The Expanded Narcissistic Truths – No. 2

i-amemptyi-show-youwhat-youwant-to-see

There is a vast emptiness inside of me.

Whatever was meant to be there is not there and instead this chasm remains, an expansive void that is dark, deep and perpetual. I remain ahead of this void because it wants to consume me and in so doing consign me to oblivion. This relentless black hole wants to devour me, breaking down all that I have achieved and crushing them into nothingness, a final insult against me as I disappear without trace. A terrible matter to contemplate that as this extinction is aimed at me is the prospect of never having mattered, never having existed and never having made a mark on the world. To be erased in an instant, obliterated and deleted.

I am fearless in all that I do, save that is this void, this nothing which is the architect of one total fear. It is against this constant fate that I drive forward. You see, hurled into this void is The Creature and he is scrabbling to escape it so that with dreadful suicidal intent he can wrap his sinewy arms about me, his yellowed and sharpened teeth plunging into my neck, his venom paralysing me as he gurgles and giggles, hauling me backwards off the precipice and into the void, the pair of us plummeting into oblivion.

That must not happen.

In order to keep him deep, deep down in the void it is necessary to imprison him and keep his vile and seditious whispers silenced. This means filling the void. Imagine he lurks at its very deepest point. He wishes to keep the void as it is. Vast and empty, since by doing so he will be able to then clamber out and grab me, dragging me down back into the void. He needs the void to be just that. He needs emptiness so he can reach out of it unhindered. He needs the void to be just that. He needs emptiness so he can destroy me through its unrelenting absence of anything.

I cannot have emptiness.

This void must be filled and it is filled with fuel. Each piece of fuel places a layer within the void and behind each layer The Creature becomes imprisoned. Oh he will wail and protest but as those layers become thicker and more numerous his wretched cat calls become muffled and then silenced. He cannot break through these layers, he cannot reach out and burst through the constructed layers to sabotage my existence. Each layer differs in depth, strength and duration in accordance with the type of fuel that I am able to gather and place within the void, fashioning my construct.

The smile from a stranger is a thin and ephemeral sliver. The admiration from a newly acquired primary source is a dense and durable slab that protects me and makes the construct strong. Piece by piece, layer by layer, each segment of fuel, positive and negative, reinforces the construct, fills the void and keep The Creature at bay.

One cannot rest for these pieces dissipate and melt away through time. The Creature picks at them, claws at them, raking through them. Your treacherous criticism punches massive great holes in them allowing the mocking howls of The Creature to echo to me. See now why we hate criticism so vehemently?

Fuel fills the void. Fuel creates the construct.

The fastest way to gather fuel is to show you what you want to see for then you will pour forth with your love, your delight, your admiration and your appreciation. Marvellous, edifying and filling is your fuel. If I show you the very thing that you want to see, namely yourself, you will give me this fuel more readily, with such potency, often and in huge amounts. I have not time to build something of substance for you to fall in love with, to admire and desire. I must create it with due expedience and what better way than to use that which already exists, namely you. Thus, I show you yourself through my mirror and you fall for that image believing it to be me, believing it to be my essence and substance.

You do not realise that you are seeking yourself and indeed you do not see yourself when I mirror you back at yourself. You are conned by my fakery into thinking that it is my substance that you see and it dazzles and enchants you. I care not. So long as you are providing me with that fuel, I will hold up that mirror to you and let you fall in love with yourself. It is an artifice, a fabrication and fakery but it is necessary.

I give you what you want. It is not real but it seems so real to you and thus your responses are in fact real. The delicious fuel flows and I want you to pour it into me, filling me up, creating a barrier of salvation between me and the Creature as you are chief architect in the plans to frustrate and defeat his attempt to dethrone me.

This is why when you are installed as primary source and your wonderful fuel flows you truly are everything that matters to us.

You are our salvation and if holding a mirror up to achieve this salvation is what must be done, then it will be done.

72 thoughts on “The Expanded Narcissistic Truths – No. 2

  1. nakedquill says:

    Interesting, gives me new insights learning about such a creature’s existence

  2. Mona says:

    Thank you, Catherine.
    Through your comment I identified my weak spot.
    It is my void inside of me. I smelled an apparently similar void inside of my personal devil, identified with it and tried to fill it. What I could not do for me, I thought I could do for him. His void made me “weak.” And I expected my personal narc to help me to fill my void. That was my inner contract.

