House of Discards




The discard. The end of the road, or so you might think. I have mentioned previously that I am of the view that the cessation of our current involvement with you would be better regarded as a dis-engagement because it is temporary in nature. When we bring the current relationship to a halt and there are many ways we achieve this, we will, at some point, return ready to hoover and therefore the discard is really a temporary act unless there is some intervening act. Nevertheless, I will continue to use discard in this article because it is common parlance in the narcissistic debate and it is faster to type than dis-engage. The act of discarding you can occur in many ways but they belong to one of the five houses of discarding. Whilst we are creatures of economy and conservation of our energy and thus exhibit repeated and patterned behaviours, we are not so intransigent as to adopt differing methods of discard should the occasion merit it. Those differences may manifest from victim to victim or you may find yourself on the receiving end of several variants of discards from our kind. Whatever they may be, you will find the method used will belong to one of these five houses.

  1. The Vanishing Act

Probably the most popular form of discard. As far as you were concerned we were both in a relationship. Admittedly, matters had been difficult if not downright awful for some time, punctuated with periods of respite, but now we have just vanished. You cannot get in contact with us. You have rung our number and if it has not been changed or you have been blocked, it has just rung and rung. You have left repeated voicemails asking where we are, each more fraught that the one before it. Your texts have filled up our inboxes. Enquiries of friends have proven fruitless. Your calls have always been held up by the switchboard or a secretary at work and you have seen neither hide nor hair of us. The days accumulate and there is just a void. This discard is a massive silent treatment. It will take you some time before you realise that you have been discarded and often this comes by way of inference and implication. You are not told to your face or in a message that it has ended. Instead you learnt that we have been seen with someone else in a romantic clinch in a bar or walking down the road. You keep trying to obtain answers but they are not forthcoming. It is bewildering upsetting and hurtful. It is all by design.

You may interpret this form of discard as appearing cowardly on our part, that we could not even face telling you that it was over. It is nothing to do with cowardice. This method of discard happens for the following reasons: –

  1. We are utterly infatuated with the new primary source which we have ensnared so she is all that matters and you are reduced to an afterthought purely for sucking the last few drops of fuel from, before we delete you;
  2. We draw one last burst of fuel from your frenetic attempts to contact us. We may see your messages, we may listen to your voicemails and we may even watch you desperately knocking at our door as we peek through the blinds. This all provides us with fuel. Even if we do not witness your attempts to contact us, we still draw fuel from knowing how you will have reacted to this callous act. Once we have drawn this fuel we then forget about you (until it is time to hoover) which makes the silent treatment that this form of discard is, easier to elongate;
  3. The manner in which it is utilised is designed to annoy and upset. You are made to feel worthless. You did not even merit an explanation. We see no reason to provide one to you. You are worthless in our eyes;
  4. It reinforces our idea of omnipotence. You are a chess piece which is picked up and moved round the board and we decide when and where you move.
  1. The Savage Strike

This is where you are told that it is at an end. There can be no doubt in your mind with this particular discard, compared to the Vanishing Act. You are told in no uncertain terms that it is over and you are told precisely why we have decided that it is over.

“I am sick of the sight of you. You are pathetic and I realised I cannot be with someone like you.”

“You are selfish. I do so much for you, yet you never think about me.”

“You think more of the children than you do of me.”

“You have put weight on. I am repulsed by you actually.”

“You don’t make any effort anymore. You dress down, never do anything and I hate it when a bitch lets herself slide.”

“You are a parasite and I cannot stand you taking from me any longer.”

These are but a selection of the horrible and harsh words that will be thrown in your direction. You will be the one to blame for the demise of the relationship. We have been forced to take this action and now we hate you for it. We will insult you, label you and lash out with a verbal tirade. Very little of this will be based on a foundation of truth, but this will not stop us. This approach is adopted for the following reasons: –

  1. To obtain fuel from you by making you upset and angry, hurt and fearful.
  2. To identify things which are wrong with you so that you obsess about them. This undermines your confidence and means you will struggle (along with everything else) to move forward which makes hoovering you easier.
  3. If you make changes based on our insults, then when we hoover, we will see this as underlining our power because you have acted on what we have said.
  4. There may even be some early triangulation by us comparing you to the new primary source if we decide to twist the knife and tell you that we are leaving you for someone else.
  1. The Wedge

This discard is so-called because it is designed to keep the door well and truly open for our return and an easy hoover at some future juncture. It lacks the viciousness of the Savage Strike but also applies doubt in the same way as the Vanishing Act but you will at least know why (or at least you will be given some suggestion as to why it is at an end). Expect to hear comments such as: –

“I need some space.”

“I have a lot on and I need time to deal with those other things.”

“I am not sure what I want at the moment.”

“I need time apart to figure a few things out.”

