The Classroom Narcissist

THE CLASSROOMNARCISSIST

I am Chloe. I am 18 years old and I had an affair with my teacher, Mr Stevens or Phil as I came to call him.

I am not some silly girl, although they have repeatedly tried to tell me that I am. Believe me, I have felt the weight of my opponents as they tried to convince me, no doubt orchestrated by Phil, that I dreamt the whole thing up. Still, it is to be expected isn’t it, that they, the teachers, will close ranks and look out for one another. That is what they do isn’t it? I have lost friends because of this, but I realise they are just jealous and they fancied Phil just like me, only I got to have him. I don’t blame them for fancying him, he is good looking and funny and he has that easy air about him that makes him so likeable, but what they don’t realise that it is all an act. Phil the Flirt, Phil the Mate but when it suits him he remains Phil the Teacher, set apart and to stay apart.

He started it of course. I won’t deny that I liked him from the beginning. Everybody does. He is a popular teacher and being good-looking as well is never going to cause him a problem in the popularity stakes, but you see, he knows all of this, he plays on all of this and boy does he use it. He uses it to reel you in and then, and here is the clever part, he uses it as his defence. “I cannot help it if they take advantage of my popularity,” he protests as he maintains his innocence. He is not innocent. And he took my innocence.

He started it. I recognised the way he looked at me. He always looked for me in class before anybody else, as if ensuring that I was there in my usual seat and then giving me ‘that smile’. Oh, he smiles at everyone I was told. He does not smile for them the way he does, or rather did, for me. I am not stupid. I may be young but I saw how he would stare at me, how I could feel his gaze on me, how I could tell from the corner of my eye that he was stood besides me and was looking down my blouse. Who wouldn’t? I am attractive, I have my fair share of boys chasing after me and Mr Stevens is a man, he is flesh and blood, so he is bound to look isn’t he? He wasn’t meant to touch though but he did. Oh he touched me, in so many ways and he knew what he was doing.

I had heard that others had become besotted with him before. Rumours of some girl a few years ago who had to be persuaded to move to another school because she fell in love with him and would not leave him alone. I tried to find her actually but got nowhere. Some say he got her pregnant and she had to have an abortion, her parents hushing it all up as they did not want the scandal. Some say it is all made up. They have said the same to me.

I know what I saw. The cheeky winks just for me, the slightly longer smile than usual aimed at me. The way he usually asked me first when I put my hand up to answer a question. He was besotted with me first. I tried to tell them this but they dismissed what I said. Told me I was reading too much into him just being friendly, that I was trying to see things which were not there because I was desperate for his approval.

He was always encouraging, praising me for my work. I always enjoyed history but it became even better when he was allocated as my teacher. I worked hard because I wanted good results and I wanted him to be pleased with my work. I got high marks from the beginning and I now realise this was his way of reeling me in, making me feel special, marking me out for special treatment. He advocated on my behalf that I should be a candidate for Oxbridge (prestige British universities) and that meant extra tuition ; with him of course. Now, I am good enough to get in to Oxford or Cambridge (I chose Oxford) but he clearly saw this as his opportunity to isolate me from the other students and cleverly, from witnesses. After all, plenty of people across the various subjects have these Oxbridge tutorials after college hours, but he used his to teach me about more than the Tudor dynasty and the English Civil War.

Once he had me in those special tuition one-on-ones, then it was inevitable where it would end up. I was not complaining. I wanted his attention, absolutely, although of course he should have known better. He was the one in a position of trust, a man in a position of authority and I was just the pupil. Yes, I wanted him, but I didn’t realise that he was the one who had engineered for me to feel that way. That is what these predators do. They make it seem like your doing, but he hypnotised me and made me fall under his spell.

He was always so assured, doing just enough to maintain an element of doubt should he have misjudged the situation, just enough to be able to protest it was an innocent gesture. The hand on the shoulder, the hug of congratulations, the slightly-too-long touching of fingers when passing a book or an essay to one another. Oh, he was good, he knew what he was doing, steadily reeling me in and making me the centre of the universe. He chose me from the very beginning and little by little he reeled me in. He used his influence to bring me to heel and have me on my knees (how he relished seeing me on my knees) and I lapped up his attention and more besides.

Soon the secret trysts began. Arrangements made in his office with that Stuart family tree covering the door window so nobody could see what went on in his office. So much for transparent government, he still subscribed to the idea of an absolute monarchy. He never used his ‘phone, clever old Phil. He made it seem romantic, the whispered instructions of where to meet and when, always outdoors, never in places where we would be seen. No traces left, no observers, no evidence. He was a master at this game and I was clearly naive, but I am not a silly little girl.

And then he dropped me. No explanation. He became cold. Civil yet cold. I tried to get my friends to see how he treated me differently but they told me that I was imagining it. My grades remained excellent but the Phil that held me and read to me from historical texts and delighted me with his knowledge was gone. The Oxbridge tutelage came to a conclusion as the entrance examinations loomed ; he had no reason to be alone with me and even though I sought an audience with him, this absolute monarch would not grant me admittance.

So I spoke out. Why shouldn’t I? He told me he loved me and I loved him too. Yet once he had my innocence (or rather once he had it two score) he considered me conquered and of no great interest to him anymore. Nobody treats me like this. I will bring him down. He is not going to get away with it. Oh, I know they think I have made this all up, some kind of revenge for not getting my way, but they have underestimated me. I am not going to be denied and I will make the all see, even my parents who for some inexplicable reason have sided with him. I shouldn’t be surprised though, the have always hated me for some reasons, they are frauds to think they can call themselves mother and father. No, I know this is how his kind behave. They turn everyone against you, cut you off and paint you as the trouble maker. That is not me. I am the victim.

 

I am Mr Stevens. I am 30 years old and a teacher of history. I still am, although I am currently suspended as a consequence of the ridiculous allegations of a fantasist. It is an outrage that someone’s made-up fantasy has the potential to ruin a man’s career.

I am no fool. I have taught for nearly a decade and I know the tricks pupils get up to. I have seen them all. I have always been a teacher who adopts the ‘carrot’ approach. You always get further with honey rather than vinegar. Oh, I know there are one or two sticks in the mud in the staff room who regard my popularity with sniffed disdain, but that is just jealousy on their part. My results speak for themselves. Plenty of students choose to study history and between Miss Kelshaw and I, we make a formidable team. Thankfully Miss Kelshaw has supported me in this unpleasant matter although I always knew she would do so. Sensible lady.

You do walk a tight rope at times when you are friendly, yet firm, with the students. I am not their friend but I do not have to be their enemy either. I love history and my natural enthusiasm for the topic is something I try to install in my charges too. If you love something, you always do better don’t you? It does not feel like a bind or a chore. By ensuring those who choose to study history with me really love it and want to live and breathe it, I weed out the ones where it is not for them nice and early and they move to a different subject in the first two weeks. Plus doing that ensures that I am only going to get those who are going to get the best grades, so it is a win-win all around. I want to make my mark on this college. I will be the principal one day, although at present it appears that moral principles are ones which are trying to attract my attention to a greater degree.

Chloe Fowler is a good student. She will do well. Polite if something of an attention-seeker. Always first to stick her hand in the air an one to air an opinion on absolutely anything and everything. Nothing really wrong with that I suppose, at least she has learned the mantra of make a point and then ensure you have something to back it up when she advanced her arguments. I taught her just as I taught everybody else ; to the best of my ability.

