Poll – Which Form of Manipulation Affected You The Greatest?
There are many different forms of manipulation used throughout the narcissistic dynamic and these methods vary dependent on the relevant stage, whether it is the seduction, the embedded golden period, the devaluation and post dis-engagement or post-escape.
I am interested to know which form of manipulation during devaluation affected you the most and ten of the most common forms of manipulation are included in the poll below. If the one which affected you the most is not listed, then choose the one which affected you there second or third most, from the preferred list. Do also, in the comments explain why the particular form of manipulation affected you as it did.
Thank you for participating.
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It was tied with triangulation, blame shifting, word salad, future faking and withdrawing. I thank you so much for opening my eyes to this horror. I escaped 🙂 I’ve had 2 malign hoovers and many emails of bullshit. I have a load of expensive clothing etc in a vacation home we built in Florida. (Future faking) I’m hoping to get these things back. I’ve arranged for UPS to pick them up. But he has to actually pack them into my suitcase. And give me a date and time. He’s headed there tomorrow. Do you have any advice on how to successfully get my stuff back? I’m thinking he’d probably like to keep it there to triangulate other victims.
Thank you H. G. !!
Gas Lighting. A form of lying that makes you question your own perceptions and sanity. This is the stuff of night mares. If you wish to see a great example of it, watch that movie Gaslight from the 40’s.
He was very good at it, being an upper midrange cerebral with verbal jujitsu, it was what caused the mental fogging and significant anxiety as I lost faith in my own sanity. Future faking was just irritating. I started making plans without him. Lying was an art of his and added to the gas lighting effectiveness.
Silent treatment was my number one. It was emotionally traumatic in that I rarely if ever knew what I had done to cause it, and when I did know the reason, it was completely irrational. It made me physically ill, and had me walking on eggshells, not know what was going on or why, feeling guilty for having upset her, but not knowing what for, and therefore unable to fix it. Second only to the silent treatment was blame shifting…in a way, it was similar to gas lighting in that my rational mind would reject the blame as irrational and contrary to sound reason, while simultaneously feeling overwhelming guilt for having made her upset for the reasons she gave me. It truly had me trapped inside my own head like a mouse on a treadmill, going round and round trying to make sense of it all.
I am going to answer this for you. I chose Withdrawal, smearing, and gaslighting.
I worked full time, was raising 4 kids still at home 2 of which were his. His withdrawal was disappearing for hours, days, weeks. This left me taking care of everything and unable to plan anything because I never knew when he would return. I was exhausted from no sleep from wondering where he was or with who. He would make me pay for everything for all while he was gone. Then out of the blue he would reappear all smiles . I would be completely depleted and he would just say, “let’s just stop this, you know I adore you.” I would say zero because I was to tired. Then I would sleep finally. If you wish for example if other two I will give.
I voted for future faking but because of future faking all of the above were experienced over and over. Add to that, my personal #1, financial abuse/resource withholding and my life, which was solvent and stable,
was literally destroyed. Again, because of future faking everything was going to get better “tomorrow/next week/soon”.
but if you really wish to know what hurt me the most? it was not his techniques..it was simply… loss of hope of ever getting out of it… that is all…
I will not be voting.
these are what he has done to me – you get the entire package
lies – he was not very good at it… he ended up reporting a false crime and getting in trouble but he got out of that situation of course with help from his mother… all so I would believe his lies – to this I now say pfffttttt!!! If you lie, could you please sugar coat it enough that it is believably swallow-able? no? then how are we supposed to not know you are lying? doesn’t matter if you believe me or not, I admit to lying… I do not know why I lie… etc but if you ask me direct I will lie and deny that it is a lie… (hmmm yeah… that one had me going wtf? and the logic here is…??? and this is why I know he was not an elite) His favorite was “I did not cheat”… some times accompanied in private with “show me proof or it never happened”
denial- deny deny deny – you know you did it, they know you did it but without proof there is nothing they can do unless you admit… thus deny deny deny
betrayal of trust, betrayal of confidence but those go with lies as well…
blaming & shaming/ blame shifting
guilt-tripping – why didn’t i say anything.. i DID… no you didnt… oh i guess that mingles in with word salad… like many of his other tactics they sorta mingled into one big confusing ball of yarn so tangled it was difficult to unravel… thus why i will not be voting
threats – dangling some things over my head and telling me he could
take our child away and make sure I never saw them again. Those were the ones he used the most and they were the most effective in my particular situation as the situation I was in made that the most credible… there was no logic fault because in the situation I was in, without answers on how to fix it… I was just stuck, plain and simple… and everywhere I looked… no answers, no fixes, no escape… until I got my hands on both proof of his abuse and on answers…and that sure took years… then I had to build my courage and take a leap of faith hoping there was enough luck on my side to pull it off… because no matter what else he did, it was not life-threatening and so there was very little to no help there… it is why it took 16 years for me to get out… but it is also why I got proof of it at all…
did i mention he threatened to commit suicide if I left him? not that I could have left him really… if you think about the situation I was in… but… he still went and locked himself in the bedroom with the pills he refused to take for his alleged medical issues…and told me “you’ll never have to worry about me again” which I honestly debated letting happen because then come what may I would be free… only… what if I was held responsible? so I called… he did not think I would.. I called it in… oh he hated me for that one… oh he had his own price it cost him..until he learned to tell them what they wanted to hear in order to let him come home… I had a nice vacation if watched by his mother and others… oh how I paid the price afterwards though…
scape-goating – everything was my fault – i was not trying hard enough etc only after a few years of bending over backwards that failed because i was trying and he obviously wasn’t and the veil of love-blindness was lifting and reality was setting in with an obvious stop the romantic music sound effect – waittttt a minute here…..
