Poll : What Would You Wish For The Narcissist?

KTN Poll - H.G Wants To Know Post Graphic

You have been granted one wish. This wish has to be applied to the narcissist (or narcissists if there was more than one) that you have entangled with in your life.

Whether it was a romantic, social, familial, work or other ensnarement, what would you want the narcissist to experience? Do you wish them dead? Perhaps you want them to change and be genuinely remorseful for everything that they have done? Maybe you would prefer them to be placed in isolation and with no access to fuel? Go with your gut response. Do expand on why you chose this in the comment.

Thank you for participating.

You have one wish the outcome of which is applied to the narcissist. Which one of the following would you choose?

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124 thoughts on “Poll : What Would You Wish For The Narcissist?

  1. myriflemyponynme says:

    Death. Complete Opportunity cessation.

  2. Kristina MacLean says:

    I have zero interest in going back to my ex Narc, though I think of him often, the sex was amazing….
    Do you think that if the human mind can talk you into an affliction, that with time (therapy) etc, that a person with this affliction can with fortitude, determination, & hard-work would be able to see the negative aspects about himself, & change. I don’t mean become a different person I mean evolve past being the kind of person who requires fuel? Or requires control?
    Also, sadly I feel what made my ex so wonderful in bed, is the same thing that drives the Narcissist..

    1. HG Tudor says:

      No.

  3. FMV says:

    Isn’t it funny to see that even if they hurt us deeply, most of us still wish them well… I feel so sorry for him, he only has one life as well, and it’s a life of hell, of solitude, never feeling satisfied or happy or fulfilled… Won’t make me come back though…

  4. DEMBunny says:

    Ok I thought about it as I’d said whatever my one wish was- I didn’t know- but whatever it would be, wasn’t on here
    Ok so after some thought , I realized I just don’t mind what happens to my narcs now, my one wish would be for myself and that is to just accept I’ll probably never find the kind of love I had/have for my narc bc it was my own love for myself reflected—. So to accept that , but instead of feel empty or sad knowing I likely won’t find it again w a healthy person- and to just revel in and enjoy and really FEEL that self-love solo. It’s already happening so, my wish is for it to grow. It’s not my business what happens to him.

  5. amanda SNapchat says:

    i wish the narc nothing.
    who da fuck cares….

    for recovery i think we should all think that way. who da fuck cares

  6. Taryn says:

    I chose no longer a narcissist because by all accounts the narcissist leads an empty life filled with pain, unhappiness and fear. I have my theory as to why my narc is the way he is and it’s heartbreaking. I know he’s not lying about the things he went through as a child because I see the signs of PTSD. I’ve also witnessed his nightmares during which it is clear that he’s absolutely terrified. In the same way some of us may have suffered a severe accident that left us horribly and permanently scarred, so too did my narc suffer terrible trauma and pain, leaving a “narcissism scar”. This “scar” renders him incapable of perceiving and reacting normally to relationship dynamics, trust anyone, empathize with others or experience intimacy. It’s not his fault he became this way. He didn’t ask for this and as a child he sure didn’t do anything to deserve being sentenced to a desolate, miserable life. I would take that from him if I could, so that he might have the ability experience happiness, intimacy, trust and love.

  7. Geminimom says:

    To be miserable without me for life. It’s possible if he doesn’t have an ipps.

    I chose isolation no fuel.

  8. Veronique Jones says:

    To know what love is and be able to trust someone will love them and know what it feels like to love unconditionally

  9. Sweetest Perfection says:

    If I could make it happen, “no longer a narcissist.” Maybe he would still be a fucking player, that doesn’t guarantee anything, but at least I would not be constantly fearing a hoover or smears or anything else. If I think practically and realistically, I would choose death, though. For many reasons, none of them related to desire for revenge.

    1. BurntKrispyKeen says:

      Hello Sweetest Perfection – “No longer a narcissist.” Yes!!! It would be sooo nice to live in a world free from narcissistic abuse. I’d let ’em keep a few of their “healthy” narcissistic qualities, but that whole player aspect is what burnt me the most. 🤬

      I have been thinking about you, SP. How did it go a bit back, when you were to run into your ex-narcissist at a work event?

      1. Sweetest Perfection says:

        Thanks for thinking of me, BKK. It did go well, I ran into him twice. The first time I simply pretended I didn’t know him and ignored him and he did look but didn’t say anything. The second time he was walking toward me and a male colleague I just had lunch with. I took advantage that I was not alone and he was to just say “hey” and he hugged me and said “it’s good to see you.” After that, a few anonymous calls and intends of indirect hoovers but nothing really serious. I think he has plenty of supply so I’ll be fine I hope.

        1. BurntKrispyKeen says:

          It sounds as if you handled that quite well, SP! 😊 I enjoy that you had a colleague with you … when the ex greeted you in such a way. It almost feels as if he was trying to mark his territory.
          🐕😝 (Was the male co-worker handsome, by chance?)

          I am happy for you … that you were able to hold strong. Nice work, my virtual friend. 💖

          1. Sweetest Perfection says:

            You are too kind, BKK. No, my male colleague is not particularly attractive, but neither is narc’s IPPS so I guess that really doesn’t matter. I think I handled it well because he seems pathetic to me now. The anxiety of the encounter was worse than the actual encounter.

  10. Kate W says:

    I voted for branding them on the forehead since I know she’ll never change—But TRULY I would wish for a permanent golden period with me! I mean why not… That would be the optimal.

