The Narcissistic Truths – No. 244

THEY ARE ALWAYSTHEREBUT YOU STILLFAIL TO SEE THEM

81 thoughts on “The Narcissistic Truths – No. 244

  1. MsSevyn says:

    HG, have you ever met a female Narcissist who knocked you off your game or would you know to avoid one and walk away?

    1. HG Tudor says:

      No I haven’t. I have no need to avoid a female narcissist but as I have explained before, I would not choose to seduce one romantically as she would not serve my purposes as well as an empathic person would.

  2. 1jaded1 says:

    I’m not ashamed to have asked him where his other source’s toothbrush went when he asked me to tutor him…he faked that he didn’t have another source. Liar. Oral health was very important to us. We didn’t co habitate but we had that in common. I wonder if my toothbrush became a toiletbrush. Gross. I would never co-habitate. You have your bolt hole and I have mine.

  3. foolme1time says:

    Before the children can be educated I feel that the adults have to be educated!! Their is still not enough people that know about narcissists!! We do now because of the blog and HG but if we did not find him we would all still be walking around saying, What the hell just happened!! I think it is up to us, the victims to spread the word and get all the information we can out their about narcissists and HG and his work!! I have finally been able to talk to my adult daughter about it after I realized that a lot of her ex boyfriends were narcissists! I had no idea at the time! I thought they were all just a bunch of assholes!! Now I and she knows what they really were! Thank you HG! Thank you so very much!! Xxx

  4. Love says:

    Hi Mr. Tudor. Do you live alone? How often are you actually by yourself?

    1. HG Tudor says:

      I do not co-habit at this juncture. The IPPS will sometimes stay over, sometimes not. Other house guests stay over sometimes, sometimes they do not. I am with and in contact with people repeatedly every day.

      1. Love says:

        Thank you. Do you determine when the IPPS is allowed to stay over? Are some of the other house guests IPSSs?

        1. HG Tudor says:

          Of course I determine it, it is always down to me.
          The other house guests are secondary sources.

          1. Love says:

            Lol, yes secondary of course to be occupying your house. But are they intimate secondaries πŸ˜‰

          2. HG Tudor says:

            I am the only one who occupies it the others are guests.

          3. Love says:

            Forgive me. English is not my native language but I understand ‘occupy’ to mean, to take up space, fill (whether permanent or temporarily). But I respect your privacy if you don’t want to share.

  5. Ali says:

    they look like just about anyone else, they don’t look evil, they don’t sound evil until after they ensnare you (most of them)…

    I’ve come across a few of them since leaving my narc ex and yes they do seem to be narc ninjas…
    at least until you make clear your boundaries and refuse to let them cross/ignore those…affirming boundaries to them seems to really anger them.
    it’s like telling them “Sorry to burst your bubble, but I will not be your new fuel source, go take a long walk off a short pier”
    πŸ™‚

    and yes, I agree that this should be taught to children… The trouble with that is that it will be tough to get that knowledge out there to home schooled children, and some other cultures… if it ever got approved as school curriculum…
    those of us who have experienced it may teach it to our own children at home. it’s not going to reach everyone but it will spread if they then in turn teach it to their children, etc. like ripples through a pool.

    we don’t have to wait for the education departments of our respective countries to catch up…

    1. VFH says:

      Yes and sadly only survivors of (most types of) abuse know that…

      “The devil doesn’t come wearing pointy horns and a cape. He comes dressed as everything you ever dreamed of.”

  6. M. says:

    The thing is that, after all the education we’ve got here, we see them everywhere! It’s like when you are pregnant-suddenly you think you are surrounded by pregnant women!

    1. HG Tudor says:

      Very much the case.

  7. 12345 says:

    “They are always there but you still fail to see them” Well, that’s just great.

  8. Hurt says:

    How would a midranger react if a discarded IPPS messes up his golden period with the new IPPS?

    1. HG Tudor says:

      Smearing, malign hoovers, reliance on supplementary sources whilst seeking out replacement IPPS.

      1. Hurt says:

        So he wont see that as fuel?

        1. HG Tudor says:

          Well it depends how it is done. You may still provide fuel to the narcissist but as you referred to ‘messing up the golden period’ one assumed that you had managed (unlikely as it is) to cause the new IPPS to break off because they believe you and not the narcissist. Doing that is engaging with the IPPS and this does not provide fuel.

