Poll : Which Of These Forms of Manipulation Has Been Used Against You The Most?
You will have experienced many different types of manipulation having been ensnared by a narcissist or more than one. You may not have realised what the manipulation was at the time and only worked it out after the event.
Was there a particular manipulation that was used against you more than the others? Perhaps one narcissist used it a lot or it has become a common theme used by the various narcissists you have entangled with? Did the narcissist use sex to manipulate you, through withdrawing it or making you do sexual acts you were not comfortable with or maybe sex was given as a reward if you were compliant? Were you the recipient of lots of Present Silent Treatments through sulking and cold shoulders? Maybe you found that the narcissist used contradiction a lot through saying one thing and doing another? It might have been that you were subjected to word salads as you fought to understand what on earth was going on.
Whichever was the manipulation that was used the most against you, choose one from the list and do please expand on how this affected you and why you think this one was used against you more than others.
Thank you for participating.
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The only one I don’t recall being used by my covert upper mid level was word salad. But, gaslighting is definitely the winner. Usually dog whistling, or manipulation that made me question my recollection of things I said or did.
I feel bad saying, “I hate Narcissists”, but I will say that, “I hate the way Narcissists behave (and Sociopaths, as well).” Of course, sometimes I hate the way that I behave, too.
But, at least I hold myself accountable, and try to change. In fact, people usually tell me that I am too hard on myself.
But, Narcissists and Sociopaths enjoy the way they behave no matter how badly they devestate others.
I am not talking about you, per say, HG, because… I’m just not. I mean, I think you are different. I really do. You are one of those rare ones, I’m pretty sure.
I chose gaslighting altho triamgulation was about as much for both narcs in my life my mother and narc partner.
Passive aggressiveness goes hand in hand with the gaslighting. Many times things were said to upset me then turned around to either make me think it didnt happen or i misconstrued what was said.
My mother is always changing history and telling me my memories are wrong and it didnt happen or it happened differently. She once even in front of company at my home told me i was wrong about a physical attack i experienced as a child which she was not even there to see!
My narc partner will drop put downs and back handed remarks then act like nothings out of the ordinary.
From learning here im more able to let a lot run off my back bc i understand npd now. Its a means to obtain power by diminishing another and then create doubt in that person over their own thoughts and awareness of whats really going on. It distorts the truth and makes you feel youre crazy so youll rely on what “their” truth is. Its all about power and control.
An example of a passive aggressive move on my narcs part is we sometimes will chat via messenger and we were sending gifs at the end of conversations. He had sent one and it said at the bottom…nobody likes you. I was stunned bc this is something i remember from on of HG’s articles what a narc will say or have you believe. It was like a punch to the gut. Within a minute he sent an apology saying he didnt see the caption at the bottom. Fast forward a few weeks later he sends a marilyn monroe one that clearly says youre not too bright or something of that nature. This time he didnt bring it up. I screen shot it and showed him and he acted dumb like hed not seen it which it was obvious. At that point i said pls dont send me gifs anymore bc even if its by accident its upsetting and i dont need that.
He probably was happy it upset me but i extinguished that by reclaiming myself by telling him to no longer send them bc my feelings matter. Im sure that caused narc injury but he can deal with it bc he initiated the problem!
This was the first poll I haven’t participated in. I wouldn’t even be able to pick a top 3. All of them have been used, and most of them frequently. Impossible to just pick one.
I thought I left a comment but maybe not. I chose circular conversations even though most of these could apply. I felt like I was talking to a toddler all the time. “But honey, as I’ve explained before, that’s because human beings like to have reciprocal relationships – that is what ‘relate’ means – two people interacting. But darling, didn’t I mention yesterday that it is rude to just leave a conversation without saying goodbye?” Etc
I voted triangulation but all the above have always applied in my life one time or another, one narc or another. (until now)
Silent treatment. I often wounded him by not running after, begging, crying. Hell NO. I always kept my pride, not that it served much because I still got screwed but at least I don’t feel like jumping off the grid because I ran after that cheap stinky lesser ass hole. Because if HG says he is a lesser, then that is what he is. In fact if HG says he is a dirty little crawling poop worm, then that is what he is. Oh and it is not the end because there is no end for no contact. And if I can wound him over and over and over until there is nothing left of that coward, you better believe me.
I can totally understand why Clara Harris ran over her cheating ass hole narcissist husband. (Opps! I didn’t say that out loud, did I?) she left jail smiling. Ok go ahead and jump on me for enjoying her smile…. as she is s psycho herself but…
LOL, Kathy Mor. I would have liked to kill MRN too. I was once involved/madly in love with someone with what was probably BPD. He ended up in jail on a rape charge (he didn’t rape anyone – he was just fucking with someone’s head, which I had warned him against as he lived in a developing country full of corruption and violence). As soon as I found out (his mother called me), he was gone from my head – poof. He went to jail and I was mentally free.
I hope my EX narc gets charged with that too. Rape and violence against women. And I hope he gets a ranging STD that makes that cock flabby as his brain is.
Love and hate: two facets of the same coin.
I gave him everything. That’s very true.
But (and there is always a but)… I never said it was free 🙂
He was so busy cheating, lying, and trying to get more from me that he missed my red flags. And they are actually black flags. Yeah I like sounding mean and evil 😈
Am I turning into a narc? Just with him, yes I am. And a sadistic one too. No pain, no forgiveness. Lol!
Kathy Mor, I could see my exN getting charged with something too, and so can he, which is why he is so secretive. It took me months to figure out who he was. He did not leave when I did figure it out, and nor did I, but lying about who you are in order to have sex with someone (no force involved) is ‘rape by deception/fraud’ and a potential crime in some places, including in the UK (narrowly), where we both lived. And an STD, well, yeah, which is why I made him swear he would not sleep with anyone else (IPPS excluded). He resisted condoms and had no conception of STDs. Might come back to bite him you know where.
