Why Won’t He Leave Me Alone?



If you find yourself receiving the repeated attentions of somebody, there is a solid chance that this person is a narcissist and one of our kind. The attention that is being given to you may take a variety of different forms. It may manifest as complimenting you, offering to take you out for dinner, asking you for a date, sending you amorous texts, leaving gifts at your workplace, standing and watching you, driving past your house repeatedly, damaging your property, covering your car in battery acid, throwing pain at your windows, calling you names, repeatedly ringing your phone and not speaking and a thousand other different ways. To an outsider some of these behaviors may have the appearance of trying to seduce you and others are clearly designed to frighten and intimidate. Ultimately, both will be unwelcome and the individual who keeps persisting in this behavior is more often than not a narcissist. You may have worked this out and you are entirely clear as to what they are as they try to draw you back into the relationship or make your life a living hell. It is highly unlikely that you will know that the first time seducer is actually one of us, no matter how persistent that person is. You are far more likely to decide that the person is infatuated, obsessed, a stalker or a bit odd. Narcissist is not going to be the label you apply. Not when it happens for the first time.

Why then do we engage in such persistent behaviour? Why do we try and seduce and woo you into entering into a Formal Relationship, to draw you back in to one or just to make your life a misery?

  1. The First Seduction

It may seem pleasant at first to receive this attention even though you are not interested and with a smile you turn down the overtures of the office Romeo. He persists in keep asking you out. He is always polite and charming but you do not wish to say no. You may have a partner already, not be interested in dating or just find this person not to your liking. You keep rebuffing this person, sometimes more firmly than on other occasions but he will not take no for an answer. There should be a picture of this man or woman in the dictionary under ‘persistence’. They are never horrible, never nasty but you start to get that sensation of dread now whenever you see him or her coming down the corridor towards you, or walking down your garden path or their number appears on your ‘phone. You do not want to be unpleasant about it, because you can see they are, apparently, a pleasant person, but it is starting to become something that is unwelcome. Why will this person not get the message.

  1. Our sense of entitlement means that if we decide we want something, then we get it. It does not matter what anybody else says or wants, we are entitled to do what we want. We want to seduce you and make you our primary appliance. Accordingly, we will keep going until we achieve this or we decide against doing so. What you say to us or what a third party might do will not dissuade us.
  2. We do not recognise boundaries and therefore we can come and park our tanks on your lawn. We want you as an extension of ourselves and we do not regard there as being any boundary to prevent us from doing so.
  3. You have been identified by us as a potentially brilliant source of fuel. We undertake planning before we make our move and also rely on instinct in identifying those who serve out needs the most effectively. The extent of the planning will vary dependent on the type of narcissist, but one way or another you have been spotted as a supertanker of fuel and we want that fuel, thus you have to become our primary source. The prize is well worth expending the effort. Thus, if you cannot understand why we just keep going and going, you may wish to consider whether it is who you are that is attracting us to such a degree. You may think you are something of a catch and viewed by the ‘normals’ you are, but to us it is your status as a provider of fuel that has caught our eye. This behaviour appears mainly by Mid-Range and Greater Narcissists because they are able to last longer using secondary sources for their fuel supply whilst they continue the hunt with you.
  4. It may be that the way you are engaging with us, even though you are trying to tell us that you are not interested, is what continues to have us pressing you. If you smile when we appear with some flowers and you thank us for them but politely let us know you do not want a date, you are still giving us fuel. If you giggle with your friends when we perform some silly romantic gesture at the door of your workplace, then we receive fuel. Even if you show irritation or perhaps begin to shout that we should leave you alone, you are providing fuel. This both sustains us and encourages us.
  5. A further alternative is that we are obtaining fuel elsewhere, this is most likely to be from devaluing the current primary appliance and so long as this fuel is being provided then the pursuit will continue. We can keep chipping away at your resistance for a long time, since we are getting fueled elsewhere and this is sustaining our endeavours to secure you as the replacement primary source. If there is any kind of engagement on your behalf, even if fuel is not being provided, although it usually is, you are providing encouragement that a breakthrough may occur.