We will not point to anything specific but instead we will rely on amorphous and vague observations all revolving around needing time and space. The ideas behind this form of discard are as follows: –

  1. It makes us seem like some kind of deep troubled soul which is both intriguing (so it keeps your interest) and draws sympathy (fuel);
  2. It keeps you hanging on because we make it sound temporary in nature. We just need time to work things out (chase down the new primary source) and therefore you are given the hope that we will come back;
  3. It creates doubt and confusion so you will not move forward but instead you will hang around waiting for our return;
  4. You will keep trying to “check in” with us during this discard period which will give us further fuel and allow us to triangulate you (“she is just a friend who is helping me gain perspective”).


  1. The Golden Wedge


As above but you actually receive a host of back-handed compliments as part of the leaving speech.

“You have been nothing but good for me, but sometimes it is too much so I need a break.”

“You have done more than most, but even that has not been enough and I just some time to figure things out.”

“You are wonderful, wonderful in so many ways. I love you, but I am not in love with you, so I need to be apart until I get that feeling back.”

“Nobody is as special as you are but even then it is too much for someone like me and I need to stand back and decide what I need before moving forward. I know you will understand, you always do.”

Akin to the Wedge this is designed to: –

  1. Have you think we are still wonderful because we have been so complimentary about you even though we are ending the relationship. Fuel will be forthcoming;
  2. Sow doubt. If you are so good, why are we sending it? Vague and amorphous answers once again follow to keep you hanging on;
  3. The terms of departure are as amicable as possible meaning that the eventual hoover is very easy;
  4. You retain hope and keep “checking in” during the period of discard. We gain fuel.
  5. Our façade is maintained

5 The False Discard


This is not intended to be a discard although if that does actually happen (although it is rare) we will still manipulate the situation so that it turns out to be a win for us. We will appear earnest and upset as we trot out such comments as: –

“This isn’t working is it? I can see I am hurting you. Perhaps you should end it?”

“Just let me go, please.”

“I am not good enough for you. Please, do the right thing and end it.”

“We’ve taken this as far as we can. It has been wonderful but I think you should draw a line under it, don’t you?”

“Please, just put me out of my misery. I cannot do this to you anymore.”

The intention is to cause you to be alarmed at the suggestion that this should end and therefore you will pour fuel our way with your upset and concern. It allows us to assert more control as we extort from you, your additional submission and obedience as conditions for us staying. Accordingly, we make you upset and anxious before agreeing to continue. We have gained fuel, gained new concessions from you, gained further fuel from your relief but also sowed seeds of doubt which will keep you on your toes going forward.

If in the rare event that you do what we want, we still win. We will have a new primary source waiting as a contingency and then we can tell all and sundry that you ended the relationship. This means we can seek sympathy from other sources, cast you as the villain (assisting our smear campaign) and engaging with the new primary source in the knowledge that you ended it so we are free to choose who we want to be with (conveniently forgetting that we of course had them already lined up and we pressed your finger on the trigger which killed the relationship).

73 thoughts on “House of Discards

  1. Gypsy-feet says:

    H.G is it possible to layer these discards over each other?

    I feel like my ex gave me a mixture of the false discard, followed by the brutal strike, washed down with a golden wedge!

    When our relationship started to sour he withdrew. Would never discuss the issues and made lame excuses about being sorry he was such a “dud Husband” then after I gave up work to stay home with the kids (which he asked me to do) he treated me like a financial burden and withhold money. I had no access to stuff for me and the kids. I feel like he was too cowardly to call it off so he pushed and pushed and got meaner and meaner till I couldn’t take it anymore and plotted my escape. It took 8 months of planning. I was on anti depressants and anti anxiety meds by the time I left.

    Then once I did, he cut me off brutal. Got a new girlfriend 2 weeks later (who he tried very hard to triangulate with by constantly telling me things about the New Primary source.
    No feelings about the relationship, or me. No sadness or consideration to the 10 years of marriage we’d had. Just cold as ice. But we have kids together so then I get the “I just really want you to be happy, you so deserve it, and I just want the best co-parenting relationship with you I can. “

    1. HG Tudor says:


  2. Anonymous says:

    Why would a Narc discard a supply that has only been intimate with them for another woman? Doesnt the narc value this?

    1. HG Tudor says:

      See the article about why we disengage.

  3. Beloved says:

    I was given a golden wedge and a vanishing act. I sense the new person ….she’s vegan….lol…I just know that somehow. It pisses me off that he is leaving the door open for a return visit. That door will be very firmly buddy. Esp since it will be the “one true love” angle….He used to play romantic movies for me. It felt incredibly awkward at the time…and unnatural. Now I know he was planting a seed….of the one true love you have- lose- and then reconnect with. But he was NOT my one true love since the man cannot love. I’m fighting the head over heart battle….sooooo hard and my emotions are just churning.

    Now when men reach out to me- I suspect them of being the same….