  11. Chihuahuamum says:

    Forgot to mention something in my post…but years ago i met a friend online and i cant remember exactly how they worded it but it sticks in my mind the meaning behind it. Basically they said revenge and negative emotions towards another is like poison to the system. When you feel this way you are taking a dose of poison and you alone are the one who will suffer. Its so true. These feelings come back to eat away at your insides and make you a miserable person. Narcissists are the epitome of this. They are poisoned inside due to jealousy, envy and so much negativity.

  12. MommyPino says:

    No longer a narcissist. I don’t need anything bad to happen to them or genuine remorse from them. I don’t need anything from them but as a fellow human being, it would be nice for the society as a whole to have less narcissists.

    1. BurntKrispyKeen says:

      Agree! You said it well, MommyPino… even though I (selfishly 😔) would enjoy a little remorse.
      But HG’s recent “article” on guilt summed it up quite efficiently. 🤦‍♀️

      1. mommypino says:

        Thank you BKK! So happy to see you here again. I have been wondering where you were!

        1. BurntKrispyKeen says:

          Thank you, MP! I have been busy with work and other matters, helping to care for two sick aunts. Life is busy for us all, but there are times when I let my duties overwhelm me a bit. 🤪

          Before HG chose to make his IG account private, I would check in both here and there. (My curiosity 😸 wouldn’t allow a complete break.) I checked out your page, MommyPino, and very much enjoyed your IG photos. I certainly understand that you were protecting your children’s identity, but even through the disguise, I could tell that they are absolutely adorable! I especially liked the picture of your son and daughter in their gorgeous church clothes. So Sweet!

          I have been reading your posts as well and can relate to so much of your message, especially the part where you spoke of how attracted you were to the handyman, but now you don’t see him quite as handsome. If I look at photos of my narcissist, I now wonder what the hell I was thinking?! Sometimes, I don’t find him attractive at all. I actually didn’t at first, but like you said, they are sooo charming, giving us this illusion of such great love… a love I craved. His attention and promises were so intriguing that my attraction to this man’s brain (and pretend heart) made me start to find his physical attributes desirable. (Sometimes his hairy belly will still pop into my mind … and those hard drummer arms … ahhh … but for the most part, he’s simply not so great anymore.) I tell myself, “Do you want someone who can tell an exciting story, or do you want someone loyal?” The problem is, I’m having a hard time finding “regular” men desirable. Even the sweet ones, which is a trait that I am drawn to in certain gentlemen (as long as they have enough masculinity to balance that out 😀) … I still find myself going “eh – whatever.” I haven’t been impressed yet … not that I’ve been looking very hard. I just wonder if and when that negativity will lift? Am I going to be so affected by this narcissistic entanglement that nothing else will excite me again? Or are we all so damaged from the hurt that we keep our hearts guarded in such a way that we can’t really open up to another?

          Sorry, MommyPino, for getting off course and asking you therapist-worthy questions. I really just wanted to say that I enjoy your posts, even when I don’t have the time to comment.

          1. mommypino says:

            BKK thank you for looking at my pictures and reading my posts. I’m really crazy about those two kids that I have. I think they are both turning out to be empaths but their personalities are so different from day one. The boy is the sweet empath, always picking weed flowers for me and telling me I’m beautiful and I make the birds sing in a butterfly tree and I’m holding a bird. I have no idea what that means but he says it full of love and devotion. Last year he actually picked a rose for me and not just a dandelion or other weed flowers like he usually do so I pressed it as souvenir. He’s also already a smooth talking empath. The little girl is the feisty empath. It’s so funny to watch them argue, they would repeat themselves whether he says yes and she says no and he would try to go on a long explanation on why he’s right and she would just cut him off with a raspberry and look away with such a strong attitude like she doesn’t care and it would get him so mad. She has such a big and thick voice too like that of a smoker. Her voice overpowers our sweet boy’s and also because there’s an attitude of confidence and conviction in her big voice as if whatever she says is final and the truth and it really annoys him. They’re too funny. But she’s also extremely sweet, she always tells him that she loves her big brother and pets his head while tilting her head with a smile. She’s a natural caretaker too, she always asks if we need something or want something. She’s only two and he just turned five but their personalities too well-developed already.

            I totally understand you BKK on the attraction to narcissists vs the non narcs. I think narcs are like junk food that are so addictive and yummy but bad for us. So now we are trying to make logical decisions and eat kale chips and cauliflower fried rice and it’s just not as yummy as the real chips and fried rice. And to be honest, I lucked out and found a man who is not a narc, has empathic qualities, but highly narcissistic that sometimes he almost can be mistaken as one. He’s very dominant and sometimes bossy as if we’re in a surgery room and I’m his scrub. Although when I bring it to his attention he adjusts. I don’t think that I would be attracted to him and fall in love if he was purely empathic. Female empaths seem to be attracted to narcs because they exhibit masculine strength and energy but I think male empaths have the same problem because that’s why they ended up here because they are attracted to narcs as well. Although I noticed that female narcs like my mom did not exhibit the same strong masculine narc energy that female empaths love about the male narcs. My mom exhibited an underlying strength also during the seduction, but the main energy that she exhibited was female energy that taps into the male empath’s ‘savior complex’. Female empaths just don’t seem to ask much from men which makes men bored because they want to be a woman’s hero whereas female narcs ask a lot from the empathic men and make them feel like heroes and manly.

