The Super Empath

THE SUPER EMPATH

 

It is well known that our kind target those who have empathic traits. Just like those of my persuasion operate on a spectrum, those who exhibit empathy do so as well. There are those we might regard as the “normals” those people who have some narcissistic traits and some empathic traits. As ever, when I use the words empathic and empathetic I state them with reference to certain traits such as empathy (clearly), honesty, kindness, decency and such like. I do not use the words in the sense of being in tune with the world and the environment. The normal are in the centre, possibly leaning one way towards my kind or the other way towards your kind. It is extremely rare for a normal to be ensnared as primary source because put simply, they do not cut the mustard. Their emotional responses are not sufficient, their empathic traits whilst evident are not sufficient to either bind to us or provide us with the fuel that we need. Such a person would easily pass a homeless person begging, a person crying alone on a bench or somebody who had fallen off their bike and injured themselves. They are self-absorbed but not to the degree that our kind is. They will help if they really have to, but they do not go out of their way to act in a way that causes harm to anybody else.

Thereafter come those who are empaths. Empaths are always targeted as primary sources. They often fulfil secondary roles as well. They are rarer in a tertiary source position since if they are an empath, they would be better suited to either being a primary or secondary source. We would not want those empathic traits to go to waste. The empath has a good range of empathic traits those of honesty, decency, having a strong moral compass and being a good listener, just to list a few of them. They may not have all of the empathic traits that we look for, but they will have several and exhibit them in a concentrated form. Thus this person would look to donate to a charity, hand a wallet in that was found in the street, help a stranger who is in distress, sit and listen to somebody who has problems and acts of a similar nature.

Next comes the Super Empath. This person is not a co-dependent. Both the Super Empath and the co-dependent have many, if not all of the empathic traits that we look for and they have them to a stronger degree than the empath. For example, both might take the homeless person under their wing and take them to a shelter, maybe even house them themselves for a period of time. They would try and locate the person who had lost their wallet in order to hand it back in person rather than say hand it in at a police station first. They will listen to the person with problems and then offer practical solutions to resolve those difficulties. The co-dependent gains validation from such acts through giving and has to do this to an excessive degree even when it goes beyond what is good for themselves, such is their inherent addiction to the act of giving and selflessness. The co-dependent may not actually be that strong an individual (they are in the sense of the abuse that they can soak up) but they are not strong as they have no identity to assert, they must form one through self-flagellation, giving and not taking. They are masochistic in nature, driving themselves to the point of collapse and illness because they lack the strength to escape and the desire to do so from the clutches of our kind. Lesser Narcissists and Mid-Range Narcissists hook up with co-dependents especially because they give, give and give but do not fight back. They challenge themselves, blame themselves and always make excuses for their abuser.

The Super Empath is also a giver but whereas the co-dependent is masochistic in this giving, the Super Empath does so from a position of strength. They hold their ability to empathise, to heal, to fix and impart goodness as a great gift and one which ought not to be abused. They are drawn to our kind less because of the co-dependent’s need to seek validation of identity through a narcissist, but more because they are initially attracted to the apparent emotional output of the narcissist. The false strength which the narcissist exhibits at the outset of the seduction, the confidence, the apparent satisfaction with his self, that he appears comfortable in his own skin, at ease with others, capable of lighting up a room and so forth is a huge attraction to the Super Empath because that person actually sees something of themselves in the narcissist when the narcissist is seducing. That is not to state that the Super Empath is a narcissist. Far from it. But the Super Empath is just as engaging as the narcissist and thus there is a mutual attraction. The Super Empath is also more challenging to the narcissist and therefore is usually the recipient of some Mid-Range narcissists and most often the Greater Narcissist. This is not because the Super Empath is awkward or reticent but rather she will be forthcoming with her empathic traits once she feels that they have been earned. Accordingly, the narcissist must put the extra miles in, in terms of seduction to ensnare the Super Empath. This person needs to be coerced into sharing the fruits of their empathy but once that trust has been earned, once the gate has been unlocked the benefits are huge. The Super Empath shines with empathy, glows with decency and pours forth delicious fuel.

This continues during devaluation. The empath and co-dependent are easier to “break” in terms of causing negative fuel to flow. The Super Empath is made of sterner material and will resist the negative machinations of the narcissist at first. This may result in the narcissist dis-engaging if he does not feel able to impact on the Super Empath and seeking fuel elsewhere. The Greater knows who he has ensnared and knows once again he must unlock the fuel source, this time negative, of the Super Empath and once it is done the tidal wave of fuel is to be enjoyed. The Super Empath will remain, wanting to fix the narcissist, exhibiting again the same empathic traits of others on the empathic spectrum, but again being made of sterner stuff, their descent towards numbness and malfunction is far slower than that of the empath. The Super Empath will keep providing the fuel but deteriorates at a slower rate. The risk factor however with a Super Empath is that their own personal integrity is greater than the empath’s and very much greater than that of the co-dependent and consequently of all these three classes of empath, the Super Empath is the one more likely to make a bid for escape and thus leave the narcissist with a cessation problem.

The challenge of unlocking both positive and negative fuel proves an attraction for the right type of narcissist because this allows him to assert his superiority and enjoy the challenge. The reward is magnificent. Excellent fuel and such that deteriorates at a much slower rate. The downside is the potential for the Super Empath becoming “aware” of what is happening, becoming unwilling to dedicate further energy to staying with the narcissist to fix and to heal and thus escaping. The Super Empath requires fairly careful management by our kind, but the rewards always mean that this person is a challenge which is often accepted.

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319 thoughts on “The Super Empath”

  1. Also, would a victim narcissist ensnare a super empath as primary source or would he or she feel too intimidated and just have the super empath as an IPSS instead?

    1. They may try and do so because of the allure of the empathic traits IF they fitted with what the Victim Narcissist needed as described in Sitting Target.

      1. HG
        I would have thought most Super Empaths would not have the patience for a Victim Narc and be repelled by them. Do you see this pairing as a rarity?

      2. NarcAngel,

        A woman in my worksthop this last weekend sent of BELLS like mad. She announced from the get go that she had PTSD. She had a service dog for that. She announced her hearing loss. Made sure to tell everyone that she is a veteran. Demanded to know what was in all her food at the restaurant. Was so toxic, that even the water snapped at her. At one point, I just got up and walked out. She was so awful, I wanted to smack her in the face! 🙁 That woman has NO idea what PTSD is IMO. And she wasn’t a veteran. Yes, she was technically, but not a veteran as she implied she saw combat. She was a pscyhologist! She just oozed victimhood, neediness, and I don’t know what else but I was so repulsed.

        But my narc played the victim but his were really pity plays. And crafitly balanced with “but please don’t pity me” therefore putting me on the defensive for my emotional reactions. His pity/victim was couched in charm, subtle violence, that arrogance, the incredible confidence. That made it hard to see, of course.

  2. Hi HG!

    1. Can you clarify which schools and cadres of narcissist would ensnare a super empath as a primary source?

    2. And what are the narcissistic traits that super empaths have?

    Thank you for this article!!

    1. 1. All would look to do so, however not all would manage to control an SE successfully.
      2. There are a variety and these will be covered in the Dirty Empath articles.

      1. Okay, Thank you for your replies!! I feel my empathic traits dimming because I am getting tired of this narc that i am dealing with. He keeps on rejecting me and it’s just nonsense. In my mind, I am thinking, why reject somebody who cares about you? … why reject someone who has been there for you? .. it’s actually a dumb decision. He is a victim narc. I am caring about him less and less now. With the last narc, my empathic traits dimmed and I just became mean and i didn’t even care if it hurt his feelings and then he eventually discarded me. So, with this one .. once again, i am at the point where I am so fed up and want to end the “relationship” – although I am a IPSS.

        (I apologize if I sound hostile, I am just fed up … you’ve been awesome HG!). So, HG, does this sound like the super empath/supernova? b/c i go back and forth with what a super empath does and what a normal would do.

  3. I can see why some empaths wish for the label of super empath, as the term and the meaning imply superior self preserving skills.
    I am having trouble to understand this categorization and disagree so far, as I find it demeaning towards others.
    An empath can have very few narc traits and still be very strong and unbreakable. And of course it depends whom one encountered.
    Healthy boundaries and looking out for oneself makes one the best possible version. And many ‘normal’ empaths here have demonstrated great strength and are certainly not easily breakable.
    I am also with Bibi – I am highly sensitive, too, and I agree that it is not so easy and one sided to put empaths in different categories.
    HG’s categories are from his predator view, of course, it all looks very different from my perspective.
    I take it that the fuel from a SE is supposed to flow longer, though it is a mystery to me how this can relate to the quality of fuel, as those narc traits can’t have simply piled up on top of the empath traits.
    Not my problem, though.

    All I can see is that many here have been unbreakable even under the most horrible circumstances.
    And I know from my own experience that 20 years of horrible relationships with the full spectrum of abuse did not do that. Then, the exnarc came along and I experienced cruelty beyond my imagination out of clear blue skies because he had a hard time controlling me, even when I had committed to his wishes, I still expected him to hold mine equally high. This led to endless fights and when he saw how I was getting on with my life to that roller coaster ride which eventually led to RE- traumatization and c-ptsd. Which doesn’t mean that he didn’t have to suffer quite a bit, too, and he did meet resistance which caused him to retreat eventually. I am talking 5 years here.

    I also cannot imagine how a super empath would stay untouched by abuse as there is not the unfeelingness of the npd.
    From my observations, some self proclaimed super empaths on this blog are completely broken, while some ‘normal’ empaths show a very strong sense of self worth and inner strength, while still having kept all the abilities to feel, and love and be compassionate.

    Your current girlfriend is not a SE, is that right, HG? Or do you have a new one?

    1. ava101

      We should learn to be “better versions” of ourselves by turning abuse into gain for our knowledge (I see no competition here, just the one with ourselves!), besides that is what I understood from “untouched by abuse” (always taking it’s good part) and trust people while keeping eyes wide open and using the information we’ve got on this blog and from experience. I sustain NC and GOSO when dealing with narcs.

      I read about empathy on all sites I’ve got my eyes on these days, for me it was a road to self discovery but I think HG was right in suggesting you’ll feel attacked by someone else’s statements on being a SE (now all I’ve got is a bad taste in my mouth, still learning). I was so happy for discovering something, but I shouldn’t write it here, only now I understand…

      HG, you showed me you better know how an empath’s mind works than I (an empath, I believe…) know; you learned that before I did and you taught me. Thank you!

      I’m not interested in what kind of empath your gf is, I feel sorry for her…anyway…and hope she’ll get out a.s.a.p. (sorry, not wanting your wound, just her wellbeing).