Unfortunately for me, she mis-read my concern for her education as meaning something else. What can I do about that? I am not going to sit behind a screen and isolate myself from my students am I? That is not how I operate. I am not a ‘no smiles before Christmas’ kind of guy. Not at all. History needs to be alive, accessible and most of all enjoyable. It is like anything in this life – if you enjoy it, make it yours and you will succeed. I want all my students to succeed.

Yes, I selected Chloe Fowler for Oxbridge tutelage. That was the right selection and I still say it is, despite her ridiculous allegations. She has her keen mind, too keen as it happens. I have read what she has accused me of, or rather the police office read it to me and it is all nonsense, a made-up fairy tale. I see she has been clever though, she has ensured that she has accused me when there was nobody else available to witness our interactions. It is always the case that those chosen for Oxbridge tuition see their tutors in their offices. That has always been the case and I am pleased that my fellow teachers and the principal have confirmed that to be the case. I knew they would back me on this. It is an occupational hazard of ours, infatuated students who start to think they are the apple of your eye. Usually it is nothing more than a harmless term-long crush and they grow out of it, but not this girl. She has something seriously wrong with her. Has to have to come out with the lies she has spouted. Suggesting we had sex beneath ‘the tree that Charles the Second hid in’. I know that to be a lie ; that tree was destroyed hundreds of years ago. Everything she has spouted is just the slops of the mind of a fantasist and she is dangerous. Nobody is going to believe her. I know the police have to go through the motions but it will be soon kicked in to touch. She has done this because I rejected her. I didn’t reject her outright, after all there was nothing to reject, we had no romantic relationship, there was no flirtation, nothing. It is clear, however, she thought otherwise and in that warped mind of hers, she has felt rejected in some way and this is the result. An expensive and unnecessary investigation, plus the interference to the other students, no wonder so many have turned against her.

I know she liked me. I am a likeable person but I maintained a proper teacher-student relationship and she has seen fit to dream up something else. What can you do? Put cameras everywhere I suppose but then who wants that, surely there has to be some element of trust between us? Am I annoyed? Of course I am. I haven’t done anything wrong and along comes this girl and she spouts all manner of idiocy and she is treated seriously. I mean, anybody can see this is a tissue of lies. This had better not affect my promotion prospects or I will be taking legal action too. Thankfully the local paper have not reported anything about it so far, that conversation I had with the deputy editor seems to have worked, so far so good on that front. He is a good friend and does not want to see the reputation of a hard-working and successful teacher sullied. What annoys me most is how easy it is for someone like her to make these things up and next thing it is suspension and investigation. They tell me that it is a neutral act but I know there will be those trotting out the old ‘no smoke without fire’ rubbish.

I realise that when you are decent-looking chap like me and because you are friendly and get to share a joke with the students, some might blur the boundaries but it is one thing for them to be blurred and another for them to be crossed. Am I to be punished just for being popular, because that is what she is trying to do?

I am not going to change my style though. I am a hands-on teacher and that always gets results and one besotted fantasists is not going to make Phil Stevens change how he teaches. No way.

It is ridiculous. As if I would be interested in some 16 year old (which is how she says she was when this started) when I have a gorgeous wife at home. That in itself should tell those looking into this that this is a witch hunt by a disturbed adolescent who should be studying for her exams and getting help with whatever problem she has, rather than trying to ruin the life of an honest and decent man. I am the victim in all of this.

Who is the class room narcissist?

 

Who do you think is the narcissist?

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152 Comments

  1. I was 16, he was 34. Daddy issues. Statutory rape here in the South. I didn’t tell because I was afraid he would abandon me. Ain’t love grand.

    1. 12345, it saddens me to read this. At the young age of 16, we are so impressionable and naive. I wish u had told someone, but i do understand u were scared.
      It may have even been difficult for u to tell us here on the blog.
      Some things are difficult for me to share too, but i do it when i’m ready. Lately, i’ve been sharing more abt my childhood.
      With everything that u’ve been thru (i know u’ve been thru hell w narcs also), you have turned out to be a v kind soul.

  2. No matter whether that teacher slept with her or not, he demonstrates some red flags:

    – “allegations of a fantasist” (disrespect);

    – “I have taught for nearly a decade” (attempt to add some authority to his words);

    – “there are ONE or TWO sticks in the MUD in the staff room who regard my popularity with sniffed disdain, but that is just jealousy on their part (minimization, disrespect);

    – “my results speak for themselves” (attempt to add some authority to his words);

    – “thankfully Miss Kelshaw has supported me in this unpleasant matter although I always knew she would do so. Sensible lady. (WOMAN-leutenant adds some authority supporting him; “sensible lady” – she doesn’t use the logic and easily manipulated);

    – “by ensuring those who choose to study history with me really LOVE it and want to LIVE and BREATHE it, I weed out the ones where it is not for them nice” (he works only with the easily controlled “history-love-devotees”);

    – ” I am only going to get those who are going to get the best grades, so it is a win-win all around. I want to make my mark on this college. I will be the principal one day” (desire ALWAYS to be a winner and have a position of power);

    – “polite (Chloe*) if something of an attention-seeker (smearing);

    – “she has something seriously wrong with her” (smearing);

    – “everything she has spouted is just the slops of the mind of a fantasist and she is dangerous” (smearing, disrespect);

    – “nobody is going to believe her” (generalization);

    – “in that warped mind of her” (smearing, disrespect);

    – “an expensive and unnecessary investigation” (minimization);

    – “no wonder so many have turned against her” (generalization);

    – “I haven’t done anything wrong and along comes this girl and she spouts all manner of idiocy and she is treated seriously. I mean, anybody can see this is a tissue of lies” (smearing, disrespect, generalization);

    – “He (deputy editor*) is a good FRIEND and does not want to see the reputation of a hard-working and successful teacher sullied (“official” friend and supporter adds some authority to his words);

    – “they tell me that it (investigation*) is a neutral act (minimization);

    – “one besotted fantasists” (smearing, disrespect);

    – “this is a witch hunt by a disturbed adolescent who should be studying for her exams and getting help with whatever problem she has” (smearing, disrespect).

    I can’t say anything about that girl, because her character and behavior were invented and described by Tudor (who is a Man and a Narcissist) and I see a lot of HIM in her “way of thinking” and her “speech”. It isn’t an easy task to write from WOMAN’s and EMPATH’s perspective, huh, Tudor? 🙃

    1. Thank you for your interesting observations. It is true that it is difficult to write from the perspective of a lady because I am a man, although of course I have learned extensively as a consequence of my interactions.

      Nice try at getting the answer though with your final comment!

      1. Lol. Your knowledge about women definitely is a good thing, but you’ll never be able to FEEL like we do.

        For example, you are listening to the conversation of two women:
        “Do you have a child?”.
        “Yes, I have. You?”.
        “Me too!”.

        What did you get from this conversation? You got the knowledge that both women have kids. That’s all what you got, man.

        But those women got more. They told to one another that they KNOW what that means to be a mother. That they both know about internal worrying during pregnancy, about very painful process of childbirth, about sleepless nights, about body problems related with pregnancy. They told a lot of things to each other actually!

        We (women) share our stories here and you read them also, Tudor. But you can’t imagine, how many things were conveyed between the lines! You can’t decipher them, because you have to be a woman, you have to THINK and FEEL like a woman and you have to have certain real experience for that.