          2. BurntKrispyKeen says:

            Greetings, MommyPino!
            Reading about your children made me smile. It seems as if every mother can sense, pretty quickly from birth, the ways in which her children are different. They just seem to enter the world with their own unique dispositions. What a blessing that both of yours exhibit such kindness! I am sure a large portion is due to your own empathic traits, but to see that type of sweet innocence from a child… it simply warms my heart. 😊🧡
            I’m thinking that your daughter is going to grow up to be a strong empathic leader of some important organization. This will be great since we women need more examples like her. Perhaps she will someday serve as a powerful commander of sorts, while being the well-balanced woman who plays for the empathic team. (I won’t let the narcissists claim her like they do every other high achiever. Pff! 🤨)
            And your son… well, prepare yourself Mommy… I think the ladies are going to be all over him. (No young mother wants to think about THAT, but this child is a charmer! 😊)
            I like that the little lady already shows signs of such conviction and that your young man is able to be so expressive. It is clear that you already know how blessed you to have those precious children…. and your strong yet sensitive husband, too. I agree with you on your views of how and why we are drawn to certain masculine/feminine characteristics and that we “opposites” certainly seem to attract. Thank you for your response, Mommypino. I always enjoy reading your comments.

          3. mommypino says:

            Thank you BKK! Those kids always make me happy. I am fascinated by their unique dispositions. I have been thinking that my matrinarc always had a problem with something about my personality or mannerisms and tried to change me or shape me with manipulative ways (threat, triangulation, or verbal and physical lashing) to this ideal child that she herself didn’t even really know. I’m just cherishing what God already gave me. I hope that they can be the best versions of themselves. 💕

            And bless you for helping take care of your two aunts. 💕

          4. BurntKrispyKeen says:

            I am sorry that she wasn’t able to see you for all that you are. You have risen well and beyond her expectations, no doubt. Your mother probably saw certrain traits in you that she actually admired… saw your gifts more than she ever let on, but like you said, she didnt know what to do with it. Your light is bright, MommyPino, even evident through my limitations to “see.” That brightness made her uncomfortable.
            Her loss. 💔
            It is such a shame that she was unable to enjoy you in the way that you appreciate and respect your own children. The beauty here is the way in which you have broken the cycle.
            That is a beautiful thing.

            Thank you for your kind words regarding my aunts. I feel as if I don’t do enough for them, but I do what I can. They both live in my state but not in the same town, so the added drive impedes my ability to help as much as I’d like. One is getting treatment for cancer and the other is about to have surgery, but through it all, they actually remain a lot of fun, so that certainly helps.

            I have taken care of two family members in my home in the past… and that wasn’t always much fun. I hate to admit that I’m still a bit worn down from it all. I joked with my mother that I hope I have something left when she gets in a bad way again… but I know that I will do my best when the moment comes.
            My sister is a kind soul but very practical. She is an accountant but helps to run a business now of which she is part owner. Thankfully, she was non-judgmental when I took care of our father, so I always respected my sister for not critiquing my every caregiving-move. I had another person do so regarding another family member. It seems the ones who are on the outer edge, doing the least, want to bark off orders the loudest. Fortunately, my sister had a “just do the best you can” kind of attitude with our dad. Her way of helping has always been to throw money at a problem whereas I usually give my time. My sister’s patience wears thin moreso than mine, so my mother reminds me that it’s not in her eldest child’s nature to be a caregiver. I think that’s Mama’s way of saying, “I’m counting on you, kid.” 😳

            When caring for my father, I was thankful that my sister wasn’t like my other situation with a “you served her sirloin – why not fillet mignon” type of expectations. That kind of criticism pisses me off in a way that makes a Supernova seem like a balanced response. But sometimes it’s best to just try and keep our cool. I just hope that when i crack, i don’t come undone completely. 🤪🔥

          5. NarcAngel says:

            BKK
            I can relate to what you have written here about the difference between you and your sister regarding the care of others. My sister is a nurse and has accused me of “throwing money” at problems as a solution. I tried to explain to her that I don’t do that to leave her holding the bag, but that I am not able to offer the emotional support at the level that is often required and that she and others can. I know my limitation in that regard, so I try to relieve the pressure for those who can by removing financial roadblocks. I will pay for things so that hopefully some of the pressure on them is relieved. For instance, when my sister was still in school for nursing (and had little income) I would give her gift cards to purchase gas for her car to take my mother to medical appointments and also for spa services that she enjoyed to relieve some of her stress. My reasoning was that my sister is more comforting in that setting and knows how to better converse with the doctors, and I recognized she had demands on her time and hoped the spa time would reward her with some relaxation. It was my way of contributing where I felt it would be most effective (I have accompanied my mother to appts and let’s just say it proved to be stressful for both of us lol). There are many other examples, but my sister’s view is that I am taking the easy way out. All of this to say, that I’m glad you do not hold this against your sister and that you recognize that some of us are as your mother says – not effective emotional care givers. We do appreciate your efforts and try to support them in the ways we think we can best help. I’m glad you have not allowed the difference to interfere in your relationship with your sister. It sounds that through her lack of criticism and support financially where she can, that she very much appreciates your efforts. I just wanted to offer what may be her perspective but that she may not communicate to you. Not all empaths are equal in the types of support that we can offer, and sometimes it comes across differently, but we do what we can. I’m sure you are appreciated more than you know.

