The Narcissist and Feelings


Feelings are an unnecessary burden and thankfully I have been relieved of many of them, being left only with those which are deemed necessary to enable me to pursue the harvesting of fuel. Feelings blur and weaken. How many times have you heard your alarm go off in the morning and you have rolled over feeling like you do not want to get up? Many times I should imagine. That feeling of apprehension about what the day holds for you, despondency at what has happened to you and dread about what you have to do weakens you and holds you back. You spend much of your life in the pursuit of this notion of happiness but are you ever truly happy? Do you look at what you have and wish you had more? Do you look at other people around you and imagine how happy they must be and you wish that you were more like them? All you achieve is bitterness. Perhaps you do feel happy but as the empath that you are you see those who you regard as less happy than you and you wish that they could be more like you. All you achieve is vanity. You spend so much of your time seeking to be happy and then you worry about whether it is fleeting in nature. You express concern that you just want to be happy and spend more and more time trying to achieve this state of nirvana. You suffer from feeling sadness which leads to paralysis and indecision. You feel frustrated which sucks up your energy and leaves you feeling spent. You take pride in your ability to feel and to be able to feel on behalf of others yet all you are doing is allowing yourself to be burdened. Why bother pursuing those feelings which are regarded as positive, such as joy, happiness and elation? Is the effort truly worth it when you get there only for it to be a fleeting moment which then casts you into despondency? What was the point of that? Why allow yourself to be mired in upset, misery and dejection? You achieve nothing as you slowly sink into a quagmire of such negativity. Your feelings deceive you, press down on you and above all else allow us to manipulate you. It is because you feel this array of emotions that you provide us with emotional reactions. Of course you know that these emotional reactions create my fuel. Your feelings are to blame.

I never acquired these feelings. This is because the pursuit of fuel cannot be distracted by these cumbersome emotions. They serve no purpose and thus were never developed. I am built for the acquisition of fuel and nothing else. I am an efficient design, single-minded and driven. All excess baggage was not jettisoned, it was never stowed on board to begin with. I am not wholly without feelings. I have been developed in a way to allow certain feelings, those that aid my purpose, to come to the fore. I feel fury which ensures that I can exert control over other people and thus extract fuel from them. I feel envy which drives me on to strip away those traits from other people which I need to create my construct. If I felt no envy, I would not want these characteristics – thus this feeling serves a purpose. There is no superfluous feeling connected with me. I feel jealousy which again causes me to strive to better that person by lauding my own achievements and prompting a reaction which garners positive fuel or by berating the person of whom I am jealous and thus I harvest negative fuel. I feel hatred. This allows me to see everything as it truly is. Hatred hones and brings into sharp focus the reality of this cruel world and thus I am better able to navigate my way through it. Hatred is visceral, it is not fluffy or amorphous. It does not cloud or blur. It is direct, straight to the point and electrifying in its capacity to allow me to always go forward. All of these feelings and ones of a similar nature have been fashioned around me to assist me in my quest for fuel. Each one discharges a method of enabling me to gather fuel so that I can feel the ultimate emotion. My pursuit of fuel is predicated on the use of these various emotions with the sole purpose of allowing me to feel that emotion which I prize above all others.

I feel powerful.

I am powerful.

222 thoughts on “The Narcissist and Feelings

  1. Joy&Love says:

    Hatred and jealously can also be blinding, and love is also powerful. In fact its the most powerful and life transfirming emotion I know. But if you shut it out you’ll never know. When I read these articles it brings home the importance of always showing love to a child, any child. Thank you HG for your usual thought provoking revelations.

    1. HG Tudor says:

      You’re welcome

  2. Ms Devine says:

    HG Would a narc hurt his children to hurt to ex IPPS just to gain some negative fuel. ie not pay for their medical, home … anything ….but to still claim that they are the only thing that they care about? its just a hook part of the game isnt it?

    1. HG Tudor says:


  3. Lorelei says:

    Yes they do ruin things Whocares.. The stress response to such a deplorable act is a stress/cortisol inducing trigger and WE wear it—not them.

    1. WhoCares says:


      I no longer know where to put this because I’m having trouble accessing comments through the WP app and there is a shortage of reply buttons when replying directly online in WordPress. But I really wanted to post back with regard to this:

      “It’s a bad day because I need to GOSO with a very close friend.”

      I’m sorry. That is not a happy discovery. I don’t know about others – but I find my developing skill of spotting narcissists to be troublesome in the way that I *want* to be wrong when I “see” them – especially when they are close to someone I care about – but then I have the sad realization that I am likely not wrong.

      1. Lorelei says:

        Thanks Whocares—maybe just narcissistic but it’s been in my gut substantially for a long while and the lack of authenticity is undeniable and troublesome. I keep catching inconsistencies and some firm indications to depart are evident. Not the first relationship at all to hit the curb since discovering this new world, but potentially the most complicated.

  4. njfilly says:

    This is one of my favorite thought provoking articles.

    I agree that feelings can weaken; but I can’t help that I developed with the capacity for certain emotions and you were not, just as you can’t.

    What weakens more is the pursuit of certain positive emotions. Happiness and contentment are over rated. I mostly prefer the negative emotions and I thrive on the intensity of my own passion and anger. Life is not about happiness and contentment for me. Life is not worth living without something to die for. I hope to eventually discover what is the intensity that drives me.

  5. WhoCares says:


    “I lived near a bakery when I was young, the alley I was molested in often, was a block away from that bakery, I can remember the smell of fresh baked goods in the air as he was doing to me what he always did!”

    I’m sorry that the innocuous – and often comforting – scent of bread baking holds such memories for you.

    Narcs really know how to ruin things.

  6. Pati says:

    Thank HG I think I understand .

  7. Kim e says:

    Oh okay, soul mate then.

    This made me spit out my Earl Grey….LOL…….

  8. Taryn says:

    HG, my ex-boyfriend narc that I live with has a genius level IQ like you do and describes feelings in the exact same way that you do. To be honest, sometimes I wish I could be like you and him because there are times I feel paralyzed by my emotions and I still haven’t figured out how to set those feelings aside in order to think logically. Sometimes it seems like feelings are a major handicap.

  9. santaann1964 says:

    Eckhart Tolle teaches of the pain body is in exactly how you are created! See I’m smart too!

