Understanding the relevant school and cadre of empath that you belong to is an integral part of arming yourself so that you effect a GOSO Campaign (Get Out, Stay Out) with the maximum effectiveness.
Recognising where you belong with regard to one of the four schools of empath and then the relevant cadre not only aids you in learning more about yourself and how your school and cadre attracts particular narcissists, it will weaponise you in your quest to GOSO and also assist you in evading narcissists in the future.
This consultation is conducted through the provision of a protocol which is straightforward and provides confidentiality between the parties. A questionnaire is provided which elicits a broad range of information about you and your behaviours to enable me to then analyse your responses and provide you with an accurate and easy to understand response through an audio sound file.
Ensuring you know what you are means you will avoid the mistakes that occur with self-analysis through lacking objectivity. It will ensure you do not embark on courses of action which are suited to different schools and it also enables you to plug the gaps in your own defences and achieve GOSO sooner and with less effort.
See the link in the menu bar for more information about the process and how to book The Empath Detector Consultation
130 thoughts on “Empath Detector”
HG people keep telling me I’m calm in real life. Over and over. But I’m supposed to be a Geyser type!
How other people perceive us and what we actually feel inside can be quite different. Nobody can read your mind even though some people may be convinced they can.
Thank you so much E.B. Which type of empath are you?
I do not know, I am not a genuine empath.
I took different tests and got different results for the same test depending on what I was thinking of while answering a question.
There is no pattern in the way I behave. It depends on what type of relationship, circumstances *and* individual I am dealing with at a particular moment.
Were those HG’s tests or somebody else’s?
From other sources, not HG’s.
E.B.—just take it!
So I had my Empath Detector and HG’s analysis says I’m a normal bordering empathic.
I’m posting this in case anybody is interested in how a normal might look like (and also to clarify some stuff to myself).
This explains why I could not see myself as completely fitting any of the Empath groups, and also why I had these fleeting moments when I thought “I am the narcissist”, but not matching the narc profile either.
From the E cadres, I mostly recognized in myself Carrier traits, but also some Magnet. Geyser, Saviour – not so much.
From the E schools, I see some Co-D traits, but only in relationship to my Nx. I don’t behave like that with other people.
Contagion fits the least, I think…
The E group I mostly identified with was the Super Empath, but I also recognized that both my empathic and narcissistic traits do not have the strength and radius that they seem to have for a SE. It’s mostly the narcissistic ones that made me think I might be a SE. I will explain this below.
I can tolerate some abuse for a while, in order to fit my usually easy-going, live and let live nature, but once a certain limit is crossed, I just don’t give a fuck anymore. This manifests mostly as a sort of disengagement, I will not pursue revenge, I don’t see any use to that. I only tried this with my Nx, with triangulation and some “not giving a fuck about you” messages, but since she did not reply I just let it go.
Up until the limit is crossed, which varies depending on how much I care about the person, I will try to ignore, appease, work out whats and whys, argue, I might get annoyed or angry or sad or disappointed.
But once I go cold, I really go cold. There are very slim chances to get back on my good side once you’ve pushed enough buttons. I also no longer get affected by what you might say in such case, you can call me an asshole, stupid, bad, ugly, coward, whatever. You can plead to my good nature, ask for forgiveness. I don’t care anymore. In case your attitude might impact me in other ways (e.g. my image with a smear campaign, or maybe financially), I might become cautious and keep a neutral attitude, just enough to prevent any open conflicts. But I will slowly try to gain my full independence. Once this is achieved, I will no longer care. My usual reply in this independence state is avoiding (even ostentatiously), and in case I can’t I will be cold smiling or becoming like a dry stone which has nothing to say, except maybe some sarcastic “ahem” or “yeah” from time to time (internally accompanied in my mind by intermittent “go fuck yourself”).
What I don’t understand though is why I have this sort of addiction to my Nx. I thought Normals were supposed to be somewhat immune.
However, I think I am only selectively sensitive to narcs. There are very few who can get under my skin, most of them I reject easily, and also they do no seem much attracted to me. I guess this is because my empathic side is not very visible, one has to get to know me quite well before I reveal its full depth. I am rather shy and introverted, so it’s not easy to get to that level.
The Nx was quite close to my family, so I think this is why she became attracted to me and accepted my probing advances. I was attracted to her by her apparent strength, ease, joy, outgoing nature.
The ED helped me see this more clearly.
I had my suspicions I might be a normal, but I was not sure, nothing seemed to fit…
It also helps me to see why I’m sometimes not on the same page with people on this blog. I just don’t understand when they go back once they have the knowledge here, once they become “weaponized”.
I can understand slipping, breaking NC for a while, longing, trying to have the last word or seeking some revenge. But knowing all this and still wanting, actively seeking to go back and resume the relationship, I just don’t get it.
I mean, I can rationalize it in some way, and I see it here almost every day, so there’s no denying it… but it simply does not fit my way of being and reasoning.
(This is not an accusation or trying to shame anybody, I just explain how I feel. I am not judging.)
I’m similar to you except I’m a standard empath. I also have minority Codependent traits and a dash of contagion. Majority carrier and strong minority madnet, very little geyser.
I can also take a lot of abuse but I have a limit in which I will stop caring or trying to make things better. It will get to the point that a narc will be crying in front of me and I will be trying not to laugh because the respect and empathy I once had for them has dried up.
I didn’t think I was that much of a magnet until I got my results and now I’m able to see it very clearly, like why a lot of people want to talk to me at parties and work. I assumed that is just what extroverted people did, I didn’t realise that I was giving off an energy which drew people towards me (and sometimes make me feel uncomfortable.) I was at a house party the other day and one person was saying to me “you’re like an angel”
Someone else was telling me that I have a “happy energy” and they want to be around me. Another guy who I assumed was gay because he was dancing fully like a woman started saying to me “you should be my wife.”
I’m not saying this to be boastful I’m just mentioning it for others who may not have thought that they were magnetic, and all this time they were just putting it down to people “being nice” like what I thought.
I recommend the empath detector to everyone, it may surprise you.