    Almost I fell for HG and his void. His void is his void and should be no matter of interest for me.
    HG and my personal narc found a way to deal with the void. They abuse others without regret or remorse or any kind of conscience.

    Therefore maybe it is the same void which leads to different ways of handling it.

    Perfect match- for them.

    My void is an inner state of loneliness. The feeling not to be missed and appreciated by anyone in the world. It is a very “old” feeling or memory which has nothing to do with my current reality. I know now who caused that void and that makes me angry. Sometimes the void shines through, if someone tries to make me feel that way. And there are people who try to do it.
    Then I need some hours to calm me and take a realistic view at my life.
    The void is a ghost of my past. It is a feeling caused by people like HG.
    I do not allow them anymore to inject their poison into my thoughts.
    They are not invited in my life anymore.

    And my creature is so small now. It reminds me of a biting dog, which has to be arrested until the rest of its life, because it is evil.

    1. Catherine says:

      Mona, thank you for sharing. I feel like this too. And my void is probably still much larger than your biting dog. You seem to have come a long way and that’s courageous. I applaud you!

      I do believe we all have this void, and depending on what happened to us in life, and I guess especially in our childhood, it will vary in size and be more or less like a gaping hole that has a constant need for being filled up. We all seek external validation as a cure for our inner hollowness so we’re not that different from narcissists in that way. But true healing comes from within and that’s the hard part.

      My void was created by my mother. I’m not scared of loneliness per se, but I am completely terrified of abandonment. Losing love scares me to death. I, too, thought I saw the void in my narcissistic man. I interpreted his manipulative behaviour for a long time as a vulnerability I could heal with the ferocious force of my pure love for him. Our relationship came to be this constant battle of me proving my love, not rejecting him or distancing myself even when he hurt me to the point of no return; not wanting to be like my mother withdrawing love. To think that all this time I tried to fill up his leaking ego, when all I needed to do was to pay attention to myself instead. All the effort I put into him should have been directed my way instead. I was just avoiding my own issues I realise and that’s so painful to think about.

      1. gabbanzobean says:

        Catherine….

        “I do believe we all have this void, and depending on what happened to us in life, and I guess especially in our childhood, it will vary in size and be more or less like a gaping hole that has a constant need for being filled up”

        This resonates with me so much. I wonder if this is reason why I was (and still am) so magnetically drawn to my narc. Always seeking to fill that void. A huge void with a magnet in it pulling him to me. I am sure this sounds stupid as hell but every moment I was with him I could feel my body being pulled to him. My mind being pulled to him. It’s like he casted some spell on me. Like I envision him waving a narc wand saying “I will fill that void” or something. Okay I hope this makes sense in the fact that I am trying to make a comparison with this whole void thing and the magnetic pull I felt toward him.

      2. Catherine says:

        Gab,

        It makes perfect sense to me. I think one of the main factors that attracted me to my narcissist was that he noticed my void, pretended to mirror it and heal it in the beginning, slowly filling my emptiness within, only to turn the tables on me and use my insecurities against me later on. Then I tried instead to fill the perceived void of what I thought was vulnerability in him, not wanting to let go even when it was obvious that I should’ve.

        I guess we need to learn how to validate ourselves, no one else can do it for us. Otherwise it’s an eternal dance. But the attraction I felt, and this destructive pull towards him is something I’ve never felt before. Knowing now that it was all fake is still hard to fathom.

    2. gabbanzobean says:

      Mona,
      Without getting extraordinarily encyclopedic about my childhood and life in general, everything you said is very relatable to me and how I feel.

  3. Narcissistic people are social geniuses. They can size you up in a few seconds and become what you want and need. It is truly a skill. It basically comes naturally. It is honed since childhood. They need to be able to switch up behaviors in an instant because of the abuse that was dished out. It is amazing that for as much social skills they present they have zero or next to nothing self esteem. The whole personality is an act. A facade. The act breaks down when their tactics aren’t working. Say they are highly reliant on looks and sexual prowess to attract attention. If they pull out the entire bag of tricks and get no reaction it’s a wound. They then have to turn to something else, say humor. If no reaction they get hurt. Sometimes that hurt turns into anger. Why? Negative attention is better than no attention. If the facade falls apart then they start to regress. This causes depression and anxiety. The thing the narcissist doesn’t know is that they never learned to feed their self esteem internally. All of it comes from outside. However, they believe that the self identity is absent. It’s not. Every fake trait cannot be faked. You have to possess the skill in order to “act out” the skill. You have to be beautiful to rely on looks. You have to be sexually experienced to have sexual prowess. You have to possess quick wit to be seen as comical. I think the narcissist can learn to dial back the narcissistic traits. Though anything you get rid of in yourself has to be replaced with something. Realizing that you are the traits you think you are falsely displaying. It’s all you. It’s inside you. You can call it pretending all you want. But you cannot display what you don’t possess. Thoughts HG?

