Poll : What Do You Believe The Narcissist To Be?

POLL _ HG WANTS TO KNOW

You know from reading my work that there are varying schools and cadres of narcissist which encompasses those individuals who are unaware of what they are and bowl through life like an out of control wrecking ball wreaking havoc and destruction and not casting a backwards glance. Others of our kind are charming, apparently pleasant and kind, yet behind that facade there is always someone who is suffering. Some of our kind are high achievers, ruthless leaders and bold pioneers who always get their way, no matter what the cost to others but as ever, the end justifies the means. Others of the brethren always grab the limelight, are show-offs and prone to bold boasts. There are those who are passive aggressive, sniping from the side lines, scurrying here and there as they play the “always the victim, it’s never their fault” card because people are just downright horrible to them despite their best efforts to please and help others. These are but some of the manifestations of our kind. Yes, we come in a variety of “flavours”.

But what do you actually think we are? In the comments sections across my various platforms I see reference to the fact that we are actually an alien life form that has somehow blended in with humans, not quite able to replicate humans but doing a convincing job a lot of the time. Some suggest we are also victims, people who have suffered in a way similar to way that we make other people suffer. There is a begrudging respect for the brilliance we can exhibit but tempered with the caveats for the price that is paid for staring at the sun for too long. Views range from possession by demons or dark spirits through to a toddler in an adult’s body.

What is your view? You may choose as many as you deem applicable from the list below before casting your vote and as usual, do furnish me with your interesting and articulate views in the comments section.

Thank you for participating.

 

What do you believe the narcissist to be?

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182 Comments

  1. Twilight,

    I know you can sense them. And you’ve explained what a double-edged sword that is, so I’m pretty sure I would not want your ‘gift’. I cannot sense them but I’m getting much better at identifying them in my personal life; online it is much more difficult – so it’s better to reserve judgement, yes.

    I know that an Empath can abuse, yes, being empathetic doesn’t isolate one from the capacity to do so. And I agree with you that when you challenge another’s morals and values they tend to get offended.

    I don’t know all the details of course of what happened but I hear enough from you and others that I wouldn’t, personally, want to venture near other ‘narcissistic abuse’ support groups.

    “…I wasn’t given enough time to come back with my reasons why I feel the way that I do…l wished they would have publicly accused me and brought their evidence to prove such claims.”

    Sounds like you would like resolution (naturally) to the disagreement and they’re not about to let you have that…?

    Hope you’re feeling better soon.

  2. I chose:

    An unaware, emotionally stunted individual – I feel that he really is kind of clueless to what he is. He does not have empathy, his emotions are definitely stunted. I do believe his actions and behavior is instinctual for the most part. I don’t think his intention is to ruin lives.

    A human being albeit a damaged one – Something happened to him to cause him to be this way. I’ll never know and can only assume, but I believe he is damaged.

    Capable of brilliance and impressive achievement – ok this is a slight exaggeration in his case but he IS a very intelligent person. I think he’s somewhat sold himself short in terms of the profession he’s chosen (law enforcement). But, I believe that choice was born of him wanting a positive of power and control.

    I ALMOST chose:

    So desirable, yet so dangerous – but in truth his desirability mostly ended after the love bombing. I think I desired the mask so much and when he became someone else, that desire definitely faded (leaving me with the addiction nonetheless). I think I initially desired him so much as a result of the way he made me FEEL in the golden period, versus a direct desire for HIM. Also, his awkwardness in intimacy itself leaves much to be desired!

    Great poll. Thanks, HG

  3. I chose a broke, pain-filled person because his parents molded this narcissist, therefore I also chose damaged. Capable of brilliance and impressive achievement, too, as he is a brilliant guitarist. I feel sorry for him as he doesn’t know what he is and cannot change what he is. As NarcAngel once said “pity them, briefly and from afar”. She was so right. Any entanglement with them, providing fuel to them, and trying to be their friend will only result in pain and anxiety.

  4. HG, did you get my post, don’t think it went , you know they are counting down the seconds on the internet to GOT!! OMG it’s only a few days now 😱

    1. WhoCares

      I am fine, or I will be. I am just sad when I see those I know are empaths misuse the knowledge they have acquired due to seeing things through an emotional lens.
      An Empath that becomes over zealous of pointing a finger driven by their hatred towards narcissist can do as much damage to a true victim as a narcissist.

      Be careful whom you accuse, I sense them, then observe before I accuse. If I call someone a narcissist I will have evidence to show my reason why I judged as I have.

      Someone can have high narcissistic traits and not be NPD, one can also abuse and not be NPD chances are they are a cluster B personality thou.

      I know I made a comment that is my opinion based on how I see the world that doesn’t run with what the majority of people believe, when you challenge another’s morals and values they tend to get a bit offended. Then I wasnt given enough time to come back with my reasons why I feel the way I do, as I was leaving work and had a minute to address things I found out what had happened.
      They proved to me they are just concerned with “narc slaying” anything that goes against what they believe a narcissist is, it is contagion in action. They let their hatred flow for victim narcs and could only focus on anything they perceive I said that can be considered narcissistic.

      I wished they would have publicly accused me and brought their evidence to prove such claims.

      1. Twilight on occasion you have been a repellant moxie on this site to some people, including me. I am not surprised you were treated the way you were. Who knows what you may have said to them. Not having your typical acolyte backup there like you do here made you fold. So … cry me some ice cubes.

          1. Hello Father, I confess I found a number of Baroque tryptichs churches along the why, especially yours. Are you gonna keep needling me about your crushing win forever?

        1. Singlet

          People do not have to agree with me nor do they have to like me. Yet to falsely accuse someone of being a narcissist is wrong.

          Usually when someone takes a dislike to me is due to seeing that which they do not like about themselves or that which they refuse to look at that needs to be healed.

          1. I disagree with when someone takes a dislike to you is because they don’t like themselves. That is such an overused thing to say. Utter hogwash! Some person decided it sounded good and it caught on in the vernacular. People dislike others more often than not because you said an untruth; offended them; or in gest – for the hell of it. You have attacked people in the past. Does that mean you did not like yourself or refused to look at what needed to be healed within yourself?