        Sooo, you have the secret fraternal sisterhood right under your nose, Tudor! Lol.

      2. Lol. I bet, Tudor!

        I thank my own personal god for that also. All those wars with Big World, competition, planning, scheming… Ugh. Not my cup of tea. Lol.

        But being so different, the Man and Woman form the very powerful team and that’s awesome.

    2. A great summary Noname.
      Your last comment is very valid. ‘I can’t say anything about that girl, because her character and behaviour were invented and described by Tudor (who is a Man and a Narcissist) and I see a lot of HIM in her “way of thinking” and her “speech”. It isn’t an easy task to write from WOMAN’s and EMPATH’s perspective, huh, Tudor?’
      Like you I also found HG’s way of thinking and speech coming through loud and clear in his recount from Chloe’s perspective. Maybe it was HG’s intention all along. If Chloe were an empath her recount and perspective would certainly be penned in very different style.

  3. Laura, what an excellent analysis. Although I do not like to agree, I must admit that you made very serious points calling her a narcissist. Nevertheless I believe that it is very often a phase at this age to behave like that. I hope so.

    Many girls of my former class in school tried to impress the teacher by an open button. Me too. We liked it when we could confuse the teacher. It was a great fun for us young girls, especially when we could see he reacted. It was not really fair, but we never went too far.

    We were selfish confident young girls who tried to find out our impact on men and we were extremely proud when we succeeded.

    There was a contest between us girls. The most respected girl was that one with the oldest boy-friend.

    When I was sixteen I seduced a thirty-two “old” man to kiss me (not much more). All the time he wailed that he could not do that because of my age. I succeeded. It was like a sport for me.

    Is that a sign for pure narcissism? I do not think so.

    Of course it is a narcissistic trait to use physical attractiveness to seduce some one and to feel your power over men.

    Me and others we always stopped this game at a certain point. We felt responsibility. And that is clearly no narcissistic trait.

    1. Mona thanks for your interesting comments, point taken. Yes, there will always be girls at either end of the spectrum with either all buttons done up or 3 or even more buttons undone flaunting it all. Mona if a fellow student of yours were to have an affair with a handsome young teacher would you and your fellow students reaction be jealousy or something else?
      If only HG had added Mr Steven’s version of the parents viewpoint, the analysis would be somewhat easier.

      Another point I want to add is that Chloe states ’ even my parents who for some inexplicable reason have sided with him. I shouldn’t be surprised though, the have always hated me for some reasons, they are frauds to think they can call themselves mother and father ’. Most adolescents are at odds with their parents at that age, however calling them frauds is a Narc term. Does this stem from the usual adolescent issues of control and criticism. Does this go far deeper and they are hypocritical Narcs with their public display of the super parent facade and behind closed doors their true dark side emerges. Chloe is ignored or is the domestic slave and has to bring herself up but ensure she gets top marks and reflects well on them at all times. The use of the formal words mother and father rather than using the more familiar mum and dad indicates a great distancing from the parents but that may well be a British mannerism. HG some clarification here please.

      It is far from normal for parents to side with the teacher accused of having an affair with their daughter. Parents may be shocked, angry, disappointed or dismayed that their daughter was involved in an affair with a teacher. Regardless, most parents would be extremely angry and in an uproar against the teacher and the school for the abuse and betrayal of their position and trust as well as breach of ethics. Parents will quite rightly demand the teacher be removed immediately. In my state any such allegations of sexual misconduct with students will always result in the teacher being suspended pending a hearing. If a student/teacher affair is reported resulting in a hearing then teachers who are found guilty are banned from teaching. It is a criminal offense. There may well be some student/teacher affairs that never come to light. There is a teachers registry web page that publishes the hearings into breaches of misconduct and incompetence. So in my state Mr Stevens aspirations to become principal would be totally defunct whether he was found guilty or not at a hearing.

      That leaves us with the following possibilities-:
      The parents might be Narcs and she is the scapegoat child, or the golden child now delegated to the scapegoat role for the alleged affair so they throw her under the bus in true malignant Narc style.
      The parents are realists and know that Chloe has issues and has been a compulsive pathological lying Narc since her early childhood so they don’t believe a word she says about anything.
      Mr Stevens, needs to have the parents on his side so that they discredit Chloe and the case is dropped and he gets to be principal some day. How did he do this? Does he have some dirt on the parents, or has convinced them she will be refused entry to a prestigious University based on his reports and recommendations and effectively blackmailed them to be on his side.
      Her parents full well support Chloe but she is a lying Narc and doing a victim pity play.

  4. Oooh HG a problem to solve. I like that.
    I think that both of them are Narcs. I am basing this on their language use and traits that echoes other Narcs I know.
    Chloe is a somewhat naïve fledgling Narc who has not honed all her skills as yet. Some of her Narc language stands out such as, ‘ I don’t blame them,’ ‘ they are just jealous’. ‘Only I got to have him,’ reflects the possessive ownership. ‘Now, I am good enough to get in to Oxford or Cambridge.’ She brags about her academic prowess.
    No doubt Chloe’s hormones are raging but she is aware of her allure ‘He was stood besides me and was looking down my blouse. Who wouldn’t? I am attractive, I have my fair share of boys chasing after me.’ There would be other female students who would be embarrassed or have the top button securely fastened in such a situation.
    Despite acknowledging her willing participation she also blames him. She comes across as a young needy victim Narc.The fact that she so clearly articulates and identifies some of his behaviour also points to an awareness of Narc traits (unless she has had therapy) ‘but he clearly saw this as his opportunity to isolate me from the other students and cleverly, from witnesses.’ ‘They turn everyone against you, cut you off and paint you as the trouble maker.’
    She is not ashamed, and she is also a determined that ‘ I am not going to be denied and I will make them all see, even my parents who for some inexplicable reason have sided with him’. Her version of events is somewhat the more believable of the two. If her parents really sided with him as she states then she probably has lied to her parents previously or he has convinced them of his twisted version.

    Mr Stevens is clearly a Narc conducting a vigorous smear campaign that almost borders on word salad. His tone is both arrogant and condescending. He puts Chloe down throughout with such terminology as fantasist, a disturbed adolescent, warped mind, spouts all manner of idiocy, dangerous, has something seriously wrong with her and she lies.
    Miss Kelshaw is a loyal minion. He shores up his facade quickly with the newspaper editor on side with a well played pity play. He uses typical narc language such as ‘that is jealousy on their part,’ and manipulative generalisations like ‘ I am a likeable person.’ No wonder so many have turned against her.’ ‘Nobody is going to believe her.’ He boasts that ‘I weed out the ones where it is not for them …. ensures that I am only going to get those who are going to get the best grades, so it is a win-win all around. I want to make my mark on this college. I will be the principal one day.’ He arrogantly evicts those weaker or struggling students that will require extra support. His perception of a win- win is warped as it all about his needs and keeping only those students with good marks that will in turn boost his image and huge ego. The reference to the gorgeous wife is also part of his façade. I bet he told the lie about the oak tree in the first place. As for this bit ‘This had better not affect my promotion prospects or I will be taking legal action too. ‘ He has a huge sense of entitlement. He is also bullying, knowing full well the school would want to avoid such costly court action and the ensuing adverse media.