    2. Ava—i get that. and how narcy it is to place empaths in some sort of a hierarchy. like hungers games. who should live. my personal experience and reflection is that i can be many of them, depending on the person, circumstance and relationship. but they too, are all a facade. i don’t always “fix” others, for example. i can trample. i can be super, or codependent. i suspect there is a common theme to all of the dynamics. but like a narc, my empath traits are chameleon-esque as well. and tho not a constant, not broken. still standing. we may be their appliances. but we are not inanimate objects. we are fluid, ever changing, evolving and yes: reacting. but also acting. especially now. girded with knowledge.

      1. I agree, Tappan Zee, and also you’ve expressed it well with “hunger games”.
        I guess I also change, adapt, etc., I’m multidimensional, and have different, kind of balanced, personality traits. And no fixer, “carrier”, etc.
        🙂

    3. Hi Ava

      The post on my feeling about the category or class of super empath on Dr HQs letter thread would more appropriately have been placed here. I think you made an important point previously when you stated that these categories are from HGs perspective in his observations of us and with regard to his procurement of fuel, and I have to say I like it broken down that way (just as the narcs have their own classes) because having it broken down makes it a little easier to digest in small pieces when we are all so different. I mean there is no denying that I am a different type of empath than others (NOT BETTER before anyone gets their dander up-just for instance I am not so much co-dependant), but it helped me to concentrate on how MY type of behaviour is viewed by a narc and to be able to interact with them with more success on my side. Having said that, how some are taking it to be a badge of honour and going about waving a banner and not offering much else by way pf input is beyond me except to say that I think they believe it appeals to HG, and their fantasy (better called a delusion in my opinion) is to appeal to him as a prospective intimate partner and willingly offer themselves up for abuse which speaks to their own issues (and not of strength I might add). The other “bolt ons” HG provides such as Carrier, Saviour, etc also designed to show that there are many variables and to customize- you can have a bit of each, but you will most likely have a dominant leaning to one over the others. I would say Saviour applies to me and no I am not proud of that but I can see how that appeals to a narc for instance. Super empaths are most definitely not untouched by abuse. Perhaps the reason that we are viewed as breaking down more slowly is because the narc traits will often have us automatically rejecting things that would be a glaringly offensive to others. I often laugh off what others would find offensive or abusive and so it may not have occurred to me instantly that someone was abusing me (very early on). I also admit to using some situations (such as offensive sexual behaviour in the workplace for example) to my advantage when I saw that it was not being addressed because my own narc traits told me that I could withstand the pressure and not have it affect me as much as someone else, but in my mind MY FOCUS AND INTENTION was not only to put myself in a better position but to get my foot in the door to help dispell some of the myths and perceptions about womens abilities and to hopefully have some impact on changing them. That was my empath side saying I want better for others and my narcky side believing I was equipped to undertake it. Of course I prefer no one having to endure that treatment but remember this was long ago and many things available now were not in place so I looked to my narc traits (bolstered and observed in StepN) to tackle the problem in the only way I saw feasible. This to my mind is what is meant by the super empath from my perspective and not from HGs perspective of a fuel source.
      There are many times I provide a story or example and I am not doing so for the purpose of qualifying my “status” as a super empth Sometimes its just funny to me in hindsight, but usually its to demonstrate what worked for me (but might not for someone else) or to show that narcs are not as omnipotent as they believe themselves to be. They have their weaknesses as HG would never admit to in his personal life, but does so here in providing the truth and information that may well see others to free themselves or avoid entanglement in future.

      But what do I know-maybe now you think: OMG she IS a narc. I knew it!! Lol.

      1. My comment was based on emotional thinking.

        I am not a super empath. I do not think that I am better than anyone here.

        From what HG has told me I am a Standard Empath.

        Some of his articles are very enticing. But I am aware of the reality of what he is.

        Am I infatuated with HG? Sure. I know I am not the only one. Saying it out loud makes it seem as if it’s losing its power over me.

        Sorry HG for saying inappropriate things on your blog. I do not want to disrespect you or your readers. Or myself for that matter.

      2. I personally don’t think YOU ever have.u rarely comment and when u do comment its usually very lighthearted and in good taste. There’s nothing wrong with having a crush on him (even if from an outsider to the blog would find a narc an odd choice lol) but I have never seen YOU go on ad nauseum about it . you simply pop on occasionally to say it. And I find it very refreshing that u would take the time to say you don’t want to offend hg or the other readers, that’s cool in my book.

      3. Thank you very much, Narc Angel, for your explanations!
        That is very helpful to me. I was only trying to understand, as I didn’t before. I believe that I can now see through HG’s eyes, how the different kinds of empaths are classified.
        Through my eyes it’s different, but it’s still interesting, as I am also practising to recognize empaths instantly. 😉

        I have never thought anything negative of criticizing of you, Narc Angel. That’s why I had to ask you which narc traits you see in yourself, and those also don’t have to be just negative (just by association). I am practising to move more into the middle of the scale myself.

        You come simply across as a very strong, very empathic person to me and you have also explained before many helpful things, how you dealt with abuse, and so on.

        🙂

        I also think every person, every character make-up and every experience is unique, it’s different for everyone. Noone can really step into the situation or past experiences of another. You seem to have dealt with everything you’ve encountered in the best possible way.

        I also don’t think that we are here to compete in “HG’s Next Top Empath, I’m not here to make friends, I’m here to win the competition”.
        😉

      4. That’s the way it work(ed)(s) for me. Putting empaths into 3 categories has aided my healing cuz I couldn’t fully identify with, say, being codependent, although some Co-D traits are evident.

        Knowing which empath I am helps me to have a greater understanding of where to concentrate my own healing.Better understanding of how I operate when around narcs.
        Being a SE didn’t save me from any pain. I still got my butt kicked.

    4. I think I fall somewhere in this category or close to it. It’s not that I wish for this label it’s just that so many time I have thought I was the Narc. I know this sounds odd by a lot of the time I enjoy the game. I like turning my narcissistic traits back on him

      I wouldn’t say I’m exclusively this as I have been diagnosed as a codependent but therapists don’t diagnose you a SE

      Honestly, a lot of the time it’s not him I miss so much l, but the game

      HG does this make me a Super Empath ?

      1. I need more information to make such a determination and a consultation is the appropriate forum for doing so.

    5. People here may seem more broken than other because everyone is at different stages. Some come here from very different points. I was a basket case when this was actively happening years ago. I am away from him. I am ok but still hashing some stuff out. And I was very touched by the experience. And I am pretty sure I am a super empath for complicated reasons. I think I surprise people as my ‘normal’ mode is gentle and shy. But I have another side when overly provoked will destroy everything. Even the narc told me that. I don’t think he is used to super empaths but he went too far. He is used to controling a much different kind of person, of that I am sure.

  4. I stated, HG has not conspired nor killed INNOCENT people.

    ^i suspect “innocent people” do not exist in HG’s world view. simply a guess. as he sees fit, they exist.

  5. HG Tudors #1 fan

    Are you saying that you personally would accept a ticket to ride on the HG roller coaster?

    1. Narc angel,

      Don’t expect a reply pronto. She may be bz volunteering at the homeless shelter, i mean shelterS (see above where she states this). That’s hgt1f for ya! Always thinking abt others!

      1. Hgt1f,

        Lol! Thank u?

        I am starting to find u kind of cute.

        But pls can it with differentiating hg frm manson. It’s obvious. Nobody here thinks manson is a greater elite lol.

      1. HG Tudors #1 fan and I ❤️HG Tudor

        I commend you both for your honest and very telling answers.

      2. I❤️HG Tudor,

        I like your style. DLS: dirty little secret.

        I will be first in line for the title of
        IPPS: Intimate partner primary source.

    2. I’ve never been into amusement parks and roller coasters I’m more of a lazy river and go kart kinda gal lol. I just go and eat food when I used to visit those places and watch everyone scream and puke lol.

      1. HGT#1F

        I did ask what makes you stand out above the rest of the SEs that would grab HGs attention.

        The list you provided is that of the prime aims.

  6. Lawdy gee girl u admit they have the same disorders but don’t want them compared just because they’re behaviour is different as far as WE KNOW but then u go on to exclaim his magnificence JUST LIKE the Manson girls did about charlie its actually comical

    1. Ugotit,

      UH HELLO,

      THERE IS DEFINITELY NO COMPARISION.

      HG NEVER KILLED ANYONE, NOR CONSPIRED TO KILL INNOCENT PEOPLE.

      HG IS A GREATER, NOT A LESSER, THEREFORE HE IS NOT DUMB ENOUGH TO GET CAUGHT LIKE THIS DUMB BUM.

      IF YOU ANYTHING ABOUT, HG YOU WOULD KNOW HE HAS ANTISOCIAL DISORDER AS WELL.

      1. To kill a innocent woman, who is pregnant, would be a job done by the lesser not a greater. Greater is more calculating more likely not to be caught

      2. There is a big difference between, HG and some uneducated luniatac piece of shit that preyed a pawn innocent people, such as pregnant, Sharon Tait who had a bunch of dummies to his dirty work.

        Why you keep defending this dumb bastard, is beyond me.

        There is no compariosn between, HG- & Charles Manson, whatsoever besides personality disorders. If you think otherwise, Ugotit please go read ,HG Tudors books.

        HG is a Greater Elite Narcissist, which happens to be a huge difference in cadres & schools of narcissist than this, Lesser devil belonged to.

      3. #1 HG has, in the past, indicated exactly that. He has killed a person.

        The circumstances surrounding the event were not divulged but he stated this on the last live question answer forum.

        Please correct me if I am wrong HG.

      4. You are correct.

        It wasn’t clear from #1’s post if she was stating

        “Hg hasn’t killed anybody and hasn’t conspired to kill anybody” – meaning I have never killed or conspired to kill ; or
        “Hg hasn’t killed anybody and hasn’t conspired to kill anybody who is innocent” – meaning I have not killed anybody but I have conspired to kill the guilty ; or
        “Hg hasn’t killed anybody innocent and hasn’t conspired to kill anybody who is innocent” – Hg has killed and conspired to kill the guilty.

      5. Yes, I know Hg has done both. Everyone was better off after he shot this person. I do recall that statement, which is why I corrected myself in the post above before you posted your post.

        What I meant to say was, he never killed an innocent person. He never preyed a pawn the weak, he got rid of the trash with probable cause, unlike that scum bucket coward, waste of human flesh Lesser- Charles Manson.

        I need Latte, sorry for the misunderstanding.

        HG, you would make an excellent lawyer.

      6. HG
        Ball washing bastards.

        Haha, yes and your more devout followers here know that is your opinion of them as it has been expressed previous.

      7. Plenty of Devils to go around. I lived with one-name wasnt Charlie. Actually Charlie is a bit of a lightweight in the murder business by todays standard but proved to be a good poster boy for evil at the time.

        No one knows what HG is capable of or responsible for, now or in future and should never lose sight of that fact. That is the kind of thinking that allows one to be ensnared or worse yet-brain-washed or murdered.