  4. Beloved says:

    The discard was out of the blue and stunning. Only afterwards did all of the little pieces, hints and incongruities piece together. Disturbingly, I spent a lot of time talking to him about narcissism and my desire to create a coaching biz for survivors. He created the most perfect mask however….and when I saw under it….I attributed it to the wrong cause. I thought he was working hard to keep me….he was….but for evil reasons….I hate that I miss the mask and the false persona. I hate that I am suffering over what was emotional rape and a con. I hate that I accepted so much flattery….”You’re the most beautiful woman I’ve ever dated…..I’ve never been more fulfilled in a relationship….” “You’re smarter than me but I’m ok with that.’ You are the best human being I’ve ever met in my life.” (Because I have a giving job with a difficult population). The only consolation….that I CAN love….I am a great partner…..he defrauded me of love…but you can only steal what is valuable and what you know on your own merit you can never actually obtain. On his own merit, the real man….I wouldn’t have allowed him to come near me with a 10 foot pole. Only with a mask and lie was he allowed into my world.

    He also chose his path. He could have been good. Merciful. Kind. Humane. He chose to be sadistic and evil after I was only good to him.

    I have to turn off my pity- even now – about his black heart and lack of love….and pity that any human being could be so dark….

    I am comforted in knowing that I will survive this pain and have wisdom, not brokenness. He, on the other hand….may have “won” in his disturbed mind but he also can’t change.

  5. Heidi says:

    We all need healing! HG even is showing he needs healing by sharing with all of us. Giving lots of insight as I stated before I have found this group to be most helpful. Can a narcissist heal we may never know, “expect the worse, hope for the best” NPD is certainly a diagnosis that is very scary and just not enough research HG is doing an awesome job with the materials he provides( don’t let go to your head 🙂 )
    Everyone here has dealt the NPD, and we’ve all handled it the same but different. Meeting evil with evil has gotten most no where, best I can say or do is NO CONTACT no matter what! I will admit today has been very hard I just have an Erie feeling my ex is hurt or something is very wrong, not because I’ve checked on him or stalked him, this is going to sound nuts but I swear I can feel it. Very hard to not send an “are you ok” message, I keep reminding myself that he left as I came home from hospital w blood clots, it’s not that I don’t care, he simply does not need to know I care… I don’t want him to suffer, and simply want peace within myself! NPD are people too, as nasty and dark as they can be they need help, while us empaths heal and get stronger daily.. starts w us finding a happy place and live happy, dance and know do good no matter how much might do you bad! No contact is not bad it’s us being good to us!

    1. windstorm says:

      You said you have a feeling that something is wrong with your ex. I get feelings like that from people I care about fairly often. With mine, I feel emotion (or maybe energy) – like to feel he is worried, upset or frightened about something or in some kind of pain.

      Based on my own experiences, I’d say don’t worry about him. Even if the feeling was genuine, he most likely is upset about something trivial, like not getting something he wanted at the store or sitting around feeling sorry for himself. Even if you sense he is in pain, it could be as simple as he stubbed his toe and has gone into a self-pitying mental rant about how unfair life is to him. He could be mentally broadcasting memories of every way he’s accidentally hurt himself in the last two years.

      Narcs are resilient. He’ll get out and find plenty of fuel if he needs it.

  6. Heidi says:

    SMH agreed! I do not think my ex is horrible i believe he has had some horrible life experiences that have caused trauma which has led to be where he is. Hence why I find it important to learn and grow my knowledge of this diagnosis. Trauma, is something we each deal with differently and one can either work through it and learn coping skills while others bottle it up and hold onto to it, and it comes out in other ways. We all dance to a different sheet of music, some can be cruel and nasty to those who hurt us, while some seek to forgive to find peace in the situation. “I forgive you, I will never hold the hurts you caused me against you, and I will always advocate what is good and right for you” never forgiving only holds us back. Does this mean I want him back no but I do wish him well and to seek whatever help he can to become the best version of himself going forward! No sense in both being ugly fighting evil with evil cannot win! Tough love against evil yes! Including walking away w a clear head and healing mind!

    1. windstorm says:

      I really like your post. I have a hard time with, “I forgive you, I will never hold the hurts you caused me against you,“. I struggle with that one, but hopefully I will eventually get there. 😊

    2. SMH says:

      Well put, Heidi. I like the idea of tough love and I did advocate what was best for him. I told him over and over that he had a good thing with IPPS, that he needed the stability and structure that his family life provided, that I could never give that to him, etc. I did recognize what he needed but to him I was fuel and I find that part hard to forgive. I walked away but not with a clear head and a healing mind. Only now am I getting there…

  7. Empress1 says:

    I am not sure- but I think— When you are amazing, feel amazing and do not react to them with ‘fuel’– They are bored with you and realize the gig is up and will finally leave you alone! I wish I knew this secret weapon years ago! Be happy, be confident, be wonderful, date, smile at them and just not give a damn, I think they can feel the energy you have and back off, even the Uppers! Just my opinion- HG, is this a way to rid yourself of one? I think I finally won!

  8. Heidi says:

    For the record, I want to have a better understanding most the material online I have found is decent but I can go to anyone of those sites and see the same bashing. Clearly someone w this disorder has suffered trauma, I don’t have the answers but to re-traumatize a person w this disorder and bash them call it fuel but it’s hate. Knowledge is power and the more I can learn the better I can understand!! Folks w this disorder are people too. Yes I’m an empathe gets me in trouble so spare me the name calling please. I have had enough of such

    1. Empress1 says:

      Heidi, sorry but I think you may still be in the denial stage. We all have been there- sadly you may want to come back here after you have spent more time with your narc, then you may understand what you call ‘bashing’. THEY, the narcs, cannot get better with more love and attention, however, I can see you are not at that stage yet! Wishing you the very best in your journey and we will still be here when you are ready.