I need to mention here that my empathic strands are self-assessed, HG did not point them out in his result (because I am not an empath, I guess). I just stated what I thought matches me.
For the magnetic traits – this might seem a bit contradictory, because I also say I’m shy and introverted. This is the usual, 95%, me. But… I have my moments, especially if a I have a drink or two, when I can be quite funny, engaging and extroverted, especially around friends and people I know (colleagues). I can also have an attitude of not caring about my image, I sometimes do outrageous things, shocking people and making a fool of myself without caring about it (or even deriving a sort of pleasure from doing it).
It has also happened to me (rarely) that strangers approach me and start talking about themselves. It is true that most of them seemed a bit (or more) crazy. I always let them speak, and usually see these as very interesting encounters… half sad and half amusing…
Oh see I.
I am also introverted, I have a lot of barriers up when meeting people for the first time. I try to have a resting bitch face in public so narcs don’t want to talk to me, I have headphones in or I read.
At parties where I’m there to have a good time I don’t try to look miserable so my magnetic properties are much more apparent.
I get somewhat anxious when people like me and I think that’s down to my bad experiences with narcs, because unfortunately a lot of narcs do want to be close to me for what they feel they can get out of me.
I used to wonder too, but over time I have become convinced that it is addiction, and addiction makes no sense. Just as knowing that heroin can kill you but you will do anything and risk death to get that hit.
I guess addiction also manifests differently from person to person.
I used to smoke, and I just fully quit at some point. I might still have a cigarette or two once in a blue moon, but I never fully restarted (actually, I am lying a bit here – during my Nx period, I smoked again for a few months, but I quit again quite easily).
I think I also have a sort of relationship with alcohol, but still moderate amounts and currently not yet to the point that I can’t have a few days without drinking. I know I have a problem though, and I’m watching it.
I never tried strong drugs, so I can’t comment on that.
My Nx is probably one of the most powerful drugs I tried, but even so, once I had it in my mind that “this is it, I’m done”, then I managed to slowly detox. I’m not fully cured, but I see the addiction for what it is, and could never go back. I am aware I could never see her the same as before. It would be a total fiasco. Even sexually, where the match was almost perfect, I am sure it won’t be the same, even if she tried (which I doubt). Because I would not be the same. I would not be capable of the same level of emotional involvement and trust. I cannot just “go through the motions”, the idea disgusts me… I would constantly be searching for clues about her trying to manipulate me, lie to me. I would probably respond in kind, and nothing good would result from this.
Anyway I look at it, I see no satisfying outcome, not even for her…
I guess HG is right, hope is the great enemy. As long as there is hope, one might want to try another shot. Once hope is lost and you know for sure that another shot won’t bring anything back, then you can quit, no matter how painful.
I guess HG is right, hope is the great enemy. As long as there is hope, one might want to try another shot. Once hope is lost and you know for sure that another shot won’t bring anything back, then you can quit, no matter how painful.
Damn you Abe for pointing this out. I have been living on hope since I unblocked and WHY? It will just be the same. After I unblocked, I had hope. And then I had that thing called guilt because I contacted him. I feel guilt because I should not have done that and now if I block again, I will wound him. He will be hurt. F that…
I am feeling my sadness coming back. My anxiety.
I wish there was a magic pill to end this but I guess it is called a bullet and I am going to have to bite it. (metaphorically)
Time to get back on track. God this is gonna hurt like hell………………
HG is right, there is no guessing about it, Kim!
He is blocked again. Day one……………here we go.
Change your number.
HG…that is too much at one time. I know it has to be done but……………..Ijust cant now
Yes you can
This is the part about you that I really like, HG.
YES, SHE CAN.
Thank you CIF. There is no logical excuse for not changing the number. It is pure emotional thinking.
I know, right, HG? Kim needs to claim her power. She HAS it inside herself…she only has to claim it. It’s like the lottery — a person has the winning ticket — but they don’t cash in on it. Bring that ticket forward & reap the rewards.
[Also, to Lorelei: Don’t mess around with UMRs…they are not safe. They have an edge…and *can* be aggressive sexually, in a way you do not want to experience].
CIF. WOW. gang up on Kim day. My ET is going in a bad direction on this 😕
Its called logic, Kim E. Your ET wants you to think you are being ganged-up on.
Mine was a supportive comment — encouraging you that you have what it takes. HG was speaking truth, on what all of us must do, to break free from these entanglements, for our betterment. He’s on your side to be more fully free, as am I…and I also want you to know greater joy.
Atta girl, Kim💜
Kim E, blocking and unblocking is like putting yourself on the shelf and taking yourself off. This guy has you doing the work for him. Don’t trick yourself into thinking he’s going to be hurt. If he’s making you feel like an emotional mess, he’s enjoying himself at your expense. Commit this time. What is the worst thing that can happen? You will not die from this. I’m reasonably sure HG hasn’t lost any empaths to death by NC. Make the commitment!! You can do this!!
I’m glad you did it Kim e… Happy for you!
If I remember correctly, your N’s staple hoover style is anonymous calls, so I think you should do something about that too. Either change your number or completely block all anonymous calls if your phone supports that (Silence Unknown Callers in iOS13 – did not try this so not sure exactly how it works). But the best option is to change your number.
How is your NC standing, Kim e?
I don’t think I’ve seen you commenting much lately… Sorry if I missed it.
Had a set back. Going to talk to HG. Thanks for checking.
For a normal you are ok….lol
Hope = inaction. Inaction is not conducive to change. Don’t hope. Change.
It definitely is a sick and embarrassing addiction.
There is something terribly wrong with me when it comes to narcs. I realised this before HG said it was an addiction. I met a somatic lesbian narc online and I ended up wanting to speak with her everyday; and when it occurred to me that she was a narc I said to myself “damn! I am really fucked up!” HG is 100% correct.
I am noticing a big red flag is a magnetic draw to someone—its always a person I have questions about. There are two of them currently, one likely an upper mid range elite and one whiny mid middle elite peach eating thing. The peach eater is less enticing when I’m not actively being molested. The other one is likely to be more a draw down the road and I need to work on this. He’s exceptionally alluring due to his social stuff and his charm. The peach eater is boring basically but the sex is the draw. It’s going to make me feel cheap if I do it—I know it. The other one could keep me on my toes longer. I’m a sick person. HG needs to fix it.