gas lighting – that’s what was present the most in the beginning of the relationship… it had me so confused and addled-brained… I lost myself
smearing – limited in potential as he had pretty much isolated me and
there was no one to smear me to other then his own family
control control control – who I could talk to, be friends with, where I could go and when and if he had to be present or not
triangulation – his mother being #1 flying monkey and the only one to stick around long
flaunting text messages from women sexting him, or flirting, flaunting a couple of online girlfriends and what he was doing with them because I might see it but without grabbing proof It was not happening of course… except it was and he wanted to hurt me. This was hand in hand with scape-goating… I was not aware of what exactly he was saying but it became clear that he was saying things to them about me otherwise why would they be so quick to be hateful and not even give me a chance, regardless of my actions when I was present, to get to know me…? I picked up on it after a while but was never entirely sure until he left his (now deleted) facebook opened to of course show me and hurt me, that he was talking behind my back… it also go with blaming and shaming… as the entire message I found was full of all 3 wrapped into a wonderful package… I also saw later on some of the things he told his online prey about me…
playing the victim oh he was good at that, had the perfect excuse/alibi – a fool-proof medical excuse, milked for all it’s worth… one he kept alive and going via medical uncertainty and self-sabotage… like… should not consume caffeine… oh well.. we will consume a 2 liter bottle of american mountain dew a day for a few weeks and use the migraines to… anything we want… fool the doctors, the neurologists the therapists… and maybe the original cause was real but he had not had any real symptoms of it in the 16 years I’ve known him except when it was darn well convenient to use for his twisted manipulations… and. I. have. no. proof. that. stands. against. medical. knowledge (or ignorance)… oh woeth him… easiest card he ever can play… gets him out of literally anything. at. all. can’t work, losing his job, mooch off the system, mooch off his mother, not fulfill his obligations, convenient memory loss on his behaviors/actions… fool. proof. excuse.
would “you emasculate me” count as word salad or blaming and shaming or both?
one time he put his hands on me and tried to force himself on me, I pushed him on his rear end and then he called his mother, knowing he would not be able to get too physically abusive because I could defend myself, told his mother I attacked him for no reason… I pointed out to her that he had tried forcing himself on me which she gasped and looked at him but quickly swept under the rug as my fault and not important as he “had no memory of it”… the entire episode in front of out then 8 or 9 year old child…
there is no one that affected me the most… it was too entangled and confusing so most of it was a mass effect… for a long time… until it escalated… I mean I’m sure those moments of what I consider respite without actual return of a golden period were supposed to be silent treatment and for a long time when he was mostly absent I stupidly missed him but voicing it meant I must be trying to make him lose his job etc… never mind that he was fine with making it so he lost his job on purpose to not be able to fulfill his obligation to me via immigration procedures…
then I began to see who he was and I began to break free… the verbal, emotional and mental abuse escalated, financial abuse was added to it in a more obvious way… stalking and, inept as it was, cyber-stalking… and he could not figure out how my online friends and I knew it was him every single time.