Yes. My ex never cared about condoms either. Every time I mentioned STDs, he would have this blank look on his face and wouldn’t say anything. Obviously STDs are of no concern to them. If I were to ask mine to not sleep with anyone else, he would understand it as if I were trying to control and that’s when he would give me the silent treatment and find another to screw just to prove superiority. So… it is a lost battle. If you decide to stay with a guy like, you have to assume the risk because they will not care. As HG says, they will do anything for fuel and sex is a weapon they use. A very potent weapon that’s why some of them are really good at it……..
Well, Kathy Mor, I gave him a choice: he could either have me and IPPS or he could have IPPS and someone else. He could not have me + someone else + IPPS. I am almost 100% certain that he did not sleep with anyone else because had I discovered that he had, all hell would have broken loose. He took a lot of risks with me – that he let me find out who he was, that he did not run away, that he talked me into an affair when I knew who his wife was, etc. He had a lot to lose. Being IPSS has its perks if there is an IPPS and a facade to maintain. Anyway, as I just wrote on another post, the sex was the best part of our relationship, whether he was sleeping with someone else or not. It is the only time I felt really close to him and he was most normal in bed.
Gaslighting. This was a touch choice. I selected gaslighting as he loved to confuse me. I remember early on in our relationship items got moved around and when I said something, he told me it was my imagination. Is that gaslighting? He also would say things and then deny them. I was already a bit confused when we started our relationship as I was going through something significant. With his games I thought I was losing my mind.
Other choices after gaslighting were Lying, verbal abuse/belittling (often most of the verbal abuse came after I escaped but was not no contact), and then of course the Silent Treatment.
My choice is gaslighting. It was a difficult choice and I guess it depends on which narcissists you’re referring to. I also believe you forgot one, humiliation.
Father: humiliation, issuing of threats, physical violence, verbal abuse/belittling, silent treatments/ignoring
Teachers/counselors: humiliation, verbal abuse/belittling, silent treatments/ignoring, projection, issuing of threats
Children ( under the age of 18) in the neighborhood: verbal abuse/belittling, issuing of threats, physical and sexual violence, humiliation, triangulation, blameshifting. Fight back hard enough, mean enough, and laugh at them as you kick, bite and punch to get away and they eventually let you go and leave you alone.
Friend L.: Triangulation, gaslighting, humiliation, belittling
Boyfriend M.: verbal abuse/belittling, sexual violence, humiliation, triangulation, blameshifting
Boyfriend R.: Lying, infidelity, deflection. Physical abuse doesn’t count here, eventhough I believe he was a lesser. Yeah, he bounced me around the house, but I deserved it. I knew he was cheating so when he’d walk through the door I’d just punch him. We fought so much it actually was like foreplay. Fight, fuck, fight.
Ex husband: verbal abuse/belittling, triangulation, gaslighting, issuing of threats, blameshifting, circular conversations, projection, deflection, word salad, mild physical abuse( he liked to bend my fingers back and ask with a smile, ” Had enough? Just say uncle. ” my answer was always the same. “Just fuckin break ’em”). When he’d threaten, I just tell him to “go ahead, what are you going to do that hasn’t already been done? I survived that, I’ll survive you.” Funny thing, when we got together ( he was someone I considered a friend from childhood), I asked him not to be one more thing I have to survive. When you tell a narcissist your deepest fears, they just have to make them come true.
Matrinarc: Gaslighting, projection, triangulation, circular conversations, deflection, lying, blameshifting, verbal abuse/belittling. No physical abuse, but she allowed others to abuse me and used it to blameshift, belittle and control. Only once, when I was 16, did she try. She kicked in my bedroom door and got me down on the bed and tried choking me. I put her through a door. She never touched me again like that.
Idanoe,
This:
“When you tell a narcissist your deepest fears, they just have to make them come true.”
…has so much truth to it. The nex often hinted about me sharing my ‘physically abusive ex-hub”
I really didnt want to delve into that memory, but there can a time when it was necessary to explain one of my reactions to some of his behavior. I could barely get through it, sobbing like a banshee.
And what does he do? Nada. Except to amp up the physical side of his abuse, to the point that I was in full panic mode just sensing what lay on the horizon.
Jasmine,
I agree knowing the truth just makes all your suspicions true, it’s like a nightmare that doesn’t end. Almost 2 yrs NC with Matrinarc and I’m still unraveling the lies. I’ve disengaged and cut off all my family as they just added to the deceit trying to protect her.
Narc parents so I was taught to be transparent. It was easy for ex to get all the info he needed to knock me to my knees. Only one problem for him, he was playing on the loyalty I had for parents and had not earned his own. It was a major mistake on his part.
TRIANGULATION hands down. The Narcissist triangulates you with every person, place, or thing constantly.
Hi anm…yes triangulation is their favorite tool!! It creates jealousy, uncertainty, insecurity, hate, anger, depression …all the feelings they feel. It also pits people against each other and can help them achieve an outcome desirable for them.
I could have picked most of those choices. But since it can only be one….Word salad. Why? Because it used to infuriate me and he knew it. I didn’t realise it was deliberate of course. I just thought he was as thick as a brick for not understanding what I was trying to say.
MMRN belittled, triangulated, and gaslighted me more often than most yet used all. I can only think of him making a few threats. I don’t think he had the balls to make threats. He’d rather be passive aggressive. I almost wonder out of all schools and cadres who the least likely to use threats is.
The triangulation with the word salad of lies. That arrogance and ignorance like I was so beneath him. Roll out the red carpet and make way for the king. A commanding officer that had no balls and no nut sacks. And will never be able to grow any.