Being in a relationship with an empath is probably the main thing that is saving me from sleeping with narcs. I’m not saying I would ever commit to one again, but I would probably still be dating them before realising they are narcs.
HG needs to put you in a chastity belt 😆
Haha—Witch—I am not sleeping with a narcissist. They just appeal and it was actually quite a revelation to understand this. I want to be around aliens in human body suits. How F’d up that is. It’s absolutely twisted after my life being such a mess. I did HG’s no human contact program already though and dropped out. I wasn’t even allowed to have water.
You will probably find that a mixture of narcs and empath men will appeal to you. Sometimes we fall into the trap of being extra negative about ourselves, I’m guilty of that on a daily basis. But I can assure you you’re not only attracted to narcs.
There are empath men out there who smell nice with good genes and thick penises who you will be drawn to, trust me. And they don’t expect much, a smile from a good woman is enough.
I’m happy to hear you’re saving yourself for an empath man.
Listen to the song “one man” by Vanessa Bling (not in front of the children, wear head phones 😆)
I won’t make the vein in HG’s forehead pulsate by linking the YT url.
I wouldn’t go so far as to say “saving myself.” Haha—I have something up my sleeve but I’m not discussing it further on here. No narcissists though. No. But.. Working through the allure is appearing to be a challenge because it’s part of my nature. A huge part. I think I can safely avoid some slippery slopes, but it’s not honest to say I don’t “want a hit” of it. It’s insanity. If I was aware of the amount of work that I had in store for me upon arrival here I never could have comprehended. In fact, I’ll reveal that even knowing better I could still easily end up engaging with a few men in my life that are narcissists. And that’s the “hit”—one likely upper mid and I know, and he knows exactly and instinctively what is going on. It’s unspoken. Fortunately, he does little clinical work so we don’t cross paths as often which helps. I recognize he is a problem for me. It’s magnetic. What to do with it is not in the scope of my understanding, so I’m here just working it out. I know the answers will come.
No, Lorelei. *You* need to fix it.
But that’s only if you want to.
Magnetism is fun, until it is not.
I just came back to reassure you that you won’t feel a magnetic connection to all narcs who are attracted to you and empaths also have magnetic attractions to other empaths.
I have a magnetic attraction towards my girlfriend.
And there’s a guy at work who I suspect fancies me and I feel he’s a narc although he hasn’t really done anything which proves it, I just feel that he is. And I don’t feel anything at all for him expect a bit creeped out. It’s the way he stares, it throws me off.
He invited me out for “group” drinks which happens to fall on Valentine’s Day. I may be reading too much into it. But I’m going to come up with an excuse not to go.
I knew I was messed up when we watched Olivier as Richard III in my high school English class, and I thought, “Damn, he’s hot!” Was I attracted to Olivier as Henry V, Olivier as Hamlet, even Olivier as (a too-sanitized) Heathcliff? Nope, had to be the total psychopath.
I wrote above but as a contagion, carrier martyr empath with super, standard and geyser minors some very minor…. I wonder if it is an addiction or our essence that we apply to all. Our need to nourish life. To use a sappy term to make the world a better place … humans, animals, plants… the inner need to lift. To go to the Light. Yes narcs are like moths to the flame but aren’t all if your sole or soul desire is true and it’s aim is to better. Day by day. ? I am far from perfect but I am only me and feel my best helping another. One thing I have noticed is narcs try to take that focus and narrow it to just them so you don’t feel like you. By the way I have seen you on this blog and your comments always interest me. You have a great mind!
Hello Kimberly Manning
I am a Contagion Empath
It’s an addiction, no different then any other addiction.
I am not here to “help” I am here to show the brutal truth. Most can not handle this.
I don’t know if you had an Empath detector or self diagnosis as a Contagion, I am curious thou.
What abilities do you possess? You mention you noticed HGs kind try to take the focus so you don’t feel like you.
It reminded me of a conversation I had with my ex a Greater.
Hi Twilight! Oh no a greater! To reply my fellow contagion… first HG gave me “my verdict “ after submitting to his empath test. But I have a mix… mainly contagion carrier martyr but also geyser, super, co… although they are Much smaller slivers if the empath pie. I don’t think of it as special. I think of it more like my belly fat around my waist just part of me, and sometimes mysterious why it’s always there;) But I have had and do have very unusual dreams. I wrote about this and met a highly educated possible doctor? Who went into great detail how empath dreams are different. Mine are like movies, can be lucid, all five senses sometimes, in color, can involve deceased or places and people I see but never have met outside my dreams but I have also had “ prophetic dreams.” These are different. Very cold. And you wake up tired. Only a few but my best friend from law school was killed and she showed me things that happened. Anyway I wrote down the dream and the time of death .for example .. I saw a clock that said 2:17 am over and over And in court her parents told me the clock time fell within the LA coroners estimate of 2:00 to 2:30, or some very small range. There were other things jenni showed me that confirmed prosecution theories such as a notebook that said Len money. The prosecution said her boyfriend killed her as they were fighting as she lent him money… and there’s more… and other equally strange dreams…I don’t want people to think I am a liar or nuts or that I am psychic. I have never ever experienced one true psychic experience in my life outside of this. And there aren’t many. But since a child… part of me life experience. I once went to a library event on interpreting dreams and was shocked as a large audience and when I shared my experiences… truth no one was the same. Some similar in experience and that fascinated me… It’s great to meet someone who has the same experiences especially if odd. But most, no. I asked my atheist neurologist good friend years ago about my dreams…and she knows I am solid and well educated… and she simply shrugged and said “ some things cannot be explained.” But if empathy brains are wired different. Maybe there is an explanation based on science? I am privately religious so I have my own theories. But like other empaths.. . I get an inordinate amount of people who ask me to help them with their problems. I go the extra mile sometimes at personal fatigue. And strangers just share. Just yesterday some lady walked up to me at the beach out of the blue and told me about her health issues and wait loss and I felt her loneliness So I took her email and sent her a text that I hoped I