  10. santaann1964 says:

    And for sure it causes problems for me. Lol

  11. santaann1964 says:

    But your logic is different then my logic so it’s the perspective that we don’t see the same.

    1. HG Tudor says:

      No, logic I decision making without the influence of corrupting emotional influences. There is not a difference in logic.

  12. santaann1964 says:

    Why is always emotional thinking why not just thinking. You Mr.H seem to be some kind of emotional thinking not all emotions are good ones!

    1. HG Tudor says:

      Emotional thinking obscures logic. Narcissists engage in emotional thinking also, but you are not a narcissist, therefore you need to understand what it is about your emotional thinking that causes problems for you.

      1. santaann1964 says:

        Fair enough

  13. santaann1964 says:

    Which ones are you relieved from Mr.H?

    1. HG Tudor says:

      Joy, happiness, sadness, regret, upset, guilt – to name a few.

      1. santaann1964 says:

        You must feel shame, anger, loneliness, satisfaction, jealousy, self pity are these some you do feel? If yes it is certainly caused by neglect, being controlled, not allowed to show real emotions. Maybe you had to love yourself because no one else did. Your thoughts have been controlled by one more powerful then you because you were a child. I just don’t understand why if you know it’s abusive and as smart as you are that you don’t break the chain. Possibly fear of it happening again by someone you may actually love. These are just my thoughts not based on emotions based on what you have taught me and what I still don’t understand. Are you just safe in your facade? I know I’m safe in denial..

      2. Mairi by night says:

        How do you know you are relieved from such feelings if you have never experienced them personally?

        I’m not criticising you – but interested in your logic and how you see the world. From my point of view, your logic doesn’t stack up. As follows:
        I don’t know what it’s like to be a narcissist. However I do know how it feels to hurt people, receive admiration and praise. I also know what joy and love feel like. Being loved meaning feeling at ease, accepted, and warmly valued – for just being, not for anything external. You can’t buy that, or trick people into feeling that way about the real you.
        Sticking with love, we are talking about a vast and complex range of feelings – covering ideas like brotherly love, love for your country, familial love, romantic love and so on- a huge part of the human experience that you are dismissing without having experienced it first hand.
        You say you’re relieved, machine like, superior and powerful – but how can you know if that’s the very best state if you haven’t experienced the alternatives? Do you accept the possibility you may be missing out on a higher level of experience? I see 7 colours, you see 6. You believe red is the best but you’ve never seen blue.

        Secondly. I struggle with the idea that a condition that arises as a response to trauma can possibly be a special evolutionary advantage, a super power – which is what you seem to be saying narcissism is, in your case at least. If you had a child and were given the choice – narcissist or “normal”…which would you choose?

        1. HG Tudor says:

          I do not experience them, therefore I know I do not have them. I understand what those feelings are, I do not have them. I know I have never had mumps, I did not have to have mumps to know that.

          The feelings you describe and what they mean to you are what are effective for you but the absence of feelings as I have described is what works best for me and my kind. I am not burdened by the feelings you experience, that makes me far more effective.
          I do not need to see blue to be effective. You are confusing the fact the absence of particular feelings enables us to be effective, that is what we must be, it is not about a higher level of experience. We do not need that higher level of experience, whatever that might actually be.
          I do not have any children. If I were to, I would choose narcissist as they would be far more effective than being a normal. Being a normal would be a miserable, unremarkable existence.

          1. kel2day says:

            HG, you say if you had a child and could choose it to be a normal or a narcissist, you’d choose narc. Narcs hurt people, they hurt your readers, and I don’t know why you’d care if a normal would have an unremarkable existence. Thank you for not creating anymore narcs.

          2. empath007 says:

            I appreciate your honesty…. but the narcs I’ve met did not have a remarkable existence. That’s in their minds. But their lives were nothing special or extraordinary. In fact in comparison to the one I dated I had a nicer/bigger house then him…. I drove a nicer car… I have a higher position at work then him…. I dress better… and I don’t live in a fantasy land lol.

            All kinds of people can have “remarkable” existance… you don’t have to be a narc to it, it’s just all in how you look at it.

          3. Pati says:

            HG so you are saying that if you had Narc children it would be more better for you because it suits your purpose and they would be a splitting image of you Sorry I dont mean to ask such personal questions.

          4. HG Tudor says:

            I am stating this because it would be better for them and me.

          5. FYC says:

            HG, Your comments:

            “I am not burdened by the feelings you experience, that makes me far more effective.”

            –This is in accordance with your POV and stated prime aims objectives.

            “I do not have any children. If I were to, I would choose narcissist as they would be far more effective than being a normal. Being a normal would be a miserable, unremarkable existence.”

            –Again, this is in accordance with your POV. Further, this would be consistent with your defense mechanism–your view is a superior way of coping and being. Therefore, if you had offspring, you would logically draw the same conclusion for them. If your children were like you, it would be validating and they would be an extension of yourself and your power. This would further confirm (for you) that your choices and way of life are superior.

            Is this correct?

            BTW, this is no criticism, just a logical observation. It seems all humans are comforted and validated when their children have similar, valued traits of the parent(s). I see this across the board. Humans tend to seek validation.

          6. HG Tudor says:

            In essence, I also see that if I had children the most effective way for them to succeed would for them to be like me.

          7. FYC says:

            “I also see that if I had children the most effective way for them to succeed would for them to be like me.”

            Thank you, HG, but suceed at what? How do you measure success? Please define. I would not want your children to experience the pain of your youth. Plus, you would have been exceptional regardless given your natural abilities, intelligence and charm,without being a N. One need not be a N to succeed in many ways, including business, as evidenced by your successful and lovely SM.

          8. HG Tudor says:

            I am successful, they would emulate my success.

          9. FYC says:

            I see. Well at least your legacy will live on in the absence of children. Thank you for the insight as always, HG.

          10. HG Tudor says:

            You are welcome.

          11. Lorelei says:

            HG—you say if you had children you would want narcissists. How funny if little Johnny were a lesser! A lower lesser!