he would bully me, try to kick me out and then try to prevent me leaving. He would threaten to call the cops because in my situation it did not matter who called them I would be paying the heavy price of deportation – yes he made me an illegal immigrant via his lies and golden period – there I said it. If you think it’s bad that they wrap you around their finger etc, the truth of it is that even when fully aware of what the narc is, when it becomes a question of law and immigration the options are few and far between when it comes to leaving them… even if you have grieved for what would never be… tricking someone and separating them from family and friends by a country border, and they cannot leave but they cannot stay… and their children are citizens but they are not…
so really he did not need much other tricks to wound me… I was no better then a trafficking victim… only I was so convinced by the gold period that I willingly walked into a cage I had no idea on… I mean… I had been warned about males from cultures where women have no rights in those countries but I never ever thought it applied to countries where women have the same rights as men… only… immigrants still don’t have the same rights as… regardless of what is believed…
so the threats were actually just pointing out what I already knew… deportation/loss of child… no rights here… saying the wrong thing to the wrong person could get me deported too and that thought alone served to isolate me perfectly…
so you see, it does not matter to me if he is a lesser, mid-ranger or anything else…
I cannot say how much was planned, how much was simply just there for him to seize on, or on the spot subconscious insight, etc… sticking him in a category won’t change any of what he has put me through. It won’t give me hope that he’ll change… it won’t give me back my lost 16 years or undo the wounds I acquired…
he has literally spent a week starving me to the point I have hoarded food as a result… in that last few months I was with him… the epitome of “you have no right, I am your GOD”… you eat and live because I will it… while he went out to eat fast food every darn day and no one knew but me and our child…
I need no reminding that narcissists are pure evil. I have tangled with the devil in his den and I broke free. No matter where life takes me now, I came out the winner.
no, he is not in jail… probably never will be…
I have no love or hate lost on him anymore. He is not even worth the silent scorn of a Canadian.
I am surprised silent treatment is most popular. While it is a nuisance, I never felt it affected my reality. BLAME SHIFTING is awful, especially if you have ever had the pleasure of being in a conflict, such a court with a Narc. But hands down, FUTURE FAKING is the worst! You plan and set goals for your life, when the reality is, you are being duped.
First the “Silent Treatment” with “No Resolve” was emotionally excruciating for me over the 32 years we were married. Then she served me papers after the boys went off to college and blamed/hated me for them sprouting healthy wings of independence to fly.
She then began a fiery “Smear Campaign” during the divorce process along with her maligned recruits of Flying Monkeys to spread malicious lies about me as they collectively attempted to assassinate my character among everyone we knew together over that 40yr period of time.
She gave her divorce premeditation away the year before she served me papers by telling me, “I can never divorce you for everyone loves you too much and they will all hate me if I divorce YOU.” Thus the “Smear Campaign.”
Six months later after setting me ablaze at the stake in the public eye, she married one of our old family friends after he served papers to his wife while “counseling” my ex.
It’s been 9yrs since the divorce and I am recovering very well and live in a peace that I have never experienced before and it is truly a wonderful thing!
The silent treatment, of course! But at the same time it was for me the first great red flag that made me think and look, and realize that such behavior was abuse. In that sense, it is a tactic not so covert and the the victim could wake up. At least, that was my case.
Blame -shifting to the point when he actually suggested that it was me abusing him. I felt constantly in defence , worthless, ashamed and defeated.
I was going through the events in my head over and over again thinking if i could have done something differently to avoid it , if i deserved it. I started believing that i was at fault. I often blamed myself and end up apologising to him. Crazy making. 😔
Future faking affected me the most. So many promises made, all of them broken, one by one. With hindsight, I realise that he worded things in a manner which would allow him to backtrack any time. Wounding with *intent*.
Intellectually, I understand how and why he did it, but I’ll never be able to grasp with my heart how someone can look into your eyes, and lie about the *most important things in life*!!! My wounds run so deep, I lost all faith in humanity… but if he thinks he has “won”, he is mistaken… he will never get another chance to speak with me, touch me, hurt me… and this is dawning on him now…
Matilda,
I agree with you on the deep emotional trauma future faking causes…especially when you don’t realize that their commitment to following through on those *most important things in life* to which you committed so deeply on the basis of their promises and love-bombing is absolutely nil until well AFTER the fact and the damage has already been done. It certainly can shake your faith in humanity very deeply. As for him now realizing that he can never do any of those things with you or to you again…unfortunately, that is very doubtful, and if he does, it will not affect him in the same manner that it would either you or I. They move on, and you don’t matter…because you never mattered except as a source of fuel, and you failed in that obligation. We are objects, appliances as HG says…not people, and not investments of emotion. As difficult as that is to swallow, finally fully understanding it and internalizing it will give you some measure of freedom and allow you to harden your heart against them. None of it was real. Not. One. Bit.
Suckerfornarcopaths,
I know that none of it was real, and I never mattered.
I cut him off completely. He does suffer now, albeit just lack of fuel and a wounded ego. That’s NOTHING in comparison to what I have been through. My world lies in ashes. There is a stillness, a sense of calm which I have never felt before… perhaps, this is the path to healing. We will see.