would see her again. Simple tiny act of kindness This is a normal day for me. Retail clerks, the man down the hall, a passing neighbor. Probably it’s my profession more than anything. In my profession I have always had insight and knew what the other side was feeling. Voices. I can feel what’s going on without seeing or meeting someone sometimes. But maybe everyone can? The weird thing is animals. For example my dog is a Frenchie, Clouseau, and I feel his muscles tensed to go to the dog park even when he is in the back seat of the car…it makes me tense …. my kids…I know… but every mom probably is like that…. But humans effect me too. But again we all feel others pain. I am blessed with a great family, friends, children, co workers … I help others everyday… definite carrier… but to me it’s an honor to help.. shouldn’t you rarely be the one helping than helped… ? So not special… and I am far far far from perfect..have narc traits, I lose it, can be a bitch. I am oh so human. In fact my many mistakes might have made me an empath as you gain such compassion through suffering…. and my choice of husbands… I did suffer when I left the sociopath. Protected my kids I hope from seeing it but he had me fearing for my life. Not in a lesser way. Anyway that’s 12 years ago and we coparented very well. Not one word spoken since our divorce lol. But we stuck to the court order and did not alienate or bash… nor did we talk. I pray my empathic young daughter chooses better later in life and son… but my Marine is a “ logical thinker” ! He actually used that term and I thought of HG. My Current Second…I really need to take the test. He has some mid ranger traits but very empathetic in other ways. He quit drinking and changed….But issues exist in other ways…my gut says he is damaged from a narc mother who controls and manipulates him in a way that negates in my mind the title mother. Sorry my response is long. But please share your “ contagion” experiences. And yes… addiction in narc love … yes. That’s why I read everything HG writes. HG is brilliant. I have referred a few friends and they are “ devotees” too. I look forward to all of his future works… I told him that would love visuals. His tales?! Can you imagine little short films. Best wishes Twilight. By the way twilight is my very favorite time of evening and the colors…. ahhh. Good choice of name! I need a moniker.
Quick question from contagion to contagion as my last response was probably too long ( I am detailed oriented.) Have you ever looked in the eyes of a sociopath and felt nothing. I have. Just pressures shifting maybe. I used to be in criminal prosecution and had a few experiences with murderers. Like goat eyes only goats have more emotion. ? I think personality disorders have a spectrum too.
Their eyes are empty, yet I feel the rage simmering underneath, I don’t lie to myself anymore and accept what is.
I pick up what I call images off of people, doesn’t matter who you are Empath, normal, narcissist it has been my saving grace and my downfall, depends on the situation.
I was stranded once in Tennessee and walking the highway to the next off ramp and a man stopped and asked if I wanted a ride. I looked in at him and was hit with a wave of “energy” that felt suffocating, and I swear I saw him lick his lips (I have been told I imagine seeing things) I got this image of him stabbing into someone. I told him no I was fine and at that moments state police was passing by and saw us. He drive off…..a week later I saw a report where this same man was arrested for stabbing a woman who looked similar to me to death later that same night.
This is just one thing that has happened all my life and the one that gets me into trouble when I let my compassion and sympathy control and not logic.
Brutal truth is uncomfortable as hell and energy never lies if one understands it.
Abe, good to see you here again. I wonder if a normal may be more inclined due to some conditioning from exposure within their lives or from family members. Anyway, I wish I were more immune and appreciate the honesty of not understanding going back, etc. I’ve often thought the empath thing was bananas. Until now. It’s doesn’t mean I’m not an ass at times. I was stressed in Macy’s and got snippy with a sales clerk and embarrassed my daughter. I was under a ton of stress trying to get her shoes and tired. Empathic people do shitty things but the traits of truth seeking (For example) can make us look crazy and the normals are even scratching their heads. There is no better or worse—just different.
Good to see you too, Lorelei.
I’ve been thinking some more about this, and I still don’t have a definitive answer re the addiction.
HG says the addiction to narcs is an exclusive attribute of empaths, and I’m not one. So I shouldn’t be addicted, no matter how much exposure I might have from my past.
I can interpret my feeling of being addicted to her in some other ways:
– For example that I’m only addicted to the GP, the rest of the mess does not attract me at all and I would not take it for long. As IPSS, I did not sustain a real hard period of devaluation (except some short corrective ones), so I could not see the rest of the mess in its entirety, which made me stick to the mirage.
– I’m actually quite good at generating GP-like periods for my lovers. I can get quite infatuated sometimes and this might be a sort of internal addiction, to the way I feel when I am infatuated. So not necessarily to the narc’s GP, but to my own…
– Another explanation could be that actually I am not addicted at all, it’s just my mind that was used for so long to think this way that now the idea is hard to pluck out of my brain.
– Or that I mistook the after-N depression and anxiety (I think I had some sort of PTSD?) for an addiction withdrawal, while this is just the normal (time-limited) response of anybody being involved with a N. The addiction is something more permanent, more complex, and harder to overcome.
Abe—I love this assimilation of thoughts. There may also be excitement triggers you are inclined to gravitate to that this affair satisfied. Like someone that jumps out of airplanes—thrill seeking?
You may recall that I said I’d be really interested on what your Empath results would be. I thought you were a normal!…which gives me every reason to believe my first (high school) boyfriend is a normal too (too long to detail why and nobody cares — but he’s actually expressed to me so much the same also, on what you just stated here).🙂
Yes, now that you mention it, I remember 🙂
You were right then…
You’re normal! You’re normal! You’re normal!🤸♀️
HG might say you are a Normal but in my book you are a good guy that has been thru it and back. Normals get hurt just like empaths do. And if you have not been sweet and honest and loving and tolerant the N would not have picked you.
It is a mind F no matter how you look at it. Your posts have helped me see reality again. I see it and then that damn ET takes over. My LT kicks in when I read your posts.
Dont try and figure out the why’s of a normal versus and empath. Just be you………..
Going to BLOCK an N now for the last time.
Thank you for your kind words.