          12. HG Tudor says:

            Hopelessly wrong

          13. Lorelei says:

            It could happen HG. Genetics could get really interesting. Little Johnny would pick out those sleeveless cut out shirts and you and SM would be befuddled as to how to manage. He may insist on going by “OJ.” Bedtime devaluation to foster the narcissism may include withholding reading auto-trader magazines.

          14. HG Tudor says:

            Nonsense. Go and buy some lip gloss. I’m taking The Shieldmaiden dancing.

          15. Lorelei says:

            It did make me laugh!

          16. FoolMe1Time says:

            HG for your children to be like you, wouldn’t you have to treat them the way your Mother treated you?

          17. HG Tudor says:

            Not necessarily. There are many different types of LOC environments

          18. FoolMe1Time says:

            Thank you for answering this one HG.

          19. HG Tudor says:

            You are welcome.

          20. MommyPino says:

            Regarding the normals being unremarkable, ever since I have been aware of empaths and narcissists, I realized that most of the movers and shakers are either narcissists or empaths. Empaths are not always efficient but when they finally find something that clicks they can take it to the next level and they also achieve so much. Both empaths and narcissists can be narcissistic in terms of how they make a difference.

      3. MB says:

        You don’t experience upset, HG? That is different than anger. I am trying to think of an example where I would be upset and you are not. Is that hurt feelings?

        1. HG Tudor says:

          No I do not feel upset.

          You would be upset that your glitter delivery has not arrived on time.
          I would be infuriated by my Creed deliver not arriving on time.

          1. MommyPino says:

            HG, do you feel anger? As an empath I feel upset, anger, and fury in that order when it comes to the intensity of emotions. Does your feeling escalate always to the level of fury?

          2. HG Tudor says:

            Read Fury.

          3. MommyPino says:

            Thank you HG.

          4. MommyPino says:

            HG, I remember how intense it is to experience fury and it has happened to me only a few times and only towards my mom. It’s where my heart was raising and my brain feels like it wants to explode inside of my head and it’s a pretty intense feeling to have whenever your Creed delivery doesn’t arrive on time. It’s not a feeling that I would ever want to experience again. The fact that narcs experience that regularly makes me think that it really sucks to be a narc. But I will read Fury. I have read it before, maybe almost a year ago and I don’t really remember what’s in it anymore. It would be a nice refresher.

          5. HG Tudor says:

            Fury serves a vital purpose for us. You rarely experience fury as you’re not equipped to handle it.

          6. MommyPino says:

            Ahh thank you HG. That makes perfect sense to me now. Empaths and narcs handle fury differently because we are wired differently that is why it is too unpleasant for an empath to experience one. I love how your answers just give me lightbulb moments even though they are so short. Thank you! 🙏

          7. HG Tudor says:

            You’re welcome

          8. Jenna says:

            Hi HG,
            What about the cowardly midranger? Would he feel “upset” when he sinks into depression due to the reality gap?

          9. HG Tudor says:


          10. WhoCares says:

            Good question, Jenna.

            HG – but mid-rangers do feel anxiety in relation to the reality gap, do they not? (Which they might label as being “upset”..)

          11. HG Tudor says:

            Yes, but the question was “what do they feel” WC not “what do they feel but mistakenly think it is.”

          12. WhoCares says:

            Right, but then in turn, we would mistakenly accept the label of “upset” and perpetuate that misunderstanding. Thanks for setting us straight, HG.

          13. HG Tudor says:


          14. MB says:

            Thank you HG. That reminds me, I do need to inventory my glitter closet!

          15. WhoCares says:


            “I do need to inventory my glitter closet!” Haha – you and me both.

            Actually, I think I need to downsize my glitter collection.

          16. MB says:

            WC, downsize your glitter collection?! I am upset at the thought!

          17. WhoCares says:

            😃 Hey, MB, you know I’d totally send some extra glitter, that I no longer needed, your way – if I could!

          18. Lorelei says:

            Was is this glitter?

          19. alexissmith2016 says:

            So can a MR experiencing a reality gap actually feel depressed? or do they only believe they feel depressed because they don’t have control over where they perceive they should be?

          20. HG Tudor says:

            Usually it is belief in depression but it can exist as a comorbid condition.

          21. alexissmith2016 says:

            Thanks HG. It’s quite hard to get your head around some of these intricacies. But it all makes perfect sense.

          22. HG Tudor says:

            That is why you need me.

          23. alexissmith2016 says:

            Ah believe me. I truly know that. And I’m grateful every single day.

            I can’t wait until I can do the N consult on my sister and know for sure what she is. I’m very torn between UMR and GN of some type. And it will be great to have that conclusion but I have to wait until this episode is concluded. Hopefully not too much longer now.

          24. Lorelei says:

            Are you a psychiatrist

  14. mollyb5 says:

    HG. You feel powerful when you control another’s emotions . When you feel responsible for their emotions . You alone made them feel things …good or bad doesn’t matter. Even the simple facial expression the woman / person shows feel wonderful / powerful for causing it and making it show itself ? So when Iam blank and not showing emotion …he narc may still feel powerful for bringing about my emotionless -ness , blankness. He feels he is the one who is controlling me …my blankness because he knows any other situation I would be smiling and laughing. I see him doing this with two male friends also. They have money and he is making them feel… like “he’s”the Most awesome friend for helping them .

    Behind their backs, I hear what he says. I know he wouldn’t be interested unless money was involved.

    1. HG Tudor says:

      You are never blank. You are not a machine.

      1. mollyb5 says:

        HG ????Does the narc get envious every time we watch tv and he sees me cry over a show and I sense him watching me . Is he jealous that Iam getting emotional over something on tv ? Or is he gaining fuel and power because he paid the WiFi bill and I am ….able to watch the show with him ?

        1. HG Tudor says:

          No, this is “wasted fuel”. You should be providing fuel to him, you are not, you are “providing” it to the TV show, thus you are causing jealousy affecting the narcissist´s sense of control.

          1. mollyb5 says:

            HG he thinking “ dam her why the hell is she crying over a stupid show , what a wimp ?” Or “ what the hell is she having feelings for that guy on tv for …slut ?” Lol. Which one …or both ?

          2. HG Tudor says:

            Most likely – “This programme is awful, I do not know why we watch it/you watch it?” or “Why are you crying, it is only a TV show, its not real.”
            You may get some semblance of “comfort” or an “awww how sweet” comment from certain Mid Range Narcissists if painted white.