  9. MsSevyn says:

    The rush of his charm and attention is so addictive. A moth to a flame…

    1. gabbanzobean says:

      Yep! Always feeling so magetically drawn to him. It’s like my brain is been wired to crave him. Yet he’s an illusion. A mind fuck indeed.

  10. The Narcissistic Ninja.

  11. Karma says:

    My first encounter and it almost killed me! I’m 42 and will never date again! I’m happy alone…
    he never deserved me.. so simply disappear and never resurface again please!!!!
    Moving to warmer territory now… never looking back.. never …

    1. Same here. Met mine at 40, heart broken at 43, next month will be a year post discard, still hurting and recovering. I’ve had predators in many forms abuse me, but this one hurt the most. I’d take the physical violence any day because in that I struck back, fought and won some of those battles -inflicted lots of pain in retaliation. With this type, doesn’t seem like they ever lose, you can’t really hurt them because they are cowards who run, and they do way more damage than one could ever imagine because the illusions and lies blindside you. I don’t want my loved ones to ever endure this, and with my family there would be no support, no understanding. This should be part of Prevention programs offered schools.

  12. Victoria says:

    I agree with narseeker. I am a teacher to middle school children and I see the potential victims on a daily basis; there should be some kind of education to help them avoid the victimization we have been through.
    HG, could you explain why we fail to see or acknowledge what is “always there” ? I know I am a logical person and If I see this behavior in acquaintances or casual friends I do not engage with them again. So why can’t we do the same with those like you?
    Thanks,

    1. HG Tudor says:

      Various factors Victoria which relate to how manipulative we are, the fact you have a ‘need’ for someone like us and your emotional thinking clouds your judgement, the fact that you see us as such a wonderful prize (when we are spinning the illusion) that you do not want to lose us, the fact that most people are trusting and empathic people even more so and a variety of other reasons which I have set out in Danger and Sitting Target.

      1. Victoria says:

        Thanks HG. I have read “Sitting Target” Is Danger one of your books? I have not seen it on Amazon. What is the complete title? Thank you.

        1. HG Tudor says:

          Danger :50 Things You Should Not Do With a Narcissist

  13. narseeker says:

    I wish there was a way to teach this material at school. I know it might sound a little “strange” but I strongly believe that a way must be found to educate people from the beginning. This must be part of a long term curriculum. This stuff is more valuable and essential than trigonometry, astronomy or grammar. I recently met a 12 year old girl that told me about her troubles at school. A sensitive girl, a bit lonely, full of questions about the school’s rules and about her peers’ conduct: she was all : “But why this?…and why that? and how this and that make sense?”. Sadly, while listening to her I was thinking to myself: “this girl.. this girl could be a perfect victim one day, and I knew that there is nothing that I could do to prevent this.
    Your thoughts, H.G? “The Narcissistic Truths for the Young” or is it that we are doomed to suffer the abuse and then read your material in order to understand?

    1. HG Tudor says:

      I agree with you, it ought to be delivered at an early age for the purposes of education rather than waiting until people experience it.

      1. Angelique says:

        Absolutely narseeker

        but then again young or old we will always fall for their deceit, grandeur and dreamy promises…
        who wouldn’ t?

      2. VFH says:

        In relation to Narseekers point HG…..Narcissist truths for the young – YES!!! Please think on this. Happy to offer up any relevant info from a parents pov.

        1. HG Tudor says:

          Noted and thank you.

    2. VFH says:

      Wholeheartedly agree Narseeker.

      Here I am now teaching my children in order to help them heal as well as protect themselves in the future.

      My children already talk to me about their peers unacceptable behaviour “I’ll be friends with you if…..” and many examples of blameshifting/gaslighting some of which is to be expected of their age group but others definitely red flags with some individuals.

      General teaching is done along lines of “what good looks like” etc but I’ve wondered if anything more specific was taught, would this then become a learning platform for all the shapeshifters out there. My ex is a chameleon through and through. Changed his way of speaking/clothes/mannerisms. The whole shebang. Would it not enable them to be more skilled at coming in under our radar? And also on the flipside, it is a very grey area giving labels to behaviours…especially children.

      Whole other kettle of fish isn’t it? These children are the future and deserve to have everything invested in their wellbeing and education yet the funding is not there to support the infrastructure needed to back it up.