          6. MommyPino says:

            BurntKrispyKeen, I admire your sense of humor and positive outlook. It is very hard to take care of sick relatives. I only had to do it once with my dad when he was dying of cancer. I remember it being physically and emotionally taxing but in a weird way it also elevated my self pride inside. I felt satisfied inside that I was able to serve him and made his way out better than if I wasn’t there. You are amazingly strong to have done it in your home twice and now you are going out of your way to drive to your aunts to help. That is definitely admirable. My matrinarc in the Phils. is being cared for right now by my cousins. She is not grateful for anything and different drama keeps unfolding each day. I am grateful to them for doing what I am unable to do.
            I am 💯 sure that you will be the best caretaker for your mom. You have that loving and caring heart and that counts more than a fillet mignon. I think it kinda rhymed. It’s so true that people who help the least tend to have the most expectations and criticisms. My husband has the same experience when he took care of his dad. I don’t know if it’s guilt being projected or just coming from their innate inability to self reflect. Even Normals sometimes are not very good at introspection. About your sister who is an accountant, she sounds very much like my engineer brother lol. Care taking is not their suit but they are willing to help from a distance and are appreciative. I think that your family is super blessed to have you. And also it is great to have someone with a good sense of humor and lightheartedness take care of you when everything in your body hurts.

          7. BurntKrispyKeen says:

            Mommypino, thank you for your sweet words. ❤ You have lifted me this morning. I appreciate you taking the time to respond, as I always enjoy reading your well-written responses.
            It sounds as if you know EXACTLY what I am speaking about! I can relate to that feeling you had when caring for your father. It is an honor, really, and it gives us a sense of peace like no other… especially once they pass… in knowing that we did all that we could.
            I am sorry that your mother is ill. She sounds feisty! Though I am sure that’s putting it mildly for a MatriNarc. 🙂 (Thank Goodness for those cousins, right!) But I do hope that she can be as well as possible. Everybody gets a little difficult when sick.
            I know it is such a long flight and you have two small children, but are you able to visit the homeland? Listening to the Filipinos I’ve worked with, I hear the Philippines have beautiful beaches. I’ve always wanted to go to see the shoreline. 🏝 (And to feast on lumpia. 😋)

          8. MommyPino says:

            Thank you BurntKrispyKeen, I have thought about coming home but my matrinarc has Tuberculosis and it’s contagious which means I cannot bring my kids with me. My husband and I have agreed that having them vaccinated against TB wouldn’t be a good option either because there is a risk for infection if their bodies do not take the vaccine the right way. They are so small that their little bodies might not be able to fight off the TB bacteria if they get infected. Leaving them to my husband would be the last resort if I really have to go home. But it will be hard because he works full time and we don’t have anybody else to help take care of the kids. They used to go to daycare in the mornings and I pick them up at 12 but I just pulled them out of daycare to homeschool them before my son starts to go to school for Kindergarten this fall. I just want to have them take gymnastics and horseback riding lessons before he starts going to school. Which also means that I will be visiting this site less often. Narcsite and HG’s books have been a true blessing in my life. I have been in constant communication with my cousins who help my mom and they are receiving a lot of abuse from her. I told them that I remember when I was in the 3-5 years of my life I used to watch my mom abuse them and drag them by holding their hair and screaming at them calling them whores. Their ages ranged at 14-17 at that time. I remember telling my mom to not do it because they’re nice and she told me that they’re not really nice and they’re just fooling me because I’m just a little kid. They could not believe that I remember all of that because I was so tiny they didn’t even think that I understood anything at that time. I could sense on the phone that it felt cathartic for each of them that I talked to that I remember and acknowledge what they experienced. I was coaching them about not letting my mom make them emotional and to ignore her and leave when she becomes abusive. One of them has already been doing that. They feel better that I don’t believe my mom when my mom complains about them. They seem to be thankful also that I keep communicating with them. It is hard because of the time zone difference, it is affecting my sleep but it’s better to support them. They’re not really helping her full time but they visit my mom every now and then to check on her. They were the ones who found her and brought her to the hospital when her lungs were full of water. I would totally understand if they don’t last but I appreciate each time that they still check on her.

            The Philippines is indeed beautiful. It looks very much like Hawaii except that Hawaii is a first world version of the Philippines with beautiful roads and big hotels and cleanliness. Some of the beaches in the Philippines are by far more naturally beautiful than Hawaii. A lot of the species of fish in Hawaii actually came from the Philippines. And it’s amazing to dive or snorkel in the Philippines because it’s part of the Coral Triangle which has 10 times more biodiversity than the Great Barrier Reef. The Coral Triangle includes the Philippines, Indonesia, Papua New Guinea, and I think Malaysia also. We went snorkeling in Palawan and it was like we were in a National Geographic show. We saw sea horses in their natural habitat in the more shallower areas full of sea weeds, we saw all kinds of Nemos and Dories. Filipinos actually cook the Dory fish. I saw an eel which scared me because it’s ugly with its mouth open while looking at me. We saw all kinds of fish in different colors and looks. We also went snorkeling above an old Japanese war ship that sunk. You will have lots of fun. Just don’t go to Mindanao because that’s where the terrorists are. Some people will tell you that it’s safe but it’s not worth taking the risk. There are a lot of beautiful places that are away from the terrorists and you will be able to go home in tact and full of happy memories.😊

  13. IdaNoe says:

    My gut response was not listed, so I chose isolation. That’s already happened. She’s confined to a nursing home. As for no fuel-it’s not possible. Even the aids who wipe her ass and bring her food will be contorted in her mind as caring. I believe her support system for the most part has failed. All the people she literally bought have pretty much abandoned her.