How then do you stop this narcissist from keep trying to seduce you? You need to give NoFuC. This stands for No Fuel Carrier. You must shut off the fuel, avoid any engagement and demonstrate that there will be no fuel provided. You will not smile, you will not say thanks but no thanks, you will not tell us to piss off or shout angrily for us to leave us alone. You will not accept the gifts, you will not acknowledge us, you will block all calls and insert gatekeepers where you can. By giving NoFuC, the narcissist who was gaining fuel from the interaction will break off and go elsewhere. If there is no means of contact, or very little, this combined with an absence of fuel will also dissuade us. If we are gaining fuel still elsewhere, if it is impossible or hard to contact you and there is no evidence of fuel being available, we are likely to test your resolve but ultimately with no potential for fuel, we will shift out focus somewhere else.

Ensuring you give NoFuC and doing so consistently is the key to dissuading the narcissist who is trying to seduce you for the first time. This is of course if you are fortunate enough not to be interested, since nearly all targets are interested and thus susceptible to being seduced and that you recognise what you are dealing with.

  1. Post Escape

In this instance you are more likely, albeit not guaranteed, to know that you are dealing with one of our kind. What is happening when we will not leave you alone when you have escaped us?

  1. You may be experiencing the Initial Grand Hoover. If the attempts to contact you and establish the Formal Relationship again are taking place soon after your escape, they are intense and repeated in nature and you feel like you are under siege, then this is the IGH. To deal with this you need to maintain no contact and sit the blitzkrieg out. Dependent on the type of narcissist you are dealing with and the availability of other fuel sources, the IGH can be sustained for a number of weeks. More usually it is a concentrated blast over a week or so and then if your resolve holds, there will be a respite as we withdraw and seek fuel elsewhere to recover from the diminution in our supply caused by your escape. You need to put your tin hat on and hunker down.
  2. If it is not the IFH but the behaviour towards you is pleasant and/or aimed at getting you to come back to us, you are experiencing a Benign Follow Up Hoover. The BFUH can happen repeatedly too. It is less intense but can appear on and off over years. Why is this happening?

Firstly, you must be activating the Hoover Trigger by entering one of the five spheres of influence. Are you responding to messages, are you contacting the narcissist about something, are you passing near where he lives or works, are you fraternizing with people who know him or her? You need to ascertain which sphere or spheres of influence you are entering and stay out of them.

If you do this and the BFUHs keep happening, then you are appearing in the sixth sphere which is our mind. Usually this is only sporadic because we will be occupied with other fuel sources, but it can be the case that if you were/are a particularly good fuel source once you appear in the sixth sphere you become lodged there and the trigger keeps getting activated.

That alone of course is not enough to bring about the hoover. The Hoover Execution Criteria has to be met as well. It is obviously being met if you keep experiencing these BFUHs and what usually causes the criteria to be met is that some fuel is being provided which encourages us to keep pressing for more.

You need to ascertain how this fuel is being caused. There are three potential reasons

Proximate Fuel – you are having some interaction with us which allows us to draw fuel from you. This might be when you are passing where we work, when there is a handover of children or such like. This will then allow the criteria to be easily met and thus you can expect BFUHs to occur. Turn off the provision of proximate fuel. Avoid us or where that is not possible, ensure no or very little fuel is provided when there is proximate interaction.

Thought Fuel – we may be encouraged by the Thought Fuel that we obtain from perceiving how you are reacting to our interactions. If we believe, based on previous experience, you will smile when you get the flowers or you will think back to when we were together when we drop a CD of a certain song through your letterbox, this will encourage us. Thought Fuel has a limited shelf life and if it is this which is giving us the encouragement, by sitting it out, its effect will dissipate and the criteria will no longer be met.