          3. mollyb5 says:

            This is kinda funny to me , not sure why ?:p hahaaa

          4. mollyb5 says:

            HG. ..I have to watch this in action now that you say this . He just sits there , I usually get up and walk out of the room and say I can’t watch this , these are real peoples faces and that man is someone’s son. ( when I watch history channel with him). He likes the narrator and falls asleep ? These are pictures of war and dead people he can look at so calmly . Real filming and real recordings of real humans dead , blown apart ….All I see is extreme pain and humiliation ..if this was my son on tv being shown over and over ….I would be furious. History channel shows this over and over . I know we need to remember so as history not to repeat itself …but narcs love it ..I think? He is feeling relaxed watching this . Could this be a warning sign to empaths …could this be a test ever?? Most people can’t watch that every night , or at least empaths can’t.

          5. HG Tudor says:

            It is a red flag, evidencing a lack of emotional empathy.

          6. empath007 says:

            Mine would see me crying.. then start crying himself to direct the attention towards himself hahahaha. The guy could cry on cue and was obsessed with looking sensitive. haha.

          7. HG Tudor says:

            What a contemptible, snivelling coprolite.

          8. empath007 says:

            Haha! That he is. It was a decent play but I honestly remember wanting to say “ are those tears real?” Because I could feel the disengious nature when it happened.

            Now if only I could have recognized that same disengious nature during our love making. I’d be in much better shape.

          9. Lorelei says:

            I’m impressed by the vocabulary HG. I had to look up coprolite. I’m not mentally deficient, yet I’ve never run across this term.

          10. HG Tudor says:

            It’s all about the education here.

          11. Lorelei says:

            Certainly. Even fossilized dung.

          12. MB says:

            Word of the day…”coprolite” When I looked that up, it made me giggle!

      2. mollyb5 says:

        HG I know the answer’s both . Lol

      3. mollyb5 says:

        Just like a narc feels powerful stabbing his dick down a girls throat and ejaculating all over her face then ..grabbing a log and slamming it into the side of her skull. Of course, the log part would ruin the supply coming forth from her but …oh well …there is warm hole in the next room.
        Ted Bundy

  15. Lorelei says:

    It’s not really any of my business but do you tell your lady friend that you love her or other emotions you don’t “feel” in order to satisfy reactions that benefit you? I would never ask had you not mentioned her so freely. If so, say she really doesn’t know all of this. What then when she finds out there is a different brand of authenticity? If you treat people well it’s just simply not an issue HG. If you treat people that are decent humans poorly after doing all of this work it would dull your personal achievements to a degree in the eyes of many. Can’t negative emotion and thought fuel of negative things be achieved with people who are narcissists and then no one gives a damn.(?)
    I just hate to think of how poor behavior could tarnish your legacy as the work is irrefutably the best work on human psychology ever. Seriously. I’m sure these things have crossed your mind.

    1. HG Tudor says:

      “My lady friend” who are you referring to Lorelei?

      1. Lorelei says:

        As my eyes roll.. Your girlfriend HG. Your girlfriend. That would be the lady friend I am referring to. I presume you don’t need to tell other ladies the plethora of niceties that make them inclined to believe in a genuine situation.

        1. HG Tudor says:

          Well then write girlfriend if that is who you were referring to!

          1. Lorelei says:

            You are over 35–girlfriend sounds corny.

          2. HG Tudor says:

            Oh okay, soul mate then.

          3. Lorelei says:

            You nauseate me.

          4. WhoCares says:

            HG & Lorelei – too funny!

          5. Lorelei says:

            It is sadly funny whocares! Why? Because I would never have fallen for giving a girl a perfume bottle to remember his scent. (I pray he didn’t really do that and hope much of these examples are just that..) The I love you bullshit nauseates me. I have issues because i think normal people exchange these things and I’m inclined so fervently against affection that I’m a play day for narcs. I make it was too easy. They can go straight to devaluation because my golden period is 2 weeks. I have zero business even bothering. I’m a disaster.

          6. WhoCares says:


            I agree with you on the sad part and seriousness that accompanied your point but I couldn’t help laughing at the resulting exchange because I also agree with you that at age 35 and up “girlfriend and boyfriend” just don’t sound right. But when you aren’t married there aren’t a lot of alternative options are there? “Partner”, “significant other”…those all sound a little detached.
            It made me laugh – in light of the discussion on platitudes – when HG swiftly came back with “soul mate.”

          7. Lorelei says:

            Whocares—someone calling me a soul mate had better be accompanied by Chanel earrings because I can’t go there. I was inclined to fall for juvenile declarations of love as a teenager but never since. I will say my first marriage proposal was quite nice, but not overly ridiculous. I have a lot of my own narcissism pickling my pickings of men I like. It’s not lending to playing with a healthy hand. It’s a tough scenario but not one I’m truly visiting now anyway.

          8. WhoCares says:

            Haha – knowing what you know now, you could just accept the Chanel earrings and “Adios. See ya ’round, soul mate!”

            I would never fall for that soul mate crap either – my narcissist didn’t spin it that way. Instead, I was his “second chance at happiness”…his “fire woman.” (Yeah, okay I kinda fell for that last one.)

            And as horrifying to think that – possibly – that’s the spin (“soul mate”) HG is taking with the SM (I doubt it though) we cannot hold him personally responsible for that fact that that works for some women. However, we can hold him personally responsible for shedding a huge, glaring light on why that works for narcissists and why we have to stop buying into that shit.

          9. HG Tudor says:

            Indeed WC and for the purposes of full information, no, I have not used “soulmate” re The Shieldmaiden. There was and is no need to.

          10. WhoCares says:

            Thank-you for sharing that HG, you certainly didn’t have to. And the way you have described the ShieldMaiden; I would not have expected her to fall for such an approach.

          11. Lorelei says:

            Haha Whocares—I wouldn’t fall for a soul mate line at least at this point. I do want a collection of Chanel earrings and a black Chanel crossbody purse. I might even allow some weird sex for that crap! (That’s a stretch—not accurate really)

          12. Lorelei says:

            Whocares—your picture is lovely by the way!

          13. WhoCares says:


            Thank-you! It was taken a long time ago but is still a favourite one of me.