I am actually not worried or “upset” at all that I am not an empath. It probably helps me better deal with my Nx situation, and I don’t feel like missing much by not having to empathetically care for all people in the world. Caring for those around me is satisfying and exciting enough.
In my case, the solution might be to just push my Nx far enough from my circle of empathic interest and then my empathy for her would simply vanish. How to do that… still working on it. She’s still somewhere in my periphery.
About the “why’s of a normal versus an empath” – I am actually curious about the differences, their causes and how they manifest in terms of addiction to narcissists. It might help understanding myself and others. That’s never a bad thing or something to avoid.
I’ve learned so much since coming here, and I still wonder when will I have enough of this knowledge? Like get bored of all this empaths and normals and narcs thing…
Hello Abe Moline!
Good to see you.
Glad to see you!
I’m just making a short come back, I thought it would be useful to share my result and opinions about it here. Actually, I never fully left KTN, just did not post anymore.
Hello Abe Moline!
It’s difficult to stay away. Thank you for sharing your results and opinions because that helps us all understand the Narcissistic/Empathic dynamic better. It’s all about the learning on narcsite. It was nice to you commenting again.
Abe, thank you for sharing your results.
Regarding your addiction to your Nx, I have a feeling about what may have happened. Of course, I could be wrong, but this is what I gather from what you have written here . . . .
You mentioned that Nx was quite close to your family prior to your entanglement.
I wonder if that’s how/when she watched, waited, and learned about you within your family dynamics and then figured out (unconsciously) what she would need to do in order to snag you.
You say she “became attracted” to you and “accepted your probing advances.” My guess is it happened the other way around: that you were the Sitting Target who never saw her coming.
Re your post to Abe: “You mentioned that Nx was quite close to your family prior to your entanglement. I wonder if that’s how/when she watched, waited, and learned about you within your family dynamics and then figured out (unconsciously) what she would need to do in order to snag you.”
I think that is possible. A female narcissist gave other women some ‘advice’ during an interview. She said that if you are interested in a man, you have to befriend his parents or any other family member first. She said she had befriended his future husband’s sister first.
My husband told me about one his narc sisters. She was interested in a man who lived in a different town. His parents lived in another one. First, she moved to his parents’ town and befriended them. She used her alcoholic father’s abuse to play the poor victim role. His parents felt pity for her. They thought she was a decent individual who would be a good wife for their son. Their son married her and they had children. She said that if her marriage did not work, she would still have his brother(!). His brother is happily married now.
A couple of years ago she left her husband and children and moved to another continent to marry a man she had met online.
My husband told me other things about her including how she used to plan what she would do to other people to meet her needs.
Sorry for the late reply, I’ve been out for a few days due to a damn flu… Couldn’t even think straight, let alone do it in English… I’m ok now.
I have thought about it too. She was my wife’s best friend for a while, sort of. My wife is definitely an empath, so I guess she was the original target. Also, Nx knew a lot about the relationship between me and my wife.
I think I became interesting for her when we started spending more time together so we got to know each other. Indeed, she was the one to move decisively, I was more like playing with fire for a while, but probably wouldn’t have dared crossing the final line without her doing it first. Which, interestingly, she denied afterwards, said that it was nothing out of the ordinary and I’m exaggerating. She was seated next to me, away from her husband, and she was almost stuck to me like a stamp, poking me in fun and touching me and having her foot resting carelessly on mine. Well, I might be blind as a bat when it comes to a woman liking me, but dammit, she was definitely all over me that evening. Never understood why she denied it (until I got here, that is). I think she wanted me to be the one getting blamed for our adventure, she could not bear be seen as “whorish”, and it was also an early attempt to gaslight.
Anyway, the idea is, this was a two way street. What I mentioned above is the conclusion of weeks or months of mutual probing. It’s hard to determine now (at least for me) who started all of this.
I did my part of the game, too, I’m not blameless.
Thank you sharing. Great input! I had no idea what I was. I was deemed mostly contagion and carrier and martyr with super, standard and geyser. A mutt empath! Asked HG what matter was “ martyr empath” he said “ doormat.” Lol But you speak specifically about your experiences and outlooks. For me, everyday I feel the need to nourish and lift up anyone I meet… could be my sons friends, the ladies at the office, the retail clerks, my clients, my family of course or dogs at a dog park or plants. I only feel myself by doing so. I feel strong and LUCKY to be able to help then be helped. But I have been ensnared in some romantic relations with an antisocial and possible mid range narc. It is so counter to my essence that I was thrown into confusion. HG solved my need to know. With knowledge comes power whatever the test result. Very eager to know more about what creates empathy, and normals in his future books. I have referred many to him but I always say.. do the test to know thyself! I personally believe it’s just as important or more so than knowing every detail of a narc. I thank HG for having insight to see the other coin but always wonder how a narc could describe an empath with such detail. I appreciate your contribution to “ normal.” Many of my friends are… best wishes!
I know you can’t see the comment I am referring to yet was hmmm put off by my impression a Contagion is a “doormat”.
I have gotten that impression from a few others that are SEs that we are the weakest link in this empathy chain.
People are entitled to what they believe……
Empathy doesn’t make one weak, it is used to understand another’s position, compassion is a choice one makes to help another and sympathy is just a feeling, to many mix up sympathy and empathy.
A Contagion masters the energy of life….we feel it, we see it and have a unique understanding of it…..yet I have learned from you my dear HG so do Greaters in a different way yet a firm understanding of it.
A Contagion can “feel” and “see” the wound that needs healing or more accurately put dealt with it is nothing more then negative energy one is holding on to that helps bind one to a narcissist. The seed of the addiction……
HG your work is extremely accurate in helping my kind deal with things in a logical manner.
You were right I belong here…..
Sorry to hear you’ve gotten that impression about contagions from commenters here.
I actually think contagions are the most interesting class of empaths.
I’m minority contagion. And even though it only effects me slightly, it definitely can have a big impact over time. What I mean is that the contagion ability wears me down over time, but because it is a minority aspect I can differentiate my feelings from others and suppress contagion effects.
I imagine being contagion gives you psychic like abilities?
Thank-you for this comment Twilight!