          2. Singlet

            Whom have I attack?

            Yes if I feel offended or hurt over something I do look within as to why I feel this way.

            There are 4 schools of empaths, Standard (largest), Co dependent, Super Empath which are in the spectrum and they are empathetic/empathetic and many if not most are HSP, what do you know of the 4th school the Contagion?

          3. Sniglet

            First off you know nothing of the Contagion if all your information has been from one article HG has written, which doesn’t even come close to what a Contagion Empath is.

            In what manner did I attack you and others? Please be specific.

            I stated if I feel offended not that I always am offended.

          4. Twilight, I know enough about the Contagion Empath reading narcsite and I could comfortably pin you into that category. You seem to satisfy all the elements of the Contagion after analysing many of your and others’ comments over a period of time posting here. The link is one example of many. Let’s call K for help if you need additional references. In my humble opinion Contagions need to relax a little more and not be so serious.

          5. Singlet

            Sense you know what makes a Contagion what are the elements that identifies one?

          6. A contagion empath would vicariously sense another person’s feelings similar to being in another’s body then have a need to address those feelings and that emotional state, even at an intimate level, and apply a certain level of empathic concern that may go beyond what is necessary. The problem with it is that they become like a wet sponge full of other’s emotions and sufferings at a conscious and unconscious level. This overwhelms them causing them to crumble. There is more I could write about a c.e. but time does not permit.

          7. Not necessarily. You need to expand on what you mean by weakness. C.Es have the strength of bonding with a variety of people in need of help. It depends on what you are trying to achieve. Would a c.e succeed at saving someone’s life cutting through their skull to remove a bullet? Would the contagion faint at the sight of blood? You would know that better than me.To say c.e.’s are the weakest empaths would not be accurate because they are strong individuals when they know their limits like any other human being.

            HG Tudor is the expert on that and I’d love to know his thoughts on how he would rate a contagion empath’s weakness in comparison with other empaths.

          8. Thank you Sniglet.

            I don’t believe HG can give an accurate account on a CE’s weaknesses in comparison to the other empaths, only due to the fact he has never known one in his private life. The last I knew he has not met one. I do believe he can give a logical assessment when comparing due to his intelligence and what he has learned of the CE.

            I would like to address your comment about CE.

            “A contagion empath would vicariously sense another person’s feelings similar to being in another’s body then have a need to address those feelings and that emotional state, even at an intimate level, and apply a certain level of empathic concern that may go beyond what is necessary.”

            For starters yes we sense another persons feeling/pain etc it isn’t like being in another person it is more like being “infected” or “invaded” I learned at a young age to separate my emotions from what was not mine. Many mistaken the feeling empathy for another is actually feeling sympathetic. I feel sympathetic towards an individual and my empathy feels what they feel which triggers my sympathy. My compassion towards the person is my empathy/sympathy in action.

            “The problem with it is that they become like a wet sponge full of other’s emotions and sufferings at a conscious and unconscious level. This overwhelms them causing them to crumble. There is more I could write about a c.e. but time does not permit.”

            I am always a “wet” sponge this doesn’t overwhelm me and cause me to crumble, in fact it is one of my strengths. You see if I feel another in such a way I know many things about the person. I know what they fear, what hurts, what causes joy. I know when they are lying not only to others yet most importantly to themselves which holds them back and stunts their growth.
            Can this cause exhaustion, yes it can. I was taught how to prevent this from happening.

            If I fall in love with a narcissist, then yes my emotional thinking “blinds” me and I hang on far longer then I would notmally.

            A relationship with a Contagion differs from the other schools due to we bond far deeper then the others. I can “consume” another if I focuses solely on them or they can “consume” me if I let them “infect” me completely.

          9. You have a special gift sensing others’ feelings. You should nurture that gift and don’t let narcissists ‘infect’ your soul. Have you ever seen a comatose person? Or a burns victim? How do you manage those situations face to face with them?

          10. Sniglet

            I don’t see my “gift” as special.

            I avoid hospitals to many shifting emotions from one extreme to another.

            As far as nurturing my gift, for the most part I avoid all narcissists.

            Blood doesn’t bother me nor the cutting into a person so long as it is to heal and not harm.

            How would I have a burn victim or comatose person, no different then I have handle other emergencies. I have been with a person who was brain dead, it was strange, if you can imagine what a body part that is completely numb, you see it yet have no feeling of it….same thing. I saw him yet nothing. What he was, was gone.

          11. “A relationship with a Contagion differs from the other schools due to we bond far deeper then the others. I can “consume” another if I focuses solely on them or they can “consume” me if I let them “infect” me completely.”

            Thank-you Twilight and Sniglet for this exchange.

            I don’t know the history between you two here, but, aside from that, it is interesting to learn more about Contagions…

            Thank-you for sharing Twilight.

          12. Thanks WhoCares!

            Twilight – I believe there is more to the contagious empath. The very sensitive ones at least. They can faint at the sight of blood, can get sick, vomit, sweat profusely when they encounter someone who is very sick ie seizure, in a coma, burnt or even cry when they hear a baby cry.

          13. Sniglet

            There is much more to a Contagion Empath that I have not gone into nor have I seen another comment here.
            A Contagion has specific traits that make them a Contagion.
            Anyone can faint at the sight of blood, can get sick, vomit, sweat profusely when they encounter someone who is very sick ie seizure, in a coma, burnt or even cry when they hear a baby cry who is empathetic/empathic/empath. These are visual cues “when they encounter” and the contagion strain in action it doesn’t make the person a Contagion.

          14. Sniglet

            What you are speaking of is not what makes a Contagion a Contagion Empath. We have specific traits that make us what we are. When we describe how we “see” the world people do not understand due to they have never experience the world in the same way we do.
            How do you think HG knew what I was, it wasn’t due to the same traits I have of other empaths, if that was the case he would have placed me in a different school of Empath. I have traits the other schools do not have which separates me from them.

            A Contagion Empath is by the original definition of Empath and not the one society has changed it to. Anyone who is empathetic/empathic (who I see as HSP) are considered Empaths. This can come about from abuse suffered which made them highly sensitive and more attuned to “visual and audio” cues so they knew how to adapt to different situations or they were already HSP and attuned to “visual and audio” cues.

