The Golden Rules of Freedom – No. 4

golden 4

You are never immune to our kind. You will ALWAYS be susceptible to us because of your innate addiction to our kind. You cannot remove it and thus you will not achieve immunity. You must therefore always be resisting.

You can don the armour to protect yourself as fashioned through my works, but that armour does not give you permanent invulnerability. All armour must be updated, maintained and checked otherwise the shield splits, the chainmail links weaken and the breastplate shatters more readily.

If you think that you are immune to us, you are succumbing to emotional thinking. It wants you to think that you are immune because if that is what you think, then guess what you will do? You will either want to test your immunity or you will believe that you can engage with us in some way and therefore you are doing precisely what your emotional thinking wants you to do. It wants you to engage with us and it will find whatever way it can to make you do that.

You are not immune. You may very well be able to take a telephone call from us and not react to what we say you may even feel nothing for us – no pity, no love or no hate. That time. You may be able to take that second telephone call from us and feel the same way, but because you are not immune, the more you engage with us – whether this is thinking about us, talking about us, spending time with us – you will eventually fall prey to your emotional thinking to a greater extent.

The very fact you are engaging with us when you think that you are immune, means that your  emotional thinking is working, because of course logic would tell you that you have no need to engage with us. Why then are you doing it? Because I want to show myself I will not react, I will not get drawn back in. That is emotional thinking. You are engaging with us and several things arise from this which are problematic. They may not appear problematic to you, because during that telephone call you feel in control, you did not get upset, you do not feel anxious any more, you do not feel anything for us, but you are creating problems.

  1. You will be providing us with fuel. It may be minimal but it will be there because you will not be able to maintain a neutral and flat tone throughout a conversation. Yes, you may be able to achieve this for a very short time and yes, you may not be giving much fuel, but it is there all the same. Thus, we are getting something we want.
  2. You are not rejecting us. By speaking to us you have signalled that you will answer the phone and engage. You may not be enthusiastic but you answered nevertheless. This provides us with encouragement.
  3. You are feeding your addiction and therefore your emotional thinking will want more and in its insidious way it will con you by telling you that you handled the call without any difficulty (it feels like this of course but it is not the case) and thus it will encourage you to do so again or encourage you to attend that social event where you know we will be there because you remain confident of being able to handle the situation. All you are doing is allowing the addiction to be fed and for the emotional thinking to surge until it overwhelms you (and it will) at a future point.
  4. You may well be feeding us useful information in the course of the conversation which we can use to our advantage.

Accordingly, by thinking you are immune and therefore thinking you can engage safely with us, you are creating risks and problems.

You have no need to engage with us.

You have no need to test your immunity because you are not immune. Understand this.

Instead, you can build your resistance. You are resistant but not immune. Some of you have a very low resistance, others far higher, but whichever it is, this resistance, just like the functioning of your own resistance to disease, can erode and weaken. The easiest way for this to happen is by repeatedly exposing yourself to engaging with us. The more you do so, you do not build your resistance but you weaken it. Of course, as I have explained above, you think you are becoming more resistant because you have an encounter with us and you walk away head held high thinking you handled it well. Superficially, yes, but beneath the surface, the problems I have detailed above are forming, waiting and growing ready to ensnare you.

By obeying this golden rule, you will avoid the complacency and risk which comes with thinking you are immune. Instead you will recognise you have resistance, you will understand that his resistance can be made stronger and can also be made weaker, so that with that logic defence established in your mind, you will work harder to avoid complacency and the problems that come with that.

Some of your resistance will be innate, but the majority of resistance is that which is learned and applied. You increase your resistance through reading and understanding, through the imposition of a solid no contact regime, by applying a rigorous purging of the emotional infection so it is driven to the lowest level and by the building of Logic Defences. Combining all of those elements will heighten your resistance, minimise weakening it, reduce the risk of using your resistance unnecessarily (which is of course a consequence of the impact of emotional thinking) and means that when a hoover happens to get through unexpectedly, that when you have those ‘bad days’ when you pine for us, your resistance will not be found wanting and you will repel the hoover, you will reject the emotional thinking which is straining to make you contact us and you will ensure that your resistance remains intact. Do not voluntarily test it, that is giving in to emotional thinking and taking an unnecessary risk – save its strength for when it is really needed because those moments will indeed come.