Proxy Fuel – you have a traitor in your camp. It may be someone well-intentioned or someone deliberately spying on you, but this individual is feeding to us your reactions to what we are doing. We do not see your emotional reaction, we do not purely envisage it, but someone is telling us that you keep talking about us, you get upset when our name is mentioned and so forth. This encourages us and allows the criteria to be met. You need to work out who this is and prevent them from relaying this information to us, either through asking them to stop or more usually by not giving them the information in the first place.

If you halt the trigger and even if you have a narcissist who is stuck in the sixth sphere, if you prevent the provision of the above types of fuel, this will be more likely to prevent the criteria being met. No trigger or a trigger and no criteria being met means no more hoovers and you will be left alone.

  1. The Malign Follow-Up Hoover

There is no desire to resurrect the Formal Relationship. We do not want positive fuel from you in any event. We want to hurt you, make you cry, make you angry, make you scared. Whatever it is, we want your negative response as this will allow us to draw negative fuel from you and also punish you.

Again, prevent the triggers by staying out the sphere of influence. The Malign FUH causes a real problem because the narcissist may remain stuck in the sixth sphere through malice and if he is gaining fuel from a new primary source, there is a greater risk of the narcissist having sufficient fuel to keep trying with you. Thus with the malign FUH the threshold for the hoover execution criteria is often lower. This is why when you have somebody who is doling out malign FUHs against you, it can appear overwhelming, incessant and frenzied. The thought fuel is also stronger with this type of FUH.

Avoid the triggers. If you are and they are still happening, it is clear the sixth sphere is being activated. Make yourself hard to contact, avoid providing fuel as described above and eventually the need for fuel and the lack of it from you, will cause you to be left alone, but you should be aware that the propensity to be stuck in the sixth sphere, the availability of other fuel and the lowered criteria threshold can result in a very rough ride for some people, not all, but some.

  1. Post discard

There will be no IGH when this happens because we chose to discard you. You will face Benign FUHs and/or Malign FUHs dependent on the type of narcissist and the prevailing situation. The same considerations apply as described above.

Ultimately, we will not leave you alone because of the prospect of fuel and the taste of fuel that is being provided in the meanwhile. This is what drives us to keep harassing, contacting and pestering you, but as ever, there are steps you can take. Understand why it is happening and then you can establish what action needs to be taken. It may be maintaining your defences, preserving no contact and sitting out the storm or it may also require proactive steps on your part.


73 thoughts on “Why Won’t He Leave Me Alone?”





    1. Run run run as fast as you can the only way can converse is if you have some level of emotional detachment.

      I am not completely detached and spoke with him twice in 6 weeks and both times it’s left me feeling shitty but my curiosity has had me wanting to test HGs information but even doing it from a detached place will mess you up

  2. Caroline,

    I thought you were pretty funny, but, yeah, if doing what makes sense doesn’t work with a narcissist, why not try superstition? Others have been doing it for millennia, must be something to it. LOL

    As for the “knocking on wood” You are not going to want to get close enough to your N’s head for the rapping on it to be effective enough for the superstition to work. His gaining fuel negates the knock on his noggin.

    You’ll have to pardon me, I’m tired and in a good mood.

    On the not recalling devaluation, maybe you haven’t noticed it in context of the push/pull. Arguing and making up constantly puts you off balance. If arguments are started as verbal attacks or become verbal attacks/abuse I think that is devaluation. The make up is distraction so you try to forgive and forget, as a lot of us have been taught. Incidents fade in memory, but sometimes are triggered to return.
    Sometimes you don’t remember specifics, because “It’s just another dumb argument” according to family of origin dynamics.

    Now back to protection spells:

    If your N’s name gets said 3 times, or you accidentally speak or think of them, you first stand straight with arms at side. Say your power word while moving your arms slowly about you, make the shape of a sphere, then add the phrase ” No contact. My force field will now be applied and unyielding”. Let me know if it works!

    1. Thanks, Perse. I think the biggest reason why he is unrelenting now is because he figures I’m just being my usual “spirited” (or “difficult,” depending on his aggravation level) self. He’s used to this quality about me, so it’ll probably take more time for him to really get that I’m not playing around.

