To Control is to Cope : Narcissism and Its Creation

 

TO-CONTROL-IS-TO-COPE-_-NARCISSISM-AND-ITS-CREATION

To deal with and to address the vagaries of life, human beings have developed coping mechanisms. These coping mechanisms vary in terms of the extent of their use, their impact on the user, the impact on others and the frequency of their deployment. Some coping mechanisms are regarded as ‘healthy’ and others as ‘unhealthy’ and some may be a hybrid of the two, dependent on the extent and duration of usage.

Distancing is a coping mechanism. You may distance yourself from a situation and people, but prolonged and extensive distancing may lead to isolation with the associated problems which such isolation can bring. Short-term distancing can allow recovery, re-charging and avoidance of an ongoing harmful situation. Longer-term distancing which is targeted on one or more chief proponents of harm can lead to near complete removal from toxic and harmful influences. No contact of course is a coping mechanism which incorporates distancing as a central tenet of it and is the most effective coping mechanism to apply with regard to your recovery from ensnarement with our kind.

Crying is another coping mechanism. The release of tension, held-grief, feelings of misery often evaporate as a consequence of somebody crying. You may be told ‘have a good cry, you will feel better’ and indeed many people have testified to the beneficial impact of doing so and thus crying achieves release and often acts as a signal to invite comfort from others. It is a coping mechanism deployed by people to deal with a stressful, worrying or hurtful situation.

Self-harming is a further form of coping. The distraction caused by the painful response of cutting (cutting being just one form of self-harming) enables an individual to relieve the pain of certain other feelings, it achieves a release, a distraction and also enables that individual to exert control in circumstances where they feel unable to exert control (or to the extent that would make them feel comfortable). Self-harming whilst a coping mechanism is regarded as a negative form of a coping mechanism.

Expression of feelings. Being able to ‘talk it out’ and ‘air your feelings’ is a coping mechanism also. The ability to talk to someone else who will just listen, even if they offer nothing in response or even just to talk to yourself about how you are feeling (be it generally or in relation to something specific) enables people to experience a sense of release, a lightening of a particular load and it often brings clarity in terms of understanding themselves and finding a way forward.

There are many coping mechanisms that humans deploy – some are conscious and others occur unconsciously.

Narcissism is one such coping mechanism and it is a powerful and invariably hugely effective, although its effectiveness does depend on the school of the narcissist and which particular outcome one is having regard to. The outcome of our narcissism is something that I shall address in a separate article.

Narcissism must maintain the construct (the false self) and imprison the creature (the true self).  Collectively this is the Self-Defence of the Narcissist. This Self-Defence is achieved through the The Prime Aims(fuel, character traits and residual benefits).

Central to this Self-Defence and the achievement of The Prime Aims is control. The narcissist must at all times have control of his or her environment and the people within that environment which of course includes you. Whether you are a stranger, an acquaintance, a friend, a colleague, a relative or a romantic partner. Whether you are a neighbour, a date, sister or brother, that man from the corner store or fiancée – you come within the fuel matrix of the narcissist and you have to be subjected to the control of the narcissist.

This control has to be exerted second by second of each and every day. Every passing moment must be owned and governed by the narcissist. We must exert control all around us, this has to be complete and total as if the very clouds were tethered by us. Why is that?

Because once upon a time the narcissist did not have control.

That lack of control meant the narcissist felt powerless, weak, vulnerable and exposed.

The combination of a genetic predisposition and the imposition of this lack of control created narcissism as the coping mechanism. These two ingredients combined and gave ‘birth’ to narcissism as a means of coping with the world, with the lack of control that the world causes for individuals. Many people have no issue with this lack of control, others have alternative coping mechanisms and then there is us – the narcissists. Around one in six of the human population of this planet became narcissists in order to cope with this loss of control.

Narcissism allows the imposition of control through manipulation. The imposition of control allows us to achieve the Prime Aims. The achievement of the Prime Aims allows our Self-Defence and thus we survive and we thrive.

Narcissism is a coping mechanism.

People believe that abuse is theingredient in the formation of a narcissist. It is an ingredient, yes, but there are two ingredients in the formation of our kind. The first ingredient is the genetic predisposition, if you will this is the fertile soil which provides the basis for the narcissism to grow and flourish. The second ingredient is the lack of control (of which abuse is part of that lack of control) and this is the ‘seed’ which is placed in the fertile soil of the genetic predisposition and thus narcissism ‘grows’ as the coping mechanism. For some, the soil is there but no seed ever arrives and thus no narcissist. For others, there is no soil but there is the seed, but again with one essential ingredient missing, there can be no narcissism.

