp did take care of the bill, but it was hell getting in touch with them. Thanks to all the computer log-ins and log-outs, we really didn’t get a full hour for lunch to hang on the phone waiting for a representative every time we needed to pass information. In one case, they snail-mailed me a crucial number instead of emailing it, and I couldn’t get to my postbox during week thanks to working hours and location.

        I’m not sure if the “hero pay” is instead of or in addition to time off waiting for test results, but I will find out. I didn’t sit in a car sticking q-tips up my nose because it was fun!

        1. Legh says:

          The narcissist always has a way of screwing with our heads. We always go to fear and anxiety. Damn that emotional thinking! I’m glad you opened the emails and it turned out to be good news. The hero pay is different than Emergency Sick Leave. At this point, I don’t know if you’d be able to collect the emergency sick leave. Hopefully the unemployment issue will resolve soon as well.

  3. InTheProcess says:

    The problem with exposure following escape (in my case from an upper mid-ranger), is that it’s impossible to gage the efficacy of exposure of the proper no contact regime is in place. And, as time goes on, I’m running the risk of violating fourth and fifth fingers of engagement by talking about the narcissist, and thinking about exposing the narcissist. Catch 22.

  4. Melmel says:

    Yes I see now.
    Actually I started to see earlier this week, and very nearly succumbed to overwhelming despair. But I’m back now. Eye on the prize.
    There is no other option. When you know, you go. The desire to expose the narcissist is powered by Emotional Thinking. Logic says GOSO. Not: wait until you can expose them then try to make a break for it.
    Also, I hadn’t thought of the Relationship Bulletins. I see now that’s one reason they want me where they are trying to force me to work.

    Thanks again HG. I am very glad to have your voice (of Logic, and also because it’s nice to listen to) in my head.

    1. A Victor says:

      Glad you are okay Melmel. Your comment made me wonder if those of us who come here already removed from their “main” narc have a bit of luxury in not having to make decisions and move quite so quickly. I did have to make a couple of decisions with regard to my mother, but that was not difficult at all really. But no romantic involvement, for a long time, has made some of the processing less stressful, I think. I don’t know your story completely, reading this it sounded like you’re leaving a narc but not sure how close you are to them. In any event, I am glad you are doing better, I hope whatever is happening, you have good success.

      1. Melmel says:

        Thanks AV. I am so thankful for this supportive place to vent and share my struggles.
        Being ensnared and in devaluation is so isolating because no one wants to acknowledge what is really happening and those closest to me don’t want to hear it and/or say I’m crazy when my clarity of thought wounds them personally somehow.

        My primary issue at the moment is a work issue that has turned very ugly. I have some protection but it is difficult to get them to understand what is really going on. Or rather, I think they understand, but they don’t want to deal with the legal implications of defending me against the malign harassment and discrimination that I have been enduring for over a decade.

        I am in a situation where that protection and the financial support that I have been receiving is threatened unless I do something that could result in me not only losing this job, but also my profession and any hope of getting a new job outside of the organization. The Employer is a large organization that has a lot of power and influence over all the jobs in my profession in my geographical area, so I will likely never be completely No Contact, although I may be able to get very close as others have done who have either been wrongfully dismissed, bullied out, or paid out to keep them silent (regarding what they have done and are currently doing to me).

        It is overwhelming and I go from shock and horror to complete despair, to rallying myself at the end of the day to stay strong for my family. There is a plan… but the overwhelm is so raw that I am paralyzed to do what I know needs to be done to get out. I am so afraid. And grieving the loss of a career that I love (because if I get out I won’t be able to do the same kind of job I do now) and have worked for very hard at great financial, emotional, physical and psychological cost to myself and my family.

        My defiance has made the desire to expose them and hold them accountable very high, but now I just want to get away without putting my family into insolvency and me into the hospital because we have all been through that once already. I wish I had more Super in me to help me get through the next few months and protect my family, but instead I will rely on working through the grief and fear and guilt with the resources that HG provides and the support of this blog (and meds and therapy).

        Today is a day for tears (you’re not the only one!).
        Thank you for your kind words.

        1. Violetta says:

          Can you smuggle in a tape recorder? We weren’t even allowed to use cell phones in he classroom, so I couldn’t get a clip of GrinchLady acting like Joan Crawford.

          1. Melmel says:

            Violetta –
            I actually have a tape recorder for this very purpose but I left it in my desk at work when I went off last year lol. Right now all of my communication is done through third parties via email but I do have a teleconference meeting coming up so I will find a way to record it as you have suggested. It is definitely easier to see (and not respond to the ET that pops up) when it’s in writing. I’m going to record everything I can from now on too so I can detect the manipulations that are spoken after the fact.

        2. A Victor says:

          Melmel, I am so sorry to hear you’re going through this. It must be awful to think you could lose something you’ve worked so hard to establish and build. I am glad to hear you’re less concerned with holding them accountable at this time than taking care of yourself and your family. That is the most important thing at the end of the day. But I also understand the sense of overwhelm, that seems to be a theme when we are dealing with narcissists. Yes, tears happen too. Lol, I have learned not to fight them, I never used to cry. Now, they happen and go away again and I go on. I wish you all the best and I hope that you will use us to vent and bounce things off of as you need to, as it is helpful. I hope today has been better for you.

        3. NarcAngel says:


          It sounds that HG’s consultation: How to Handle the Narcissist at Work
          would be of great benefit to you.
          No one knows better how to navigate his kind.

          1. Melmel says:

            NA and Asp Emp –

            Yes I was able to get that Assistance Package at a discount when HG offered one of his earlier sales. It was very helpful. And helps me when the ET crops up and I start worrying about everything to remember that the end goal is Escape. I’ve also bought that book and some others to help.

            I am working my way through the Consultations as well. Next is the Narc Detector (for my Employer – I have no doubt about the IF, just the school and how that applies to my EDC/TDC. I’m a full on hybrid so I will need HG’s help with that for sure). Finally I am sure that I will require a Consultation with HG specific to the situation; I want to read all the relevant materials first though so I can get the basic principles solid to know exactly what questions to ask for my situation.

            Thanks everyone for your support! At times when the terror threatens to overwhelm and it seems like no one is listening, this place has been a great source of comfort. And thanks to HG again as well… Without this material I would be very lost and spinning out of control trying to understand something that is really incomprehensible without his direct first hand insight.

          2. Asp Emp says:

            MelMel, thank you for your response. Glad you are working through HG’s resources to get some ideas together about going forward. Hope this can be sorted out sooner than later for you 🙂

        4. Asp Emp says:

          MelMel, reading your comment – wow. NarcAngel’s suggestion of HG’s Assistance Package – is very good and worth obtaining to give you more insight. Maybe also a consult with HG to obtain further advice on a way forward for your situation? He would be the next step I would take as he will signpost you. He’s the best person for assisting you to navigate through your whole quandary so you’d still get employment within the area you are now. The best of luck and keep communicating with us on the blog. Take care lass x

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