      It really is a case of learning at home and that seems to be a lucky dip from my experience!!

      1. narseeker says:

        I agree VFH, extremely difficult to teach. Specially if you are raised by a narcissistic parent. But I believe there must be a way. I believe that HG has not only the knowledge but also the creativity and entrepreneurial skills to come up with a way (maybe in the future) to make this impossible mission possible.

      2. windstorm2 says:

        VFH
        It is needed, but I agree it would be difficult and create its own problems – like all solutions do. My first thought was of manipulative children coming home, accusing their innocent parents of being abusive narcs and threatening to turn them into social services. My own opinion is it shouldn’t be taught until high school.

      3. sarabella says:

        Windstorm2

        I agree. My daughter went through a child safety program in her school. I could not figure out what had happened. One day, I am hugging her and kissing her, next day, she was “You have to ask to hug me.” Yes, true. But what had changed?! I did some digging and traced it back to the program. A well intended program to teach children body boundaries had morphed in to her being controlling and suspicious of what was once spontaneous affection. It made me very sad. I had to sit down with her and really talk to her about what the teaching was really about and get very graphic about sexual abuse for her to understand what they were trying to teach. This sadly just can’t be taught to young kids. Its much too difficult and would fail in a school environment. But a teen audience when kids are starting to date and so on would be much better. Sort of a new series of Judy Blume stories to teach it… and with HG’s story telling. it won’t save the world, but will reach some.

    3. High Octane Fuel says:

      This absolutely should be taught in schools and I can’t believe it’s not. People don’t get that there are predators living among us who come in very friendly, safe-seeming packages and blend in with society yet have a covert goal of destroying us. Psychopaths all look like Charles Manson and are murderers, we’re told. But what about the person who bakes you a pie and tells you about how they’ve been the victim all their life? We are never warned that they could be unsafe. That charming pie baker has the potential to tear out your heart, cause you to develop panic attacks, steal all your money, give you an STD, destroy your entire sense of self worth, all while remaining innocent in the eyes of others and convincing everyone that YOU are insane. And these people will never feel bad about it and enjoy your suffering as they watch you crumble. Kids need to be told! Don’t take candy from strangers, Stop Drop and Roll, and steer clear of ppl who exhibit certain narc behaviors and *trust your gut feelings* about people at all costs. Walk if it doesn’t feel right. Immediately.

    4. sarabella says:

      Yes, I suggested some time ago that HG write a book for young people, especially girls. In this day and age of the internet especially, the information is depserately needed. I knew my narc when I was 14 and he targeted me then. Fully admitting only last December an awareness of his choices then, after lying about the past all this time. He is a sick MF. And clearly, he was learning when he was young to be a sociopath. And when I mean learning, he already was, but he was learning to blend in and hide. I look back rather horrified at the fact that my first encounter with him decades ago shaped my life and view of so many things and the perspective was ALL wrong. I was the target of his abuse already and had never even known it at the time. How many lives are ruined by young people not getting that there is nothing wrong with them but there are already extremely messed up people that young which have great potential to dammage another life? Teens are not children, they are not adults and its even worse I think what can happen. They are in no man’s land in terms of not young enough to get a pass and too old to claim total ignorance and not be accountable. How many used people, pregnancies, lives already heading the wrong direction before you have a chance to even know anything really about life?

      And that little girl with all her “whys” is a truth seeker and teller. That is why she will be targeted. Sad, huh?

      1. narseeker says:

        I totally agree, Sarabella. A book for young people by HG? YES. Great idea indeed . Several misconceptions about “romantic love” have to be deconstructed (a la Foucault) and demystified. Furthermore, I agree that the concept of a sociopath (as portrayed in popular culture) needs to be deconstructed as well. It is fascinating that in order to understand narcs we need a revolution in thought. A new construction of self and of society’s premises. I thank HG for deconstructing our world view. Unfortunately (I think, unfortunately) for me, I feel like I need the existence of a N in order to be creative. Frustrating. Much to understand.

        1. sarabella says:

          I hear you on the creative part. What did Kurt Cobain say? “Thank you for the tragedy, I need it for my art.” I realized that I never needed a narc for that. I had enough childhood abuse from all sorts of people, not even narcs. Or maybe they all were. Back to that ‘child’ thing. But I don’t need anymore to add to the tragedy. I could write a book on it myself. All I need to do is tap into the depth of pain there and unmet needs and hurt… I don’t need a narc to recreate it. Not the least one who had put alot of that hurt in me once before!