    I have a duality to my personality. My empathetic side feels for her pain that created the monster she is, however my hard side, knows there will never be justice, ever. My case is different than most. My mother was college educated in a time when most women weren’t. She was the head of a department in the major hospital in our city. She knew the trauma she had been through and had access to the entire hospital staff, yet never got help. Instead she poured everything toxic and vile that she was on to me.

    My gut response would be justice. Justice in my mind is not revenge, but to be made whole again. That’s not possible. Rape some one and you’re supposed to at least go the jail right? IF they go at all, then they get 3 hots and a cot, oh and free medical care, free education and we’re left to pay their bills. How about if you’re emotionally raped? The systematic destruction of someone’s personality and belief system? She’s in a nursing home. 3 hots and a cot. And all paid for by taxpayers because she used all her money buying her facade.

    Because of her, I no longer believe in much of anything. I don’t believe in God, religion, country, society, justice, family or love. It’s all been perverted and contaminated by them. The entire world reeks of the stench of them. At best, I would like to cut off her head and put it on a pike in my front yard as a warning to the other little narcs to stay away. But mostly, I wish I had never been born. That is the answer I would have chosen.

    1. BurntKrispyKeen says:

      IdaNoe, I can certainly relate to your frustration.

      “At best, I would like to cut off her head and put it on a pike in my front yard as a warning to the other little narcs to stay away.” – IdaNoe
      I too have felt that type of disgust where thoughts popped into my head that I never thought I’d ever have about my narcissist. Oh, how I can still get all fired up over his lies and the ways he manipulated me!

      But I know that he is lost… in many ways. He is a wounded soul with an unrealistic sense of how to properly gain what he ne needs. Now don’t get me wrong, my narcissist does a most effective job in finding fuel. He is a master at making a woman feel as if she is the most special girl in the world, but he does so in a way that is not authentic.

      To me, THAT is the saddest way ever… to garner such attention through means of not being one’s true self. So sad for him; so sad for yours too, IdaNoe. They often can’t see what is necessary for a *real* connection because of their own terrible wounds. So they end up wounding the ones who care the most.

      It is grueling trying to recover from narcissistic abuse, but I wish you the best as you heal. And thank you for sharing your story, IdaNoe. That in itself made me glad that you were born into this world… that I was able to stumble upon your message. So hang in there. Know that you are not alone. 🤗

      1. FYC says:

        Hello BKK, I was wondering where you were (did you get lost on the whiskey trail?) lol 😉 I hope all is well with you! Welcome back!

        1. BurntKrispyKeen says:

          😀 Ha! FYC, I wish I could say that I’ve been wandering around the Bourbon Trail! 🥃 In my humble opinion, I still feel THAT whiskey adventure would best be taken with a bunch of entertaining empaths… so I’m still holding out on the hope of orchestrating our field trip in the near future. (I know – HOPE. 😔)
          Actually, I’ve just been super busy with work and other issues. I have been popping in and out to get a quick fix, though. ⛓🧲 😥 I still need the guidance, so I read as much as I can, but I do miss “this” more when I don’t have the time to comment and interact with you fine people. I’m actually listening to a very distinct British accent right now. I’m missing the appetizers while listening, but I’m finding this new version… this TTIF series to be more enjoyable than a donut cheesecake. (I’ve actually never eaten that at TGIFridays, but speaking of whiskey, some of their glazes aren’t bad. You really got me wanting to hit that trail!) Anyway, back to your kind comment, FYC. I have been crazy busy 🤪 but well. Thank you for your sweet greeting. 😊

          1. FYC says:

            Hi BKK, So glad you are doing well and just busy. While you were away, I hope you got to see HG’s posts on the creation of the narcissist—very informative on genetic aspect and environment required. I remember you mentioning genetics back then. I also enjoyed the TTIF Q&A and hope it becomes a regular event!

            I agree with your comment on NA. I especially enjoy when HG and NA play off each other on any topic🤣 I’m sure the (bourbon) spirits would move them to come up with even more humor if HG sanctioned that field trip!😜🥃

          2. BurntKrispyKeen says:

            Hey there again, FYC.
            No – I think that I might have missed his comments there. I have long suspected that NPD resulted as a combination of nature and nurture, so to speak. So I would definitely be interested in reading his comments. I have seen in the past where HG refers to his NPD as a coping mechanism … and I agree … which is one of the reasons I contend that their behaviors can be modified. 🙂 (But I won’t get that whole debate started again! 😳 My “hope” for change seems to be like that stray hair I keep noticing on my aunt’s chin. It’s truly there, even though most try to pretend like it’s not. Pretty much, everybody wants to pluck it, but NOBODY wants to be the one brave enough to draw attention to the pesky problem… so that task falls on me! Luckily, I do carry tweezers. Pretty sure HG sees hope as a pesky stray hair. But guess what? The thing keeps coming back! I’m starting to think something so persistent is simply meant to be noticed.) Was that too gross of an analogy?

            Anyway, I have seen (and heard) him say over and over that a narcissist can’t change. So even though I might get depressed, I will try to find his words and allow the teacher to teach.

            And yes … it would be a hoot to see HG and NA exchange a few comments full of spirits! I really would love to plan that trip, FYC. We could attach it to the Kentucky Derby, starting at the track and then hit the trails… or stumble upon the trails. I would very much enjoy meeting you all. Just seeing what snippets a few have shared reminds me of our connection … that those of us affected by narcissism are indeed, very real.