  5. Narcissistic people are similar – yet different. Some are far more dangerous and full of malice than others.
    It is sad that people turn out this way due to issues they had no control over as a child.

    I’m a teacher, and it is heartbreaking to see some things young people endure. No choice. No love.

    Depending on a persons experience- many of the answers will be so very different in this poll.

    Empaths aren’t all the same – and neither are narcissists. One size does not all. But you’ll know when you have been involved with one. Forever.

    1. “………people turn out this way due to issues they had no control over as a child.”

      This is incorrect. Proof is a narcissist child or adult raised by two conservative non-smothering empaths or normals. 3 kids normal or empathetic and one nightmare narcissist. Choice is ALWAYS involved. ALWAYS.

      1. Wrong.

        It is not a matter of choice.

        See the article To Control is To Cope for the explanation as to why we are created as we are.

        The lack of control IS fundamental in our creation, Laurel is correct, you are wrong.

        1. More blame shifting by you and your kind in the field of psychology. You…chose. The behavior over the cookies 🍪 was probably a choice. “Now” you are governed by other forces but some time, long ago, you made a choice. All narcs we’re NOT abused or spoiled rotten. You were not created this way thus your “creature” that you “now” must keep imprisioned.

          1. ID, Psychologically and genetically speaking, you are incorrect. Choice is a conscious action.

            The genetic predisposition of narcissism becomes expressed when a child 0-6 years old is subjected to poor maternal attunement and or abuse. Once expressed, the defense mechanism of narcissism is subconsciously engaged and relied upon as a means of survival. Therefore, no actual choice.

          2. FYC, in your study, has any way been found to flip the switch back? Perhaps teach empathy while they are still young and developing? Thank you

          3. Hello IdaNoe, It’s a bit more complicated than that. Multiple factors are involved.

            Epigenetics may one day lead to advancements in altering the gene expression of narcissism. Epigenetics is a relatively new area of focused study. It involves the natural control mechanisms that influence gene expression. It is theorized our choices and our environment influence genetic expression, whether to ignite gene expression or halt it.

            Because genes do not dictate behavior, but lay the groundwork for behavior, even if the gene were halted, it might not effectively change NPD. My reason for theorizing this is two-fold.

            First, everyone has narcissistic traits. Healthy narcissistic traits are positive (such as self survival, self care, confidence, self esteem, self reliance, self-worth). Think of these traits and other traits on a gradient scale from 1-10. If you have too few (1) you will struggle in life. If you have too many (10) you will suffer NPD. Somewhere in the middle, you thrive.

            Second, behavior, beliefs, fears and psychological adaptations are complex. So even if the gene is halted, the memory, self-concept, attachment style and behaviors remain and would require the recognition and desire to change along with applied effort. A further complication is that many people that have NPD are not aware they do and would not seek help.

            Outside of Epigenetics, there are studies that report that behavioral modification can be successful with NPD (to a degree) when an empathetic and supportive approach is taken and the person with NPD desires to make a change and is willing.

            I apologize if my explanations are dry and technical. I am trying to be accurate as this is not my field. I am learning too. ;)

          4. FYC, Thank you for the information. It was very helpful. Both my parents had huge trauma by 6 yrs old ( loss of the same sex parent). It also helps me to understand that this wasn’t all their choice. I still don’t excuse their behavior, but it lessens my anger. Thanks!

          5. Hi IdaNoe, I’m glad it was helpful. I understand and agree completely. I have some familial narcissists including one parent who also suffered trauma throughout childhood. I have great compassion and empathy for anyone dealing with a narcissist’s behavior, but I also have empathy for the narcissist as their condition is directly related to their exposure to various kinds of behavior and trauma. I see both sides and it is sad from every angle. Having empathy for all involved does help me cope.

        2. It is also a choice once you know about it, to deal with your addiction. It’s difficult for all addicts to alter their habit. Not impossible. You can’t change who you are, which is always ‘a narcissist’ or an ‘addict’—but everyone has the potential to let the latent self that comes from inborn disposition, buried beneath their defence mechanisms, develop and gain more influence on their conscious minds. It takes discipline and skill.

          Not every narcissist is a gaslighter, for example.

          1. The vast majority of narcissists do not know what they are, hence there is no choice.

  6. Although not in the list, I also see narcissism as a post traumatic condition. Both narcissists and victims who remain in abusive relationships grew up in a dysfunctional family/environment.

    What about narcissism as a Dissociative Identity Disorder (DID), previously called Multiple Personality Disorder with *only two personalities states* as seen by Vaknin?
    1-The Host Personality is the false self and 2- the Child Personality is the true self.
    The false self protects the child in pain personality. What is your opinion about this, HG?

      1. If this is Vaknin’s view, he is patently incorrect. The true and false self are contained in everyone; they are not distinct personalities. Non narcissists accept their true self. Narcissists do not; they rely on the false self and avoid (but do not exclude) acknowledgement of the true self. Winnicott’s false self theory does explain that if the false self is relied upon exclusively and the true self is effectively absent, schizoid adaptations result.

  7. I have come to believe that there is no wrong answer to this poll. Everyone is correct in a sense.

  8. “He simply wasn’t all there. He wasn’t a complete human being at all. He was a tiny bit of one, unnaturally developed; something in a bottle, an organ kept alive in a laboratory. I thought he was a sort of primitive savage, but he was something absolutely modern and up-to-date that only this ghastly age could produce. A tiny bit of a man pretending he was whole. ” Evelyn Waugh Brideshead Revisited (that was my mid-range. Funny, since 1944, they don’t change at all, do they?)

  9. I don’t understand why the reptile and alien ones didn’t get more votes, seem totally logical to me. ;D
    With the winner “survival strategy”, I feel a bit manipulated.
    You just had to smuggle the brilliance one in, didn’t you, HG?

    Best poll so far, nice options. :)

    Why “necessary” evil?

    1. Because the things I do might be deemed evil but they mean you get to sleep safely in your bed at night.
      Because much of the innovation, invention, entertainment and delivery of goods and services in the world originates from our kind.