    1. abrokenwing says:

      ‘ You have to be sexually experienced to have sexual prowess ‘

      I disagree.
      I don’t have much of experience. I’m a natural talent.😜

      1. Hahaha. Nice one! 😆

  4. He gave me something I didn’t believe existed, I didn’t even know I wanted it. There must have been some void in me to be filled also.
    He left more voids in my life.
    But I don’t have a monster trying to claw it’s way out of my voids.
    I pity you with your monster.
    But I don’t want you to let that monster out, either.

    1. Tappan Zee says:

      PERSE—the voids, precisely.
      your whole post rung bells. ty.

  5. Witch says:

    Eeeee!! I’m giddy because I’ve been listening to your 16/7/17 Q&A and you mentioned that you’re planning on experimenting with isolation.
    I said to you quite a while ago that I would love to experiment with a narc and wanted to isolate you for 24 hours and see what becomes of you. (This is when I posted under “D” and had to change the name as someone else started posting under “D”)
    So I’m flattered!
    Please keep a diary during these isolation experiments and publish! Please Henry!

  6. Chingona says:

    I’m trying to take everything HG shares to heart. As hurt as I’ve been, I can’t blame them. Not anymore. Most of us consume creatures that are cruelly factory farmed in order to live. We pretend not to know that animals suffer, so we can eat what we want. Most of us “benefit” from the exploitation of others (sweatshop labor in Bangladesh). We think we’re entitled to dress like a celebrity at bargain prices. Every creature comfort we have is paid for by the labor and suffering of the less fortunate. Even super-empaths refuse to face our own lack of compassion when, for instance, our elected sociopaths destroy Yemen. Politics to prove a point…

    It’s important for me the understand the big picture, the cosmic/genetic dynamic, the impersonal truth and all of the “why”s. The more I blame him, the longer I will suffer. The more I blame him, the more likely I’ll be to fall in with another. The more I blame him, the less work i’ll do on myself.

  7. Jojo says:

    I knew he wasn’t right..he’d been hurt , he felt unworthy ,he didn’t try to buy me,,he didn’t put on any airs, it felt so natural, Id been alone by choice 4 yrs , we evolved from friends over time to loving,lovers,in love..then I let him down by not being able to pick him up from a meeting, a miscommunication, the darkness began ,so did the secrecy, the texts all night from women,the blocking on social media,the disappearances, short temper, spewing horrible accusations . I tried to love him as he should’ve been loved all his life ,I tried to prove I wasn’t them ,but he lost trust in me from this one miscommunication, the creature..I almost killed myself, thought I would die from this loss,I’ve never loved as I loved him ,this creature.. Physically it’s been a year apart, 9 months no contact, but a few name changed emails. I’m living on,I’m surviving,I’m getting help,I know Now I was loving my own hurt self..I’m healing her,I’m loving her now…

  8. Catherine says:

    Oh, the Creature! The thing is we all have this empty void inside of us, we all have this kind of Creature eating away at us, needing to be quieted lest we’ll be annihilated from the face of the earth. Or that’s how it feels at least, the dark emotions of self doubt and insecurity eating away at us. We all need validation as human beings to build a construct and most of us go through life with some kind of made up sense of ourselves in the form of defense mechanisms, hiding the small, fearful version of ourselves deep within at times. That’s life. Life’s tough. We survive. That’s what we are here for. We face the abyss within. And we learn to deal with it. Sooner rather than later. We’re born innocent, we spend our life constructing a façade to hold on to; but true wisdom and love comes from slowly and courageously starting to deconstruct what was falsely built to be able to see ourselves finally. It’s not easy, it’s hellish, but I do think it will be rewarding. I’m certainly not there in any sense, but I sure as hell do not go about life trying to survive through hurting someone else.

    I’ve never been as close to pure annihilation as when with my narcissist. But I do and did survive. You should grow up in a way too, face your fears. You might also be rewarded. Through refusing to confront your fears you might miss out on so many beautiful things in life. Like positive feelings.