          14. FoolMe1Time says:

            Lorelei I’m wondering if the ones that like the scent of there significant other could be the love devotees that HG writes about? I have always incorporated different smells with people or places from my past. My Mother’s pillow smelt like her, when she passed away, I clung to that pillow for dear life, it had the scent of her perfume on it. The same with my Father when he passed, it wasn’t his pillow but a scarf that he wore that had the smell of his cologne. Even my ex narc when he would be away in another state working, I had a tee shirt of his that had traces of his cologne on it. I burned that though after finding out what he was! Even certain events from my past, if I smell a certain fragrance it will take me back to that time. In fact many of the times I was molested can be brought back with a certain smell or even being in a similar place. An example would be a bakery, I can’t go near one without ghosts from my past entering my mind. I lived near a bakery when I was young, the alley I was molested in often, was a block away from that bakery, I can remember the smell of fresh baked goods in the air as he was doing to me what he always did! I’m far from being normal, however when I tell someone I love them, it is with my whole being. My fault is that whenever it was spoken back to me, it was and still is a lie, I didn’t know that then.

          15. Lorelei says:

            Hi Foolme—I certainly don’t think the love devotee is any better or worse off. I’m so conditioned to accept nothing that I’m like a cat being put in water when it comes to PDA or any affection unless sex is involved and then I don’t want anywhere near the person after the actual encounter. I am convinced it has to do with growing up stifled. I gave a bit of it a try in my teen years when I was a little more starry eyed and it quickly waned. (The affection stuff) I have zero desire for what would be considered a conventional relationship and HG discusses normal people want a typical progression and I’m simply unable to trust anyone on this level and really am pretty narcissistic myself when it comes to a wandering eye. The modification and work involved—the introspection required seems enormous. I’m affectionate with my children but that was learned until it became natural. (No one was ever affectionate toward me including my mother who is not a narcissist)
            Sex has always been a fucked up subject. It’s not an issue (the actual itself) at all—it’s just been quite an evolution as maybe I’ve used it to be a substitute for a brand of affection. I really don’t know? No clue. Childhood sexual abuse used to bother me but I don’t feel haunted by it now. I didn’t do it so it was never my behavior to reconcile. I can logically look at my kids and know if such a deplorable thing had occurred at such and such age it wasn’t their fault. I think that has helped conceptually to be ok with it. I did have a horrible time after my first daughter was born with nursing—I flipped out and couldn’t do it. Lost it and was vulnerable and that dissipated with time when the others were born. I’m a particular sort of messed up for sure. I’m high functioning in the world but carry a load of stuff. I know there have been improvements but the rest feels daunting at times, although the possibilities are endless.

          16. FoolMe1Time says:

            I understand Lorelei, I am somewhat reverse of you. It was like I was born with enough affection to give to the world! My Mother nor Father ( who was most definitely a narcissist) were not very affectionate people, nor were my Sister or brother, although he had a soft spot for me and still does. Usually the affection from him was me forcing it on him, but he would always laugh and give in. So sex became my way of getting that attention and affection. Basically we are both pretty well messed up!! 😘💞

          17. Lorelei says:

            Haha, but there are worse. It’s a bad day because I need to GOSO with a very close friend. Once you know—you disengage. And I know that enough to know a lack of authenticity when my gut is screaming at me.

          18. FoolMe1Time says:

            You know who to call! When in doubt, call HG! Or rather consult with HG! Lol. In the mean time follow your instincts. That is something neither one of us does, until it’s to late!

          19. Lorelei says:

            HG is not a neurosurgeon and I need a lobotomy and a Thorazine shot in the ass.

          20. FoolMe1Time says:

            A lobotomy for you is not necessary! However perhaps some down time and a glass of wine is in order. 🥂🍾

          21. Lorelei says:

            Ugh no wine. I have a box of makeup. (Most is for Xmas gifts). I start early. But some of it is mine!

          22. FoolMe1Time says:

            Oh God you’re one of those people!! Enough! I’m out.

          23. Lorelei says:

            Are we the most messed up losers around or do we just get like a special mention? Like we can bag groceries and stuff and tie our shoes but not walk and chew gum?

          24. FoolMe1Time says:

            Haha! Oh I believe we can do a lot more then just that! I also believe we are not losers, far from it!! 🥰

          25. Lorelei says:

            We are not lessers, this is true.

          26. FoolMe1Time says:

            Stop! Hahaha! We are not narcissists at all!!

          27. Lorelei says:

            I just got a delivery from Nordstrom Rack. Lessers don’t order from there. I’m hooked on Lorac lip gloss and I’m happy again.

          28. FoolMe1Time says:

            When in doubt? Shop!! 🤣🤣🤣

          29. NarcAngel says:

            I know we kid about shopping a lot but people can really get themselves in trouble trading one addiction for another.

          30. FoolMe1Time says:

            I think she had her shopping addiction long before she had her narcissism addiction!

            But I do agree with you. My sister had it so bad for shopping, even after she got in debt and cut up her credit cards, leaving everyone thinking she had gained control. We found out that she actually memorized the numbers on her cards and was still using them.
            My Mother actually had to borrow money to help her pay off some of that debt! Eventually she got help and has not had any issues in years, she also does not have anymore credit cards.

          31. NarcAngel says:

            I wasn’t referring to anyone specific, just reminded that many of is refer to retail therapy and usually it’s a joke, but when we are prone to addiction and removing ourselves from one, we just have to be careful not to trade it for another and end up on a different wheel of misery. Now if you’ll excuse me, I have to pop out to the shops. Toodles.

          32. FoolMe1Time says:

            Hahaha NA! Happy shopping!

          33. Lorelei says:

            Shopping addiction is an interesting topic NA. Just saw this. I use it to cope but I carry no debt. It is cyclical—waxes and wanes. I actually refrained from buying a new car a few weeks ago. We joke a lot to jazz up the serious gist here indeed but I’m in good shape. Admittedly—I do work a lot 1-2 weeks of the month to maintain a debt free status. Things equal work. But I love my work so it’s a win/win. LOVE my work. What a privilege I have to make people’s lives better each day I walk in with a smile. And I smile every day these days.