      I accept my kind cause a lot of suffering as well, before somebody does the usual protest, but Ava101 was asking about the necessary evil element.

      1. HG, Thank you for your professional work in keeping people safe. Thank you for your brave and brilliant work here, for this also keeps us safe. If evil is defined as the absence of good, you are not evil.
        You are also correct that many of your kind are highly successful in many fields and we are benefactors of their contributions as well.

      2. Thank you, HG. So that one is one of the answers you would go with, I know.
        I’ll stay with the reptile one.

      3. Are narcissists necessary? No………”Because much of the innovation, invention, entertainment and delivery of goods and services in the world originates from our kind.”

        Narcissists steal others work, frustrate innovation and inventions. Think about things like what Tesla faced just to get us alternating current electricity!!! Entertaining = Narcissist filth and lies playground when not stealing from the empaths.

        Delivery of goods and services in the world originated from narcissists??? 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣. I don’t FLIPPING think so!!!!!!!!! Amazon ain’t possible without the slaves, I mean employees. And the great ideas 💡 in the company RARELY EVER come from some dumb ass CEO. FACT!

        And has anyone realized just how uneducated people like politicians are? 🤣🤣🤣

        1. Of course narcissists steal the work of others,not all do, but many do, usually Mid Range or Lesser.

          The delivery of the goods and services ORIGINATED from narcissists not the EXECUTION of the delivery of goods and services. Who is the originator of the behemoth that is Amazon? Mr Bezos, what is he? One of our kind.

          You do write some nonsense at times.

          1. Off topic but I just thought of something. The simple nature of the narcissist conundrum. If there is a just Creator, it would hold you accountable for your evil. If there were no Creator, your kind winks out of existence, nothing you ever did matters, all your efforts are in vain and history will forget you ever existed, remembering you no more and that means that you don’t matter in the least, yesterday, today…ad Infinitum! Hmm 🤔

          2. You really do not think things through do you?

            There is no creator, just or otherwise. There is no judgement.

            When we die, that is it, it is over. However some of us continue to exist through a legacy.

            What is that subject you study at school, that’s it, history. Now, who do you learn about, read about, talk about – oh yes, dead people. How many people know about, talk about, read about, make programmes about say Henry VIII, Genghis Khan, Pol Pot?
            What are those things you read? Ah yes, books. Read any Geoffrey Chaucer, Shakespeare, Beatrix Potter, Enid Blyton? They are all dead and yet their books are read daily.
            What’s that thing you listen to? Music of course. Listened to John Lennon, Johnny Cash, Michael Jackson, Beethoven for instance? All dead yet they live on through their music.
            What do you look at and appreciate? Oh yes art. Picasso? Van Gogh? Pollock? All dead yet they live on through their art.

            What do millions use to communicate with? Apple products. Steve Jobs lives on.

      4. However, we need protection from your kind…narcissists are only necessary as weapons against other narcissists. If your kind didn’t exist we wouldn’t need so many services or feel as unsafe as we do. It’s because of your kind why some of us have a home and others have to sleep on the street. The empaths want to help them but at the same time we are scared they will turn out to be your kind, so we don’t.

  10. Have you ever posed as the victim of a narcissist, HG? In real life, I mean, and other than your mother.

  11. The narcissist is not a victim, but was one, long time ago. He/she took the path to what he/she is now, maybe not as a choice, but as a result of various circumstances. Males are proner than women to develop as narcissists, because they are, from a young age, expected to behave with restrained emotions. They are somehow conditioned from an early age to disconect from emotions, to lead, to disregard others. Add in the abuse and the genetics and voila. The degree varies, NPD, like all PDs, is a continuum but somehow, cerebral, somatics, smart or idiots, violent or not, they all have the same egotistical inner pattern. Women are encouraged and expected to show and develop an obvious emotional side, which leads them more towards BPD, HPD or codependency (I am talking here PD people, not Nons). I have lived surrounded by narcissists, I am their product, I have mated with them, they are to me what nons are to nons. They are or used to be my normality. They are cold. Cold and dead inside. Never passionate. Their aparent and fulgurant passion is an illusion, is the mirroring of your passion. Narcissists are simple primitive creatures, with very limited neurological structures, no matter how smart they are. Most of them fail miserabily by the time they are old. To discuss the narcissist as an abstraction is easy and useless, to bare living with one, another story. So, since I do own narcissistic traits strong enough to see their reality, my 2 cents are: hypothetically I am sorry for you, but realistically, I am not.
    With a samurai you fight like a samurai, with a ronin, you fight like a ronin. Most of nons and empaths (geee, I used the dread word) fight like a samurai with a ronin. Narcissists are neither good or bad, they just exist. Victims should find a purpose of their own in life, another one beside catering for the narcissist. In fact, if you truly are centerred on your own needs, a narcissist cannot harm you, because he will never get a chance to get in. You might not even realise you were about to get entangled with one, because you will not give much attention to him and instead mind your own interest. What people could learn from narcissists is to put themselves first. Not in a malign, but in a healthy way. Like in – why should one stay with a guy who is not consistently considerate? Or with one who uses your money, or assaults you, or makes you feel bad. How many times could an unacceptable behaviour be tolerated? Once, maybe twice if we presume it was an unfortunate mistake. Third time is already too much, goodbye. What do you get from this? Is this man the only man in the world who could provide good/awesome sex? Is he the only rich person? Most obviously not, there are billions of men out there and among them, hundreads of thousands could provide just as good or even better, you should just find them. But many times the victims are not at all confident they can find someone just as good, they are not strong and entitled in their own mind so they accept.

    1. Fabulous post Q! Some refer to codependency as “self love deficit disorder” and with good reason. Narcs are “never passionate” you say. I’ve noticed this bizarre trait (lack of) myself. What’s it all about?

      1. @Allison Dixley – are you a codependant or a narc? have you been diagnosed? You know, lots of nons are not passionate either and the lack of passion could mean nothing at all for many people. In my post I used it mainly to mean non-emotional. NPDs have emotions regarding their person only, even when they think otherwise. It is difficult to accept it when it is about your husband, father, lover or son. You automatically think it has to be you, that you have some horrible flaws that make you unlovable, unispiring, useless.
        It is even more difficult to acknowledge it when it is about yourself. If you are a codependent, you can enter therapy and heal, but you will have to admit your codependency is not at all the opposite of narcissism, a carte blanche to see him as the incarnated devil who wronged you. You are not automatically the good guy. If you chose to love someone else more than you love yourself, Houston, we have a problem. You are your own huge problem.