Matilda,
I can certainly identify with your pain. My world, too, is in ruinous ashes, and it has taken a long time to get to a point where I feel like I can start picking up the pieces. These blogs have helped a lot, if only to help me retain my focus on what she really is and what really happened…not my perceptions and confusion when it all started coming down around me. The continual mental reiteration that none of it was real, and she is not affected as I was helps keep me centered sometimes when I feel myself start to circle the drain. Best of luck to you.
Suckerfornarcopaths,
I agree: we must never forget what they are, and what they did. Close that door and throw away the key. May peace be with us all! 🙂
Gas Lighting; I loved the silent treatments!!
Projection!
I chose blame-shifting, but they all are hurtful. There is so much overlap in these. The silent treatment is given as punishment for something after the blame was shifted to me, etc. It’s odd because in my marriage AND the guy I had the online relationship with, they both use threats too, but are completely different kinds of threats. With my husband, his rage is threatening, and saying things like he wants to kick the dog. With my online “affair,” the threats if he didn’t get his way, he was going to give more attention to one of his other conquests, and he would blatantly say that, but make me feel like it was my actions forcing him to act that way. Maybe pity plays too, because he said he pulled away emotionally from me because I vanished a week without talking to him, but the reason I did so was because he humiliated me during sexting and then said it was just fantasy when I tried to talk to him about it. I’m not an idiot, he talks about having others online, and he wanted me to have them too. Maybe that was triangulating? I don’t know how to separate the manipulation types when they are connected to others.
Future faking, gas lighting, triangulation.
Future faking hurts me the most on an immediate guy kick level. Believe in me, nope don’t, yes do, nope don’t, okay this time for sure, nope again, really this time it’s for real, and no just kidding, wait this time I mean it, no sorry I didn’t just kidding….
Gas lighting is long term torture.
Triangulation plays on my insecurities and need to please in the worst kind of ways.
It was so hard to decide…in the moment the silent treatment was the worst, because I didn’t realize all the other verbal tactics that he was employing. I didn’t realize he was blame shifting, I thought I really was at fault because he was so convincing. So I wound up voting for blame shifting – realizing now how that pretty much obliterated any sense of self or self-esteem I had, but silent treatment was a very close second.
Future faking, silent treatment, lie after lie, 30 years of never ending driving past my home, calls from pay phones. All the other women, the horrible lies he told about me aka smear campaign. The life long damage of what was emotional abuse. The fact all those other women that left him he would leave alone and never understanding why he wouldn’t leave me alone. Now I pray daily he never comes back or contacts me his new source believes he is a new man aka triangulation. Karma and god will serve him well. I am glad for the peace I finally have
Triangulation.
I’ve been triangulated with another woman for 2 years.
For 2 years I heard that she dresses better than me.
That’s she’s so smart.
She’s a lawyer, I’m not.
For 2 years I watched you watching her profile every day.
I heard how paranoid and jealous I am.
I cried and begged for you to stop it, telling you how much it hurt me.
I watched your smile with satisfaction.
After two years, I was discarded and replaced with her. Now I’m watching the pictures of the two of you happily ever after.
Could there be anything worse?
Nat…that is so very hurtful 🙁 he did not deserve you and i guarantee this lady will be devalued as well. Its a cycle that keeps repeating. You were an unfortunate reciepient and theyll be many more. They never find their “true love” but you can ❤
Most definitely the silent treatment in the beginning. Now I cherish the silent treatment. I love the quiet in my mind.
This was so hard to decide. I picked blame shifting but triangulation and gaslighting were about the same level as well. I never got the silent treatment per se, He just would stay away from the house unless he was hungry, horny or ready for bed. He was always up for a good fight, though. Silence would have been a blessing. 😀
I voted triangulation because my mid-range narc used a particularly insidious form of it. He used his late wife. I met him 18 months after his third wife had died suddenly. He was still in full-on grief mode, which was of course an excellent pity play and a way to constantly draw all the attention to himself. Throughout our 10-year relationship, he never let me forget how much he had “loved” her or how great their life was, and I always felt that no matter what I did, I’d never be as “good.” (I didn’t know this woman, but I know people who did — and believe me, she was far from perfect.)
As I know now, he didn’t really feel grief for her. What he felt was self-pity at the sudden loss of fuel (which she was apparently still providing at a satisfactory level when she died) and anger that she had left him with some real responsibility (two children still living at home). But that didn’t stop him from using her constantly to make me feel unworthy because I wasn’t providing fuel at the extreme levels she did.
Occasionally other women were brought into the equation… A casual remark about a work colleague wanting to fix him up with someone. Or a brief flurry of interest in some woman he’d met somewhere. But primarily, the triangulation was done with the memory of his “wonderful” late wife. It was a perfect device. How could anyone compete with that?