          3. FYC says:

            Hi BKK,

            Yes, an HG live event would be interesting–just imagine all the legal disclaimers we would need to sign! I bet we could come up with some cool KTN themed hats to wear to the Derby too. 😉

            I will admit the chin hair analogy was gross, but effective. Not sure if the visual of the long hair or you plucking it is more disturbing! 😝

            Sorry you missed article on the creation of the narcissist which also talks about the coping/defense mechanism. It’s here:
            https://narcsite.com/2019/03/12/to-control-is-to-cope-narcissism-and-its-creation/#comments

            That post sent me off on a lot of searching for more understanding of the components of narcissism. I comment on my findings in the comments on this post:
            https://narcsite.com/2019/04/14/twisted-9/#comments

            After that point, I also read a study on natural empathy as experienced by narcissists and possible behavioral modification. Briefly, the study examined diagnosed narcissists and non narcissists via fMRI while showing tragic images of others. The portions of the brain associated with empathy of non narcissists lit up, not so (or far less so) for the narcissists. They next examined only the narcissists to view tragic events while asked to imagine these tragic events are happening to themselves (the narcissist). In this case, the same areas of the brain that lit up for non narcissists in the former examination consistently lit up for the narcissist. As a result, they concluded narcissists are capable of natural empathy for themselves, but block this response with regard to others. They suggest behavioral modification may be possible if the narcissist can view events as they would relate to the narcissist, versus trying to change their undeveloped empathy for others. Note: this study did not include evaluation for APD.

            Lastly, I have also read that when motivated, narcissists can alter their behavior (e.g. HG’s new dynamic), but there is no known “cure” or case of wholesale change to date. Given the complexity of the origin and creation over many formative stages, and the power of coping mechanisms supporting perceived survival, I am beginning to doubt such a change would be entirely possible, even if the genes were deactivated via epigenetic methods.

            I also started research on empathy and genetics, but it’s on hold until I finish another project.

          4. BurntKrispyKeen says:

            Hello FYC… Thank you for your well-thought-out response. As soon as I get a chance, I will review those two links you provided. I’m on a brief break right now, but I need to soon get busy again … so forgive me for not finishing my post just yet.

            I agree, as I usually do, with your findings and comments. I find the brain scans very interesting as well and have commented in the past about a scientist whose brain lit up in the same pattern as a so-called sociopath’s, but he, while considered a bit distant and aloof, did not exhibit outward signs of APD. (Can you imagine conducting a study on psychopathy only to find out that your OWN brain shows signs!? 😱 Yikes!)
            I still believe (though at their core they will remain) that certain individuals can adapt their behaviors. I simply cannot give up on this hope, FYC, as it is part of my own core belief. I have many reasons to believe this, and I feel comforted that some scientists also agree. [And I don’t hold out on false hope that MY narcissist will change, HG. Even if he were aware enough to try to convince me (once more) of his changed-self, I now realize that the cost of the pig isn’t worth the tiny amount of sausage. 🐷🥒 Nope.]

            After I read your recommended articles, FYC, I will try to expand more. Know that I love that you are so open-minded, FYC 💖… that you view the world in a positive light, yet look at it with a realistic eye… that you have a keen eye for the science that backs up our theories. (And we both can enjoy that the science allows us to chance our opinions… ahhh, the ever-changing perspective of science. 🤔🥴)

            Speaking again of good ole science … there was a recent internet newsfeed on a new form of dementia discovered, and I just received one of my periodicals in the mail discussing Alzheimer’s disease. The article referenced the known roles of amyloid plaque, hyperphosphorylated tau protein and signs of inflammation, but this article also discussed the role of immunoexcitotoxicity as well as recent evidence of certain viruses having a profound role in Alzheimer’s within certain individuals. I have long believed that viruses and other pathogens might be the root cause of many illnesses… but it’s scary stuff to say the least! 😷

            That’s why we all need to fuck this shit sky high (thank you for that one, HG) and don our Derby hats… (FYC, are you thinking with a flaming heart between the two steeples or the word “evil” spelled-out in roses?)
            Anyway, we need that break, FYC. Besides, I want to find out how WhoCares new adventure is going? So yes… I’d be willing to sign a waiver. HG’s secrets are safe with me…. though I might feel inclined to mention any stray hairs that I see. (You made me laugh out loud there, FYC.) I notice them on my ex-husband’s head as a wild one likes to stand erect every once in a while, but since HG visits his barber three times a month, I’m sure he’s impeccable. 🙄
            Good Grief! (I’ll have to find something else to notice.)

          5. FYC says:

            BKK, I laughed in so many places at your humor filled response my stomach got a cramp😜 By all means let’s FTSSH and meet up at the Derby! I’ll buy everyone a round of Blanton’s bourbon. (Please do remove all errant hairs prior to arrival and leave the tweezers at home!) Lol 😂 Maybe FM1T can enter the race on one of her ponies🐎 she would love the horse more than any jockey, so she’d win hands down as long as she doesn’t dismount to give the pony a break!

            I read that study about James Fallon too. He must have been shocked, but I wonder if he has the genes unexpressed or if expressed he is at the lighter end of the spectrum? If you liked that, you might like this:

            https://news.stanford.edu/2015/12/09/brain-study-poldrack-120915/

            I am hopeful too. The science on this is just beginning and as you point out, is ever changing. Mommypino has some interesting links from her genetic research as well.

            I love knowledge and seek it out just like you and others here do. It is a fantastic learning environment. I’ve missed your humor and insight so hurry back when you are done!