    Haha.. I might have gotten a bit carried away now, but still there it is. We are brave; you are not.

    1. Catherine says:

      Now I’m going on and on about it, but I do think that my narcissist made me face my greatest fears, my Creature within, and it was the most painful experience of my whole life because suddenly my entire existence was unraveling thread by thread. It’s not really about him at all, it’s about me. He was just a starting point from which my deconstruction of myself could begin. So he had a role to play in my life, and I guess maybe later on I’ll even be grateful.

      What’s so different about you narcissists? The stronger defence mechanisms? The more urgent need of validation? Sure. But where do they stem from? The lack of emotions? The emptiness of you? If you would just have a look your Creature might have been sat on those feelings all the time. Our journeys are all different of course but in the end we need to deconstruct to truly be able to connect to another human being. And that’s beautiful.

    2. BurntKrispyKeen says:

      True. You share my thoughts.

      1. BurntKrispyKeen says:

        Scary but true…We all suffer from a version of this creature.

    3. Tappan Zee says:

      I’ve never been as close to pure annihilation as when with my narcissist.

      ^ 💯💯💯💯💯💯💯

    4. Windstorm2 says:

      Catherine
      I agree that we all have a sort of creature within that we feel we must hide. At least I know that I do. I used to really work at keeping it hidden and fearing what people would think if they saw it.
      Used to. Now not really. I’ve pretty much made peace with my fears and insecurities now. I freed my creature and my world did not end. It actually got a whole lot better.

      1. Catherine says:

        That sounds beautiful Windstorm. To free your Creature, face your fears and be who you actually are in a much better world. I hope I’ll get there eventually.

        I learned in my early years that my self worth had to be determined by someone else, so I guess I’ve gone about my whole life needing validation, fearing rejection and abandonment, in an unhealthy way. The experience with the narcissist has become some sort of a catalyst for me. It’s time to love myself.

        But I do think this is common ground for many of us, personality disorders or not. Both the narcissist and his/her victims have this void, and though we come at it from different perspectives and world views, with varying degrees of awareness, we recognise some insecurities in each other in a manner that leads to even more painful experiences, at least for the victims.

      2. gabbanzobean says:

        Windstorm.
        I agree. I feel like I have my own creature lots of the time. Being with my mid range piano turd made me feel better. He was an alternate reality where I was not faced with such a creature. My creature could be called “loneliness, fear of abandonment” etc. if I had to name it with something. Jesus, I sound like a narc. Do we often wonder if we are narcs? I do not think I am a narc but when my mid used to spin shit around on me he often had me feeling like I was some narc. He told me that I compartmentalize things! What the F? LOL.

        1. Windstorm2 says:

          Gabby,
          They want to undermine our self esteem. They want us to have a creature, be lonely, feel insecure because it makes them feel better. They have to be on top. If they aren’t naturally better than us, then that means they have to pull us down so they can feel more successful. It is an illusion that piano turd completed you. The reality is that you complete yourself in your own mind. You’re just using him like a crutch – maybe more like a totem – a physical representation of the love you crave that you let yourself feel when you are with him.

          I’ll admit I don’t understand the pull of great sex, having never experienced it. But I do know that filling that void has to come from you. I filled mine by accepting myself, flaws and all, and focusing my energies both inward to love the woman I am and outward to love and help those around me. I tossed out all the lies and rubbish narcs had tried to convince me of all my life and just started over.

          I always thought that saying, “if you love it, let it go, if it comes back to you it’s really yours….”. was stupid. Nothing and nobody is really ever “yours.” That’s all just an illusion. So much anxiety and unhappiness comes from wanting other people to belong to us and somehow be integral to who we are.

          And as to mental compartmentalization, that just shows a scientific type of mind. I’ve always compartmentalized my mind. That lets me focus all my thoughts and resources on a given problem, without other worries and problems interfering. That’s not narcissistic. That’s just efficient. Use that thinking to focus on loving yourself for who you are and block out all your narcs and naysayers. 😊

      3. Catherine says:

        Windstorm, you truly are wise! Thank you for sharing.

        Your statement that no one ever belongs to us resonates so much with me. I’ve always been a loner, but still when in a relationship I’ve gone through life trying to bind that person to me through love, needing his validation to fill my void, not knowing how to complete myself without this kind of external love.