      Sorry about the rather confusing “rut roh” comment I left, if you even saw it. It had nothing to do with you. I just realized that I can be rather dismissive/wounding of the upper echelon narcissists… something I’m unaware of sometimes, like it’s instinctive… and sometimes it’s because they bring out a bratty/defiant side of me. In any case, I realized I can even do it on the blog. So at least I’m aware of it.

      Anyway, thanks much for taking the time for me. I really appreciate it, and hey, if something works or empowers, I’m for it. 🙂

      I’m not in a great mood either… I’ve had a killer sinus pressure headache for three days, and I have to travel this week.

  3. My IGH was intense. 3 months of malign and benign. Push me, pull me, as I fought to get myself together. No Contact now fully in place… things are all quiet on the home front! YAY, for now

      1. Oh no! You jinxed yourself! My friends and I call my narc Beetlejuice… any time someone says his name three times, he hoovers…. damnedest thing. I’m in the throes of malign hoovers right now and I just don’t get it. Hope you survived yours and can keep your NC relatively in tact. I’m holding on by my fingertips today.

        1. “Shark-and-Grace”…I know, right?

          I feel rather ill at ease… every single time I have stated something positive in my efforts to get my narcissist off my tail, something less-than-good occurs. And now, with Jasmine.:-(

          (I’m pleased to report all is, pretty much, a screwy mess for me right now).

    1. Jasmine,
      I’m starting to think that when we say something positive about out situation with out narcissists, we should immediately:
      -knock on wood
      -sprinkle salt over our shoulder
      -wear a garlic necklace

      Ok…let’s just go with those first two…because we are feminine, pretty, powdery-fresh creatures…so that garlic thing just isn’t right.

      1. Yeah.. ew on the garlic 😜 I prefer tossing sparkles and clicking my heels 3xs.
        ::fairy dust, fairy dust::

        Hoover was twarted. The most he’ll get out of me is thought fuel. I just wish I could stay out of that 6th sphere!

        It’s more aggravating than anything kimi. He can’t contact me directly without incurring legal problems for himself, and I’m staying far away.

        Sorry to hear you’re having a bad time of it Snark&Grace. Malign Hoovers are wretched. *HUGS for you. 💞 XOXO

        Can’t escape them.. even if we isolate ourselves. UGH. Why HG?? WHY do you torture us so?

      2. Oh, those superstitious protection spells! LOL!

        I always wondered if they work?

        Not to laugh at you, but my narc always said he was NOT superstitious, but if salt was spilled, he INSISTED the spillee pinch up some of the salt and throw it over their left shoulder. I don’t know why this caused him to act so, if he was not superstitious. He actually put his arm around me so I could not get away, grabbed my hand and forced to the salt on the tabletop, yelling at me that I HAD BETTER PICK UP SOME OF THAT SALT AND THROW IT OVER MY LEFT SHOULDER RIGHT NOW OR SOMETHING BAD WILL HAPPEN TO ME!!!

        So I did. But he was still there, so throwing salt doesn’t work.

        Just want to let you know…. 😉

        1. Hey, Perse~I was mainly trying to make Jasmine laugh, but I guess I am a bit superstitious, because I do the “knock on wood” thing sometimes. But yeah…hasn’t worked on my narcissist either — he’s not given up yet. (And he thinks *I’m* stubborn? Yeah, ok…whatever).

          I was just thinking about something, and I wondered if you’d have an opinion. Do you think it’s odd that I can’t define/recall devaluation periods (like I’ve read on here) when I dated the narcissist (steadily) for 3 years? Do you think it’s possible for the turbulence of the push/pull of arguments + making up (cycling continually, for the last year with him) can be a substitute for devaluation? Can it be its own sort of devaluation?