(I always read your contributions because I get glimmers into what being a Contagion empath is all about.) But also, it triggered me into going back and reading “The Doormat” – I mean *really* reading it and I finally grasp what a Doormat is…and it’s not what I thought it is.
Hope you are well, Twilight.
Thank you for sharing. It was very interesting.
It’s been a long time since I last saw you posting on this blog. I hope you are doing well.
HG, is it possible to be a super empath – a magnet and a dirty empath simultaneously? And if so, is this a common combination?
It is and no it is not.
Thank you for replying….. The Detector test sounds very interesting, and I’m interested in taking it..
Is it possible to be a super dirty empath?
No, but you can be a Dirty Super Empath.
Not me—I’m of stellar moral upstanding character at all times.
General question: Is the carrier cadre the most common one? The poll results show a different distribution but of course, self-assessments may not always be realistic due to a lack of objectivity.
You are correct with regard to the lack of objectivity. Nearly nobody has 100% of a particular cadre, but has varying percentages of two or more cadres. Carrier Cadre does feature frequently and is common.
I realise that I wasn’t specific in my initial question – I was referring to the prevalence of the relevant ‘domineering’ cadre among empaths. I assume the poll results reflect where people see themselves with regard to their ‘domineering’/majority cadre hence my curiosity in that regard. Thank you for your answer.
You are welcome.
Can you elaborate on this contagion piece? I don’t wear Birkenstock’s or do palm readings.
I am not clear on what you are referring to, Lorelei, could you elaborate ?
The concept of contagion—how would you recognize this in a person? That is what I meant.. What do you believe the origin of such a quality?
By the identification of particular traits, by the way they behave, act and speak. The origin will be addressed in the material about this subject matter.
I’m curious as it was a feature noted per the empath thing. That’s all!
HG, you stated here that nobody has 100% of a particular cadre.
You analysed me as a hybride empath with 100% Martyr cadre.
Am I the only one with a 100 % cadre?
Nearly nobody has 100%, Auti Amp (I missed a word when typing too quickly), it is unusual to find somebody who is 100% of a cadre, but it can occasionally happen as was the case in your situation.
Aha oké, thank you, i understand it now.
You are welcome.
Hi HG 🙂 What would you say if a Narcissist or a Normal person took the Empath Detector? Thanks
If an individual takes the test which does not result in a finding that the individual belongs to the empath group, then that is what they are told.
Standard Empath, Carrier Cadre with an element of SE/saviour. I was relatively accurate in my self-assessment prior to the Empath Detector Consultation here on the blog, except that I don’t have any codependent tendencies according to the results.
You are welcome Narc noob.
Anyone care to share what the detector told them? What cadre or school of empath they got?
I did the Empath Detector consultation and found the result to be very precise, confirming – and further elucidating.
I’m a Standard Carrier*, with elements of Super/Magnet, empath.
I don’t find the label limiting; as I find it explains *tendencies* in my behaviour – with regard to how I interact with narcissists – and I’ve found it explains past choices and has been most useful in some present decisions that I need to make in my life.
Highly recommended; even if you’re just someone interested in self-knowledge.
*K, remember our past discussions?
Thanks WC, I wonder if you had previously labelled yourself before doing the test?
Yes. I had tried very hard, with much reading and a lot of self-reflection. And I was pretty close – but the results reveal why I couldn’t pinpoint it.
I most certainly do! I am a Standard Carrier, too.
K, funny how all the carrier kind have commented. I think I am high carrier also – I just wouldn’t fair well looking after a terminally ill, disabled or the elderly for too long. 3 kids are quite enough – so that empathetic trait of the carrier isn’t strong.
Carriers are a popular cadre and there are plenty of them here. I have three children, too, so I understand why caring for an elderly or sick individual would be too difficult. We have to be practical because there is only so much one person can do. If I had plants, they would all be dead because I would forget to water them. I know my limitations.
” If I had plants, they would all be dead because I would forget to water them. I know my limitations.”
Ditto what you said; if the plants don’t come and tap me on the shoulder saying they are thirsty…well, survival of the ambulant!
Ha ha ha…your comment reminded me of Little Shop of Horrors- Feed Me. In my world, if it is ambulant, then it can get it’s own water and food; I don’t have time for plants.
That made me laugh – Little Shop of Horrors is hilarious. I can relate to all the limitations mentioned – I am a Carrier Empath of the selfish variety.
Feed Me, Seymour! That had a great cast and I had forgotten that John Candy was in the movie.
Part of being practical is being selfish but it is motivated by a sense of responsibility. It is about balance and reasonableness and there is nothing wrong with that type of selfishness.
Carriers are grounded, practical, pragmatic and excellent problem solvers. – The Carrier Empath
Indeed and then Steve Martin as the sadistic dentist.. haha.
I entirely agree re “selfish”, “balance” and “responsibility” for oneself and others – it is essential and I consider it a matter of self-respect and self-awareness to know one’s limitations and protect one’s ressources by having firm, healthy boundaries.
Ha ha ha…Steve Martin is fantastic!
Good boundaries are very important for healthy relationships with family, work or friends. They keep your sanity intact.
Haha “Little Shop of Horrors”…such a memorable movie!
I hear you; a friend of mine has rooted, nursed – and now planted in a pot – a cutting from one of her plants…because I’m looking for new residence…so she’ll give this well-cared for ‘baby’ of hers away…to me…when it’s time.
“well, survival of the ambulant!”
That really made me laugh.
I am carrier also. I felt the same way as you all are saying because I can be selfish. But my job is a carrier job, I didn’t get all that til I did the detector thing. I also am a carrier with psychological things and I think a lot of people on here are. I now notice myself doing it pretty much every single time I talk to a narc, it’s almost how I can detect them easiest, if I start trying to reassure them about something it’s either a narc or an empath, though some narcissists don’t go into that dynamic. Sometimes it happens within minutes of meeting them.
I think this is the thread.
Ooh, thanks K. This is also the one on MB’s creature…will have to have a re-read later…
Much appreciated, K! ♡
My pleasure WhoCares!