  5. …and the student by the way she is expressing herself,has gained some knowledge of who she was entangled with but too young to understand that that type of revenge is not effective due to the extensive fuel matrix that the narcissit teacher has ( note how he talks about Miss Kelshaw as a sensible lady). He has already turned people against her ( including her parents) and started the smear campaign long before she knew it..

  6. ….one of the many leading phrases contained in the article showing Phil is the narcissist:

    “It is like anything in this life – if you enjoy it, make it yours and you will succeed. “

    1. That is all I will say because I have far too much to say regarding this particular character and the situation.

  7. Hg – If I think I might be a narcissist that means I am not one, right? I know lesser and mid don’t know what they are or think they do anything wrong and I am not a greater because I am not malignant like that.

  8. Excellent article HG! He talks like a typical mid ranger. Sympathy seeking one minute, then switching to boastful attention seeking.

    He’s thought of every different scenario to control the situation, from manipulating her thoughts, lying about her behaviour, playing his fellow staff members. Even going so far as to contact the deputy editor of the local newspaper. Not to mention the rumours of a previous entanglement with another schoolgirl.

    She talks like a typical self-obsessed needy teenager. They all sound like that. She is only concerned about him and how she feels about him. She does not sound like she has any understanding of the wider ramifications of what she is alleging and what the consequences will be. I think she is foolish and naive and she may be over-exaggerating, but I think he singled her out at the least, and very cleverly at that.

    I’d be interested in the answer to this. It’s a great idea 👍

  9. She is not over confident in my opinion. She desperately defends herself talking about her physical attractiveness. She talks bad about her parents, maybe because it is the truth? There are narcissistic treats (jealousy) but which young girl or boy does not have them at this age?
    If she would be a full blown narcissist she would humiliate him to be a bad lover, would not only focus on him, instead she would take other boys of her age or older ones for comfort right now, would try to persuade them to do the dirty work for her.
    The lie about the oak tree, who had whispered that nonsense in her ear? It sounds very romantically.
    No, he uses a lot of narcissistic phrases, a bit too much. “Nobody will believe her.” Generalisation! Another weapon of a narc.
    If you take a close look at his statements, he either exaggerates or he understates. All clear hints of a narcissistic personality.

    1. While many teachers are narcs, many more are empaths. As a teacher for 25 years, I can affirm that the majority of my colleagues were drawn to teaching because of their love of children and their desire to help others.

          1. That made me laugh, HG! It made me think of two often heard comments that always make me want to gag: “I want to mold and shape the young minds of tomorrow.” And “It’s all about the children.” I’ve never been able to stand starry-eyed idealists! I always want to stand up and say, “What about us? We’re just as important as them!”

  10. Chloe definitely has high narcissistic traits aka the dirty empath.
    Phil is the true narcissistic sociopath.

    Abuse of power, agreed. Using his position of authority, his charm and sexuality to ensnare his captive prey.

    What an excellent example, HG, to help us discern who is the real narcissist. It is never really as black and white as some might think.

    This is different from your other writings HG, are you changing your writing style?

    1. Do you think it is different? I suppose it is different in the sense of it being two fictional characters. I would not say I was changing my writing style though.

      1. It may not be different. It felt different to me when reading. I enjoyed the format. It was not a criticism.

        All your writings are magnificent , thought provoking and pleasing, HG.

  11. I think Chloe is the narc.

    The way she regards herself ( attractive , having fair share of boys chasing after her ) , friends ( they just jealous) , what she thinks about her parents .
    The fact she claims she loves him but wants to bring him down and destroy him ( nobody treats me like this).
    She lied in her statement about having sex beneath the Royal Oak which suggests it is all her fantasy.
    Teacher still talks well about Chloe and wishes her well despite her allegations. He regards himself as a decent looking ( not very good looking or handsome) . He is very defensive.
    If he would be the narc I don’t think he would choose someone like Chloe for his pray having so much to lose .( depends on his awareness).
    People turning against her for some reason , she doesn’t seem to be empathic at all,over confident . I don’t think she is an ideal target for the narcissist.

    I used the voting button. 🙂

      1. She is not that endearing. Sounds a bit like a borderline. Found it very difficult to read though thought provoking.

      2. There are so many obvious narcissistic traits in both Chloe and Mr Stevens , so instead of asking who is the class room narcissist I asked myself who is not and what an empathic or normal person would do or say in this situation even when hurt and driven by anger and despair of revenge.
        But then I tend to overthink and overanalyse things..
        Too much of Mr Tudor in both characters!
        Great exercise though, I enjoyed it.

  12. It is him. The first hint is to be found in his second sentence. He complains about the “ridiculous allegations of a fantasist.” To call someone or someone`s actions ridiculous is the typical behaviour of someone who feels superior. To call someone else a “fantasist” means that the other one is not seen as a respectable person. It is devaluing. He likes the “carrot” method. Typical manipulative tactic of a narcissist. He emphasises that he is a beloved teacher….

    And he is a teacher. A teacher has to be a professional. Young girls often adore their teachers, that is well known. And if he realises in his job, that a young girl falls in love with him, he has to be cautious. He is the adult and he is responsible. He is responsible for many things. He has to reject the girl in a friendly, sensitive and sensible manner.

    The young girl instead mixed up her need for attention and recognition and appreciation with the feeling of love. She got none or not enough by her parents. She was easy prey for him.

    Thank God, that there was a rumour before. Maybe she has a chance.

    Good girl.

      1. Hallo Windstorm2, please look at Laura`s comment. It is excellent. She pointed out all hints of narcissism of both. Very interesting.

  13. Oh and I do want to thank everyone here for their kind comments and support:) I love this forum!!❤️The truth is we are all shaped by circumstances and events, but they have helped us learn empathy and compassion and strength. Also again thank u HG for the knowledge you give us and a safe place for us to express ourselves openly:)

  14. Will you please tell us the correct answer someday?

    I think Mr. Stevens is the narc. They are both denying/ blame shifting. So I think the truth can be found in the last paragraph of the girls story. You can realy feel her emotions coming into play and this is not fury… she’s feeling helpless.

      1. I can’t wait for the answer. I’m finding this exercise very exciting! You did it again tudes. You continue to surprise us on the blog.

  15. ;peace out,

    In my mind, predators are child abusers and rapists. HG isn’t either of those things. Yes, he knows which woman to choose based on certain traits; though I don’t see him as a predator. That would almost be similar to saying the women he chooses are parasites.

    We have to look at certain experiences objectively, and learn from them. Maybe you have been the innocent victim. Maybe you have known the innocent female victim. We have to see the other side as well.

    Not every man charged with statutory rape deserves such a charge. Many evaluations should be implemented to thoroughly examine each situation. Many situations fall in a gray area, law or not.

    1. I disagree when a narcissist intentionally scopes out an individual to take advantage of and suck dry emotionally, physically and financially they are being a predator. That is what HG is teaching us here to beware of these types. A narcissist is not to be taken lightly. They actively seek out certain individuals that are vulnerable and they exploit those vulnerabilities, thats being a predator. Im not calling HG that out of respect but what hes taught here is that narcissists are predators whether they know it or not.

  16. Chloe was no “innocent” virgin. She loved the attention and was able to read between the lines. She knew he was a married teacher. Double no-no. Normal parents would hold her accountable, yet they wouldn’t take his side. Maybe she delighted in “staining their name.” Not that I see it as such, but I’d imagine narcissistic parents would.
    His remarks and behavior remind me of things a greater would say and do. An innocent man would respond in a different fashion, in my opinion. He seems to focus on how he is seen. I’m thinking he has an empathic supernova situation on his hands or a budding narcissist.