Genetic predisposition plus lack of control (at a formative stage of life) equals narcissist.

What does this lack of control (at a formative stage of life – i.e. childhood) look like?

  • Abuse. Whether it is physical, emotional, sexual or psychological, any form of abuse towards us amounts to a lack of control. We could not defend ourselves against the abuse and therefore this is a lack of control, over ourselves and over those who meted out abusive harm towards us. The abuse is an act of commission – we were beaten, molested sexually, told we were useless, insulted etc.
  • Isolated. Whether this was being locked in a cupboard under the stairs, prevented from playing with other children, kept apart from other family members, not allowed to participate in group activities of any nature, given silent treatments and treated as if we did not exist, isolating and ostracising us in some form again constituted a lack of control. We were not able to control our own interactions, someone else did this for us and to our detriment. We were controlled by another and thus lacked control.
  • Neglect. Whilst there may not have been abusive acts of commission , there are abusive acts of omission. Therefore we were not given a safe environment, we were not taught effectively (be it about ‘facts’, relationships, behaviour, responsibility), we were not emotionally supported, we were not fed, clothed or protected, we were not shielded from an abuser of commission and/or we could roam where we wanted. Once again we were denied control over ourselves because we were not provided with the assets, resources and tools to achieve effective control over our lives and this neglect (lack of control) exposed us to hurt, pain, disease, injury, loneliness and/or acts of abuse through commission.
  • The Golden Child. Everything we did was lauded and praised. It was invariably held up as a glowing and shining example of brilliance, even when it was not or the praise was excessive for a valid achievement. This meant we lacked control in the sense of earning achievements in a valid fashion. We had greatness thrust upon us without being ready for it, without having earned it and without appreciating it. Everything came to us too easily and this also amounted to a lack of control. We had no control over the outcome from our endeavours, we felt no compulsion to achieve and apply endeavour because whatever we did (bad, mediocre or good) was met with accolade, praise and the lavishing of ‘how brilliant’. We were denied the ability to control our own destiny.
  • Shifting Sands. Where we experienced Shifting Sands we had a lack of control because the environment around us at that formative stage lacked constancy. One day the sun shone and the next day, even though everything else appeared to stay the same to us, there was a thunderstorm. On Monday our painting was declared to be ‘Rembrandt in the making’ (a la Golden Child) and by Friday our painting ‘was the work of a moron wielding a potato for a paintbrush’. The application of black and white thinking by the aggressor created an uncertain environment, one of push and pull, idealisation and devaluation and we had no control whatsoever on which version was going to appear to us. There was a lack of control in our lives through uncertainty, unpredictability and those shifting sands.
  • B Graders. ‘It’s good but not good enough.’ ‘You can do far better.’ ‘You are not trying hard enough.’ ‘You are letting yourself down but moreover you are letting me down.’ These phrases and those similar to it encapsulate the loss of control felt by those who are ‘The B Graders’. Each time the hill was climbed and the summit anticipated, another hill suddenly appeared. The effort was okay, decent enough, acceptable but never that which met with approval. Keep going, learn more, be faster, swim stronger, climb higher, shine brighter. There was no control because we were never allowed a moment to settle, to cherish that which had been achieved and to reflect. We could not establish our own parameters of achievement and satisfaction but instead we were always beholden to the standards of another which ultimate proved to be unobtainable standards and thus we had no control.
  • The Facsimile. We were shaped to be precisely like the aggressor. Sometimes this was entirely at the behest of the aggressor and sometimes we saw how this individual behaved and decided ‘I want that power also’ (usually unconsciously but sometimes, such as was the case for me – consciously). Whilst you may think a conscious decision to copy the aggressor and thus seize power was a form of control, it was not – this was actually a product of the already establishing narcissism and thus a symptom rather than a cause. Where the aggressor caused us to be moulded just like them – forming our opinions, our views, our behaviours, our likes and dislikes, what we wore, what we ate, where we went, what we did and in some instances alongside this there was an unconscious decision to mimic and copy those behaviours and characteristics, we were once again denied control.

Thus, whether we came from an impoverished background, a gilded background, a seemingly run-of-the-mill background, any of those environments had the potential to cause a lack of control in our lives. Take this lack of control and add it to the genetic predisposition and thus our coping mechanism of narcissism was given birth to.

Narcissism became our way of coping with the world.

Narcissism allowed us to exert control.

A lack of control equates to a lack of power.

A lack of control equates to  being vulnerable.

A lack of control equates to being weak.

A lack of control equates to being worthless, meaningless and unimportant.