      8. Well since I have signed up for HG Tudors sight I’m pretty sure I can get the information and help I need from the source. But thanks for underscoring yet again how important your role here is.

        I have not read all his books and don’t know everything about him. This may shock you but I am ok with my pitiful existence when set against your shining example.

        I suppose if anyone cared about all the 2nd hand knowledge you profess to have you’d need to declare it less often. And I also assume that, in response to my lack of reverence, you will let everyone know yet again. Snore.

        So to save time:

        I get it. You adore HG. He adores and prefers you. You know him better than any of us. You are the most important informed member here. Without you the blog and HG’s purpose would undoubtedly fall apart. Convinced and unimpressed….

        Rock on with your self proclaimed badass self.

      9. Dickforlong,

        I stated, HG has not conspired nor killed INNOCENT people.

        After I read my post I I realized it was a bit confusing.

        I pretty much have read everyone of HG Tudors books, I listen to all of his live streams, and book consultations. I pretty much know everything there is to know about, HG that he has publicly put out for display.

      10. HGS number 1fan . I compared hg to Hitler before as well how does that taste lmfao . I consider it a compliment in term.s of the fact that I put his powers of persuasion to equal those of Hitler and Manson. I think you greatly underestimate him. I get it you think hg is the greatest thing since the invention of the wheel maybe you shouldn’t underestimate him so much then

      11. Oh and for the record since you seem to be unable to read between the lines I never defended Manson or Hitler ever not once I do not approve of either of their actions and I never stated or implied that I did this is your interpretation in fact in my original comment about Manson that you latched onto I was clearly joking about sitting around singing like Manson and his followers did you took the ball and ran with that which is not my problem

      12. Dickforlong,

        Yes, this is true, yes I do absolutely adore, HG.

        HG, prefers Super Empaths & adores nobody, but himself.

      13. Lawyers are ball washing bastards.

        You have the best sense of humor ever. You are very special, and one-of-a-kind, HG.

        I am convinced you can be anything you put your mind to. You are intelligent and perfect in every way, but I do understand, HG you are a narcissist and a very dangerous.

        One thing for sure is, it would definitely be one hell of a roller coaster ride worth riding.

      14. HGT#1F

        I am curious what makes you different from any other SE? There has to be something that makes you stand out to be better then any other SE out there? Something that would make HG have to have. because he has never had it, so I will again ask what is it?

      15. HGT#1F

        I am trying to understand what you see that makes you better then another SE, you have definitely made it clear you would step into the shoes of HGs IPPS I am wondering why, there has to be a reason for this to be driving your emotions to this belief.
        Do you know what it is?

        I am not trying to stop you from expressing your feelings towards HG, I just worry you don’t understand yourself and aware to the why you feel so strongly towards him.

        I do understand why and how one could develop feelings for HG, yet infatuation and love are very different.

  7. I am skill confused by the classification, HG.

    Like I see it: there is the other extreme on the far end of the scale to the narc in someone being altruistic (to a disordered degree), and, in addition, then there is the degree of emotional and/or true empathic depth.
    I think someone can be altruistic without being really empathic and lacking in depth. But simply be disordered. I also think that the emotional depth (or width actually) has nothing to do with how anyone is having healthy boundaries and looking out for themselves in a healthy way. And being resistant to narcs who would violate that.

    These two scales are not identical, so you would find the emotional broad spectrum in all kinds of empaths, but I don’t see how they can be the same when many narcissistic traits are there at the same time. They can co-exist, but not expand / double i. e. some empathic traits must be replaced then by narcissistic traits … why would you want that? …

    altruistic & co-dependent —> healthy empath —> empath with narc traits

    true empath –> broad spectrum of deep emotions & empathy –> less –> lesser

    In my view, narcissistic traits would indeed deminish empathic traits. You cannot be a certain way in regard to certain things and at the same time be a another way. Either you care about a sick baby animal or you don’t (to give a very simple example).
    One can be resistant to narc manipulations etc. but not have (too many) narcissistic traits? Having a strong sense of real self worth and healthy egoism, but (of course) not in a narcissistic or egotistical way?

    So, how is it challenging or even interesting if an empath shows strong narcissistic traits?

    1. Jealousy provokes anger and hurt for instance. Pride evokes not giving up but continuing to try to heal or solve the problem, thus remaining engaged. The determination to succeed at work produces character traits and residual benefits which are advantageous to us. There are plenty more.

      1. Thank you for your reply. This surprise managed to get me up in a sitting position on my couch, been watching inspirational movies about strong survivors.

        So, you are actually turning narc traits against them while enjoying empath traits at the same time. You play with them like with mid range narcs, while those don’t give you much fuel.

        Which means that someone without the traits you mentioned is actually in advantage and stronger, possibly more in control. 🙂

        And someone who is satisfied and content with an inner sense of accomplishment by doing meaningful work, instead of showing off “success” is actually not of use to you, interesting.

        And how do you provoke empaths who don’t like intimacy and don’t feel a lot of love themselves?

        Will add humbly: this reply reminds me of my exnarc, who certainly tried to use every single one of my weaknesses and flaws against me. Including attacking the part of my work which was supposed to help others. And I thought he only wanted to belittle me …
        You and many empaths here describe this (often unknowingly) repeatedly: that you take advantage of any flaw, any self-delusion, any vain wish, any weakness. Trust a narc to show you absolutely any negative traits you have …

      2. “And how do you provoke empaths who don’t like intimacy and don’t feel a lot of love themselves?”

        Feel a lot of love? Who for? Themselves or for others? And is this a constant state of affairs for this person?

      3. Some call it jealousy, others can argue they don’t like to be disrespected.

        I don’t consider myself a jealous woman at all. I don’t like being disrespected by a male or a female.

        If that occurs, yes I could be hurt, I could be angry but I will most likely be disgusted.

        The look of contempt on my face can’t be masked lol.

        The chances of getting laid later on. Not possible.

      4. Actually, I retract that statement.

        It has prevented me from getting “ensnared” on many occasions – especially these days.

        However, it becomes a little more complicated when I find something that excites me.

        In those cases I walk the line because the feeling is so rare for me.

      5. Things become a bit more complicated when I’m attracted to the person and they stimulate me. It’s so rare for me that it’s much harder to let go; however I have always had a point when I would go boom and not take it anymore. I don’t put up with shit now. At this point in my life my bullshit tolerance is so low. If mistreated, slighted and disrespected I can promise you I would disengage. I would be disappointed and bored but I wouldn’t let myself get disrespected just for that fix … no… not anymore.

      6. Hello Ms. HQ,

        not sure who you think you’re talking to with your stream of comments, but …

        yes, we got it. You’re super.
        I was hoping for a fruitful discussion though about different angles, on how one can view empaths.
        You know … the label “super empath” consists of two words … you seem to have missed the second one.

        You had your moment. I’ve been standing on the sidelines and kept my mouth firmly shut.
        But this thread is not about you for a change …

        An empath has also the ability of insight (self-), of admitting that one has been shattered into 1000 pieces, of seeing that one is not the only one or the worst one off, actually, of taking on responsibility for the part one played. Of seeing and listening to others, too.

        And spare me the answer you’ve given previously to others pointing things out along these lines to you … of showing off self-pity …

        It’s pathetic how often you have to state that you’re above it all, maybe it becomes true when you say it often enough to your mirror.
        As a therapist you maybe know that much … that to own up to having been victimized, hurt, and indeed become broken, and not having been above the whole experience, might be the first step to recovery.
        But not parading self pity or self delusion.

        Well, you’ve had about 10 years less of experience than me, so, in time maybe … one can make out what gave anyone the impression that you were an empath. Other than being used by narcissists, I don’t doubt that, but that doesn’t make one an empath in itself. Sounds more to me like you had overestimated yourself in the game.
        Including your ability to profile men and to stay in control.

        I do feel sorry for you for your childhood, but not for the show you’ve been putting on here from day one even though I do clearly see your pain. But this is not the way to show it.
        I’ve never said anything, even though you’ve interrupted more than one dialogue by trying to pull the spotline on yourself and I’m fed up with that as I would like to read and write in the blog in peace.
        That’s all.

        And pride does not protect, pride is a weakness. Real self love might do the trick. A lot to learn. Well, you got time for that, as you don’t want another relationship, sex, or children anyways (your words …) …
        if you are a normal person with some empathic traits, that is. Hard to say with your psychological make-up. But as I don’t think that you are a narcissist, you should have the potential.

      7. I also concur with Ava101 and Dickforlong. If I didn’t know better she and her chum would be trying to take over the site with looooooooong ad naseaum points. One commentator even confused who she wanted to have a consultation with. Yes, a triple yawn there for Dr. Q (Medicine Woman).

      8. HG, have u figured out via our blogs what type empath each of us is, coordinated the color of our ribbons to reflect our status? And there are open and closet narcs on this site . . .

      9. I do not establish purely through the blog what empath type every commenter is.
        I also identify the occasional narcissist that appears here.

      10. I’m not sure what of therapist would make those kinds of comments and I’m not sure why a therapist would be here. I have been in therapy with 2 that share a practice one a psychiatrist and the other a psychotherapist. They would not likely be ensnared. They can sniff a Narc a mile off nor would they make those kinds is comments

        Just sayin perhaps the therapist needs a therapist

        Sorry HQ HG is Chief Narc in Charge lol

    1. Britt

      So is it your belief then that Super empaths all volunteer to be with Narcs and are never ensnared?

    2. I think that’s true anc I think they are drawn to the excitement. I think the Super Empath likes the game and eventually finds healthy men boring and loses interest

  8. For those of you planning to be the future Mrs Tudor I could be wrong but I assume he would choose someone who doesn’t know he’s a narcissist which if I’m correct excludes everyone on here since we know. Then comes the fact that u will eventually be discarded in the most brutal way imiginable. Its four months since my discard tomorrow and I’m in agony I can only imagine how horrendous a discard from hg would be .but hey to each his own and good luck on your future nuptials

    1. Ugotit— good for you. i’m at 6mos. since my escape. which is really a preempt at discard. hg would say disengage. whatev. horrendous is right. hard as hell. hang in. xx

    2. Hi ugotit,

      U stated: ” I assume he would choose someone who doesn’t know he’s a narcissist… ”

      U r correct. He has stated in comments b4, that a lady who knows he’s a narc wud not react to his machinations as he requires them to.

      U got it, ugotit!

      However, in this particular case, there are two factors involved. One, she knows he’s a narc. And two, if she were in his personal life, at most she cud be an ipss, for reasons i cannot explain right now. It will cause an uproar if i do. 😉

      1. Hi Jenna in case u didn’t know this is Kim aka over thinker aka ugotit lol. I won’t ask anything lol don’t want to cause an uproar on thanksgiving eve lol hope u have a great turkey day tomorrow

      2. Hi kim!

        What a nice surprise! I like ur new name hehe. Btw, if u want me to stop calling u kim due to anonymity, just let me know!