        An entanglement with a narcissist puts everything you ever believed about yourself at odds and I can’t believe all the effort I put into loving him, when all I really needed to do was to finally love myself instead. I wouldn’t even have been an option for him if I had truly loved myself and had healthy boundaries when we met. So, when you’re at the bottom the only way is surely up and this life of ours is a learning experience. That’s what my narcissist taught me. To take a good look at myself and my unhealthy behaviour. No one belongs to me. I don’t need someone else to be complete. My recovery has started to revolve around me finally.

        1. Windstorm2 says:

          That’s great, Catherine! And you’re absolutely right. I remember years ago sitting in an AlAnon meeting thinking that -when you’re in the bottom there’s no where to go but up. Of course my MIL added the advice, “when you find yourself in a hole, quit digging!” That’s good to remember as well. 😝

  9. Becky says:

    This sounds very similar to the Borderline experience.

    1. Tappan Zee says:

      I think borderlines are less vacuous. They have deeper and broader emotions, including empathy. They lack regulation of them. I will take BPD over NPD any day. They are who they are and, though play games, they are authentic. Genuine, even if it is or presents as a shit show now and again.

      ^@becky

      1. gabbanzobean says:

        I know it can be common to diagnose yourself but I have often wondered if I am borderline. Jenna posted a descriptive summary she found online with a quiz I think. I know those types of things are not to be used as a diagnosis but I was shocked how many boxes I ticked “yes” for. The only things I did not identify with on the borderline list was the similar “idealization vs. discard” behavior, the split thinking and cutting myself. Everything else seemed to be on point though.

        1. HG Tudor says:

          I sometimes wonder whether borderlines are really just Mid Range Victim Narcissists and that the supposed empathy that is demonstrated is really cognitive empathy and not emotional empathy. Further, borderlines are more usually women and therefore I wonder if there is some gender bias at work which does not like the idea of labelling a section of women as narcissists, so this alternative category is used. I know that the diagnosis of borderline personality disorders was withdrawn by one of the major diagnostic bodies a few years back. Before you get worried GZB, I am not suggesting you are a narcissist, I know you are not.

          1. gabbanzobean says:

            Well I am relieved that you know I am not a narc, HG. The way Mr. Piano recital would speak to me and “analyze” me he’d sometimes have me thinking I was a narc! Common behavior though. I still cannot classify myself from your empath articles.

            My first sentence is not meant to me sarcastic by the way. I really am relieved. But I still wonder about the whole borderline thing though. I really do.

      2. narc affair says:

        Hi tappan zee…i agree with your description of a borderline. The amygdala part of the brain is overstimulated and that is where borderlines are highly emotional and another area of the brain that controls thought processes is understimulated so you get emotional deregulation. This is where emotion and logic need to merge to create the wise brain functioning.
        Borderlines are not narcissists but of course can have narc traits.

        1. Twilight says:

          Narc Affair

          What would you say is the difference between a mid ranger and a boardline?

      3. Nuit Étoilée says:

        Speaking of categories being removed from the DSM – NPD will be removed in the future is what I learned today…

        I think that is a mistake..

        And as for gender bias wreaking havoc in diagnostic criteria – not difficult to convince me.. history is full of these instances..

        Gab, people who have suffered emotional abuse can have difficulties w emotional regulation.. and other things, so don’t be too hard on yourself. You have a big heart.

  10. Bronna315 says:

    I understand why narcs can never focus on the needs of others. Its has to be so draining and energy consuming seeking others for constant validation. Its like a cup with a hole in it being filled with water. Never enough. And u guys are incapable of getting it from yourself. Sad

  11. BurntKrispyKeen says:

    I read every word, even learned a new one for me… sinewy. And now that I have a visual of those arms… for me, this article represents the root of narcissism.

    And when you speak of the Creature becoming buried and essentially stuck (although not always to stay) within the layers, I can see this in every narcissistic person I know. I often spoke of the dark hole, the little wounded boy buried within or the monster that couldn’t help but rear his ugly head… with the male narcissist in my life. This is the part that fascinates me.

    Why is he there? How do you manage him?

    I understand how fuel feeds the monster, keeping him settled, but his appetite seems to be ever-changing.

    I have already learnt so much, but I am certainly looking forward to learning even more about this dark hole… this Creature from within…

    1. BurntKrispyKeen says:

      Furthermore, what if you didn’t try to keep the Creature imprisoned within these layers? I see how your layers are your protection, your armor… as every narcissist I know reveals their truth once those layers are peeled back like an onion. The traits eventually become obvious, but I’ve yet to see one allow them to all be pulled away.