When we lack control, we start to fade and will no longer exist.

A lack of control now returns us to the lack of control then.

This must never happen for too long and thus we were formed from this lack of control adding to our genetic predisposition and in order to survive and thrive we must never, ever lack control for if this persists, well, then, it ends.

We must have absolute control. And that means absolute control over you, him, her, them but most of all YOU.

51 thoughts on “To Control is to Cope : Narcissism and Its Creation

  1. lickemtomorrow says:

    AV, wow! Thank you for sharing more of your ex-husband’s history and experiences.

    That is quite a lot to take in and seems to relate to what I’ve heard other families and parents say about their children later diagnosed as ASPD/psychopathic. Part of the difficulty must be in making the determination when brains are still developing and hormones are also kicking in. We expect teenagers to be temperamental and I can see how a parent might overlook that in the circumstances. Things must have been serious for your ex’s dad to send him away when he was 13yrs old. And the counsellor appears to have been spot on with his tentative diagnosis at 15. He obviously had a very troubled history during his teen years and that had to have impacted on him as well. Though, maybe it just made him more wily, if you include the lack of empathy and remorse which is part of the diagnosis. It’s amazing how he found stability with you. And somehow that says something about your influence as well. We know we never have control, they don’t allow it, but considering how bad his teen years were he really seemed to have made an effort to turn his life around in some ways. And that all ended after he left you. The whole thing is heartbreaking, including what he put you through. The lack of early intervention seems to hold a definite key. I saw a psychiatrist on YouTube who had a young son diagnosed as Callous Unemotional, along with ADHD/ODD, and he spoke very openly about his situation. It was intriguing as he obviously has expertise in that field. I’ll have to try and look it up again. And I’ve also come across a series created by a female psychiatrist who married a narcissistic sociopath and was concerned about their son and the implication around the genetic component. I’m seriously considering getting my hands on it as I haven’t done so yet. If nothing else, it would be fascinating to learn more, especially with regard to children. Mine are grown up now, and I don’t have these concerns personally, but the more we know the more we can share with others and maybe help them in their situations <3

    1. A Victor says:

      LET, you’re welcome, I have hesitated to share it for a number of reasons but your previous comment made me decide to go forward, a possible case as you described, up close and personal. Yes, the teen years are already in an upheaval, who can determine what is what. I know things began before he was a teen, his siblings saw things going back almost to before he could talk. One of them once said to me “If he’s talking, he’s lying.” Such was his reputation. Of course, I was already far involved when that tidbit came out. He found stability with me only on the surface, underneath he was always doing things, cheating, gambling, lying etc to fulfil his aims. I believe I was only there for facade, our kids also. Perhaps he had figured out his aims would be more easily secured if his facade was such. Who knows. It actually ended prior to me, in addition to the cheating, gambling etc, he went back to some serious drug use, which he hid from me for 6 years. He was able to do this in part because he also had an illness for which he blamed a lot of odd things, if I questioned. I definitely agree that we can spread the word better if we understand more. I was so worried about my children but writing that comment last night made me realize that, even with my son’s situation a couple of months ago, I have nothing to worry about, I am so grateful for that.

      1. lickemtomorrow says:

        AV, appreciate you sharing once again and I see that there had already been a build up in your ex’s behaviour prior to his teen years which is probably why his father sent him away at such a young age. That must have been very difficult for his family to do, to recognize that and act upon it. It’s hard to know what impact he would have had on his older siblings prior to that, but his behaviour obviously stood out.

        It must be very hurtful to realize that he used you as part of his facade, but I suppose we all have to come to terms with the fact at some level we’ve formed part of the facade in our marriages and relationships. At the time, of course, we don’t know that. We often have no other understanding of what a marriage should be and spend all our time and energy trying to keep it afloat. I was actually very confrontational with my ex-husband in some ways when it came to his facade. I would challenge it in ways that were threatening to him, but didn’t know that at the time. All I knew was that there was a dimming of my empathic traits as I confronted him. It didn’t always end well.

        I’m very happy to hear you have no concerns about your children. I’d say that has a lot to do with you and how you were able to manage the situation. I shared with you about my son as well and I don’t take that back on myself. Simply because I can’t control everything they do and I’ve done everything I can to oversee the best possible upbringing. There’s no guarantees. Sharing in your sense of gratefulness <3

        1. A Victor says:

          Hi LET, I guess his behavior stood out, I heard the same types of things from many over the years. For me, realizing I and the kids were part of the facade was so minor in comparison with other things that I’ve learned simultaneously that I don’t think it fazed me much. Also, I had recognized for years that my mother played roles, I had even wondered which one was the real her and I had even spoken of these thoughts to a couple of people. So the idea of facade was not surprising, I was part of hers also, and I learned early I had better play my part. The article about the smile and what it hides always strikes me in relation to this.