        Happy thanksgiving to u and hg and everone here! 😊

      3. Even tho there is no thaksgiving in the uk and many countries, still happy thansgiving frm the usa everyone!

      4. Jenna

        I am curious as to your observations as to why one that knew what HG is couldn’t be an IPPS.
        I do see why you say it could cause an uproar due to the perspectives of some here, yet this is an issue within them and the emotions they have towards HG.

        One thing I do know and that is HG will do what HG wants.

      5. Hi twilight,

        Many many months back, clarece and i were trying to convince hg that if his ipps knows he’s a narc and still loves him, it wud be nice because she will love him for the real him.

        He replied that it will not suit him becoz she will not respond to his machinations as he requires, ie. upset, hurt, great fuel ooutput! 😅

        He disagreed with our opinion that an ipps who knows wud be great!

      6. Yes hg, correct. That is why i stated ‘if she were in his personal life… ‘

        U do not meet pple on the blog. I know that!

  9. Overthinker,

    Charles Manson was the devil. Please do not put him in the same category as, HG or anyone on this blog.

    Ding Dong the devils dead. It’s about time that evil waste of flesh dies.

      1. Um, neither did Jim Jones. Are you seriously trying to defend that rotten piece of shit who is now thankfully dead?

        “He never killed anyone.” LOL

      2. No I stated it is her opinion not mine that Manson is the devil Manson was a narcissist and had antisocial personality disorder along with psychotic features that I think he played up for the media.hg is also a narcissist but probably does not have antisocial personality disorder or maybe he does but he lacks psychotic features.I am defending my right to compare them.hg life differs greatly from Manson but maybe if living in a different time with different income and different prime aims and different goals he could be like Manson.he has no need to behave like Manson because his IQ and income is very different he is professionally employed and has a different facade to maintain than Manson and gets his fuel and recognition in a very different way.

      3. He is still just as bad as his piece of shit followers.

        Stop comparing the brilliant, magnificent, perfect, HG Tudor to that devil please.

        I am pretty sure, HG has antisocial disorder as well.

      4. HGT#1F

        If manipulating and having others murder for them brings them both control and fuel they will do such. Manson was doing what brought him what he deemed he needed in the fashion he desired. He was a Neanderthal

      5. HGT#1F

        I reread my comment and see it could come across as if I could be implying HG is in the same league as others of his kind. He is not, he is in a league of his own.
        Now could HG control one to such actions, I have no doubt he could, I just don’t see him desiring to take that path. It is brutish and undignified
        Not that I agree with abusing others yet I am positive about one thing his ways are more sophisticated.

        There is a reason why he can convey all of this so well
        There is none like him, and one would be foolish to ever think differently.

        HG if I have offended you in any way I apologise, never my intentions. I have the upmost respect and admiration for you and the work you do.

      1. Ha ha I think that every time this article posts

        Lol I am Contagion

        Want to spar HG?

        I couldn’t help myself feeling feisty today….

  10. The empaths are categorised in a different way which does not relate to the level of cognitive function.

    ^if our cognitive functioned correctly, we would not be here. ie: we do not logically make decisions. our ET is our demise. so whether we are intelligent or not does not buy us out of this mire.

  11. HG, is the Greater the only narcissist aware of what he or she is?

    Can an upper mid range also be aware of what he or she is and does?

    Also upon reading your blog, can unaware narcissists actually believe they are Super Empaths?

    Confusing high narcissistic traits for a specific type of Empath and not their own disorder?

      1. Why some followers cannot recognize in themselves the narcissistic traits you outline in your blog and books.

        Yet others can clearly observe them, as you do HG.

        Does lack of awareness and emotional thinking both cloud such observations?

      2. Thank you for clarifying.

        If a narcissist, the narcissism obscures it. In other instances it may well be emotional thinking that prevents recognition.

      3. Thank you HG.

        I was a bit confused in the Super Empath versus narcissist debate.
        It makes sense now. I think.
        Super Empaths have higher narcissistic traits which make them appear as one of your kind.
        The problem for me now is this,
        it is more difficult to discern between them and narcissists.

        As I observe the self entitlement, Attention seeking, confrontational and critical behaviour, grandiose behaviour as some key detriments of a narcissist.
        Yet they also apply to Super Empaths.
        Which leads me to seeing them as the same,
        I think if the empathic traits were more overt and apparent it would be easier to discern, who is who.
        Therein lies my dilemma.

  12. Hmm..Super Empaths eh.

    Oh yes..Them.
    The Belisha beacon targets.
    Let them line-up.

    Buys me time to laugh my hide off all the way to freedom.

    See my footprints in the snow?
    No?
    I didn’t think so.

  13. As stated previously (many times) we are all at different stages of the healing process and I know that can get frustrating to other people who are further along. It is all understandable but lets all try and remember when we were there.

      1. Oh shhhh….

        I’ll take that guitar and chase you around with it LMAO

      2. Don’t lie hg you would love it if all your followers sat around holding YOUR hand and singing kumbaya kind of like Charles Manson and his followers one big giant fuel fest

      3. Ha ha, you can sing but I will pass on the hand holding, thank you. You can sing Flower of Scotland instead.

      4. Omg, i now have a picture in my mind of all of us holding hands, singing, and swaying around a camp fire. I’m dying! 😂

      5. Awesome Idea
        My crew is so going to be sending some hate towards you….I am singing if you are happy and you know it….and that was before reading this

        On a brighter note know what happens when pilot lights go out on stoves and you turn them all on and light them….you get everyone’s attention really fast….they think I run to my own beat around here and I have no idea why

      6. There is nothing like a good strumming, however, I did read on Hush that Dr. Q thinks sex is overrated.

      7. Marvelous, Dr. Q loves a good fight and it looks like Twilight does, too.
        All these feisty empaths means lots of challenge fuel.

      8. HG has been nothing but nice and helpful to me so he is on my good side so there will be no “coming for him” ….lmao…

        I just realized that sounded dirty – my bad.

  14. Furthermore, I believe it is even more important that we try our best not to judge people and tell people how they should be feeling or who they should be and how they should behave.

  15. This forum is excellent for exchanging information, opinions, and ideas on many topics. I think it is important for us to stick together and try to be understanding of one another and basically support each other through the healing process.

    I believe it is in everyone’s best interest to try and understand the perspective of others even if it isn’t something that you agree with. Our thoughts and feelings can be expressed in ways that aren’t hurtful to others.

  16. Lets all try and refrain from attacking each other. It isn’t helpful or productive. We are all adults here who have been through enough stress and trauma in our relationships with narcissists and psychopaths.
    We all come from different experiences and backgrounds etc and I think we are all capable of having disagreements without attacking the character of another.

  17. I can’t help myself right now. I’m feeling playful…

    If you’re a super empath and you know it clap your hands…

    ::clap clap::

    Where my super empaths at?

  18. I truly wonder how to see/feel the difference between a Greater N and someone with highly autistic features. Both seem to react pretty much the same way and in both cases empaths seem to be drawn to them. Could you elaborate on this, HG?

    1. I do not know enough about autism to provide a detailed response, but I would immediate point to awareness, malice, fuel and calculation as being key distinguishing features.

      1. Thank you. The question came up after -amongst others- hearing your video ‘What do narcs feel?’. Personally, I found this video very touching. What you describe as a sense of power, I recognize in autism as a need for control, because if people on the spectrum can’t have control, they loose their sense of self and get lost in a world of uncoordinated impulses. There comes in the calculation you mention. In my experience people on the autism spectrum are never aware what another person feels, so malice is not an option. Would it be the awareness only? Because people on the spectrum are usually quite aware that they lack empathy and try to compensate this by other means, including what you might call extensive seduction. Both Narcs and people on the autistic spectrum tend to work from brain only. And because they can’t empathize the work around by mimicry. A little confusing, I would say.

      2. Although I will answer this question more in depth in a little while – I will begin my response by saying Autism Spectrum Disorder is a neurodevelopmental disorder.

      3. That is a correct assessment regarding autism from what I have read. The negative traits are not present.

      4. The fact that people on the autistic spectrum lack a lack of empathy is a myth that has already been overthrown … they present difficulties at the level of EMPITIA COGNTIVA, not so with the EMOTIONAL EMPATHY, once they are explained, for example, why a person has a feeling of sadness are able to empathize, in which they present a difficulty is in inferring the feeling … last studies say that they have excess of empathy, connection, sensoriality, what overwhelms them and leads to avoid over-stimulation … I demand a deal just for them, that if they are able to feel and so much that overwhelms them.

        I apologize if I did not understand as much as I would like in my defense about autism spectrum disorders, my English is very basic, but I could not stop commenting on this…thank you

    2. I can elaborate on the differences between autism and narcissistic personality disorder in a little bit (currently busy but will get to it later tonight).

    3. Hi syroya.. i hope you dont mind me piping in. My son is on the autism spectrum and is higher functioning aspergers. He doesnt have a mean bone in his body. I can see where people may see similarities in regards to empathy bc he does struggle with that. He loves very deeply but struggles to put himself in others shoes so to speak. For instance if one of the family hurts themselves he will go up to his room to escape crying or having to deal with the stress of that persons reaction.
      Individuals on the autism spectrum are the very opposite of narcissists in that they lack understanding human psychology. They struggle to understand what you and i naturally understand like body language, different kinds of humor and personal space. They struggle to read peoples emotions. The narcissist is the polar opposite they are fully aware of human psychology and use it to prey on the vulnerabilities of others to get what they want from them. This is very conning and its deliberate. They lack empathy but thats about the only similaritie a narcissist has with someone with autism.
      Autistic person…a disability where they struggle to understand human emotion and behaviour.
      Narcissist….product of upbringing and partially genetic disposition who are predators and understand like an expert human behaviour.
      Two different conditions.

      1. The scensory overload in the bookstore reminds me of my son when he was very young. Certain sounds really upset him and flushing toilets he had a phobia of. We kept exposing him to these things slowly and he outgrew them. Its amazing how much it can be improved thru therapy. Chase i dont think is very high functioning. He would be the same as dustin hoffmans character in rainman. He will likely need assistance all his life. Hes got a wonderful dad and im sure will be taken care of. I think its great the dads educating people thru this channel.

    4. syroya,

      The autistic are not interested in becoming you, or in flattering you, or in your flattery of them. They will not harm you intentionally. Their ignoring of you is honest, not contrived.

      All in all, if an autistic is communicative, they will be brutally honest, with no idea that their words can hurt. Many of them do take what you say in quite the literal sense. I find them very calming to be around, once I adjust to them being for the most part, only physically present.

      HG mentions Awareness as a key distinguishing feature. This is the most outstanding difference, in that an Autistic is hypo-aware of others, and the narcissist is hyper-aware of others.