By applying the cornerstone elements from the paragraph above, their maintenance becomes easier, more natural and more instinctive and thus less arduous for you. You do not need to maintain a state of heightened vigilance, for that becomes draining, you will create a more-readily maintained defensive regime. Doing so little and often becomes far easier than a sudden overhaul when it is too late, which is invariably when complacency has already become the traitor who is unlocking the castle gates.

You are not immune.

You are always resisting.

Remember this and that resistance will achieve freedom and maintain it.

64 thoughts on “The Golden Rules of Freedom – No. 4

  1. Brave says:

    Resistance will achieve freedom and maintain it. You gave me hope. Tx HG

  2. SSM says:

    I am still perplexed by how a wife stays with a man who she knows has been having an affair for the last 5 years while she was 3 months pregnant and then finds out he has had yet another relationship with a woman who he now has a child with and yet she stays? Has he got that much of a hold on her?

    1. HG Tudor says:

      Your state of confusion is understandable but the emotional thinking of the victim is often so powerful it can lead to scenarios arising that an external observer would find baffling. I have witnessed this in numerous consultations.

  3. Bubbles 🍾 says:

    Dear K,
    Ps .. I seem to need someone to point out the obvious as I just don’t see it … I haven’t been able to categorize myself all this time … I think you just did 😘Mwah

  4. Bubbles 🍾 says:

    Hey dear K,
    Ohhhhhh …. is that what it is ? I really liked how you described that. But we empaths are doing absolutely “nothing” …. I even have my “resting bitch face” on now more than ever 😶… and it still doesn’t work. 😱
    Mr Bubbles kept saying as a joke … “you must be on permanent heat” 😂… in fact lovely K … its getting worse as I get older and I’m scratching my head as to why
    Thank you lovely one
    Luv Bubbles
    Xx

    1. Windstorm says:

      Bubbles
      I’ve always had that problem too. I’ve found it helpful to never look at other people, especially never look at their faces or in their eyes when I am waiting somewhere. Narcs will almost never approach me if I’ve never looked up at them. But often only once glance will pull them to me.

      1. Bubbles 🍾 says:

        Dearest Windstorm,
        Are you serious … “But often only once glance will pull them to me” ….. I had no idea! I try to wear sunglasses most of the time. However, I am always observing my surroundings and people ….. it’s that fear thingy and in case it’s the weasel. Most times I’m looking for something on the shelf, reading a magazine or even texting when people talk to me … sometimes it’s literally behind my back with no eye contact, nothing!
        I don’t want people to talk to me ….. I hate people! I just want to be left alone!
        (Apart from Mr Bubbles and my kids of course)
        I luv your wisdom and advice … thankyou lovely lady 😘
        Luv Bubbles
        Xx

  5. Bron says:

    Ok – great. Unless you have kids with your narc. How do you deal with the forced contact in this situation. Would love to have the option of NC, but no choice in the matter

    1. HG Tudor says:

      See How To Reduce Giving Fuel To The Narcissist or organise a consultation.

  6. Bubbles 🍾 says:

    Dear Mr Tudor,
    This article is superbly written with excellent advice. It’s funny ….. doing the opposite works in our best interest instead of actually confronting the enemy head on. Go figure

    Mr Bubbles and I were at the doctors the other day….. waiting, waiting, as one does (sigh) .. I had my head in a magazine and then this bloke plonks himself near me and starts talking …. (why am I not surprised) ….. he goes straight into Sherlock Holmes and the word “observation” (library buff, I noticed his library bag, intelligent yet creepy) …… what the blazes ???? …… and “observed” me reading a magazine….. no 💩 Sherlock… do I have ” psychos and nut cases please apply within ….. tattooed on my forehead” ? Mr Bubbles is witnessing first hand what I go thru every time I go out. I dug Mr Bubbles in the ribs and made him talk to the Sherlock man as well. It’s bloody hard work… this resisting thing, no joke!