          I was confrontational with my ex also, I have learned these were supernovas, possibly yours were as well, until an incident where our then 2 and a half year old daughter ran back and forth between us saying “Please don’t fight! Please don’t fight! Please don’t fight!” That was it, I stopped right there. That was at about eight years in. I did not fight with him again until the end, and then only a few times, only whenit was a matter of safety for my children.

          I think I went a bit broad regarding concern for my children, there are always concerns. What I meant was no concern that they are narcissists. Oh, yes, thank you for the reminder about your son. We all have things like that I suppose. That same sweet daughter from above later gave me much grief. But today she is a wonderful caring woman, 2 weeks overdue with her 4th today! And she’s married to a sweet man, they don’t fight, they are best friends, they talk! And she recently told me is all down to frequent sex, haha, imagine getting that kind of marital advice from your kid! I laughed so hard! If she only knew, but they never will know the truth that happened between their father and I. I will never share that, unless it is needed to help for some reason. Thank you for your reply, these conversations help sort things out.

  2. lickemtomorrow says:

    I noticed there is some talk about children and diagnosing narcissism here, and wanted to place this comment separately just because it’s in a slightly different context and I didn’t want to connect it to what anyone was saying about a particular child. I watched an old black and white movie the other night called “The Bad Seed”. It’s basically about a child who is obviously psychopathic. I was amazed such a movie was allowed to be made in the 1950’s. It’s “film noir” and that seemed to be the era for alot of these movies. It’s intriguing as you see the mother become more aware of the lack of empathy in her child, a level of callousness, and also an ability to manipulate. As a young girl she appears as if butter wouldn’t melt in her mouth, but there is one person who has her pegged early on and that is the less intelligent, but possibly more intuitive handyman. It’s a fascinating study of the mother’s dawning awareness, the boldness and ability of the handyman to challenge the child when both are out of sight of the mother, and the unraveling of the mother’s past and her sanity as she tries to come to terms with the reality of her child’s condition.

    I’ve watched a number of documentary programs where individuals later diagnosed as psychopathic were described as ‘perfect’ children by their parent’s, only to become more truculent teens who seems to have come out of nowhere. And yet, that could be the story of many parents in terms of hormones taking over and children trying to develop their own individual personalities and lives. Many of the parents of psychopathic individuals seem to be totally oblivious to their hidden nature. In the instance of this movie, the grandmother, or the mother’s mother (who she had no real memory of after being adopted age 2yrs) was a known criminal and likely psychopath. The mother only discovers her heritage after becoming aware of her daughter’s own psychopathic tendencies. It puts a big focus on the genetic component.

    There is a lot to know and understand about these issues and the difference a timely intervention could make. I’m not sure it would make the difference in all cases. But it’s good to know where narcissistic traits are beginning to show that there are ways to deal with those.

    1. A Victor says:

      Hi LET, my ex’s mother said he was a good boy. His siblings told me there was something different about him even when he was very little, he is the youngest of 8. His dad sent him away for the first time at 13. A counselor told him he likely had ASPD at 15, it went in his notes but being that young couldn’t be considered a diagnosis. He was in and out of group homes, juvie, treatment and jail through his teen years and into his early 20’s, which is when I met him. He was on probation for the first few years that I knew him. But once we met, no new trouble with the law except for a couple of speeding tickets, for over 20 years. He held a good job ago that time, to everyone outside of our home we seemed happy. But as soon as he left he went back to his old ways. He stopped one step shy of prison. I wish he could’ve been helped, the people he was put with, in the group homes, did try. It is heartbreaking. I don’t know what his problem is, narcissism alone or something more. But i agree that the more help they can get early on, the better to try to help. He did not have an intervener and he had done a lot of damage to a lot of people as a result.

      1. Asp Emp says:

        AV, maybe all he needed was a bit of stability and understanding? In my opinion, it is not just narcissism on it’s own – from what I read you say, there is more going on underneath the ‘surface’. His dad sent him away for the first time at 13?