      The most currently high functioning autistic that I am aware of would be Temple Grandin, Very interesting person, google her.

      Perse

      1. Thank you. I know Temple Grandin and her work.
        Suppose I flipped your statement and stated instead that an Autistic is hyper-aware of Self and an narcissist is hypo-aware of Self? Would that change anything?

      2. syroya,
        I’m not sure.
        I think the autistic is only aware of the fact of themselves.
        I think the narcissist may sometimes be aware of the fiction of themselves.
        That’s all I got. opinion from observation.
        Sorry I can’t quite answer that..

      3. Hi perse…Temple Grandin is a fascinating lady. Her mother was a speech pathologist and more or less kicked into action modern day therapies for people with autism. Inclusion was a big part of this. She hired a nanny to interact throughout the day with Temple and this changed her brain development and helped her to be higher functioning. It amazes me how she thinks in pictures and also her empathy and connection to animals. Shes a professor and has achieved a lot!
        Ive had my son in many things but drama and dance have really helped immensely! I had to giggle at your mention of how they take things literal lol its so true. He acts and talks so wise and years ahead of his age. I love to tease him bc he takes things so seriously 😄

      4. Perse and narcaffair,

        I just watched an interview w temple grandin on yt. She is v intelligent. This led me to a few other vlogs of parents documenting their autistic child’s trips etc. for short times so the child does not become disturbed. I absolutely wished i could enter the video and hang out with these particular kids. They are so fun, lively, intelligent, and also v innocent and vulnerable at the same time. They are a precious gift to the world.

      5. Hi jenna….autism is a spectrum and my sons very lucky to be on the highest end of it. Hes gifted in areas. He can memorize a full script to a play in a coulle hours time. He has many gifts bc of his autism but he still struggles at times with empathizing and holding onto things that upset him.
        What breaks my heart are the lower functioning autistic that are in diapers and will never live or function on their own. Its so difficult on their families as well 🙁 some can be violent and dont realise their behaviours bc they are cognitively only a toddler. Its sad.
        I absolutely love downs children and adults they are so sweet and fun to be around. Cute too!! Id like to volunteer with downs syndrome adults and children kne day. Maybe outings etc.

      6. Hi narcaffair,

        I am glad to hear that ur son is higher functioning. The scripting behavior is remarkable! I just love it! It is truly a talent!

        Abt the lower functioning autustic children, oh that is sad. I hope such children are always well cared for.
        Thank u for sharing that with me.

        This is one of the videos i watched:

        http://youtu.be/5NmVR-rHMxU

        I love this kid! I just wanna hang out with him!

      7. Jenna…im not sure if youve watched the show the good doctor which is about an autistic doctor but he would have aspergers which is what my son was diagnosed with. My son is in ways more functioning in speech than that character bc altho hes very literal in his way if thinking he doesnt speak as monotone as that and can have a sense of humor. Mind you that character is an adult and my sons 12 so im not sure how he will talk when hes an adult. I do find his literal serious thinking so cute and so does his teachers lol im very proud of him hes very driven to get good grades and be an architect or engineer. Hed love to design buildings. From a young age he was fascinated with how things worked like elevators etc. Apparently thats common.

      8. Hi narc affair,

        I just watched the trailer for ‘a good doctor’. It seems like a good show. It is nice that a major network is focussing on asperger’s syndrome.

        Your son is obviously very intelligent. Aspies have normal to very high intelligence. Many are gifted!

        It is nice that ur son was diagnosed already. Some aspies don’t get diagnosed until later in life.

        The kid in the video i shared is 18. Lol i still regard him as a child, tho he’s legally an adult. I tend to view anyone under 20 as a kid hehe!

        I am sure ur son will become an architect or an engineer, or anything he puts his mind to! He sounds like a gem!

      9. Another point id like to make regarding autism vs narcissism is i think the two are similiar is the area of the brain affected the amygdala. Ive had my son in drama classes for a few years now to help teach him social nuances and body language along with broadening his range of emotions and reactions. Some will never come automatic to him and he will have to fake these to some extent to be socially acceptable. Where narcissism differs is the narcissist, especially a greater, has a gift for faking emotion and using it to manipulate. They are chameleons in a group and are very advanced in this area.
        Autism is a disability in the area narcissism is very advanced at. If you took an adult with say aspergers and had them work around a greater narcissist i could see a greater poking fun at and antagonizing an autistic individual or manipulating them to do their bidding. Im teaching my son about narcissism so he can protect himself but hes reactive and struggles to deal with bully types properly.
        Autism and narcissism are not the same thing.

      10. I would say autistic people get their feeling of control from hobbies, anything from toy train sets to computers,fixing cars.
        Narcs use people to feel in control.
        Autists are too honest, narcs not honest.

      11. narc affair,
        Thanks for the first hand info on Autism.
        Your son sounds like a joy to be around!
        Jenna, Brian, & Syroya,
        Thanks for your comments and questions.
        Interesting convo, I keep checking back for more.
        Jenna, thanks for the link!

        Perse

      12. Hi jenna…ty for the link and i subscribed to the channel. Chase is a sweety. My son is way more functioning in that he doesnt stim or have these maneurisms. Meeting my son youd not know he had autism unless you spent considerable time around him and knew the signs. He also gets trapped in circular thinking like the father describes of the bookstore. He has his mind set on something and has a hard time letting go and moving in another way of thinking. What a cool channel ty for sharing! 🙂

      13. yw Jenna
        Autists can be smeared easily because they are reactive as narc affair says.
        I used to frequent autism forums and they would talk a lot about how the bullies would provoke them until they exploded in anger…and then everyone would think the autistic kid was bad.
        The flat effect would already have people being leary around the autistic kid, then the anger would just confirm everything they were thinking.

      14. Hi brian…im not sure how it is for an autist as an adult and it varies depending on their fuctioning. My son will stand up for himself and his sister but has a hard time letting things go. Hes brought incidents up that happened 5 or more years ago out of the blue. We made an “all done” box where he can write on paper what happened and his feelings and put it to rest when he was younger and im teaching him to do that mentally now. In the workplace surrounded by narcs which he will be bc theyre everywhere itll be difficult for him. Hes already got a social handicap to some degree but mix in narcissism and that poses a problem. Its difficult for people without autism so i cant imagine how autists deal with it.

  19. I believe that I fit the profile of just a normal. HG is probably in a better position to ascertain that. But I am pretty sure my analysis is correct. And there is nothing special about normals as they are not written about in great detail either.

      1. @Tappan Zee..
        You are sharp in your observations but you are right. I totally agree with you: that was a perfect example of triangulation

      2. TZ – perhaps you are a superempath. I just found out that Tappan Zee is the name of a bridge.

      3. Ty for the triangulation reference. Astute.

        I do think I am a super empath but doesn’t mean I would be preferred by a narc who prefers SE’s. I am a woman too… Doesn’t mean I am a shoe in for someone because they prefer women.

        Weird reading from Hg #1 fan. I am an SE but I still am me. I have a distinct personality… Style and way of being that is not attractive to many narc whether they prefer that school or not.

      1. Ha ha. Oh, yeah – what happened to it? You all know my references are excellent. The devil’s spawn is taking his God damn time and won’t take a fucking bite of this beautiful red luscious delicious apple. He is threatened, surely. My brilliance will just shutter the dark side. K, you’re best mates with HG Tudor, put in a good word for me, will ya, before I change my mind.

      2. The Adjudication Panel For Admissions, Acolytes and Admirers has noted reference to considering oneself a normal – this caused some arching of eyebrows.

      3. Sniglet
        Last time I checked, he was going over your references:
        1. Lord D. Vader;
        2. Ms W. Witch of The East; and
        3. Mr D. Dasterdly.

        However, I will be sure to put in a good word with His Grace, but I do believe your reference to being normal “caused some arching of eyebrows”, so I will try my best to pour honey into his ears for your benefit, before you change your mind.

      4. Ha ha ha ha @ arching of the eyebrows! Your A. Panel of AAA agrees that I’m normal? And will a brilliant normal be expunged from the application process with all possible prejudice by this Panel?

      5. I thought so too, that it invited clarification but I had decided to shift my reply in a different direction just before pressing send. Agreed, it will need clarification. What is required?

    1. Sniglet,

      I think you are pretty freaking amazing. During the holidays, I deicate my time voleenteering at the, Homeless Shelters. This is how I enjoy spending the holidays. I would give anything in the world to be normal. Consider yourself a lucky beautiful woman. It sounds like you got a good head on your shoulders.

      Happy Holidays Sniglet,

      xoxo

  20. HG- I recently discovered I am a super empath thanks to my narc ex fiance. My dad has always been closest to me (there’s three daughters) and he is harsh like he gives off the vibe that he doesn’t care if he ever sees anyone again. He has punched a wall before. My mom is an empath. I know my dad’s dad never told him he loves him. Does that mean my dad and my grandpa are narcs? Turns out two of my best friends are.

  21. Over The Rainbow–it’s my interpretation that empaths are more deeply affected by people, situations and things. ‘Normal’ people tend not to internalize as much. Normals can be sensitive, but not AS sensitive as empaths.

    I don’t look at it as limited to just your feelings about people but also your environment, nature, animals, etc. Do you often pull in the world around you? I find I have to separate myself just to keep parts of it out. That is, the hurtful parts.

    As a contrast, codependents have lost their sense of self within another person–this habit goes on more than once. I’ve known some women who would change their interests and opinions depending on their new boyfriend. They seem to have this urge to rescue and or/be rescued.

    I actually am an HSP or Highly Sensitive Person–you should look that up and see if you identify with it. While I am not fond of labels per se, it is a personality trait that involves how one reacts to both internal and external situations and stimuli.

    As example, I don’t need to skydive to feel alive, I am ok with sipping my tea and watching the leaves move on the tree. Boring to some? Maybe. But my thoughts keep me occupied.

    Empaths are a bit more difficult to classify as I find them more complex than these narcissists who seem to all act according to some asshole handbook.

    That’s just my take.

    1. Bibi…

      Thank you and sorry for my late response…

      Yes, I found out what I am: I easily/almost unconsciously relate to other people/animals emotions, positive or negative, I’m not able to watch a sad story without my tears falling, as much as I try containing them. I can’t get involved for long with a narc in a personal relationship as I feel/see him/her for what he/she is. My husband considers me a waking human “detector”; he distrusted until I told him something about people I’ve never seen or seen only once and in weeks or months what I’ve told him turned out to be the truth. He was coming home and saying: you were right about X, now it’s obvious for everybody, how did you know? I can’t explain, I’ve always thought is pure logic, but maybe it was something else, something we call intuition…

      Yes, I feel the need to stay away from malls and huge public places as it’s overwhelming for me. I didn’t understand why until now, as I care for people and I like people, I’m very sociable to those I feel as “good”, even if I see them for the first time.
      I remember there were few strange situations: people feel the need to tell me what’s bothering them…this happened also with someone on the street: he was maybe 65-70 yo, I wasn’t alone (with my child and husband, who is used by now to my “abilities”), so it was not some “sugar daddy”, yet the man felt the need to tell me his life story and I was like: “wow, why?”. As if that wasn’t strange enough, his “private life story” had been a lot like mine! He seemed a rich and bright man, very well dressed, somehow I felt he was someone important in the army or some of those gov. “structures”, not asking him thou.