          And if there is to be a revolution, then its gotta start somewhere and might as well start with me. How can I recreate that same whatever it is without one of them? Cause I really, really don’t want another one getting that near me ever again. Maybe I can create the same feeling by going on a anoerexic narc diet. Deny myself the narc I want back to mess around with almost causes the same internal dynamics which says alot about alot, doesn’t it?

          1. narseeker says:

            Thank you Sarabella, I need to hear this. In my (twisted) equation, my internal pain got mixed up with the N-inflicted pain, and also got mixed with the N internal pain. A chemical compound of sorts. You are absolutely right, I have to distill my own pain/emptiness/longing and kick out the N from it. I hope I’m not being too optimistic but I feel that something is changing since I have started to actively participate (I have been reading here for a long time).
            In Oscar Wilde’s book “De Profundis” (From the Depths), written from prison as a letter to his lover Lord Alfred Douglas (clearly a N) who totally destroyed his life, I read that after all the pain/shame/life destruction/illness that Douglas inflicted upon him, Wilde still wrote that he needed Douglas in order to be able to write, in order to be creative.
            I like the notion of an “anoerexic narc diet” . It was imposed on me via ST. The next step for me would be to actively choose to be on this “diet” and kick the N out of the equation pain-void-creativity-Narc

          2. sarabella says:

            Oddly, it was Mr Narc man himself that set me on that path himself about distilling out what he did vs what was my own life experiences. He angrily wrote me that I was placing alot of blame on him for my pain and what he said was true. I had a whole jumble of pain he activated. But wasn’t that also the point? Whether he knew it or not? Thing is he was so selfish, so childish, so calculated, so full of lies, that had he been none of that, alot of that pain would have stayed dormant. But he was right and I decided to start honoring my pain and my life as having nothing to do with him. I decided, if this whole mess was going to always hurt, was it going to hurt any more or less with him out of my life in all ways? Of course, the beginning of pulling his tendrils out of me was horrific, and that personal pain was all mixed in it, but I am at a place where I won’t ever speak to him again. Finally. And it still can hurt but I will hold on to it. Maybe even martyr it as my own and use that, without him in my life at all. In the long run, so much safer.

            It will change. Hang on to that pain now as yours, not the narcs. You earned it and survived it the hard way. Keep it alive as your life’s story, not his. That’s your power you will take back from the narc.

          3. narseeker says:

            Thank you so much Sarabella. I deeply agree and connect with your “hang on to that pain now as yours, not the narcs. Keep it alive as your life’s story, not his”. Beautiful. In my twisted perception it had been framed like this: (seduction)”finally the narc is going to fill the childhood void and emptiness” .. and then during the ST it became even more twisted: “the void and emptiness is all about and because of the narc’s disappearance and his denial of my existence as a human being”.
            It’s probably way too optimistic, but I would like to believe that a change is finally coming. And if so, it’s a blessing but it also scares me a bit: to reduce the N to his true proportions..
            Thank you.

          4. sarabella says:

            Oh, yes. He not only denied my existence once, but twice in my life. I did actually have to really connect to the first time and that was no picnic to go through those buried emotions again. And then to too late grasp what had happened the first time, make the narc connection, to have been conned out of letting him near my life, I almost didn’t make it at times. Not suicide, but I almost didn’t make it through the full body pain. In his horrid way, he taught me some things, oddly gave my the key out of his life when I was strong enough to take it and use it. It was in fact very scary to not only reduce him but to also now that I would never, ever speak to him again, once I used that key. That was the most difficult hurdle to ever overcome. I have never felt so exicted to see someone, so hopeful that he had changed, so open and boy, was I gutted by him again.But I can’t have him near my life and whether I stayed around him and felt that pain, or cut myself off, I realized it was all the same. He was never capable or ever going to love me or even like me. No matter what our history and no matter how intense it all was. So I kick him out of my heart, I feel the pain. I leave him in it, I feel the same. Not much different I found. At least with kicking him out, I have the hope that it will disappear for good one day and once I faced the fear that it would, and so would he become a memory, was when I started to shift. Its quite a story. Imagine a narc apologizing for what he did before, to only do it again, and to cause the same pain he knew he had caused once before? Takes a reall special kind of evil to do that. I wanted him to fill the void of the friendship I wanted with him that he never gave me before. The joke was on me in the end… That pain is now ours. Our old pain, our new layers. We just can’t add anymore by staying around them once you get mostly educated enough. I won’t be a volunteer to being abused by him again. I volunteered to love him and friend him. He said no. I didn’t want to volunteer to be abused by him as ‘second best’. that’s insane…