Hello K and WhoCares,
Thank you so much for sharing this link, K! I read through all the comments and was incredibly moved by the bravery of MB sharing her trauma experience and her resulting fear of the dark kernel within. I want MB to know I see every part of her as more than good enough. Brave, compassionate, intelligent, caring and resilient come to mind, MB. I was equally impressed with the honest and caring replies from Windstorm, NarcAngel, Twilight and others. I’m grateful you are all here. It would be a sad day if any of you left. And K leaving? The defender of justice and master magician of finding all links? No way. We would pay you to stay 😉
For those that suffer from a critical inner voice (very common even if it seems like your voice), confronting your inner critic sets you free. Fact find (seek logical evidence) of truth against the criticisms that seek to keep you stuck in shame. Talk back to that voice with your truth (intent and facts). You are not the toxic shame you feel. Not at all. Behaviors are what we do, not who we are. We all make mistakes. When this happens, healthy guilt draws us to take action to realign with our values. Conversely, shame creates false beliefs that we are bad people (partially or fully) versus that we took a bad action. When we are young, if guilt, shaming and blaming occur (these can be veiled) by those we seek validation from, this can plant the seed of shame. Do not believe the lies. I’f anyone would like links to research in this area let me know. I borrowed liberally from their works to construct this reply.
You are all amazing. Thank you for being here. I am grateful.
My pleasure FYC!
And, thank you for your kind words. Ha ha ha…you cracked my up. It would be a sad day if Windstorm, NarcAngel, Twilight, MB or any of the others left. WS is on hiatus and MB is NC at the moment but I hope she pops back in again and others have cycled in and out. It is always nice to see them come back. I am happy you found your way here and I am truly grateful for you and the others, as well. It is very difficult to find support for this type of abuse and Narcsite provides both support and accurate information. It is definitely an amazing place.
Thank-you for your very considerate words and your very practical suggestions on dealing with the ‘inner critic’ – I think we all try to deal with that inner voice in each our own way.
It bothers me when I read of MB’s internal thoughts – not for the fact that she shares them; that is valuable – but because we see the evidence of what a lovely person she is – and how she just needs to tell that inner criticising voice to shut the heck up! Lol. (But of course, it is not always so straightforward and simple.)
It also bothers me when I read of Windstorm’s admittance that she gets very depressed and feels alone because she is constantly aware of how she affects other people, and acts in a way that is mindful of this but then feels…resentful…(I think? maybe she’ll correct me when she’s back) when others are not mindful (or even aware) of how they affect her, or those around them.
Anyway, it feels a bit weird not reading their contributions, as of late, and I wish them both well!
FYC: on your reflections/feedback – agreed, there are some very special people contributing here who, occasionally, fail to see their value.
Hello WhoCares, Thank you for your kind and thoughtful reply. It is that last part of your reply that spurred me to comment in recognition of you all. You are all impressive. Yet, as you aptly noted, it is an individual process to accept the fullness of ourself—the parts we feel good about and those we may wish to change. I just felt I would share my observations rather than withhold what I see. I do believe your user name stands for one who cares, versus the rhetorical question of who cares? 😉
“I do believe your user name stands for one who cares, versus the rhetorical question of who cares?”
In the beginning, FYC – when I signed on to the blog – I didn’t have the confidence to name myself in any other way.
After that, I left it open to interpretation.
Thank-you for your particular interpretation. ♡
One Who Cares, you have come very far from that day indeed. Spelling out your name that way sounds like an American Indian name honoring your heart. Very apt, but I’ll return to WhoCares as it is shorter 😉
WC, I did not see that about how windstorm felt, but it doesn’t surprise me. I feel that way all the time and didn’t have a description for it. It eats at me. And I feel guilty for feeling like that. I will sit in a conversation and intentionally effect the feelings of the person that I’m talking to. It’s easy for me, I don’t know why. It’s not like I can fix their problems, I can’t, but I usually with expressions and emotion and understanding effect them to at least a temporarily more comfortable place. I will often spend automatic effort and intention to do it and it flows but then when anything switches to me the other person feels absent to me. Most of the time it isn’t too bad, but other times when there is a lot weighing on me I feel distraught. It makes me want to be away from people. Every once in awhile, not very often, I snap at someone about it.
I hope I didn’t make windstorm feel that way ever, but it is possible, but I can say that I still feel things from people, it is hard to communicate online sometimes.
I’m glad you said that because I’d not heard anyone say it like that before. When I feel resentful I feel bad about it, like my expectations are whacked, but I also feel like (with in person interactions) there is a very obvious difference between how my energy communicates and how most other people’s does and sometimes it builds up after a series of things that compile.
To clarify, my comments about Windstorm were not from any one thread, nor were they directed at people here on the blog, but in her real life. (At least her statements lead me to believe that but I guess it could be more generalized.) My observations were just gleaned from more than one comment of hers that I have read. But I don’t know if I understand her completely and the Contagion element contributes to her experience and I certainly don’t claim to understand that perspective.
However, I’m glad for your input on sharing the ‘energy’ exchange when you interact with others. (Not that I fully understand your words; but I chalk that up to it being difficult to explain anyway). Because in trying to understand others here and making the connections with my own experience I have come to some conclusions. I am not a Contagion but I have come to realize that I’m hyper-vigilant of my ‘effect’ on people – from my actual physical presence to my mood and every action and decision. (No wonder we like the occasional drink etc…to nullify that…and be more ‘natural’ – it is absolutely exhausting – no wonder we want to take off – sometimes to the ends of the earth in order to avoid interacting, in the slightest, with another human being.)
I know personally, especially in situations like riding in the subway in a big city, that I’m always tuned in to ‘space’…like where exactly I’m situated…and am I invading anyone’s space…is my elbow poking them…are my belongings crossing that ‘invisible’ line that indicates their personal bubbles…etc…and I take offense when others do not respect this. (I know it’s a cultural thing too and I make allowances for that.) But this level of consciousness plays into every step I take in a day – if I let it. That is why I recall enjoying living in a big city because ‘anonymity’ relieves some of that…or being so bone tired you just don’t care as much about it…I never thought of it as ‘energy’ or emotion per se, but maybe that’s because I’m more in tune with my body? For example, I’m very tactile and sensitive to textures, taste sensation, touch…etc…and I can read the body language of others more readily than I can guess their thoughts.