It is almost easier to answer with what my Narc of 30+ years didn’t use often, but I chose lying as the most used because it was used to support all of the others, mostly revolving around his favorite form of punishment, infidelity. My covert mid-ranger never used physical violence, word salad, and never used the silent treatment until the final discard.
So difficult to choose. I selected triangulation because it pushed so many jealousy buttons for me within the relationship as an on going thing. Triangulation with things, real and imagined, other women, objects, events repeatedly, it was only a matter of time until he would have orchestrated me coming face to face with IPPS which would have caused a big drama that would have been a fuel fest; but the lying was also huge and was the thing that really really hurt and broke me out of the dream/nightmare and once I realised there were so many lies upon lies finally pushed me to escape. Although the lies were happening alongside the triangulation they just didn’t appear to me until the end. In retrospect I also had buckets of gas lighting and word salad, projection of his darkest depressing feelings of guilt and unworthiness and lots of devaluation with snide remarks.
Boasting and bragging. Infidelity. Future faking. Withdrawal of sex or very quick basic get it over with sex. I ended up believing he was my only friend I could trust. Turns out he was the last one I could trust. Fell out with a few people as I believed they were the enemy.
His excuses played out over and over the same story slightly different circumstance. He told me I was his mirror. I reflected back to him himself. Weird. He went through my phone, my reflective diaries and my medical records. He hinted hinted hinted that he had done so by dropping clues about painful things he knew were within these private personal documents. I only realised this is how he knew and what he meant in hind sight. The sniggers and smirks and pleasure he got from my puzzled and pained expressions.
The Twat – a disgusting excuse for a man. Ended 18 mths, NC 1yr 1 month. 🤘stronger each day x
Belittling. I forgot belittling.
This was hard to pick because different narcs used different tactics. My mother was mainly verbal abuse, blameshifting and projection. My Moron in Munich was mainly silent treatments, word salad, projection and threats.
My Pretzel MnM is not usually deliberately hurtful like the others. He likes to play games and see if I can catch him out. More like teasing. For that he uses lying, triangulation and gaslighting and very subtle blame shifting.
If he really wants to manipulate me away from a subject, he usually uses very skillful deflection or subtle verbal abuse (I tend to fixate and worry about any verbal abuse). He has never used infidelity or silent treatments. We both have fun with word salad and circular arguments and often trade them back and forth as a joke. He can do hilarious parodies of passive-aggressive mid-rangers.
Anymore, I stay painted white with him (since we no longer live together). That more than anything is why his manipulations are more entertaining than vindictive, I think. When we lived together there were many subtle threats – often with violence (destroying things that were important to me), intimidation and ugly, hurtful verbal abuse.
Dear Mr Tudor,
That was really difficult to select just one
I selected “word salad”, however, lettuce be clear here, it should’ve been NARC SPEAK salad because everything was tossed in a bowl and mixed up with sweet and sour, you name it
He literally dressed everything to the point of drowning, so much so, it was too slippery with oil and very tart with vinegar
He tried to overcompensate with a huge grind of pepper until it just burned, but in the end, the salt made it just too bitter
Everything got tossed out
Fabulous poll … thank you
Luv Bubbles xx 😘
Bubbles I love this description x
Dear Em,
Thank you lovely 😊
Luv Bubbles xx
Bubbles
Awesome description
Dearest brokenrainbow,
Thank you sweet pea
I tossed out the salad, but then he came back and offered ” devilled” eggs…. I said “no way you crouton”, “I absolutely refuse to eat burnt offerings”
I felt very “scrambled” at this point and quickly left
On the way out, I noticed a fruit tree and was able to pick the very ripe fruit
I was extremely happy ….. as I left with a “plum in my mouth” … best plum I’ve ever tasted…. he literally gave me the pip
Luv Bubbles xx 😘
Bubbles,
This made me laugh this morning and I sorely needed a moment of levity. Thank you! Haha
Bubbles
Ha Ha!!! You have a way with words!
Dear brokenrainbow and Supernova DE,
Many thanks precious ones
We all need more laughter …. it’s way better than the alternative
I told him to stop concocting recipes in his head and go read a recipe book… …. (when everything else fails read the instructions) he might actually learn something, but I’m afraid he just can’t cook, everything and I mean everything, tastes like crap
I couldn’t stand the heat, so I got out of the kitchen
Luv Bubbles xx 😘
That bastard has put me in the middle of so many situations I didn’t even know I was in the middle of, I thought I was perpetually in a scene from the exorcist where my head just kept spinning.
He loves seeing his primary partner humiliated, begging, sobbing, lost, forlorn, abandoned and ignored as although the energy isn’t sent in his vicinity directly…he is directly involved in its creation and he inhales the multi-level of fear & sad energies like a vampire does blood.
Even now as he endeavors to bring down a community through the court system, I sense he is fully aware of their contact with me, ergo, he keeps me in a loop I would rather not be involved in.
I have had to unaffiliate myself with certain social medias because even blocking him was not enough. Each time I sense I am being drawn back into his circle the anxiety that clutches my heart requires at least 24hrs & anti-anxiety medication to recover.
Although he doesn’t know anything about me now, he seems hell bent on being certain that I will be effected by his actions somehow, someway for as long as possible.
I am truly grateful that my life is unraveling in a positive way. I’ve been able to confront and let go of many of the beliefs that led me to someone like him in the first place and that the people in my life now love me with a heartfelt sincerity & authenticity I only dared to dream of.
No matter what role the narcissist played in my life, I would never have found my way to where i am now without needing to look at why I needed to be with someone who is abusive (by my understanding) & for that I can say thank you.
The journey can enhance the destination if you let it.