      1. Heidi says:

        Emoress1 no apologies needed! Not sure what or how you may have perceived my comment. Believe you me I’m done!! The pattern of return is what I fear maybe I should have stated that a bit more clearly. I have a child that is not my ex’s child but my ex NPD uses my child to get at me hence why I asked to make sure I’m making myself and child safe from a return. As well, due to my profession I’m aware of trauma and understand that it can make ones live in terrible ways, does it make them horrible? Who am I to say! Because I mention some bouts of sympathy for the trauma NPD has I’m not ready for this group? Hmm, I do believe that’s for me to decide all while trying to understand not only myself but as well a full circle of understanding of the NPD I don’t think anyone of us wants to ever live the nightmare of being w an NPD. Bashing someone due to a mental condition or putting labels on one makes no one any better than those who battle w NPD. No offense to anyone, knowledge is power and order to understand this illness it’s wise to understand from both sides, hence why this site is set up by someone who admits to NPD and again has been beyond helpful and very insightful! No disrespect to anyone. My personal preference is not to name call or label. NPD is a diagnoses as much as they may behave and treat others as monsters they are still people too! Furthermore, I get it no contact is the only way yet they always return pull our heart strings and I’m simply avoiding such by gaining insight! Thanks

        1. SMH says:

          Heidi, For what it’s worth, I agree with you. I want to be prepared. That doesn’t mean I think my narc is a horrible person. He’s just ill.

  9. Heidi says:

    What does it do when your told “I pronounce you blocked and deleted and this time for good” this was told to me on the day I was diagnosed with blood clots, which the ex had been sweet again for about 3 weeks then this. Prior to being told this I did mention to him after being yelled at that “he knew where he stood since I didn’t call him directly from the hospital” a family member did, i then confronted him about a post he had made bashing me. I changed my phone number a phone number I have had for 15 years. Is he really done? Or is he going to show up? 2 years of getting blocked to one day he leaves blames me for not giving him enough attention, spending too much time w my child sport. Just leaves yet calls me things are good for 3 weeks then the silent mean and hatefulness for about 8-12 days but I’m told “see there’s you go here comes the cycle” it’s exhausting. I’m simply trying to understand from the Narcissit view point. I’ve read all the other bashing websites and am happy to have found this to understand from NPD view point..

    1. HG Tudor says:

      You should organise a consultation so I can receive more information and provide you with an accurate response to this situation.

    2. Lori says:

      I’ve been told he’s done with me many times blocked and unblocked this time it appears as though it permanent but you can be assured it will many times of this before it’s the last

  10. Dude says:

    She went overboard with a particularly biting false discard and it all got really, really weird when I summoned enough self esteem to say “You know what; you’re building a false case against me, and I can see it coming. You’re fired, it’s over.”

    I think everyone in town was surprised. Needless to say she was screwing a mutual friend within a month of breaking off a 5-year relationship. Fuel Uber Alles!

  11. Caroline says:

    He talks more about time and space than Dr Who!

    1. Caroline says:

      Sorry, should read #3, not 5

  12. Caroline says:

    Scene, a cafe.
    Caroline sits with large latte in glass. Phone in hand, she is laughing at hilarious posts of her fellow empaths on
    A waitress puts a couple of plates down in front of her.” Here’s your word salad and wedge of depression pie. Compliments of that man beating a hasty retreat.”
    Exit waitress.

    Caroline looks confused.
    “Wait ! This isn’t what I ordered!”

    1. windstorm says:


      1. Caroline says:


  13. Pale Horse says:

    I received The Wedge with a little Golden mixed in with it. ” I need my own life…my own identity…my own interests” Really???? Then what the hell have you been doing for the past nine years because it seems that you had all that and more Ex-N????

    1. Caroline says:

      Pale Horse
      Sounds like an unwinnable conversation. How exasperating and painful for you.

      1. Pale Horse says:

        To say the least. At that point, it was just too much to sift through. Thus, it was adios (for now as HG likes to profess).

      2. Pale Horse says:

        Plus, at that time it was too much too process. I mean, where would I even begin with that. I am turning another corner though. Do not think of her as often and when I do, it’s less emotional than in the past. Which for me is strange. Typically, I don’t get over relationship breakups for about two to three years.

        1. MB says:

          Two years is my number for broken heart healing too, Pale Horse. I think it’s common although it’s an awfully long time.

          1. Pale Horse says:

            See, more in common! Two years is long but less than the years of torment most of us have endured (if you don’t consider healing time torment).

          2. MB says:

            Yes, it’s around the two year mark that the realization comes that I haven’t thought about him in a bit and when I do, it doesn’t hurt the same.