      So, you’re right, we are more complicated than narcissists. We try to understand them and to some extent we may “get their point”, but they can’t understand us, we’re so complicated that the only way they can “deal” with us is through manipulation. Our “interior world” is a “place” where someone of their kind gets easily lost in…

  22. I’m def not a super empath. I am not made of stern material. I am brittle☹️

    One of his niss’s was a super empath i think. He disengaged frm her on n off. She finally had enuf n i believe he’s history for her.

    And here i am, placed on n off the shelf (texting only) and i don’t mind. I don’t like breaking contact w pple. I have never done it w anyone for too long, not any ex’s either.

    1. I am a super empath.

      Jenna you are a borderline. At least that is what you say.

      HG, don’t you prefer super empaths?

      1. HGT1F—you are doing the work of the narc. triangulation. one more battle won sans fighting for them. doing their work makes one (even more) vulnerable and prime target. a super e would not be so garishly obvious. you are not. nice try.

      2. I don’t know you from a hole in the wall but based on your comments in this site I have never seen you demonstrate empathy

      3. Hgt1f,

        I thought i was borderline becoz my signif. other unofficially disgnosed me as such. He is a physician, but not a psychiatrist.

        My most recent psychiatrist conducted a few short tests on me, and concluded that i am not borderline. No psychiatrist b4 him asked nor cared.

        However, even if i were borderline, that wud make me a geyser empath.

      4. SMH

        Let it go HGT#1F.

        I understand your feelings towards HG, What is done is done, unless of course you are looking to rattle a cage.
        HG has stated this is a place for educating not targeting.
        Your comment comes across as if he would prefer you over another……

        Everyone else, do you know her story?

        Do you know what has transpired between those two?

      5. HG Tudors #1 fan – your comments seem to to fit the profile of a Super Empath which is the best cadre to be. Nice!

      6. Oh boy. Jesus, Mary and Joseph! There goes the warm and fuzzy sisterhood. Soft dung’s about to hit the fan and I’m looking for a safe corner to hide AGAIN. A pie is heading my way, I bend to avoid it and it hits HG, behind me, square in the face.

      7. Sniglet,

        What makes u believe super empaths are ‘the best cadre to be’?

        Sniglet, i am going to be honest with you. I am feeling a strange bond with u due to our disagreeable relationship/non-relationship. U may feel nothing but i do. Lol!

      8. Jenna – it has been noted that a Super Empath provides HG with the fuel he desires most, and logically it would be an advantage for his #1 fans to also have Super Empathic traits if they want to attract him more easily. I simply do not understand and I am mystified why anybody would be against HG Tudors #1 fan for proclaiming her adoration to/for HG! I care not who causes HGT#1’s nocturnal emissions and neither should anybody else. Additionally, HG has put a lot of effort into his website/business and naturally he will receive admiration from many women. Let him enjoy the attention. Cockblocking his fuel is unprincipled.

      9. Snigers, snickers,

        Your name is making me hungry.

        Thx for ur opinion. Pls see my comment below concerning all types of empaths hg likes to engage with.

        For the record, i do not have a prblm with readers expressing admiration for hg. It is posing as something one is not, that i have a prblm with. I will say no more. Hush jenna hush.

      10. Hey Jenna – you seem like a good person. It is not I who chooses anybody’s preferences and I don’t care what anybody does on here with their life. Anyhow, I have had some free time this past week to post more than usual and have gained more insight into the subjects of empathy and narcissism, experimented, poked and prodded around and it has been fun playing the game. I understand and feel armed with enough knowledge for now. I have so much to do! Back to the real me and my ‘normal’ life, am at an impass, preparing for a 24 hour flight, holidays, career changes, catching up with fam&friends, exams, moving from one continent to another for the 5th time in my short life, renovations, packing, gift shopping and continuing my plans on building that homeless shelter I’ve been meaning to build for a while. It never stops. I do this to myself. Oh, one other thing – I apologise to you HG Tudor for ever offending you. I truly enjoy your insightful blog. Keep it up! ☺️🙋🏼‍♀️

      11. Snickers,

        Ty for sharing all of that w me. Moving continents for the 5th time, wow! That’s difficult!
        All the best building the homeless shelter!😉
        I just gotta know, do u like the choc bar ‘snickers’?

      12. Until reading this site I always thought I was simply codependent.
        But now I am pretty sure I am a super empath with cadres of carrier in the home and business and magnet when traveling and socializing.

        I also believe my ex was a greater. He absolutely relished the challenge of pitting himself against me mentally. If he got an emotional response and flowing fuel he knew he had to work for it which I KNOW made it sweeter for him.

        But stay tuned… Am still learning.

      1. Sniglet
        Christ almighty, you are a riot! A pie in HG’s face. No wonder he made the “arching of eyebrows” comment.

      2. Hgt1f,

        It does not concern me.

        But i will elaborate. Just like hg wud have a size 2 and a size 8 woman, he wud also have a super empath, a contagion empath, a geyser empath, and a co-dependent. He is polygamous, as u know, but they must meet his stringent requirements, as outlined in ‘sitting target’.
        He likes super empaths for reasons explained in the above article. He has written in ‘chained’ that if he ensnares a co-dependent, it is like winning the lottery. He has also stated on the blog that he likes messing around with borderlines, ie. geyser empaths.

      3. Jenna, he likes engaging with who ever give him fuel, but HGs preferred empath, is a SUPER EMPATH.

      1. This blog is public. If hg did not wish to post twilight and overthinker’s comments, he would not have.

      2. Did you mean its none of my business ? Yes that true . concern? I’m not concerned if you mean worried. Curious ? Yes I’m curious but its obvious an answer will not be forthcoming. Guess I’ll have to draw my own conclusion.

      3. OT

        Sit back and observe or go and read the comments from the beginning of the blog to now, Using the knowledge HG provides you will start to see who is a narcissist, those that either are boarderline or have some serious traits, the co dependent, the actual SEs, standard Empaths, Not only this but you will see many stories unwinding and understand why some react/respond the way they do.

        I do agree with Dr Quinzel we need to remember many here have been to hell and back and are at different stages of healing. We are not all going to react/respond in the same manner, some become possessive of HG, no different then those that become dependent on his presence here and become panicked when he is gone. It is the way they see him and cling to him.

      4. Hi twilight,

        🙋🏻
        I am one of those who is dependent on this blog for support, and use hg as an alternative to texting ex narc. Hg has encouraged me to “use” him and the blog as a “substitute” early on. Ty hg.

        U stated:
        “SMH
        Let it go HGT#1F.
        I understand your feelings towards HG, What is done is done, unless of course you are looking to rattle a cage.
        HG has stated this is a place for educating not targeting.
        Your comment comes across as if he would prefer you over another……”

        U also stated:
        “We are not all going to react/respond in the same manner, some become possessive of HG, no different then those that become dependent on his presence here and become panicked when he is gone.”

        I am just curious what is ur stance on this, becoz u were shaking ur head at first. Pls note this is not a criticism at all. I enjoy reading ur comments. And like i stated earlier, i have no prblm w pple expressing their affection towards hg, as long as they realize it is “not a competition”, as hg has stated in the past (his words, and i agree).

        I am also one of those who has some borderline symptoms but not borderline personality disorder (as diagnosed by my psych). My symptoms include fear of abandonment, high sensitivity, suicidal ideation.

        I do not have the borderline traits of “unstable relationships with family, friends, and loved ones”, no dangerous behaviors such as spending sprees, unsafe sex, substance abuse, binge eating, gambling (2 need be met), no “chronic feelings of emptiness, intense anger” (i seldom become angry), no “dissociative symptoms, such as feeling cut off from oneself… or losing touch with reality”, no painting pple black or white (i almost always see only gray), no deliberate manipulative behavior.

        In fact, i was trying to convince my psychiatrist that i am borderline, but he strongly disagreed with me. He pointed out that while i have some borderline symptoms as explained above, it is a manifeststion of delayed onset of ptsd due to childhood trauma. That is my diagnosis – delayed onset of ptsd.

        “Some of these signs and symptoms may be experienced by people with other mental health problems—and even by people without mental illness—and do not necessarily mean that they have borderline personality disorder. It is important that a qualified and licensed mental health professional conduct a thorough assessment… ”
        (nimh.nih.gov).

      5. Hello Jenna

        Yes I know you are one that uses this blog and HG. Your comments told me that long ago. There is nothing wrong with what you are doing, besides HG can handle it. He amazes me with what he handles daily.

        I am very familiar with a boarderline. I have known 2 in my private life and work with one. All three were/are diagnosed as boarderline. I understand the allure one would have to a narcissist. I have observed traits of a boarderline in many people, traits isn’t saying one is. That is kinda like saying when the more narcissistic traits come out in people this makes them a narcissist, we all carry them to a degree it doesn’t always make us one.

        We are each an individual with a unique perspective on life, to expect we all would react/respond in the same way is not logical. What one would consider painful another would consider not painful. Both will react/respond differently.

        There isn’t a person here that doesn’t use this blog for something, to gain knowledge, support, connections to those who understand, a place to vent their frustrations, to be validated, to be heard in a world that doesn’t listen.

        I hope this answers you question Jenna, I may not get back to you due to either not being notified or My private life is demanding a lot out of me. I always try to respond back thou.

      6. Thanks for your reply twilight I’ve only been here a few months so I admitillingly don’t know peoples back stories. I doubt I have time to go back and read all the past articles although it would be a nice distraction but at the end of the day I need to focus on what brought me here which was to figure out what happened with my narc discovered he’s just a typical narc so my question to myself is is it now time to let go and put all things narc like behind me and forget it ever happened

      7. OT

        Ha ha I understand, in reality that would be a week event.
        Your own healing thou is what matters, a persons core doesn’t change and you will see this as time goes on henceforth the sit back and observe. This blog holds many lessons and different perspectives.

        Letting things go is good, yet don’t forget what it taught you.
        May the road ahead of you be paved with the stones they once thrown at you.

      8. HG, with toy with a borderline, but not for very long. A borderline is a huge headache. A SUPER EMPATH is fiery & fisty.

        A SUPER EMPATH is a challenge for a GREATER like, HG. A challenge, HG eventually conquers in the end.

        Since you refer bloggers to look at your previous comments, why don’t you look at my comment asking which school of empath, HG prefers and check out his answer, Jenna.