          34. FoolMe1Time says:

            I’m so glad you are feeling better! I’ve hit a low point and need a break for a few days. Behave yourself until I return. If that’s not possible, order some hair products online!😘💞

          35. Lorelei says:

            My hair is under excellent control!

          36. Lorelei says:


          37. Lorelei says:

            Oh and I got that boyfriends phone number. Whatever whatever asshole. Haha

          38. MommyPino says:

            Are we being judgmental now on how people get ensnared by narcs? Does it matter what kind of crap someone fell for when they got ensnared? The end product is the same. 🤷‍♀️

          39. MommyPino says:

            Never mind my first comment. I was just being grumpy because I feel so stupid for the fact that I have even entertained the thought that the handyman could have been my soul mate. In fairness to myself though I wasn’t always like that. It must have been temporary insanity. 🤯

          40. Lorelei says:

            No worries MP—I’m actually more upset I have no real expectation of a golden period! That’s sick all by itself.

          41. MommyPino says:

            Haha thank you Lorelei for being forgiving!! Love you friend!! 😘😘😘😘😘.

            The more that I think about it, ‘soul mate’ was probably just an excuse I came up with for wanting to have sex with him so badly lol.

          42. Lorelei says:

            Haha! It’s always the sex and the sex and the sex!

          43. MommyPino says:

            So true!! No wonder it’s one of their most potent weapons aside from words!

        2. Desirée says:

          Re: HGs “lady friend”
          I have never heard that term before…just looked up the translation and am still not sure what it means. And what does age have to do with that term? If there is any truth to what HG wrote in The Voice of an Angel, he would have turned 44 this month.

          1. Sweetest Perfection says:

            Lorelei: “I just got a delivery from Nordstrom Rack. Lessers don’t order from there.” Incorrect. My UL does. But he’s a Lesser with delusions of grandeur.

          2. MommyPino says:

            Was he an Upper Lesser SP? For me I get confused with both Upper Lessers and Upper Mid Rangers because they have traits that make them seem that they are in an upper echelon school.

          3. Sweetest Perfection says:

            Yes, he was/is an UL. I don’t know the similarities between the two, I just recognize my narc’s patterns, and they are awful enough to GOSO.

          4. MommyPino says:

            Hi SP, It’s just for me personally I tend to mistake an UL as a Mid Ranger and an Upper Mid Ranger as a Greater because they have some traits of the higher echelon schools. For example in your narc’s case, he shops at Nordstrom and I am imagining him as not the typical LL and ML when it comes to the way he presents himself. I know an UMR that I thought was a Greater because I have never seen him do pity plays and he is amazingly smart although he never went to college. He was a VP of a big Silicon Valley company and used to be one of the best hackers working for the government. But after reading more I have re categorized him as an UMR because of other factors.

          5. Sweetest Perfection says:

            Yes, he was confusing until I did the narc detector. I totally believed him to be a MRN because of his profession, because he doesn’t show any violence, because he has a nice façade… but I never thought he could be a Greater although I was scared of that possibility. And I didn’t mostly because he has no sense of style haha!

          6. MommyPino says:

            Haha honestly I’m ever so thankful that I have never dealt with a Greater. I was also thinking that a narc that I briefly dated in my home country may have been a Greater but everybody likes him too much so he has to be just a UMR. If I’m going to tangle with a narc I pray that they be the lower echelons so that escape would be easier/possible. The LMR handyman would never bother me again unless I initiate it because he’s a cowardly lower echelon narc who would not want to be in trouble. 😊

          7. Lorelei says:

            Upper lessers love expensive things. Indeed.

          8. HG Tudor says:


          9. Lorelei says:

            I think Cardi B is an upper lesser!

          10. Sweetest Perfection says:

            I’m expensive!

          11. Lorelei says:


          12. Lorelei says:

            He must be 44. But he’s been dating since age 5.

          13. Desirée says:

            I’m sure HG has been dating since age 5, no doubt he was very extroverted in kindergarten.
            As for Upper Lessers liking expensive things, I once knew a guy that had a gold bar shaped perfume as his “signature scent” and proudly kept the flacon in his car for when he’s on the prowl and for everyone to see. Red Flags come in all flaconshapes and size.

      2. Sheron says:

        How do I know if my husband is Narc or just a mean and stubborn man?.. I left him 4 months ago and he hasn’t reached out to me and I don’t understand why.. When i call him we fight over what he has done and he doesn’t want to hear it.. When i go to our place his now he hasn’t cleaned up and he has our wedding picture up and a sign I made for him and I don’t understand that nor has he changed the locks I still go there from time to time when he is not home to see what I can glean no evidence of a woman there. Also I have called him and we don’t speak a word we just sleep on the phone until it reaches its time limit why does he still do this? And why does he have our picture up

        1. HG Tudor says:

          Hello Sheron,

          Use this

  16. Joy says:

    Perhaps narcs are powerful in the ability to take from others, to control and destroy.. But can you ever create.or generate your own fuel even if you wanted to. Some would say it seems a bit parasitic. We can survive without you but can you survive
    without us.. Emotions are wonderful. But as with all things self regulation is necessary I think.

  17. Pati says:

    So I gather that Narcissist fed off of people’s emotions whether its positive or negative and turns it into fuel. Is that correct HG?

    1. HG Tudor says:

      It is.

      1. Pati says:

        Thank you

      2. empath007 says:

        HG… is passive aggressive behaviour normally indicative of narcissim? I know the mid rangers tend to be… but can passive aggressive behaviour be seperate of narcissim in some individuals?

        1. HG Tudor says:

          It is an indicator, it is not determinative.

          1. santaann1964 says:

            Oh no! Passive aggressive behavior….

    2. empath007 says:

      Does your husband try to gather negative fuel pati?

      1. Pati says:

        Yes it does. He know we have to be somewhere and makes me late on purpose. Then I get upset and he tells me to relax and I have anxiety .

        1. ashlei1 says:

          Ugh, I hated that so much with my ex. He knew I was the black sheep of my family, cast as forgetful and irresponsible, and he knew I was determined to not ever legitimize the mis-characterization, and dang if he didn’t always somehow *accidentally* make us late when there was a family affair to attend.