          5. narseeker says:

            You’re absolutely right: the same pain either with him or without him and it’s better without. Someone told me once that children (especially children raised in a narcissistic environment) feel that they miss their mother while being in her company and presence (!). That’s exactly how I felt with the N: missing him while being near him, because he was never really near.
            In my case, the second time he came back from his ST, no apologies were issued. Maybe once. I thought that I was the one to blame, I thought that I had hurt him. When he returned he seemed to be a different person. I found it hilarious that at the time he came back I had a very mild flu. He texted several times a day asking about my health, how are you feeling? fever? headaches? hot tea?(so worried ha ha). This, while several months before, when I tried to reach him while being hospitalized (!) he never cared to reply. And then suddenly my sneezing worries him so much. Another twisted and funny feature was this: he texted “greetings from me” “I’m checking..” like he was a robot revealing his programming code. Also, when he thought that he had conned me into believing him, he turned his head and smirked to himself in the open (instead of smirking in his mind). Nowadays I am subjected to a ST again. He “inverse-hoovers” me through posting songs and photographs. My goal is to stop looking at his social media. I know I have to, I want to, but I struggle and succumb every time I try not to peek. (My greatest achievement in this area being 52 days without snooping, but it all turned to dust – no progress there. I even tried to convince myself that I can detach and peek at the same time but, as HG rightfully claims, this is a serious mistake). Thank you

          6. gabbanzobean says:

            I struggle with social media as well. He threatened to block me once and then he did a complete 180 and took it back. He’ll like a picture on my Instagram every two months or so. I know I should unfollowed him but I just can’t bring myself to do it. Part of me is also nervous how he would react if I were to block him. I made the mistake of checking his social media last week and I learned that his daughter was in the hospital. It was all he was posting about. He must’ve wanted attention. I was tempted to reach out but I didn’t. I didn’t want to interrupt his Facebook fuel. It was a plenty!

          7. narseeker says:

            Good for you gabbanzobean. I would have reached (not that determined still, but learning). Maybe HG’s upcoming “Zero Impact” will be the cure, the needed remedy in case news from the N flow in my direction.

          8. sarabella says:

            That reminded me of when the cycle was going string, I was so anxious to hear from him. When I did, when he was available, my anxiety stayed the same. I was longing to hear from him WHILE I was talking to him. Very bizarre but I guess it was because I knew he wasn’t really there in a way

      2. Helen Damnation says:

        My research indicates a lot of victims are the high school flame of a narc. I know my Narc2 appears to think she’s The One, no matter how many times she’s fled from him.

    5. 12345 says:

      I wholeheartedly agree with you narseeker and I think you’re right to educate when they’re young. My daughter is 20 and she sees me reading HGs books and asks me why I’m reading something so dumb. (No offense HG). She’s at the age where she truly believes she knows everything. I’ve been there. She is past the teachable stage by her mom. But adolescents aren’t. They’re little sponges. Maybe couple it with a class on stranger danger.

      1. narseeker says:

        Or maybe even a computer game, a fun game (albeit sophisticated) in which the basic “Narcissistic Truths” have to be found/detected/applied. Truths like “I get you” “you are my Soulmate” “before you I had nothing” “let’s move in together” .H G Tudor could be a character/hero/savior/devil/angel/genie, we could have “narc-busters”, terminators, Lessers, Mid-rangers, Greaters, silent treatments, scoring points for succeeding in hoovering (if we choose to play a Narc character).. I think there is potential there, but I have no knowledge or enough creative ideas how to design such a game to drive HG’s teachings home. But it makes me feel playful and hopeful.

        1. Indy says:

          Narseeker!!!

          OMG I LOVE this idea!!! A video game with a lil HG popping up to tell us what we missed or magically sending us to other “spheres of influence” with other scenarios!!! Oh please make this!