Interestingly, when he actually began recruiting his new IPPS candidate, he went to great lengths to hide from me that there was a new female acquaintance in his life. By that time, he was in devaluation mode and no longer felt the need to manipulate me with triangulation.
I would love to answer this question honestly, but I don’t think you would believe me.
I certainly would not be surprised.
Silent treatment and future faking are first and second. At the end of this relationship I wanted answers, I wanted to understand why and what had happened. At that time, I mistakenly believed we had a deep and intense connection that I realize now wasn’t real. I couldn’t understand how someone could just disappear and never speak to me again! Shortly after posting photos of the “new one” with him in Hawaii which was my favorite place to go.
Mine is word salad. This is because all the others are so easily recognizable and as such, automatically dismissed by me as pathetic and childish. They just make me laugh.
Word salad though can slip by my filters at first, and when I don’t recognize it, the inability to understand what they are trying to say disturbs and worries me.
Discussion and understanding are most important for me. I always place tremendous importance on what is said to me and thoroughly analyze all that may not make sense to me at first. It is therefore particularly galling to realize I’ve been wasting my time on deliberate, obfuscating nonsense. My standard reaction to word salad is to calmly acknowledge it for what it is (purposeful nonsense because they are unwilling to discuss the topic seriously with me) and then to withdraw and have nothing to do with that narc for at least a month.
Thanks for another poll, HG. They are always fun!
You are welcome.
HG so what are your favorite methods of manipulation?
Gas Lighting, Threat, Sexual Withdrawal, Charm, Blackmail.
I voted Word Salad because that had a huge affect on me. I am still completely blown away that there is a definition for it, that I wasn’t making it up. I always said our biggest problem was lack of communication… what a joke…
I got to the point I would get so frustrated with his nonsensical responses that I would yell and even shoved once, he then strangled me and threatened to kill me. He still to this day is absolutely impossible to talk to.. And he does this all with a content demeanor while I feel like my head is actually going to blow up
I voted for future faking as he was married and led me to believe he was not going to stay married. But the withdrawal hurt just as badly. Silent treatments were done as pity plays (woe is me I am so depressed I push you and everyone away, it is not just you, oh but my feelings are still the same for you). Yeah I got a combo of future faking, silent treatment (nice silent treatments though with charm and fake love and pity plays all swirled in there like a Narc ice cream sundae)….
I fall into the only 6% category. My answer is tied really with the triangulation. It’s still being carried on after a year and a half and the crazy part is I’m still with him believing he is going to end it with his other girlfriend. Believing his words and promises of the future with me. When I had chose to not to be tied down to a relationship for so many years, I changed my mind when I met him. I became ready and wanting to be in a serious relationship, and now I’m becoming aware of the illusion.
Withdrawal of affection and sex was the most heartbreaking. Then realizing post escape that it was all bullshit.
I have had three relationships where the Narc, (male), used their children to triangulate. That doesn’t go over well at all for the primary, nor the kids involved. I really appreciate the ACON memes…thank you for addressing this particular issue. It is the one issue that baffles me the most..believe it or not! I’ve seen some posts written by those who claim to have been diagnosed with NPD, INSIST that they genuinely love their children, parents and siblings. They are indignant that anyone would even suggest they don’t love their family. If that is the case, I suppose there must be “Narc” switch these people can flip on and off at will…depending on whether they are dealing with a primary vs a family member…ridiculous! All 3 narcissists that I’ve been involved with did, for the most part, appear genuinely concerned about their kids…including adult kids, and appeared to love them, as well. The kids appeared to return that love and adoration. How can a person be a full blown sociopath…narcissist with a primary and ACT like father/mother, son/daughter or brother/sister of the year with family. I am talking about full blown NPD’s here…not just high on the narcissism scale. I would appreciate your insight, HG! Thank you!
The clue is in the word ‘appear’.
I love these polls. The results are so interesting to me. While each form of manipulation hurts, triangulation is what makes me feel most unworthy. Silent treatment was agony but at least I wasn’t compared to anyone when his mouth as shut. The constant comparison to other women on every level was brutal and I drove myself crazy trying to improve in every way that I was compared.
I finally realized I could’ve been the combination of a millionaire, super model, rocket scientist, brain surgeon, world record breaking blow job giver, comedian, Mother Teresa, therapist, nymphomaniac, geisha and topped all that off with the tightest vagina on the planet…none of it would’ve measured up. Ever. That was the whole point. Never ever measuring up. It took me just a couple days short of FOREVER to figure that out.
But I did.
Add to that list chef with a show on the Cooking Network and professional house cleaner aka Mommy Dearest Joan Crawford kind of house cleaning – the serious kind.
Can you please comment how withdrawal is different from silent treatment? I want to make sure I select the correct one. Thank you!