            Are you American? If you’ve said, I missed it.

          3. Pale Horse says:

            Yes, I am.

          4. Pale Horse says:

            How about you?

          5. MB says:

            I’m American too. A southern belle. I don’t think HG minds because I’ve said before on here I’m in N.C. (not to be confused with No Contact)

          6. Pale Horse says:

            I’m in CT.

        2. SMH says:

          Pale Horse, I was over my L in three months! It was not because I knew what he was at that point. It was because I met MR! That is why I will always have a soft spot for MR. He yanked me right out of my funk. Some people here do not understand how I could think anything good of him, but the truth is that I do. I was way more attached to MR than to L, maybe because I am a super empath and MR was a better match for me. I think back on those years with L as me drowning and trying to beak through the surface. MR pulled me right out of the water. Sometimes it takes someone else to get you past that hump…someone who brings out parts of you that you had forgotten about or never knew you had.

          1. Pale Horse says:

            I will concede that my ex-n gave me the resources needed to better my life and I have done such. Although she has caused me great pain, I will always give her credit for that. I do not believe I would have accomplished as much as I have in the past ten years without such. However, there came a time where she became more of a hindrance than an asset. When I look back at the past year, I cannot believe I was able to finish my graduate program but I did!

          2. SMH says:

            Good for you! I find that these sorts of stresses help me to concentrate on work. Seems I cannot do two things at once!

      3. Caroline says:

        Pale Horse
        I understand what you’ve said.
        There is such a mountain of issues and then they bring in a truckload of irrelevancies, and then there’s the tsunami of disrespect…
        Where do you start?
        Add that to all the other unresolved stuff from x-number of arguments ago…
        You’ve done well to get through this far.

        I need more comedy in my life at present. I’m in an intense headspace. I’ve been binge watching ‘Raised By Wolves’ today, and gone for a long walk.
        What’s working for you to decompress?

        1. Pale Horse says:

          For me, running has become an essential part of my day. It allows me to clear my head and expend energy. I have recently joined a gym and been doing some weight work. Also, I read…a lot. The hardest part is that I used to do much more but in order to get out, I had to give her everything in our divorce. Thus, I do not have many of the resources I had to decompress. I’m making it work though. Additionally, some of the activities I used to participate in remind me too much of her and I have had to give them up for now. What have you found to be beneficial to your well being?

  14. Ugotit says:

    I have been great thanks for asking going to the gym everyday lost 20 pounds I’ve also been in a new relationship that’s going well so far and haven’t talked to the narcissist in months and this time finally have not been thinking about him or checking his social media have no desire to but last night I accidentally had a ten second internet exchange with him ( long story) but in just those ten seconds I experienced such evil and cruelty which took me by suprise how bad it was cuz I had been away for so long and made it so clear to me what an evil monster he was all along

    1. Insatiable Learner says:

      I am very glad to hear you are doing so well, Ugotit! Very happy for you! Wishing you continued healing, peace, and joy!

  15. Jane hall says:

    Had a false discard years ago . He was devastated when I left the home and went back to live with family. He hoovered me up practically in weeks.

    NC for 6 months.

    He has tried to hoover me. He told our Daughter that he missed me every day and make sure you tell mum.

    Its all rubbish.

    This last time he went. And I am proud that I have gone 6 months without seeing him or even speaking with him. He has made his bed and he can now sleep on it. No way back.

  16. Fuel on the Shelf says:

    I experienced bits and pieces of almost all of these except the savage strike.

    After a “vanishing act” he once told me his phone broke and he ‘lost all his numbers added to his phone since February 2016″ (ironically the month we began talking…WHAT a coincidence!)

    I’ve had plenty of regular wedges AND golden wedges. Yawn!

    However what really chaps my ass is the last one, #5, the false discard. This one was really a mindfuck.

    “You need to be rid of me” – He said that quite frequently. Also… “I am not cutting the cord but YOU will force the cutting of the cord”. With this he would often threaten to block me if I reached out before such and such a time. I would call his bluff and reach out and he never did block me.

    He wanted me to cast him aside yet he never wanted me to do that.

    There were a few times where I did as he asked and I left him alone. He always came back around and reached out rather quickly. Always. I often joked he had a “6th sense” and knew when I would plan to shut down and not talk to him because surprise surprise! He would then reach out and pull me back in!

    I am still going through the motions of making the pleasantries. He owes me money and I want it repaid. With all the articles I have read here about money, I am not too confident I will get the money back.

    Hey there is always the chance to send him an invoice via Pay Pal and CC his wife on it!

    1. Venus says:

      Fuel on the shelf. Funny ‘via Pay Pal and CC his wife’!! In my humble opinion? Forget the money. I set myself up for contact to get the money back I lent my ex N. This was before I found this site.He texted me to meet him and he didn’t have my money. Only then did I come to the realization how dangerous he really is. I decided to chalk it off as experience. I don’t and won’t lend money again. “Neither a lender nor borrower be.”
      Looking back for clarity, in my heart I did want to see him. I don’t have to look back anymore.