    My daughter said after ” mum … stranger danger …. stop talking to people” ….. I defended ” but they talk to me first” ….I only get distracted by “shiny” things …. 😂. As Mrs Zeroni from the movie “Holes” quoted “You and your family will be cursed for always and eternity” 🔮

    Great advice, very helpful, beautifully written article Mr Tudor … thank you 😊

    1. HG Tudor says:

      Thank you.

      1. Bubbles 🍾 says:

        You are most certainly welcome Mr Tudor, my pleasure

    2. NarcAngel says:

      Bubbles
      Happens to me also. If theres a nut nearby they come straight for me. They can be interesting and amusing short term, but if they look dangerous avoid eye contact and start reading or digging in your purse lol.

      1. Bubbles 🍾 says:

        Dear NarcAngel,
        Awe …. I’m sooooo sorry, you’re cursed tooo …. it must be our fragrance …. ” Eau de Empath” … . hahaha
        I had another the other day… supermarket ….I was asking the assistant where to locate an item, when this bloke suddenly comes around to my aisle and says “here it is, I heard you asking” .. Mr Bubbles was in shock ….. I said to him .. don’t ask, it just happens ! 😂
        Thank you for your advice, I like the purse one .. I’ll search for my phone to call the police….. 😂👮🏻
        (I usually try to exit stage left quite quickly….. so many weirdos out there)
        Thank you gorgeous
        Luv
        Bubbles
        Xx

      2. K says:

        NA and Bubbles

        Your fuel brings all the narcs to the yard,
        And they’re like,
        Its better than hers,
        Damn right its better than hers,
        I can teach you,
        But I have to charge

        My IRL empath is a narc magnet; they all glom onto her while I stand by and take mental notes.

    3. Windstorm says:

      Bubbles
      It’s not your fault. It’s all because of your dirty, rotten, no-good pig-stealing, great-grandfather! I’ve seen that movie over 30 times. We show it at school. “If only, if only…”

      1. Bubbles 🍾 says:

        Dear Windstorm
        …exactly …. 😂
        Great movie HOLES …. luv it!
        Thats what we say when the govt continually do more road work … dig it up, oh oh (dig it) … then they fill em in again …. then … dig it up, oh oh (dig it) 😂
        Luv Bubbles xx

      2. K says:

        WS
        The book and the movie were both awesome!! And Fonzi was in it!

  7. /iroll says:

    I resisted seeing narcy, but the hoovering went on for 3 months. So, i’m now weak again, it’s a reset. I feel i went all the way down the river, to the very bottom of meaninglessness – and that came just from the struggle of resisting without even going back into the relationship. The ‘dark-side’ is not for me, and i couldn’t be cruel even when i was teasing and rejecting / playing him, i’m too emotionally involved. I’m not even angry with him, he clearly has big self-esteem issues, my addiction is the whole problem – and it comes from an original trauma. I even think, even now, that this must be the final discard, it must surely be it by now, after all this.

    I need regular repair and updates. We can resist and chose a better path, but ‘eveyone heals’ – completely, is a myth. A very annoying one.

    1. Brave says:

      Hi iroll. If it helps. I get it. I’m ‘there’ myself. I’m trying to get much rest. Just when I think final discard the creep can’t let go. Xo

  8. Gisa says:

    Exactly what I needed to hear today!
    I can not leave yet but I am applying theses rules every day to protect me but as it is exhausting I do everything to stay sane – luckily ALL my friends are on my side and are helping me through it

  9. DebbieWolf says:

    Bookmarked.
    Great article.