          1. narseeker says:

            Indy, please convince HG!!
            Initially I thought about it in the context of a “Narcissist for the Young” package, but I would Love to be able to play this game, designed right, it can be extremely fun, deep and sophisticated. I can think of computer people that might be able to help. But of course it depends on the Head Games master . Would you have a word with him?

    6. Indy says:

      There are some (not exhaustive) things that we can teach children (and it needs to be done in my opinion) to protect them.

      Here are a few things I think that are needed:

      Teach them boundaries(bodily, emotional, social, etc), healthy boundaries and model them. None of this parent as a “best friend” or allowing a child the rule of the land. Also teach them how to stand up for their own boundaries with others.

      Teach them about the importance and value of the word “no”. And model it.

      Teach them about their own emotions, naming them, identifying them, validating them…and how to listen to them and their gut. And how to soothe their own emotions when needed.

      Model unconditional regard/love for the child.

      Teach them to self-soothe, rather than become attached to addictions later.

      And, especially for those children in homes with narcissistic parents, available role models and mentors need to be encouraged and used by the healthy parent.

      Get them into some sort of self-defence and teach them to stand up for themselves when wronged.

      Of course, teaching those red flags helps, depending on the age of the child and how much they understand. I think teens in the dating world could use a primer on learning on how to identify emotional/physical predators.

      These are just a few that we can do as parents, mentors, teachers, therapists, etc for the future kiddos. It takes a village and all of us can help. Start with yourselves to model healthy living….and mentor.

      1. 12345 says:

        Hi Indy, I agree with your post. Sadly, only healthy parents can give their children those things. I’m afraid the majority of parents aren’t healthy. Maybe that’s not true. I hope its not. I certainly have nothing to back that statement up.

        I never knew to tell anyone that both my parents (narcissist and sociopath) and subsequent step-fathers were crazy because I thought everyone had parents like that. It was normal to have a calm life in public and terror in private. Their friends/family had no clue what they were like because they never saw the mask slip. My father was a pastor in public but used his fists to communicate with his children in private; my first stepfather was an elder in the church but a pedophile in private, my second stepfather was Mother Theresa to all in public but verbally abusive in private. My mother is a classic southern bell who honey/darlin’d everyone in her path in public and private but she saves a special kind of hell for private times only.

        1. windstorm2 says:

          I completely agree. They don’t teach parenting in the schools either. If we never were taught or experienced those things, we don’t even know them ourselves – much less how to teach them to our children. When I was reading Indy’s list, I was wondering what my life would be like if I’d ever learned those things myself. Don’t have a clue. It’s like trying to imagine what my life would have been like if I’d grown up in a completely different culture I haven’t even studied. Probably a lot better, but no way to tell.

          1. VFH says:

            Hi Everyone……such an emotive subject and so many layers. The subject of mental health is rising up the public agenda which is reassuring, especially the subject of emotional abuse, although it’s just a fledgling and by what I’ve read of any cases so far there’s certainly a long way to go. But a beginning is still a beginning…..

            I recently read a book called The Gift of Fear by Gavin de Becker (sorry if I’m not allowed to name drop HG….I guess I’ll know if it’s OK due to you publishing my post or not….) I literally couldn’t put it down from page 1 – the first book I’ve been able to concentrate on since “Him” and I used to be such a book worm!

            Anyway, i found it very empowering – refreshing in his depiction of women in society and being able to take back our power so to speak. Highly recommend it and will also give it to my children to read when they’re of an appropriate age.

        2. Indy says:

          Hi 12345,
          You are totally correct. Most are not taught this and many families have unhealthy dynamics. Mine certainly was not healthy. Only after I got therapy and started my own healing could I do half of these. It is an ideal lust. One we first have to learn ourselves to model. These are skills that a good therapist can teach families and communities. I’ve always said, DBT (the type of therapy I do)is life skills 101. I had to go through DBT personally before teaching it professionally…this stuff needs to be in the water, it is so needed.

          So, no, many adults do not know it and we need to teach it once we can practice and model it in our own lives to lil kids. I didn’t know either, trust me. Why else do you think I am drawing predators and narcissists in my life lol I’m still working on me. However it doesn’t mean we cannot share this with kids too well we are learning this as well. This is why I am so passionate about health he mentors for children. When the home is not safe or healthy, somebody outside the family may be able to offer Hope.