Does that make any sense?
WC, yes, I know you weren’t referring to anything, I appreciate what you said because it’s something I’d picked up on a bit prior to this conversation, so I was very curious. And also it’s something specifically I had been trying to talk about and ask people about but I’ve never been able to do it actually because I couldn’t put those words to it and they really resonated with me, she said it well, whatever she did say over time. It’s a feeling I feel the need to address and process so I can settle with it a little bit and I get the “alone” as a result feeling. I feel like I’m not supposed to feel that way, if that makes any sense.
Yes I know what you are saying with the space and the sensitivity, I very much feel like that. I shared a little bit with HG on contagion and I hope it is helpful, but I’ve no idea. I hope we get to read more about it : ) I feel like mine goes up and down or in and out or something, but it is there. I’ve got a mess of schools and cadres it seems, but a couple of primaries. The anonymity makes sense too. Thank you for sharing, it was helpful to me.
To clarify; you feel resentful of people because they are not as equally conscious of how they affect others – as you yourself are? And this makes you feel guilty for resenting them? I’m just reiterating to make sure I understood you.
It is definitely difficult to put words to…from what I understand from those here who are Contagions, I know I’m not one – certainly not on the level with regard to their ability to feel emotions.
But I know from having shared living quarters where I am now that I am ultra conscious of not over-stepping the boundaries of others – but I don’t just mean emotional boundaries – I mean *everything* boundaries…to the point where it actually gets difficult to function. I think this is purely a product of narcissistic parenting and further narcissistic entanglement. It is like Windstorm has communicated that you just feel “wrong” all the time.
For me, this is currently playing out, because I am a guest in someone else’s house I am constantly assessing how I can contribute but at the same time not be in the way…like I want to do the dishes late at night (cause my son is asleep), but I might wake them up by making too much noise – but then if I wait…I get busy doing things for my son…the dishes sit, then someone else does them and I feel guilty for not getting them done earlier (this is a simplistic example) but it’s partly as a result of feeling like I can’t do ‘enough’ or the right things at the right time; which is what is communicated repeatedly by a narcissist. It is just as if I am constantly assessing how to do the least harm…that when I get ‘nothing’ done I then beat myself up when in actuality I was doing stuff. And then it just spirals into feeling depressed etc…
Even when I choose to protect them by making sure I keep my emotions in check and keep my “stress” to myself – I still cause them harm or ‘stress’ by not talking with them…because then they have no clue what’s going on and they are concerned/worried – it’s like I can’t win for trying. Now, these people are empathetic so if I do try to explain it to them, they do understand but continue to fall into the same patterns. It is actually a bit more hurtful to me than a narcissistic entanglement…because I’m causing genuine hurt feelings and stress to people who have been very kind, supportive and understanding to my situation. And I’ve learned I really need to move on.
Sorry to hijack the topic with that personal story but it illustrates how the damage can play out in relationships with normals and/or other empaths.
It just gets depressing and feels as if you could just stop causing ‘hurt’ to people or affecting others you’d feel better yourself – hence the desire to go live in the middle of the desert…or a cabin in the woods…or a hole in the ground.
I think this need must be even more intense and pressing for a Contagion but it wears on other empaths too.
WhoCares, I know exactly what you are talking about!
I have felt exactly what you are describing. I am so sorry you are feeling that way right now, I think it’s related. I experienced it living with my parents also, even briefly as an adult, but also as a child probably. I think that it is worse than what I am describing right now as far as physical feeling in many ways. I was never successful living in shared space with others because of what you are describing. I felt so much better when I was able to avoid it and have my own space.
I think now I have enough freedom that my skin is a bit thicker so I go through it less. It seems like it highly depends on life circumstances how to manage it. I often feel out of sorts with “normal” people, and I often feel they are narcissistic, but at the same time I had to practice not acting like a narcissist for years anyway while balancing emotional responses. I have been thinking that’s what can make narcissists attractive. I remember when I was living with an abusive lesser he and I decided to see a counselor and when I had a therapy session alone with a young man I told him a short synopsis of my issue. He was new to therapy and looked at me with nothing but concern and asked me why I would stay. I remember even his kind facial expression made me feel disconnected, like he couldn’t explain to me anything because he just didn’t know. I see that differently now, but he likely had no experience with my perspective, so there was no recognition. He acknowledged that though and I moved to another therapist.
So I don’t know if what I’m talking about is contagion related or not anyway. It sounds similar to what you are saying. I have a friend who has a lot of life stress and when she explains it to me my responses are easing and give perspective that she can take or leave for herself, but they help and are meant to contribute to her internal feelings independently. When I share my situation the response is more that she’s had that happen also and overcame it herself, so I feel it’s dismissive. It’s not intentional, it’s just that she can’t feel me acutely enough to remove judgment or something. I was telling you about my male friend who was picking apart the accuracy of details I was saying. That is because what he wants out of conversation with me is different than what I need? These things often don’t bother me too much, but during a time when there’s a few issues at once and it happens with several people I get extra reactive and aggravated and want to be away.
Isn’t that the thread you called me an ocean of emotion?
That has stuck with me.
Ha ha ha…yes, that is the thread.
MAY 24, 2018 AT 15:01
That is a great song and when I read Twilight’s comment, I immediately thought of Mumbo # 5. She is a little bit of every cadre; an ocean of emotion.
Yesssss!!!!! And it is stuck with me.
I heard Mumbai #5 the other day and thought of you.
Ha ha ha…ever presence! Whenever I hear that song, I think of you and HG. Also, the Twilight Saga reminds me of you, as well.
I’m all the things too Twilight. It makes me want to hide under my blankets.
I have a funny question to ask fellow contagions but… I feel the energy even of dogs… my beautiful Clouseau ( yes the inspector, a Frenchie)…. he stresses me without knowing it as I feel his need to run full speed. Humans yes but also animals. You?
Hi Narc noob, I found out that I’m a Standard Empath- Carrier and Geyser!