          1. Pati says:

            So true ,its because they didnt want to go in the first place. Next time this happens I am going alone. I have a better time without him anyways. I am myself and dont need him to always criticize me. Plus wherever we go he needs to be the centre of attention. The world doea not only evolve around the Narcs. He can go get his fuel elsewhere .

  18. Kelsey P says:

    I tried to not feel—but it built up and created trauma, so I have learned to face it. It’s quite daunting so I don’t blame you for avoiding it I don’t know if I couldn’t feel even if I tried. You must have been through something quite horrific to go where you have gone, on par with a child soldier in Uganda. You probably don’t even acknowledge it happened. Compartmentalization, how do you do it?

    What is narcissistic abuse if not rage outsourced?

    Also, thank you for reminding all of us that emotions lie and love doesn’t conquer all.

  19. empath007 says:

    I still have trouble with this article (I know HG “riddled in emotional thinking” Iam..) but still… There is nothing weak or wrong with having a wide variety of feelings. Its just simply not true.

    Also, I could probably create a good argument in defense of the fact that Jealousy is a weak emotion, while we all experience it to one degree or another, it is a weakness to be jealous of someone else. I do not feel jealous of others very often and I believe that puts me in a position of strength. I truly (for the most part) do not feel any need to keep up with other people or achieve to have what they have etc. I make decisions for my life that make sense for ME and I don’t bother with what any one else thinks of it. As a result… in my social circle I have much more then most around me. I also have my contentment.

    Nothing is ever perfect. There isn’t a right or wrong (unless I say its wrong 😉 haha) in this world. We are all just getting by with our own coping mechanisms.

    1. HG Tudor says:

      There is no such thing as an objective truth. You keep failing to grasp this, because of your emotional thinking.

      This is a place to explain to you how WE view the world, how WE regard your kind, so you understand. It is based on our perspective. You will never alter that by saying “Its just simply not true” because you fail to understand that this represents an intra subjective perspective.

      1. empath007 says:

        If I was so opposed to others perspectives… I wouldn’t even be on this site.

        I understand fully me saying that will not get you to change your own perspective or other narc perspective. That’s ok. I don’t need to change anyone’s perspective.

        I am simply posting my own perspective from my own point of view. Because that is what I believe. Regardless of whether anyone agrees with me or not.

        1. HG Tudor says:

          You are perfectly entitled to post your own perspective, but understand how that is not our perspective and it is the difference in perspectives which is at the root of many difficulties for the victim.

          1. empath007 says:

            Yes. I sometimes think my ability to make excuses for
            Their perspective is the problem though. It’s what keeps me stuck. The whole “he’s entilted to his opinion” that may be…. but it doesn’t mean I have to stick around to agree with it either. Which is the point you try and get across to us… it’s important for me to feel rooted in my views and not apologize for them anymore. I objectively beleive certian things and I don’t need others validation that they are true.

            When it comes to this article… it just hits a nerve so that’s why I comment.

            But I understand there’s nothing to argue about.

          2. santaann1964 says:

            Bazinger difference of opinion, logic or perspective however it is written. It’s what makes us different but understanding the difference is what makes us powerful to reject the pain caused by the difference. Thank you Mr.H for your enlightenment.

          3. HG Tudor says:

            No. Logic, opinion and perspective are not different labels for the same thing.

          4. santaann1964 says:

            Ok so you got me going with my thought process. I’m very eager to learn. I am twisted because I’m confused. Ok you got me Narc. Brat. Lol. If we ever had a face to face conversation, do you have any idea how many times I would say “BUT” in our conversation. Just so you know I’m goggling logic, and perspective. Thank you for giving me your time today. I really do love you Mr. H. ❤️. I’ll give you fuel anytime. Thank you

          5. santaann1964 says:

            Are you Eckhart Tolle? Just kidding Mr.H but another great teacher of the “ego”

        2. santaann1964 says:


  20. Sarah says:

    The investment in acquiring knowledge and applying logic to make intelligence based decisions is a great strength. Feelings may or may not be a part of the equation in arriving at a decision. I respect differences here. The desire to feel powerful I would see as a chain rather than wings?

  21. lisk says:

    Sounds like you’re a well-oiled machine.

  22. WAF Tudorita says:

    Agreed in that feelings are a burden until one realizes that they as fluid as life’s circumstances.
    In my experience there’s an underlying and omnipresent ground of being that underlies all fleeting feelings. It is peaceful , and this can become the abiding place of residence , to greater or lesser degrees.
    From this “place” feelings can be felt and seen, revelled in or released fairly quickly, so they aren’t as burdensome.
    There’s a “forgetting” of this original residence, myself I get pulled from it on and off , but even that isn’t too terrible , it’s just part of the fun of existence
    I feel others feelings , and I get pulled away for that reason more than anything it seems.

    While not feeling would defin be a release of what is sometimes unpleasant-,I wouldn’t choose it as an alternative. I did so with the abuse of alcohol and many do the same ..but that’s only putting off the inevitable

    1. WAF Tudorita says:

      Great pic by the way lol!!

  23. Jenny Devine says:

    I dont see myself as an “empath” just a normal human being whose brain developed fully with normal reactions to normal things. “empath” suggests an almost grandiose description of a fully functioning human being (slightly narcissistic trending in its own terms)
    I wake up and want my children to be happy, but if they are sad it is life we cant and dont want to be happy every day. How can you be happy if you dont know sadness and all the other normal emotions? I wake up and want to have no external person trying to control my emotions and to have my own security to trust what ever emotions I feel that day. No bitterness for not being happy. (It gives me a reason to listen to my tired body and mind and have a pyjama day and watch movies with friends and family)
    I also dont wake up needing to strategise and plan and think about all of this or where I can get fuel to make me feel worth while I can just feel normally and accept it.

    I am no less powerful than you I am in control of my own needs and wants. You dont. I dont need fuel.. You do.. I make my own and you cant have it. Hugs xo

    1. Lorelei says:

      Jenny—I don’t like the term empath either for some of the same reasons. The self promotion of this kills me but I do know it’s not often brought up to self promote. No one chooses their inherent disposition. Even a narcissist. I simply want to function optimally within my realm of possibilities and it’s a clear handicap in some areas.