      9. Twilight,

        Thx for ur answer. Indeed i did not get notification in my inbox. Lucky i checked this page manually!

        I missed u twilight while hg was not moderating. We are all connected by one factor – narc abuse, which i am currently suffering.

        My ex’s true colors are coming out, as i write this. Text after text, he is stabbing me in the heart – after all i did to help him. 😪

      10. Jenna,

        I’m so sorry to read your Nex is wounding you! They all eventually do! There seems to be no peaceful coexistence with a Narc!

      11. Hi kimi!

        So nice to see ur comment! Ty.

        Yes, i am slowly realizing it. Funny, today i am not so upset as i was yesterday. I hope it means i am ready to disengage. I am keeping my fingers crossed.

        How r u kimi?

      12. Hi Jenna,

        I just wanted you to know that you are not alone, although that does not mean that you are in good company! I continue with my Narc even though I recognize the futility of doing so. I make no excuses and recognize it as a bad choice that will not end well. I also continue with my non-Narc. Although I do take great pleasure in duping my Narc!

        If we have made it to this site and HG, then we all are seeking knowledge and perhaps, healing. I applaud those of us who are Narc-free and the few that have found peaceful coexistence with their Narcs. I learn so much from HG and the community here and for that I am very grateful!

        Happy Thanksgiving to my fellow North Americans and may everyone experience gratitude in their life!

      13. Hi kimi,

        Looks like ur having some fun duping ur narc! Haha!

        I am v grateful that we have made it to this site also. It is one of the greatest blessings i have experienced.

        I also applaud those who are narc-free. I believe, the ones who r not, have not been devalued yet, or have kids involved.
        Yet they are here to learn. Knowledge helps alot too.

        Happy thanksgiving! I have frm scratch apple pie baking in the oven! Yum! I would offer u some if i could!

    2. Yes, he has stated he enjoys toying with all empaths, it’s fuel, but HG prefers SUPER EMPATHS.
      When asked if he was to ever get married again, which cadre of empath would he choose? HG answered with, SUPER EMPATH please!

      1. HGT#1F

        If it suits his purpose I do not doubt he would marry again, I just don’t recall him ever saying it would only be to an SE.

        He has stated he prefers SE, and has explain why in this article.

        He enjoys a challenge and chess seems to be his favorite game…….

        Do you know how to play chess HGT#1F?

      2. Hgt1f,

        U stated:

        “HG answered with, SUPER EMPATH please!”

        Hehe. The ‘please’ made my day. That was cute.

    3. HG, sure you do.

      Super Empaths are unbreakable, too self conscious to let you ruin their lives for long (too many people to help, good goals to achieve, truth to be revealed).
      Super Empaths are aware of their narc traits and try to keep them under control (not when dealing with narcs, just for the good/innocent people).
      At first I thought I may be a “normal” but I’m not, reading my husband’s mind also. I see people, I feel people (even physical pain to some degree), I mirror people based on their own behavior, little to no tolerance for nonsense and those finding excuses of all kinds. I give…what I receive in a relationship. When giving to people in need I expect nothing back, I do it from the heart, still not out of weakness.
      I admire Warren Buffett. An intelligent man knowing that all working people deserve a decent income and that he will leave this life with empty pockets.

      1. Re-reading comments before mine, I must state there was no intent in “becoming” a Super Empath, I just found that out, based on another of your posts and some tests I took, plus taking into account all my strange experiences, my prophetic dreams and my ability to heal and start a new life after getting hurt.
        No narc in my life…ever again, not the brightest on Earth!
        I can’t stand them near for long…they try to “steal” my energy just by thinking of it (if someone looks at me feeling envy-emotional vampires- I feel drained and sleepy at any hour, without an obvious reasons, start to loose my ability to articulate words, something hard to explain if not experienced). I fought it was some old superstition (I was not paying attention to), but nowadays it can be scientifically explained through energy flow. My maternal grandparents were both empaths, I’m positive.

        I could never inhabit the same house with another narc but my father in my early years. I’m unable to “hate” someone for long, it takes away my own peace.

  23. Somewhere over the rainbow
    I found it very helpful to read as many articles as possible, if you go to the search bar, type in “empath” and read those articles, and by process of elimination, you may discover what you are. Your other option is a consult.

      1. Somewhere over the rainbow
        My pleasure! The Three Strands of Empathy mentions emotional contagion, which is quite interesting. Enjoy the reading, as well as, unraveling the mystery of what you are.

      1. Thank you. Many would (sigh)! I have limited pie slices and I will keep one just for you.

  24. Do the Greater Narcs that you expose ever contact you? Or any narcs, for that matter, who have lost a target after your consultations? When a target/victim tells the narc about you and your advice, if they do before going no contact, the thwarted narc must feel confused (which is rare).

    1. No Greater Narcissists. There have been two Mid Rangers who have done so after losing their target following their consulting with me.

      1. Yes and both showed complete Mid Ranger tendencies in their protestations and amounted to excellent examples which would have been useful to exhibit. I did not allow the comments through however because of course, that is what they wanted.

      2. Excellent. Not posting the comment was a smart move, of course, you knew that. Being ignored is tantamount to a criticism.

      3. Not really conversations Perse, more a monologue from both in terms of a comment and very much confirming the MR credentials.

      4. And where are all these Greaters? I’ve known lots of Lessers and many, many Mid-Rangers but the Greaters evade me. Not that I am complaining, albeit I’d like to have a real world person to use as comparison.

        And I just want to add how stupid Lessers are. They’re not even clever in how they manipulate.

        Dummies.

      5. The majority of narcissists are Lesser and Mid Range. You may never meet a greater. It depends on the circles you move in.

      6. I did out of courtesy and to also enable them to see the confirmation (were it required) that were dealing with narcissists.

      7. Oh, Mr. Tudor, tisk, tisk. All narcissists are notorious for putting on airs. So my challenge for you is to deliver your next You Tube video in an American accent. Traditional, Mid-Western ala Ohio area. It’s flat and bland as shit. Perhaps it is not so glamorous, as your UK intonation, but I’d like to hear you try those flat a sounds and those strong r’s.

        “I parrrked my carrr near the waaaffle house….”

        Tee hee…

      8. I consider that some Greater Narcissists are indeed judges and silks, but all judges and all silks are not Greater Narcissists.

      9. A Greater would not be on this blog, because they know what they are. A Greater would not waste their time.

  25. Super-empath here, with more than one narc in my life. Like him, I refuse to lose, and no man, not even a narc, can break my stride. The narc belief that i will always love the person i thought he was is not correct. i knew he was NSP the first couple weeks. i’ve cried a lot during our time, but when the ostentatious discard was happening, i came full circle. I knew it wasn’t real, but i needed it at the time. The same circular arguments became booooooooring, and I knew how to elicit them, to reinforce my resolve by getting the predictable scripted response. I miss him NOW, two weeks since discard/escape. But the thought of actually seeing him holds no allure. Accept the truth about yourself as well as the narc. Facing yourself is much harder. I can’t hide from the fact that narcs are the only people who burn as ferociously, in their way, as me, and that is irresistible. Knowing that they equally serve MY agenda changes everything, no hate, no wistful, no mourning. I will not be “topped” by any mere mortal. 🙂 Hope everyone has a lovely day.!

  26. In my youth I was very attracted to narc’s “cold” intelligence, I’ve never stayed for long in that relationship, but I was a “challenged accepted” two times, I managed to escape both times.
    Is there a way to distinguish between being a super empath and a “normal” person? There are many similarities, feeling really sorry and trying to help less fortunate ones can make a difference between those two? Otherwise…it’s all foggy for me.

  27. Great. My narcs all told me I was a ‘challenge’. I never knew I could be an empath, much less a ‘super empath’ because I have a very black, almost nihilistic sense of humor and I don’t allow very many ‘in’ so to speak, but the narcissists managed to find that way in, which made their broken trust all the more painful.

    Surprise! I guess am warm and caring after all…till you betray me, you swine.

    Years ago, I found a man’s wallet that had 100s of dollars in it. I called him up and returned it, wherein he had tears in his eyes in reaction to my doing that. I only think how if I lost my wallet, I would want someone to do the same for me.

    But I don’t invite strangers into my house, homeless or not. Fuck that. There is being nice and then there is being stupid.

  28. When Narcissists Collide: Kim Jong Un calls Trump “old lunatic” and Trump tweets: Kim Jong Un is short and fat.

    More narc action: My empath spy did not believe me when I explained to her that her son’s playmates are lesser narcs. She and her husband felt sorry for the little sociopaths. Well, the 7-year-old took a knife out of her kitchen drawer and knifed her whole car. The empath spy spoke to the father and grandmother (both narcs) and they blamed her, started screaming she (the empath) was crazy, kicked her out of the house and slammed the door.

  29. Lesser & co-dependent have often small IQ
    and Greater & Super Empath high intelligence?

    Am I right, dear HG?

      1. Only to the Narcs?
        Why?
        Because, anyway, the Empaths don’t use their brains?
        Just think with their hearts?

      2. The empaths are categorised in a different way which does not relate to the level of cognitive function.

    1. Salome
      I have two females that I am certain are CoDs*. One is from a family of all lessers and she is not very smart. The other CoD is from a family comprised of lessers and LMRNs, and she is not very bright either. I think intelligence has both a genetic component and an environmental one, so families can be a mixed bag of cognition. My lessers range from dumb, dumber and dumbest.

      *co-dependents

      1. Twilight,

        Let me refresh you rmemory in regards to HG, stating, if he was going to get married again, HG requested it to be a Super Empath please.

        This statement was made on his live session back in, July.

        Yes, I do know how to play chess.

      2. HGT#1F

        First you are not refreshing my memory, I have not listen to that live stream. Work obligations kept me from listening that night. I have not gone back to listen to it,
        I am here for knowledge and to increase my awareness.

        Just because HG has said his preference is an SE, doesn’t automatically make one his choice to target. It is like you are trying to get his attention by jumping up and down screaming I am a SE and your preference, and you make sure people know this. Confidence doesn’t scream it is felt, that attracts him not one stating I am your preference.

        Find your worth and value within yourself then it will shine brightly words will not be needed.

      1. Ha! Ha!
        One “like” for you because of your question.
        But why do you ask?
        Are you looking for some friends on your level?
        😉

      2. Salome,

        I didn’t find any research to confirm your statement so i assumed you based it on your own example.

        I am very careful choosing friends and those who upset others by making inconsiderate and thoughtless comments are automatically disqualified unless they apologise and show remorse.

      3. A Broken Wing

        It’s OK.
        Just…
        Next time don’t confound “own example” with “own observations”.

    2. Oh can be different! Codep can have very high intelligence. They have the cultural level according to their family – they just are raised by narcissist etc.