I picked verbal abuse/belittling, the belittling, under guise of concerned constructive feedback, was where it started. “You should quit trying to be the smartest person in the room. Nobody wants to hear what you have to say. It makes them feel stupid, and shows them how you think you are so superior to everyone else! I want everyone to like you, cause you’re with me! So, don’t try to be the smartest person in the room!” So, of course I don’t think i am superior, and I wouldn’t want others to feel stupid, this curtails much of my conversations with others outside the relationship with the N.
But I also include with verbal abuse: lying, gas lighting, threats, triangulation ,deflection, blame shifting, circular conversations and word salad. If it issues from your mouth, and it does any of these things, it is verbal abuse. If you start yelling “Help! Stop it! Help me!” while you start trashing the room, and I am doing nothing that warrants that behavior, simply because you want the neighbors to think I am the abusive one, THAT IS VERBAL ABUSE.
It covers quite a lot, in my experience.
With my last narc it was the silent treatment! He would make me so mad! I would blow up his phone with text messages that weren’t very nice! It would make him so mad he would break the silent treatment so that he could scream and yell at me! After awhile I would do it just because I knew how angry it made him!! 😝 But there have been so many in my life and with each one it was different.
Hello FM1t .. same here! with all being different
I literally bust out laughing when people attempt to gaslight me.
The dirty doc tried that once and tried to make me think I was crazy – I was so insulted and yet at the same time I couldn’t control myself from busting out and laughing.
While laughing I said “You can’t make me think I’m crazy. Who the fuck do you think you are talking to Dr. (his name)? Let me remind you right the fuck now you are talking to Dr. HQ – don’t you ever speak to me like I am some peasant.” He just stared at me and then said “I’m not a peasant either!” LMAO I can’t……I’m laughing so hard right now.
Another one of the dirty docs favorite moves was to call everyone a borderline. When we were fighting at one point he is like “I recognize this behavior – you’re such a fucking borderline.” Once again I started laughing because he couldn’t provide any examples of this so-called borderline behavior. He was going on about this and that and how I suck at this and that deflecting from his INSANE and nasty behavior on vacation…
Dirty Doc: I recognize this behavior! You are such a fucking borderline!
Dr. HQ: HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. Really? You think everyone is a fucking borderline. I’m closer to a fucking psychopath than I am to borderline! Did you ever consider you are invalidating my very existence and telling me how to think and feel and be in order to be accepted by you? OH…NO…you didn’t! I”M NOT AN EXTENSION OF YOU! I’m my own person! Oh and how dare I react in any which way to your outlandish statements. Let me take it further – this became about how I suck at this and I’m all these terrible things when this conversation was really about your INSANE and out of control NASTY belligerent behavior that you displayed the other night.
Dirty Doc: So are you telling me you are a fucking psychopath?
Dr. HQ: What if I was?
Dirty Doc: WELL ARE YOU?
Dr. HQ: NO YOU MORON – I SURE AS SHIT WISH I WAS RIGHT NOW. You have a whole lot to say about me – how I’m this and that and how I SHOULD BE this way or that way. People are drawn to me because I’m authentic…YOU…you’re a car salesman. You are a fake, fraud and a fucking narcissist. Oh look at that mask slipping. You couldn’t hold your shit together for 24 hours after you lost your shit when we went away and made a scene! You couldn’t fake it for fucking 24 hours! Oh I’m all these terrible things right? I have nothing to contribute to a relationship RIGHT? ::Now I have an evil little smile on my face and I’m looking at him dead in the eye and all of a sudden got cold and calm:: WHO ARE YOU? Oh what was that? You’re nobody because you have no sense of self. You don’t even know who you are….
::The dirty doc just starts to stare off blankly for a moment surprised at the bomb i just dropped::
You do realize you are a narcissist, don’t you?
LOL Evoking Dahlias. Thank you for saying what many people here would like to say.
Dear Dr HQ,
you could write narc novellas. They’d be a sensation. You have soooo much material to work with!
Caroline,
Someone told me to write a story about a psychologist and a psychopath lol.
Hmmmm… maybe I will.
Thanks for the inspiration 🙃
You’re welcome Dr HQ
Good ideas can come from the strangest of places, and after we’ve been through some tough times.
I want us to derive some benefit from our suffering at the hands of Ns.
There is a market opening up, and you just might be the right person at the right time.
Caroline,
The right person at the right time…
I like the sound of that lol. You might be right.
When you refer to the market opening up – can you elaborate?
I always get DEFLECTION, CIRCULAR CONVOS, VERBAL ABUSE.
Once the initial emotional reaction to what they are doing subsides and it hits me what I am dealing with I disengage. I go from HOT and emotional to cold. This is because I realize it’s pointless. I space out or I walk away.
I admit the cold reaction doesn’t happen right (while the deflection, circular convo and verbal abuse is occurring in the moment) – it happens after the first or second time. I become so angry and emotional at first but that shit dies down real fast – once the hot emotion leaves me…I think logically and know what I am dealing with and become cold. There is literally no point engaging and I don’t wanna bang my head against a wall and I’m over it.
I think you left one out, HG, unless I am misunderstanding. I was about to choose ST but MRN only failed to respond to me twice – once during Act I (before I knew about IPPS) and once during Act IV, post-escape. He never did it during the main part of the FR (Act II). He always responded, even if he was curt. He would even tell me where he was. Once I got upset because he suddenly disappeared after a period of relative stability. He responded from a bathroom at 6:00 a.m. when he was away with IPPS.
What he did do constantly was intermittent reinforcement/approach-avoid. That is, he would be present, then distance himself, present then distant etc. Where would that fit?
In any case, I chose circular conversations because that is what seemed to encapsulate our relationship – conversations being understood here symbolically. Everything was circular, whether we were actually discussing it or not.