  17. is semantic aphasia more of a value judgement, than say, low affect? you apply value yourself to affect vs ‘cold’ cognition. but these processes always work together in unpredictable ways, together with social environment.

    anyway. i’ll think about it. not pretending to be value-free at all.

  18. anyway, what i like about your posts, is because you are a predator, you know how to work power relationships outside the law, which causes devestating effects to people, and neither the law nor our moral systems – such as notions about good victim / bad victim, are really equipped to deal with it.

      1. Ok, who here doesn’t like u? Ur like a big cuddly teddy bear (with ‘evil’ spelled across the back).
        Well, now that i mention it, many have been plain rude to u. But u don’t care. Good to not care👍

        1. Indeed Jenna, but it is a dollop of fuel and most then realise the value of the material here and manage to see the considerable benefits that are to be obtained.

          1. Very true.
            Abt the dollop – a tertiary dollop. A very tiny molecule of a dollop within the dollop. A mere atom. Likely even the tiny parts within the atom – the proton, the electron, the neutron? Most likely the neutron. Tertiary we are, and tertiary and remote shall we remain……………………………………………..f……o….r…..e…..v…..e…….r………….

        1. Narcaffair, tell me abt it! We are next to nothing for him in terms of fuel – tertiary, remote, very low quality, quantity, frequency. Barely applicable. Dismissed. Not needed. Irrelevant. I could go on. I’m enjoying this!

  19. it is interpreted of course. it’s inter-discursive nature of the law, which includes today current theories from psychology which it didn’t have in the past. a lot of people think the law is ‘truth’.

  20. part of your condition, HG, is semantic aphasia, but many political conservatives do not understand these concepts either. they are very much a part of our legal system though.

    1. I accept that my kind have a different interpretation but no value judgement ought to be applied to that, there is no ultimate arbiter. I understand full well the concept of consent.

  21. “Chloe is alleging that Mr Stevens took her virginity, she is not alleging he raped her.”

    that is not up to her, but the code of ethics of both the school and our legal system.

    in the case there was no sex involved but only projected ideation that the teacher encouraged and ego-tripped off, then she might be making up a story of sex in order to enact revenge for being rejected. this rarely happens, but it’s possible. that doesn’t mean that boundaries weren’t crossed, as i said before, seduction is a kind of psycho-emotional sex. she may not be in a healthy state of mind where she can tell the difference between reality and fantasy, but the teacher could have encouraged that irrespective of the student’s vulnerability. these are fictional characters.

      1. Jenna, it’s like chess. if anything, this is a more consequence-free space than IRL. safety in numbers too! ^^

          1. Jenna, i have a couple of friends who are on the psychopathy spectrum, they have a dry sense of humour and love to ‘talk shit’. chess would involve that, i imagine. one of them is idealistic and nerdy. the other is a colourful eccentric who needs to vent their violence through video games. neither of them are ‘malevolent narcissists’ – there’s a broad range to being human. i think it’s harder for men to step outside of social norms and ‘constructs of masculinity’ and identify with alternative ones. high testosterone and very low oxytocin & serotonin doesn’t help either. but games are a good method for therapy. i wouldn’t recommend friendship with HG! >.>

          2. Peaceout, ur comment is thought provoking. Yes, i have realized, friendship w hg would not be wise. The way he treats his ipps’s is evil, especially when he screams in their ear to imitate their crying, and draws tears on his cheek to show how pathetic their crying is (frm his perspective). That is utter cruelty.

      2. Jenna
        If you are a NISS, you could possibly experience a long golden period with HG and maintain a friendship. NEVER become his IPPS, ever!!!

        1. K, correct!
          Or have a short golden period then flee b4 the malice begins!
          Of course, he would most likely recognize this and begin the malice straight away!
          Best to be an niss!
          Or better yet, stay where we are, as tertiary and remote!

          1. Jenna, I’m with you, tertiary and remote! Better to be safe than sorry.

            HG, Thanks for explaining the difference between hebephile and padeophilia. Nice discussion BTW. I have learned a lot.

  22. actually included in the definition of rape is a lack of ability to consent. a teenage student is unable to consent to an adult who is in a position of power over her.

    so, it’s not a leap of logic, it’s the law.

    1. Of course she can consent. It is not an absolute that she is unable to consent, that is why the offence of an abuse of trust was placed on the statute book.

  23. Or, actually…maybe both are narcissists. Mr. Stevens seems like he could be an mid-ranger who accidentally seduced a student who was a narcissist herself…then dropped her like a hot tamale when he realized.

  24. Oooh-it’s so difficult to tell. 😀 Both have some definite narcissistic traits, but when you’re getting the story only from two different skewed perspectives, it’s hard to tell who is actually lying.

  25. Both. Teens are naturally pre-disposed to self-absorbed behaviour and fantasy, especially adolescent girls. As an adult, the teacher demonstrates true narcissistic traits by revealing his true beliefs: good-looking, friendly, jokes with his pupils.

    The question though, is not who is the Narcissist but who is telling the truth and that’s Fowler. She’s now 18, admits how the ‘affair’ affected her life and her story is rounded and consistent. She doesn’t wallow in self-pity and it’s clear she is isolated. Steven’s on the other hand is defensive; his story is based on his need to control the situation (bribing the news editor) and apportion blame to Folwer. Note that his testimony is all about him, even his anger makes an appearance: if his chances of promotion are scuppered he’ll sue.

    Nice touch with her surname there, HG, planting seeds of doubt about her character.

    Excellent writing. Btw, is there a prize for getting the right answer? Haha

    1. Hi scout….i agree about teens being self absorbed and that is very normal. Thats the whole point is their view on the world is skewed from lack of full maturity and experience. Most are not full fledged narcissists but in the teen years more than ever they possess narc traits as theyre bodies are changing hormonally, physically and mentally. This is why i voted the teacher as the narcissist bc he was of an age to know better and knew he was preying on someone that was not at an age to really know fully what they wanted or what may be a wise decision. I remember that age clearly and life was centered around self image and romanticism. I see things so very much different now and it has prepared me to better protect my children and especially in light of our technology. Back in highschool we had no internet so that was one less avenue for any predators.
      Now on the flipside there are the rare situations of a teen that is a full fledged narcissist and the movie “Lolita” springs to mind. If the teacher is telling the truth in this story then Chloe is a Lolita and had tried to control her teacher. I still feel this is rare and more times than not its the teacher thats the culprit and the students allegations are true.
      We had a situation in one of our highschools where the teacher became infatuated with a student and they had a brief fling. She ended it and told her parents and despite a restraining order he still persued her. He was of course fired and it was all over the papers about his conduct.

      1. Hi NA. I had trouble relying to your comment yesterday so I’m having another go!
        I agree with your comments – there are Lolitas out there who definitely prick tease to entice the men, what girl doesn’t become infatuated with a handsome older man? I know I did but I didn’t act out my emotions. But we know that adult men in roles of responsibility ought to know better than to get involved with young girls.
        In my experience in junior school, we had a paedophile teacher who openly touched up the girls. If the we girls forgot our PE kit he made us do PE in our knickers… I found out a few years ago that one of his later pupils committed suicide.
        As a former teacher myself, I boys falling for female teachers but it was rare. In the main it was girls gooy-eyed with young male teachers, but it was the teachers who overstepped the boundary by flirting back at the girls like it was all an innocent joke dressed up as ‘just being friendly.’
        Of course, not all male teachers who get involved with female students are paedophiles; there was a case of a 16 year-old falling for her teacher and he felt the same way. There was no sex but they did hold hands and were seen together. He lost his job and was put on the paedophile register, despite the couple getting engaged and then married when the girl was 18. Of course the law doesn’t distinguish between genuine love and sexual assault. At the end of the day, men with big egos and impressionable young women just don’t mix.