      1. NarcAngel says:

        When people are approached for money, they should switch out ‘borrow’ and ‘loan’ to ‘give’ and ‘gift’ in their mind because youll likely never see that money again. If a man asked me for money he’d be gone in an instant because that is indicative of a man who has no pride or shame (not to mention money lol) and is likely a con. Huge red flag.

        1. windstorm says:

          That’s very true. I have a current ongoing problem of trying to get back money I loaned to one of my narc sons. I know better than to go to my exhusband about this, because I know exactly how he feels. He’s always said that when you loan money to a narc, “loan” is a euphemism for “give”. That you should never even think about trying to get any of the money back, that you should just say “goodbye forever” to your money when you give it to them. Any attempts to collect it will just entangle you in “crazy,” 😕

          1. Fuel on the Shelf says:

            When he was pleading his case for the money he said to me “I hope that you believe in your heart and with metaphorical certitude that I will repay you…” and then “I promise I will not let you down”.

            Don’t the words “metaphorical” and “certitude” sort of cancel one another out? The certainty of him repaying me is a metaphor? What the hell does that even mean?

            The deadline he promised to repay it by is next Monday. Is it sad that part of me thinks that he will repay it? Yet everything I read here says otherwise.

    2. Supernova DE says:

      Haven’t seen you comment much hope you are doing well! You sound more detached, and strong. Good for you.

      Mine also knew when to Hoover or love bomb a little to keep me from shutting down. They have that instinct, even when they can’t see your face from a distance. But he would initiate all contact for a while, then shelve or wedge discard as punishment for making him put out the effort and to maintain the upper hand. Predictable.

      I also got the wedges “I need to concentrate on my family for a while.” “I’m not cutting you off, just stopping the online erotica.” “I’m going to concentrate on my wife, it’s simpler.” Um, yea, that IS simpler cause I’m a grade A pain in your ass, asking for honesty, respect, and orgasms.

      The last one was a false discard when I said I had to cut it off “sigh, maybe that’s best, I really don’t have my life figured out.” I expressed disappointment that he wouldn’t fight for me, but I was still leaving. That really irritated him and then he started blocking.

      Amazing how they’re all the same.

      1. Fuel on the Shelf says:

        Hi Supernova,
        I received similar wedges of him wanting to concentrate on his family, specifically his daughter. He never really mentions his wife to me. If I try and text or call it is….”I am having dinner with my daughter” or “My daughter and I are at the movies” ….

        Once in awhile I get… “Please do not text me tonight, once in awhile my wife handles my phone and I do not want her to see your messages and start asking questions of who you are”

        When you say,
        “They have that instinct, even when they can’t see your face from a distance. But he would initiate all contact for a while, then shelve or wedge discard as punishment for making him put out the effort and to maintain the upper hand. Predictable.”

        Oh my Gawd….yes! He shelves and then I back off and then he comes back, showers me with attention again. Then the flood gates open and once I am reaching out again….SILENCE! Yesterday I was “Call you tomorrow?” and he says “Maybe…” I sarcastically said “Maybe has historically meant NO. Anyway I will call you tomorrow and you better answer!” When I called next day his phone did not even ring. It went right to voice mail and my texts went ignored. I have backed off again but I am sure next week he will be reappearing again. It really is predictable.

      2. Supernova DE says:

        You’d think they’d realize that the effort of going through that cycle, and having to love bomb/shower with affection repeatedly, is much more taxing on them than just being steady and true…. but HG doesn’t lie when he says they love the drama. They cycle for a reason, we are the ones that want the steadiness, not them.
        But I do wonder if it is the Mid rangers that act this way, and if the Greaters temper things better to conserve energy…but I don’t know.

        My cycles are exactly as you describe as well. I’d play it cool for quite a while after he hoovered, having been fed up and angry with him for a time – I felt him unworthy and he had to re-earn it from me. But he kept at it until he felt me fully thaw…then he’d hit me with the devaluations/ignoring/triangulation/withdrawal of sexual attention.

        Yours is cerebral? MMRN or UMRN?

        1. Fuel on the Shelf says:

          There has been some speculated debate about that along with consults from HG. General consensus is cerebral, either middle mid range; possibly upper mid.

      3. Fuel on the Shelf says:

        Supernova DE,

        “But he kept at it until he felt me fully thaw…then he’d hit me with the devaluations/ignoring/triangulation/withdrawal of sexual attention.”

        I wanted to address this comment too. And…yes!!!! On point!!! He seems to have a 6th sense of when I back off and avoid him because that is precisely when he comes back around to try and “warm me up” again. Then as soon as he has me, he withdraws again. I told him just the other week “your silence hurts”. And he says, “I am sorry you feel that way but please know that my silence means nothing. Unless I tell you I do not want to talk to you for awhile”. WTF?

        Another comment I made to him after being pushed away/shelved: “It sucks when you keep me at arms length”

        He replies, “My feelings have not changed. I love you. I am always here for you no matter what length I keep you at”

        Again. WTF?