        1. A Victor says:

          Hi Asp Emp, missed you yesterday, though I wasn’t on much until last night either. I don’t know what he needed or if anything would have helped. If so, he did not get it. The entire family is messed up, so bad. I’m 99 percent sure his dad was a narc and his mom a CoD empath with Magnet. She was a beauty queen before she married him, on her way to bigger and better things, dated John DeLorean for a period prior to meeting my father in law for example. She must have had something else also, she did leave him once, for 3 months, after the kids were grown. But she came back and he continued his abuse of her. She drank a lot, I don’t blame her at all. I have guessed that he was a UMR elite, due to his treatment of her and other things.

          But back to my ex, I don’t know, I think there is something beyond narcissism but couldn’t say exactly what. He did abuse animals, he liked messing with fire, but both of those things were as a young person, teen or below. I don’t believe any of that continued into his adulthood. Though, now that I’m thinking of it, on the few occasions when he took the dog out alone, that dog would almost always come back with some kind of injury! Now I’m super angry. I didn’t want that dog, I was pregnant, he insisted we get the dog anyway and then I was the dog’s main person, of course. I was the one at home, I took him to obedience school, we bonded. And he’d come back the the injured dog and talk about how the dog wouldn’t like him anymore, thinking he’d get hurt around him, I always reassured him that the dog would continue to like him, now I feel like he was probably lying to me! I missed that dog when he died way more than I have ever missed that man. And this is making me incredibly sad, that dog was a really great friend, he didn’t deserve any mistreatment.

          1. Asp Emp says:

            AV, thank you for your response. Since you only know limited info of him as a child and only know him as the adult, you have no idea what went on in his home with his family – maybe he was abused and it was the only “life” he was taught that was ‘normal’. If he saw his actions were different from everyone else’s outside the family home, he does not know what is ‘right / wrong’ because some people learn better by observing rather than listening or doing. So if his mind was always ‘on the go’, ie not stopping to sit quietly and think because no-one taught him that and with a noisy / disruptive household, how is he going to be taught to see or think differently? With, added narcissism (assumingly), the guy never learned to ‘relax’. Maybe the father abused animals too? If they had pets. That dog that you had, was abused. I have said it before on this blog, some dogs do not recover, no matter how much love or care they are given. Similar can happen with people, even with ‘re-processing’ the mind ie CBT. Do you have any idea why you say you loved that dog more than him? Maybe because you knew deep down that the dog was unconditional with it’s ‘devotion’ towards you and the fact you were aware that the dog was abused by him but you don’t know how much or what was done – either way, it is at peace now. Now, do not think it was your fault, you have every right to feel angry when you think about it but you cannot dwell on it – otherwise you’ll keep your ET level up. It is in the past – I am not being ‘cold’ as such but I am because it is in the past. Today, tomorrow, next week, next month, next year matters more. Today, tell yourself that you will try your utmost best to concentrate on today and understand more about yourself. Sorry for coming across as hard.

          2. A Victor says:

            Hi Asp Emp, I has a reply all written out and suddenly a glitch happened and it disappeared. I will wait and see if it shows up, maybe I bumped send by accident.

  3. lickemtomorrow says:

    I’ve seen an article in the last couple of days where Beyonce says she and her kids love to wear matching outfits ‘on vacation’. As in the same materials are used to create the outfits. The images are creepy rather than cute, I think. The children are the walking definition of ‘mini me’s’ from what I can see and appear, at least in these images, to be an extension of her. It really struck me when I saw them.

    I remember as a kid being dressed in the same outfits as my sister. No individuality whatsoever, and a sign of the times. But, at least our mother didn’t dress us to match her outfits. At first the article states Beyonce says she loves to coordinate outfits with her kids, and then changes to say they like to match what she is wearing. I don’t remember wanting to match what my mother was wearing and I doubt she wanted to coordinate with us. I didn’t want to wear what my sister was wearing 😛 I still don’t know why that was a trend!

    Anyway, that is a random thing that popped up during the week that signals narcissist to me. If it doesn’t, I still think it’s creepy anyway.

  4. Supernova DE says:

    HG,
    Have you considered (or will you please consider) doing video(s) about younger children who are narcissists? Particularly the ‘tween’ period ages 9-13 or so when narcissism is cemented but all the facets are still evolving.
    Are there clues for us to recognize them? How to deal with them?
    I am particularly interested for two reasons: 1)Screening my empath children’s friends for their protection 2)Help for any of us who have narcissist children of our own
    Thanks for your consideration and/or comments as always!

    1. HG Tudor says:

      Once cannot state with certainty that a child is a narcissist.

      1. Asp Emp says:

        HG, and that is the sad reality because it is nearly always too late in the day when it comes to recognising that a person, when they become older, is a narcissist because there are so many ‘conditions’ around these days – a child is still in ‘development stages’. Some ‘conditions’ are easier to recognise than others.