  4. Dear HG, What about the hoovering of escapee secondary sources – is there an end date to the hoovering, particularly when there is plenty of other fuel? I do NoFuC really well, but I do question the wisdom of this in the workplace. I also think it has created this ‘thing’ between us ( I’m a challenge) & wonder if low contact + politeness would have killed it. Have you written anything on working with the narcissist? There are loads of bodies there too! Thankyou.

    1. No, there is no end but likelihood is governed by Hoover Triggers and the Hoover Execution criteria being met.

  5. I’d dealt with narc abuse by being married to one. Did all the proper recovery work. Life was good. What has landed me here – a gift from the universe perhaps – was reconnecting via social media with someone I met in a chatroom years ago when the Internet was fairly new and people actually used their real full names. I found my old flirty chatroom friend on Facebook and, not knowing his relationship status, (if it had said married or in a relationship, I would not have initiated contact) sent a non-flirty message saying I’d hoped the years (over 15) had been good to him. Not being particularly ‘social media’ tech savvy, I didn’t realize Facebook messages from non-friends didn’t appear in your main ‘inbox’. So, it was a few weeks later when I discovered multiple messages from him inquiring why I had reached out but now couldn’t be bothered with a reply.

    Someday I’ll tell my pathetic ‘love’ story, either as a letter to the narc or to HG by way of consultation or both. After reading here post mortem, I feel so stupid for falling for it all, both times. But I also feel I should have known better the second time, because of ex husband. I just feel the advancement of social media added a new layer of intricacy. I’m choosing to embrace this latest narc encounter as a beacon which led me to this place and further fortifications.

    Thank you HG for spending your valuable time educating us.

  6. Hi HG! I was wondering if you had an idea of what could happen next? My narc recently called (hoovered)and apologize about how he treated me in the past and he said that when we worked together, he said he always said to our coworkers how I was a good worker.

    1. I would need more information about the scenario and therefore a consultation is the appropriate forum.

      1. Thanks for responding! I was getting a little worried that I would not hear from you. I would love a consultation in the near future. Thanks so much HG

  7. Dear Mr Tudor,
    Moral of your article … beware the “bearer of gifts”, compliments and attention ! Run rabbit run 🐰😱 I think my low heel homey peds got stuck in the grate when I attempted to run, I tripped and couldn’t get up from too many cups of tea n biccies resulting in weak knees n wrists or just being a tad too rounded 😂
    Valentines Day is approaching and a “just off the press” recent survey was done on morning tv. One question they asked females was “what are you giving your valentine “and the majority answered “they are the gift”

      1. That they are narcissistic 🤔… Greaters ?
        or is this a trick question 😂
        See, now I’m doubting myself … it said the majority, does that mean all those who took part are narcs or have healthy narc qualities or women who have seized the power or they can’t afford pressies? Do narcs even bother to do these surveys?
        I should always go with my initial gut response, final answer ….
        Lock in … female narcissists , please Mr Tudor

  8. Is it normal to go back and forth between he is not a full blown narcissist to deciding he definitely is? Have any others experienced that confusion of not being sure? I experienced the golden period for over 6 months, I was not devalued as such, alothough i did experience the rage. We broke up and got back together more than 4 times after the 6 month period and each time I truly believed it was all my fault! It’s only when he came back to punish me 6 months after the official last breakup that I began reading about narcissism. I have a feeling he will be back because he was obsessed with me but for now we have blocked each other and I know he has no new IPPS (although I suspect this may be currently his mother) but I do believe there are many others that have experienced the same treatment from him and I have a strong feeling he is speaking to or even meeting other women, he has not made anything public though?

  9. HG, I’m thinking about boundaries. I realise that you don’t acknowledge any boundaries in a narcissistic relationship; that we’re just an extension of yourself which implies that we’re dehumanised and seen as appliances because you can’t/won’t accept us as human beings with our own right to thoughts and feelings separate from you; and I also realise that this stems from a lack of empathy and conscience. But you are aware; you know that your reality is not our reality, and if the whole world around you is then seen as “peopled” with appliances then you are in effect the only “real” person around or are there people you do recognise boundaries with more than others without it being part of a power play? Do you ever see anyone’s boundaries?