          6. Fool Me 1 Time says:

            FYC, I’d dismount and let him rest! 😂🙃

          7. BurntKrispyKeen says:

            🤣🤣🤣 Thank you for that.

            I am looking forward to sharing that drink with you, FYC. That’ll be worth leaving my tweezers behind. 🥃🥃 🙂
            I hope that FM1T would enjoy the derby. It really is a lot of fun. I understand about that dismount though, so I hope she would be okay. 🐎 We are a horse loving state, no doubt. Some horses here live better than I do! But not everyone is a fan. Some folks view the derby as a cruel sport, so I hope that FM1T will enjoy herself. One of the aunts that I’m caring for can’t stand to watch a civil war reenactment because she sees it as cruel to the horses. Oddly enough, my narcissist also saw the Kentucky Derby as a cruel sport. I realize those narcs are good at pretending, but I think he actually has a bit of sincere sympathy for animals… at least more so than for humans.

            I will definitely check out that link. 🧠 And when I can gather my thoughts… when not rushed, I will share some ideas on my hope for the possibilites. I think it all has me jacked up more than usual because of HG’s new situation. Once I saw a snippet of SM’s blonde hair, especially her hand, she became very real to me. I know that IRL, their relationship is none of my business, but once HG shared his lady with us, he opened that door. 🚪 And once you give me a crack, I’m in.

            I want to be happy for our Norwegian sister empath, as I can sense through the screen her excitement in finding this unique relationship. But I will never forget going from that thrilling enthusiasm to curling into a ball and crying until the tears could no longer flow. No one should ever have to suffer the type of mistreatment that most of us here have endured.

            I do not want him to hurt her, so I choose to believe that he has enough self-control to not. (Sadly, we all hurt each other, but I know that you understand that I’m talking about that horrible feeling they bestow upon us when they dramatically shift their demeanor.) This has me so worried that I’ve given this dynamic way more energy than I should. Once I heard her voice… well, I’m not immune to organizing the travel group a trip to Norway if need be. I am kidding. Sorta. But I think HG senses this and probably doesn’t much like me because of it.

            I should work on my attitude. So I’ll do my best to behave, but one reason I keep checking in here is that I truly am rooting for him. I want him to succeed.

          8. FYC says:

            BKK, You sound a bit down in spirit, I hope you are not reliving your own pain. I think HG likes you as much as he likes any of us (after all, we are way down the fuel chain), so no worries! He certainly knows we see both sides.

            I give HG credit for sticking to his new dynamic so far and hope he continues and never regrets the effort (for the sake of his future and any current or future empath). The SM seems very lovely of what we know and her joy is palpable. I would hate to see her hurt. We will all feel it. Yet even normal people break up, so if it should end, I hope it can be a clean (non abusive) disengagement.

            You are right about movies and horse racing. There is a dark side. I was just going with the light conversation and trying to point out that loving the horse would win the race (versus what can happen) and could imagine sweet FM1T stopping and dismounting to give the horse a break to rest. I certainly did not mean any disrespect, it was in recognition of something I admire. I adore animals and have been an active advocate and donor for animal welfare.

            BKK, I hope you feel better. We can all have the drink🥃 on the trail and still wear cool hats👒, no worries!

          9. FYC says:

            FM1T, I imagined it in my head and knew you would! 🐎🥰

          10. Fool Me 1 Time says:

            FYC, But of course, if it’s a horse! 🐎 🤣🤣😘

          11. BurntKrispyKeen says:

            I hear you, FYC. I do get worn down from it all. Leave it to a true empath to be able to pick up on my subtle change of tone! 😉😁

            I remind myself to not have expectations on how HG sees us (his readers) as I long ago accepted that we are basically minions… a means to his endgame. But like you, I really do try to see both sides, so it’s hard not to feel a connection to him. Of course, I pretty much feel a connection to everyone, so … 😌But I am impressed by all of the fine people I have interacted with here at Narcsite. I still remind myself that HG is the only human being on earth with whom I have shared my secrets… that he is the ONLY person whom I have spoken to, saying out loud that my involvement with my narcissist was more than just friends. For some reason, I couldn’t even tell (and haven’t yet) that truth to my best friend, a beloved friend since first grade. ❤😔 (I’m still amazed that this stranger across the ocean… this so-called sociopath… is the one person to whom I chose to bare my soul!) ❓❓❓ So one would think that I could refrain from being such a smartass at times, but often, I let my frustrations take over and get a bit too feisty.🥊 (I’m just sharing my thoughts, as I have sensed before that I’ve rubbed that man the wrong way on more than one occasion.) So I should probably just chalk my previous comment up to: Inherent Empathic Guilt, and be done. But you know how hard it is for me to not expand. 😀

            I guess that I was trying to say that I think HG knows how upset some of us would be to see a fellow sister get hurt, so he seems to get (understanding so) a little defensive at our intrusion into his real life. (I know that he stays more than prepared, and once he decided to share… well, I do admire how well he has been able to take criticism. Usually. 😁) Not that I have criticized him for sharing SM with us. I have enjoyed that glimpse into his life very much and believe that he does so in a protective way. Like you, I am hopeful that this new dynamic will prove successful and can become educational… for the world … so I’m grateful to see this unfold in real time. We both can easily see how HG’s human nature is like ours… there’s a real desire to connect with his readers. And if he’s like my narcissist who swore that he can ALWAYS prove himself … there’s probably also a desire to document that what HG says of his life is indeed real. And then there’s a component of HG that I sense is just always itching to pop out… to show us who he really is. “Check me out ladies. Looky but no touchy.” Did I just make him sound very non-British there?