  10. Lori says:

    This is truth. If you are willfully engaging with a known Narc it’s cause you are getting something from it emotionally. It Is not a “experiment” that’s code for I need the attention from this person toxic or not

  11. IAM says:

    I’ve been in a state of hypervigilence since going NC 3 months ago. It’s only been three months and my thinking and life have changed. Yes, it is exhausting. It seems like every day the past 3 months something triggers me.

    My girlfriend, loyal to me but knows my ex-narc for years (I met her through him), has been taking her auto to a car wash across the street from where my ex works. Since she washes her auto once a week, is it possible when he sees my friend it can trigger a hoover?

    I’ve been getting hundreds of emails a week that I’ve not signed up for. Some days I get a break. Unfortunately he blocked me first before I got a chance to block him. But when my friend goes to the f***ing car wash, I get bombarded with emails.

    Has this email juvenile activity happened to anyone else? Should I just delete my email account?

    1. NarcAngel says:

      IAM
      My intention is not to make you paranoid, but are you sure your friend (who is loyal to you but who has known him for years and who you both met through) is really YOUR friend and loyal to YOU? If I told my friend that I thought this was the case she would find another car wash. I would delete the email. Just my thoughts.

  12. HG Tudor's #1 fan says:

    You read my mind today. You are a mind reader. I am feeling sad again. Although I said the lesser didn’t faze me this time around. His silent treatment along with memories of the past is getting to me.

    1. Lori says:

      I have been the same

      1. Caroline says:

        Lori and HG Tudor’s #1 Fan,
        Oh, I’m sorry…feeling sad about your history with a narcissist is hard. I do understand… I almost married one. When he was good, he was awesome. But… it can’t be daily reality.

        I don’t know if this will help or not, but:
        -They really can’t help what they are… they are just incapable of that deep love… they can only go to infatuation, and then their psyche has to stir up trouble.
        -Try to accept there was some fun/thrills/your own feelings + warm sentiments, and that is the good. But also try to think logically about the pain (bad) they inflict. It is not a reflection, at all, on who you are — it is a reflection on them/their limits. Do not accept it as your own failing. It is not.

        XO.

      2. Lori says:

        Caroline

        Thank you so much. I embarrassed to say I have had 2. The first I was with quite awhile 5 years. The 2nd just an online face time thing.

        This article is exactly right. I was well educated on narcissists but still fell into the trap. I fell into the trap because i didn’t know there were different schools that present differently and this guy was totally different than the first. The first an upper mid ranger the last a middle lesser. So this article is 100 percent true.

        I think my struggles today are because I believe i may be am being hoovered by proxy. I was friended by one of his friends out of the blue yesterday. I simply don’t know if it was a random coincidence or purposeful

        Thank you for thinking of us who are struggling today

        1. Windstorm says:

          Lori
          I’d think the odds are very low that it was a coincidence.

        2. Caroline says:

          Lori,
          So welcome, and I agree with Windstorm — that doesn’t sound like a coincidence. I’d say be vigilant..and stay outta the crazy loop! 😉

      3. /iroll says:

        Caroline – thanks. Hard cold unresponsive limits, are what’s causing the hurt. But, yes.

        1. Caroline says:

          Understand, iroll~and you’re welcome 🙂

      4. Caroline,

        It is not reflection of who I am. I am not the failure. It is in fact , a reflection of who they are. You are spot on with every word. Thank you so much for you kindness.

        1. Caroline says:

          You’re more than welcome, HG Tudor’s #1 Fan. 🙂

      5. Lori says:

        Windstorm I’m sure it’s no coincidence. It makes you want to scream. He doesn’t speak to me blocks me yet wants to monitor wtf? Wouldn’t it just be easier to speak to me ? Ugh

        This shit is maddening

      6. Lori says:

        Y’all I’m pretty sure it was purposeful. I know he has another profile that he thinks I don’t know about but I do. Anyway I accepted the friends request and I looked for that fake profile no sign then just last night I go to that friends page and when I look at my new friends friends whose pic shows up right away ? Narcs fake profile. That was not there Day before yesterday. It wasnt and for it to show as one of the first 6 pics under his friend list means one of two things:

        1. He either recently corresponded with him (hmmm about what )

        2. He was looking at my profile.

        Wtf? I mean really what is the f ing purpose ? Wouldn’t it just be easier to unblock me and speak to me? This is like 4 year old

        HG

        What is the purpuse of this? I know you’ll say ro keep tabs, but keep tabs for what reason ?