    1. I do not see many boundaries, I see some and I ignore them unless it serves a purpose to pay lip service to them.

  10. So, 2 questions for you hg: Malign hoover. If i cry and you, “win”, do you leave? After you “punish are you ok?

    1. It depends on the school of narcissist, the composition of the fuel matrix, the fuel level and the relevant circumstances.
      For example, a Mid Range Narcissist issues a malign hoover in order to extract fuel and assert his superiority. The victim gets upset, apologises and accepts what they said was untrue. The MRN has acquired fuel, feels superiority has been asserted and therefore ceases the malign hoover.
      A Greater wants more fuel and therefore whilst superiority has been asserted from the tears and apologies, he continues the malign hoover to punish and gain more fuel.

  11. I am reading Fuel right now and this article is a nice compliment to that. So far, the book has been excellent. I get a kick out of the various ways you explain this relative material.

    I was surprised to find that you even created a mathematical equation, of sorts. As if the narcissist doesn’t take up enough of the ole grey matter, now I find myself crunching numbers for him!

    But I must say, your point system is clever and cute… as it does help to better understand the potency of fuel. So I’m feeling informed and entertained. That’s almost as good as Hoover Fuel.

      1. It’s cute when a Brit says “Jolly good,”… but is just *wrong* when an American does.

        (“Not that I’m American,” says trenchcoat-wearing Caroline, her sunglasses firmly in place).

          1. Well spotted, I did sneer as I read it but I resisted writing a comment at the time.

          2. BlackUnicorn,
            Oh right, the narcissism thing… by it being “cute,” I meant, uh…insidious yet alarming. There. Fixed it. lol.

          3. Oh, and BlackUnicorn…I really love “Blimey”!

            I’m going to find a way to get that into a conversation tomorrow, even if people look at me oddly…

            “Oh, Blimey! Rain again?”

            “Blimey! I’m late for another meeting.”

            (Did I use it correctly?)

          4. Hi Caroline, sorry for the late reply, I’ve been away. I’m now sat down with my cup of tea 😉, and can confirm the correct usage of the exclamation, “blimey!” 😉😂

      2. Oh no… sometimes I find myself saying it out loud when reading Metro while sitting on the loo. But I won’t dare touch toilet paper from that side of the pond.

      3. Just to clarify: I hope I didn’t offend any European toilet paper manufacturers. I’m sure it’s a fine product. I was only referring to HG’s admission of his paper tainting abilities. Botulism, I believe it was?

        I was referring to “jolly good.” But I must confess that I really don’t say it, nor have I ever read Metro… even if it is full of salacious, interesting gossip.
        (And if it’s a reputable paper, apologies again!)

        But when I also used the word cute, I don’t have a good save there Caroline. I meant it as adorable, endearing, sweet. Maybe HG needs a kitten or something to soften him up a bit. Awww.

          1. Oh, so that adorable Norwegian Forest kitten I sent you won’t be cuddled nightly?

            Oh, please…on all things sacred in the universe, do not put a curse on me, HG.

      4. And by kitten, I meant a baby cat… feline… no Freudian slip there.

        Jeez. I must really be an empath… an over-explaining one. Sooo, before I make things worse, I think I’ll just hope off of here and go hug a tree or something.

      5. Hop*
        Yeah, even my phone knows I can’t shake the hope thing. I give up.

        Thank you for your time today.
        I’ll be outside.

      6. Ha ha.. I called mine cute when I saw his photo on the dating site where we met. It almost cost me the whole relationship; he was SO insulted by it, stating angrily that he’s a man and not a puppy. Now I’m kind of sorry it actually didn’t get rid of him; it would’ve spared me lots of pain. And no, sorry to say, but you’re most definitely not a man. A real man doesn’t emotionally or physically abuse the woman he proclaims he loves; a real man doesn’t treat her like his property and a real man doesn’t mistake control for love. He’s a loser; and not even that cute anymore;)

        1. Hi, Miss Catherine!

          My narcissist (I hate saying “my,” as I don’t actually claim him, lol) didn’t mind any of my “cute” references… hmm… interesting.