      2. Hi scout…that story of the student and teacher marrying is similiar to mary kate letourneau and her young student years ago who by the way are divorcing.
        Thats a good point you brought up about age. In some cases the teachers arent that many years older. A teachers degree here is 5 years so if it was an 18 year old thats not all that much different in age but a 16 year old seems way too young. In my case my science teacher id guess at the time to be late 20s early 30s. Bottom line is these teachers are put in a position of trust and need to leave their feelings/urges out of it whether they are paedophiles or not.

  26. I personally don’t really see how she is the narc unless she’d be an “inverted narc” in this situation – a person who craves the attention/strives to be the chosen one of a traditional narc. With the abandonment of her parents, she’d want to be the apple of some adult’s eye.

    1. But the fact that she goes on the offensive to bring him down after she has been discarded is a bit narcy on her end. That’s why I’ll stay the theory that she’s an inverted narc and he’s the greater narc.

  27. This reminds me of The Fall (one of the best shows to come out of the UK in ages, though Black Mirror is also good), where a teen develops a crush on a serial killer. she doesn’t know that he is, but it doesn’t deter her when she finds out. he involved her in some online masturbation sessions and had also flirted with her schoolmates online, but he never had sex with her. his ignoring her existence, in the end, after was had for her been ‘intense intimacy’ that she had kept secret from everyone, made her obsessed with him and self-destructive.

    These situations are complicated, because of moral stigmas people have over sex, we treat it as something physical, not psychological, and victims have to behave like ‘good victims’ rather than – what can also be the case, people with problems who behave badly. That doesn’t mean they’re not victims, it’s even more a sign of victimisation in my opinion, the domino-effects (here) of men being absent fathers, selfish mentors, opportunistic boyfriends, and girls learning that their social value is sex rather than who they are, so they trade in sex for love. This can be dangerous when you get a teen’s emerging sexuality in combination with childhood abandoment issues, and then put them in social situations with gender politics. Of course the girl has serious problems, which make her respond to social triggers in destructive or inappropriate ways (like, we also expect people to be able to neutralise the effects of social politics and make them invisible – that’s being ‘civilised’), but the teacher was taking advantage and didn’t care about her wellbeing. The key is where he thinks that her crush was about him, when it wasn’t.

  28. “Who is the classroom narcissist?”

    Both?

    Reminds me when i was in university, age 21, i had a huge crush on my sociology professor, who was in his fifties, short, skinny, and balding. I was attracted to his intelligence, and his confident lecturing style. I needed to see him for a letter of recommendation because my grade in his class was 98%. I called his office and left a msg. I was so nervous my voice was shaky. I never ended up getting the letter of rec frm him becoz i was too nervous to see him in his office because i liked him so much. Crushes.

  29. Id not read this one and its triggered slme memories from my grade 11 highschool year. I had a science teacher ill call mr.M. He did pretty much what is described in this blog. Hed look at me longer than normal while he was teaching and i thought maybe i was imagining this. I was a quiet student and a bit on the shy side. I was also late in developing crushes on other boys but there was something about mr.M i found alluring. Thinking back it was the fact he was older and experienced along with his cerebral type mind that fascinated me. Science was my favorite subject and he was quickly becoming my favorite teacher.
    I remember him discussing reproduction in humans and describing the sensation of ejaculation a little too in depth and enjoying it. At the time i thought this was part of the curriculum but as an adult i see the inappropriateness of it but i waa fascinated with mr. M and started daydreaming and fantasizing about him at home. Was he married? Did he have kids? What was he like outside of schools as a man and not a teacher? I fantasized scenerios where wed be just the two of us after class eyes locked and end up kissing. What would his lips feel like on mine? I could feel my heart racing living each scenerio in my mind. Mr. M was slowly taking over all my thoughts.
    Id be in class first in hopes of getting some time to chat with him and hed always ask me how my day was going along with a flirty smile…or was it? Maybe i was reading too much into it? Afterall i was just a 17 yr old with an overactive romantic mind. Did he like me as i liked him? Could he in that way or was i kidding myself?
    During a lab we breathed into a respiratiry reader and mine was the highest for aerobic performance. I prided myself on being active and physically fit. Mr. M made it a point to pat my back leaving his hand there and telling me how fit i was. I was ecstatic! He praised me in front of my peers! Was i special to him? How i hoped i was. My heart beat fast wanting this to be the case.
    Near the end of that year a yacht trip was planned and i signed up to go. Mr. M Would be one of 2 teachers overseeing the trip. Waiting at the airport bound for vancouver he sat near me and we chit chat about the trip and what to expect. We discussed tidal pools and marine life wed be sure to see on island shores we would stop at. He smiled a lot in anticipation of the trip and his smile sent butterflies flitting thru my tummy. I knew then i had a major crush on an older man that happened to be my teacher.
    During our trip many times wed chat one on one about our lives outside of school and he asked me my plans for after highschool taking a real interest in my life. It felt so good to have a man take notice of me and express an interest in me the way mr.M did. He made me feel so special. I found myself daydreaming more and more about the two of us. First kisses, first touches, first sexual encounters….it was heedy and sooo exciting! Did he think of me the way i thought about him or was it wishful thinking?
    The night came when we were woken up at 1 am to board our dingys to row to a remite tiny island to see the tidal pools and the marine life inhabiting. We got out and got our flashlights out to light the way in the pitch dark. Mr. M came up beside me and whispered, ” are you ok in the dark?” And i admitted i was a bit scared. It was at that moment he took my hand in his hidden in the pitch dark. My heart just about jumped for joy out of my chest. I couldnt believe it was happening he liked me as i liked him! As our fingers were entwined he carressed mine and we walked silent hand in hand but communicated so much with our hands. Once back on the yacht i knew things had changed. I knew mr.M was attracted to me and felt a similiar bond.
    Waiting at the airport once arriving home feeling sadness at magical trip ending mr. M’s wife approached him stark and cold. She gave him a quick hug and cheek kiss. Her hair in a tight bun she was taller than him and seemed so unaffectionate towards him. I felt pity for the man i adored and found myself in love with at the tender age of 17…

    1. Not sure if my second post went thru but mr. M im not sure was a narcissist or a man lonely in his marriage void of affection. I disnt know his wife but from watching them she seemed very cold towards him. There could be reasons why she was that way as we know narcissists can make their partners seem the unloving ones after devaluing them over a period of time. Its hard to say but one things for certain and that is he covertly was inappropriate at times. Lines were subtley crossed. During the teen years students can be very impressionable and influenced.
      In the blog the teacher is most definitely the narcissist. He persued a teenage girl knowing it was not appropriate behaviour and then smeared after allegations came out which narcissists are only too good at.
      On the flip side if what shes telling is all lies then she would be the narcissist but more times than not where theres smoke…theres fire.