Withdrawal is the removal of something – showing affection, sex, financial support and so forth. In this context it does not mean withdrawing from the relationship or your presence, that act is an Absent Silent Treatment.
Oh, I guess I misinterpreted what withdrawal meant.
Oops, no apologies.. Then I’ll just say ” I stand corrected.”
So tricky this bc so many are equally upsetting. Silent treatment was a close second. His silent treatments were different frim a typical one jn that hed be late or not show up but hours later have an excuse and tons of apologies but i knew it was a way to punish me bc he knows my issues with abandonment.
I went with withdrawal bc his shelving is the most hurtful form of abuse and devaluement. He does it while playing like nothings changed. He plays the friend card and shelves me which really hurts. Eventually i disengage from him which then restarts the cycle of golden period and eventual devaluement. If i didnt enjoy his company and form of friendship id be gone long ago! Ive even offered tl be just friends but of course he wouldnt control me that way.
Shelving sucks and really makes you feel taken for granted. Withdrawal has been the worst. Present withdrawal with a smile ughhh. Coverts are the worst give me an overt narc and ill kick him to the curb in a second!
I voted ‘Threats’. These annoyed me the most, because after doing all of the above (as if that wasn’t enough), he threatened me with with the police and called me vile names because I wasn’t complying with what he wanted. That was it for me, someone who cares about you doesn’t do that. I can handle silent treatments and withdrawals because I like my own space. Never been smeared.
Gas lighting would be a close second.
HG after this poll Im sure that you are going to make much more use of silent treatment 😂
KT, I was thinking the same thing. LOL (No offense intended, HG.)
KT and Mary
I would have to disagree with you on the assumption HG will use silent treatments more after this.
I don’t use them that often, they are not my manipulation of choice.
Oh HG!
Do not hold out, what is YOUR favorite one to use?
What tactic of manipulation effected you the greatest when used by MatricNarc when you were younger, HG?
Come, join us as we sit around the fire and burn yummy fuel!
Indy with a toasted marsh-mellow.
My comment was not intended for anyone to agree or disagree. Its MY opinion and opinions are never wrong
KT
I apologize that my comment was taken offensively and meant no disrespect, I understood it as your opinion.
It is interesting in your opinion he will use silent treatments more from what is learned from this poll, and curious as to what brought you to this perspective?
I do disagree, being HG knows us better then we know ourselves to which makes him very effective in what he does. That and if I have been a good student I believe mids use silent treatments the most.
HG, what’s your manipulation of choice?
Gas Lighting.
Which is your favorite, HG?
Gas lighting.
I have a feeling it’s, already one of his favorite tools.
I think one of the reasons I didn’t choose silent treatment was because he leveled up and got much more sophisticated in his machinations.
What I mean is after this poll HG can see that silent treatment has the most powerful effect on so many hence he may use it more now
If we’re doing opinions…I think HG already knows how to use other methods to greater effect than he could get from silent treatments. I believe silent treatments may be at the top of the poll because so many more of us have dealt with midrangers and that is one of their most effective methods. Midrangers are often more ham-handed and unskilled with the other more psychological torments, in my opinion.
A completely accurate observation.
Apologies HG, the silent treatment is beneath you apparently 😉
Not beneath me, I use it but it is not my ultimate favourite.
What is your favorite to use HG?
Gas Lighting.
So what is your ultimate favourite HG? I’m sure everyone is dying to know!
Gas lighting.
What is your ultimate favorite?
Gas lighting.
Yikes! Noted. Thank you.
That’s, actually, really good to know, coming from a “Greater” 😏👍
I agree. I happen to think the psychological abuse done by a cerebral upper mid or higher, especially greaters, (can’t even imagine!) is akin to being held hostage and interrogated by a pro in mindfuckery, intensely damaging.
Hello Indy!
Interesting comment of the psychological abuse of some upper school narcissists. Your comparision to a hostage condition is very accurate ( under my perspective) .It reminds me a lot of the Stockholms Syndrome. And when I left my ex narc I didn’t feel “happy” as I expected..but most reliefed and a mixture of feelings that might me compared of those of the Stockholm Syndrome : “Stockholm syndrome is a condition that causes hostages to develop a psychological alliance with their captors as a survival strategy during captivity. These feelings, resulting from a bond formed between captor and captives during intimate time spent together, are generally considered irrational in light of the danger or risk endured by the victims. Generally speaking, Stockholm syndrome consists of “strong emotional ties that develop between two persons where one person intermittently harasses, beats, threatens, abuses, or intimidates the other.”
Best wishes!!
Hi SuperXena!
So nice to hear from you!