    2. While most of your article is good, I disagree with one point and take offense to one.

      Disagree: “The narcissist is not a victim, but was one, long time ago.”……not true in ALL cases.

      Offense: “Narcissists are neither good or bad, they just exist.”……tell that to a five year old rape victim.

  12. HG, would you be prepared to say which one of those you would choose , if you had to choose one ?

        1. Thank you Whitney, those are applicable to those who interact with my work here and through consultations.

          1. Yes because HG Tudor is the best part of you whether you realise it or not regardless of your motivations

      1. I have noticed that you use the word Evil a lot – as if this is your identity. Have you often been told by Matrinarc or by any other narcissistic family member that you were evil?

          1. Yes, foundation. It holds everything up you see and therefore is a strong word.

          2. Yes but we all have a foundation. I’m trying to re-build and I’m lacking in carpentry skills. It’s hard work!

      2. Have you considered what you would have been like if you’d had a loving protective mother/family?

  13. An abusive narcissist is a human being with a Narcissistic Personality Disorder. He has a soul (being/self) but didn’t develop an healthy ego and own identity, due to nature (genes) and nurture influences. So they create a fake ego/ mask and need supply to fill this void and ‘prove’ they exist.

    1. My Narc said I have no sense of self. He said I don’t know who I am. Now in my confusion, the aftermath, that is one of the statements that bothers me the most. And makes me ask HG questions like “Am I a Narcissist?”
      My lack of self could be from having a mother with Narcissistic tendencies, and focusing on her emotions rather than mine. My parents both ‘parentified’ me. But I see myself as something to be discovered. My Narc saw himself as something he could create.

  14. I think a narc is a soulless person who does not want to be responsible for the upkeep of a soul but pride themselves on tricking people into thinking they have one.They are conpeople. They are unethical. They are parasites. They’re lazy bums. My brother is a lower narcissist and I am just amazed at the ruse he has kept up throughout his life of being a mature, upstanding, responsible individual. When his wife discarded him he showed who he really was, a lame ass and I was shocked to no end because I had no idea this man was so trifling. He won’t take responsibility for his part in the breakup of his home, family and marriage and is literally having a tantrum by refusing to return to work or doing anything to maintain himself out of spite! I have lost all respect for him and do not want to even talk to him. His entire adult life has been a lie, a put-on, and I cannot stand him. Liar. Manipulator. Wrecking ball. Ugh.

  15. It is the Spirit of Jezebel from the Bible…. but just as God dealt with the demon and it’s host…so shall their fate be. Everyone has the choice…I was gang raped repeatedly,beaten, and bones broken by stepfather and CHOSE to love and heal others. Also primed me for the lesser/midrange narc I stayed with for 35 years. Now…supernova time.

    1. It really is nothing to do with the Jezebel spirit.

      Does sound like you need to unleash the supernova though.

  16. different breed of human species . Just like planets or you know what the Universe as above is below any way .

  17. I chose a few but non of the ones about them being possessed or devils or special powers and non of the ones about them being special geniuses either or great conjurers of charm wit and intelligence and saviours of the world. I’m making these up because I can’t remember the actual phrases. They are not possessed by devils and demons but the extreme psychopaths are clearly evil due to the brains they were born with and helped along by whatever environment they were then exposed to, although I think in some cases the nurture versus nature would have made no difference. Nor do I think they are doing greater things in the world than non narcs, I don’t know the stats on that one in the history of the world. I do see how a lack of emotion can be useful in some areas of life however and therefore may allow them to carry out jobs in the world better than normals or people with unhealthy amounts of empathy. I see Narcissists as people with mental health problems that can not be fixed or helped or changed. Not right now anyway, that may change in the future with more and more understanding of it, but I doubt it very much.

  18. I chose only one—the one that I believe will give any narcissist the least amount of fuel: An individual who has evolved differently in order to survive.

    Plus it’s what I believe.

    Now it’s time for me to evolve differently in order to THRIVE! Thanks to HG education, I am well-equipped to do so.

  19. I can smell the shit; your so full of, on your breath through my phone. LMAO! Feel pain for the first mi amor. Releasing mine to you. I’ve readied thine coffin. Adieu

  20. Well! For some unknown reason, I am not able to vote? Did you do thatvto me on purpose HG?🙃

    1. An interesting question. Personally I think it works along the lines of a quote by Nietzsche. Least I think it’s Nietzsche? “Whoever fights monsters must take care not to become one” was roughly it I think.

      Somewhere doing this served them, so narcs keep doing it and in some way it does serve them still. Though in a weird way the disorder is it’s own living beast gnawing away the narc bit by bit until someday there will be nothing but said beast.

      The question I wonder is if the narc even knows they are trapped in their own cycle like everyone else and have actually zero control or if they have just become that beast and stopped bothering to hide?

  21. Narcissists come in all flavours and one of those I believe is the empath who can mimic a narcissist being boastful to being a victim to ruthless, spiteful, rude, incredibly polite, to being very quite, analytical full of awareness to argumentative to submissive and more and back to the start of the cycle. I think that is possible.

  22. I ticked quite a few but the ones I didn’t were alien/reptile/devil etcs. Those ones.

    They have evolved differently in a world which they perceive to be harsh, cruel and uncaring.

    TBH, I think at times, they are right.

  23. I think narcs are traumatized people for whatever reason in their
    past. Trying their best to mask themselves bc they don’t want to be hurt again by any means necessary. Narcs from what IK & exp. are not all
    bad, unless they’ve killed or hurt children those people usually can’t be helped. I do believe that all things are possible anyone can change if they really want to. Maybe not their characteristics but as far as lying in wait to hurt people for no reason or any reason. I think theirs something good in everyone.Now the real problem comes if a person doesn’t want to be better or stop intentionally hurting people than you mustn’t deal with those people.Simply turn away only the strong can do that .