      1. Hi scout…ty for your reply and reading my story. It brings back so many memories but that hand embrace ill never forget. I never thought holding hands could be so sexual but it was and yet so subtle. Fortuneately in my case it never went to the next level. He left for another position at a different school.

    2. Narcaffair, u had such a crush on mr. M. I cannot believe he held ur hand. It is very inappropriate and crosses the lines of ethical conduct w a student. Shame on him. Thankfully, it did not progress further than that.

      1. Hi jenna…i did have a huge crush on him but it was the mindset of a 17 yr old which now i think much differently. If a teacher held my daughters hand the way he held mine id have some real issues with it but back then i was in love. I ask myself if he wouldve persued me more would i have succombed to his advances and truthfully idk. I was pretty shy and naive back then so probably not. A kiss maybe but anything more wouldve scared me off i think. I can still feel the sensation of his big hand in mine rubbing and entwining fingers squeezing. Most people would think holding hands in the dark as an act of protection or reassurance but this was way more and it bordered on sexual. The rest of the trip he looked at me more intensely and i definitely felt a difference. This is what i mean by covert narcissism its so subtle that you second guess yourself but i no longer do i. I know what i experienced.

  30. This is a really good article. It really made me think. I could see this going either way. I know guys that regardless how beautiful their wife is at home they would still cheat. And I know teenage girls can be just as scandalous with their raging hormones.

    So now that I thought about it some more. I would say that it was probably mutual. Until he got what he wanted and then decided to call it off. She wanted more, so she threw him under the bus. Maybe they are both narcissists.

    So what is the correct answer?

  31. Excellent new article, Tudor. Bravo.

    I had such “problem” when I was the uni student (3rd year).

    Because I didn’t choose the type of career my Patrinarc had wanted me to choose, he disowned me and said “I’m not going to pay for your graduation. It is your problem. Goodbye”…

    It were the post USSR breakdown times and all Soviet money, I had inherited from my grandparents (pretty big money), were “annuled” by new non-communistic government. After that, the “communistic” money became the useless “sheets of paper”. So, I had no money to pay for my graduation…

    Thank goodness, I had very good high school marks, plus I took the uni’s “introductory” exams successfully. It permitted me to graduate in “money free” manner. It was very crucial for me to get the high marks to maintain my “money free” status during graduation. Just one bad mark and “the end of story”…

    My Narc professor knew it…
    When he saw me first time, when I read his eyes, I knew that I’m going to have a “story” with him…

    No matter how hard I had studied his subject, I always got “not satisfied” mark. “Do it again”, was his usual answer. When I realized, that I’m going to fail the whole semester and final exam, I decided to have a talk with him and see what he wants…

    “What can I do to improve my marks, professor?”, I asked him directly.
    “Ohh… You know, darling… I’ve been fond of you from the beginning… So small, so thin, so fragile… Exactly what I like in women… I’ve always wondered how it feels to kiss you…to have you in my arms… Of course, we can “improve” your marks and I know how…”
    “Go on, professor”.
    “I know you are married, but I’ve never seen you wearing your wedding ring… Why so?”.
    “Because I never had it”.
    “Ah, I see… I see… Anyway, your husband doesn’t matter. What does matter is you and I…”
    “…”.
    “I guess, we can start to “improve” your marks… Tomorrow evening would be perfect… Tell your husband you are going to study with your female mate at her home and you are going to do it whole night… Do you know my home address?”.
    “No”.
    “I’m not going to write down it to you, because I know you have a good memory… You are very talented, you know… I’ve always admired you… It would be pretty bad, if you stop your graduation, you know… Our country desperately needs such intelligent specialists as you are going to become… Soooo… I’ll see you tomorrow… Right?”.
    “No. Not tomorrow. Not after tomorrow. Never”.
    “Ah, I see… I see… In that case, our country is going to lose a good specialist then… What the pity… If you tell someone about out “little talk”, no one would believe you… You’d be a laughing stock… You can do nothing to compromise my reputation… Enjoy your last days at University…”.

    When I left his office, I had two choices to continue my graduation:
    1. To ask my Patrinarc to solve my “problem”. He was capable to “improve” my marks with single phone call. Plus, that professor would have kissed goodbye to his career. But, in that case I had to submit to my Patrinarc completely. So, that choice wasn’t the choice at all.
    2. Alternative way…

    Alternative way…
    I had my high school mate and I heard that he had chose the criminal “career” for himself… He was the “street level” criminal. I found his phone number and called to him. When we met, I said to him “I have a big problem… Using your connections, please, arrange the meeting with real mafia guys for me…”.

    When I rode to meet the “real” guys, I was shaking from head to toes from fear. My eyes were tied with piece of black fabric, so I didn’t know where we were going. Then they “walked” me on long corridors with a lot of turns. When they finally put that piece of fabric off, I found myself in very cold basement room. There were six men there, sitting around the table.

    Everyone was silent for pretty long time. They just were sitting and staring at me. Finally, one of those men said “Sit down. What the “problem” do you have?”.

    I put my grandmother’s ring on the table. That ring was my single memory of her. When she gave it to me, she said “Use it when you have no choice…”.

    I explained the whole situation to them. Then I added “I don’t want him killed or injured or anything like that. I don’t want any scandal also. I just want to get my really deserved marks and continue my graduation”…

    That “one” man took the ring and scrutinized it. “Good ring…”. Then he said “Give me your hand”. When I did it, he put the ring on my finger…

    “Be sure, we’ll teach that asshole how to respect women… We’ll do everything as you wish. No blood. No harm. No scandal. You can go now, girl…”.

    On the next day, that professor “fired” himself from University and, after a couple days, he left the country. His last words to me were “I didn’t realize, that you are the princess of criminal world”… He looked scared to death saying it.

    When that professor left our University, many girls started to tell stories, that he had forced them to “improve” their marks… I listened to them and felt sadness. It is really awful to have such “teachers”.

    1. Noname, i’m sorry for ur horrible experience. You were very brave. I’m glad the teacher left the university. U saved yourself, and many girls frm him.

  32. “orchestrated by Phil(harmonic?)”
    🤔

    “to teach me about more than the TUDOR dynasty”
    😁

    “we had sex beneath ‘the tree that Charles the Second hid in’. I know that to be a lie ; that tree was destroyed hundreds of years ago.”
    😂

    Je vous adore, monsieur Tudor!

    P.S.
    The sensible Miss Kelshow…
    One of the harem?

  33. Well now the re opened a few old wounds I must say. Only I was 18 and in university fairly sexually innocent. He was my professor and in a “sexless empty marriage of convenience “. I mis carried ( I suppose a blessing in disguise) and dropped out of university. Everyone was shocked that I dropped out as I loved school. But I never said a word of explanation to anyone. I was ashamed of my own actions. I still am to this day.But that incident caused a series of events leading to where my life is now. It has all worked out , but I still feel guilt , shame and yes a bit of residual anger. I sometimes wonder if I could turn back time how things could have been different….

      1. Hi HG:) hmm interesting question.I feel he was a selfish individual.Very high narc tendencies. Full blown narcissistic personality disorder? no I do not believe so. Lol maybe I am wrong tho..

      1. Also i wanted to mention that theres different forms of rape and sexual is just one of them so even with consent at a young age the victim imo is raped of so much. Narcissists rape everyday thru devaluation and deception. They rape us of our dignity and innocence in life exactly what theyve more than likely been raped of. They rape our souls and view on life. Rape isnt just sexual.