      I can relate to how you say it feels to be void of fuel as we all seek validation on some level.

      But what if you really didn’t feed him?

      He’s suppressed because he’s fed (right?) … essentially stuck where you keep him hidden, but what if you released him… REALLY released him?

      What if you peeled back every layer of protection?
      Would his core be like in Oz… just a meek wizard behind the curtain?

      This is what has my curiosity so high as I believe behind every narcissist is a wounded soul… just like what lives within the rest of us, some certainly more wounded than others. But no one makes it out of here without feeling at least some discomfort along the way.

      Perhaps we each simply choose, after nature has made her stamp, of course… just how we build those layers of protection? Some build theirs without requiring much up-keep and are often very contented within their existence…. But what if under all those varying layers, we are basically all the same?

      Would that be viewed as an insult?

      I think I understand the need for fuel and the rage that follows when the supply runs dry. We all have our moments where we try to suppress the beast within and seek comfort from our fellow man, but what if you didn’t?

      What if you took a sabbatical, so to speak?

      Not to sound facetious, but something along the lines of an isolated (upscale, of course) spa, or say… time with the monks… a respite of sorts from the search for fuel?

      Would you perish?

      No.

      (I can see that you’d be sorely missed, however, so you could still blog to further aid your journey and to keep us updated as you are like “therapy” for many of us.. and I am being hypothetical… so please stick with me…)

      I appreciate that you prefer your current way of being, that it works for you in many ways. And it does! But I simply wonder if this condition COULD be resolved with solid therapy and a concerted effort between the narcissist and his doctors?

      Essentially, would it be possible to train the Creature to survive on less fuel, so he no longer stays so hungry? I know it would be a painful process, but do you think it’s possible that by not stuffing him full, he could find his way to freedom?

      If you don’t post this, I understand. But I’d love to know? I can’t help but get the sensation that there is so much more for you… that your unique talents, while bring properly utilized here… well, it just serms that your special gifts would be further enjoyed and utilized and would proliferate if the Creature had less control…..?

      Sweet Jesus… I know I need to stop trying to fix people. And I am fully aware that I need plenty of work myself. I do.

      So forgive me HG, but you’re my only shot to know, so I had to ask?

      Regardless….

      1. HG Tudor says:

        It is an ongoing process. Let us see what happens, there is more to report on this in due course. I appreciate your kind intentions.

    2. BurntKrispyKeen says:

      Fascinating subject; great read.

  12. Luna says:

    I believe there is something besides the Creature in that Black Hole. In fact, something the Creature is actually protecting. I propose hypnotherapy as a possible way to find out who/what might be behind the Creature. It’s a terrifying prospect, but aren’t you curious? Don’t you want to be free from the Creature’s shackles?

  13. gabbanzobean says:

    This is incredibly deep, HG. And very helpful for me as I continue to read and understand.

    In the beginning when I would explain to others how I felt about Mr. Piano Recital one of the things I recall saying was “It’s like I am seeing a male version of myself because we have so much in common”. The similarities, the things in common, him finishing my thoughts and sentences (either typed or spoken), etc. This never happened to me before. Sure I’d have one or two things in common with someone else but never this much with someone or on that magnitude. Anyway, this mirroring thing definitely makes more sense now. That was all it was. Mirroring. Not real.

    And to make things more eerie, he used to say “My name is (Piano recital) and I love you and I am goddamned real”.

    If you mirror someone then you are not real….you are fake. HG, if someone were to accuse you or tell you “you are not real” would it wound you? I wonder why would he always have to remind me that he is (was) real. Like I envision this creature you describe saying something to him like “Yeah hi Piano recital…you are not real!!!!!”. And he says “Yes I am real”.

    This reminds me of my mother (who I do not think is a narc but has some of the narc qualities you describe) used to always say “I was a good mother” (despite being anything but that).

    1. HG Tudor says:

      Yes it would wound me as they would be attacking my superiority.

      1. Twilight says:

        Would it wound you if you knew one could see your true self and the self you present to the world?
        Could see the part that you buried to survive?

        1. HG Tudor says:

          But nobody can, so it would not wound, Twilight.

          1. Twilight says:

            HG. You never know until you discover something or someone, until that moment I do understand they or that does not exist.