        And lastly when we arranged to have dinner together he says to me “Nothing sexual is happening tonight, you need to know that.”
        Me: “Why? You don’t want me in that way anymore?”
        Him: “Oh I do. But the pendulum swings for me. I go through a cycle where I can compartmentalize my guilt and then I can’t. Right now I can’t.”
        Then it became a pre-lecture of how I cannot “lean over the table to kiss him” or “stew from across the table with a desired look on my face” because he “cannot handle that tonight”. LOL.

        Yeah that was all a contradictory lie as we ended up having sex anyway. And surprise wouldn’t you know….it was way more intense since he “took it away” earlier only to contradict and then engage with me.

        So when you say ignoring and withdrawal of sexual attention (and then doing the opposite in a matter of hours)…right on point!

        1. Supernova DE says:

          I’ve had the same experience with mine talking about his silence.
          “I just get distracted, not talking for a while doesn’t mean I’m angry with you or want things to end!” – Translation: “Woman, will you please just sit on this shelf until I come back and get you without causing me problems!!!”
          “I’m feeling overwhelmed with how much communication you want from me.” – Translation: “Better gear up for this Prior Warning silent treatment!”

          I have no experience with him talking about love, he knew much better than to go there, as I would have run for the hills thinking he might interfere in my marriage in a real way if I heard that from him.
          Mine didn’t try to cut off sex until the very end just prior to dis-engagement, but he would become more mechanical about it, like sending me pics of him using his vibrator instead of participating with me and sexting, etc.

          But I did hear about his ebbs and flows of desire for me, as you describe, as way of avoiding culpability. He also played the tortured soul over his feelings for me, “If I acknowledge them, it will be real, and we’re both married so…”

          1. Fuel on the Shelf says:

            Good grief are they all cut from a similar narc cloth?

            I heard…. “I am sorry I cannot fill the huge gaping void in your life”

            Yeah well he had no problem swooping on in at the beginning and filling it!!!! And now I am on and off a shelf.

            He will also frequently bring up things we have done in the past to illustrate that he “pays enough attention” when he doesn’t feel like making current plans with me.

            Just this week he brought up something that only happened once. And it happened 2 years ago! When I pointed out the ridiculousness he promptly changed the topic.

            But yeah the ebbing and flowing with his sexual desire vs. his tormented soul guilt and shame. I get that all the damn time. If he really felt so guilty he would not quickly contradict.

            I am sure based on what I have read here that this will all be used against me later.

  17. Ugotit says:

    They discard you because u have nothing useful to offer them either they are no longer in need of the benefits you provide or they have another source to provide those benefits then you get to glimpse the true evil that was there all along it’s like they are thinking how dare you fucking exist after I no longer need you evaporate please your sucking up air that I could be using you will see the most grotesque display of evil when you are no longer of service to them

    1. Insatiable Learner says:

      Hello, Ugotit. I was just wondering about you the other day. How have you been?

  18. Blank says:

    After a life full of narcissistic abuse I need some arms to hold me and a voice to tell me everything is going to be alright in the end. And that in the second half of my life I will finally meet someone who really loves me. Where should I look for such a man… outer space? This is how low I’ve gotten. Trying to find comfort on a narcsite. (Hi Mr. Tudor, how are you?)

    1. HG Tudor says:

      You do not look for him, you ensure you avoid the wrong men and the right one will appear naturally.

      1. Blank says:

        Thanks HG, that really sounds comforting x

        1. tigerchelle78 says:

          I’m so sorry you have gotten low, and have suffered from narc abuse throughout your life…. I’m sure many can understand where you are coming from in a similar way. Here is just some suggestions:

          Do not look for another man to love you, approve of you, and somehow make you whole again. (It’s all we kind of know and can become very codependent like that, narcs will stiff that out in you).

          Look for yourself. Search within yourself. Look at what you need to work on, and become whole within yourself. (This will take time).

          Do not wait for Mr Right, as they do not exist. That’s just in fairy tales.

          Do not go onto dating sites, that’s where the narcs all hang out fishing.

          YOU be the voice telling you that everything will be alright. It’s time to look after you and heal.

          There are many wonderful ladies here with experience who can help you find yourself and to not fall into a similar trap. Listen to them.

          I felt your words, because when you’ve been through narc abuse, you can get to a point where you do not even realise what you are like, and how you show up onto a narcs radar, but read Tudor’s books, (as I have been doing), continue learning and taking in knowledge, and you will be alright.

          You will not need a man to tell you these things, because you’ll already know.

          Take care my lovely x

      2. Blank says:

        Thank you Tiger.. you’re sweet.
        I did read all Mr. Tudor’s wise lessons, it’s just that the brain, heart and senses don’t always agree with each other.

        And I find it hard to explore new ways in life. Like you’re waiting for a new opportunity, but nothing is happening. I feel I have to take action, but don’t know where to go or what to do.
        Shortly I have cured from Cushings disease and diabetes (that I got due to very high cortisol levels- causing me to look pregnant) and I’m probably scared to get it again when I’ll put myself in new stressful situations, therefor I avoid people and situations, which I shouldn’t. Just hope I’ll be the daredevil again that I used to be when I was young.
        I haven’t been here for a while and I’ll read all the comments carefully again. Thanks for the advice Tiger xx

      3. MB says:

        That is so sweet HG. Sounds like fatherly type advice. I like it.