        I know there is an article that discusses this but I could remember which one it was HG do you or does anyone else know ?

        The crazy part is I could text him right now and he’d just ignore me and he has me blocked on Facebook so why f ing bother keeping tabs on me? Ugh

        1. HG Tudor says:

          You should not be allowing this issue to be thought about as this is engaging with the narcissist and is a breach of no contact. He wants information because that allows control. Control is what we need for the purposes of gaining fuel and maintain superiority.

    2. /iroll says:

      Lessers are pretty brutal

  13. Mona says:

    Oh HG, I have to cope with your kind each day at home and at work! Not the greater ones, but a lot of midrange. And from day to day I learn more how to handle them. Your magical thinking (emotional thinking) blends you,so that you think, you have all of the control.But that is not true. All parts of mindgames are possible. I have no conscience anymore to blend them too. I blend my mother, I blend and manipulate my chiefs at work (only the narcs) and it works better from day to day. You gave me the knowledge how to cope with them!!. I am sorry, but you gave me the information how to cope with your kind. And they fall for it. I admire my chief in front of him, although I think he is stupid and egotistical. And he believes my admiration!!! Some people are only satisfied, when they get lies and do not have to see reality. The real decisions are made at other places – in the backyard. But that is only possible, if you have someone who really believes he is superior. That is your kind`s weak point.

  14. Caroline says:

    I love this one… and I think the more you resist, the easier it becomes. You build yourself up.

    One of my strengths is resisting. A bit of a stubborn streak is not all bad. 🙂

    To be of a resisting mindset, I think it helps to think on these things:

    -Am I really going to allow another human being to control me, in any way? For what good purpose would I give up my unfettered freedom to another’s behavioral whims? How dare anyone believe I would do so.

    -If I do not resist, how sorry will I be later? For what good reason will I not stay strong? How free will my mind/emotions/spirit be if I give in to something destructive/disempowering for me — how much regret will later dog me? How much freedom (peace of mind/dignity of self) will I lose? How hard will it be to get it back? Is anything — anyone — worth that?

    Resist.
    Resist.
    Resist.

    And gain strength… while maintaining your freedom, which is priceless.

    1. Omj says:

      Great insights sweet Caroline ! I will pin this – it applies not only to Narcs. It anyone who is trying to control us. Great self awareness question ! I too feel I gain strength by resisting !

      1. Caroline-is-pinned! says:

        Aw, so sweet, OMJ. I’m not sure it’s worthy of being pinned, but thanks for making me feel really good. 🙂

        I’m convinced that they respect our resistance (whether they admit that or not), as a little side benefit… but then they kinda want you more, so I’m still trying to get myself completely out of the narc loop, lol.

        1. Omj says:

          Mine Hoovered with a malign and benign hook in the same couple sentences. I responded neutral- he never responded – I guess he probably thought he wrote to a stranger…

          1. Caroline says:

            Great job, OMJ…neutral is the way to go. I know neutral is boring for us empaths — it’s like the color beige — but it’s truly how we don’t get sucked in and can stay empowered.

            So, in a way, beige is the new fuchsia… for empaths. Yeah, let’s go with that. Lol 😉

          2. Omj says:

            You always manage to make me smile !!! I got congrats from HG too ! That made my day.

            Frankly- there is something empowering in neutral – it’s like mastering another kind of art. Something strange to us, like if we can’t draw outside the lines. Funny feeling.