      2. WhoCares says:

        HG,

        “Once cannot state with certainty that a child is a narcissist.”

        Is this a topic you will ever write on in the future?
        Or is a topic you would expand upon in consultation?

        1. HG Tudor says:

          I will expand on the matter willingly through consultation.

          1. WhoCares says:

            Thank-you HG.

          2. MB says:

            I attest. HG was very helpful in consultation regarding my 11 year old niece. As he said, narcissism in a child that age cannot be determined, but certain behaviors can certainly be mitigated. My sister has achieved a more peaceful existence in her home since consulting with HG. The behavior is still there and, in fact, is escalating as time goes on. Controlling her own reactions and behavior is key as well as letting go of expectations for her relationship with her daughter 😢

          3. HG Tudor says:

            Good to read, thank you MB.

          4. WhoCares says:

            Thank-you for sharing MB.

          5. MB says:

            You’re welcome WC. Going NC with a minor child is obviously impossible. I hope that HG will have the time to do an article/recording regarding that situation.

      3. Supernova DE says:

        Thank you HG.
        I was thinking of one particular kid I know who both my husband and myself both have commented that of every human being we know, this kid aged 10 is the worst human we know. Already incredibly manipulative, seems to operate facade at times, tantrums etc.
        But I do understand that children are inherently narcissistic and also still undergoing development so cannot be “diagnosed”.
        I appreciate that you can expand in consultation if so needed.

        1. MB says:

          Supernova DE,
          I’m looking at it this way… If one in six humans is a narcissist, there are one in six kids that are well on their way. There is an “acceptable” level of narcissism expected in a child, but the 10 year old you mentioned is likely a budding narc. I know HG doesn’t want to “diagnose” it until age 18, but a lack of empathy is certainly evident before then.

          1. Supernova DE says:

            MB,
            Yes I agree. I honestly can’t imagine raising a teenage narc, what an utter nightmare, my heart goes out to their empath parents (if there is one).
            Also hope you are well as I haven’t talked to you in some time!

          2. Joa says:

            In my opinion, the most narcissistic period in a young person’s development is around 14-17 years of age. I remember myself and my own behavior, thoughts, focus on myself and total selfishness. I am also anxiously observing my own daughter at this very stage.

  5. Joa says:

    HG, I care abaut your opinion. Is it possible for a narcissist to self-harm?
    As:
    1. Self-punishment for attacks of anger.
    2. Out of regret and jealousy when a friend became friends with someone else.

    1. HG Tudor says:

      A narcissist may well self-harm and it is driven by the need for control and fuel. The unaware narcissist may say it is a form of self-punishment (but it is not), the narcissist will be driven by jealousy and may believe it is done out of regret (but it not, we do not genuinely regret anything because that would mean an admission of fault which cannot happen because of the need for control.)

      1. Joa says:

        HG, thank you so much for your quick reply.

        Well, point 1 and 2 are basically my guesses and interpretations …

        Too bad. I was hoping you would write back that it was out of the question in the case of a narcissist. Eh…

        Thank you.

  6. Ironically Controlled says:

    Need to be in control of everyone else’s brain besides your own I understand. Little half ass backwards considering that puts the control, dependent on others. Does that mean those you control, are actually controlling you?

    https://youtu.be/v7KQsS2kLM4

    1. MB says:

      Joe Dispenza is da bomb. Thank you for sharing this IC. I’m glad I stumbled upon it. I need to rediscover him. It’s been 8 years! Lost my way. I was just asking HG yesterday if he could teach the ability to be in control of ones own emotions. I just needed reminding! Digging his book out now…

      1. A Victor says:

        MB, did you ask about this on the blog or privately? If it’s on the blog, would you share which thread, or any reply he gave? I am guessing it has to do with going to the evidence.

        1. MB says:

          AV, I don’t remember the thread, but he said he could help to an extent, but I am made different to him so he could only teach me so much. Our emotions are instinctive.

          1. A Victor says:

            I see, thank you MB.

          2. A Victor says:

            Hi MB, It just dawned on me that he can teach us how to best respond to the emotions even though we likely can’t stop/control them from happening. He has done this for me very much, it’s all about going to the evidence, which can be terrifying but is so helpful to actually know what’s going on rather than just wondering and worrying. I am certain you already know this, you’ve been here so long. I have a really hard time sometimes feeling like it’s okay to say things I’ve learned, I still consider myself to be a newbie and I feel others see me in such a way also, but it is helpful to share sometimes, it helps to cement the knowledge. But I hesitate. Thank you again for your feedback.