Yes, like Stockholm and also like how POWs in war are messed with to alter their sense of reality. Ultimate gas lighting. You do not know the time, the day, what is real….in some cases, when done by a very skilled torturer, this is the ultimate weapon. My ex was exmilitary and knew some psych techniques, plus being primarily a cerebral type, he was a pro at this. He lied like breathing, everything was said with such conviction… Some may think one has to be weak to fall for gas lighting…not at all. After the
salami slicing, one is worn down, it takes down many. I consider myself pretty bright and it slaughtered me. The fog and CPTSD, lord. Then the trauma bonding you mentioned SuperXena, such a horrible combo.
Hello Indy!
Nice to hear from you too!! How are you?
Ah!!! Your ex was a cerebral and exmilitary..ugh!! not good! They are extremely trained in those areas…no wonder why he “eroded” you…Yes I know ( by what you write here) that you are a very strong,intelligent and caring person!
I am sure you were a challenge for him to break you down..but you made it!!! Wonderful!
Yes, I recognise the gas lightning …now I can ” see” it…it is like the fog is vanishing now…I think this kind of abuse/ manipulative behaviour is harder to detect( even though you are alert) and the effects are far more damaging than the other manipulative strategies…My ex was so calculating, so refined…I had like a veil covering not just my eyes…but all my senses..I remember all this circular conversations when he tried to convince me that what I heard or saw was not true …although the evidence was right in front..I wonder sometimes if he really believed that “red” was “green” when you could see that it was green…Terrifying..
Ha,ha lol..sorry Indy .I meant :”I wonder if he really believed that “red” was “green” although you could see that it was RED!! Wow…perhaps I am still trained to see it that way?? Lol…
Best wishes
Arigatō, sensei. 🙏🏼
KT
I am sorry about the remark of good student, it was rude and I was wrong to even say it.
“Not beneath me, I use it but it is not my ultimate favourite.”
So, what’s your favourite strategy, HG? (my guess: smearing) Just curious!
Gas Lighting
“Gas Lighting”
Yes, you mentioned that in one of your interviews. Thank you for answering.
The fury gave me a giant case of PTSD, in case you were wondering. <3
Silent Treatment. Mainly because that’s what happened the most. Others didn’t happen at all. The only time he threatened me was when I found out he was cheating and texted him and didn’t buy his lies. He wrote “stop it or it’s goodbye forever” and I replied “what makes you think I want to stay with a cheater?”. I don’t do threats and pity plays are also not my thing, so maybe he didn’t do them with me but does with another victim. Like I said, low tolerance for bullshit.
Although wait, I guess telling me he won’t talk if I’m negative was a threat as well. I didn’t take it seriously though, and he knew I wouldn’t shut up and be nice just because *he* says I have to be. Quite the contrary.
I looked at aforementioned text and I believe it shows several forms of manipulation. He was struggling at that time. I shall post it here for our entertainment, not so much for yours HG because you’ve probably done similar when freaking out (or whatever it is that you do). Typos are his, not mine: “IM NOT IGNORING JUST DEALING WITH FRIGFING PARENTS, I SAID THEY WERE RELATED TO FRENCH UNI STUFF AND HAD QUESTIONS ABOUT THE UK SYSTEM, WAS SOME TIME AGO AND IVE NO CONNECTIONS, THEYRE REMOVED NOW STOP THIS BSHIT OR ITS GOODBYE FOREVER FFS. IM TURNING PHONE OFF.”
So we have a threat, pity play (parents), followed by silent treatment. And obviously blatant lies. He sent this at 4.30 pm on Saturday and ignored me for the rest of the day. I went out and had a few drinks, this was unrelated to his idiocy, it was planned days before. While I was out, I got a message from one of those “French uni people” telling me she met him on Tinder in August last year. They didn’t have sex, she wasn’t interested in him. So…I texted him again, from a bar, it was obvious I was drunk. No reply until 6.50 am on Sunday.
“This is bshit, I guess you’re still drunk, my dad is sick and I need to take care of it”.
So again, pity play and what’s that other one, the one about me being drunk at almost 7 am when I got home at 1 am? Gaslighting? By the way, that’s the last thing I heard from him. After that, I got more messages from women so I told him to get fucked and looks like he did.
The worst for me, silent treatment no doubt.
It is the one which my mother used during all my childhood, I really suffer very much with it and now, at least, with my last narcissist it was me the one who stop talking this man anymore…yes, it was very hard for me but I did.
What do I feel? guilt, need of comunication to explain the things, it is awful, and know I’m sure that anyone who come to me in the future and make this kind of manipulation will make me run away as soon as I can, either men, women or apes…
No more silent treatments in my life…n.e.v.e.r.