            I like the neutral perfect – I don’t find it boring – I find it classy and timeless. Like a picture of Grace Kelly:) neutral is full of grace and cleanliness !!! Épure

          3. Caroline says:

            Hey, OMJ~~if you got “congrats” from the Resident Expert, you know you’re doing well, Missy. 🙂

            I’m still waiting for him to congratulate me.

            Waiting… waiting… waiting…waiting…

            (550 million years later):

            Waiting… waiting…waiting…to-infinity-and-beyond waiting………

            LOL! 😉

          4. Omj says:

            I must say I would have not make it without his help and his positive reinforcements.

            I see relations and people totally differently now – I read through thenm in a self preserving way- I had no boundaries too, now I do.

            I had a huge deception with my co dependent mother this week – I reacted so differently than I would have before and she called me the next day and had changed her decision realizing she was asking me to pay the price of her own collaterals. Even if she would have not changed her mind-‘I was repeating to myself – I am not a victim of her decisions – I have my life – I own it and will live it fully.

            I learn a lot about me here.

            I met this guy – I know now it won’t go far- but I am happy I could feel tenderness again for a man – that I could be in sync with my gentle nature with a man again- my Narc has not killed my inner beauty- inner capacity to bond. I am so relieved.

            So I must say thank you again for everything I have learned here- it makes me appreciate me more . Tonight at least 🙂

            And congrats to you Caroline – I see you are also moving along your Caroline’s journey !!

          5. Caroline says:

            I love reading what’s going on with you, Miss Journey (you really picked the perfect name for yourself). That was so healthy, what you told yourself with your Mom. I have a few people in my family where I need to think about my boundaries more as well. It’s blasted hard! So proud of you. XO.

            A man? A “normal” man? I’m liking it… it’s nice to have good company, and no big stress with it. 🙂 No, your inner beauty has not been killed off~still shining!

            I was truly just being playful with HG, about the congrats thing, but thanks for your sweetness. I may need to consult with him sometime – depends on how this evolves…

            I picture myself someday standing on the edge of a cliff, the narcissist closing in on me, as I fumble with my work bag — throwing my purse at the narc — as I finally (yes!) find my iPad…and frantically email HG:

            “Hi, HG! It’s Caroline, you know, from your blog… the pale-green dress…the one who’s a bit bratty to you sometimes… so sorry about that, especially now… oh, and… well, HELP!”

            Yeah, that’s probably about how it will go down… 😉

          6. Omj says:

            I found HG was very good at reading how I was evolving – sometimes vacillating .

            Always gave me choices and although I know sometimes I did not follow the script perfectly and crisply – I learn a great deal all the way – I found that regular consultations develop muscles that you can use overtime. Emergency consultations are great but often your ET is rampant and you absorb less simply because your system is on fight flight freeze and so you retain less because your short term memory is screwed.

            I know I was able to GOSO more logically than emotionally and that helps too.

            Don’t wait to be on the cliff a avoid walking up to there … :))

          7. HG Tudor says:

            Thank you.

          8. Omj says:

            And as for the normal man – he appears really normal but there are many red flags that I see or fabricate as an excuse – things I found out last night : let’s have fun and see if I am getting better :
            Red flag 1- his «  ex » wife got back living in his house – apparently separate bedroom
            Red flag 2- when we met he told me she has left him and yesterday he was the one who had left her
            Red flag 3- he wrote me a funny text – a word play that could mean he had lost interest – when Inpointed it out – he said it was a joke – did not apologize – suspect gaslighting
            Red flag 4- He always have somewhere to go on friday night
            Red flag 5- right after our first date he wanted a chat call at my lunch time – which I find odd – I told him no
            Red flag 6- after I finally let go and had some fun – he asked me if he had told me he is leaving for 2 months this summer on a trip with his kids ????
            Red flag 7- he hates his father – who was really mean to him
            Red flag 8- when his wife left him she went into a depression, lost weight etc
            Red flag 9- he is told me how he got ride of many of his employees at work and the methods he has been using – which is really intimidation

            So in isolation there is nothing too crazy there – but amalgamated I see a big red flag – maybe I am reading too much into it and becoming a bit paranoid . I feel like my ex husband with him he is very affectionate and he sure could trap me with that.