          3. MB says:

            AV, you’ve been here ages! This is a safe space to write and interact. I hope you don’t ever feel invalidated here. The topic is vast and the experiences are so varied, we will always have much to express.

            As far as controlling emotional reactions, the best teaching for me was in ‘How to Handle a Narcissist at Work’. I’ve visited it time and time again for refreshers and used it for interactions with all narcissists, not just work ones.

          4. A Victor says:

            MB, I’ve only been here 10 months, okay, 10.5. It just seems longer because I comment so much, I’m sure! But no, not invalidated, just insecure that my learning is valid?? If that makes sense, not from others, my own insecurity about it. I never want to say the wrong thing with regard to HG’s knowledge, though I know he would correct it if he felt the need. Or others would. But that makes me hesitant to say much, haha, considering the number of my comments, that is an odd statement! Thank you for your kind reply!

            I will check into ‘How to Handle a Narcissist at Work’. It is one of the few things I don’t already own, I don’t have any narcissists at work. Though I do wonder about some of our suppliers and definitely some of our customers, so it would be helpful there as well. Thank you for this suggestion.

          5. NarcAngel says:

            AV
            Amount of time here doesn’t equate to knowing more – it depends on the individual and how (or even if) they digest and apply the material. Much as being older does not necessarily make one wiser – one could just have been wrong for a longer period of time. HG is the only one here that can ultimately tell us how a narcissist thinks and why they behave as they do. Unless they are quoting material obtained here, all anyone else can offer is an opinion/comment based on their interpretation of their own personal experiences and the observations of others. Opinions and comments are interesting to consider but are not always correct as applies to the material because of individual interpretation. HG is the only one here qualified to assign grade but he does not. I suspect many of us would be surprised at where he would grade us vs where we would grade ourselves.

            I feel confident that MB knows this was not a comment on MB’s time here (or anyone specific for that matter), and your interaction with her/them, but rather speaking to your discomfort in relating what you have learned and your feeling of being viewed/graded by others as a newbie.

          6. A Victor says:

            NA,
            You understood well the intent of my comment, thank you. And you are correct, not aimed at any one person, certainly not MB, I figured she would also understand. Thank you very much for your comment.

          7. MB says:

            NA, I feel the same way. I have been here awhile, but still way less than some such as yourself. We all contribute in our own way. I wouldn’t want anybody to feel that their contribution isn’t valued. The newly arrived have much to offer. Ditto everything else you wrote, *except* I HAVE been graded on some of those blasted quizzes in the past and was a miserable failure 😂 Prof Tudor’s tests are really hard and he doesn’t give partial credit!

          8. Asp Emp says:

            MB, RE: the tests you are referring to – see them as a way of measuring your ET / LT, not as a measure of yourself, how much you understand. I noticed that HG did not provide a ‘scoring limit’ as an indication. It is not his aim to make empaths feel or think that they are ‘failures’. I suppose it is similar to the EDC results, where there are weaker areas requiring more awareness and more application on understanding yourself to be able to strengthen those ‘weaker’ parts of yourself to empower yourself – not necessarily just against narcissists either. View these tests as constructives to assist you 🙂

          9. A Victor says:

            MB, as NA said in her comment, my previous comment was not in any way aimed at you, or anyone specific, it was purely my discomfort at sharing sometimes. I hope I did not offend you, I felt like you were a safe person to share that with actually, which is why I put it where I did. Please accept my apology if you were in any way offended or hurt by it, that was not my intent at all.

          10. MB says:

            AV, It was actually flattering, not offensive. And yes, I’m always safe to share with and communicate with. I’m not here much at all anymore due to demands on my time elsewhere, but I do pop in from time to time. Of all the millions (it seems) of comments I’ve made on this blog, very few, if any, have been volatile, adversarial, or inflammatory. I imagine HG’s index applied to my comments would be 0%. I don’t jump into the fray. I’m conflict avoidant in all areas of my life. You’re an excellent student, AV. Keep up the good work. You have the best teacher and classmates on the planet!

          11. A Victor says:

            MB, I’m glad you took it as such. You are very safe from what I’ve seen and it is appreciated! Thank you for the encouragement, and I agree completely with your last sentence!!

          12. NarcAngel says:

            AV
            I was not offended at all. Just wanted to offer that to address the discomfort you expressed and that others might also feel.

          13. A Victor says:

            NA
            I understood and I really did appreciate your comment. I am glad you were not offended, I had not thought you were, but rather felt you read between the lines something I had not stated as clearly as you did, your comment was helpful. Thank you again.