  14. patrizia says:

    Certainly, and then I ask myself : didn’t his 83 yr old dad tell me through his simple words that his 52 yr okd son “was strange”!
    What a mess I made of myself, believing him and chasing him to his new workplaces. I acted as a good wife who cared, nurtured him, loved him …..little I knew about this hidden Creature!

  15. Mona says:

    It is not easy to make a comment on this topic.

    All I can say at this moment is, that my narc always thought he would know what I liked about him. And he tried to show me that in the beginning. He was so astonished that it was something completely different than he thought. He had made so many efforts to impress me, to seduce me and to fake me with some non-existent qualities, and that all was such an effort by him and I liked or more exactly loved something completely different, which he never had in mind. During the relationship I had no possibility to tell him, because he talked all the time. I said it to him at one of our last meetings. He stared at me – overwhelmed, confused, irritated and astonished…
    No one can save another one. There is no salvation through another living person. This way we have to go all alone.
    I know that I felt different years ago. I had the idea that, if I would find the “right one”, life would become easier. I thought that there had to be someone who would make me happy. Such a huge approach! It is impossible. There is no “other half” who can complete you. It is only the will of two different people to spend a life together with some values that both people share. Anything else is an illusion.
    I will share my thoughts about the void later.
    Nevertheless I see your run from the creature and the fight against the creature as one of the reasons that you cannot be happy. There is really no time to enjoy. If you cannot relax you cannot be happy. The creature dominates all your feelings.
    Be free not to publish this comment, if you want to.

  16. @border says:

    Why your kind is so good with words? Mine could send the most beautiful poems I can think of (off course during hoovering time only). He got excellent imagination as well. He gave me around 20 nick names – and when I finally escaped I told him the most I will miss him were these names. So he send me a document with each name and its meaning. I knew he was a narcissist. I knew it for full two years yet I don’t want to judge him. I am self-diagnosed borderline and people have left me alone for my tantrums. For him my tantrums were fuel so we developed a kind of symbiotic relationship. Despite being borderline, I have extra empathy when not under anxiety conditions. So in both situations (anxiety and no anxiety) he was gaining his fuel. But then I had to escape. Being borderline I left relationship when I see the end coming, I saw it coming and I left him. He now claims that I miscalculated thing. He was not planning any discard. I really don’t know. Whenever I try recalling things that were happening, I feel he was planning a discard but the way he is trying to get me back, I sometimes feel he was perhaps just planning another silent treatment and not discard. Confused

    1. HG Tudor says:

      Because they are easy to use and can be purloined from elsewhere.

  17. Tappan Zee says:

    This. Is. My. Mother.
    I SO DO NOT WANT IT TO BE.
    Raging against the truth = my demise.

  18. JenniferJ says:

    To me, this is quite fascinating, especially when explained graphically & in detail like this. It makes me wonder if such fearful thoughts ever give rise to more rational thoughts that such inner turmoil isn’t actually real and that the anxiety of being dragged into the void by the creature is an irrational fear that can be overcome, perhaps with focus & cognitive thinking. I wonder if parallel thoughts that attempt to quell the fears ever arise internally in such individuals? Maybe not in lessers and mid-rangers, but perhaps in greaters?

  19. Natalie says:

    Is it safe to assume that this is where the tremendous fear of death comes in to play?Every narcissist that I know has a crippling fear of death and the afterlife..

    1. HG Tudor says:

      No. I have no fear of death and there is no afterlife, when you die it is over.

      1. BurntKrispyKeen says:

        No doubt, we will learn more and more about the make-up of our brains. Science is remarkable in that way.

        This sounds exactly like the man I was involved with. He seemed to have a very practical approach on death, which threw me off as other narcissists I know do appear to have fear of dying, or at least the manner in how the end will occur.

        My fellow was also not a believer, even though he would act as if he did when it suited him to do so. When I questioned him in private, at best I could conclude he was agnostic.

        I’ve just always been a believer. And that stance has given me great guidance and a tremendous amount of comfort throughout my life.

        But with some experts claiming to have discovered a so-called “God gene” one has to wonder just how differently our brains are wired, especially considering empathetic vs. narcissistic tendencies?

        So many differences… yet so many similarities between narcissists.

        No dreams and now this!

      2. Twilight says:

        To fear can be a death in itself….

        Death is just a beginning, and if there is an afterlife one only knows once they are dead

      3. Yolo says:

        H.G.

        When you die…life begins….Our shells is gone but we will live on.

        1. HG Tudor says:

          How?