            So since he is leaving for 2 months – I will cut ties but nevertheless – I felt good – If he is a narc – then that would have been a short Golden … :))

          9. Windstorm says:

            Omj
            They all sound like red flags to me. Taken together sounds like a midranger to me.

          10. Omj says:

            He is not a lesser for sure . Forgot one red flag: always talk about future thing – remind me to cook this for you , will talk about this, we will do this, we will go to this place etc so wether he is or not – the pointers and observation is more important to me .
            Just getting better at looking at how they behave instead of what they say 🙂

          11. Caroline says:

            Yup, way too many red flags! On your behalf, I couldn’t bring myself to overlook even Flag # 1…but, in fairness, I can see legit (non-suspect) reasons for a few. In total, uh, no. FLASHING WARNING NEON LIGHT.

            So you get the golden — and you get out.

            Yup! Best plan.

          12. Omj says:

            The first one effectively came as the flagship of flags. I remember reading a lot about those type of statements here and how they were no no no.

            I remember one reader here mentioned once she was going from golden to golden and leaving them before devaluation or just when devaluation would start.

            I must say that when he told me about the vacations ( right after the fun part) – I said to myself … game over.
            Did not asked if I would be interested at joining at some point or did not gave too much details but I suspect his wife will be there Too.

          13. Caroline says:

            OMJ,
            I’d bank on that, re: his wife. Time to get outta there.

            So let’s call your “catching the golden/avoiding the devalue” experience as the GEO.

            Gold…
            Exit
            Out!

            Or call it the “gold rush.”

          14. Omj says:

            Funny girl ! I just woke up to your funny GÉO.

            I don’t want to conclude on a diagnostic of him – but just that number one is enough to run with any given man.

            I will see him for breakfast and diner today – seems like he is placing himself all over my agenda.

            But really he will be gone in a couple days – so I won’t sit around my whole summer.
            It was a nice interlude after my Narc and nice way to test my learnings- from theory to applied learning. I lknow My emotional distance is growing ( even if I am not immune) just by the way I was able to engage with this person and let go and compare him favoribly to my Narc.

            So in any event – file closed- but thanks for the acronym. 🙂

          15. Caroline says:

            Wait, wait! No breakfast! No dinner! I mean, not with the probable narcissist.

            Where are you, OMJ — so I can come rescue you? Oh dear…

            Ok, but you must report back after dinner. Wow, beginning to see what HG is up against with us. Lol

          16. Omj says:

            Don’t worry Caroline … he is leaving in a couple of days – so I am just enjoying the good time.

            Ps . We have not determined he is a Narc yet – so let’s not throw too many rocks at him.

            Flag number 1 – makes him out of the game.

    2. windstorm says:

      Caroline
      “Am I really going to allow another human being to control me, in any way? For what good purpose would I give up my unfettered freedom to another’s behavioral whims? How dare anyone believe I would do so.”

      That’s exactly how I feel! That’s good to think before you give in to anyone else’s wishes, children, friends, family, coworkers – not just narcs.

      1. Caroline says:

        So true, Windstorm…those boundaries that we empaths sometimes forget about. It’s how we get taken advantage of by some.

    3. Preach sister.

      Resist
      Resist
      Resist

  15. Omj says:

    I love this one because I got hoovered after 23 years with a fat , ugly lesser and that led me to a second depression ( note that the first one was when he was in my life too).

    3 years straight to hell, spent all the money left from my divorce, could not work, could not think, my son moved out – he could not bear see me Like this. I became a ghost of myself. I would have never predicted it . I was so infected that even my therapist walk out on me as I was taking his calls in our sessions.

    hearing his voice on my voicemail «  I am a ghost from the past coming to haunt you » I was warned – I knew nothing about narcissistic abuse at the time and I thought that destiny had finally brought back my love, my soul mate etc

    You are right so right HG- never immune- never above falling again.

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