I chose triangulation which is the one my narc uses the most. HG has helped me so much since I found his site. Both reading his articles and consultations I have booked, his answers are always spot-on. I would like to nominate him for an award for the assistance and answers he has provided and continues to provide. I, for one, would not have known what I was involved with had I not found him. Does anyone know where HG can be nominated for the brilliant work he does?
I agree with you, gyserempath, about nominating HG for an award. If this happened, I will be the first one to vote for him.
Physical violence .
Dear DoForLuv,
…. that just breaks my heart 💔
Luv Bubbles xx 💜
Love you Bubbles 🤗❤️
I chose word salad because in my opinion this covers , lying, blame shifting, future faking, manipulation , it’s all the same to me, just talking circular bullshit constantly . I have to say one of the things that i think should be highlighted more is presenting as commitment phobics ( which of course they are ) but this is misleading and something that should be a giant red flag, this of course will be presented as how much they’ve been the victim of awful evil women in the past !! These so called dating coaches are raking in the cash based on these Avoident men that women are apparently handling wrongly !! I wonder what percentage are actually dealing with narcissists …
Actually it was difficult to choose just one, but ultimately I chose lying.
It is not listed, but my father always asked things to be done with the nicest smile on his face, pretending I was the only one on earth to be able to make it. It worked 100% until age 28. 🙂
I picked verbal abuse/belittling because I could choose only one. Projection was was also hugely used, seeing me they way THEY were or accusing me of things THEY did. Accusations and interrogations were constant. Blame shifting. They purposely would provoke me and NO MATTER what I said or did I was blamed for THEIR bad behavior. They would say things emphatically then later emphatically deny they said it and I was crazy. Expect me to constantly show love and affection and if I didn’t I was accused of every reasir under the sun for being distant, while they barely gave me crumbs of affection. The double standards were too maby to mention.. I could go on and on but you already know she ( female to female) did all these things and more.
The last nex used verbal abuse the most, and small incidents of physical abuse thrown in (with enough blame shifting, word salad, projection, gaslighting, etc- to make me question the reality of what was happening) When the physical abuse became obvious and seriously threatened my safety and the safety of my children – I escaped
I’ve been NC since. And completely TRULY NC after talking with HG.
He went to jail
It’s been 1 yr No Contact this week. (At least on my part. He’s been hoovering and slandering me the whole bloody time) What a mess
Me, I’m healing.. better every day 🌼
Thank you HG. You’ve been a big help, you’re writing has been a beacon of light in my darkness
Oops! *YOUR
You are welcome Jasmine.
Way to go Jasmine! One year no contact is awesome. Let his violent ass rot in jail!
Awe, thank you MB XOX 💕
It’s been a long difficult road, but I’m starting to see the “light at the end of the tunnel”!
** I wish he was still in jail! But long term jail sentences are rare for DV. He had to wear a tracking device for about 6 months (And had a RO for the year)
After I turned him in for breaking the RO, he was arrested again. The state filed another case, so he copped a plea of “no contest” on both cases, and the judge changed it to “Guilty” haha. I loved that! There is some justice in this world, however small
Hi Jasmine,
One year NC is a great achievement. Thanks for writing that there is a N in jail; that makes me happy. May he be joined by many more who should be there already.
I wish you continued healing, safety and happiness for your future, and that of your children.
Thank you Caroline !!! (((SQUEEZE!!))) You are an angel XOX 💋
He’s no longer in jail, and he’s probably found me here (freaking stalker!) But it was glorious to see the “guilty” proclaimed by the judge, without having to go to court too!
Now it’s my time to focus on ME
HUGS xx
Cannot say a single one the most because all of them were employed and they were all truly devastating to one’s person, eventually.
I look at my ailing partner of over 30 yrs, who has made my life hell. He sits in his chair. He can’t even get up to use the bathroom. I go over in my mind all of the scenarios and tactics he used. I cannot count how many times I tried to run from him,just to be dragged back..How when we first met he talked me into using my excellent credit to start a business which completely failed destroying my credit. I have been so brainwashed by this man. In the beginning I would confide all my secrets just to have them used against me. I cannot have my supervisors phone # because when we fight he grabs my phone and says he is going to call my boss and tell her everything. This is just scraping the surface. THANKS TO HG TUDOR. I am now 57.I have a good 20 yrs left. But what do I do with this human being sitting in front of me who is helpless but has caused so much pain I want him to suffer the way I have suffered. I know that will never be because in his mind he never did anything wrong
You plop him in a nursing home and live the life you have left and deserve.
That’s hilarious and a perfect solution!
wissh,
I second that opinion/advice! I thought mine was too sick to wreak anymore havoc, he was terminal!
Instead this mean MFer was robbing me of every single penny, as long as there was some way for him to contact the outside world, he was siphoning it off, giving it away, looking like he is handing out generous bequeaths, and bragging how well I’ll be set financially.
All he left was lies and debt.
chris m
Guilt and obligation were used against me. Don’t let it be used against you! You owe the N nothing! You are not guilty of what they have brought upon themselves. They owe you everything, but they WILL MAKE YOU PAY IF THEY CAN!
Dump that N in a nursing home, set it up so the N is the financially responsible party.
Or if you do have the money, and can afford it, are willing to pay, and can control who the N contacts, putting them in a nursing home maybe well worth your money in that you need not waste anymore time on this N. You can consider that you have been most generous in fulfilling any “obligation” you think you have to the N.
And the damned creature is still alive. That is a big one. He does owe you for not going “pillow therapy” on him.
Dear wissh,
Best advice ever 👏…. absolutely brilliant !