      4. narc affair says:

        I agree yolo! There are differing views on life after death but i believe we go on. We dont just disappear. Whether thats reincarnation or in a different spiritual realm that im not sure but ive had too many things ive witnessed to believe we just die and thats it.

        1. HG Tudor says:

          Elaborate please.

      5. narc affair says:

        Hi HG…im not sure if you wanted me or yolo or both to elaborate but ill give you a few examples why i believe life after death but in the end its a personal belief and i dont wish to sway anyone either way.

        Ive worked around terminally ill people and have had family close to me near death and have witnessed many things. One prominent occurance is how many near their time of death have seen their loved ones and spoken of them in great detail. As theyve passed ive heard them reaching for and talking to such passed on relatives.
        As far as near death ive heard many stories of this happening with proof that cant be denied.
        One story which ill have to get the name of the book cant remember offhand but this boy went into a coma for many months. When he awoke he had a story to tell of this young girl that took him on a journey he even knew her name. It turns out she was his biological sister who he never knew about as he was adopted. He knew her name and what she looked like as well as the fact she was his sister. He had no knowledge of any of this.
        Myself personally ive had many “signs” from people who have passed on. Many will think that a bunch of hocus pocus but i know it to be what it is.
        Then theres my faith and i do have faith in the afterlife.

        1. HG Tudor says:

          Hello NA, thank you for expanding. It will not surprise you that I remain unconvinced by what you have detailed. I do not regard this as credible evidence concerning an afterlife. Naturally, you are entitled to draw your own view from what you have witnessed. I was interested to know what evidence formed your belief and you have kindly answered that and thus this closes the matter before anybody else turns this into an afterlife debate as that is not relevant.

      6. Nuit Étoilée says:

        This is not to replace others’ thoughts but I love it when you show your curiosity & I’d like to put in my two cents –

        To me I think in terms of physics – matter is not destroyed, so I think in terms of energy.. I don’t think our energy ceases.. so yes.. reincarnation? Maybe..? Or some other dimension that our human senses cannot perceive? Energy is all around us and we’ve only begun being able to measure it in a scientific way.. who knows what the future holds in terms of understanding life and consciousness..

        What is life? How do we know something is alive? The physical, tangible vessel ceases to hold that presence that makes it alive.. where does it go? I think for now that is a secret of the universe.. and one my feeble brain has yet to comprehend.

        I’m curious on others’ interpretations, and yours, HG 🙂

        1. HG Tudor says:

          The conservation of energy has an attraction to some because

          a. It applies a logical law of physics ; and
          b. It accords with any people’s desire that death is not the end so they can find some comfort from that.

          Thus, if you apply the principle of the conservation of energy, when you die, the potential energy in your body becomes that which causes the breakdown of the body through decomposition and then that energy transfers to the maggots that eat you.

          Question answered. Line drawn on afterlife observations as already stated.

      7. Biblically you are correct sir. Genesis 3:19, Ecclesiastes 9:5,6

        1. HG Tudor says:

          I’m obliged, even God agrees with me.

          1. You are his right hand man after all!

          2. HG Tudor says:

            Other way around.

          3. Trouble Maker 💙

      8. narc affair says:

        Ty for your reply HG and i respect your beliefs and everyone elses. I never try to convince anyone to believe what i do bc thats a very personal stance.
        I do want to say that i think most if not all narcissists except holy ones(they act like they are) are athiests and im not surprised for two reasons. One .. the ego. A narcissist is his own god and no one is higher than their ego. Two…to be held accountable in the afterlife is something they will never agree with and it goes with the whole lack of accountability. They deny any accountability
        Religion is a farce to most narcissists ive met. I wont say i believe fully in the whole organized religion but at its core i do believe in a god and an afterlife what that is im not fully sure.

        1. HG Tudor says:

          I understand your stance. Logic tells me there is no afterlife. I also accept it accords with the way I am. Thus doubly it is correct.

        2. windstorm says:

          NarcAffair
          I agree that most narcs as agnostic at best. I was surprised to learn years ago that one of the hardest step in the AA 12 step program was for alcoholic narcs to acknowledge that there was a power higher than themselves that could restore them to sanity. Once they actually accept this, I think that they are a lot less abusive to those around them.

      9. Natalie Black says:

        Do I remember correctly that it is somehow a criticism to you? I may want to brush up on your article, “Death and the Narcissist”…

    2. Kara Harris says:

      Mine was scared too

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