  24. A person with a personality disorder which is part learned part genetic. They think differently bc their brain is physiologically wired differently.

    1. If you’re absolutely right. The empathic ones in the same way, we were also programmed and mistreated, but we took the opposite path. Our submission and weakness to them was the fruit of our punishment for throwing their weaknesses and miseries in their face. Defects that they do not want to see or recognize. For they will never have empathy, love, compassion, etc. Their faults our virtues. For both our curse.

    2. I agree with this.

      I wonder if the “differently wired” aspect relates in some way to a failure of the brain to imprint the emotions that are attached to an event. I experience this myself, to a degree. It struck me as I was reading HG’s “MatriNarc” post that, like HG, I can’t remember much of my childhood. I don’t see this is a blacking out of traumatic memories, because I know from pictures and anecdotes of my siblings and my mother that we had some very good times that should make me smile when I look back upon them, if only I could. For me, it seems like a short- to long-term memory deficiency. I feel joy or pain or fear or sorrow or anything else very intensely in the moment, and they originate in me in response to my environment. But with a relatively short passage of time, without some amplification, I become unable to recall the emotions, and then the factual memories of the event fade away as well. I believe my interest in masochism is related, as I want to amplify my feelings and make them “stick”. Perhaps on the continuum, the narcissist is simply farther down the scale from where I sit… which is somewhere down the scale from “normal”. A person who cannot originate his own emotions but needs them for cognitive function, as I believe we do, would naturally feel compelled to find a proxy. Because the emotions are not original to him, though, a long-lasting or permanent attachment to the event (and the corresponding learning about the human condition that results in empathy) is unlikely even if those emotions are amplified in the fuel-providing empath, and thus, the operation fails and must be repeated. From this perspective, the sadism of a narcissist is the natural complement of empathic masochism. Perhaps it is why I am drawn like a moth to a flame, and probably always will be. In this wider narcissist/empath landscape, emotional imprinting and memory issues are a blessing in disguise.

  25. I appreciate that there are different types of narcissist mentioned in this post (I haven’t read through the entire blog, I’m sure there is reference to each type otherwise). I was raised by the victim, interacted with the passive and have been targeted by a very great one. I never was taken in until the great one came along and I have enjoyed the game. I suppose my experience has allowed me to be both an emotionally detached observer (and appreciator) as well as an emotionally gripped participator. I’m very fascinated. Don’t get me wrong, I’m not fascinated by every narcissist, the ones that are scraping by and are lost in it are of no interest. It’s the self aware (disciplined) that I enjoy watching.

  26. It’s a shame their bad side is so bad. It eventually outweighs any good they project. They’re blindly self-destructive.

  27. Unaware and emotionally stunted. Also capable of brilliance and impressive achievement but couldn’t quite match me in those departments. Ha.

  28. I found this poll to be difficult, for two reasons. Firstly, as a person who currently interacts on a personal level with three narcissists of differing varieties on a nearly daily basis, I note there are many qualities/traits listed that apply to one of them, but not to all. Therefore, in selecting my responses, I attempted to stick to those that apply to them universally. (Most do not). Secondly, my trigger finger hovered over certain check boxes. My hesitance arose due to multiple adjectives. For instance, I think that all of my narcissists could be described as “emotionally stunted”, as they are not capable of developing and experiencing a full range of human emotion on their own, but one of them is absolutely not “unaware”. Nevertheless, the responses are interesting!

  29. I think they are a link in a chain. A chain of pain, suffering and despair. A chain that binds us all to abuse. Everyone has predispositions they are born with. Some are good, some are bad, sometimes it depends on the situation. Narcissists are brilliant, no doubt about it. Some of it will be positive, but their motivation is not. At their core, I believe they are children. Children who were wounded, abused, neglected and/or misguided. I believe all are trying to compensate for something. Something they didn’t receive as a child. I believe this applies to all people. Everyone has something they are trying to overcome. Narcissists just go about it differently, to the detriment of everyone. They have a void, a need, a longing for something. A cup that has a hole in bottom that can never be filled, at least not the way they’re trying to fill it. Because it’s never filled, they never feel secure. Because they never feel secure, they never stop moving. Always hunting for what they cannot find. Always punishing others for what they themselves lack. Always trying to consume something to fill the hole, but outside things won’t fill holes on the inside. So no matter how hard they try or how cunning they are, the hole remains.

  30. Can’t stand how he ruined my life. How can one person completely devastate another person’s life in such a short amount of time. it’s very puzzling.. I am getting back to myself the overcomer the high achiever the confident determined girl that I once was that he stripped from me.

    1. Findinglife11, He did not ruin your life. He pushed you off your path but you are clearly getting back on it. Well done!

    2. Hi Findlinglife,
      I am sorry that they ruined your life. It can be devastating.
      I wish you strength to carry on and heal.

  31. Hi HG. I am watching a documentary just released on the disappearance of Madeleine McCann. Somewhere, I thought I recalled you saying Gerry McCann was a narcissist. Am I misremembering? If you said it, care to briefly elaborate? I am not seeing anything other than a response to the horrific “loss” of a child.

    1. No, you are correct in your recall E&L. I do not have time at present to elaborate but intend to do so in the future.

      1. Oh, I would love to know what you think about that case HG! I was actually discussing it with a friend of mine a couple of weeks ago. She’s a mother and she believes the parents have nothing to do with the disappearance of the girl. Yeah, right.

      2. That’s interesting you say about Gerry McCann being a narc, that explains why I’ve always found him to be an absolute arrogant up his own arse twat during every interview I’ve ever seen. While Kate can also come across arrogant at times she always looks like a woman in such depths of pain as anyone would be , while that twat of a husband comes across as an asshole and has never once shown one sign of being even slightly humble about the error they made leaving those children nor has he ever shown any real gratitude to the help and financial resources they have been given way beyond any other missing child. Despite what happened to them in losing their child I’ve never been able to warm to him, there’s just something about him, he thinks he’s above any kind of reproach or error. I have wondered about them 2 and was there an accident regarding that child that they covered up , they certainly lied a lot about many things , but actually having just watched the Netflix thing, I don’t think they were involved , just lied to cover their own arses and defend their parenting choices and all their friends lied as well. Definitely something odd about it all.