    2. Kiki says:

      Aww Blank my heart goes out to you ,I feel your pain I do.
      You are not alone I’m in a very similar position.
      Sometimes I get upset inside looking at loved up couples and happily married women.
      I was married v young ,divorced v young ( even then I was desperate for love) then met up with unsuitable guys nothing serious until the Narc entered my life and practically tore me apart.
      I’m left feeling why why can’t I do something basic like find someone to share my love with.I have a difficult professional job ,I’m highly educated but this means nothing sometimes.
      Maybe this is our path ,I don’t know, we like the Narc have deep unresolved wounds in ourselves I think ,just like the narcs creature.
      We are so desperate for love and validation to keep our own creature away we put up with everything ,it must be a feeling of not being good enough for love that the Universe gives back to us tenfold.
      A man won’t ever take that away , he may mask it soothe it for a while but we have to look deep inside and heal

      1. Blank says:

        Thanks for your comment Kiki. I’m sorry you have this feeling of loneliness too. Being highly educated or being intelligent is often more a curse than a blessing I think. If we would stop thinking so much and act more from our primitive gutfeeling maybe life would be a lot easier. Go with the flow I read all of the time. That is easy, when you’re 22, but once you’re 50 there is no flow to go with. There is a society that says you are old, so we do not give you a job and no job is no money, no house… struggle. What flow?
        I don’t think a man could heal my inner wounds, but I also do not believe that first we need to become happy on our own before we can give happiness to the world, bla bla, all the things they write about these days.
        Recently I read an essay on love and happiness saying we are social animals. We need people around us that love us, that care, that we can love and care about. The interaction with other people, the love, the caring, the validation, that is what makes people happy. We are not happy on our own, all by ourselves. This is a misunderstanding we learned since the 80’s. Being independent in every way. Especially in the US, but in my country also. That’s why so many people are hooked on drugs. It’s a replacement of dope we should naturally get from love and a good laugh and interacting with family, friends, loved ones. I hope you have or will meet good people that you can share your love with Kiki and this is what I hope for myself too xx

        1. MB says:

          Blank, I agree! Life is all about the relationships with people (and dogs 🐶) The times that you share. The memories made. That is what life is made of…moments. That’s what you’ll remember when you lay your head down to die. Not how much money you made or what kind of car you had. Interaction and relationships with humans and other living things is what makes life worth living.

    3. Beloved says:

      ((((HUG))))) You are amazing, lovable and whether a partner tells you that or not -its true. We are all here because we have lived an experience that happens in secret that no one else understands. You are not alone. I also had decades of it….BUT your loving heart will heal one day even if you meet someone in your 80’s. (And those couples are sooo cute. )

  19. SMH says:

    I once got a false discard with some wedge thrown in. But even that was complicated as I had also independently decided that it was over but he wanted to be in control.

    1) He warned me on the way over that he was wearing his wedding ring and I was like huh? Why would I care? (IPSS) I was the OW, after all. It’s not as if I did not know or had even ever looked. Now I think this was a clue that he wanted me to want to be IPPS (this was after I told him I was fine being IPSS). I must have really disappointed him that way.

    2) He did not give me a chance to say anything before he launched into an explanation. After he was done, I said, ‘yeah, I agree. I was going to say that I am leaving for a few months and I don’t want to be in touch while I am away.’ The surprised look on his face – why isn’t she begging and pleading?

    3) He hugs me and tells me he wants to have a drink when I get back. I am incredulous as we have never left my flat apart from the first meeting. Must have been setting me up a hoover attempt just in case.

    4) The whole time I was away I was convinced that he and IPPS were bonding and having a grand old time. I did not break NC. He creeped me online for six months.

    5) Two months after I returned, I broke NC. He said ‘I am cautious’ (because we had been fighting a lot pre-NC). I said, ‘I have been back for two months. I am cautious too.’ Got him again.

    6) He wants the FR back. Once again, I am incredulous but we see each other. It was nice and sweet.

    7) I still said no, so got to discard him.

    HG is right. There is no such thing as a discard in narcworld. I just hope that I can stick to it.

  20. Kiki says:

    I stupidly came across pics of him on the Internet doing a business walk for charity .He looked older , surrounded by his staff of women , I ended up having horrible nightmares about him all night .Why HG is it coming up in dreams now.
    I not do that again.

  21. Claire says:

    I’ve had four out of five! First the false discard (three times), then the golden wedge. Hoovered back then given the wedge. Kept dangling for a few weeks while he secured his new primary (who I knew nothing about), then given the savage strike – he FaceTimed to tell me all about her.

    The whole thing was so confusing. I thought he was confused about his feelings for me and that’s why there was so much push/pull. Turns out it was deliberate manipulation tactics. Thanks for this article HG! It explains it all so well.

    1. HG Tudor says:


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