      1. I’m border, that’s why I have and know codeps.
        That are only people who can last long years around narc or border.
        They are not being discarded usually. Everybody is discarded around, but they stay…
        Being raised in the families where usually there are one narc of border and one codep, they were pressed by high standards of achievement.

        The thing that differ them in behavior – they have pretty good adaptation not to wound subj; they have distorted boundaries, the narc atmosphere is (only one) familiar for them; they don’t have own egoistic feelings (it was prohibited to feel and wish something by cold parent – they are highly empathic, but their own wants are suppressed); they can “understand” the rages, not taking them on their own account, like “this person feels bad now”. Too much of empathy, self-sacrifice and understanding. Always want to fix, not let go.
        Can range from low intellect sufferers, enabling Lessers, probably. Until very intelligent successful people. They just can not date normals, bored with them, and magnetized to trouble we all know.
        But among them are also “active” codeps: control freaks who even able to dominate in relations (I’m not sure, but probably this controlling type are, by obvious reasons, not utilized by narcs (?), so all then left for borders). Particularly this active type is described in “Human-Magnet Syndrome” by Ross Rosenberg, who is codep and specializes on codeps.

        ***

        I think HG categorizes Empaths by fuel, that’s why not by intellect. That’s kind of emotional strength/ giving energy intensity category, independent of brain.
        But obviously the higher the narcissist is, the higher intellectual and physical demands he puts on his victims.

        The Greaters, probably, promote themselves very fast to the higher places, so can be caught in two ways – or very young (like it was in my letter case) or in the high flight, so that demands hunting for them (ha ha, if somebody really wants to put such goal) in the specific highest social milieu.

      2. Antifragile: I just read this “The thing that differ them in behavior – they have pretty good adaptation not to wound subj; they have distorted boundaries, the narc atmosphere is (only one) familiar for them; they don’t have own egoistic feelings (it was prohibited to feel and wish something by cold parent – they are highly empathic, but their own wants are suppressed); they can “understand” the rages, not taking them on their own account, like “this person feels bad now”. Too much of empathy, self-sacrifice and understanding. Always want to fix, not let go.
        Can range from low intellect sufferers, enabling Lessers, probably. Until very intelligent successful people. They just can not date normals, bored with them, and magnetized to trouble we all know.”

        I keep wondering how I would classify myself in this whole “empathic” spectrum. I am hyperanalytical (probably a learned defense, having grown up walking on eggshells to avoid triggering the family around me). Having to walk on eggshells is not the norm in any era.

        Living in the US, perhaps this perception is different in other countries: Parenting was different in the 70s (drastically) than what we see today. If a baby cries, in today’s world, you pick it up. My parents (and friends’ parents) would instruct us, as new mothers, to let the baby cry it out so that it learns to comfort itself. We were taught that looks are highly important in females (as we were to grow up to earn that “MRS” degree), not to go out without makeup, not to gain weight, wear clothes that complement your figure (nothing baggy), be seen with people who reflect well on your character, etc. We were taught not to be prideful, to stay humble, and praise was a rarity. High achievement was expected (not praised). Anything less was punished. It seems common among women of my age group (to have been raised similarly). Everyone’s parents were “cold”.

        I have no idea how to label myself on the empath spectrum. I know I feel things that other people don’t. I have a physical reaction to certain colors, sounds, images, and of course people. Every once in a while, I come across a person who puts off such a strong aura, it makes me dizzy (literally). I will lose my balance and stumble (towards them) if I’m walking alongside (it’s like experiencing vertigo next to a magnet, and being made of metal). If I reach for something near a person like this, I might actually tip over. It is eluding me, the common denominator of what these people have in common. Lots of narcs in my world, but only a few have had that kind of aura. I’ve only known one greater/elite, and that one definitely had the strongest pull. The others were simply not intelligent enough to be greater/elite, much closer to the lesser or lower mid-range. Two of them, I’m sure, were psychopaths. I’m still uncertain whether this pull/reaction is related to psychopathy, narcissism, or something else entirely different. Who knows.

        All this said, for all of this highly-tuned sensitivity and intuitiveness, I cannot detect when someone is PRETENDING to be interested, happy, engaged, etc. It takes a brick to the head (several times over) before I recognize the fraud. My mind just doesn’t go there, yet.

  30. Lol I just wanted to say just as I thought a narcissist was somebody who spent too much time looking in the mirror and grooming themselves I also thought an empath was somebody with psychic and /or clairvoyant abilities prior to discovering ur YouTube and blog.still don’t know what I am because I have traits of a normal a narcissist an empath a super empath and a codependent .I never and I mean never ever homeless people. I am somewhat masochistic in relationships especially in bed but I never let him break me emotionally.I can have tremendous empathy in some situations and have zero percent empathy in other situations.some situations trigger enormous amounts of sympathy to the point I feel that persons pain and can think of nothing else other times I feel nothing but disgust for certain people. I think I am a hybrid empathic narcissist lol

    1. “enormous amounts of sympathy to the point I feel that persons pain and can think of nothing else other times I feel nothing but disgust for certain people”

      Have you tried a border dress?…
      This sounds as a very “bordery” description. They are definitely people with some (but not many) narc traits, while highly sensitive and empathic, feeling others (or even artificial, film) pain to a highest level, as their own, with long bad mood afterwards. People without emotional skin.
      As for disgust… If it happens after these people have criticized you, for example, – that’s typically how I “paint black” and then devalue people. if If it is sudden disgust – totally can subscribe under this description.

      There are great amount of borders around the narcissists. Same family ‘language’.
      Amazing that borders are so rarely mentioned in comments here – must be a big per cent of them here.

      1. My therapist and several others have confirmed to me I’m not borderline .I know for myself I don’t paint people black or white. The disgust I feel is when some people lose their children due to drug abuse and then want sympathy I know its a disease but I can’t sympathize with them due to my father being an alcholic I’ve never felt disgust for someone because they criticized me its usually because I feel they made terrible choices

      2. Got it. I’m sorry if you dislike the idea – I thought later I shouldn’t post it.
        I understood that this concept do not help you. With me was vise versa.

        I just think that border condition is underestimated. And underdiagnosed.
        Two doctors said I’m not, because I’m not impulsive. But what to do with that oversensitivity and all other things that help to understand the inner dynamics a lot…

      3. I’m very familiar with borderline personality disorder.psychology was my major in college its not a matter of the concept not helping me, I do not have the symptoms, unstable relationships or mood, desire to avoid abandonment etc. I do have a pretty severe case of OCD and have been in treatment for it most of my life.

      1. If you are a co-dependent you do not have the traits of the super empath and you do not create those traits through healing, therefore you do not become one.

    1. I think theres a bit of codependancy issues in all victims whether theyre super empaths or even narcissists for that matter. The issue is within them that makes them vulnerable as a target. There is something crucial missing and it makes them put up with what others would normally not put up with.

      1. The term ‘codependent’ is quite a turbid one.
        To come to the common exact definition is needed…

        Because, yes, to some points of view, narcissist is also codependent in mutually dependent relations with codependent empath.
        Or it can be just definition of somebody normal, who can not live (bored) another way than with narcissistic person.
        But codependents contain not only the normals, but all the range – inverted narcs are definitely codependents for example…

      2. Ah there is Codependent book by HG, but i’m still waiting for it, the delivery to my part of the world is long, so can not check the term there yet…

      3. Hi narc affair, I agree with you. Because of internalised abuse in early years I think we are all to some degree co-dependents. We put up with the abuse, maybe even mistaking the lows as necessary for the highs because that’s all we know. I don’t really know what kind of an empath I am. I do know that I tend to have no protective layer towards the world and life at large sometimes, but there are also situations and people that I can’t bring myself to feel the slightest empathy for. I just shut myself off at times coming across as almost cold.
        I think I might lean towards co-dependency in the wrong kind of relationship though, even though I consider myself to be quite strong, self assertive, and accomplished otherwise. I just loose sight of myself in that kind of toxic environment, probably being brought back to a childhood time where I wasn’t allowed any boundaries at all, and where love meant being controlled and subjected to pain, guilt and shame all the time.
        How is it for you?

      4. Hi antifragile and Catherine…ty for your thoughts. This is a core belief i hold. Codependant and independant imo are two different things. You can be very independant have a successful career and support yourself and still be codependant. If a person wasnt reliant on another in some capacity why would they put up with abuse? You can say bc they wanted to heal them or help them but theres codependants that get their fix from doing that as well. The fixer or healer. Ultimately it stems from the same vulnerability…lack of self love and need of validation that they matter in some form.

        Hi Catherine for me it was similiar. I grew up not really being heard or validated. Ive read the stories on here and my childhood was not near as bad as others but it still had an impact where i struggle to feel visible or worthy. My narc has made me feel so special but in a heartbeat not special at all. Ive been codependant on what hes given me that i havent had in my marriage and also from my mother. Its taken a lot to be able to see this thanks mainly to this blog and HGs works. Now that i see it i need to try and fill my own codependant gaps in myself. Its definitely not easy but neither is being in the narc cycle.

      5. Also there are empaths out there that will not put up with abuse and have strong boundaries so what sets them apart from empaths that stay or disengage and then go back to the abuse? A super empath will go back so theyre not super at all until they fix whats wrong with them inside. Its vulnerability and codependant issues imo.

      6. narc affair

        I have been thinking more about co-dependent behavior and my behavior, and I am not an expert, but now that I know about NPD I will avoid these types of individuals as much as possible. I am single and very happy and I am not looking for a romantic relationship at all.

      7. When i think super empath i think of an empath who has educated themselves and know what they do and dont want in their life. They dont go back to abusive individuals they gravitate towards healthy people who respect their boundaries.
        This super empath i think of as a super “fuel” empath. Someone whose still dysfunctioned and keeps coming back for more abuse. That is weakness not strength.

      8. They have their fix, totally agree, NA!
        But what if they have more upside than loss? What if gain is overweights?..

        If for example due to parental family dynamics the only way to have love – is to have it with narc? Then what is better: to have and lose, or not to have it at all?
        For me it is an open question – the my last experience I would never give away, if I had choice to return to the past and decide. (Ironically, it was almost my first phrase to him – “wow, if I met this you ten years ago, I would never let you go”).

        All people who consciously and repeatedly drawn to narcissists are not just normals and empaths. That are people who came from narcissistic families, with no another way of communication known…
        I’m searching for the way to break the chains and come to normal world now … it’s not an easy task.)

      9. Hi antifragile…i get what youre saying and i actually watched a vid on this very thing where there was an analogy of language being used. For instance is you only new say french would you would not understand say spanish and would gravitate to french speaking individuals and would know no better. Quite often those who are drawn to narcissists know that language from childhood and feel alive and exhilarated thru being with a narc bc its all theyve known. Personally i wont say i entirely regret loving my narc but i want a healthy whole love thats free of narcissism. Thatd be a new “language” for me to learn. Some individuals would maybe feel different and only want what they know being a narcississtic relationship.

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