        1. Hi Lisa,
          I have been following this case for years and have read a lot about it, watched different interviews and the documentary. I think both of them are narcissists, especially Kate. I think she is the boss in the relationship and decides what to say and how to behave during interviews. I can see how fake she comes across when pretending to be distressed, concerned, in pain.

          1. Hi E. B.
            Yeah I’ve watched everything on this case as well, I don’t know about Kate, I’ve always found it hard to feel any warmth towards the pair of them which is weird given what they have been through and still live with daily. I thought the recent Netflix series was good. I saw them once in St Pancras train station , Madeline had been gone about 2 years, Kate must have weighed about 6 stone looked like the walking dead. I don’t know what to make of it or what happened to that child, it’s like a nightmare . But they definitely lied about things.

      3. I’m really interested. I shall look forward to reading more about this. I don’t believe they did it but Gerry is definitely an N. Either way, My heart goes out to them both. Yes they made mistakes but what a price to pay. Horrific and unbearable to think about.

    2. I watched that doc too, E&L (I am on a True Crime binge at the moment). I then watched a YouTube video with someone who took apart both Kate and Gerry’s testimony, which I found very convincing. I also thought that Kate seemed to be under Gerry’s control and very unemotional for a mum who just lost her kid. I don’t think they killed Madeleine on purpose but I do believe they were responsible for her death.

      1. SMH, I watched the doc on ID Discovery that aired on 4/7/19. I am just not that astute to see what may be the tells. But, the true crime shows definitely help me hone my ability to spot a “toxic for my well-being” person, if you will. I am always struck, however, that people assume someone’s reaction to a situation out of the ordinary to be not “right”. I am absolutely certain that I could not predict my reaction if a loved one was murdered, kidnapped, raped, or assaulted. I just know a flood of pain and emotion would wash over me and I would try not to drown. Whether that means I shut down or decompensate or have an emotional meltdown, I would feel horrible. These are not everyday occurrences.

        1. E&L, That is true and at first I did not know how to read Kate, especially, because she is British and so perhaps not as emotionally expressive anyway as I would expect (stiff upper lip and all that). But what I think happened now is that Madeleine died by accident. They gave her something to make her sleep and she either stopped breathing or got up and fell in a stupor. Gerry is controlling the cover up as well as controlling Kate. Kate might even be or have been an abused wife. Hence her flat emotional affect. I don’t think their friends were involved in the cover up because that’s too many people not to crack, so the friends believe that Madeleine was snatched. If you are interested, a series of YouTube videos called “McCann’s Embedded Confessions” convinced me.

          1. SMH, Thanks! I am very interested in the YouTube series and will watch them. Before I do though, I wonder why would they continue to generate publicity regarding the search for Madeleine if they knew she were dead. If attention and money were their motives for this charade, drawing attention to their own negligence and possible involvement is still risky. If NPD is involved, I can not fathom this level of denial and the ability to escape accountability in an effort to prove innocence.

          2. E&L, That is a good question. I can’t remember if those videos answered it or not, but maybe it’s part of the facade.

      2. Agreed. Drug addicted individuals are capable of better judgement than leaving kids that age alone in a hotel room. That said I’m very imperfect and the entire situation is just bad.

    1. Jonathon hart

      I agree that its hard to choose because many of us have more than one narcissist in our lives and we cant put them all in the same category. Do you care to share what types of narcissist that you have been involved with (familial, intimate relationship etc) and that you have been affected by?

  32. Be interesting to do genetic, epigenetic, biochemical, and brain studies on you people.

    If nothing else, it can determine species and evolutionary issues.

    :DDD

    1. Hi Leslie, I’m so glad to see you back. I’ve been thinking/worrying about you, and hoping you were ok.

    2. I believe theres that epigenetic component where environment(childhood) mixes with and trigger certain genetic components that maybe under different environmental influences woulsnt of been triggered active.

    3. Leslie – what I would really like to know is where the gene sits on one of the 23 chromosome pairs humans have.

      What I do know for certain is that it cannot be carried on the Y chromosome of pair 23 (the pair that defines biological gender) as you get female narcs.

      I am sure, some day, we will find it but the real test is, do we remove it? If we remove it, is there a chance that we also remove the empaths too? This is something my friend and I have been recently discussing.

      1. Even something simple like eye-colour is influenced by dozens of genes we know of. Something complicated like personality, or the abstract concept of Narcissism, must be influenced by millions of genes interacting in ways we could never understand.

        I believe being treated improperly as a baby is the epigenetic component that triggers Narcissism 😔 Eg being left to cry, not being held enough, sleeping in a room alone. The way we treat babies in our culture is unprecedented in human history. They are triggered to think they are in a harsh environment and develop accordingly. 😔

  33. Strawberry-flavoured Narcissists – ribbed for extra pleasure.

    I feel ripped off at the bare minimum effort he put in to secure my madness. There’s room here for a few more twitches and the strangulation of a ghost (which is anxiety), if anyone would like to recommend a reputable narcissist that isn’t particularly busy at the moment.

  34. Mr Tudor what does fuel exactly mean? Is it similar to salisfaction or pleasure? What do you feel when you gain fuel?

    1. Please see the book Fuel and also the recent article What Fuel Feels Like To The Narcissist.

  35. I ticked 5, but the main one that stood out was ‘An individual who has evolved differently in order to survive’.

    Unaware and emotionally stunted, yes – thought as a result from both genetics/nature and nurture combined. I don’t believe in Satan or a God, so just being ‘evil’ isn’t an option here for me.

    I like these polls – they’re fun.

  36. Great Poll HG! What about the ones who claim to be Empaths? They learn all the lingo, but when it comes down to it, their falsehood shines through.
    Peaceful

    1. HG
      Will you confirm I am actually an Empath.
      I have been labeled a narcissist by some who know my identity and post here on the blog.
      It is apparent when an opinion on something qualifies one to be a narcissist.

      I find it interesting how once again empaths label another Empath a narcissist and be completely wrong in their assessment. Empaths have hurt me deeper then any narcissist ever has. Especially when you began to trust them. At least with the narcissist I know they will eventually hurt me, empaths it always catches me off guard considering…..