      2. VFH says:

        I said somewhere else on the blog in reply to another thread that I wish there was just more kindness in the world and I feel that’s at the root of teaching our children too. Not being woolly or idealistic (someone tore me down for saying it….) but basically if we put kindness first, everything good will follow.

        So we have names for these things now and I’m trying to teach them all to my children – boundaries, the power or “no”, owning our mistakes etc – but basically if we teach our children kindness (to themselves and others) that brings all the above into effect by default.

        Before my relationship with my ex, I hadn’t ever experienced his type of behaviour before but certainly people had been shades of it and I’d thought simply that some people were just a bit mean, or weird. Like how they’d been a full on friend then dropped off the face of the planet, other people I’d thought of as friends had been strangely distant and then come back around etc

        Well now I think they were narcs!! And the weirdness was me having been smeared or triangulated! Is anyone “just mean”??

        Is narcissism Having a Moment due to the modern age of selfie obsessed, post every second of your life online, social media fascination? The murderous cults we’ve seen on the news over years; headed by Greater Narcs I presume? Especially the ones with the tractor beam stares.

        We definitely are a village here…I have that uneasy feeling creeping in again though. The one that was triggered by HGs Personal Jesus post. It basically amounts to the fight between good and evil. The ball is rolling isn’t it HG?

        1. Indy says:

          Hi VFH,
          Kindness seems to be a “lost art” at times, huh? I agree, teaching kindness, acceptance and tolerance is so needed and missing in our selfie culture. Now, I will say this—we can be too kind too. I used to get in trouble with being too “helpful” or too “kind”. Some people can see this and know, Ah, here is someone I can “use” in my life. Balance is key too. I was told as a child to “be good” or I will “burn in hell”. It created this fear in me of “being bad” and I was primed for developing co-dependent behaviors (rescuing others, being overly selfless, not speaking up, not setting boundaries with others).
          I like the strong yet kind , assertive yet soft woman I have eventually become. Parenting is never perfect. What I hope for is to help children develop enough coping and self-esteem skills to survive our imperfections πŸ˜‰

          1. windstorm2 says:

            Indy, your earlier self-description sounds an awful lot like me- always trying to be good and helpful, no boundaries and often taken advantage of. I’m glad you’re happy with the woman you’ve become. I’m still a work in progress. No real clue how to set boundaries (other than physical distance) and still can’t hardly say “no.” But I’m a lot better and happier than I’ve ever been. We’re all on the road to improvement, HG too. 😊

          2. Indy says:

            Hi Windstorm,
            Isn’t it amazing that we all can find so many similarities between our own backgrounds and struggles as well. It speaks to the profiles of individuals that narcissists target, for sure….or the long term effects of childhood neglect, abuse or mistreatment in some sort of manner. Yes, we all are individuals though I often relate and share so many similarities to others here as well. It is not just the narcissist that seem to be made from the same mold, huh?

            I am so glad to here you are on the healing journey too. I, too, am a work in progress and, as I said to another blogger, not sure if I will ever “graduate”. But, this is OK, as this is life, right? Always learning, growing and getting stronger!

            Best to you,
            Indy

          3. windstorm2 says:

            Hey Indy, glad to hear from you. I always enjoy reading your comments for your ideas and insights (I started studying Reiki 😊). Yes we are all similar in so many ways and for many different reasons. And hopefully our growth as people never ends. Like they say, “Life’s a journey, not a destination.” That’s true for spirituality, recovery, education…so many things! Have a great weekend!

          4. VFH says:

            Hi Indy

            Yes it is important isn’t it…and I agree with you on the whole being too kind thing. As I read your reply this really resonated with me….

            I too was like that, especially when a bit younger, certainly before children. Always quick to offer a helping hand, too quick on occasion because it either wasn’t something I could back up easily or even might have regretted after. I think I was doing it for the wrong reasons….bit uncomfortable to admit but I think I was was doing it to ingratiate myself as this is how I perhaps thought – subconsciously – I could get people to like me. I definitely didn’t have healthy boundaries…in fact I have probably only just started to build some in the process of helping my children to heal and protect themselves. I’ve not been confident in the art of saying No, again probably seeing it subconsciously as something that might result in me being disliked. I’m not like that now, in healing from my ex I’ve definitely grown a pair and can’t be arsed putting on my party face if something doesn’t work for me I’m able to explain why and feel confident in my decision. In the main.