  7. SParham says:

    Maybe this kind of control is an attractor for empaths? I don’t want to control anybody ever. I know that my ET skyrockets when I’m being controlled in obvious ways. Narcissists move around too fast too, it may just be me but, the narcs that I now recognize seem to scurry I don’t know how they aren’t more accident prone? I try to rush like they whine about and I inevitably experience bs. It’s the craziest thing.

  8. Asp Emp says:

    One of my favourite articles because it explains so much, including an important aspect in relation to ‘coping strategies’. HG wrote in this article that narcissism is a coping mechanism.

    There are also ACONs who did not ‘form’ into narcissists, yet would have developed their own ‘coping mechanism’ and at the same time, continued to put themselves through the ‘manipulations and machinations’ of narcissists because of their ‘addiction’ to narcissism that was ‘instilled’ from an early age. Only this ‘cycle’ of “self-abuse” would end once an ACON is given the ‘tools’ to become aware of their ‘cycle’ of life is not the ‘perception’ of the ‘norm’, simply because they were not taught otherwise.

    Those that are unaware (or, in some cases, ignorant) about the affects of narcissism and the ‘addiction’ to narcissists, to the victims (ACONs, including narcissists as a result of narcissistic LOCE) would make statements ie “Oh, that ‘relationship’ is doing more bad than good for you, you need to leave that environment”. Those that are unaware / ignorant do not realise that some ACONs ‘rely’ on the narcissist(s) for ‘support’ because it is what they have ‘learned’ from an early age.

    I will state that from my own experiences as an ACON, having lived with CPTSD (and other complex ‘conditions’) as a result and getting myself out of this almost ‘impossible’ cycle – it is very difficult to be able to ‘see’ it, never mind finding a way to make a start on the changing of the mindset and to take a ‘grasp’ on “re-writing” a whole life-time of “knowledge” and ‘understanding’ about myself.

    It does take time. It does take stamina and strength to ‘push’ yourself and your own ‘limits’ to get into your mind and emotions to be able to ‘reduce’ the ‘residue’ as a result of narcissistic abuse. There will always be an amount of ‘residue’ left, which is the ‘addiction’ part but learning to understand what it is and knowing how to recognise it (keep ET low & maintain LT) when it comes to interacting with narcissists in the future, ie at work, in public etc.

    In my view, this is one of the most important articles on this blog, it explains a great deal. I also recognised a lot of this article’s words within myself, as an ACON.

    Thank you for re-posting, HG. A really good article.

    1. psychologyandworldaffairs says:

      Thank you ASP EMP – you offer in you experiences the other side to the coin. My heart goes out to you. I cannot say I was an ACON, I am not. Yet feel it of equal importance to understand this dynamic within the context xx

      1. Asp Emp says:

        PAWA, thanks so much for your words. I do not know of any other place on the internet to be able to provide ‘insights’ to people who are listening. Thank you, much appreciated 🙂 c

  9. Thank you HG. Your explanation does cement some of my own thoughts. We can despise the narcissists and hate their behaviour towards us. We can learn to recognise them and avoid them like the plague.

    But once upon a time – they were innocent children, who when they needed help the most – nobody stepped in to save them. Somebody might have looked the other way – or just did not make the effort. Sadly, I think society as a whole needs to wake up. Passive compliance is as much of a contribution.

  10. Paul says:

    A relationship (friends / family / intimate partner) with people who understand and accept you and are willing to make allowances to accommodate your needs can also help you address whatever issues you have. Relationships are transformative so an alternative to coping mechanisms that help in the moment but don’t bring any long-term benefits.

    Newsflash: All people have issues, needs and fears and were born with certain positive and negative traits. No-one is perfect but all people, including you, have inherent value. Understanding this fact is the key to being able to do relationships.

    With a relationship involving a narcissist, it will probably be all about the narcissist initially, which is reasonable given the needs and past experiences of the narcissist, but over time the narcissist can begin to understand and make allowances for the needs of the other person in the relationship.

    A relationship won’t give you perfect control but it will give you something better that will ultimately allow you to reduce your feelings of insecurity and need for control and also boost your sense of inherent self-worth. Surely this is the ultimate dream for a narcissist – getting off the treadmill.

    I have seen it happen so it is definitely possible. This is available to you if you want to take it to the next level and go from an ultra narcissist to a transcendental narcissist. There are always risks but life relies on taking leaps of faith. Ultimately, if you are going to achieve anything worthwhile in life, at some poinit you will have to take a chance and go for it. Fortunately, you can always start small and build up from there.

    Try using your words to communicate your needs with one person. Sis?

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