    2. santaann1964 says:

      Nicely written which brings my question I have asked Mr.H in his thought process it seems that there are only Narcissist and Empaths aka good and evil aka normal or abnormal. How about just humans just are different period! My thoughts

      1. MB says:

        Labels alone denote nothing except classification. It is the human mind that assigns judgement to the label. I’m not sure we can help it.

  24. Desirée says:

    You write that you don’t feel many emotions because they would distract from the aquisition of fuel, but fuel itself is aquired through emotion. So hasn’t the narcissim merely outsourced the need for most emotions by having you feed on anothers emotional reactions towards you?

    1. HG Tudor says:

      No because the feeding, as you state, on the emotion is not for the emotion itself but what it achieves.

      1. FoolMe1Time says:

        Not for the emotion itself but what it achieves. So as to what it achieves, is that the power that you feel by causing these emotions in each of your sources HG?

        1. HG Tudor says:

          Yes and the confirmation of the assertion of control which is an absolute necessity.

          1. Pati says:

            I agree,I see that provoking is a huge issue as well HG. If you need to be somewhere and they they are sleeping and you get them up they will give you a hard time. Its like they want you to be late be late on purpose just to see me pissed off. Then they will stop for a coffee through the long line at Tim Hortons drive thru. I guess they like my negative emotions as it gives them fuel. I think I am on the right track

      2. njfilly says:

        Would you classify the need for fuel as an emotionally driven need?

        1. HG Tudor says:


      3. Jenna says:

        Hi HG,

        So “the feeding… on the emotion is not for the emotion itself but what it achieves”? I always thought fuel was for the emotion itself? I had no idea. Can you please explain this, if you don’t mind?

        1. HG Tudor says:

          Fuel is your emotion. This is what is required. We do not acquire your emotion (as some people mistakenly think) but it is the effect of your fuel which is required because it makes us feel powerful and it signifies control.

          1. Jenna says:

            Ah, I think I need to rework my understanding of fuel then. Thank you HG. But why is it that a smile from a stranger (tertiary source) makes you feel powerful? Or even a smile from a friend (secondary source)? With this new aspect to the definition of fuel (it’s not exactly a new aspect, but something I obviously failed to understand before), I finally understand why you like negative fuel. But now I no longer understand why you like small gestures of positive fuel, like a smile.

          2. HG Tudor says:

            Because it denotes control and validation, as previously explained.

          3. Jenna says:

            Hi HG!
            Validation from a stranger is a little difficult to understand, but narcs operate from a different world view after all. Thank you for your responses!

          4. HG Tudor says:

            An appliance enters onto our stage, that means, whoever they are, a potential need for control arises, hence this would include validation for a stranger.

          5. FYC says:

            HG, So emotions, from anyone in reaction to you, are but points of evidence that demonstrate you have influence and power over them. The more intense the obvious affect/effect, the more the implied influence and power. The degree to which you can purposely provoke the outpouring of said emotions/power, is evidence of your control. Such proof of control enables you to cope so the cycle repeats. Would this be an accurate characterization of your fuel?

          6. HG Tudor says:


          7. FYC says:

            HG, Thank you for the confirmation.

          8. HG Tudor says:

            You are welcome.

          9. Jenna says:

            Thank you HG.

      4. Desirée says:

        I understand that the emotion itself is not the crucial point. However, since fuel cannot be obtained any other way, your narcissism still requires the emotions you can’t feel to sustain itself. Unless you’d say that you could live solely on the fuel obtained from the limited range of emotions you can stir in other narcissists, in which case I suppose I have no point here.

        1. HG Tudor says:

          That is not the case, Desiree.

          It does not require the emotions we do not have, it requires emotion per se, be they positive or negative. Those emotions are provided by empaths, normals and narcissists (in differing ways). Empaths, are of course, the best choice because they are the easiest to ensnare and keep ensnared for reasons explained previously.

          1. Desirée says:

            Are empaths not the best choice because they provide the best fuel output?

          2. HG Tudor says:

            Yes owing to the ease of ensnarement and maintaining ensnarement.

          3. Desirée says:

            I see, thank you for elaborating HG. I find the concept of being more efficient when relieved of most emotions difficult to grasp. The energy my emotions (good or bad) provide me with is what makes me passionate, driven and conscientious whereas most narcs I’ve known are ridiculously lazy, even in their fuel aquisition.

          4. HG Tudor says:

            It cannot be denied that some narcissists are lazy, in the same way that some narcissists are driven and ambitious and hard-working.

            I am talking about me. I am highly efficient – why, because I am not burdened by particular emotions.

          5. Lorelei says:

            So if narcissists are unburdened by so many emotions lending to success, how do you explain how an empath driven for success manages the nonsense they encounter while achieving their own success “successfully?” Why do some empaths seem to do this more easily than others? Why do some empaths naturally avert ensnarements whether personal or professional? I think it’s a good question for once!

          6. HG Tudor says:

            They apply logic and reign in emotional thinking. They may also have a faster ET rate of reduction than other empaths, in the same way some people have a faster metabolism than others.

          7. Lorelei says:

            Is there an emotional Adipex that doesn’t cause pulmonary hypertension?

          8. HG Tudor says:

            Winners don’t do drugs.

          9. Lorelei says:

            I wouldn’t want to go in the required dwellings where such things are acquired!

          10. HG Tudor says:

            Fair point.

          11. Lorelei says:


          12. Alexissmith says:

            That’s helpful. So an empath is easier to keep ensnared. So when a narc ensnares another narc long term they’re usually from different schools as in the case of bill and Hillary? Would that be correct?

          13. HG Tudor says:


          14. Alexissmith2016 says:

            Loving you so much right now. 💋

          15. Lorelei says:

            Have you ever dated a normal in a girlfriend capacity HG? You say empaths are preferred..

          16. HG Tudor says:

            All my girlfriends have been empaths. There has been the odd normal who has come my way but not as a girlfriend.

          17. WhoCares says:

            “odd normal” – oxymoron much?

          18. HG Tudor says:

            Odd as in occasional, not strange.

          19. WhoCares says:

            *Sigh*, yes I took it out of context. Thanks for the correction!

  25. kel2day says:

    I think your ultimate quest is to deplete the world of narcissistic fuel, except for yours from your adoring followers, and be the last of your kind like the last unicorn. I’m all for that.

    1. Violetta says:

      At least we’ve upgraded.

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