    1. Oh Star, what a traumatic thing for you to have gone thru. I’m so sorry that happened. Those years are a such time of flux in many people’s lives, even in the best of circumstances. And you are right, the path of your life developed just as it was supposed to. I am glad it has all worked out and you are okay. It seems that everything we experience is another layer of our creation, building us into the resilient light-carriers that we are, flowing us to the place where we now emit that light. I hope one day you will feel able to let go of your guilt, shame and anger.

      Let your paddles go and flow

    2. Star, it saddens me to read of ur experience. U must have trusted him, being ur professor, and he had no right to abuse that trust. In addition, u miscarried, which must have brought confused feelings (because u say it was a blessing in disguise). At the age of 18, you barely know what to feel abt day to day occurrences, having to face this must have been so difficult. I’m sorry u had to drop out of school, esp since u loved school.
      U need not feel ashamed or guilty star. U are a survivor in more ways than one. U should feel proud of urself for coming thru such difficulties. I feel proud of u.

    3. Hi Star,

      You did the best you could with the knowledge, skills and possibilities you had at that time. It was a heavy burden to carry on your own and you were able to manage it without help. You can be proud of yourself.

    1. If a teacher stole my innocence, I wouldn’t brag about how attractive or smart I was or how the other girls were jealous. I would have been mortified that a teacher raped me and I would have kept my mouth shut.

      The teacher is an adult and not once did he display any empathy towards the girl, even if she did accuse him of rape, there was no concern about the possibility that something could be amiss with her home life, etc.

      They both bragged and blame shifted.

      1. Just to be clear K, there is no suggestion of rape. Chloe is alleging that Mr Stevens took her virginity, she is not alleging he raped her.

        1. Here in the US, if she was 16 and he was an adult, that’s called statutory rape. Maybe your laws are different.

          1. Fair point. In the UK the age of consent is 16, which is where the example takes place, so statutory rape would not be applicable, but thanks for making the point. If there was sexual activity between Mr Stevens and Chloe Fowler and she consented, he would, as her teacher, have committed a criminal offence in the UK as it is an abuse of trust.

      2. HG & WS2
        Senate Bill: S.295 will raise the age to 19 in Massachusetts. A teenager’s consent is considered invalid in MA because an adult in a position of authority shifts the balance of power.

      3. I don’t think we have such laws in Germany …. sounds ridiculous.
        It’s 16 in general, 14 if the partner is not older than 21.

      4. Ok, so I reread the post; it was a consensual affair and I think Chloe displayed these narcissistic traits: everybody is against me (woe is I), bragging, blame shifting, she wants to punish him and get revenge, she plays the victim, she claims other girls are jealous, boundary line is crossed (sex is a no-no with a teacher, however the onus is on him). Zero responsibility. No empathy either.

        Mr Stevens displayed: deflects/downplays, blame shifts, claims staff is jealous, he uses charm (honey, jokes & good looks), brags, he plays the victim, manipulation (weeds out bad students so he looks good), has a flying monkey (Miss Kelshaw), he says Chloe is warped (smearing), cares about loosing promotion, he might sue (revenge). Zero empathy!

  34. I think the teacher is the narcissist only because of my experience.

    My instructor always used my name in the scenarios that he would tell the class. He couldn’t keep his hands off me. I wasn’t imagining this. Others students pointed it out as well. I was flattered. He was charming. I loved his attention. I wanted him.

    I kept my distance until the semester ended. I text him first and about a year and a half later I had to go see a counselor for answers. Because I was so confused about why a guy could just ignore me and why am I so obsessed him with.

    But if Chloe is the narcissist then it makes me question whether or not I am the narcissist because of the way I behaved.

    Although I have been told by my counselor that I am not a narcissist.

    1. Hi I❤HGT, it’s perfectly normal for adolescent girls/young women and young men to fixate on an older person. The draw is looking up to someone perceived as ideal love interest for their intelligence, beauty or wisdom, etc,. These are normal narcisstic traits in a developing mind and body, it’s usually at this stage in life that young people experiment with their sexuality too. All normal behaviour.

      1. Hello HG,
        ….It is obvious to me that is the teacher that is the narcissist because:
        1. As her teacher he is committing abuse of trust ( regardless if she is 16 or 18 and it is defined and punished as a crime depending on the country) it is still a crime of abuse.

        2. She is NOT a narcissist .Being a teenager with all that comes with that ( NAIVE, self-absorbed,fantasying , infatuation) does not make her a narcissist but just a teenager. As a teenager she is allowed to dream and fantasise. The problem is that if a the teenager that is going into adulthood does not have a strong adult figure to relay on ( i.ex. a parent) will be an easy prey for the narcissist,specially being her teacher who she respects and admires. The teacher is obviously tacking advantage of his role as a teacher and her vulnerability and naivety making her a perfect prey.

        Unfortunately and sadly this happens very often within schools. Something that makes me reflect on how many narcissists are deliberately placing themselves within these haunting grounds knowing these vulnerabilities?

        What I find extremely provoking as well is making a parallel with a relationship in adulthood with a narcissist. What the narcissist recreates during the Golden Period is like the teenage love we once had. Relying on the naivety and the belief that “love conquers all” is transporting one back to that stage: the ever lasting love. That is what I find infuriating and provoking.
        Being in both cases: an abuse of trust.

      1. Hello Twilight!
        Yes,I find very interesting reading the answers and following this thread. All the posts here are very insightful, finding this in particular very polemical.

        1. Hello Superxena

          Yes I agree I am enjoying the comments as well.
          I have refrain from posting my view, for the moment.

  35. They both have issues with narcissism, she has an underdeveloped, insecure sense of self and likely misses a father figure, at home she feels ignored or misunderstood. She’s living in a projected fantasy where the teacher meets the needs of her emerging of self, which is awakened in the classroom where she is engaged, but she’s still holding unresolved abandonment and neglect fears and is very confused about what her social role here is – to become an individual or perform for parental acceptance and love. This isn’t abnormal for teens.

    He is a predatory narcissist who takes advantage of his social position and uses the ‘idolising fanatic crush’ of the teen to feel important and escape the humdrum of work responsibility and middle age. He doesn’t care that she’s vulnerable and how the nature of the teacher-student mentor relationship can trigger such feelings, and that it’s part of the teacher’s job to help the student redirect focus on their work (the platonic process) — and he didn’t report it to colleagues sooner, despite being aware and her ‘close mentor’.

    Didn’t read in detail, but that’s the gist of it.

  36. Now that I have “Don’t Stand So Close to Me” by The Police stuck in my head…..
    my vote is the teacher, not to say the student doesn’t have her own narcissistic tendencies. However, the clear cycle of idealization, devaluation and discard are present. She tends to be less insulting to where he calls her a fantasist and even managed to win over her parents. Also the detail “sex in the tree that Charles the Second hid in” wasn’t mentioned by the student. He’s covering a detail of the story that was never indicated to begin with. He refuses any culpability, and goes further to say he adamantly refuses to change. Moreover, who would want the attention of a 16-year-old student with a gorgeous wife at home? A narcissist, of course. He’s also in touch with the editor of the papers and police to make sure he draws them to his side. I could go on, because the evidence does continue to mount, but I think I’ve covered enough to make my case.

    Then again I suppose HG will be the judge of that.

  37. Well obviously the teacher is the narc. I could tell he was a deceptive liar when he said history was “enjoyable!”

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