🥇🏆🥇🏆🥇🏆
Luv Bubbles xx 😘
Chris, I understand your situation very well. Not a husband but a mother. I can tell you from experience, please dont harm him, it only makes you feel guilty. I came very close to doing something very violent to my mother. I agree, no matter what he made you promise, put him in a nursing home. Make sure he’s set up well and everyone there knows everything they need to know, then walk away. Request to be removed as his health care representative. Divorce him and then remove yourself as power of attorney. You can legally do that. You are not required by law to be responsible for him. I dont care what he told you. Consult an attorney, you may have to divorce him first. But run, please just run and never look back. It will be overwhelmingly painful for a short time. You will catch tons of crap from friends and family, but grap onto your freedom like a bulldog and run like hell. It’s the only way. I tried it, mother and I kept father at home for 11yrs as he declined with multiple strokes. Run, baby, run. It only gets worse and they get meaner and meaner the sicker they get. They hate you for not being sick. He also shot me! Run!
Silent treatment, followed closely by triangulation and gaslighting.
He used ST because he figured out over time it was the best way to get me to fountain fuel and upset me the most due to all my abandonment issues etc.
Triangulation was used because he knew it got to me. I didn’t need to be the only one, but I wanted to be important.
Gaslighting was used to keep me confused and to give him more license to act like a dick.
Considering all relevant interactions with narcissists in my life I can remember, it was blameshifting.
This affected me in a peculiar way: I developed a tendency to take the blame for anything a culprit was needed for on me. It became obvious at the workplace at one point when some of my coworkers started making fun of this habit which I was unable to explain. I tried to stop that reflex but it continued to happen.
Somehow I seemed to be guilty all the time.
For many years I have tried to work on myself, to improve, to become a better person, to make less and less mistakes. This effort was exacerbated when I found all those Bible / mindfulness memes that tell you to look for the plank in your own eye before you accuse anybody else of wrongdoing.
When my narc lover (wrongly and intentionally so) accused me of a major misconduct as an intro to the discard it came to me as an almost natural reflex: I was sure that I had caused a major misunderstanding, that I was to blame fully for the fact that everything was ruined now. I should have acted and spoken more clearly. I should have been able to foresee and to prevent this possibility of a misunderstanding…
I even felt bad for him.
But meanwhile I have indeed removed a speck from my eye: the speck that narcs used to hide behind.
Now that I can see them it has become surprisingly easy to say: “Hey it wasn’t me who did … (insert whatever suits you). You did it.”
“You are accountable.”
And I am utterly fascinated how they play the unaccountability card:
When I was about 10 years old I once came into a conflict with my mathematics teacher. I had become angry because he wouldn’t explain, i.e., he wouldn’t teach. Somehow he managed to tell my parents that I would behave like a wretched and cowardly conformist and at the same time like an impertinent and annoying extremist the way I had allegedly put my questions in class.
When they came home from the parent-teacher talk, I was drowned in my mother’s brainless accusations. I was reproached for doing one thing and for doing the opposite at the same time. No grown-up asked how or why, no grown-up took my side or even my point of view for a minute. The only issue my mother would bother herself with was the possibility that somebody might think she wasn’t fit to educate her daughter. (She definitely wasn’t fit to educate her daughter.)
This was more than 40 years ago. Again and again I had wondered, over the years, what had happened in that moment.
After that I developed another strange habit: When I didn’t know people very well I often stopped speaking in the middle of a sentence in formal conversation. This was irritating to the people who were speaking with me. To me as well.
At least I could delete that trait when I grew older. Today I can see how all these contradictory and malicious accusations that could come down on me at any time have been the cause of that reflex.
What I also know: silent treatment, triangulation, verbal abuse, word salad, lying. But blameshifting is my number one.
Regards to all of you
DF
DF
You explained yourself really well here.
I’m pleased for you that you are seeing things clearly now, and that the weight of responsibility that was never yours to begin, with has dropped off you. You can breathe now.
The confident person that you have a right to be will emerge like a butterfly with beautiful new wings.
Thank you Caroline. Indeed I am surprised about that moment of revelation when so many things fell into place, and I hope that many more people will have those moments and feel so much better afterwards.
I have been lucky only to come across one partner who I believe to be a narc,this being my most recent.I believe he used the silent treatment the most as he new it was hurtful and very confusing it must of been very obvious and rewarding to see a relatively strong person going out of their mind not knowing what I had done to cause it,and almost begging for answers.
We hadn’t been together long and the love bombing had been so intense that I moved in straight away,leaving a home and a bewildered partner behind me.We were surely in the honey moon period still (4 wks in for Christ sake!!!)so why silence,no cuddles and no intimacy??? BECAUSE he was bored already.RIGHT???
After a week of unfortunate events I was perceived by Narc Mom to have done many things wrong. I received a two week silent treatment which included my Stepdad and young sister who weren’t allowed to talk to me. I ended up becoming depressed, suicidal and left the house in the middle of the night. My father took me for psychiatric care and I moved in with him the next day. I went no contact with her for over a year after that.
The narcissists in my life, upon hearing this story, were tipped off that this form of manipulation would greatly effect me. Feeling unseen is unpleasant but over time I learned to ignore them back and for much longer. As an empath, when I’m angered, I will go silent as well to avoid hurting others and embarrassing myself ..so I get it to a degree. Narcissists take it to far with silence until you feel harshly rejected. It really is their way of killing you.
What happens when the Narcissist becomes sick and unable to take care of himself?
You are expected to do it.
Chris
I’m curious about this also, I’m a nurse, his ex-wife was also a nurse. He’s aging and declining. It’s no longer my problem but early in our relationship it was something I was willing to take on. But I didn’t know what he was.
Wissh,
My N-FIL first had my MIL to take care of him. After she died it was an army of people, like the neighbours would bring meals or clean the windows etc.. He had us for the weekend-care and he would have a cleaning lady and many different nurses to come to his home for medication and to wash him and in the end change his diapers as well, before he had a doctor to end his life with an injection (which is legal in our country). he could not live with the degradation/humiliation any longer.