          And yes — your narcissist IS a loser. He was mean to you. He, therefore, sucks. And just look at your pretty hair — what a special beast he was to not appreciate all your beauty, inside and out… they do lose out, and it is sad.

      7. Hi Miss Caroline,
        Aww, that’s so sweet of you. We’re all special and they’re all beasts not deserving our attention (sorry HG). He actually got so angry from me calling him cute that I never did it again.. ha ha..

      8. Ladies, I really don’t understand their disdain for the word cute. But again, there’s plenty about narcissists that I don’t understand.

        And I agree, Caroline… that’s a gorgeous head of hair. But I’m most impressed with the arm placement. I think we might have a yoga master on our hands.

        It makes sense. Mind – Body – Spirit… a lovely practice, suitable for any variety of empath.


        1. I’m thinking it’s most likely about what their aims are at the moment/what they can get out of it, BKK. So, for instance, my narcissist soaked up my finding cuteness in (or about) him to his power advantage…

          But the G-r-e-a-t-e-r we have here on site isn’t going to want anyone to think he’s soft (which he isn’t) — or for anyone to think the little Caroline empath can get away with an “aw, it’s cute how you talk” comment. He could let it go until someone pointed it out.

          1. Thank you for your clarifying reply, HG. Damn. Forgot you can spell.^_^

            (Please don’t think twice. I’m being playful – not bratty).

      9. BurntKrispyKeen,
        Thank you, but I can assure you that I’m no yoga master. This picture is from Chiang Mai in Thailand; I went a few years ago and had this splendid idea that I would do yoga with a visiting guru from India there. I do yoga, but I was in complete shock the first day I went to this class. Two hours of bending your body intensely and spending at least half the time upside down in 35 degrees without being allowed to drink water and having this tiny guru all over you all the time was too much for me; I almost fainted (but of course I stayed on anyway not to hurt the poor guru hopeless empath that I am) and when he told me the next class was in a few hours and this would go on for a whole week I bolted. I found a beautiful waterfall in the mountains instead and decided to escape there which was really hard because I couldn’t walk for days after the yoga class. Ha ha..

      10. I’d have to see you in person, HG, to see if I agree with your self-assessment.

        And I see what you are saying Caroline. It’s all about the fuel, as HG has taught me. But I bet if someone were whispering in the ear of, say a Greater… descriptions of how cute he is… I bet he wouldn’t object. But a Greater in a professor role, probably not going to embrace being called cute. I get it.

        But that was the word that came to mind when I saw his point system in Fuel. Only a Greater would be so creative. It made me smile for many reasons. And like you, I thought the same thing when he responded “jolly good.” (But you’re right; it only works in a heavy British accent.)
        So cute!

        Just like Catherine’s profile picture. I mean… you get what I’m saying about that flexibility, right? Think how easily she can scratch her own back!

        Is it okay for an empath to be jealous?
        Those pesky human traits…
        I mean… look at HG’s comment. I think we just witnessed a Greater being modest!

      11. That had to be a lovely and venturesome trip Catherine. But I understand that feeling. I’ve been so sore before that it hurt to smile… and I swear… I thought I could feel my eyelashes.

        The first time I saw your picture, I guessed that you were a centered woman. I knew you were no stranger to yoga, so your image inspired me to work on stretching out my own shoulders a bit as I tried to mimic your pose. Still can’t, but I’m still impressed.

        I’ve enjoyed reading your, Caroline’s, as well as Blackunicorn123’s comments here as I appreciate the humor. Mine is a bit sarcastic, so I hope to never offend as being cheeky doesn’t always translate so well through text. (I just love borrowing from the British! I guess traits from my heritage there pop up from time-to-time, but like most Americans, we are a mixture of many. Proud mongrels we are… but it helps in feeling a connection to those abroad as this world becomes smaller. You ladies certainly help with that.)