            Ahh, the mysteries of everyone here!!! I think my comment to you was more because I had previously alluded to hunting HG down if he were to hurt SM … something like… it might have taken us a while to find Osama bin Laden, but … I think that’s why I said what I said to you. 😔 I started to feel guilty about some of the things I’ve thought and said, though I was only teasing. Mainly. Besides, I remind myself that the strong women of Norway can take care of themselves. He didn’t name her Shieldmaiden because she’s not capable. 🦸‍♀️ I just get fired up because a part of me feels like I’m turning a blind eye… that she should be warned, but the other part of me feels that it is too early for her to know… that HG deserves a real chance to try out his newfound approach without obstacles.

            I feel weird talking about him knowing that he can hear, but until he realeases the party, it’s our only way. 🤷‍♀️ And I knew that you meant your dismount comment in a lighthearted way. 🐎 It made me laugh out loud. So sorry for getting all serious on you. It just reminded me of how cruel my narcissist thought jockeys were for putting horses through such a race… you know, the man who makes a career out of shitting on humans. 💩
            I’ll stop rambling now, but you have a great day, too, FYC! Your wisdom and humor have both been much appreciated. ❤

          12. FYC says:

            Sweet BKK, HG knows ET when he sees it. His keen observations of empaths and their traits is what enables him to be so effective.

            HG knows we hold empathy, truth and justice dear to our hearts and we live in the land of positive hope. He knows every aspect of both sides of the coin (but does not experience the feelings we do). HG does everything he does in maintenance of his highly defended position. He cannot afford to care about feelings. He would dismiss anyone’s feelings as irrelevant and of no consequence unless they provided fuel or impacted his personal objectives. His incredible awareness, perceptiveness and appropriateness in communication here is to be commended as is his restraint in many situations. HG clearly has a superior set of skills and intelligence compared to other narcissists. Unfortunately, this does not change his way of being.

            I am 100% certain HG anticipated all of the responses he has gotten regarding the SM and more! There is nothing anyone could say to HG about his personal life that would influence his choices (unless they were to his benefit).

            HG and the SM are adults and must make their own decisions. I do hope HG can maintain his new dynamic and focus his negative fuel on others more deserving. I think the SM, if put in an inappropriate or unhealthy situation, would shut that down and leave. But if she googles any behaviors she encountered after the fact and comes to narcsite, boom! All bets are off and we might witness a supernova.

            As for you, BKK, no worries! You are valued by everyone, including HG, just not in the same way by all and that is okay.😊

      2. NarcAngel says:

        BKK
        Glad to see you are well. You’ve been missed.

        1. BurntKrispyKeen says:

          You are a sweet soul, NarcAngel. I find myself missing all of you when I take a brief break. Even though I don’t always comment, your wise words and wisecracks are still an appealing combination. That’s what I admire about you, NA… You know when to be serious with sound advice, and you know how to lighten the mood… to help us all not take this shit so seriously!

          Your Scrubbing Bubbles comment on another post was intriguing. I always said there’s nothing more sexy than a man holding a Weed Eater. Now you got me all jacked up thinking about the possibilites of what the right man could actually do. I would leave the lights on if I found one who would clean the shower right after a slippery session of rumpy pumpy.
          Ahhh. 🧼😆🚿
          Don’t get my hopes up, NarcAngel. You know how some people feel about my high hopes.

    2. WiserNow says:

      Dear IdaNoe,
      I understand what you’re saying and I’m very sorry your mother made you suffer like that. I think you are still whole though. Your life has travelled a certain path and you have experienced a certain fate, and that has made you who you are. There is no way of knowing what you ‘could’ have been if you had a different life or a different mother. No-one can know that. So, you are who you are and you are whole.

      Also, it’s very sad that you don’t believe in much of anything, but I know that feeling too. The entire world may reek to you of the stench of narcissists and I get that, however, you need to help yourself now. You need to try to see the world from a different perspective.

      I was talking with my mother recently and the conversation was about something in the news that was tragic and my mother said something along the lines of, “..that’s just how the world is. The world is mean and cruel and that’s just how it is.” That made me think, no, that’s just how ‘certain’ people are, but not all people. There is still good in the world and not all things or all people are mean and cruel. There is still a lot to believe in.

      You have to make an effort to believe that and to be the contrast. Somehow, you need to look past your bad experiences and what you have suffered to see a point beyond that, where things can be better. It does exist. Stay here and keep reading. That’s one thing you can believe in. I wish you all the best IdaNoe 🙂

      1. BurntKrispyKeen says:

        Hi, WiserNow … Your words of care and concern to IdaNoe are sweet and help to demonstrate your very message:
        “There is still good in the world and not all things or all people are mean and cruel.” – Wisernow.
        So true! Some days it might seem hard to find, but the world is still full of kindness.

        I hope for us all to be able to see the “good” hidden amongst the evil. It’s there; we just sometimes have to look really hard. 🤓
        (Or learn to see it in the little things… which is truly the best place to find it. 😊)

        1. WiserNow says:

          Thank you for your message BKK. There is still kindness in the world. Often it takes a change in perspective or a conscious effort to ‘be’ the kindness, especially in situations or at times when you are not feeling very generous or patient.

    3. E&L says:

      IdaNoe, I appreciate your comments, feelings, and beliefs. You are not alone; imagine I walk beside you!

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