            Blimey I’m learning about myself as I even write this to you! No wonder my ex was attracted to me!! I always thought of myself as a strong independent woman (before my ex and one that i trust i will become again) but I clearly didn’t think that much of myself before did I.

            I wonder why….

            Hmm.

            Hats off to you for becoming the woman you’ve become too, your children are lucky you are so grounded. Parenting isn’t easy at the best of times, let alone in the face of narc adversity. I hope I can educate mine to not only enjoy and survive the big wide world but also to not suffer too much because of my own inadequacies.

      3. Dr. Harleen Quinzel PsyD says:

        Indy,

        ::Clap clap::

      4. narseeker says:

        I totally agree with you. Healthy boundaries are the key. I have struggled to apply those boundaries as a mother. The love, sensitivity, open lines for communication are there but the task is often self-defeating (when you haven’t been raised according to those healthy boundaries as a child). I’m learning. I agree with your notion of mentors and role models for children in homes with narcissistic parents.

        1. Indy says:

          Hi Narseeker, I too am learning. I was not raised with healthy boundaries, some extra stiff ones and some that did not exist that should have. It takes a life time of practice when we are raised without certain things. I, for example, still practice saying “no”. Its hard.

          My son, who is now an adult with a child, was raised with looser limits than I would do now. We have very open communication lines and a very tight bond, but even my son tells me I should have “smack his bum” a few times as a kid LOL (something I never did, nor do I promote in all situations.) He now raises his son with very strict boundaries, he’s a loving and tough parent. Nana (me), is a bit of a softy. πŸ˜‰

          Good for you on learning and being on this journey as well!
          I think one of the reasons I “escaped” my small town was because of a mentor/teacher of mine, an art teacher that believed in me. They make a big difference!
          Best,
          Indy

  14. They’re bloody everywhere !!
    I think the stats on Ns play down the estimated numbers massively. Or maybe I’m just in all the wrong places haha

    Thanks to you HG I can always spot them.

    Some are very obvious from the outset.

    Others are sneaky little buggars, but the red flags do wave eventually and pretty early on once you start to get to know them properly.

  15. Jane says:

    He still haunts my dreams. I never had night paralysis/ terrors before him.

    1. Gabrielle says:

      Jane,
      Ditto. πŸ™

      1. HEN says:

        Wonder why this is. I have dreams or wake up thinking of him a few nights a week. Creepy.

    2. sarabella says:

      Yes, I still wake up startled at times. When the PTSD was at its highest, I was waking terrorized every 2 hours. Since my “relationship” was primarily virtual with 3 visits, and an old history, this can give you a sense of how awful it is, that I could be so profoundly affected so far away. I have gotten rid of one of the more powerful tethers (facebook) but still, I feel him invade me. I can’t tell if he is or if I am still doing this. I have a friend who would say he is, that evil is like this. He chose evil once, and evil now works through him and with him. And that is what continues to chase me…

  16. giulia says:

    Yes, I saw them and I stopped. I didn’t know I had to evaporate. I would evaluate the situation, sometimes acting like a friend, in a neutral way.
    That only pissed him more.
    I think I got the worst treatment of all.
    I kept some sort of awareness and I had to be punished for it.

  17. ballerina9 says:

    HG,Β 
    Typo in the meme. Should be “failED”.Β 
    See…we’re “Tudorized” now (or do you prefer Tudorised?)Β 
    Ready to playΒ Whac-A-Mole with your kind. Bring it on.

  18. Lou says:

    The Communists?

  19. 1jaded1 says:

    Or we ignore and face the consequences….next….that’s .okay. If I would ignored them, i wouldn’t have popped into your world to annoy you.., our paths never would have crossed…or would they? Bwahaha.

  20. High Octane Fuel says:

    No, we do see them. We know the person is odd and things don’t add up but we give people the benefit of the doubt until they prove otherwise. Plus, the seduction feels so damn good – easy, comfortable, safe, warm. Everything we want and we don’t even have to try. Too good to be true.

  21. Jaeger says:

    Thanks to you This doesn’t have to be the truth. You are a great teacher. Just look out for poison apples. Some of your students could be a bit shady. 🍎

  22. Yeah. I had to get pregnant and be devalued to see it. Then I had to get a mere text message for my birthday, while I was pregnant to see it. That was it. No contact from then on.

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