      I am tired of walking alone and they just proved to me I have no choice in this…..

        1. Thank you HG.

          Those of you who belong to the other schools of Empath via HG description of them be carful whom you label a narcissist.
          Just so we are clear in what context I am speaking of.

          Outside of this blog I am sure many are helping others recognize the narcissists in their lives, To which I applaud yet be careful because you could label a victim via only focusing on the negative behaviors or they don’t line up with what your perspective dictates is an empathetic/empathic/Empath person.

          I was part of a support forum until yesterday where I find myself booted and blocked after I posted a comment on ghosting is it right or wrong. One of my replies goes against what the majority believe. I am entitled to my opinion. Apparently not when it goes against the majority I become the narcissist then, even with my background and then knowning some of the trauma I have endured. They knew more then what anyone publicly knows about me.
          The other admins knew a few of the things that actually trigger me, I was open on somethings I have been dealing with….this almost triggered me. Memories of what my ex did to me flooded me yesterday….he had me booted and blocked from many groups it was the last thing he did to isolate me completely. I had no support system and had to fight this alone. Just thinking about that point in time makes me feel nauseous. HG found me toward the end of all that, and I am sure he remembers our conversations and sees I have come a long way sense then. And yes i said found me, and no i do not know him in person.
          My point being is I would have left the group if they had said they no longer wanted me there due to not agreeing on things, what they did was triggered what my ex did to me. Yet they are empaths and it is ok for them to cause pain in another because they now believe I am a narcissist.

          In my opinion Empaths who do this are just as hypocritical as the narcissist.

          It is really sad because I believe they could build something different from many of the other support forums.

          I have many mix feelings and again that empaths are just as cruel as narcissist yet say it is ok because they are not evil. because they understand and feel another’s pain. Yet it is ok if they have now label you a narcissist to hurt you.

          It is never ok to intentionally hurt another person.

          1. HG

            I would say their empathy has been haulted, I call it selective empathy.
            You may not agree with me on this.

          2. Empathy can be diminished or suspended in certain situations but that tends to arise from either long term repeated exposure to an eroding factor OR a significant major ‘blast’ if you will. I do not see that this applies here. The individuals may have limited empathy or none.

          3. HG

            You have given me something’s to ponder yet I disagree with you, they are not a cluster b personality yet they do hold onto their hatred of your kind. This in my opinion can taint ones empathy.

          4. Twilight, I’m sorry you have been injured in this way. I have noticed this phenomena as well. I have also noticed that casual labeling and mislabeling of people as narcissists has become commonplace in society as a trendy, careless smear. Compassion, understanding and tolerance are becoming more rare indeed.

          5. Twilight

            I know we have had our rucks in the past but I am sorry to read that you have been booted out of a support forum for expressing contrary views. As have I.

            No, it’s never right to deliberately hurt someone and as HG says, it is not empathic behaviour.

            Personally, I have a rule to never ever label someone a narc on the web. The reason being that I am fallible and to do so might very well deeply wound someone who does have affective empathy. I simply dont want that on my conscience.

            I believe you said you were a Contagion? If so, you are even rarer than I am. I know damn well how I am perceived at times, I’ve become used to it, I can even predict when it will be leveled at me but it’s not great. Especially after what we have been through.

            I was reading a diary from 2017. In it I write this about a LVN

            “So unfair, I let him rail. I do not argue back. I do not accuse him of stuff. But on he goes. Whore, cocksucker, bitch, alkie and my personal favourite, narcissist.”

            He had found a book you see, ‘The sociopath next door’. How delighted he was. In Feb 2017, I had not yet found HG so it is very prescient that I was not reacting to his taunts and provocations. But god damn they hurt.

            I hope you are keeping well.

          6. Twilight on, I feel sorry people did that to you. People can be cruel. Why do you want them anyway when you have us? Stay here and forget about those losers 😘

          7. I am sorry to read this, Twilight. I understand how you feel, as I had something somewhat similar happen to me a time ago. I wasn’t booted from a group, but I left because I posted something about a type of music and there were some who lashed out on me with such coldness that I was really taken aback. It shocked me, really.

            I was criticizing a type of pop music and then I was called an ‘elitist’ which I suppose is true to a degree, but they were implying that I look down on others who might listen to it, and that wasn’t my point. Hell, in another post I admitted to enjoying some dumb Mariah Carey songs on occasion when no one is around.

            My feelings were hurt and I felt my opinion was taken completely out of context by a select few. This is hard to take.

            You’re definitely an empath. I have been called a narcissist a few times, and I agree that people need to be careful about throwing around that label esp. to those who have likely been told they were a narc by their own narc.

            Empaths are reactive, and sometimes the reactions are negative. That’s why they’re empaths–lots of fuel.

            I don’t think there are any narcissists on this blog, in my opinion. I think some have come and gone and there have been some ‘attention seekers’ and ‘contrarians’ but no one who seems downright nasty, but then again, only HG would know this as I can’t read everything.

            HG it was very nice of you to reassure Twilight. It makes me weepy-happy.

          8. I was simply stating a fact to maintain accuracy. If the collateral consequence of that is reassurance for Twilight, then that is an added benefit for Twilight.

          9. Dear Twilight 🌟 I am sorry for your traumatic experience. You feel safe in a support group and you don’t expect it deepen your wounds.
            My opinions/ideas: Support groups, any forums, or any groups of people, naturally become like cults. There are many cults centered around the idea of narcissism. With accepted ideas and ways of expressing them. Challenge any cult of people and you will be ostracized.

          10. Whitney

            Thank you and I am going to be ok.
            I never feel safe in a support groups, this particular one I got to know the admins and was a moderator. This was more a shock to me due to the fact the head Admin knows who I am here and has seen many of my comments not only here yet on yet on the group. I have been here for almost 3 years now I believe.
            They have read HGs work and share it due to the accuracy.

            I know here I can state my opinion and not be concern with HG booting me, he will just correct me if I am inaccurate. I also know I do not have to agree with him either and be labeled as anything other then being “emotional” and a Empath

            I am familiar with cults, not being in one yet observing them.