Dearest wissh,
They seem to gravitate to any type of “carer” …. particularly nurses and teachers are the most vulnerable, I believe
I was the “only friend” to come forward to help him after his hospitalisation …. cleaned his place, take meals ….. then “boom” you’re gone (I’m not a nurse myself, however I’m very capable and efficient with sickness, care and looking after others)
From what I’ve heard … his victim after me is in the “care” industry
I think she’s now finally gone, after their “on off on off” relationship
(He was always mentioning different nurses he knew)
The weasel has his foot in the door with many schools and hospitals …no energy required for his prey with an abundance of supply ….all those caring empathic targets yet to be destroyed by mind body n soul
If all else fails, he still has his “golden child” to take care of him…bit like I am with my mother…. makes one sick 😷 🤢
👩⚕️
Luv Bubbles xx
I am a nurse. Coincidences? No. They are looking for a free caregiver. Not gonna happen. My ex narc aims at nurses because he has heart problems. Smart narc, huh?
We shall see.
You sit with a good cup of coffee, your cute feet up in a pillow, and enjoy the show he will engage in. Watch him shrinking away like a poisonous plant, his little soul going in and out of his rotten body gasping for air as he experiences near death but unfortunately keeps coming back… like a freaking Dracula trying to suck fuel out of you. Make sure you enjoy every second of the fake pain, agony, and crying wolf bullshit he will throw at you. Hook him to a monitor and watch those vital signs and believe the monitors, not the narc. Deem him incompetent (confused), sign a DNR order and let sweet nature takes its course.
Unless he is handsome like HG, not worth your time 😉
joking! I am a nurse. Dark humor is my fav coping mechanism… even if hides the truth… I am just kidding again… 🙂
No I am not.
Kathy Mor, I can’t do ‘likes’ here but I found that very amusing. Dark humor is what we need.
SMH
If you only could see my thoughts…………
Holy crap Kathy! You exactly described something my father did, 20 yrs ago. The whole “soul slipping in and out of the body and near death experiences “. He has his first stroke when I was 17. We kept him at home(Matrinarc insisted) for 11 yrs. Then 2 yrs in nursing home after the doctor removed him from mothers care. Last few years were spent in the fetal position only moving his eyes. He lost his ability to speak clearly just a few years in, but would talk in his sleep, very clearly, reliving the WWII. Then when he was completely immobile and no longer speaking, he would look up and talk to the air, but he couldn’t or wouldn’t speak otherwise. Matrinarc said it was his guides taking him back and forth between worlds. It was fascinating and terrifying. The night he died, I could go into his room. Went to the smoking area and cried. I very clearly heard him bark, ” You’re not crying for me, so dry it up.” He didn’t allow crying, it just made him mad, apparently even death.
Kathy Mor
that made me laugh!
No Contact is like stamping Do Not Resuscitate on a relationship file with a N.
It’s dead.
The mortuary staff are on their way.
We’re having a cremation.
Empath’s Codicil:
Provision can be made for HG, under certain circumstances. Like if he promises to not mentally torture lovely empaths anymore.
it’s not that simple depending on what type of narcissist I am dealing with as to what they use , I can usually tell when they are fishing for information to use later to punish me and as my mother is a greater narcissist I never give up the information of my biggest weakness anymore,I learned that the hard way
I don’t fear much because I know what I have survived and frankly a good percentage of my life has been a horror story I’m the type of person that narcissists like to really push to extremes, when my mother would inflict one of her many forms of abuse as a child it would usually follow someone else being kind to me and she would play the doting mother until we were alone and then after she would ring friends and family crying saying all sorts of lies about me and gain sympathy for it
How it affected me I learnt from it I know the feeling of the poisonous snake in the grass
I have never had a real attraction to lower narcissist I find intelligence attractive but as narcissists they are the worst they use mind games and gaslighting and sex as a weapon and the devaluation period is very intense but even them I can spot , their arrogance gives them up they believe so much in their ability to win people over and they underestimate me
I will never give up my compassion empathy or love it’s what really makes my life worth living
Narcissists only take your power if you allow it and yes I dare say I will probably get hurt again but not twice by the same person . My love is unconditional I don’t know any other way but my trust and respect are not
Gaslighting. It fucks up your brain so bad that you can’t tell a Narc from a Super Empath.
I feel I have to apologize to my mother for smearing her here, telling everyone she’s a narcissist, when she’s probably a Super Empath. And that makes a huge difference in wether I want to take care of her if she can’t take care of herself anymore. She’has probably only copied her parents narcish behaviour. I guess empaths do silent treatments and manipulations as well.
How can you ever be sure?
Matrinarc (or super empath): Silent Treatment, Verbal abuse/belittling, Triangulation, Blameshifting, The issuing of threat, Physical Violence, and the worst of all: the always succesful GUILT TRIP!
N-ex husband: Gaslighting, (mainly present) Silent treatment, Triangulation, Lying, Blameshifting, Circular conversations, Projection, Infidelity, Word Salad, Deflection
Musician Narc: Silent treatment, Triangulation, Lying, Gaslighting, Blameshifting, Projection, Infidelity, The issuing of threat
Blank
She is a Matrinarc based on your comments about her.
Thanks K, I think I know, I just don’t wanna know I guess.
My pleasure Blank. It’s ok, my mother is one, too. You are not alone.
Blank, Consult with HG as he can tell you, given enough relevant information. It’s liberating and life-changing to know if you are dealing with a Narc. It’s like taking off the rose-tinted glasses or swallowing the Neo pill from the Matrix series. You can never not see them as Narcs again. Thanks to HG!
Kimi, I’ve gone full NC with HG. . So I’m happy K did the diagnoses.
Full no contact with HG?