Initially it was silent treatment because it was so emotionally traumatic. He was able to stop the silent treatment eventually. So we overcame that. But in the end it is actually the blame shifting. You can never fix a problem until you admit that there actually is one. It’s a lifelong pattern that is deeply rooted in shame. Very tough to overcome but I have seen effort and progress. Slow progress but progress none the less. Two complicated people are bound to have a complicated relationship.
Libertygal, do u mean your narc is making effort and progressing?!! I fell for that too, but HG’s recent article explains that mid-rangers do it especially, to maintain the facade of a good person.
I am grade A supply. He likes his life much better with me in it. I have implemented strict boundaries. Zero silent treatment. Admit and apologize when in the wrong etc. I have found my voice and although it is still a struggle….I feel We are actually a team instead of opposing teams.
Then he must be asserting control in other areas?
What cadre is he? Also what entails grade A supply?
Good questions KT. I am also curious to know.
I wish I could have chosen more that one of those options, but for me Gas Lighting was the worst and his most formidable weapon against me.
Silent Treatments didn’t really work on me, since I was running myself ragged 24/7 for him that when he did give me the Silent Treatment as a punishment it didn’t have the desired effect, Instead i would do all of the things for myself that I had been putting off. I had a day or two off!
Making me feel as though I didn’t know what I was talking about,or I
was remembering things wrong, or getting forgetful. Making me feel off balance and like I was losing my mind was the worst.
My silent treatments went on for weeks sometimes a month or two. Always at my most weak and vulnerable times. Always as punishment for standing up for myself or getting annoyed at him. It was at those times I felt my lowest. Unloved, unwanted but mostly unimportant.
The only thing that really affected me with lasting consequences was future faking. Twice.
This is why when there is no tangible progress in a relationship, I withdraw any effort soon.
Other manipulations weren’t as nearly effective if at all.
I’m fine with silent treatments. I get a lot more done than when I’m babysitting a relationship with a narcissist.
Triangulation? Nah, I know who I am.
Smearing? The truth always floats to the top like oil. The audience is rarely worthy of the truth anyway.
The others are meaningless, they don’t even register.
Trust me when I say not every time I received the silent treatment bothered me because I was quite happy not to hear his voice or see his face, but it was when I didn’t have to do anything to cause the treatment that really bothered me the most. However there did come a time that it stopped bothering me at all and I looked at it as well at least it’s peaceful this way , so I tended to embrace it, and then he would get upset with me because I didn’t let it affect me, so then came other methods for which I don’t care any longer. I can take it or leave it which I told him that as well. And he has never forgot those words, it haunts him till this day.
The longer the relationship lasted, the less I cared about his silent treatment. I guess we get used to things after a while. I gave him some silent treatment in December. Not as some punishment, I was genuinely sick of it all. I even ignored his birthday. The next day he messaged me. I knew it would bother him to no end that his caring and loving girlfriend doesn’t give a shit about his birthday.
This is a no-brainer for me – Triangulation – with my daughter AND my mother. Real fun and games.
The silent treatment because I want answers. What did I do? Was it something I said? Why would someone act like that?
And if I wanted answers I would be accused of being needy, clingy ,intense, tiring , overwhelming and over emotional
Yep, same here. Oh “you are so sensitive”, “can’t you take a joke”, “I didn’t do or say that”, “I am tired of explaining to you” (he never did)….
OMG Indy! Those were my mothers favorite lines! “You’re just too sensitive!” “I was only joking. Can’t you take a joke?” And denying things ever happened or she ever said them!
I guess I tend to block those memories out of my mind now that she’s dead TBTG. But when something brings them to mind it fills me with a furious rage! Good thing I’m sitting under a tree in the breeze right now. I’ll channel it into the ground. 🌲
Ahhhh, yes! Enjoy the tree and let all that rage flow with the breeze! It is healthy to feel it, just not to hold on to it (as I am sure you know 🙂
At the time I was being needy and clingy. I asked him if that’s why he was ignoring me, but he never answered.
At least the accusation would have had some thruth to it.
The most dangerous part of gas lighting is when your partner can manipulate your moods so much that you completely lose control and you start to believe that you’re going mad.
I’m going with word salad because I have never experienced such ridiculousness. I would ask a direct question and get anything but a direct answer. For example: ‘Why do you treat me like a second class citizen in front of your friends and family?’ The answer was always something bizarre like ‘because you had children with another man before I knew you’ or ‘ I don’t like that girl you hang out with.’ Wait what? Go bang my head on a wall for a while. Did I miss something? Wow!
Silent treatment is just fucking horrible. It made me feel physically ill
all of them
My top three, in order, would be; 1) Future faking – voted for this one, 2) Triangulation 3) Silent Treatment