        Through all of the pain we have experienced, it is nice to have a place where we can share our stories while sharing a laugh. So thank you all for your laughter. HG has made me smile too, but I don’t want him getting the idea that I think he’s too cute or anything, so I’ll just leave it that.

      12. BurntKrispyKeen,

        Just give it another go with your arms behind your back, I’m sure you’ll manage it! And yes, the trip was adventurous; I love traveling. Thank you also for your belief in me and thinking I’m centred; I used to believe so too, but the last years of upheaval and abuse have left me quite exhausted and I don’t recognise myself anymore; I feel more unbalanced than ever before in my life so introspection is currently my cup of tea.

        Your humour isn’t in the least offensive; I love sarcasm and I agree with you; being able to connect here with so many others that have gone through the same thing from all over the world is helpful, healing and joyous at times. Lots of hugs from a bloody cold Sweden;)

  12. I was thinking that only written words, no interaction (not even a phone call…nothing!) and being tertiary source means nothing to a narc. It’s over =”game over”. But narcs manage to consider you their property even if you’re far away, not interested and respecting their “choice” to not keep in touch.

    If we do as you asked from us=we’re mean (we take away your control over us), if we won’t do as you ask=we’re mean, because we sabotage your “demands” and challenge your authority. You have such a twisted mind…there’s no winning in staying with your kind, only going in circles/roller coaster until one feels nauseous and must get off.

  13. What do you think about a method of torturing the narcissist where a victim goes no contact – the narcissist can’t call, text or see in person the victim but once in a while a victim posts something online that is a source of fuel for the narcissist but narcisst still can’t interact with the victim. My friend does it to her ex narcissist. She escaped him, moved to another city, and torture him from afar. He is totally obsessed with her, he can’t reach her, he stalks her online in the hope she will give him a sign. What do you think?

    1. It may have some effectiveness with regard to certain narcissists, but this is not to be done when you have recently escaped/been disengaged as this will be a product of emotional thinking (you are still creating some form of engagement) and therefore feeding your emotional infection so that you will hit a tipping point and weaken resulting in ensnarement. It could be done after a solid period of no contact when the ET has been brought under control and logic prevails.

  14. Thank you very much for this one, HG. Very timely for me… and really helpful for me to reflect. Three biggies for me:
    -I’m going to have to “go missing” (not reply back, even if it’s hard for me) with a few third parties who may be relaying info to him; I must forego the niceties/politeness for my safety’s sake.
    -if the narcissist does break through my barriers, I need to shuteth up… as in, no arguing/last word, etc. It only keeps him coming back for more.
    -If he shows up AGAIN, I need to walk away — no run away, like a little girl — without a word.

    Besides that, I do think I’m mainly entering his 6th sphere, based on several things he’s said. So I’m arranging for that lobotomy for him, but in the meantime…

    Tin hat is in place.

      1. Awww, encouragement! I go a long way with encouragement, so thank ya much, Miss BKK. 🙂

        It’s kind of a messy thing right now, but I’m tougher than I probably seem. So I press onward!

  15. My X’s hoovers vacillate from “”You’re a whore and a bitch. This is your fault. You need to suffer “ to “I’m grieving over us and we could be amazing together.” So sick.

    1. What crap, LB!

      Obviously, it’s abundantly obvious to you that you need to dismiss such utter BS…and I’m sorry you even have to hear such stupidity.

      1. That is horrid- a knee jerk reaction from me was “I wish ‘he’ would talk to me like that- it would be so much easier to kick him to the curb.” Knee jerk- I have no idea how I would react to anyone speaking to me like that– however kick to the curb does come to mind. Perhaps easier when they are so cruel with words– and with actions- and with some of the things HG has admitted to doing? I do not know— awful–
        No one should be treated to or talked to like any of this— well maybe some people– the ‘thems’– however we have too much class to lower ourselves to that level.

Vent Your Spleen!

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