I received my narc detector results from HG yesterday, I’m so glad I did that consult. He explained so much and now that I’m becoming more familiar with schools and cadres and all the shorthand used on this blog my understanding is increasing. Initially it was like trying to learn a new language. The affirmation was really empowering too. Thanks HG!
Pleasure.
Blank
You seem a bit fragile at the moment, are you OK? Are you a bit overwhelmed with life, and emotional pain at the moment?
It’s OK if you are, it happens.
I’m working through the truth about my N-mum, and the implications of being the eldest daughter of a N-mother.
It can be confusing and painful on so many levels.
We will have problems with self-esteem, with boundaries, perfectionism, saying no, addictions, knowing who we are, knowing how we feel, needing to be deprogrammed from years of gaslighting…
Self-sabotage, overachieving, anxiety, depression, intimacy issues because we don’t know what being loved and accepted feels like yet, so many things… We can feel deeply disconnected from others, and deeply lonely all through life because of attachment trauma. We can be unassertive, and a doormat, or we hold everyone at arm’s length. We can be plagued by guilt, and be compulsive pleasers
Plus we are attracted to men who are smothering, controlling, or emotionally disconnected, and so we can feel like a failure because we haven’t found happiness with a partner yet. We can find friendships difficult.
So much to work through, and if any of these is part of your stress at the moment, we encourage you to be kind to yourself.
We know what it’s like.
It will take as long as it takes. It can’t be hurried.
A mother/daughter relationship is difficult enough without the mother also being an abusive narcissist.
Caroline, the points you have made in this comment are very interesting to me, is your mother a narcissist and did you become aware of these things you have mentioned from some kind of therapy ? thank you
Blank,
Totally not trying to start anything…
If you’ve gone no contact with HG, that means you wouldn’t be on the blog.
No contact is like literally no contact – pretend the person died and don’t exist.
For example…when I go no contact – I disappear. I ignore. I block. This is because in my mind I want nothing to do with this person.
*Doesn’t not DON’T exist
Pretend the person doesn’t exist.
Caroline,
Just came across your comment that was addressed to me. You are right about every word. I’m going to see my parents tomorrow and I know it’ll take me another week to ‘recover’.
Is your mother still alive Caroline?
Thanks for caring and taking the time to write your comment. xx
Harley, I know what NC means dear, I was just ‘joking’ (probably in a negative way) to say to HG that I was angry because he was messing with the comments. But I’m like half NC. If I didn’t come across a few comments addressed to me, I would not be commenting right now. Fighting with you took too much of my energy. Take care Harley xx
Except I was not.
HG,
“Except I was not.”
Yes darling, I know you were going to say that.
I dreamt about you the night before last night. You were lying in a boat on a lake, wearing t-shirt & jeans and had blonde curly hair. Your head was hanging over the side of the boat. A big ship came towards you, but you didn’t notice it and it smashed your head, You were dead. Next in my dream somebody showed me a slow motion video of the crash. Your head was pushed completely flat, like a rubber ball would in slow-mo and then it went back in normal shape. Nothing was broken and there was no blood.
How could this happen, we wondered. Did you have super power?
After I woke up, I realized that I wasn’t feeling horrified, like I usually would have felt after such a dream, but I felt completely nutral, nothing.
Perhaps the scariest about this is that I dream about you anyway.
(after I worried something happened to you, because you were gone for a day or two). I hate it that you ghost. Why don’t you tell us that you will be gone for a few days or so, that would be sweet.
(No) hugs (because you hate them) xx
Blank,
Gaslighting *does* make you feel crazy! Ex-hubby, the whoring psychopath, used so much gaslighting- I really did think I was losing it. Of course it turned out to be even worse than I imagined.
>> I made him answer all my questions. Turns out he was sleeping with anything on 2-legs (and I’m being generous) Unfortunately – knowing the truth did little to change the situation
Fucking musicians 😠
Jasmine, hi!
“Fucking musicians” .. right!
I can’t even recall all the feelings I had for more than 3 years. From being intensely in love, to confusion, anxiety, hurt, pain, mourning.
Never in my life have I cried this much (I never cried actually – apart from the loss of my best friend).
His abuse was so different from my N-ex husbands, which I call ‘slow abuse’ (like active silent treatments, neglect and very suttle gaslighting/manipulation)
But I can see them now for what they are and I feel sad for them.
Are you okay now Jasmine?
Lying in the sense of not being genuine is really at the heart of most interaction with the narcissist. So I chose lying as the most common manipulation. Pretty much everything they do and say is a lie.
Character Assassination/Smear Campaign is the form of manipulation that is used against me the most by narcissists and has become a life theme.
(Present) Silent Treatment is actually used against me by the Normals and Empaths who had their minds polluted by the narcissist.
The reason I think this one was used against me more than others is that the narcissist believes that I might be threat to her.
Silent treatment, always. Not answering messages. Saying he needed space. And let me tell you that I never double-text, because I’m to proud to do so. Still, he managed to make me feel needy when I said it’s just rude to continue a conversation 3 days later as if nothing happened. I’m getting angry again, writing this comment. Angry that I allowed someone to treat me like that. Oh, the passive agression. It literally makes me feel sick!
There also was some gaslighting, projection, blameshifting, triangulation, lying and infidelity. The ideal narcissist. 👹
Definitely had to be the Silent Treatment. Ex Narc did that to me for the slightest of infractions…i.e. not answering my mobile phone when he called, even though I was in with the doctor at the time and called him straight back 10 mins later. Got the silent treatment for a week.
Anyways, right now I’m using the very same tactic against him …5 months NC and counting (will be FOREVER).
Selected silent treatment – but equally could have chosen Deflection and Word Salad. Somatic mid range.
Silent treatment, gaslighting,triangulation,lying
I guess silence really is golden….for a narcissist at least .
Hard to choose one- all apply